[Suggestion] Remove / Disable Thumbs Down (possibly Thumbs Up)

[TheOneWhoSighs.7513]

For anyone who wants it, I've made a number of edits to the forum CSS & removed the reaction stuff other than helpful.

 

You can use an app like "custom style script" and set it for the ANet domain.

 

I haven't made any edits to the front pages of the forums, only the actual threads. So more to come eventually.

```

body * {

font-family: helvetica, sans-serif !important;

color: #333333;

}

.Section-Discussion .Content .Item-Header::after {

background-image: none;

border-bottom: 1px solid #333333;

}

.Section-Discussion .Content .Item .Item-Body::after {

background-image: none;

border-bottom: 1px solid #333333;

}

.Section-Discussion .Content .Item {

border-bottom-width: initial !important;

border-bottom: 1px solid #333333;

}

.DataList .Item {

background: none;

}

.ReactButton {

border: 1px solid #e1d9d9;

background-color: #f9f9f9;

border-radius: 5px;

padding: 5px;

}

.Section-Discussion .Content .Item-Header .Meta time {

color: #333333 !important;

}

.RecordReactions {

display: none !important;

}

.ReactButton-Dislike {

display: none !important;

}

.ReactButton-Like {

display: none !important;

}

```

[TheUndefined.1720]

If you agree with this / disagree with this thread, you should probably post your thoughts in this official feedback thread as well;

 

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/269/feedback-new-forums#latest

[draconicrose.6213]

I agree that it should be removed. Thumbs Up and Down are generic and worthless, with potential for abuse. I actually recommend looking at Facebook of all things for how to make better reactions.

[TheUndefined.1720]

It looks like they're shutting feedback / suggestion threads down, if you want to post on this - put it in the feedback thread.

 

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/269/feedback-new-forums#latest

[warbignime.4610]

Why? I like it, it let's people see how many people agree/disagree with you. Why not? The forum need a upvote/downvote system like reddit.

[ardasica.4531]

> @warbignime.4610 said:

> Why? I like it, it let's people see how many people agree/disagree with you. Why not? The forum need a upvote/downvote system like reddit.

 

I thought commenting accomplished that fairly well.

[mrstealth.6701]

They at least need to get rid of the avatars being displayed with thumbs up/down. It's pointless as-is anyway, with the ups and downs all clumped into one unorganized pile of visual clutter.

 

I'd prefer see the system trashed and just keep the helpful option, and perhaps an anonymous thumbs up. I don't see much benefit to having it announced, but it does have the potential for trolling, grudges, etc.

[IvoryAire.1597]

I truly do not understand something. Some people here on this thread are saying that they believe that don't believe that the thumbs down promotes a positive environment. Whether you agree with that or not, why give them a thumbs down? Why are they being thumbs downed for trying to promote a positive environment? It is just strange to me.

 

As far as how I feel about the thumbs down option, other than reddit, I've not been in a forum where something like that is normal. I rarely have been on reddit where they do have down voting, but I've never paid attention to it. So I really have not strong positive or negative reaction to the down vote.

 

Still the down votes for those who just want a positive environment seems to prove their point IMO.

[rapthorne.7345]

I appreciate the irony of using the thumbs up to show support for removing the thumbs up/down buttons, but yes. the thumbs up/down serve no good purpose on a forum, we're not on reddit.

[Einlanzer.1627]

> @IvoryAire.1597 said:

> I truly do not understand something. Some people here on this thread are saying that they believe that don't believe that the thumbs down promotes a positive environment. Whether you agree with that or not, why give them a thumbs down? Why are they being thumbs downed for trying to promote a positive environment? It is just strange to me.

>

> As far as how I feel about the thumbs down option, other than reddit, I've not been in a forum where something like that is normal. I rarely have been on reddit where they do have down voting, but I've never paid attention to it. So I really have not strong positive or negative reaction to the down vote.

>

> Still the down votes for those who just want a positive environment seems to prove their point IMO.

 

Because thumbs down basically operates as a way to give unthinking people a voice in specific topics they arguably don't really deserve. And disagreeing with people in a thoughtless way was never its intended purpose in places like reddit, but that's what it swiftly became.

