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If you're complaining about LR Ele the problem is your play


Poelala.2830

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> @"youle.5824" said:

> > @"Kuma.1503" said:

> > > @"youle.5824" said:

> > > Lightning rod with tornado is currently pretty cancer in 1v1.

> >

> > It's annoying, but it's also risky. One of my favorite ways to counter nado is by giving myself stab, and then bursting hard into it. Ele is pretty squishy regardless of build when they're unable to evade or re-sustain,.

> >

> > If I don't have good access to stab, I've also had good success shutting them down with immob. Hold them still then burst.

> >

> > Failing that, you can break stun and use any mobility you might have to gain some distance. If you've got ranged pressure, you can counter it with that. Just watch out for skill 5.

> >

> > If your build somehow lacks access to all of these... Idk, have fun doing your best impression of a rag doll because you're going for a ride, lol.

> >

> > `

>

> All these counter and stab corrupt are only possible vs average and below eles, good one pop tornado on top of you after waiting for your stunbreaks to be poped, this way you're cc chained from start to end of tornado and end up 100-0 hp with LR dmg

Bouncy "elecrified tornado" hit a lot too btw

@"Arheundel.6451"

Why you insist on being wrong all the time? 2 the best NA team ran LRod eles and obviosly 1 of them won :joy:

The only time they used word "degenerate" was about deleted trait, not about the class.

P.S raging in game calling ranger broken and insult everyone who slaughtering you on it but on forum "ranger is fine, dont touch!1111", you are such a joke

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> @"youle.5824" said:

 

> All these counter and stab corrupt are only possible vs average and below eles, good one pop tornado on top of you after waiting for your stunbreaks to be poped, this way you're cc chained from start to end of tornado and end up 100-0 hp with LR dmg

 

Well yes, when counterplay exists, there generally exists counterplay to the counterplay, otherwise the skill and/or class in question is unviable against anyone who knows what they're doing.

 

I must ask though, if you've just blown all of your stunbreaks and any skill that can grant you stab, why are you still standing next to a LR ele? It should already be in your mind before you use that skill that it's high time you disengaged this fight or you're going to take a butt load of damage. Saying nado will 100-0 you is a bit misleading as well. It will chunk you for a good portion of your health bar, but it will not singlehandedly kill you from full. Not unless both you and the Ele in question are running full glass... and here I must pose another question. How did you manage to last in a fight with a glass ele long enough that you were able to burn through all of your defensive cooldowns without either one of you netting a kill?

 

 

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> @"Odik.4587" said:

> > @"youle.5824" said:

> > > @"Kuma.1503" said:

> > > > @"youle.5824" said:

> > > > Lightning rod with tornado is currently pretty cancer in 1v1.

> > >

> > > It's annoying, but it's also risky. One of my favorite ways to counter nado is by giving myself stab, and then bursting hard into it. Ele is pretty squishy regardless of build when they're unable to evade or re-sustain,.

> > >

> > > If I don't have good access to stab, I've also had good success shutting them down with immob. Hold them still then burst.

> > >

> > > Failing that, you can break stun and use any mobility you might have to gain some distance. If you've got ranged pressure, you can counter it with that. Just watch out for skill 5.

> > >

> > > If your build somehow lacks access to all of these... Idk, have fun doing your best impression of a rag doll because you're going for a ride, lol.

> > >

> > > `

> >

> > All these counter and stab corrupt are only possible vs average and below eles, good one pop tornado on top of you after waiting for your stunbreaks to be poped, this way you're cc chained from start to end of tornado and end up 100-0 hp with LR dmg

> Bouncy "elecrified tornado" hit a lot too btw

> @"Arheundel.6451"

> Why you insist on being clueless and wrong all the time? 2 the best NA team ran LRod eles :joy:

> The only time they used word "degenerate" was about deleted trait, not about the class.

> P.S raging in game calling ranger broken and insult everyone who slaughtering you on it but on forum "ranger is fine, dont touch!1111", you are such a joke

 

I still have screenshots of your rants you whispered before being blocked..other than some **resign when losing free arena hero** ...I don't recognize you, I won't waste time replying anymore ...your vitriolic posts are now boring, you spend more time asking for nerfs than anything else.

