Yasi.9065

> @"Lord of the Fire.6870" said:

> > @"Yasi.9065" said:

> > Problem isnt alacrity, really. Vigor is more of a problem. You need it as a defensive boon and also because there are traits that let you do more dmg if your endurance is full. Retaliation. Fury. Those are boons that are difficult to organize.

> >

> > Removing alacrity would only make sense if theres a huge boon-overhaul. With boons being made 10man, different boon-spam builds and stat-contribution of might being lowered. Just to remove a boon? Not much use in that for theorycrafting. We would still be stuck with chronos.

>

> The problem with alacrity is it scales the dps with % this is always a concern for trouble, the other point is it changes how fast the game play is and skills in the rota which with alacrity must be executed faster. With 20% its nearly okish but with 66% gw2 must have been felt like a an hack&slay game ala Diablo. To say it out load without alacrity rotas would change and weapons would need a buff differently for each class.

>

> Spirits especially frost spirit has a similar problem but with 5% it also okish but it has the same balancing problem to make it more clear those % modifier multiply with each other this result in exponential grow which is really bad in terms of balancing at some point A- NET balancing team must realized themselves this is the reason those skills got nerfed again and again.

>

> By the way fury don't has this problem because with 100% crit rate you have a hard cap. Banners are absolute okay they have fix values and it isn't said that future elites could do something similar e.g engi with new towers.

>

> One thing more chrono isn't the only class who can do alacrity the reverent can do it too so far I heard the up time is equal after the last patch. I don't know how right this is but it certainly went in this direction.

You misunderstood the post. It wasnt about the boons themselves., but rather who can apply them to the grp for how long.

Problem isnt alacrity, really. Vigor is more of a problem. You need it as a defensive boon and also because there are traits that let you do more dmg if your endurance is full. Retaliation. Fury. Those are boons that are difficult to organize.

Removing alacrity would only make sense if theres a huge boon-overhaul. With boons being made 10man, different boon-spam builds and stat-contribution of might being lowered. Just to remove a boon? Not much use in that for theorycrafting. We would still be stuck with chronos.

Is it really bad to have a boon-providing build for 10man? I feel like its rather the additional utility thats the problem, not the boons per se. Resistance, stability, aegis should be way rarer, yeah. But the other boons? It helps diversity a ton to have them provided by chronos atm.

Maybe go about it the other way? Nerf the cc of chronomancer. ToT on big hit boxes is 1k, moa 1k. On top of that utility, you get focus pulls and atm have even a slot free for something like precog well, which is just plainly OP in pve content.

Imo, its the additional utility thats the problem. Not the boons themselves. Reading how people want to nerf chaos trait or SoI pains me, simply because then we would need to get the boons from somewhere else. And the way boons are distributed across different builds ... I made a spreadsheet with percentage uptimes and lets just say, if you remove druid and chrono from the mix, you end up with 5+ very specific supporters. Vigor alone is a pain because pretty much only druid and chronos provide it 100%.

This could be solved by a 10man buffer build that sole purpose is to provide boons, some healing and decent cc - along the lines of a druid, but with less healing. With such a build, SoI could be removed without breaking raids and t4 fractals. Without SoI, chaos trait is pretty pointless.

But tbh, I gave up on the boon-fiasco a year ago, when anet went the easy road instead of finally completely restructuring boon distribution across builds and just added more boons and more boon corrupt to every build. Any major changes at this point will either mean a huge balance patch with unforeseen repercussions for pvp and wvw... or will break raids/t4 fractals.

Well, thing is... re-balancing basically all... lets call them "elite areas" to accomodate boonless fights would be a ton of work I imagine.

And I mean, boons are part of the game, so imo they should be included.

Also I dont see the boons themselves as source of the problem. Rather those traits relying on specific - or all - boons uptime are the real reason for why alternatives to chronos are always a form of downtrading or limitation.

