Bast.7253

The treat collection you can complete just from pof zones. Everything has a pretty high drop rate. Elon Riverlands has over half of them. Karka from Sandswept, and bats in Thunderhead. I don’t think there is a single one that you have to get from core maps.

> @"Faaris.8013" said:

> I sure hope that I can trade the Skyscale for a legendary amulet or ring when I'm done. I wouldn't mind forging the Skyscale together with a Mystic Tribute to get something useful. Doesn't even need to have an aura.

>

> Seriously, I don't really care about the timegate, the collections are pretty good. But what all this for? A dragon mount that cannot even fly and has no advantage over other mounts in combination. Unless there is some surprise that makes it a flying mount, I will prefer the griffon. And all the stuff that we do for the Skyscale is a bit overkill for a mediocre item. I did Aurora and think it was worth it. So far, I don't think the Skyscale is worth the effort.

>

> In other News: Suicide rates in Divinity's Reach are exploding.

I hope there’s at least more to it than just being for the base mount. Lol honestly even if they just made it able to climb it would make a huge difference even without the full flight.

> @"ukuni.8745" said:

> > @"cptaylor.2670" said:

> > > @"Tails.9372" said:

> > > Well the most recent guild chat answered this question, "it" was the magic that corrupted him.

> >

> > Well, sort of. It was, but they posed the question essentially asking, "But is there something else exacerbating this?" Which implies that even though it was the magic, there may be another force that was at work.

>

>

> Thats interesting, my thought was that it had potential for demons to be involved apparently they are born from the mists from malevolent forces like hate yada (dont quote me on that tho) when kralk says to aurene that he hopes she dosent have to kill someone that she loves it can be implied that kralk had to do that to possibly his mother which would most likely bring the feelings involved in creating a demon

That question was asked to, and they answered that it was in fact referring to Glint. Lol

> @"CETheLucid.3964" said:

> Since this is a spoiler thread per the title I'll go ahead and speak freely about it starting now. Fair warning.

>

> Aurene's basically a super Elder Dragon at this point. Even Kralkatorrik couldn't perfectly utilize these magics he acquired from the other elder dragons and Balthazar.

>

> This reinforces the original thought that human god magic/divinity and Tyria's magic are incompatible.

>

> You can "make" it work, but it causes suffering. While Kralkatorrik could power himself up and become stronger with it all, it was actually an agonizing process for him.

>

> I'd figure Balthazar's lingering magic (or divinity, the part that "made" him a god/demi-god; even largely stripped of it he was still a part of that original alien paradigm) was the straw that broke the camels back so to speak.

>

> It's hinted Kralkatorrik and possibly all the current EDs that aren't Aurene are actually suffering creatures and not just because of our actions in killing the previous EDs. That certainly didn't help, but we didn't know better.

>

> This cycle they do is a result of them becoming insane from magic, a bit like the ley-line madness exhibited by a lot of the bounties (and even the PC a little bit before we got help from the Priory/Consortium).

>

> I'd hesitate to call them "good" guys from our perspective just yet but they might not be intentionally malicious.

>

> We don't know much about the EDs personalities. Kralkatorrik is the only ED we've had a chance to peek into and it was fractured between murder machine torment and a fairly approachable personality that we can assume was the true Kralkatorrik.

>

> I imagine if the Forgotten had gotten to Kralkatorrik before his madness was further along they might have won over an Elder Dragon.

>

> Of course the state they end up in might be due to countless cycles of magic gorging to the point of the world resetting and revolving around this slow release they do.

>

> Aurene is a singular exception in that she can handle all these different magics (even utilize them per Joko; all hail the crystal lich dragon queen) including Balthazars, to no ill-effect.

>

> Knowing what we know now maybe we can "fix" the remaining EDs by easing their pain and reasoning with them. Don't want to end up like the Forgotten that tried that though. They could be too far gone. Maybe we could try it on Primordus or Jormag since they're sleeping?

>

> Absent scions to replace them (let alone the ones we've already killed), we couldn't just go kill them anyway.

> On an unrelated note: We (The Commander) are officially an Elder Dragon champion. That's pretty awesome.

Well I was about to post something about that actually.

With us being elder dragon champions, and us having this newfound Skyscale, would we potentially have the ability to empower these dragons ourselves?

