Mewcifer.5198

> @"Incar.7358" said:

> Call me old, call me crazy even, but I remember when the only new content that came to games was via expansion packs.

>

> Free content is free content. I may not like all of it, but I won't argue about what's included, especially knowing there IS an expansion on the way.

Yeah, same here. Regular free updates is a relatively new concept in video gaming, especially in MMOs.

People want things like mounts and gliders added. But it's hard to add things like mounts or gliders to living story because you will have people complaining about how they are locked out of it and need to buy previous episodes or else they can't continue the story because they need that gimmick.

I do wish they made the icebrood saga mastery tracks more useful in all maps though, not just the ones associated with the story. The LW4 masteries mostly improved mounts and so they were useful everywhere and was a step in the right direction. But then they took steps back in LW3's direction with the latest masteries (with the exception of the mount stealth)

I think the devs and the players had different idea's about what "expansion level content" meant.

Think about previous living world, most of the living stories were bridges in content rather than a full story themselves.

-LW1 was wonky in that anet wasn't originally planning on doing expansions so they tried to make the living world be a full plot. But they realized that the transient nature of it made that hard to do since you can't expect people to care as much about a story they missed the beginning of.

-So LW2 they switched things up a bit and made things instanced again. And LW2 wasn't it's own plotline. It was a leadup into the first expansion.

-LW3 had subplots but for the most part it was also a lead up to an expansion. It was like how TV shows will often have a lull between major story arcs. Things happened, they were interesting, but in the end it was all lead up into Path of fire.

-Lw4's things get a little different since this is where anet was thinking about not doing any more expansions. They wanted to tie up the loose end of Joko, but we also couldn't ignore Kralk. The writers didn't seem to think they could pull enough content from kralk to justify an entire season. But imho they probably could have managed enough for both to give them each one season. But I cant also say I know what I would have added in order to do that, so I can't judge. But overall the season looked like they were preparing for a new campaign to begin like how previous seasons prepared for expansions.

So I think to Anet "Expansion level content" is more about the fact that its a whole campaign of a story. Not a subplot, not a series of smaller events that prepare us for the next campaign. They wanted icebrood saga to be a large overarching, world changing plotline on par with fighting zhaitan, mordremoth, or balthazar.

But to players "Expansion level content" was about new gimmicks, new elite specs, new maps, etc. They imagined expansion to be about the mechanics because "well story is in the living world too". They wanted icebrood saga to add new mechanics that would create considerable changes in the game.

Consider me in on the idea of speedy snail

I don't see any need for this.

> @"Kosmo.3468" said:

> Any chances of getting some races reworked outside Gem Store cosmetics?

> Give the Charr a more bipedal posture, removing the hunchback.

> Give the male Norn a more proportional arm length, so they don't look like orangutans on steroids.

> More organic male human faces, so they don't look like plastic dolls.

I thought this thread just just going to suggest some graphics updates. Like increasing texture resolution on player models or something.

This seems more like you want to have them change character _design_ to better fit your preferences.

> @"VelvetJelly.2896" said:

> More often than none it is a slap in the face after a Meta and you get gear thats soulbinded to a character who cant use it nor sell it.

Don't they usually only get soulbound after they have been equipped?

> @"reapex.8546" said:

> ## Devourer Burrow

> 1st Race

> All guildies receive the first chest except one person.

>

> 2nd Race (we restarted)

> We ran the one guildie through the new guild rush twice, they did not receive the chest and time expired.

>

Did you make sure to double check they were repping the guild and had not gotten rewards for that mission slot with another guild already?

> @"Josiah.2967" said:

> I agree with everyone else. I use the celestial infusion with my Starlight Outfit, because the helm is so awful on Asura. Being a necro teletubby just isn't for me.

>

> Alternative: Just add the upgraded infusion in the Gemstore. Keep the current one, and let us buy that. Hopefully we can get a dye-able infusion that way. *drool*

That alternative is a horrible idea. Infusions are one of the biggest in-game rewards. To add a gem-store infusion that is a direct upgrade to a previously existing reward would be a very bad move. It would anger a lot of people and set a bad precedent for future things.

Replayability is made up of a combination of various things.