 

If you're going to disagree with an idea someone is posting, you need to be willing to think through why and post constructive criticism, otherwise, you need to just leave it be for other people with more investment in the topic to discuss. A lot of forum posters just don't think that way, and thumbs down enables them.

[TheGrimm.5624]

I think its too early to tell yet. Right now it seems to be a good indicator on how well your comment is received and acts as a mini moderator on its own. The +1 system of the old forum wasn't that visible and some people do like to provide feedback but without adding in comment. Do not use Reddit but it seems that people are more familiar with how the system their can be abused. As long as thumbs down does not cause a thread to be removed/vanish not seeing a reason to see how well the community here uses it before adjusting if needed.

[Aaricia.9758]

I don't really care one way or another as long as this doesn't turn into my Facebook feed:

 

"My character turned five today! Can I get 500 Thumbs Up?"

"My character died. 1 Thumbs Up = 1 Prayer to Dwayna."

[Helbjorne.9368]

> @Aaricia.9758 said:

> I don't really care one way or another as long as this doesn't turn into my Facebook feed:

>

> "My character turned five today! Can I get 500 Thumbs Up?"

> "My character died. 1 Thumbs Up = 1 Prayer to Dwayna."

 

Sounds like you need to do some social media cleansing...

[Menadena.7482]

> @rapthorne.7345 said:

> I appreciate the irony of using the thumbs up to show support for removing the thumbs up/down buttons, but yes. the thumbs up/down serve no good purpose on a forum, we're not on reddit.

 

Which is why we need a LOL button. :)

[Rauderi.8706]

> @Menadena.7482 said:

> > @rapthorne.7345 said:

> > I appreciate the irony of using the thumbs up to show support for removing the thumbs up/down buttons, but yes. the thumbs up/down serve no good purpose on a forum, we're not on reddit.

>

> Which is why we need a LOL button. :)

 

LOL+1

I kid, I kid.

 

Though, perhaps instead of Up/Down, we'd be better served with items that have a more direct purpose? It'd probably be button bloat, though.

But stuff like "Funny" for amusing/pithy posts or "No Thanks" for ideas we're not so keen on. Maybe even a "Rude" callout for those folks who would normally get downvoted for their tone, instead of the content of their message.

 

But let's keep Helpful. :)

 

[TheUndefined.1720]

Honestly, I think fun tongue-in-cheek phrases should be used instead of the thumbs up / thumbs down (direct agree / disagree), here's what I got so far:

A-Rytlock-Grumble

Coo-rrific!

Commander-Cat-Judges

One-Logan-Facepalm

A-Garm-Growl

An-Aurene-Tailshake

 

Also, you could substitute them with status effects, skill moves, or even item names like;

Confusion

Torment

Protected

+1 Ecto

+1 Karma

Etc...

 

I get the status effects don't really have meaning, but that's sort of the point. AGAIN - I'm not suggesting these features to be taken out purely to protect self-egos; people need to thicken their skin and face differing of opinions. I'm only suggesting these features to be taken out, because they detract from discussion. The side-effect is yes they could be used for harassment and that's bad too.

 

What replacements can you all come up with? :)

[TheQuickFox.3826]

Yay, I got my first opinion about my contributions and it was a... thumbs down. :s

 

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/profile/reactions/TheQuickFox.3826?reaction=dislike

 

Apparently someone can't handle the truth and decided to leave an anonymous downvote.

I would be happy to get rid of the downvotes and leave it with a report button for stuff against the rules and a thumbs up button for things you like.

[Leo G.4501]

An easy change to this would be "Thumbs Up" be changed to "Agree" and "Thumbs Down" changed to "Disagree". You can keep the icons but those changes would make the option sound neutral enough for everyone.

[castlemanic.3198]

> @Einlanzer.1627 said:

> Because thumbs down basically operates as a way to give unthinking people a voice in specific topics they arguably don't really deserve. And disagreeing with people in a thoughtless way was never its intended purpose in places like reddit, but that's what it swiftly became.

>

> If you're going to disagree with an idea someone is posting, you need to be willing to think through why and post constructive criticism, otherwise, you need to just leave it be for other people with more investment in the topic to discuss. A lot of forum posters just don't think that way, and thumbs down enables them.