I'm trying to think of a way to relate this to an earlier precedent but the only time I feel like we've seen an elder dragon champion having the ability to create new minions so to speak, or empower minions, is the Pale Tree and Sylvari. But could we effectively act as agents to Aurene our own branding process? I guess not, because I can't really think of any solid examples of this already being done. But it would be pretty cool.

It's a fun thought though.

I feel like this episode would have been a perfect time to add a new title showing that we're such. Elder Dragon Champion/Dragon Champion. Something along those lines.

Maybe we'll get a current event later before the next season starts that gives us an opportunity to explore this more.

Another thing to wonder in relation to all of this, is it the fact that Kralk had all of these magics that created the torment, or is it the fact that Kralk had the magic of two elder dragons and the magic of Balthazar? I mean, Balthazar wasn't a god anymore, but the fact that Kralk absorbing him enabled him to do things the elder dragons normally can't.. like traversing the mists... showing that it's less about the fact that he had all of these magics and more that the magic and potential connection to the all that Balthazar had being non-native to Tyria could be a possibility.

If so, then is a future plot going to be necessary involving the gods and Balthazar's possible replacement and absolving Aurene of this corruptive non-dragon facet?

So now that Aurene has replaced Kralk, what abilities does Aurene have now? As a complete rundown - spheres of influence and all that.

1. Prophetic - but natural to Crystal Dragons anyway.

2. Mind/telepathy - attributed to Mordremoth.

3. Death from Zhaitan.

4. Immortal unless consumed/unbound - Joko. Which honestly seems like it could be applied to any of the elder dragons given their specific weaknesses/connection to the all or whatever as we see with Kralk.

Kralk never seemed to use any of Mordremoth's abilities though. We never saw vine touched branded. And it didn't seem like he really used any mind associated abilities.... Which is strange because he clearly uses Mordremoth's magic in episode 5 as part of his little super Saiyan power up.

Although small, is the fact Aurene's brand creates flowers indicative of Aurene having more of Mordremoth's abilites than just Mind?

> @"Tails.9372" said:

> Well the most recent guild chat answered this question, "it" was the magic that corrupted him.

Well, sort of. It was, but they posed the question essentially asking, "But is there something else exacerbating this?" Which implies that even though it was the magic, there may be another force that was at work.

I wonder if, while we're focused on elder dragons, their origin, and attributing all of this potential manipulation and chaos to elder dragons, if there should be more thought put into the idea of beings that preceeded the elder dragons or may have aided in their creation. There are other beings like the Norn spirits, the celestials, Arachnia, and so on. We don't really know anything about them, and we haven't had any lore given to them. But it would be interesting if some of this manipulation that Kralk or the other dragons could have been enduring could have been caused by something far more ancient.

Though if they went this route, I would be far more inclined to believe that Bubbles has something to do with it more than the others, given its homage to Lovecraft. While they may not descend from the same being, I think the speculation that Bubbles could be a lot more "active" than we see could be a high possibility.

People mention that Bubbles potentially holding domain over water because it's in the ocean means that it could be the progenitor of elder dragons as water is most essential for life, but given that in the guild chat they mentioned they don't internally know what the origin of the elder dragons is, I pose the theory that it's not the fact that water is essential for life, but it's the abundancy of water in the world that's key.

Side by side you essentially have:

DSD - unknown Kralk - crystal, energy, and potentially air.

Mordremoth - life, earth, etch. Zhaitan you have death and shadow.

Primordus you have earth, fire heat. Jormag - ice and cold, and potentially air.

Examining them, it's funny that of the elder dragons we know of and have seen - the ones on the left side of the diagram have all been fairly ground-based dragons closer to the earth, and the ones on the right side of the diagram have all been shown as very airborn and connectioned to the sky/air.

I know my long post about the all wasn't very well received on here, and I'm not sure if they've really put this much thought into it, but this diagram:

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/File:The_All_(texture).png

As much as they love asymmetry in their gear design, it could mean nothing, but tracing the lines of this diagram and seeing how each is connected or placed in relation to the other could fuel some rather long theories. I wonder if this is also hints at power ranking.

> @"perilisk.1874" said:

> > @"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:

> > From the "Glint's Legacy Saga" (Season 2 to Season 4) we have the following major loose threads:

> > 3. Replacements for Mordremoth and Zhaitan.