-Fun/Sense of accomplishment

-New experiences

-Rewards

It doesn't have to have all three things, but the more it has, the more replayable it is. Personally I think the first two points are more important, but rewards should never be neglected too much. No matter how fun something might be there will always be the nagging feeling of wasting time if there is another activity that gives exponentially better rewards. If an activity is heavily leaning towards at least one, then it is generally okay if the other two are somewhat lacking.

Map Completion is an example of points 1 and 3. (At least I find it fun). It is never anything new. But each map has a 25% chance of a black lion key, which is a decent reward, especially for those who don't want to spend gold or gems on them.

Raids/fractals also have points 1 and 3. Except instead of purely fun it leans more towards a sense of accomplishment. Although, often times people eventually get bored with doing the same fights over and over. The fractal instabilities sort of make each run different, but it isn't a big difference.

I think the biggest thing lacking in gw2 when it comes to replayability is new experiences. The personal story had choices that lead to different story paths, which meant playing it through on different characters could give you a new experience each time. HoT had some choices that did this as well. But since then there hasn't been much in the way of creating a new experience. The choices we got to make in PoF were barely noticeable.

And there are some things that can damage the sense of replayability. Like, even if an event has really good rewards, people won't want to replay it if the whole thing is a painfully slow slog of mindless things while waiting on some timer to tick down (cough raven's keep cough), or if they find themselves failing the activity over and over and over again due to some RNG thing.

I think many people are missing the distinction between *can* be done solo and designed to be soloable. I am not going to argue about this though.

> @"Randulf.7614" said:

> Maybe a feedback thread on what you would like to see might be better in a couple of weeks when the devs are in the office. Ill be surprised if any read the forums over this period

I don't know about the forums but I can say for certain at least some devs are reading the subreddit. They are working from home so there isn't a reason to assume they won't be looking at the places they normally look.

> @"dodgerrule.8739" said:

> Actually group content was forced in guild wars 2 main campaign as the final story mission. So saying that it was never forced before is false.

If you are saying this as a reply to my original post that started this thread then you very clearly did not read what I said. If you are replying to someone else, you should probably use the quote feature.

Answering the questions in the raven sanctum is great. I absolutely love that there is no wrong or right answers.

The first time I played it I was left feeling like I had answered everything wrong.

Playing through it again to hear all the responses and all the flavourtext on the buff it gives was a real treat.

And the different meanings to each choice and question are great.

To the devs who worked on this, especially the narrative dialog: You did an amazing job.

Eyy a housing thread again.

My view on player housing is that it's a pretty unnecessary addition to the game. However, people clearly want it. So it wouldn't be a bad addition either. I am not going to go around asking anet for it, but if it was implemented I would find it enjoyable.

My view on how to best implement player housing: make them function similar to guild halls

Allow the player to pick from several locations and require them to go in an clear it out of some enemy (grawl, skritt, giant spiders, whatever). Allow them to take a party in with them if they want help from friends. If they want to change locations they have to clear out the new location. The locations should be a small map that include a house with at least some outdoor space around it.

Once they have established their house they should have weekly missions that are designed for solo or party play that give them a currency similar to guild favour, they can spend this at a butler or housekeeper of some kind to get upgrades to their house (and once all upgrades are completed maybe something like map currencies or unid gear). Like guild missions, let them pick from PvP, WvW, PvE, or random missions. The missions can be used to encourage players to do things they might not always think to do. Like requiring certain world boss kills or meta events. This can be used to move people around in the maps every week to keep older content a little fresher. (Granted not everyone will be doing these missions so the population shift might not be super drastic, but it still might introduce players to places or content they might not have noticed before, which is also nice)

An early upgrade could be a material generation thing, but unlike the mine for guild halls it could be a garden or something. Upgrades can be mild convenience things like repair anvil, bank access, crafting tables, etc, or they can be more decorative like a stable that has your unlocked mounts (bonus points if it shows what skins you have equipped on them), a library of all the lore books you have collected, a trophy room with trophies for certain achievements or something. There can also be different music options for your home that can be unlocked with upgrades, and possibly some upgrades that let you customize it's look more by having different textures/shades of wood and such for the building.

