Nerf the mesmer already, the relentless clone spam is extremely overpowered.

[ChivalrousKnight.7201]

Maybe I was the illusion all along ヽ༼ຈل͜ຈ༽ﾉ

 

I hate playing against Mesmer though. I personally think it's stronger than scourge at higher levels of play (though 1 scourge is still mandatory for each team). Stun break on dodge bothers me the most, makes Mesmer too safe. Meanwhile dash thief nerf LMAO.

[Morwath.9817]

Better nerf Irelia.

[Master Ketsu.4569]

It's not the clone spam that makes mirage S tier. It's the ability to exploit mirage mirrors so that they have near permanent evade. It's possible to chain evade for a full 12 seconds all the while shitting on people with AoEs, clones, and ambushes. Another balance mistake.

 

 

[Cynz.9437]

> @FaboBabo.3581 said:

> > @Majic.4801 said:

> > Wait... which Mesmer was it?

> >

> > Was it that one? Nope, gone. How about that one over there? Nope...

>

> This is a new Player issue. Nobody playing the Game longer then 1 year has Problems with targeting the real Mesmer withing 1 second.

> Stop saying it's OP, when u dont even try to adapt.> @Hitman.5829 said:

> > > @FaboBabo.3581 said:

> > > XD oh dude you Made my day :D

> > >

> > > Well now on a serious note ; what to nerf exactly? Make suggestions instead of whining only.

> >

> > * Remove dodge stun break

> > * Remove enemy Target break

> > * Tone down clone spam

>

> Clones are Killed with one auto attack from any zerker Class - Do it ; this is called COUNTERPLAY, since there are no clone death traits anymore

> Stunbreak on dodge is NEEDED, because otherwise u'd just die. Most classes have like 4 or 5 Stuns avaible. Instead of using em all in Line, time em better.

>

> Enemy Target Break ; I agree that this can be annoying, but calling the real Mesmer out in the begining of the fight really helps.

>

> Overall, yeah nothing to see here.

>

> Especially with the Change to Elusive Mind, Mirage would be useless in every part of the Game.

> Some people, even some Mesmer's say Elusive Mind is OP, but Power Creep of the Game is calling for it.

>

> Without vigour, or endurance food, EM, is a Stunbreak every 10 seconds + removes a condition. Remember it's a Master Trait, so u cant go IH or DC.

>

> Lets take a look at another ability...

>

> https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Outrage

>

> OP

>

>

> What's "OP" at clone spamming on a POWER Build?

> Clones don't deal damage, they'd only stack Condis, but again it's a power Build.

>

> Those clones have only 1 purpose, which is shatter.

>

> Is clone spamming (which dont do anything), or Shatters the Problem for u?

>

> Please remember, when specced into ELUSIVE MIND, you don't have acces to IH. So Clones won't even perform Ambushes.

 

Let me guess, you have no issue with UC nerf lol.

 

It still blows my mind that Anet deemed UC OP (after lol 2 years) and decided EM is somehow OK. I mean they could at least try to be less obvious when they balance specs around xpac sales.

 

I don't see any issue with clone spam as OP, i don't see issue with target loss. I have issue with mes being able to stack crap load of condis while evading/stealthing/evading/evading/evading/evading/blur/stunbreak constantly at the same time. On top of CCs. It is just too much of good things in one. Once can argue that mesmers need it in current powercreep but once again, if Anet attempts to justify nerfs to other classes with comments like Karl left then mes and co. should see same treatment otherwise there is no consistency and we are just lied to straight in the face.

 

And there are plenty of suggestions on mes forums how to address mirage, devs just need to listen to community a bit.

 

I mean if they continue to balance classes around xpac sales, chances are next time a lot of people won't buy xpac because they got fed up with whole foul marketing strategies and probably even quit.

[Arheundel.6451]

UC was OP and got finally adjusted after 2 years...EM is equally OP and I hope it will take less time to nerf

[Cynz.9437]

> @Arheundel.6451 said:

> UC was OP and got finally adjusted after 2 years...EM is equally OP and I hope it will take less time to nerf

 

Only reason why they nerfed UC is same reason why they nerfed acro pre-HoT: to force thieves to play DE. Too bad DE is so badly designed that even core builds are more viable. There was no actual balance thought involved there, otherwise EM would never make it live in current form.

[Cwnannwn.7681]

> @"Master Ketsu.4569" said:

> It's not the clone spam that makes mirage S tier. It's the ability to exploit mirage mirrors so that they have near permanent evade. It's possible to chain evade for a full 12 seconds all the while kitten on people with AoEs, clones, and ambushes. Another balance mistake.

>

>

 

Maybe don't run into the mirrors then? Most players have no trouble sidestepping them.