>

> It seems like they might have handwaved that away with the whole "Aurene can juggle multiple types of magic with no ill effect" thing. Aurene is on her way to becoming a Prismatic Crystal Dragon, or Thyria [hypothetical original singular Elder Dragon] reborn.

>

Yeah, listening to the Guild Chat it wouldn't surprise me. Most of the questions were answered with your typical, "You'll just have to wait and see. *wink wink" But two questions in particular talked about Aurene and her absorbing these magics. One answer being that, diving further into the fact that saying "mother" was intentional, the same thing that happened to Kralk may be something that Aurene has to consider. That while the combined magics tormented Kralk, there may be something else that worsened the situation for him.

The other answer that stood out when asked about Glint knowing Aurene's full potential in relation to her prophecy of Vlast and Aurene replacing the elder dragons and cycling magic, they kind of dodged it a bit and made note that Glint looked like a prism.

So I wouldn't be surprised about Aurene being kind of an absorb all, but with a catch.

On the note about them talking about Kralk saying mother, they mentioned that it was intentional and hinted at it being a story thread moving forward, they also later answered a question about Aurene being the first of her kind in terms of being born from an egg, and that they don't actually internally know the origin of the elder dragons or how they came to be.

So from that we have to consider, this "mother" Kralk mentions, may be the predecessor to Kralk but I think it's pretty safe to say from that answer that this mother isn't somekind of origin of all elder dragons or anything. They said if you listen closely and pay attention during this, the mother bit may give more clues.

Following the dialogue during this story, the torment is saying that Aurene betrays her own kind, but given this I could see it having a double meaning. Implying that there is in fact, as some people have speculated, another elder dragon that may be doing this same betrayal. That there's some elder dragon worsening the effects this magic has. Or for that matter even The All for all we know.

It would be an enormous stretch, but the fact that the pale tree is at the center of it and is the "Pale Mother" I wouldn't be surprised to find a future storyline that involves the Pale Tree potentially being involved somehow. It would seem odd given that she's a dragon champion and you wouldn't think of her as having that much influence, especially over other elder dragons. But who knows.

I'm not sure how much weight I put into any of their hints about this though. It kind of felt like most of it was just formulated in a way that they attempting to avoiding answering and more focused on creating hype.

They mention that they do things quite often knowing that they will have significance later in the story, i.e. Aurene eating Joko, but then mention that they weren't completely sure that Aurene eating Joko was going to be the catalyst for her resurrection. There are multiple other points during this latest guild chat where I was just thinking, "okay, so you mention that this was intentional and you put it there for a reason, but now you're saying that you didn't really have any reason for it to until much later..." I don't know if that makes sense or not. It's like they either "intentionally" create opportunities to come back to something, but don't actually know why until they decide to build on it later. So less about creating these long devised plots that are well mapped out, and more about scattering breadcrumbs and figuring out which one they want to pay off on or make work, or how best to make them work to fit. And if this is the case, if they sort out the specifics of the story pretty much right as they begin development on the episode, it's really anyone's guess as to what will come next.

Apparently Phlunt was going to be a major antagonist this season, and they scrapped that. I'm glad, personally, but it definitely seems like that would be a bit annoying to have to work around for the people developing these episodes. Because at any moment, they could change their minds and have to rebuild future releases to fit that episode.

I’m still not really sure where they came from or how they came to be.

Did they just materialize out of thin air as full grown adults? Or are they from the mists? I feel like I missed something here...

A couple more questions about the lore and some general statements:

1. I'm still not entirely sure how the Skyscale came to be, in terms of lore. I feel like it was a bit fast and I missed something. Did they just appear out of thin air? Or did they get pulled in from the mists? Is it that they were in the mists, brought to Tyria, and somehow these new skyscale were born but essentially pulled out of the mists and created as full grown adults? It's just quite confusing.

2. So Kralk's torment makes it seem as though it was the combined magic of Balthazar, Zhaitan, and Mordremoth that created the torment. But what about all of the bad things he did before this torment and before absorbing this magic? Like killing Glint? You could say that him killing Glint started the chain reaction that led to Aurene and it was his design all along, but then why did he provoke people to attack him anyway instead of him just flying off into his own little corner and leaving things be a long time ago?

3. Did he prophesize the death of some other elder dragon, realize that it would lead to this corruption, and decide to initiate the events of his Destiny's Edge AND this prophecy just so that the world would have a way to mend itself via Aurene?

