Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Link.1049" said: > > @"Flauvious.6195" said: > > Y'all should start taking toughness. I know it's been a completely useless stat for a long time since 80% of your opponents completely ignored it, but now power is run again there is a stat which reduces it's effectiveness... > > Toughness does NOTHING for a thief... it's like giving us alacrity...useless. A mesmer should not be getting the drop on you in pvp as a thief. You should be initiating all fights with any oneshot mesmers, or ready to shadowstep out the moment you get power locked. For all other classes, Toughness amulets will help cover the initial dps. It is still merciless, don't get me wrong. But I prefer this to confusion stacking that gets reapplied so fast you cannot clear it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Threather.9354 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 haha. Tried to duel greatsword mesmer in WvW on my holosmith. He just kept trying to burst. Then went 1200 range, pewpewed with his gs for like 6k per sec and when i got close again, shatter bursted and ran far away again. He wasnt good tho so I could have won that if I just wasnt derping. Cant imagine what it can do on good hands tho,. I hope they dont have any cleanse at least so one-hit thieves and condi builds might counter it or something :D Dont think holo can take long range mobile power class on open field. Time to swap class I guess, holosmith lost its cleanse as well so there are too many bad matchups now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diesel Stelar.3709 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"ToPNoP.2493" said: > > @"Diesel Stelar.3709" said: > > You ppl are funny, if you can't make a difference between the real mess and the illusions and can't care less about being aware where the enemy is, you will die. I would gladly have back the condi confusion mes instead of the power-> more invis, more disengage and better mobility overall instead of this current static power mes. Git gud or git rekt. > > The Mesmer is a bandwagon toon, if it is too strong we just wont play against it. If pvp is still terrible, personally I will just farm gears. I have no worries on the Mesmer front, because opness is just a setting. I haven't had enough Mesmer encounters to make a guess on how strong it is, but I will say that I have beat 3 and been killed by one while roaming. I also fought 2 on my warrior (the other suddenly appeared mid fight when he seen his friend getting facerolled), they had a hard time with me. I know that thief daredevil is having a hard time with mirage (and gets 1 hit by weaver, soulbeast, and Mesmer without being able to 1 hit back) but thief has been nerfed as much as it can be without fully destroying it. If Mesmer is ever nerfed, I feel like they will be in for a rude awakening when thieves can again compete. This will happen. The hands down most annoying, non camp taking, slow, and overpowered Mirage spec is over thief, the most popular and fastest class? I don't see that lasting forever. If so, just quit, less money equals action. The current mesmer build does what all berserker builds do- a lot of dmg in a few hits. I played since the patch as power mes and heraldshiro rev. When a ranger gets a target on me as mes i'm seriously screwed, due to the lack of mobility axes and secondary staff gave me in the previous meta. Unless I manage to juke in the eviroment i'm dead. When I've experienced already how immobile and unable to disengage the current mes is, when I switched to rev they are food for me. Might juke me around for a couple of seconds, but sooner rather than later I kill them-> if you manage to hit rev sword 4 it takes about 50% of the mes hp. On a second note the sources of power mes dmg are mainly shatter. If one panics and instantly uses all his defensive skills once he gets hit by some aa of power mes or like gs 4, he's doomed to die, since it could be said the mes juked you to use all your defense and when you really need them, he shatters you and you die. The mechanics of power mes are really transparent and there aren't many ways to bait the enemy of using their defensive utility in order to get a clear shot of shatters. If one is aware of the map rotations and the enemy positioning then you shouldn't have much if any problems with power mes. My advice for guys,who complain is first off to learn all classes, their rotations and defensive mechanics. Once you do, you can forsee what the opponent might do and know how to exploit his weaknesses by baiting out skills, defensive utilities etc etc. One doesn't get good in PvP in any game if he doesn't understand what the enemy does. It would be nice for guys to stop complaining about stuff they don't or don't want to understand. People now don't know what real nuke was, back when thief did double backstab for like 20k dmg, now that were