With regards to the latest patch

[Ryan.9387]

Only good players play rev.

[mortrialus.3062]

> @"Cal Cohen.2358" said:

> Rev is a class that's favored more by the best players, and the best players tend to win the monthly.

 

[...](https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/1099919/#Comment_1099919)

[Lighter.5631]

tbh, i'm more concerned with FB and holo...

[duster.7013]

We have to wait for thief nerfs to land before we can start making fun of holos

[Lilyanna.9361]

> @"mortrialus.3062" said:

> > @"Cal Cohen.2358" said:

> > Rev is a class that's favored more by the best players, and the best players tend to win the monthly.

>

> [...](https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/1099919/#Comment_1099919)

 

What the actual hell????? I am beyond speechless. Did I READ that properly????

 

[mortrialus.3062]

> @"Lilyanna.9361" said:

> > @"mortrialus.3062" said:

> > > @"Cal Cohen.2358" said:

> > > Rev is a class that's favored more by the best players, and the best players tend to win the monthly.

> >

> > [...](https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/1099919/#Comment_1099919)

>

> What the actual hell????? I am beyond speechless. Did I READ that properly????

>

 

The ellipses link to the post.

[Leonidrex.5649]

amazing patch, see yall in 4months when we get another beauty.

 

[mistsim.2748]

Malyx/Glint will entirely ruin 3's.

[Starbreaker.6507]

> @"Leonidrex.5649" said:

> amazing patch, see yall in 4months when we get another beauty.

>

 

https://giphy.com/gifs/gladiator-hrnYspWWhsIyA

[bravan.3876]

This is a joke tbh. Condithief problem not even solved, Ranger can just switch to some other still broken pets (Jacaranda rofl), Rev, Holo not touched, also Necros still too strong, Eles are... who cares. Mesmer elites still a meme. 3v3 will be fun with that balance. Let it happen on small 2v2 maps pls so i just can spam my condi aoe on the whole map during my already tanky butt gets carried by some facetank support classes. I gave up to write essays for this game already anyway. I guess you need to wintrade and acc share before you have impact on balance and can ruin it to your own favor, while Devs seems to have no clue what they are doing at all by themself.

[Bigpapasmurf.5623]

Actually for condi thief, it halved the torment stacks and halved the poison stacks it gets from the venom. It may not have killed the condi teef, however acknowledging that nothing was solved is an incorrect statement as it lost a chunk of its damage as the condi teef relies on poison and that torment. Ranger bird was hit somewhat decently so I will give you the fact they will switch to another pet (seeing how good players will adapt after all). Holo isnt that bad imo and necro is creeping up there for sure.

 

Imo burn guards also need looked at

[bravan.3876]

> @"Bigpapasmurf.5623" said:

> Actually for condi thief, it halved the torment stacks and halved the poison stacks it gets from the venom. It may not have killed the condi teef, however acknowledging that nothing was solved is an incorrect statement as it lost a chunk of its damage as the condi teef relies on poison and that torment. Ranger bird was hit somewhat decently so I will give you the fact they will switch to another pet (seeing how good players will adapt after all). Holo isnt that bad imo and necro is creeping up there for sure.

>

> Imo burn guards also need looked at

 

It barely changed the initial burst. And aside from that, Condithief can just switch to another utility to compensate. I still make 20k dmg on a not moving, not casting target that do not remove condis with my opener alone. Way too much reward for how easy it is to land. Also that Thief stays in stealth after failing to hit is stupid. Delete the ICD on backstab and make Thieves get revealed the moment they use an attack out of stealth no matter if it gets blocked, blinded, evaded or whatever.

[duster.7013]

Ranger

Slash (Bird): Reduced power coefficient per strike from 0.38 to 0.25.

Chilling Slash (Owl): Reduced power coefficient per strike from 0.66 to 0.475.

Blinding Slash (Raven): Reduced power coefficient per strike from 0.66 to 0.475.