I enjoyed the story, but it definitely feels like parts were a bit more rushed than they should have been. Especially with regards to these two former points. I fully expected Aurene to resurrect and replace Kralk this episode, but I didn't imagine the curveball of Kralk having a split personality or being corrupted by magic. With that being thrown, I feel like I have more questions than I did going into it.

> @"mercury ranique.2170" said:

> I think there are plenty of hints, but they are also too obscure to call it a direction. Later it will all fall into place, but till then we can only guess and fanfiction.

>

> So to speculate.

> - Kralk hints that Aurene can hold the different powers in herself unlike he could and that it would be her strength, making her the first of her kind.

> - In an earlier theory I have put down that the influence of Gods and Dragons are simular. It was dismissed. We know that Balthazar took Primordus his power and his power was again taken by Kralk. It was represented as the facet of fire and war.

> - We know the all is too big for anyone to be comprehended. One can only grasp a portion of it.

> - We know That both Kralk, Glint and Aurene can hold different magic in different facets. But Glint and Aurene can control it, but Kralk could not.

> - We know there is a sixt elder dragon, the deep seas dragon.

> - We know there is a mom.

>

> So to theorise more, lets link the dragons once again (not saying they are really connected, but maybe tied to the same sphere of influence the All)

> Zhaithan - Grenth

> Mordremoth - Melandru

> Primordus - Balthazar

> Kralkatorik - Lyssa or Abadon/Kormir

> Jormag - Lyssa or abadon/Kormir

>

> This leaves Deep seas dragon and Dwayna. The first God to arrive to Tyria (according to the scrolls). She is the mother of Grenth. She is the Godd of air. The first thing we breath.

>

> My main theory is that the last sphere of influence is the sphere of origin and birth. The first thing you do when being born is breath. It is our beginning, just as it is the end. The sea provides and the sea takes. So to me it seems we are going to the deep sea.

>

> The only issue here would be that underwater combat is so troublesome.

>

>

I can follow Mordremoth - Melandru, Primordus - Balthazar, and even Zhaitan - Grenth. But Grenth could just as easily be Jormag.

I think if the deep sea dragon is related to anyone, it would be Lyssa. Kralk could be Komir/Abaddon, I guess, but could also be Dwayna.

I do kind of see the connection between Kralk and Lyssa though, given they both have that sense of duality.

I also wonder at what point the elder dragons started going mad, at least with Kralk. It's confusing because it seems like his torment was created solely from his exposure to Balth, Zhaitan, and Mordremoth, but he was doing bad things way before that. The only thing I can think of is that he HAD to do those things and kill Glint in order to lead to Aurene being born. But if that were the case, why wouldn't he have just stayed away from everyone in his nice little resting spot? Long before he killed Glint. Did he intentionally provoke the fight, because he foresaw some elder dragon somewhere getting killed and the others going crazy, and just decided to take the bullet himself and become a sort of prophetic anti-hero mastermind?

It just doesn't really make sense to me. Is it too much magic in general that drives them insane eventually?

I like the theory that the mother could be the deep sea dragon, but given everything else that's going on, perhaps when Kralk says that he will now be a part of Aurene, when he says mother... he's referring to Aurene. Because his essence will be recycled somehow and reborn later. No idea. It could go in a number of directions really.

I tried looking into the interactable in the bottom of the airship in the epilogue, the journal with Tianni and Zipp. Scoured Rata Sum to see if I could find any npc's with those names just for the fun of it, but no luck. I guess it was just a random item they felt like adding in? Or maybe it has some personal significance to one of the devs or a player memorial or something.

Twist: Skyscale is related to Bubbles.

I enjoyed it. But there are a few things that bothered me...

The voice acting at times was really strange, and the dialogue was a little weird. Like Braham's 3 minutes of non-stop forced laughter at max volume...

Aurene saying, "He is DEFINITELY not happy to see me." Who wrote that? I don't know, that's a minor pet peeve but it just struck me as a bit awkward.

The dialogue exchange between Kralk and Aurene in the final instance. 1. Kralk was kind of hard to hear. 2. It felt a bit rushed, especially with all of the combat mechanics. I feel like this part would have been a bit better in the form of a cut scene before the fight started or something.