I mean, do we REALLY need 100% retaliation uptime? Or aegis? Or stability? Or swiftness? Or even vigor? No. They are nice boons, but especially aegis and stability are meant to be situational shorttime boons. Tieing dmg traits in PvE to those boons is just bad. Why cant it be traits that work like mirage's vigor? They buff the caster if he/she applies the boon to themselve? Then it would make sense, and we could finally "evolve" from the "get as many boons as possible 100% uptime" meta that we have been stuck in since... forever.

It doesnt really matter what your personal preference is in regards to boons :) Problem is that raid and t4 fractal encounters (to be more precise, fractal instabilities) are balanced around status quo. Without those boons, its a huge battle uphill. You get it done - maybe. But it will be painful, unfun and very toxic towards casual players.

Not 100% uptime, thats the problem.

Hi :)

With the current changes to chrono - which I believe were meant to give other supporters also a shot at being more than just barely viable - we are again faced with the big mess that boons are in gw2. All professions have some boons, but not 100%, not condensed - except chrono ofc.

Theres those boons that are just so strong you simply cannot forgo them. 25 might, fury, alacrity, quickness, vigor. Of those boons, fury and vigor are actually pretty rare. Especially, support builds that offer alacrity or quickness dont offer much vigor (fb around 30%, renegade none). Fury you can somewhat cheat with rune of altruism, or by forcing a holo to play sword and bring hardlight arena to fill up duration to 100%.

In addition, we have traits that rely on uptime of certain boons - guardian retaliation traits in radiance, warrior swiftness trait, weaver swiftness trait etc. So you want those boons as well for max dmg output, since those traits are so strong, theres really no alternative. You could ofc just not run with dh, ele, warrior... but... I dont like being a class nazi.

And then we have the biggest offenders, thieves, warriors and ele's %dmg per boon traits. Those make anything below 10 boons with 100% uptime a very noticable dps loss. Yes, you can live without them, but why would you? 2xChrono can provide them.

So, what imo has to change is mainly the boon-reliant traits. Make them into slightly lower but permanent values, split between gamemodes. And suddenly we have alternatives to 2x chrono in raids, and even to 1 chrono in fractals, without having to kick 3 builds out of the meta because of missing boons.

You gotta keep stacksize in mind. Im too tired now, but I guess if you dont want to prestack in fractals, chaos/illu might be a variant that works without TW.

> @"OriOri.8724" said:

> (...) and we can no longer pump out double signets of inspiration

For 10 man content, the passive signet just got moved to the 2nd chrono, and with increased quickness on SoI you can now play mimic variant on both chronos, upkeeping 10-11 boons on 10 man.

For 5 man content this was a pretty harsh nerf that now necessitates prestacking boons in fractals if you want to bring moa signet and aegis on distort. With TW and druid you still dont need prestacking.

Really nerfed was stabi uptime, but then it was OP and deserved a nerf. Fury, vigor, retal you overcap anyway as chaos chrono. Might are still around 10 missing nothing changed there.

Hope this helps.

Tbh, the "action driven" part of it surprised me so much, with past stories mostly being dialogue with some riddles to solve thrown in and quite unchallenging mobs to fight, that I failed at it and got shot off my gryphon ;) We had tons of fun sneaking from cover to cover... just to discover the cover is made of wood and gets destroyed.... then run for our lives.

This and the raptor race at the end are the most fun I had in story missions in gw2 in a very long time.

And as to it being "unfair" for necro. I helped a friend with the achievement - he a reaper, me a thief - and he got the achievement first because I got too impatient and didnt wait for the shot to hit the cover before moving on. So in a way, the high mobility actually hindered me ;)

Please stop complaining about every little difficulty you encounter in storymissions. If you think a thief is better suited, then nobody is forcing you to play necro for stories. See, I main a thief for all openworld stuff and stories, and I have other difficulties to overcome - like being a oneshot to every single surprise attack. Or mobs with protection. Environmental damaging auras ticking me down. Etc.