Allow players to purchase or craft decorations and decorate their house like how guild halls can be decorated.

Allow players to bring friends into their house via parties so they can have private, personalized, areas to RP or to just show off what they made of their place.

Have some achievements associated with claiming and fully upgrading your home instance with a title for the latter. Maybe something like Estate Baron or Real Estate Agent, who knows.

> @"Tazer.2157" said:

> > @"Mewcifer.5198" said:

> > Why is a 5-10 man instanced strike _required_ to complete the story? Requiring other players for story content hasn't been a thing since before you made killing Zhaitan a soloable instance. I am not happy about this. I get you want people to do strikes, but forcing it on people who want to play the main story is not the way to go about it.

> >

> > I prefer my first playthrough of new story content to be done solo so that I don't have the distraction of another player. Now, not only do I need another player, but if my friends arent online and willing to do it with me I am stuck with randoms who are even more of a disruption to my enjoyment of lore and story.

> >

> > Bad choice Anet. Normally I am a "white knight" (as some people have tried to call me) about the game. But this really gets under my skin.

>

> Disagree, the other players make this fun. The music, the other players and the npcs make me feel as a part of the warband. Its chaotic, its fast and that adds to the atmosphere. Doing this solo would be a big bore and make the instance longer than it already is. You can still do the content and not have anyone distract you. I am not sure how randoms would distract you and take away from your enjoyment of the lore. If lore is what you are really after, I would think you would appreciate the lore of having other players in your warband. The instance is long enough to allow you to go through the achievements. This is honestly the best story mission I have experienced in the entire game and I wish Anet releases more content this way. It was ridiculous that we were able to take down the elder dragons and even a god solo.

It is good group content, lot's of fun, but I still do not like them making instanced group content a requirement for completing a chapter in my story journal. (Although many people saying it is soloable I have also been seeing many people saying it is incredibly difficult to do solo.)

> @"killermanjaro.5670" said:

> I have to admit I was annoyed when it came up with the group message for a story instance, but thankfully it was actually fine and nothing to worry about in the end. What worried me was that 1-2 players would run ahead skipping battles/story bits and I'd not get to enjoy it as I'd have to rush to keep up, or that some might treat it like a raid and start hurling abuse in chat if I didn't have a set build & perfect dps. But thankfully the way it was desgiend meant none of that was an issue, you go at the pace of the npcs, and there's not really anything tough enough for people to worry about builds/optimal dps. In the end my group just got on with it like any open world meta or event and it was just as enjoyable.

>

> So for anyone who hasn't played it yet and is put off by hearing its group content, don't worry if you had the concerns I did where it might end up like a raid, or fractal speed run, it won't, it'll just be like any other open world meta/event chain. With that being said I do agree with those saying that story should be doable solo.

That was also a worry, as well as running into trolls who would fuck around instead of actually trying to get things done.

The content itself is pretty fun though. I managed to get enough guildies to do it earlier. I'm hoping to get some of my more experienced friends on at some point to do the CMs.

> @"Thornwolf.9721" said:

> > @"Mewcifer.5198" said:

> > The latest story requires 5-10 man instanced content in order to complete it. Anet has not required group content for story since the original Zhaitan fight which they later changed to be soloable.

> >

> > Making group content required for the story is a step backwards.

> > I prefer my first playthrough of new story content to be done solo so that I don't have the distraction of another player. Now, not only do I need another player, but if my friends arent online and willing to do it with me I am stuck with randoms who are even more of a disruption to my enjoyment of lore and story.

> >

> > I know anet wants to push players into trying out strikes but this is not the way to do it.

> > A chapter in my story journal should not require group content.

>

> Its a step forward, Reinforce people to join guilds and play an MMORPG together. For too long guild wars 2 has tried to be both a single player game, and a multiplayer and I believe it was to get people to try visions of the past. Im not against it, it was and is a lot of fun and I've enjoyed it quite a lot more so than I initially thought I would as its got a lot of lore and feels good to play.

>

> If you dislike this wait until the woodland cascades come next, its said to be a pve variant of WvW so I imagine its gonna require TONS of group content to actually work and get you to your story. I like this direction~

Historically a game company making a sizable change to the philosophy of their games and how they are played does not work out well for them.