Other issues:

1. It looks like we're pretty far out in the ocean, but somehow this land mass just lands into the ocean and somehow doesn't sink down into it? The placement of all of that, particularly in the ocean, seemed really strange unless they are in fact using it as a lead in to the introduction of Bubbles somehow.

2. Skyscale's introduction. I'm still not entirely sure what they are or how they got here. It implied that they're a new species... that what.. just came out of thin air? They just manifested themselves? How does that happen? Or are they from the mists? I'm still not sure what is going on with those. Maybe they're secretly not a new species but they themselves are related to the deep sea dragon somehow. I mean, they just appeared out of thin air, and they have a hell of an appetite for fish. That part was really rushed though.

The last issue I'd like to mention is:

Why wasn't Canach more involved? It's like he was given Rox treatment this episode? No dialogue on the airship? No involvement really with the map. Did his voice actor get laid off or something?

So, several questions for you. Timegating annoyances aside but also somewhat in relation:

1. Will they change it so that alts can access the rentable mount in the future instead of having to repeat the story steps? Because that's a bit of a burden right now ontop of the preexisting issues with the collection.

2. Where are Marjory and Kas? It seems like even a majority of the playerbase has forgotten about them. They've never been my favorite characters or even that overly interesting, but feels like they've just been exiled from Dragon's Watch.

3. Did Glint realize the full potential that Aurene had in terms of being able to withstand multiple kinds of magic, or was she really just counting on Aurene and Vlast replacing the two dead elder dragons and maintaining at least a bit of balance. From the prophecy in a city of gold, it would seem like she was aware and that perhaps Vlast and Aurene were meant to cycle all three domains and magic to each other? But now it's seeming like Aurene may have the possibility to replace all of them?

4. Wouldn't a giant island size land mass being plopped into the ocean create some massive tidal waves?

5. Where was Canach during this episode? Last episode he was helping us by setting up bombs in the mountain and with us during multiple instances, but this episode I don't think I heard him say a word of dialogue, he wasn't in the epilogue, and he didn't seem to really have much of a role? I guess because it was more focused on Braham, Rhytlock, and Logan due to their history with Kralk?

It's hard to tell, but it almost seemed like they were implying that Aurene could become a general replacement for multiple dragons given her ability to harmonize the different kinds of magic. The general feeling I got from this was that, it seems like they just wanted to not only finish Kralk, but just finish the elder dragon plot in general for quite some time. We have new dialogue that shows us that Elder Dragons or at least Kralk, seemingly aren't chaotic but become chaotic due to the magic they consume. They could essentially all be good or at least neutral to begin with, but then be corrupted themselves just as they spread their corruption to everything else.

So, for all we know, despite the implications that The All requires 6 elder dragons, they've pretty much opened way for this to be countered later on in that Aurene could just absorb more power. Adversely, we could discover that although she has a much higher tolerance and ability to withstand the magic, Kralk saying he hopes she never has to kill what she loves could be an indication that it's not a permanent state of harmony. That eventually, it will start taking a tole, in which we may need to find more elder dragon replacements to take in some of the excess magic she's carrying.

In general though, it seems like that's more of a... well this covers us for however long we need it to, in regards to the elder dragons.

I really do wonder if this was meant to wrap up this franchise in general, even with season 5 being announced earlier during the season. They've done some major reworks to the story it would seem from what I was reading on That Shaman's twitter.

The best bet in my opinion, is something a bit more spread out resolving multiple other plots that haven't had much going on. I think season 5 may very well wind up focusing on a return of the gods. Given how we've killed Balthazar and sucked in at least a part of Melandru, Balthazar, and Grenth's domains, it wouldn't be surprising to find out that the gods want to pay a little visit. We still have the Lyssa plot that hasn't really seen any more attention either.

Especially now with Aurene being the first of her kind and taking in multiple forms of magic, her existence would be of particular interest to the gods who only left to find a new world because they were unaware of the possibility of this happening. It does seem rather strange though, that Glint would so much about the forgotten, who potentially knew more about the gods and what they know, yet the gods would possibly not know about this potential solution to their previous problem.

Anyway, my bet is on the gods returning and having some involvement as the overarching story, but minor sub stories involving unresolved plots like Malyck's tree and what not.

But yes, the possibility of Bubbles taking more action now that we just plopped some of the gods domains into the northern part of the unending ocean could come to pass.