Sometimes I get this feeling that people arent happy if they cant complain about something being too difficult in living world episodes. Like its a badge of honor to make a thread about this or that being unfair/impossible and getting it nerfed into utter boredom.

> @"Danikat.8537" said:

> If it wasn't such a mess this promotion would be fantastic.

I snipped this, because this just has me baffled. You'd think all involved would have an interest to solve this whole mess as fast as possible, with as much needed catering to customers to smooth things out. Instead they quite obviously try to bury it.

Atm, Anet and KungFuTea are portrayed as being neglectfully incompetent at best, deceitful datagrabbers at worst. That kind of rep might not harm a company like google or twitch. But neither Anet nor KungFuTea are somewhere close to that.

At this point, this whole promotion was the worst marketing Anet has ever done. It might not directly result in lost customers, but at least for me, a lot of my trust in Anet has been destroyed with their reaction to this mess.

> @"Nash.3974" said:

> > @"Daroon.1736" said:

> > > @"Gaile Gray.6029" said:

> > > > @"fatihso.7258" said:

> > > > When do we get an update on the matter? Half month almost passed.

> > >

> > > Have you asked Kung Fu Tea? We're answering questions that are properly addressed to us, but cannot answer questions that need to addressed to the company that is hosting the promotion. I'm very sorry that we do not have answers to every question, but truly we do not.

> >

> > Here's a few question properly addressed to you:

> > If so, How and why did the promotion details end up in GW2 the launcher for EU players and why did no one at Anet anticipate the inevitable negative reaction ?

>

> Are you unable to read? Gaile explained how the launcher is language based and not location based. Everyone has the same launcher and it was translated into all languages because first of all the US has no official language and because all languages are always supported because why wouldn’t I be able to read the promotion in french (even though I live in the US) when I always play in French.

Doesnt change the fact that it wasnt advertised as US only. I checked it back then. And no, in times of the internet and since the app is available to ALL, not only US residents, this is NOT in any way a logical conclusion. The exclusion of what... over 60% of their playerbase from a promotion advertised in the launcher accessible to all, thats just plain stupid and the only logical conclusion to that is actually this thread.

> @"Gaile Gray.6029" said:

> > @"fatihso.7258" said:

> > When do we get an update on the matter? Half month almost passed.

>

> Have you asked Kung Fu Tea? We're answering questions that are properly addressed to us, but cannot answer questions that need to addressed to the company that is hosting the promotion. I'm very sorry that we do not have answers to every question, but truly we do not.

Never thought Anet would actually cop-out like that. Very disappointing. This thread is filled with pretty much the same 3 questions asked in myriad ways, and at least 1 of those questions pertains especially to Anets part in this farce.

1. When will the promo resmue? -> KFT only.

2. Was the non-sweepstakes part meant to be US only from the start? -> Anet and KFT as they surely signed contracts that included the particulars.

3. Why was the promo advertised outside the US, even in translated form, without stating it is US only? -> Anet only.

Hmmmm, new footage of a certain mmo, coming out next year, released a few days ago... looks better and better with each day. Maybe they wont rate non-US customers second class.

> @"Greaka.6905" said:

> Hey there,

> I opened a ticket on the 13th of May and have still no answer. I know sometimes it takes a while to get an answer but since your normal response times are half a week in worst case, I begin to wonder if my ticket was missed or something. So does anyone have an ETA on when I can hope for an answer?

>

> Also: When I wanted to open the ticket, I could not log into my account. Whenever I was on the support page, it told me to log in (with a link). So i click the link, enter my credentials and land on the account page. I then click again on support and the support page tells me that I am not logged in. So I had to create my ticket without being logged in. Chrome v66, no script blockers etc. Just the plain browser.

This sounds so trivial, but when I have that problem (on firefox though) its either a faulty cookie. So deleting the cookies helps me. Or for whatever reason I have to force reload the account page because it loads the cached version.