 

The winning team from last tournament had a mesmer, many teams in EU had mesmer....it's time for you (and your ilk) **to get good**, spend less time on the forum and more in game...my suggestion to you

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> @"Arheundel.6451" said:

> > @"Odik.4587" said:

> > > @"youle.5824" said:

> > > > @"Kuma.1503" said:

> > > > > @"youle.5824" said:

> > > > > Lightning rod with tornado is currently pretty cancer in 1v1.

> > > >

> > > > It's annoying, but it's also risky. One of my favorite ways to counter nado is by giving myself stab, and then bursting hard into it. Ele is pretty squishy regardless of build when they're unable to evade or re-sustain,.

> > > >

> > > > If I don't have good access to stab, I've also had good success shutting them down with immob. Hold them still then burst.

> > > >

> > > > Failing that, you can break stun and use any mobility you might have to gain some distance. If you've got ranged pressure, you can counter it with that. Just watch out for skill 5.

> > > >

> > > > If your build somehow lacks access to all of these... Idk, have fun doing your best impression of a rag doll because you're going for a ride, lol.

> > > >

> > > > `

> > >

> > > All these counter and stab corrupt are only possible vs average and below eles, good one pop tornado on top of you after waiting for your stunbreaks to be poped, this way you're cc chained from start to end of tornado and end up 100-0 hp with LR dmg

> > Bouncy "elecrified tornado" hit a lot too btw

> > @"Arheundel.6451"

> > Why you insist on being clueless and wrong all the time? 2 the best NA team ran LRod eles :joy:

> > The only time they used word "degenerate" was about deleted trait, not about the class.

> > P.S raging in game calling ranger broken and insult everyone who slaughtering you on it but on forum "ranger is fine, dont touch!1111", you are such a joke

>

> I still have screenshots of your rants you whispered before being blocked..other than some **resign when losing free arena hero** ...I don't recognize you ...your vitriolic posts are now boring, you spend more time asking for nerfs than anything else.

Nice false accusations, I dare you, post it, because unlike you, I didnt answer with insults (at least not in the game :> )

I cant help to cure your hypocrisy and stop you from false accusations without evidence :D

> The winning team from last tournament had a mesmer, many teams in EU had mesmer....it's time for you (and your ilk) **to get good**, spend less time on the forum and more in game...my suggestion to you

NA had no mesmers at all, even Zeromis played core necro, there was other mesmer player also had to play rev. EU - desperate attempts to counter Misha portals :)

Also NA had 2 rangers and 1 of them in finals, alrdy told you, in case you have short memory. Are you done with irrelevant derailing?

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Just to make it clear, nerfing LR won't stop cc chains in team fights. It won't stop tornado from rolling over you like a rag doll.

 

Ele's CC's will still exist. A nerf to LR will only nerf the small power damage Ele's have left and the huge defensive condition they rely on.

 

So that's really what these complaints are about. Nerf Fire Weaver. Nerf LR Weaver. Ele's can only play bunker builds

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> @"Crozame.4098" said:

> At the very least, the concept of no dmg to CC skills is a joke on LR. I don't care how they fix this, but as long as it is in line with all other CC skills, I am happy.

>

> Oh, and make the Elit CC blockable would also be nice.

 

If you can't realize you need to dodge instead of block a skill with 3/4 or more casttime, you probably should go to a duelling server.

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> @"Grimjack.8130" said:

> > @"Crozame.4098" said:

> > At the very least, the concept of no dmg to CC skills is a joke on LR. I don't care how they fix this, but as long as it is in line with all other CC skills, I am happy.

> >

> > Oh, and make the Elit CC blockable would also be nice.

>

> If you can't realize you need to dodge instead of block a skill with 3/4 or more casttime, you probably should go to a duelling server.

 

5 CC's, then shocking aura, and nado. Too many things to dodge! Something must be nerfed.

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> @"Eurantien.4632" said:

> > @"Grimjack.8130" said:

> > > @"Crozame.4098" said:

> > > At the very least, the concept of no dmg to CC skills is a joke on LR. I don't care how they fix this, but as long as it is in line with all other CC skills, I am happy.