Lastly, it's hard to tell what direction Aurene is flying in when she glides back down from the stars and into the horizon, but it could be the charr homelands which would lead us into season 5 involving that area. It's really impossible to tell. Definitely no glaring hints or teasers about the next season though, and to be honest, I'm kind of torn between wanting something and just enjoying the fact that we don't have this cliffhanger keeping us on edge making us feel like it's the end of the world again. I think ending it this way was a great way to conclude Aurene's growth arc, even if I wish we had a way to visit her in her new elder dragon form somehow like the exalted portal stone or something.

> @"Mickey Frogeater.1470" said:

> > @"Sir Vincent III.1286" said:

> > > @"ChronoPinoyX.7923" said:

> > > > @"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:

> > > > That drawing by Scarlet directly conflicts with the Priory's map of the All. And Taimi's simulation that had the Tyria, the central orb, destabilize when Jormag's and Primordus' orbs died.

> > > >

> > > > 

> > > >

> > > > It would also make zero sense for Zhaitan's orb to crash into the Pale Tree (which was confirmed a representation of Zhaitan's magic spreading into Tyria, iirc), or for the Elder Dragons to revolve around the Pale Tree.

> > >

> > > Again, not talking about the Pale Tree here. Talking about something similar but on a world scale where all life originates from, hence "World Tree" where all life is born that summons an avatar similar to the Pale Tree.

> > >

> > > Not conflicting at all either since the central sphere remains the same as a representation where all life originates and the other spheres of influence can destroy that central sphere of life if imbalanced.

> >

> > This World Tree theory is interesting since the Mist, Tyria, and Elder Dragons somewhat represents 7 of the 9 realms in Norse Myth.

> > Asgard is the Mist

> > Midgard is Tyria

> > Muspelheim is Primo

> > Niflheim is Jormag

> > Alfheim is Mord

> > Helheim is Zhaitan

> > Svartalfheim is Kral

> > Deep Sea don't fit in any realm though...

> >

> > I'm not saying that this is where they got their reference, I simply find it interesting.

>

> [Ginnungagap apparently is tied to the Ocean in some Norse Texts(despite others claiming there was no Sea when the Ginnungagap first existed).](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ginnungagap#Geographic_rationalization "Ginnungagap apparently is tied to the Ocean in some Norse Texts(despite others claiming there was no Sea when the Ginnungagap first existed).")

>

> Deep Sea Dragon is Ginnungagap or Vanaheim(which is tied to Water and Woods)!

Njord is also a Vanir sea god and the father of Freyr and Frejya. Also something something favorable conditions for fisherman and seafarers. But the realm itself is described as a fertile realm of magic and light. Nidavellir is however the 9th and I'm not sure how it would fit into this equation.

I like the correlation. I don't know that it fits all that well, but it's a nice symmetry.

> @"linamaria.1830" said:

> > @"Malthosia.2613" said:

> But seriously, when there are five phases to a collection (including the one that could be done on launch day) and you can only do one phase per day, **having one of the phases take an additional four days** is a bit excessive, don't ya think?

> >

>

> IMHO, Anet should remove the 3 foods per day time-gate, **at least**.

> These additional days, for me, is being like a slap in the face of a lot of people who were already not necessarily happy with the original waiting times.

>

There's also no telling if the last two collection tiers require a similar, x number of this per day and 4 or more days to complete. So, best case, it could be … what.. 9 days? 8 days? I can't do math. And that's if you just buy the food and lamp.

The collection is definitely more geared to veteran players though. Because people just coming into the game are going to be so overwhelmed with this they won't even bother.

But yeah, I think people were up in arms about the initial timegate to begin with, but knowing we have an extra 4 days added onto it sent it over the edge. And it's just nonsensical anyway when you have the exact same feeding style collection with the beetle without a timegate.

Diving deeper into the collection, I honestly think it wouldn't be an issue if it weren't for the timegates and daily resets. As someone else mentioned, we can feed all of these treats in one day, but we can't feed all of the food? Didn't stop us from gorging the beetle.

And then waiting to do the next tier of the collection at reset?

I can see where they were going with some of these collections. I think this collection, aside from the first part and the tediousness of running back to the same starts, has made me think "oh, this is interesting.. I think someone posted about this on the forums and it looks like they're trying to incorporate it into the collection." Several of those moments with this third collection alone, and the second one was actually quite painless aside from taking awhile. I honestly don't mind collections like the second and third part, but I DO mind the fact that I have to wait an undetermined amount of days to continue the collection. If they had just implemented this without the timegate, I don't think we would have had nearly this much of a backlash.