Obviously, it could be something entirely else for you, and to boot you already opened the ticket.. but yeah :)

She gets stuck on respawn, so atm you only get that event on a fresh map, which in orr - thanks to istan farm - only happens on patchdays nowadays.

> @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > @"Yasi.9065" said:

> > > @"Deihnyx.6318" said:

> > > Also, even having a salt does not necessarily protect you, if the formula (for example md5) is known and the salt is unique per client, anet still need to keep track of which client is using which salt in order to generate a set of hashes for the unauthorized programs per client.

> >

> > So what? Nobody said its easy to legally keep hackers away from your software. Anet went with the most lazy approach, and the one doing most damage to innocent bystanders.

> >

>

> But no damage has been done at all. I wish people with zero knowledge about this would stop talking.

>

> Also did you ever heared of "The end justifies the means."? They cannot let thousands of cheaters go unpunished just because some clueless people blow this out of proportion. There are literally thousands of areas where complains about privacy would be justified. This case isnt.

The damage was done when Anet accessed data outside gw2 *and* send parts of that data to their servers.

The end **NEVER** justifies the means. On the contrary, illegal or unethical measures invalidate positive results. Fun fact here, cheating is exactly that... end result justifying the means. Think about it.

> @"Deihnyx.6318" said:

> > @"Yasi.9065" said:

> > > @"Deihnyx.6318" said:

> > > A hack resulting of a leak would likely cause a lot more damage with... I don't know... text logs from in game? personal info such as irl name? email?

> >

> > Tbh, irl names arent even THAT important.

> > Knowing every process being run on a computer - on the other hand - makes it way easier to attack that computer, thats just a fact even amateurs should realize. Anet created a security risk with their behaviour, and they did it in a way thats unsavory and distasteful because it also was an infringement on everybodies privacy.

> >

> > And btw, we still dont know what Anet EXACTLY did with that data.

> >

> > The lack of concern about the security risks and infringement on privacy just plainly worry me. So what if other companies do the same or even worse? That doesnt make ANY of it right.

>

> About privacy, you accepted to be monitored while playing the game when you signed the ToS. There is really nothing else to say.

Wrong. Read it please without bias.

> @"Deihnyx.6318" said:

> The second scenario assumes that anet kept all hashed processes from everyone and is going to be hacked, causing a leak.

Again, wrong. Simply by having gw2 client send that data to their server regularly and over an extended period of time they exposed that data.

> @"Deihnyx.6318" said:

> Also, even having a salt does not necessarily protect you, if the formula (for example md5) is known and the salt is unique per client, anet still need to keep track of which client is using which salt in order to generate a set of hashes for the unauthorized programs per client.

So what? Nobody said its easy to legally keep hackers away from your software. Anet went with the most lazy approach, and the one doing most damage to innocent bystanders.

> @"Deihnyx.6318" said:

> Again, while yes in theory it could be possible to make use of such things, I think we're getting to paranoiac levels of concern. It's a WHOLE OTHER DEBATE in general. It doesn't only apply to this case, but also how do we know that our logs are safe today? How do we ensure that a leak isn't going to reveal my personal name + address?

Again, your irl name and address isnt even the most interesting part about your computer. Dunno why you keep thinking that.

> @"Deihnyx.6318" said:

> And not focusing on anet, how do you know that your banking data is safe is a leak happen at Microsoft, at Sony? At all these online stores that you go to everyday? Is all the data being transferred to them safe?

THOSE have to get certified regularly either for me to buy something there, or by law (online banking). Dont compare apples and shoes please. Also, its nice of you to mention Microsoft, since THEY at least warn you upfront about the data they gather. For each case, not just hidden away in some broad UA statement.

/edit: Probably because they already lost several suits concerning this.

