Change HoT HP champs to veterans or elites

[Negativity.5801]

This content should all be solo-able. The devs seemed to have realized that in PoF since all those hps are veterans yet if this is the case, why do the HoT hp champs still exist. I completely skipped over HoT initially so I'm not sure if this has been discussed 5000 times but it doesn't make sense to leave it as is in the game. It detracts from the idea that the world design should behoove players to work together towards a common goal. This splits the HoT meta maps since there will be people trying to do meta, and an HP train with 40-50+ people completely ignoring it. A meta map should incentivize the everyone to do the meta yet because some of the hps are so overtuned, some classes either simply cannot solo it, or it takes a significant amount of effort and near perfect play to kill it.

 

I know a large majority of the hps even as champs can be solo'd and I know because so far I've done it on every class except my warrior so far. But for a majority of the player base this is simply asking too much hence the 40-50 people zergs. The fact that maps are player-driven arbitrarily designated as HP train maps or meta maps is all the outlining that should be needed to exemplify that this is a bad design.

 

Not to mention the fact that the few HPs are ridiculously overtuned, are difficult for dumb reasons is everything wrong with gw2 pve and it's sad that the same bad design that has existed since launch continues to be implemented into the game. Over-inflated health pools with badly designed abilities that do entirely too much damage. If you need an example, simply look at the champion of balthazar hero point. His "fireball" is a tiny orange splinter. Seriously, why couldn't they just take the ele staff fire 1 ability and just use that? Why is it a tiny orange splinter that hits for 50-60% of your health. His flames of balthazar attack that sets the entire arena on fire doesn't actually dissipate when the visual dissipates. Multiple times I have died since the fire goes away and I jump down and die instantly and I sit there going wtf did I just die to only to check my log to see 3 20k+ ticks of a visual that went away.

 

It's like this was designed with the intention of having at LEAST 4-5 people doing it and that at least 2-3 of those people would die. Try res'ing someone on champ of balthazar, or mushroom queen in tangled depths, or even the chak hp in auric basin who from what I've seen, it's almost like the stomp he does intentionally one-shots downed players.

 

TL;DR Champion hero points detract from map metas and are mostly overtuned and should be scaled down to be solo-able so hp trains become less of a thing.

[castlemanic.3198]

I absolutely despise champion HPs, one of the worst things they ever did with HoT. However, people have been complaining for ages and ages and Anet never did anything about it.

 

I absolutely agree that a change needs to happen, but I worry if such a change will ever come.

[Jinroh.4251]

I don't know if they will ever change the mobs in HOT. I know compared to POF, the mobs can downright murder you even if they are not veterans. Hell pocket raptors STILL kill players. We can only hope one day they do change the mobs and the HPs that go with them but I doubt that. People still run HP trains in HOT content and ANET figures they would rather keep it like that. I also happened to notice that there are a few who actually like the murderous mobs. Have no clue why, you figured they'd get their difficult kicks from raids, fractals, and event bosses.

[Zaltys.7649]

Yeah, they probably wont.

I recommend playing a bit of WvW: that's an easy way to unlock the Maguuma HPs. I always do with alts, since getting the HPs the 'right way' is pure annoyance.

[OnizukaBR.8537]

I actually like them a lot more, I do HP as a daily activity and most of PoF are so easy to solo that is not so fun, i prefer to solo the ones from HoT. So i hope they release champion HP and veteren HP so they can please both crowd

[otto.5684]

No. I like the challenge in HoT. You want easy HP stick to PoF.

[Evil.1580]

LOL, no

 

The whole content shouldn't be solo oriented. If you want solo content stick with core Tyria or PoF.

 

Anet has made a step back with PoF compared to HoT imo, talking about group activities/meta-events/world bosses.

 

The beauty of HoT is that it is challenging and require a lot of people to complete. Even then experienced players can complete the HPs solo.

 

Just look what the solo content of PoF did, 3 weeks after the release. We already see more people in HoT and soon there will be a lot more.

 

No need to kill both expansions.

 

 

[TwiceDead.1963]

No, I like the difficulty of the HoT HP's. You already have easy ones in PoF, use those. There's enough to please both crowds here, no need to ruin the others fun.

[Sithis.3564]

Doing HP's is fun? Huh.

[Healix.5819]

If they were going to change it, they would have done so prior to the bundle offer. It's highly unlikely that they'd bother with it now. Consider that they were working on PoF almost immediately after HoT launched and had to pull resources from it to barely change HoT the first time and now they're wanting quicker expansions. The only change HoT may see is reward nerfs and it going F2P with the next expansion.

[particlepinata.9865]

Now that Hot is 2 years old, it would be a good idea if they do that, agree that hp's should be soloable (just like in Pof). There is more then enough group content already in the Hot openworld.