Thief

Shadow Strike: Reduced the number of torment stacks from 4 to 2 in PvP and WvW.

Spider Venom: Reduced the number of venom stacks from 6 to 3 in PvP and WvW.

Sneak Attack: Reduced bleeding duration from 6 seconds to 5 seconds in PvP and WvW.

Prepare Shadow Portal: Reduced preparation duration from 60 seconds to 30 seconds in PvP only.

 

Condi thief still a thing, def gonna be a thing in 3v3. People want thief to have mobility, but pairing that with even a bit of condi makes it busted because there's no consequence to being wrong, nor a requirement to even appear on point.

[saerni.2584]

> @"bravan.3876" said:

> > @"Bigpapasmurf.5623" said:

> > Actually for condi thief, it halved the torment stacks and halved the poison stacks it gets from the venom. It may not have killed the condi teef, however acknowledging that nothing was solved is an incorrect statement as it lost a chunk of its damage as the condi teef relies on poison and that torment. Ranger bird was hit somewhat decently so I will give you the fact they will switch to another pet (seeing how good players will adapt after all). Holo isnt that bad imo and necro is creeping up there for sure.

> >

> > Imo burn guards also need looked at

>

> It barely changed the initial burst. And aside from that, Condithief can just switch to another utility to compensate.

 

Could you clarify what you mean by initial burst?

 

If the initial burst was X + Y + Z, and assuming that was based on Venom Share to three Thieves Guild summons, then we went from 6x4 Venoms for 24 stacks of poison to 3x4, so 12 stacks of poison less.

 

Taking into account the nerf to torment stacks, that is 2 less torment and 12 less poison in the burst potential.

 

If we aren’t talking about venom share then that’s only 3 less poison and two less torment (but that already wasn’t hitting too hard).

[Bigpapasmurf.5623]

> @"bravan.3876" said:

> > @"Bigpapasmurf.5623" said:

> > Actually for condi thief, it halved the torment stacks and halved the poison stacks it gets from the venom. It may not have killed the condi teef, however acknowledging that nothing was solved is an incorrect statement as it lost a chunk of its damage as the condi teef relies on poison and that torment. Ranger bird was hit somewhat decently so I will give you the fact they will switch to another pet (seeing how good players will adapt after all). Holo isnt that bad imo and necro is creeping up there for sure.

> >

> > Imo burn guards also need looked at

>

> It barely changed the initial burst. And aside from that, Condithief can just switch to another utility to compensate. I still make 20k dmg on a not moving, not casting target that do not remove condis with my opener alone. Way too much reward for how easy it is to land. Also that Thief stays in stealth after failing to hit is stupid. Delete the ICD on backstab and make Thieves get revealed the moment they use an attack out of stealth no matter if it gets blocked, blinded, evaded or whatever.

 

tbh the overall initial burst does use teh venom and the p/d #3 so it did change it (3 stacks of poison and 2 torment). ALso make the follow up bursts not hit as hard. Cleanse the initial burst and the thief has a longer fight on its hands. I can see more thieves bowing out of a fight sooner.

 

Dont get me wrong tho, most condi builds need to be looked at, including thief so its good they nerfed it.

[Psycoprophet.8107]

These changes if anet had any clue would been rolled out with the ranger focused patch two patches ago so the new cadence is roll out few changes every few weeks so in a yr we have basically one mediocre balance pass if all was combined lol. Takes 3 patches focused on ranger to balance things that were all obvious 6 months ago all while plenty of feedback was given. Not they they shoulda had to rely on feedback ad doesnt take long to notice most of the issues discussed.

[Poledra Val.1490]

> @"Psycoprophet.8107" said:

> These changes if anet had any clue would been rolled out with the ranger focused patch two patches ago so the new cadence is roll out few changes every few weeks so in a yr we have basically one mediocre balance pass if all was combined lol. Takes 3 patches focused on ranger to balance things that were all obvious 6 months ago all while plenty of feedback was given. Not they they shoulda had to rely on feedback ad doesnt take long to notice most of the issues discussed.