> @"Deihnyx.6318" said:

> But bringing that up NOW as an argument to fight a ban wave is plain hypocrisy, unless people were absolutely unaware of it all of that and have now disabled javascript, avoiding google, facebook, and have started a big fight for their privacy rights with all these companies, with microsoft and all.

I was aware of it, I take countermeasures. But thats beside the point. I couldnt care less about the suspensions, except to find it *hilariously* laughable that Anet:

a) thinks CheatEngine is mainly used for cheating

b) wasnt even able to check for handles and

c) didnt even ban way more offensive software

As if someone that creates hacks and bots for mmos plays around with CheatEngine for long, just plain hilarious.

> @"Deihnyx.6318" said:

> Anet shouldn't be burnt at the stake for it while sharing information with servers (the LARGE portion of it being for non malicious intents) has become a standard today, and when the MAIN purpose is to make everyone's experience better in their game!

Yes, Anet should be burned for it, because they crossed a line there. They went and snooped around in my underwear drawers, put me under general suspicion without me giving them any reason and exposed my computer system to security risks.

And THATS what Im angry with and take offense at. Those that got caught? Well, except the false positives and those using CheatEngine not on gw2... they deserve what they got for being so stupid.

> @"TexZero.7910" said:

> > @"Yasi.9065" said:

> > > @"TexZero.7910" said:

> > > > @"Faaris.8013" said:

> > > > > @"TexZero.7910" said:

> > > > > Additionally, it's not spyware when you consent which everyone using this service did. You voluntarily gave up whatever perceived right to privacy when you consented to the user agreement which states in pretty clear as day terms that anet can scan your system for any tools that may be used to cheat or otherwise gain an unfair advantage.

> > > >

> > > > You would not say that if the tool had accessed your webcam and sent screenshots to Anet, just to monitor if nobody else is playing your account, because that would be against the ToS.

> > > >

> > > > Or maybe you would, the slavish obedience expressed to authority in many posts here by several people horrifies me.

> > >

> > > If i consented to it, i would allow it.

> > > However, i don't own a webcam so your hypothetical Orwellian scenario falls flat.

> > >

> > > You know though whats even more horrifying than what you claim to be slavish obedience ? The sheer attempts to feign ignorance and pretending that anything you do online is protected. What you do online is about as protected as what you do in a park. Both are public spaces.

> >

> > And still, personally, Im wearing clothes in park... you know, for protecting my privacy.

>

> Wow are you intentionally missing the point.

>

> What you do in said park is public, it has consquences. What you do online is also public, it has consequences.

>

> If someone happens to catch you in the act of a crime in a public space, guess what....You're likely to face the consequences.

> You get caught running a tool that can be utilized to cheat at the same time (not happenstance, not accident) for a sustained period of time in a service where you've agreed not to... You face the consequences.

>

> If you wish to continue to miss the point that's on you but i hope i dont have to explain this any further.

Actually, YOU are missing the point ;) What I do and write on the internet is public, what I do and write on my computer is private. My computer is NOT public property. Thats like saying your home is public because it has windows and doors and is connected to a public place called "streets".

> @"BillC.4521" said:

> Now we only need someone to make post about windows and antivirus program using "SPYWARE COMPONENT" to scan your computer and gather your data.

>

> If you afraid of gw2 doing this again then just delete/uninstall gw2 from your pc.

> Even the reddit post said its built in into the gw2 client but people keep saying as if anet installing separate program into their computer.

> And its only scanning for running processes and people keep saying about your picture video and webcam etc

You can install totally new functions into an existing program... the patching process itself is the installation.

> @"TexZero.7910" said:

> > @"Faaris.8013" said:

> > > @"TexZero.7910" said:

> > > Additionally, it's not spyware when you consent which everyone using this service did. You voluntarily gave up whatever perceived right to privacy when you consented to the user agreement which states in pretty clear as day terms that anet can scan your system for any tools that may be used to cheat or otherwise gain an unfair advantage.