some amazing times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToPNoP.2493 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Diesel Stelar.3709" said: > > @"ToPNoP.2493" said: > > > @"Diesel Stelar.3709" said: > > > You ppl are funny, if you can't make a difference between the real mess and the illusions and can't care less about being aware where the enemy is, you will die. I would gladly have back the condi confusion mes instead of the power-> more invis, more disengage and better mobility overall instead of this current static power mes. Git gud or git rekt. > > > > The Mesmer is a bandwagon toon, if it is too strong we just wont play against it. If pvp is still terrible, personally I will just farm gears. I have no worries on the Mesmer front, because opness is just a setting. I haven't had enough Mesmer encounters to make a guess on how strong it is, but I will say that I have beat 3 and been killed by one while roaming. I also fought 2 on my warrior (the other suddenly appeared mid fight when he seen his friend getting facerolled), they had a hard time with me. I know that thief daredevil is having a hard time with mirage (and gets 1 hit by weaver, soulbeast, and Mesmer without being able to 1 hit back) but thief has been nerfed as much as it can be without fully destroying it. If Mesmer is ever nerfed, I feel like they will be in for a rude awakening when thieves can again compete. This will happen. The hands down most annoying, non camp taking, slow, and overpowered Mirage spec is over thief, the most popular and fastest class? I don't see that lasting forever. If so, just quit, less money equals action. > > The current mesmer build does what all berserker builds do- a lot of dmg in a few hits. I played since the patch as power mes and heraldshiro rev. When a ranger gets a target on me as mes i'm seriously screwed, due to the lack of mobility axes and secondary staff gave me in the previous meta. Unless I manage to juke in the eviroment i'm dead. When I've experienced already how immobile and unable to disengage the current mes is, when I switched to rev they are food for me. Might juke me around for a couple of seconds, but sooner rather than later I kill them-> if you manage to hit rev sword 4 it takes about 50% of the mes hp. > On a second note the sources of power mes dmg are mainly shatter. If one panics and instantly uses all his defensive skills once he gets hit by some aa of power mes or like gs 4, he's doomed to die, since it could be said the mes juked you to use all your defense and when you really need them, he shatters you and you die. The mechanics of power mes are really transparent and there aren't many ways to bait the enemy of using their defensive utility in order to get a clear shot of shatters. If one is aware of the map rotations and the enemy positioning then you shouldn't have much if any problems with power mes. > My advice is first off to learn all classes, their rotations and defensive mechanics. Once you do, you can forsee what the opponent might do and know how to exploit his weaknesses by baiting out skills, defensive utilities etc etc. One doesn't get good in PvP in any game if he doesn't understand what the enemy does. It would be nice for guys to stop complaining about stuff they don't or don't want to understand. > People now don't know what real nuke was, back when thief did double backstab for like 20k dmg, now that were some amazing times. Your statement that mes is more immobile is laughable, but otherwise... I wholly agree with you, I don't pay much attention to pvp because of the obvious cheaters and loopholes that anet does nothing about. I wvw mostly, though id be ranked if I cared more in pvp (it gets annoying so I quit, degrade to bronze, and can never break platinum because it takes 2+ seasons to average over gold)... It is simply too soon to tell if Mesmer is op yet. I hope it is normal, but assume there will be great players as are on all different types of toons. I am a bit pessimistic because Mesmer can blink and invis so far away, making it almost unkillable if they don't want to press the fight. I hope that the mechanics are at least a little difficult, because thief is hard af to play, and guard is hard af to play, and warrior, well its warrior. Op classes should need the toons to be learned before being so powerful. If 100 1st time players cry because mirage is too hard to learn, and they need class carry, tell them to get gud or get rekt (as rumors go, as for the devs that main mes too, if I kill you don't buff your class to your skill set, because if you are not as good as me, the ones who are will be god mode). Because no one should be op day 1. A game should have some level of integrity, at least enough to tell players to learn, and to tell devs no when they want a few classes to dominate the rest. I mean, anet states they will use player data to determing world restructuring in the future, its too bad they cant find a way to determine power output, damage taken, and wins/losses for each class so they could find the real issues, not just squeaky sub par players opinions on day 7 after buying pof (in determining the wins losses, the player should have purchased pof and played for a year in order to keep errors more in check). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tartarus.1082 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Crinn.7864" said: > A Mesmer's downstate phantasm hit me for 7k. It didn't feel very good. I oneshot a thief with it tbh, it’s a bit crazy right now I think it hit for like 11-12k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToPNoP.2493 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"tartarus.1082" said: > > @"Crinn.7864" said: > > A Mesmer's downstate phantasm hit me for 7k. It didn't feel very good. > > I oneshot a thief with it tbh, it’s a bit crazy right now > > I think it hit for like 11-12k oneshotting a thief seems to be the norm now. soulbeast, mirage, weaver, and holosmith can all 1 shot a thief with no skills required. I think weaver only takes 2 seconds with its unlimited chain lightening skill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saerni.2584 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"ToPNoP.2493" said: > > @"tartarus.1082" said: > > > @"Crinn.7864" said: > > > A Mesmer's downstate phantasm hit me for 7k. It didn't feel very good. > > > > I oneshot a thief with it tbh, it’s a bit crazy right now > > > > I think it hit for like 11-12k > > oneshotting a thief seems to be the norm now. soulbeast, mirage, weaver, and holosmith can all 1 shot a thief with no skills required. I think weaver only takes 2 seconds with its unlimited chain lightening skill. To be fair a weaver can oneshot even tanky classes. The gimmick zerker build can hit a burst combo of 40k. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wichidi.9281 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 yeah nerf mesmer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apolo.5942 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Link.1049" said: > Holy cow... .I was holding out for a good patch...but anet disappointed the hell out of me. Someone was saying they do less confusion damage now...that doesn't matter because they don't need it anymore. It's the most broken class I've seen since HOT launched! I know they said they were going to watch it and adjust as needed, and that couldn't come soon enough. Wow... what a miscalculation. Mesmer the problem child? why am i not surprised, like not at all.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diesel Stelar.3709 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"ToPNoP.2493" said: > > @"Diesel Stelar.3709" said: > > > @"ToPNoP.2493" said: > > > > @"Diesel Stelar.3709" said: > > Your statement that mes is more immobile is laughable, but otherwise... Ye buddy, I'm main mes in plat 2 and don't know what I'm talking about. You right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Itz Jay.8941 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Diesel Stelar.3709" said: > You ppl are funny, if you can't make a difference between the real mess and the illusions and can't care less about being aware where the enemy is, you will die. I would gladly have back the condi confusion mes instead of the power-> more invis, more disengage and better mobility overall instead of this current static power mes. Git gud or git rekt. Gladly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stand The Wall.6987 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Threather.9354" said: > Dont think holo can take long range mobile power class on open field. Time to swap class I guess, holosmith lost its cleanse as well so there are too many bad matchups now. grab crystal configuration: storm holo master trait to make your aa 600 range Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadMed.3846 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Link.1049" said: > > @"BadMed.3846" said: > > It's a welcome change. Mesmers needed this balance. Use skill now. > > Mesmer was in a good place... now it's just broken... it's become just another broken spec in need of a fix. Meanwhile fixes that actually NEED to be done get left on the cutting room floor. #obstructedbygrass > > > Being OP is surely considered a "good place" to be in by many who play the class. It wasn't good for the game though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperadordf.2687 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 I just %80-0’d a Guardian with Phantasmal Rogue (Downed #3). It was... a sad moment. I didn’t like it. And Phantasmal Disenchanter now can one-shot classes with 11K Healthpool. Not nice at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deniara Devious.3948 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 So after