> > >

> > > Oh, and make the Elit CC blockable would also be nice.

> >

> > If you can't realize you need to dodge instead of block a skill with 3/4 or more casttime, you probably should go to a duelling server.

>

> 5 CC's, then shocking aura, and nado. Too many things to dodge! Something must be nerfed.

 

That argument can be said for literally every single class in the game.

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I don't think people are saying it's OP as much as it is obnoxious and a generally unhealthy direction for the game mode.

 

When two teams both have Eles at mid and are perma CCing each other for 5 minutes straight, that's too much CC man. It gunks up the fluid combat dynamic that this game once had. Also, we aren't even talking precision CCs that require hitting a target. No, this is just a bunch of passive atmospheric CC that is constantly pulsing all over the place against every target.

 

I mean... come on now. I understand if an Elite Skill is providing an effect like this, but when a class can just generate effects like this all over itself and its team mates with normal combat cycles, it's too much.

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> @"Arheundel.6451" said:

> nobody but mesmer in this game ever seen an entire traitline banned from tournaments.

 

Also this is unture. 1v1 tournies back in HoT banned Ranger from using BM together with wilderness survival, meaning you could only take one or the other.

 

Can you please stop derailing and lying to push your agenda? This crap is why the game is as bad as it is.

 

-----

As for Ele I think it's mostly fair on it's own, 1v1 it isn't an issue, just in team fights I think it should have a higher skill floor to be effective. It brings to much CC way to easily and dominates the nature of the team fight in a way that isn't fun for conquest. I don't particularly think it needs to be nerfed, I think the game needs to evolve away from the game mode to something better... But if not then it is unhealthy.

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> @"Daishi.6027" said:

> > @"Arheundel.6451" said:

> > nobody but mesmer in this game ever seen an entire traitline banned from tournaments.

>

> Also this is unture. 1v1 tournies back in HoT banned Ranger from using BM together with wilderness survival, meaning you could only take one or the other.

>

> Can you please stop derailing and lying to push your agenda? This kitten is why the game is as bad as it is.

>

> -----

> As for Ele I think it's mostly fair on it's own, 1v1 it isn't an issue just in team fights I think it should have a higher skill floor to be effective. It brings to much CC way to easily and dominates the nature of the team fight in a way that isn't fun for conquest. I don't particularly think it needs to be nerfed, I think the game needs to evolve away from the game mode to something better... But if not then it is unhealthy.

 

Accusing me of lying won't change anything....

 

I have no personal agenda, **the devs won't nerf the game out of existence**, all points have been made and decisions from the devs will follow...no class will be left out of playable level ever, I will adapt as I have done for the last 8 years in this game.

 

 

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> @"Stallic.2397" said:

> Just to make it clear, nerfing LR won't stop cc chains in team fights. It won't stop tornado from rolling over you like a rag doll.

>

> Ele's CC's will still exist. A nerf to LR will only nerf the small power damage Ele's have left and the huge defensive condition they rely on.

>

> So that's really what these complaints are about. Nerf Fire Weaver. Nerf LR Weaver. Ele's can only play bunker builds

 

Let them be...

The devs will buff something else on ele anyway....

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> @"Poelala.2830" said:

Ranger, play intelligently.

 

lol, cant happen. anyway dont know what the big problem is tho with this ele build. my experience is that a worse ele player loses the matchup, a better one wins. atleast thats how i feel, not sure how ele feels about that. all from slb perspective

 

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> @"Shao.7236" said:

> It's pretty misleading, people have two evades and there's 5 CC's to avoid without counting Tornado, it's clear that without Stability to counter it can dominate any fights because Weakness and preventing any skill to be used while doing damage is a lot in one place.

>

> Reducing damage on LR to make others worth something rather than just roll everything is the better solution.

 

I think one thing that's really brought more attention to it is no-one is running stability in any form anymore. Back in core you'd have double balanced stance warriors, guards giving good uptime on stab and there was a bit dotted around for many classes, coupled with CC being on longer cool downs.