> >

> > You would not say that if the tool had accessed your webcam and sent screenshots to Anet, just to monitor if nobody else is playing your account, because that would be against the ToS.

> >

> > Or maybe you would, the slavish obedience expressed to authority in many posts here by several people horrifies me.

>

> If i consented to it, i would allow it.

> However, i don't own a webcam so your hypothetical Orwellian scenario falls flat.

>

> You know though whats even more horrifying than what you claim to be slavish obedience ? The sheer attempts to feign ignorance and pretending that anything you do online is protected. What you do online is about as protected as what you do in a park. Both are public spaces.

And still, personally, Im wearing clothes in park... you know, for protecting my privacy.

> @"Deihnyx.6318" said:

> A hack resulting of a leak would likely cause a lot more damage with... I don't know... text logs from in game? personal info such as irl name? email?

Tbh, irl names arent even THAT important.

Knowing every process being run on a computer - on the other hand - makes it way easier to attack that computer, thats just a fact even amateurs should realize. Anet created a security risk with their behaviour, and they did it in a way thats unsavory and distasteful because it also was an infringement on everybodies privacy.

And btw, we still dont know what Anet EXACTLY did with that data.

The lack of concern about the security risks and infringement on privacy just plainly worry me. So what if other companies do the same or even worse? That doesnt make ANY of it right.

> @"Sojourner.4621" said:

> > @"Twoodi.5849" said:

> > > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > > > @"Twoodi.5849" said:

> > > > > @"Deihnyx.6318" said:

> > > > > > @"Twoodi.5849" said:

> > > > > > > @"Deihnyx.6318" said:

> > > > > > > > @"Twoodi.5849" said:

> > > > > > > > > @"Deihnyx.6318" said:

> > > > > > > > > > @"Jinks.2057" said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @"starhunter.6015" said:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > No they installed spyware on March 6th and removed it on March 27th on all our computers.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > You need to do your research and come back when you understand the entire situation

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > It was not spyware, it was only checking processes running along with GW2. It scanned for nothing more. It collected no personal information, no location data, no passwords. It is not tracking what web sites you went too. Many MMO's run programs like this to check for cheats and hacks.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > No it opened each file and read it then sent it back to Anet servers.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > That is the definition of spyware

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Read the link to the reddit post

> > > > > > > > > Read it, yes.

> > > > > > > > > It sends a list of hashed values, a hash is destructive and you can't get the original content back.

> > > > > > > > > No "private" information, just a guess of what processes were used, which is required to detect a list of software they don't want you to use.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Stop posting misinformation

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > They will then go through all processes and get their file names. Those file names are then fed into the very same hash function as before at 0x6F4E90, which will open the respective files, read all their content, create a MD5 hash of it and returns said hash, which are then, again, stored in a list for later use.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > While the list is submitted in form of hashes, those hashes are not salted, so they are trivially to reverse

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Do you even read what you post?

> > > > > > > "create a MD5 hash of it and returns said hash"

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Seriously.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > While the list is submitted in form of hashes, those hashes are not salted, so they are trivial to reverse

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > A hash IS destructive, you will NOT get the value back. If you believe that I really hope you're not working in any job related with IT.

> > > > > Encryption, compression, now you get the stuff back, but those are different things.

> > > > >

> > > > > Now, yes, they need the hash of "cheat engine" so that they can compare it with their own hash of "Cheat Engine" and conclude you are using it. That's why it's possible to figure out what processes are running. That's the whole point of this process, that they can detect if you're using something they don't want you to be using.

> > > >

> > > > Yes they are but they were unsalted which means you can still match it to databases and see what program it was and sending all that info across the internet is not okay. Hence why blizzards and others use a local database on the users system. It's a lazy "anti-cheat" considering its trivial to compile your own version, something as small as a 1 byte difference means it wont be detected.