[KrHome.1920]

> @FaboBabo.3581 said:

> Clones are Killed with one auto attack from any zerker Class - Do it ; this is called COUNTERPLAY, since there are no clone death traits anymore

Are you Bronze Tier?

 

Serious question. I mean autoattacking a class that spams confusion. Great idea!

 

You also seem NOT to understand your own class mechanic. You go stealth, melee, dodge and while being invulnerable (mirage cloak) you spam illusions which you immediatly shatter while your target might even be dazed and blinded. Then you staff2 away and repeat the process.

 

Or why would you state something like autoattacking (from a low HP zerker class that kills himself (confusion) in 3 attacks!) is counterplay? .... SERIOUSLY?!

 

[Loop.8106]

This post is made by the same player saying core guard / DH has higher stab uptime than Spellbreaker with pre-nerfed balanced stance and FC. I wouldn't take him too seriously.

[tartarus.1082]

> @Cwnannwn.7681 said:

> > @"Master Ketsu.4569" said:

> > It's not the clone spam that makes mirage S tier. It's the ability to exploit mirage mirrors so that they have near permanent evade. It's possible to chain evade for a full 12 seconds all the while kitten on people with AoEs, clones, and ambushes. Another balance mistake.

> >

> >

>

> Maybe don't run into the mirrors then? Most players have no trouble sidestepping them.

 

Ummm you realize you run into your own mirrors to get evade right?

[Morwath.9817]

> @tartarus.1082 said:

> > @Cwnannwn.7681 said:

> > > @"Master Ketsu.4569" said:

> > > It's not the clone spam that makes mirage S tier. It's the ability to exploit mirage mirrors so that they have near permanent evade. It's possible to chain evade for a full 12 seconds all the while kitten on people with AoEs, clones, and ambushes. Another balance mistake.

> > >

> > >

> >

> > Maybe don't run into the mirrors then? Most players have no trouble sidestepping them.

>

> Ummm you realize you run into your own mirrors to get evade right?

 

Ooo.... that was supposed to be seeeeecret.

[Furious.2867]

My Mesmer is super hawt. Don't nerf her pls.


[tartarus.1082]

> @Morwath.9817 said:

> > @tartarus.1082 said:

> > > @Cwnannwn.7681 said:

> > > > @"Master Ketsu.4569" said:

> > > > It's not the clone spam that makes mirage S tier. It's the ability to exploit mirage mirrors so that they have near permanent evade. It's possible to chain evade for a full 12 seconds all the while kitten on people with AoEs, clones, and ambushes. Another balance mistake.

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > Maybe don't run into the mirrors then? Most players have no trouble sidestepping them.

> >

> > Ummm you realize you run into your own mirrors to get evade right?

>

> Ooo.... that was supposed to be seeeeecret.

 

Oh no I let the word get out D:

 

Tbh though I love how long it took people to recognize the condi burst potential of mirage after pof dropped . Plus whenever someone talks about it, someone randomly brings up the power burst combo and genuinely thinks that's what the discussions and complaints were even about. So I'm not really sure if everyone knows how easy a mirage condi burst is to pull off yet.

[brannigan.9831]

They'll definitely get some nerfs eventually. The problem is not that visible at lower skill levels. Basically a good mesmer is extremly hard to pin down and damage and there clones do in fact end up raping you eventually it doens't mean squat they are easily killed you'll have a couple more back on you in a second or two. Killing clones has never been the answer to killing a mesmer. I would hope they would die if you farted on them because they are so easy to spawn it would be ludicrous for them not be easy to kill.

[BurrTheKing.8571]

Three idea that Mesmer sustains itself by the use of visual trickery is fine. The issue is,very few players actually use the class in that way. Instead of standing still to make yourself appear to be a clone, most play the class like any other damage dealer. Why shouldn't they? The game actively encourages it now. You don't have to be clever with Mirage, land your confusion spike, then rotate your defenses until you can do it again.

 

I assume the class is this way because the old GW1 Mes wouldn't have worked in open world PvE. There were damage builds, very common ones, but the core of the class was debuffing and interrupting, which is fairly worthless in most PvE content.

 

Even so, changing the class to be just another spike class that uses Condi while having way smaller tells than something like Holo. You can still damage the Holo while they damage you, not so when it comes to Mirage. They're very strong 1v1 but factor in Scourge giving them cover condis and you have a real monster on your hands. I think the only reason we don't see more is that the class is much less pick up and play than say Scourge.

[Nuka Cola.8520]

Remove stun break on dodge and daze on sword ambush. Rest is fine.

 

With the mobility and evades, the sword is already insanely powerful. But with constant cc spam, the weapon is on another level. I mean, if they don't do anything, cool, i'll use it permanently...

[Nickel.7918]

still just learn to play insted of crying!