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> @"apharma.3741" said:

> > @"Shao.7236" said:

> > It's pretty misleading, people have two evades and there's 5 CC's to avoid without counting Tornado, it's clear that without Stability to counter it can dominate any fights because Weakness and preventing any skill to be used while doing damage is a lot in one place.

> >

> > Reducing damage on LR to make others worth something rather than just roll everything is the better solution.

>

> I think one thing that's really brought more attention to it is no-one is running stability in any form anymore. Back in core you'd have double balanced stance warriors, guards giving good uptime on stab and there was a bit dotted around for many classes, coupled with CC being on longer cool downs.

Shall we return good old CI then? Its was people fault that they didnt ran double stability utilities after all :joy:

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> @"Grimjack.8130" said:

> > @"Crozame.4098" said:

> > At the very least, the concept of no dmg to CC skills is a joke on LR. I don't care how they fix this, but as long as it is in line with all other CC skills, I am happy.

> >

> > Oh, and make the Elit CC blockable would also be nice.

>

> If you can't realize you need to dodge instead of block a skill with 3/4 or more casttime, you probably should go to a duelling server.

 

5 CC's, then shocking aura, and nado. Too many things to dodge! Something must be nerfed.> @"Grimjack.8130" said:

> > @"Eurantien.4632" said:

> > > @"Grimjack.8130" said:

> > > > @"Crozame.4098" said:

> > > > At the very least, the concept of no dmg to CC skills is a joke on LR. I don't care how they fix this, but as long as it is in line with all other CC skills, I am happy.

> > > >

> > > > Oh, and make the Elit CC blockable would also be nice.

> > >

> > > If you can't realize you need to dodge instead of block a skill with 3/4 or more casttime, you probably should go to a duelling server.

> >

> > 5 CC's, then shocking aura, and nado. Too many things to dodge! Something must be nerfed.

>

> That argument can be said for literally every single class in the game.

 

Right!?!?!

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> @"Odik.4587" said:

> > @"apharma.3741" said:

> > > @"Shao.7236" said:

> > > It's pretty misleading, people have two evades and there's 5 CC's to avoid without counting Tornado, it's clear that without Stability to counter it can dominate any fights because Weakness and preventing any skill to be used while doing damage is a lot in one place.

> > >

> > > Reducing damage on LR to make others worth something rather than just roll everything is the better solution.

> >

> > I think one thing that's really brought more attention to it is no-one is running stability in any form anymore. Back in core you'd have double balanced stance warriors, guards giving good uptime on stab and there was a bit dotted around for many classes, coupled with CC being on longer cool downs.

> Shall we return good old CI then? Its was people fault that they didnt ran double stability utilities after all :joy:

 

Old CI was a problem of mesmer having double or more the CC it ever had in core. LR is a problem because weaver now has more CC than ele originally had and they're all on 20s or below CDs while core ele only really had shocking aura and some CC on the offhand:

Sword: Gale Strike, Polaric leap

Dagger: Katabatic Winds, Mudslide

 

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/1004275#Comment_1004275

 

Edit: "If you're happy with it then sure nerf CI and every on CC trait or interrupt trait into the floor and below, break out the guy who invented the abomination of balance that is sbooning and sic'em onto it." oh look people are complaining about most on CC traits now. _sips_

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> @"apharma.3741" said:

> > @"Odik.4587" said:

> > > @"apharma.3741" said:

> > > > @"Shao.7236" said:

> > > > It's pretty misleading, people have two evades and there's 5 CC's to avoid without counting Tornado, it's clear that without Stability to counter it can dominate any fights because Weakness and preventing any skill to be used while doing damage is a lot in one place.

> > > >

> > > > Reducing damage on LR to make others worth something rather than just roll everything is the better solution.

> > >

> > > I think one thing that's really brought more attention to it is no-one is running stability in any form anymore. Back in core you'd have double balanced stance warriors, guards giving good uptime on stab and there was a bit dotted around for many classes, coupled with CC being on longer cool downs.