> @"Sigmoid.7082" said:

> > @"Mewcifer.5198" said:

> > > @"Sigmoid.7082" said:

> > > > @"Mewcifer.5198" said:

> > > > Wow, I see a lot of strawmanning in the responses to me. So here we go:

> > > > Every single MMO still has content that can be done solo, the amount of soloable content can vary but GW2 has always leaned heavily into being more solo friendly and allowing people to pick and choose when to interact with others and who they want to interact with (such as not having things like group queues that toss you into a group of randoms until recently with the public strike missions)

> > > > I do not want anet to stop making group content.

> > > > I play group content in GW2 all the time.

> > > > Story has just been traditionally a solo or party-optional part of the game, and I enjoyed it this way as it allowed me to take in the story and lore at my own pace without the distraction of other players and potential trolls.

> > > > I do not always have friends available to play with and pugs are notorious for being bad to the point that its almost worse to have them around than to be solo.

> > > > The mission needed for this story is tons of fun and I enjoy playing it, but I still feel it should not have been required to advance the story in my story journal.

> > >

> > > So this boils down to where the progress of the content is recorded: in your story journal?

> >

> > Yes and no.

> > The fact that it's in the story journal is a big part of it. But there is also the possibility that the information we get from this release will be directly tied into the story later, so that even if it wasn't in the story journal the game would still expect you to have done it in order to understand a major plot point. (A pitfall that gw2 had when it came to dungeons and how if you didn't do the storymode for them you were suddenly met with a group of people who hated each other getting along again and you aren't sure what happened to change that)

>

> Why are you making this sound like something new?

>

> I mean by and large instanced or group content has always been used to tell potentially related but not overall important part of any given story in the game. You don't really need to understand the whole story of the dungeons or raids to get the major plot points, let alone understand the story and it's direction.

>

> If this wasn't in the story journal I feel very confident in saying this thread would not exist. It literally seems is the fact that it's in the story journal that is your problem.

You clearly did not read what I just said.

> @"Sigmoid.7082" said:

> > @"Mewcifer.5198" said:

> > Wow, I see a lot of strawmanning in the responses to me. So here we go:

> > Every single MMO still has content that can be done solo, the amount of soloable content can vary but GW2 has always leaned heavily into being more solo friendly and allowing people to pick and choose when to interact with others and who they want to interact with (such as not having things like group queues that toss you into a group of randoms until recently with the public strike missions)

> > I do not want anet to stop making group content.

> > I play group content in GW2 all the time.

> > Story has just been traditionally a solo or party-optional part of the game, and I enjoyed it this way as it allowed me to take in the story and lore at my own pace without the distraction of other players and potential trolls.

> > I do not always have friends available to play with and pugs are notorious for being bad to the point that its almost worse to have them around than to be solo.

> > The mission needed for this story is tons of fun and I enjoy playing it, but I still feel it should not have been required to advance the story in my story journal.

>

> So this boils down to where the progress of the content is recorded: in your story journal?

Yes and no.

The fact that it's in the story journal is a big part of it. But there is also the possibility that the information we get from this release will be directly tied into the story later, so that even if it wasn't in the story journal the game would still expect you to have done it in order to understand a major plot point. (A pitfall that gw2 had when it came to dungeons and how if you didn't do the storymode for them you were suddenly met with a group of people who hated each other getting along again and you aren't sure what happened to change that)

> @"Kanok.3027" said:

> You know what? Let's let the people that want Tengu as a playable race have it. It means the expansion will be delayed even further, thus putting it another year or so out because of all the work involved. Let it happen!

That is assuming it is not already being planned for.

Wow, I see a lot of strawmanning in the responses to me. So here we go:

Every single MMO still has content that can be done solo, the amount of soloable content can vary but GW2 has always leaned heavily into being more solo friendly and allowing people to pick and choose when to interact with others and who they want to interact with (such as not having things like group queues that toss you into a group of randoms until recently with the public strike missions)

I do not want anet to stop making group content.

I play group content in GW2 all the time.

Story has just been traditionally a solo or party-optional part of the game, and I enjoyed it this way as it allowed me to take in the story and lore at my own pace without the distraction of other players and potential trolls.