 

Why is the immediate thought that thumbs down gives 'unthinking' people a voice? Has there never been a case where someone so obviously misses the truth/reality of a situation and has been actively fighting againse the truth that it becomes useless to argue against someone who won't listen to reason? Maybe there's a trend to do so, but undoubtedly there are numerous scenarios where people can argue against facts without being a troll or doing things against the terms of service and legitimate conversation goes nowhere, and in those situations a thumbs down works.

 

Not that I think thumbs down is necessarily the way to go (as Leo G suggested, changing 'thumbs up' and 'thumbs down' to the much more ambivalent 'agree' and 'disagree' could create enough psychological difference to reduce downvote spamming and it's psychological effect on those who receive downvotes), but I'm saying painting an unnecessarily broad stroke of situations as 'giving unthinking people a voice' is definitely wrong.

[VaaCrow.3076]

I enjoy the thumb up/down system, not everyone will, sure. But does that mean it should be removed? no.

[Cyprien.4208]

I find it funny people like to compare it to reddit when the system itself is nothing like reddit. Yes, while it does have a thumbs up and down voting the voting here doesn't effect the post in any way so unlike reddit your post aren't hidden when down voted or moved lower in the subforum list.

 

The amount of down post which are even down voted on this topic is very small with only the og post being down voted the most.

[Helbjorne.9368]

> @TheQuickFox.3826 said:

> Yay, I got my first opinion about my contributions and it was a... thumbs down. :s

>

> https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/profile/reactions/TheQuickFox.3826?reaction=dislike

>

> Apparently someone can't handle the truth and decided to leave an anonymous downvote.

> I would be happy to get rid of the downvotes and leave it with a report button for stuff against the rules and a thumbs up button for things you like.

 

This is the issue. People take it too personally. Someone disagreed with what you said, oh well, move on. As others have mentioned, this isn't Reddit, where posts are hidden due to downvotes.

[Alimar.8760]

Honestly we should post these opinions to the Feedback forum that Gaile is observing. Also if i recall correctly she'd like to see how the thumbs up/down works for the next few weeks or something. There's many pro's and con's to the system. The fact that it isn't anonymous helps curb peoples "mass voting" like reddit. As this is a new system, it should be up to us to help push them to what is best, so lets provide good feedback on this system and make it awesome!

[Leo G.4501]

> @castlemanic.3198 said:

> Not that I think thumbs down is necessarily the way to go (as Leo G suggested, changing 'thumbs up' and 'thumbs down' to the much more ambivalent 'agree' and >'disagree' could create enough psychological difference to reduce downvote spamming and it's psychological effect on those who receive downvotes), but I'm saying >painting an unnecessarily broad stroke of situations as 'giving unthinking people a voice' is definitely wrong.

>

 

I would also suggest removing any tracking of agree/disagree so looking at a person's profile can't pull up these facts. Also, remove the ability to take action on a posters posts via their profile (as is, someone can click the profile and look at all their posts and up/down vote from that page). You should be required to go to the thread with the post to then vote on that post.

 

In the end, the only way to see the standing of a post is to read the thread and the only way to know how many downvotes or upvotes someone has accumulated is by going to each of the posts and adding them up (or look at their badges).

 

And that's another point of contention. The badges. It'll only be a matter of time until you have helpful/upvote farms, which is a blatant abuse of the system but no one cares about that. They only care about the "negativity" that isn't even tracked by anything. That should tell you enough about those participating in these discussions...

 

 

[castlemanic.3198]

> @"Leo G.4501" said:

> I would also suggest removing any tracking of agree/disagree so looking at a person's profile can't pull up these facts. Also, remove the ability to take action on a posters posts via their profile (as is, someone can click the profile and look at all their posts and up/down vote from that page). You should be required to go to the thread with the post to then vote on that post.

>

> In the end, the only way to see the standing of a post is to read the thread and the only way to know how many downvotes or upvotes someone has accumulated is by going to each of the posts and adding them up (or look at their badges).

>

> And that's another point of contention. The badges. It'll only be a matter of time until you have helpful/upvote farms, which is a blatant abuse of the system but no one cares about that. They only care about the "negativity" that isn't even tracked by anything. That should tell you enough about those participating in these discussions...

>

>

 

These are smart suggestions. I didn't think a simple thumbs up was good enough so i figured i'd vocalise it.