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > It is getting old. A method that catches 90% of the cheaters is still better than nothing. Salting this kind of information would be a waste of CPU time and energy.

> >

> > For you maybe ethically/morally but i prefer a system where 0 innocent people get punished.

> >

> > Like i said for the other programs that were created purely to cheat in GW2, sure they had no legitimate reason to be running those programs. But with Cheat engine the world isn't so black and white and as far as i am aware it's impossible to use it to cheat in GW2 as cheat engine cannot edit server side data.

> >

> > The official cheat engine forums themselves don't even allow users to post tables/tutorials for multiplayer games.

> >

> >

>

> That doesn't mean it isn't possible... GW2 relies heavily on the CLIENT side instance for things like positional data in order to combat latency, particularly for things that require split second timing like activating your glider just before you hit the ground. That means that the common "teleport hack" (there are also examples of it being used as a flying hack) can be done by using cheat engine to adjust the positional data that is being sent to the GW2 servers, causing your character to move to places that would otherwise not be possible. Most things are strictly server side, in particular actual character and inventory data, but positional data is largely client side. Cheat Engine can be and is used to manipulate this data before it is sent out (You can actually find examples on youtube of people doing this FOR GW2).

And still you could implement methods to detect this client manipulation serverside. Of course, it would mean higher server costs, more money spent on developers and less profit. So of course, the approach Anet took is the better way /sarcasm off.

> @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > @"Nightlark.4029" said:

> > > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > > > @"Twoodi.5849" said:

> > > > > @"Deihnyx.6318" said:

> > > > > > @"Twoodi.5849" said:

> > > > > > > @"Deihnyx.6318" said:

> > > > > > > > @"Twoodi.5849" said:

> > > > > > > > > @"Deihnyx.6318" said:

> > > > > > > > > > @"Jinks.2057" said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @"starhunter.6015" said:

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > No they installed spyware on March 6th and removed it on March 27th on all our computers.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > You need to do your research and come back when you understand the entire situation

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > It was not spyware, it was only checking processes running along with GW2. It scanned for nothing more. It collected no personal information, no location data, no passwords. It is not tracking what web sites you went too. Many MMO's run programs like this to check for cheats and hacks.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > No it opened each file and read it then sent it back to Anet servers.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > That is the definition of spyware

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Read the link to the reddit post

> > > > > > > > > Read it, yes.

> > > > > > > > > It sends a list of hashed values, a hash is destructive and you can't get the original content back.

> > > > > > > > > No "private" information, just a guess of what processes were used, which is required to detect a list of software they don't want you to use.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Stop posting misinformation

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > They will then go through all processes and get their file names. Those file names are then fed into the very same hash function as before at 0x6F4E90, which will open the respective files, read all their content, create a MD5 hash of it and returns said hash, which are then, again, stored in a list for later use.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > While the list is submitted in form of hashes, those hashes are not salted, so they are trivially to reverse

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Do you even read what you post?

> > > > > > > "create a MD5 hash of it and returns said hash"

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Seriously.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > While the list is submitted in form of hashes, those hashes are not salted, so they are trivial to reverse

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > A hash IS destructive, you will NOT get the value back. If you believe that I really hope you're not working in any job related with IT.

> > > > > Encryption, compression, now you get the stuff back, but those are different things.

> > > > >

> > > > > Now, yes, they need the hash of "cheat engine" so that they can compare it with their own hash of "Cheat Engine" and conclude you are using it. That's why it's possible to figure out what processes are running. That's the whole point of this process, that they can detect if you're using something they don't want you to be using.

> > > >

> > > > Yes they are but they were unsalted which means you can still match it to databases and see what program it was and sending all that info across the internet is not okay. Hence why blizzards and others use a local database on the users system. It's a lazy "anti-cheat" considering its trivial to compile your own version, something as small as a 1 byte difference means it wont be detected.