 

That pretty much describes the balance changes accomplished in an 8 year period.

[Psycoprophet.8107]

> @"Poledra Val.1490" said:

> > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said:

> > These changes if anet had any clue would been rolled out with the ranger focused patch two patches ago so the new cadence is roll out few changes every few weeks so in a yr we have basically one mediocre balance pass if all was combined lol. Takes 3 patches focused on ranger to balance things that were all obvious 6 months ago all while plenty of feedback was given. Not they they shoulda had to rely on feedback ad doesnt take long to notice most of the issues discussed.

>

> That pretty much describes the balance changes accomplished in an 8 year period.

 

Yes although true I was coming from a place where someone who is going by their more recent models of development and who may not know any better. After 7 years I know better and definitely not a white knight on anets behalf, I'm honestly surprised gw2 had any pvp players left after all these years but I guess its issues are starting to weigh on its players given it's current population.

[mistsim.2748]

condi thieves weren't gonna get killed, CMC said SHAVED. the build wasn't too bad to begin with, and not the most competitive in the higher brackets of play. hardly saw any past plat 1.

 

condi thief is good now.

[Poledra Val.1490]

> @"Psycoprophet.8107" said:

> > @"Poledra Val.1490" said:

> > > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said:

> > > These changes if anet had any clue would been rolled out with the ranger focused patch two patches ago so the new cadence is roll out few changes every few weeks so in a yr we have basically one mediocre balance pass if all was combined lol. Takes 3 patches focused on ranger to balance things that were all obvious 6 months ago all while plenty of feedback was given. Not they they shoulda had to rely on feedback ad doesnt take long to notice most of the issues discussed.

> >

> > That pretty much describes the balance changes accomplished in an 8 year period.

>

> Yes although true I was coming from a place where someone who is going by their more recent models of development and who may not know any better. After 7 years I know better and definitely not a white knight on anets behalf, I'm honestly surprised gw2 had any pvp players left after all these years but I guess its issues are starting to weigh on its players given it's current population.

 

Yep absolutely unfortunately the development team dont seem to learn a lot and just keep on making the same errors. Whether its company policy or not i really dont see the logic in holding up an obvious problem that needs a fix. Just bizzare really in all respects.

[Starbreaker.6507]

> @"Poledra Val.1490" said:

> > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said:

> > > @"Poledra Val.1490" said:

> > > > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said:

> > > > These changes if anet had any clue would been rolled out with the ranger focused patch two patches ago so the new cadence is roll out few changes every few weeks so in a yr we have basically one mediocre balance pass if all was combined lol. Takes 3 patches focused on ranger to balance things that were all obvious 6 months ago all while plenty of feedback was given. Not they they shoulda had to rely on feedback ad doesnt take long to notice most of the issues discussed.

> > >

> > > That pretty much describes the balance changes accomplished in an 8 year period.

> >

> > Yes although true I was coming from a place where someone who is going by their more recent models of development and who may not know any better. After 7 years I know better and definitely not a white knight on anets behalf, I'm honestly surprised gw2 had any pvp players left after all these years but I guess its issues are starting to weigh on its players given it's current population.

>

> Yep absolutely unfortunately the development team dont seem to learn a lot and just keep on making the same errors. Whether its company policy or not i really dont see the logic in holding up an obvious problem that needs a fix. Just bizzare really in all respects.

 

Couple that with, for whatever the reason, they refused to invest in any sort of PTR so people could hammer away with any proposed changes.

 

Instead they just lob a salvo and hope it hits the mark.

[Walarti.2961]

> @"mistsim.2748" said:

> condi thieves weren't gonna get killed, CMC said SHAVED. the build wasn't too bad to begin with, and not the most competitive in the higher brackets of play. hardly saw any past plat 1.