Given the way this unlocks and the general silence about a lot of this aside from addressing that they've acknowledged our concerns, I really have to wonder if one of the later collections unlocks a special skin and the timegates locking the collections and even the rewards of those collections as well as their silence.. and wanting to wait until the 24th initially, are indicative of this. Perhaps that's giving them too much credit and it's just the base mount skin, but they really have incorporated a lot of things people have been requesting in this patch. I.e. A more H.O.T. style map meta, armor sets, weapon sets, stat changeable trinkets, decorations, tonics. So given the amount of people that requested in-game obtainable mount skins, it really wouldn't surprise me if this wound up being something they tested out or incorporated into this patch as well.

But if that were the case, I think having a hidden collection similar to the gryphon or something that leads you into it after already obtaining the mount and working on masteries would have been the better route, and much more well received.

In all actuality, this is probably just the base skin and meant to reflect our journey raising Aurene, but there's a slight glimmer of hope there's more to it than that.

In terms of what someone else said about the map being empty and much smaller, I do feel like the map is significantly smaller but it's fairly well designed and it doesn't feel as empty as other maps like Sandswept or Kourna to me. It would just be MUCH better if I had access to the mount. ESPECIALLY if I had access to the rental mount without needing to make it that far into the story. Which is definitely something that should be revised at the very least, upon at least one story completion of course. But that might be tricky considering the way it's currently implemented and integrated into the story. (But again, if someone's already done it, it's not exactly going to be immersion breaking.)

> @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > @"Teratus.2859" said:

> > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > > @"Teratus.2859" said:

> > > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > > > > @"Teratus.2859" said:

> > > > > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > > > > > > @"Teratus.2859" said:

> > > > > > > > I'm disappointed that there is no mastery that either increases the flight bar or slows down it's use to allow for longer flight.

> > > > > > > > And again disappointed that Skyscales much like Griffons are unable to utalize updrafts when they should be able to.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > At least once we've unlocked the last mastery we'll be able to exchange endurance to charge flight time while clinging to a wall so theoretically it might be possible to fly forever if endurance regens as it does on normal mounts.

> > > > > > > > Unless that flight bar is used for the jump and depleates instantly afterwards which will kinda suck.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > If you glide downward, even at a sight angle, the bar stops depleting.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I know, so long as there is some flight juice in the bar you can hover indefinitely.

> > > > > > What I want to know is if while mounted on a Skyscale the endurance bar regenerates like it does on all other mounts.

> > > > > > If it does then we can cling to walls, restore our flight bar and jump off the wall, hover a while then climb and repeat allowing us to essentialy gain as much hight as the terrain will allow for and fly for as long as we like more or less wherever we like.

> > > > >

> > > > > It does regenerate slowly as you glide downward but not enough for infinite flight.

> > > > >

> > > > > What you described with the wall also won’t happen as the mastery only restores a small amount and requires endurance.

> > > >

> > > > Not the flight bar the endurance bar, the yellow one all mounts have.

> > > > I want to know if that regenerates not the flight bar, I know the flight bar doesn't regenerate unless you decend.

> > >

> > > It won’t regenerate while attached to the wall. I also don’t think it’ll regenerate fast enough to allow you to continually regain altitude. The reason being that if you’re above your max altitude, it drains your flight meter if I remember correctly. It’s not something that I personally tested when trying it out over the past couple of days though.

> >

> > Well you need the mastery to unlock the ability to regenerate flight and jump from walls first, the map Skyscales don't have that ability.

> > Until I get my own Skyscale and unlock all the mastery's I won't be able to test it myself.

> > If the Endurance doesn't regenerate even with the bond ability then that will be a little disappointing even if it does make sense to have that limitation.

> > I like the idea of the Skyscale as a proper flier but I wish it was possible to extent it's flight bar, feels too small right now.

>

> You can theoretically test what happens if you’re above the max altitude by using the tornado during the final meta. I want to say that it forces you to drop but I never remained in the fixed position to see how far.

The way it behaves on tornadoes is just another nonsensical thing about the way this mount functions. The gryphon gains altitude and can use it as an updrafts, but this one just descends and you’re struck. I got hit by it once and was wondering why there was a glaring inconsistency even if minor.