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > It is getting old. A method that catches 90% of the cheaters is still better than nothing. Salting this kind of information would be a waste of CPU time and energy.

> > Generating the list of hashes repeatedly is the thing that is a waste of CPU time and energy. Adding a salt would be such a small amount of additional overhead that it might as well be unmeasurable. Sure, catching 90% of the cheaters is good, but not when you have a significant number of false positives and refuse to overturn them with appeals.

>

> But there are no false positives. If you cheat in one game you are prone to cheating and should be kept out of online games.

> Also the hashing is nothing to a modern CPU, so if it happens let's say every 5min or so it will cosnume like 0.01% of your CPU time.

> I just run a benchmark and my CPU can handle hashing 11.7 GB data per second of simple algorithms like MD5.

> Even the most complex algorithms my benchmark tool has still reach 1 GB of data hashed per second.

As someone that has learned how to program stuff WITHOUT wasting resources, Im very aware how to go about something like this in an efficient way. The person that wrote that snippet of code didnt.

As to your generalization about cheaters and how they should all be punished without proven guilty (no matter if they actually cheated or not). How does Anet even know that someone cheats in another game? Because a debugger is opened and a game is running? Conjecture! That would also make everyone running the majority of mouse software a macro-user.

You got a c/++/# compiler running on your system? Fishy, could be you are writing a cheat -> suspended

You got mouse software installed? Shady, could be used to create macros -> suspended

You got an autoit or ahk script running? Suspect, could be used to cheat OR for macroing -> banned

You use VMware? Suspicious, you obviously have something to hide -> banned

You got wireshark installed? Obviously you are trying to reverse engineer network traffic -> banned

You searched the internet for cheating? Well, you are practically proven guilty already -> banned

All those things have one thing in common: conjecture. And thats exactly what Anet did there with CheatEngine. And what you do when agreeing with Anets methods.

> @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

> Of those, only some are designed primarily to be used to cheat (notably Cheat Engine).

And here you are completely wrong. Dont let yourself be fooled by the name, its mainly used for modding and debugging. It is a user-friendly debugger, probably the only one, and therefore especially used by programmers that "just" want to debug their own software and/or create mods/addons for other software. The other debugging tools are infinitely more useful for cheating btw, so putting CE on that list isnt only stupid because its main purpose isnt even cheating (especially not in mmos), it is inconsequent because then they would have had to ban PE, x64dbg, ollydbg, IDA etc also.

> @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

> Installing it is fine; the issue is whether it's active while GW2 is running.

And on the same note, Anet could have put in a bit more effort into their spyware and checked if CE was used on gw2. Not that difficult tbh. They could also have used a whitelist to look only for specific programs, or a blacklist to at least not gather all data.

> @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

> Wouldn't it be far more intrusive to let ANet put software on our machines that restricts what software we can or cannot run?

I dont agree with that sentiment. It would be upfront instead of behind my back.

> @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

> You're running (sometimes, anyhow) Cheat Engine, Keybot 2, Tiny Task, AutoHotKey, Logitech Gaming Framework, and Asus Armory. I think the "I don't want my performance degraded" ship has sailed.

Actually, most of those just idle. What Anet put in gw2 in layman terms, is... they called several windows api functions to get to the filename of EACH active process (no blacklist!) and then opened those files, created an MD5 hash of the file and uploaded said hash to their servers. This is significant activity and impacts performance.

Personally, I noticed the increase, but I thought it was because of buggy living story. Silly me. Just shows I trusted Anet WAY too much.

> @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

> [...] ANet used Windows API to expose programs running alongside GW2. [...]

No, the point is: Anet went behind my back and installed spyware that gathered information about all active programs and then uploaded that data to their server, where for all I know it still sits, waiting to be used for whatever shady business Anet decides. Anet did NOT have my explicit consent to do this, and imo uploading and storing that data onto their server is NOT part of the UA. In the least this whole thing was widely out of proportions, dilettantish and unsavory.