countless of months of mesmers being overpowered, we get yet another OP mesmer spec with crazy damage. Do we need to wait yet another 6 months to finally to some game balance? Why not fix things in a week? Tweaking numbers back isn't that hard. This long-waited "balance" patch was a bad JOKE. It is no wonder that competitive minded players have moved to other games. And the newcomers will vanish from the game after being one shot dozens of time in a row. There is no way to a successful pvp game, unless you can make the game more newcomer friendly. In current form we are very far from it. To developers: discuss the changes before implementing them e.g. publish the upcoming patch notes 3-7 days before actually making them live. Then you have still the chance to cancel some of the changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToPNoP.2493 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Diesel Stelar.3709" said: > > @"ToPNoP.2493" said: > > > @"Diesel Stelar.3709" said: > > > > @"ToPNoP.2493" said: > > > > > @"Diesel Stelar.3709" said: > > > > > Your statement that mes is more immobile is laughable, but otherwise... > Ye buddy, I'm main mes in plat 2 and don't know what I'm talking about. You right. > > But snowflake, being plat doesn't mean anything, a lot of them face roll as easy as any gold or silver and anyone can be plat in 2 seasons, just make sure there is no decay at the end of the season. Back to the substance that matters; In wvw a Mesmer can blink a long ways away, it can go invis, and it has a super long invuln period. I run an evades speed thief and can not catch a mesmer if it does not want me to. Evades for days will get it to any gate before I can catch it (we are talking noob here because if they are on mirage and competent, class carry makes mirage to strong for me 1v1 with a thief). If that does not spell op getaway power to you, I'm wondering just what more are you asking for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crinn.7864 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Deniara Devious.3948" said: > So after countless of months of mesmers being overpowered, we get yet another OP mesmer spec with crazy damage. Do we need to wait yet another 6 months to finally to some game balance? Why not fix things in a week? Tweaking numbers back isn't that hard. > > This long-waited "balance" patch was a bad JOKE. It is no wonder that competitive minded players have moved to other games. And the newcomers will vanish from the game after being one shot dozens of time in a row. There is no way to a successful pvp game, unless you can make the game more newcomer friendly. In current form we are very far from it. > > To developers: discuss the changes before implementing them e.g. publish the upcoming patch notes 3-7 days before actually making them live. Then you have still the chance to cancel some of the changes. Dude chill, Mesmer was totally redesigned there was bound to be balance issues arising from such a overhaul. It's like I said on my channel last week, the rework will make mesmers either gods or garbage, and it seems that it was the former. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genesis.5169 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 Yep, my warning wasn't heeding for 4months i've been talking about power mesmer. 4months People have been complaining about condition mesmer while power was 1 shotting people all day. Nope your all gonna reap what you sow you all lobbied for condition to die you got it now your going to deal with mesmer one shotting you with decoy f1 out of stealth every day. The vindication is already here day 2 but its so bittersweet because my favorite spec in all of the 5 years i've been playing GW2 had to die because people refused to add condition cleanse on there bar. > @"Crinn.7864" said: > > @"Deniara Devious.3948" said: > > So after countless of months of mesmers being overpowered, we get yet another OP mesmer spec with crazy damage. Do we need to wait yet another 6 months to finally to some game balance? Why not fix things in a week? Tweaking numbers back isn't that hard. > > > > This long-waited "balance" patch was a bad JOKE. It is no wonder that competitive minded players have moved to other games. And the newcomers will vanish from the game after being one shot dozens of time in a row. There is no way to a successful pvp game, unless you can make the game more newcomer friendly. In current form we are very far from it. > > > > To developers: discuss the changes before implementing them e.g. publish the upcoming patch notes 3-7 days before actually making them live. Then you have still the chance to cancel some of the changes. > > Dude chill, Mesmer was totally redesigned there was bound to be balance issues arising from such a overhaul. It's like I said on my channel last week, the rework will make mesmers either gods or garbage, and it seems that it was