[Jephery.8915]

I honestly like the difficulty of HoT's champion HPs and like to use them to gauge an open world build's effectiveness.

 

To me the best open world builds can solo all HoT HP champions. When I'm soloing I don't want to have to bother with pugging randoms to do something.

[Ashen.2907]

I think that varied difficulty between the two regions' challenges is a positive. I'd be disappointed if HoT encounters were downgraded.

[OneYenShort.3189]

> @castlemanic.3198 said:

> I absolutely despise champion HPs, one of the worst things they ever did with HoT. However, people have been complaining for ages and ages and Anet never did anything about it.

 

Incorrect. Anet has done a few passes on them. Some HPs got changed from champs to commune. Some champs changed to vets. Others removed the local mobs from being around the HPs.

 

I'm of the opinion now if they get changed, they get changed. *shrug*.

And no, I can't solo every single HP out there. I'm also pretty sure that isn't the intention either. I can solo the majority, however, depending on which character I'm playing. If i'm playing one of my lesser character... oh boy, yeah I'll need help and I know this. So contrary to what anet has been doing to the game, I'll ask my guild for help.

 

Funny thing that.... having a guild help out with stuff, in a game called Guild Wars... Go figure.

 

 

 

[castlemanic.3198]

> @OneYenShort.3189 said:

> Incorrect. Anet has done a few passes on them. Some HPs got changed from champs to commune. Some champs changed to vets. Others removed the local mobs from being around the HPs.

>

> I'm of the opinion now if they get changed, they get changed. *shrug*.

> And no, I can't solo every single HP out there. I'm also pretty sure that isn't the intention either. I can solo the majority, however, depending on which character I'm playing. If i'm playing one of my lesser character... oh boy, yeah I'll need help and I know this. So contrary to what anet has been doing to the game, I'll ask my guild for help.

>

> Funny thing that.... having a guild help out with stuff, in a game called Guild Wars... Go figure.

>

>

>

 

Not all of them, many remain unchanged, champions and unsoloable to a large number of players.

 

Also any argument that says **character progression** should be unsoloable flies directly in the face of almost every video game out there. Better gear is *not* character progression (it's gear progression which, while tied to characters, is not the same thing) and all HPs should be soloable because it's character progression. It's a good thing that some of the HPs were changed, and that every PoF HP enemy was made a veteran, because it's simply more logical to have character progression soloable. The difficulty was artificially inflated because HoT was made with a higher difficulty in mind, but with a new expansion in place, it's a dangerous move to keep character progression locked behind artificially inflated difficulty especially when more expansions come out that may draw players away from HoT maps, and lower the availability of players to aid with champion HPs.

[Haishao.6851]

I also prefer HoT champions Hero Challenges over PoF one.

At least they're challenging and make people play together.

[Fluffball.8307]

I find both expacs HP to be the same level of challenge (which is pretty close to zero for most of them.) HoT HPs just take slightly longer. The vets in PoF have way more health than a normal core vets, often have reasonably interesting mechanics, and their attacks hit harder.

 

Long story short, it doesn't really matter what enemies are called; how much health they have and how challenging they are is pretty arbitrary. PoF vets should probably be called elites if we're trying to have some sort of workable system.

[Valiant.5078]

No. Leave HoT as it is, Core Tyria and PoF is fine. Having more different kinds of content at different levels of difficulty is a good thing imho. In fact, for their next expansion, I'm hoping they cater to both crowds of people, those who like challenging group content, and those who like solo content. It is an MMO after all, I'd rather get over hurdles with other players/friends/guilds, or I'd just play a singleplayer game.

[Mea.5491]

No. GW2 is a massively multiplayer game. If you want to solo, go play single player games. If I were Anet I would change PoF HPs into champs.

[Healix.5819]

> @OneYenShort.3189 said:

> Not all of them, many remain unchanged, champions and unsoloable to a large number of players.

 

They basically ensured that there were just enough challenges for the average player to unlock their elite spec completely solo, with the assumption that they leveled through the core game. Their original plan was to require map completion anyways, since they were going to require an additional 65 points to unlock your core skills, on top of HoT's original 400. They basically shifted that requirement to HoT for solo players, since that's roughly how many points HoT lacks.

 

The only remaining problem is that they block map completion, so they essentially encourage players to skip it entirely. Most people probably don't bother with that however, especially for HoT considering the complaints about the map design.

[kharmin.7683]

I am no fan of HoT but I firmly stand with those who wish the content there to remain unchanged. Having a variety of challenges (Core, HoT, PoF) is healthy IMO

[Neural.1824]

Either reduce the difficulty, or offer alternatives to the collections that require them. HoT is old enough now that this should be looked at. I'd rather not see the difficulty changed, personally, but requirements for collections can be relaxed a bit now.