It would seem they’re just censoring everything at this point. So I wouldn’t expect anything to change. It is what it is. But I guess it’s good to vocalize our disdain for the future. They took the meta complaints to heart and gave us a food one this episode. So they’re listening. I just don’t know why they thought this would be a good idea in the first place.

Well, apparently I was thinking of the one in Thunderhead Peaks instead of Derelict Delve in Dessert Highlands. So that's part of the issue. But it's still ridiculous.

I walked around the "lava room" for a good 10 minutes and never got the achievement for standing in the lava. Is the lava room different than the "fire room?"

Why would both not count even if so?

Also, the Derelict Delve is a one per account activity, so if you don't happen to get the "fire room" and the "water room" in one go, that's another 24 hours added onto this bullshit timegate.

And if the lava room is the correct room, then enjoy doing this shit with bugs.

The absolute fucking worst ever. Stop making collections, especially extremely tedious timegated collections if you're not going to code them to work. Obviously there will always be some margin of error, but if there are consistently bugs with collections and there always are, stop doing collections.

This shit is going to put me off of this game entirely. Disgraceful.

> @"Emberstone.2904" said:

> If I'm going to be artificially gated, I'm not even going to bother. The griffon stays in the air longer and flies faster, so the Skyscale collection/mount is not only terribly-designed content, it's a pointless addition to the game. I reinstalled GW2, hyped as hell for the patch, but now I'm mad that I wasted the bandwidth.

>

> If it took 5 days because it was incredibly involved, that's perfectly okay with me, but because it takes 5 days for no reason other than "because," I wouldn't do it even if it were an upgrade over the griffon. I initially started playing GW2 to get away from MMO tropes like this. I'm not staying around anymore if Anet is going to commit the same sins MMO's like WoW do these days.

It's going to take a lot longer than 5 days. During one of the other collections you have subcollections and at least one of those that we know of consists of collecting items that you can only get 3 of a day if I'm understanding that right. And the food that you have to make to obtain those items takes charged quartz crystals, which charge once a day. That's just for ONE of the sub collections within another collection series. So, who knows what will be involved with the others that people can't even access yet due to the current 5 day schedule. Not to mention, it sounds like a lot of these will require specific events that are also only available during certain times, and are known to be frequently bugged.

But yes, the general mount functionality seems like a Frankenstein of other mount technology with a cluster of restrictions upon restrictions, and apparently the acquisition is going to be an absolute grind.

I don't know if this whole collection process is meant to recapture what we went through with Aurene, especially for the new players that didn't play Heart of Thorns or living season 3 or what, but this is beyond excessive. I don't know why they suddenly decided to take every possible worst aspect of the collection system, increase it tenfold, and then pumped it into obtaining this mount. I could understand if it were superior to the others, but aside from hovering and unintentionally sticking to every surface from here to the mists with nothing to do but let go and attempt to glide back down or just use the mastery to launch yourself off, it does nothing the other mounts can't do better. At least not enough to warrant this insanity.

There's just no reason for any of this outside of doing exactly what lesser creative games do like World of Warcraft and putting hard stop time gates on things to stretch the feature out as long as possible.

> @"miraude.2107" said:

> Arenanet, you might as well just start putting any new mounts here on out in the cash shop the way ESO does so you can at least get some revenue for your work if people want something as special as this to be instant gratification.

> The community is getting a new, shiny mount for **FREE** because all we have to do is log in to get the episode and all we have to do is actually play the game to get it. At least show some respect to the devs and actually play the game? I mean this isn't the griffon, you can actually stay in the air with this mount. Anyone notice that the endurance bar fills when you descend and you can fly back up (I think a lot of you _didn't_ notice that judging from the yes votes)? I spent at least 45 minutes in the air messing around with that alone and never touched the ground in Dragonfall! Getting this mount means that I can easily avoid nearly everything in Tyria/HoT/PoF because there are few to no aerial threats to speak of in game. It makes sense that a mount like this can and should be time-gated, to make it worth the effort of getting it. So no, there is nothing wrong with this being time-gated as I can easily see this becoming a WvW/PvP nightmare and hearing the complaints on that end the moment it does start appearing.

There are some plenty of aerial threats in pof and hot. And the mount doesn’t go that high up or travel that far before you have to descend. Have you even tried the mount or are you just being blindly argumentative and condescending?