[Curunen.8729]

wow, the witch hunt is out in full force! :o

 

Edit - I suppose I will add one comment/food for thought. Mirage has little to ZERO sustained healing, given almost no mirage will be using Inspiration.

 

If they have regen on cloak they have no self deception. If they take DE they have no Ineptitude or Superiority Complex. Remind me, what other clone generating traits exist in the game? That's right, nothing.

 

So if they have no regen the only healing is the heal - oh and have you looked at Mesmer heals? It's not like they can frequently reheal or reheal to 100% like some classes...

 

The evades and active defence is absolutely mandatory for mirage survival - without it, mirage melts extremely fast.

[Genesis.5169]

At the beach by the dead sea, there's alot of salt in air but its a nice day to get a tan.

[Hitman.5829]

Look at all these mesmers trying to make it sound like mesmer is ok and not OP. It will get nerfed and all of you know it.

[OriOri.8724]

> @Hitman.5829 said:

> Look at all these mesmers trying to make it sound like mesmer is ok and not OP. It will get nerfed and all of you know it.

 

You are referring to the same mesmers that are telling you exactly why EM is overpowered and should be nerfed, aren't you? Cause yea, that's definitely shows that we think mesmer is perfectly fine and all.

[tartarus.1082]

> @Hitman.5829 said:

> Look at all these mesmers trying to make it sound like mesmer is ok and not OP. It will get nerfed and all of you know it.

 

I'm pretty sure most of the thread comments agree with you. As a Mesmer I sure do.

 

In fact both helseth and frostball said elusive mind should never be a trait and most vocal mesmers in the forum agree. If anet wont replace it I personally would like to see it get the same treatment as UC or at least get an icd.

 

Moreover the condi burst potential is pretty toxic design. Most of the skills are instant cast and for the most part set up isn't even required, just precasts into jaunt. It sure isn't fun to face, and is just as boring to use.

 

Also for the random power spike comment that always appears when someone talks about Mesmer bursts that isn't what people are concerned with atm. Mainly because power mes generally can't hit through passive procs such as warriors defy pain and engi shrink skill (not saying that it should either).

[MyPuppy.8970]

> @BurrTheKing.8571 said:

> Three idea that Mesmer sustains itself by the use of visual trickery is fine. The issue is,very few players actually use the class in that way. Instead of standing still to make yourself appear to be a clone, most play the class like any other damage dealer. Why shouldn't they? The game actively encourages it now. You don't have to be clever with Mirage, land your confusion spike, then rotate your defenses until you can do it again.

>

> I assume the class is this way because the old GW1 Mes wouldn't have worked in open world PvE. There were damage builds, very common ones, but the core of the class was debuffing and interrupting, which is fairly worthless in most PvE content.

>

> Even so, changing the class to be just another spike class that uses Condi while having way smaller tells than something like Holo. You can still damage the Holo while they damage you, not so when it comes to Mirage. They're very strong 1v1 but factor in Scourge giving them cover condis and you have a real monster on your hands. I think the only reason we don't see more is that the class is much less pick up and play than say Scourge.

 

Maybe autogive 5 stacks of torment to the mesmer when generating a clone? Some say torment is useless if you don't move.

[Burnfall.9573]

Isn't it obvious 5 years+ later that nerfing messmer and their counterpart thief does absolutely nothing to them?

 

It's like both of these toxic classes are intentionally design to be immune to all nerfs

 

So why not just remove the root cause of their toxic design and redesign them?

 

Anet, The community is tired, frustrated and losing patience beyond outrage.

 

We know nerfing thief and mesmer are not the solution

 

+ Redesigning them is The Solution

 

**Enough is Enough!!**

 

 

Take Action Now!!

[Ragion.2831]

I'ts just odd to me that mesmer no longer has a down time. It used to be that each class had 2 or 3 high damage must dodge skills but if you manage to avoid those, you can focus on landing yours which they had to avoid. It was a lot more interesting because combat became a game of who can punish who the most for missing (assuming no bunkers)

Mesmer in particular used to be vulnerable right after they committed to a burst and the burst was practically instant and could one shot so avoiding it was kind of an achievement since you had to guess when it was happening. After that they had to go on the defensive so you had some time to counter.

 

Now, even getting hit by anything the mesmer does either will take 50% of your hp or applies enough condis to kill you and it never ends. But this is actually fine, its pretty stupd but its tolerable most of the time.

 

What makes no type of sense is any class not just mesmers being able to activate non stun break skills while cc'd simply because they have no cast time. Stunned should mean unable to do anything but with Arenanet stunned means unable to move or cast unless the skill doesnt have an animation wind up.

 

So when i find that half second opening on a mesmer and the cc lands, they can still shatter and distort? With other games when you experience any type of CC, all skills get blocked out or go on a global cooldown for the stun duration.