[Ayumi Spender.1082]

You know they could easily set up like some of those hearts out there. Like that one bug catching one I think in Diessa and that one colosseum one in Gengardan Fields where you have to go into a pen and fight a certain enemy.

 

On the HoT maps, they should allow us to interact with the hero challenge and then pick "Easy Medium Hard" on them. If you pick easy you get a Veteran, if you pick Medium it's Elite, if you pick hard you get Champion.

Hell, you can even add a "Hardcore" option and add Legendary. That way everyone can have fun with it in however form they like.

 

You may ask, "Why would anyone do the harder ones then?"

Here you go... the harder ones might give you better drops from their daily chests. That might entice people to still do HP trains to maybe get the better loot from it.

I say it's a win-win situation that I'm not sure anyone would disagree on unless they just don't want anyone to have choices.

 

"No, they should all be hard and stay that way!" Which I think would be a bit selfish on those that just want to get the hero points and that's about it.

Me personally would go either or. When I'm in a hero point mood, I will solo them on easy. When I'm in the mood for HP trains (which I still do from time to time for those daily chests), I would pick that hard/hardcore one.

[TEKnowledgy.1760]

> @"Ayumi Spender.1082" said:

> You know they could easily set up like some of those hearts out there. Like that one bug catching one I think in Diessa and that one colosseum one in Gengardan Fields where you have to go into a pen and fight a certain enemy.

>

> On the HoT maps, they should allow us to interact with the hero challenge and then pick "Easy Medium Hard" on them. If you pick easy you get a Veteran, if you pick Medium it's Elite, if you pick hard you get Champion.

> Hell, you can even add a "Hardcore" option and add Legendary. That way everyone can have fun with it in however form they like.

>

> You may ask, "Why would anyone do the harder ones then?"

> Here you go... the harder ones might give you better drops from their daily chests. That might entice people to still do HP trains to maybe get the better loot from it.

> I say it's a win-win situation that I'm not sure anyone would disagree on unless they just don't want anyone to have choices.

>

> "No, they should all be hard and stay that way!" Which I think would be a bit selfish on those that just want to get the hero points and that's about it.

> Me personally would go either or. When I'm in a hero point mood, I will solo them on easy. When I'm in the mood for HP trains (which I still do from time to time for those daily chests), I would pick that hard/hardcore one.

 

I think Ayumi is the only person i agree with 9/10 times on these forums. I think the reason for this, is the fact this person is considerate of different play styles and view points a trait like that is a gift and one well worth respecting. One myself shares atleast 9/10 times.

 

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I to wish champs was selectable difficulty or non-champ elite be fine even if it was a hard elite as long as I could solo it at my own pace, even if it took a couple tries np.

Loot to me isn't worth the value of my experience or enjoyment of the game. (i know some people like to chase it I respect that) I do like hard stuff but I can't solo all the champs i might could some if I took my time to learn them, I know no way on all of em because of my builds and how I play.

 

I respect group contents despite I'm a solo only player 90% of the time.

I fail to believe anet can't find a middle ground to please both. 50 % of this game you can solo and easily. other 50% is group stuff counting PvP and WvW I don't even get to enjoy group stuff because who I am as a person and how I play the game. Not complaining about that, just stating that fact.

 

In the end all of us here are here for the same reason to play a game for fun, maybe to escape reality, to relax, to chill out, release stress so on and so on.

If you are a competitive person you probably eat poop sleep PvP and WvW nothing wrong with that. I also respect that each to their own.

I used PvP alot back in '12-'13 and wvw. I have a season 1 wvw badge to back it up.

 

I support the ability to solo and group content, every where in this game. I even support henchmen in instanced content, because I could make use of the other 30% to 40% of the game I paid for I bought gw2 in 2012, but with no way of playing the rest based on my personality and how I play the game. Part of my money was wasted. Was no option to just buy open world content for half price off the client. Else I would have. Because I never had any pure intention of doing group content, from the very start. Again, i'm not complaining about it I'm just stating the facts.

That doesn't mean i don't support others in the ability to do so. Because we are all here for same reason.

 

I hope in the future anet will consider the idea of easier champs or something for HoT hps it be nice to finally get the hp i paid to have lol.

 

 

 

 

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

Git gud? I'm not sure that the HPs being champs is necessarily a problem. It is different from core HPs, certainly, but making the hero points group content doesn't necessarily make them worse. It makes it so HPs are a challenge you have to approach from a different direction. If you have to use an HP train, the join it or make it. Challenge is inherently a good thing, as it forges creativity and cooperation.