>

> condi thief is good now.

 

winning monthly and 2x condi thief in almost every p2/3 game, often 3-4. yee so hard to see any past plat1. maybe you didn't see any because you didn't get higher than plat1?

[mistsim.2748]

> @"Walarti.2961" said:

> > @"mistsim.2748" said:

> > condi thieves weren't gonna get killed, CMC said SHAVED. the build wasn't too bad to begin with, and not the most competitive in the higher brackets of play. hardly saw any past plat 1.

> >

> > condi thief is good now.

>

> winning monthly and 2x condi thief in almost every p2/3 game, often 3-4. yee so hard to see any past plat1. maybe you didn't see any because you didn't get higher than plat1?

 

i think you are basically a bad.

[Walarti.2961]

> @"mistsim.2748" said:

> > @"Walarti.2961" said:

> > > @"mistsim.2748" said:

> > > condi thieves weren't gonna get killed, CMC said SHAVED. the build wasn't too bad to begin with, and not the most competitive in the higher brackets of play. hardly saw any past plat 1.

> > >

> > > condi thief is good now.

> >

> > winning monthly and 2x condi thief in almost every p2/3 game, often 3-4. yee so hard to see any past plat1. maybe you didn't see any because you didn't get higher than plat1?

>

> i think you are basically a bad.

 

I don't get your point tho? you said bullshit so I called it bullshit, I had about 300 ranked games this season, 95% of them was plat2-3 and in almost every game there was condi thief and you say condi thief was "hardly played past plat1", also I mentioned condi thief won monthly so how is it not competetive in higher brackets if it won the highest?

[Psycoprophet.8107]

> @"Poledra Val.1490" said:

> > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said:

> > > @"Poledra Val.1490" said:

> > > > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said:

> > > > These changes if anet had any clue would been rolled out with the ranger focused patch two patches ago so the new cadence is roll out few changes every few weeks so in a yr we have basically one mediocre balance pass if all was combined lol. Takes 3 patches focused on ranger to balance things that were all obvious 6 months ago all while plenty of feedback was given. Not they they shoulda had to rely on feedback ad doesnt take long to notice most of the issues discussed.

> > >

> > > That pretty much describes the balance changes accomplished in an 8 year period.

> >

> > Yes although true I was coming from a place where someone who is going by their more recent models of development and who may not know any better. After 7 years I know better and definitely not a white knight on anets behalf, I'm honestly surprised gw2 had any pvp players left after all these years but I guess its issues are starting to weigh on its players given it's current population.

>

> Yep absolutely unfortunately the development team dont seem to learn a lot and just keep on making the same errors. Whether its company policy or not i really dont see the logic in holding up an obvious problem that needs a fix. Just bizzare really in all respects.

 

I honestly think their balance devs like cmc are doing this as a side gig and are probobly giving as much attention to the games balancing as they can, the design team is probobly small at this point and working on the expac probobly can't devote any type of attention to changing skill machanics/designs for balance purposes hence the over half yr long place holder the passive traits have become. Honestly unless they get a team that actually devotes real time to balance changes and a design team that can handle multiple avenues of the games development at once somewhat efficiently they should just focus on pve and just stop any focus on pvp,I'd say just casually add updates to give allusion of focus but that's kinda the current situation lol. Most times when I see content on the net or discussions about the game its usually pvp content,not always but usually. That said it's strange to me even if pve has higher pop as all mmos tend to that they focus so much on pve when pvp due to its combat mechanics are what sets it apart and most time above other mmos yet they focus more on pve even though it literally has zero Hope's to compare to mmos like ff14 or eso as far as quality pve content, those companies are far bigger and devote more of their revenue to those games. Gw2 should have focused on pvp as a main focus and pve second that way I'd have a long and healthy population in the part of the game that actually is its strength and sets it apart from others. My take anyway.