> > Shall we return good old CI then? Its was people fault that they didnt ran double stability utilities after all :joy:

>

> Old CI was a problem of mesmer having double or more the CC it ever had in core. LR is a problem because weaver now has more CC than ele originally had and they're all on 20s or below CDs while core ele only really had shocking aura and some CC on the offhand:

> Sword: Gale Strike, Polaric leap

> Dagger: Katabatic Winds, Mudslide

>

> https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/1004275#Comment_1004275

>

> Edit: "If you're happy with it then sure nerf CI and every on CC trait or interrupt trait into the floor and below, break out the guy who invented the abomination of balance that is sbooning and sic'em onto it." oh look people are complaining about most on CC traits now. _sips_

You surely forgot about shocking aura and now add to it focus CC's. LRod always was cancer, its not even on "interrupt", you just spam it to kill. It deserves the same fate as LostTime - deleted.

Actually wait, how come mesmer had twice less CC's than now? The only difference is mantra of distraction was buffed over the time. Ah yes, they allowed useless traits to be proc'd on heal in 2017, forgot that one :)

And it was a joke about returning CI ;)

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> @"Grimjack.8130" said:

> > @"Eurantien.4632" said:

> > > @"Grimjack.8130" said:

> > > > @"Crozame.4098" said:

> > > > At the very least, the concept of no dmg to CC skills is a joke on LR. I don't care how they fix this, but as long as it is in line with all other CC skills, I am happy.

> > > >

> > > > Oh, and make the Elit CC blockable would also be nice.

> > >

> > > If you can't realize you need to dodge instead of block a skill with 3/4 or more casttime, you probably should go to a duelling server.

> >

> > 5 CC's, then shocking aura, and nado. Too many things to dodge! Something must be nerfed.

>

> That argument can be said for literally every single class in the game.

 

Pretty much this. The feel of combat since the patch is worse for this. I don't pretend to understand what everyone else is looking for in terms of passive vs. active gameplay. All I know is that it used to be much more difficult to lock players down with CC. Now it's basically the only way anyone dies! Is that what we're going for? Damage so low the only way you can kill anyone is by removing control from their character for several seconds at a time?

 

Don't get me wrong. I enjoyed PvP/WvW prior to the patch and I still do. I'm just not so sure this aspect of the change was beneficial to the overall feel of combat.

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> @"Odik.4587" said:

> > @"apharma.3741" said:

> > > @"Odik.4587" said:

> > > > @"apharma.3741" said:

> > > > > @"Shao.7236" said:

> > > > > It's pretty misleading, people have two evades and there's 5 CC's to avoid without counting Tornado, it's clear that without Stability to counter it can dominate any fights because Weakness and preventing any skill to be used while doing damage is a lot in one place.

> > > > >

> > > > > Reducing damage on LR to make others worth something rather than just roll everything is the better solution.

> > > >

> > > > I think one thing that's really brought more attention to it is no-one is running stability in any form anymore. Back in core you'd have double balanced stance warriors, guards giving good uptime on stab and there was a bit dotted around for many classes, coupled with CC being on longer cool downs.

> > > Shall we return good old CI then? Its was people fault that they didnt ran double stability utilities after all :joy:

> >

> > Old CI was a problem of mesmer having double or more the CC it ever had in core. LR is a problem because weaver now has more CC than ele originally had and they're all on 20s or below CDs while core ele only really had shocking aura and some CC on the offhand:

> > Sword: Gale Strike, Polaric leap

> > Dagger: Katabatic Winds, Mudslide

> >

> > https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/1004275#Comment_1004275

> >

> > Edit: "If you're happy with it then sure nerf CI and every on CC trait or interrupt trait into the floor and below, break out the guy who invented the abomination of balance that is sbooning and sic'em onto it." oh look people are complaining about most on CC traits now. _sips_

> You surely forgot about shocking aura and now add to it focus CC's. LRod always was cancer, its not even on "interrupt", you just spam it to kill. It deserves the same fate as LostTime - deleted.

> Actually wait, how come mesmer had twice less CC's than now? The only difference is mantra of distraction was buffed over the time.

 

Read the comment I linked, that was before the patch when CI was being complained about and the justification for it.

 

LR wasn't as obnoxious as CC was considerably less, you had shocking aura and 1-2 skills on the offhand. It was ironically better on staff as staff CC didn't have a target cap so you could proc it on Static Field and Unsteady ground on everyone multiple times. Even then it wasn't that bad as it didn't do a lot of damage iirc.