I do not always have friends available to play with and pugs are notorious for being bad to the point that its almost worse to have them around than to be solo.

The mission needed for this story is tons of fun and I enjoy playing it, but I still feel it should not have been required to advance the story in my story journal.

I want to put it out there that despite me being disappointed that the story requires the group content. The group content is still very fun. I just wish it wasn't required.

> @"SkyCakeLight.3750" said:

> I personally really enjoyed it despite the several bugs I encountered. But! I do agree that it needs a solo option for people that would rather that. Not a "can be solo'd if you're max special uber l337 alpha gamer with a pro chair" kind of solo. But, the same (or relatively the same) pacing as all the other story content in the game.

>

> After making that an option, please add more public story missions with optional solo because I really enjoyed hoping around with a couple of other people and playing with the tank.

It is at least a little encouraging that I have heard it can be done with <5 people if they have a basic understanding of what they are doing. So when I am able to grab some friends I won't have to grab for a full 10 people.

Still a little frustrating that it's group oriented content to begin with, but not like my complaining will change it now. I just hope this isn't the start of a trend.

> @"Randulf.7614" said:

> > @"Zok.4956" said:

> > > @"Mewcifer.5198" said:

> > > > @"Randulf.7614" said:

> > > > > @"Mewcifer.5198" said:

> > > > > > @"Randulf.7614" said:

> > > > > > > @"Mewcifer.5198" said:

> > > > > > > Why is a 5-10 man instanced strike _required_ to complete the story? Requiring other players for story content hasn't been a thing since before you made killing Zhaitan a soloable instance. I am not happy about this. I get you want people to do strikes, but forcing it on people who want to play the main story is not the way to go about it.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I prefer my first playthrough of new story content to be done solo so that I don't have the distraction of another player. Now, not only do I need another player, but if my friends arent online and willing to do it with me I am stuck with randoms who are even more of a disruption to my enjoyment of lore and story.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Bad choice Anet. Normally I am a "white knight" (as some people have tried to call me) about the game. But this really gets under my skin.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > If you mean the Steelwarband stuff it's all just side story. It's similar to a dungeon to be honest just with public access.

> > > > >

> > > > > Dungeons were never required to complete the story with the exception of killing Zhaitan and Anet changed that to a soloable instance for the story. This is a step backwards.

> > > >

> > > > Yeah they were all side story stuff that tied into the main plot. This is this same. It's not main story like in an episode. Unless I am missing something, you don't need to do this either to progress the main plot which will pick up naturally in episode 3 after SAB. It will just fill in some past details. Like the dungeons did for the DE story arc

> > >

> > > It is different because this is a chapter in the story journal that can't be completed without doing it.

> >

> > And it seems, that you have to finish this visons-episode, to be able to play the season 1 instances. But I am not sure about it, because the second strike mission/vision/story step can not be started because of a bug.

> >

> >

>

> OK, if true then I am a lot more understanding. Because LS1 would should not be locked behind future content. If that is the gripe, then I will agree with the problem if is true

Based on what Anet said in the release it is true that replaying things from LS1 is locked behind having this episode unlocked and completing the story.

> @"Randulf.7614" said:

> So realistically the only thing of concern here is the position of the content within the UI. Because this isn't main story and it isn't required to progress to ep3 when it comes out. It is just filler content (and quite good fun I have to say) between the actual episodes

>

> If they moved it to a different part of the achievement UI, I take it it would no longer be an issue?

Yeah, if it was moved to say, current events, I would be less bothered by it. But the fact that it is in the story journal seems to indicate that it will be more directly meaningful to the main story than dungeons or other side events.

They have added content to the game before without it being in the story journal.

The latest story requires 5-10 man instanced content in order to complete it. Anet has not required group content for story since the original Zhaitan fight which they later changed to be soloable.

Making group content required for the story is a step backwards.

I prefer my first playthrough of new story content to be done solo so that I don't have the distraction of another player. Now, not only do I need another player, but if my friends arent online and willing to do it with me I am stuck with randoms who are even more of a disruption to my enjoyment of lore and story.

I know anet wants to push players into trying out strikes but this is not the way to do it.

A chapter in my story journal should not require group content.