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> @"apharma.3741" said:

> > @"Odik.4587" said:

> > > @"apharma.3741" said:

> > > > @"Odik.4587" said:

> > > > > @"apharma.3741" said:

> > > > > > @"Shao.7236" said:

> > > > > > It's pretty misleading, people have two evades and there's 5 CC's to avoid without counting Tornado, it's clear that without Stability to counter it can dominate any fights because Weakness and preventing any skill to be used while doing damage is a lot in one place.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Reducing damage on LR to make others worth something rather than just roll everything is the better solution.

> > > > >

> > > > > I think one thing that's really brought more attention to it is no-one is running stability in any form anymore. Back in core you'd have double balanced stance warriors, guards giving good uptime on stab and there was a bit dotted around for many classes, coupled with CC being on longer cool downs.

> > > > Shall we return good old CI then? Its was people fault that they didnt ran double stability utilities after all :joy:

> > >

> > > Old CI was a problem of mesmer having double or more the CC it ever had in core. LR is a problem because weaver now has more CC than ele originally had and they're all on 20s or below CDs while core ele only really had shocking aura and some CC on the offhand:

> > > Sword: Gale Strike, Polaric leap

> > > Dagger: Katabatic Winds, Mudslide

> > >

> > > https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/1004275#Comment_1004275

> > >

> > > Edit: "If you're happy with it then sure nerf CI and every on CC trait or interrupt trait into the floor and below, break out the guy who invented the abomination of balance that is sbooning and sic'em onto it." oh look people are complaining about most on CC traits now. _sips_

> > You surely forgot about shocking aura and now add to it focus CC's. LRod always was cancer, its not even on "interrupt", you just spam it to kill. It deserves the same fate as LostTime - deleted.

> > Actually wait, how come mesmer had twice less CC's than now? The only difference is mantra of distraction was buffed over the time.

>

> Read the comment I linked, that was before the patch when CI was being complained about and the justification for it.

>

> LR wasn't as obnoxious as CC was considerably less, you had shocking aura and 1-2 skills on the offhand. It was ironically better on staff as staff CC didn't have a target cap so you could proc it on Static Field and Unsteady ground on everyone multiple times. Even then it wasn't that bad as it didn't do a lot of damage iirc.

It did monstrous damage, there was some troll playing only full zerk ele with arcanes (in unrankeds ofc xD) and it did melt anything that got caught in his sight without stability. When damage was higher and CC skills did the damage, it was way easier to kill Lrod eles (they couldnt sustain the damage)

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> @"Grimjack.8130" said:

> > @"Crozame.4098" said:

> > At the very least, the concept of no dmg to CC skills is a joke on LR. I don't care how they fix this, but as long as it is in line with all other CC skills, I am happy.

> >

> > Oh, and make the Elit CC blockable would also be nice.

>

> If you can't realize you need to dodge instead of block a skill with 3/4 or more casttime, you probably should go to a duelling server.

 

the Tornado 5 has such a long casting time? I dont think so. And, applying the same logic and go back to pre-nerf rampage: if you cant realize you can dodge AND block all the rampage skills which most of them has a long casting time, you should probably go to a dueling server.

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problem not CCs, problem is lightning rod doing too much damage.

and it's going opposite of anet's current balance philosophy, also weakness is a problem

weakness to 1.5 second and damage only apply when interrupt.

 

tbh they have been removing damage from CCs and lightning rod shouldn't be exception.

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Btw LR or Shock Aura also triggers when not attacking, there must be a bug or something, i got stunned and LR application by it several times without even attacking. I also see no reason for Shock Aura to be undodgeable, it interrupts and completely neutralize Lightning Reflexes on Ranger (because of the useless dmg application on that skill but because of the bug maybe even without that). But a stunbreak and dodge skill should not be neutralized by such braindead spammable hard cc stuff that procs such a big reward without even the need to interrupt anything. When good visible lines on the ground with decent casttime like Guardians staff cc skill (Line of Warding) or Ele staff skill on air (Static Field) are undodgeable is ok but not on instant applied Shock Aura.

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