the former. Power Mesmer has been this way since PoF launch none of you saw it because none of you wanted to because omfg conditions. Don't cry nerf now you guys got exactly want you wanted conditions completely out of the meta NOW your going to deal with REAL burst not the shitty one that gave you multiple times for counterplay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EUmad.7645 Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 > @"Genesis.5169" said: > Yep, my warning wasn't heeding for 4months i've been talking about power mesmer. > 4months People have been complaining about condition mesmer while power was 1 shotting people all day. > > Nope your all gonna reap what you sow you all lobbied for condition to die you got it now your going to deal with mesmer one shotting you with decoy f1 out of stealth every day. > > The vindication is already here day 2 but its so bittersweet because my favorite spec in all of the 5 years i've been playing GW2 had to die because people refused to add condition cleanse on there bar. > > > @"Crinn.7864" said: > > > @"Deniara Devious.3948" said: > > > So after countless of months of mesmers being overpowered, we get yet another OP mesmer spec with crazy damage. Do we need to wait yet another 6 months to finally to some game balance? Why not fix things in a week? Tweaking numbers back isn't that hard. > > > > > > This long-waited "balance" patch was a bad JOKE. It is no wonder that competitive minded players have moved to other games. And the newcomers will vanish from the game after being one shot dozens of time in a row. There is no way to a successful pvp game, unless you can make the game more newcomer friendly. In current form we are very far from it. > > > > > > To developers: discuss the changes before implementing them e.g. publish the upcoming patch notes 3-7 days before actually making them live. Then you have still the chance to cancel some of the changes. > > > > Dude chill, Mesmer was totally redesigned there was bound to be balance issues arising from such a overhaul. It's like I said on my channel last week, the rework will make mesmers either gods or garbage, and it seems that it was the former. > > Power Mesmer has been this way since PoF launch none of you saw it because none of you wanted to because kitten conditions. Don't cry nerf now you guys got exactly want you wanted conditions completely out of the meta NOW your going to deal with REAL burst not the kitten one that gave you multiple times for counterplay. Condi mesmer had a lot more survivability through staff 2 disengage. Staff in small fight is much better than gs so this was the reason condi chrono/mirage was the meta. Other than that meta had always had 2k power so it was not only the 25 stack of confusion, but the burst damage of f1 and sword 2 was not bad at all woth carrion ... and also with sage at time of chrono meta . People complained all time on condition stacks but also the direct damage was not trash .... Condi Chrono or Condi Mirage could kill a tempest with power .... ( in a long fight ) ... for a pure condi class it was near to impossible to do it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julius Seizure.4985 Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 Mesmer is currently balanced as if you had to manage clones and as if they were a limited resource for your shatters. This is no longer so, as all builds are generating tons of clones and can button mash Phantasms without consequences or competition for the 3 illusion limit— because hey, it’s a free clone regardless of the outcome. And then there is Shatterstorm sliding into this situation where clones are not anywhere near a limited resource anymore. The update certainly made Mesmer more intuitive and easier to play, but that also means you can no longer balance it as a high skill/high risk/high reward class. Heck, some of the defensive buffs are already the best traits I have ever seen... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunacy Solacio.6514 Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 > @"Crinn.7864" said: > A Mesmer's downstate phantasm hit me for 7k. It didn't feel very good. pshh just 7k? It can hit a zerk character for 16-18k apparently Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Link.1049 Posted February 12, 2018 Author Share Posted February 12, 2018 Yup...after logging in tonight and playing 5 matchs (losing 4)...bleck... I think I'm done. It's become more a game of who hit who first above all else. Will see what happens in a few months maybe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackBeard.2873 Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 > @"Crinn.7864" said: > > Dude chill, Mesmer was totally redesigned there was bound to be balance issues arising from such a overhaul. It's like I said on my channel last week, the rework will make mesmers either gods or garbage, and it seems that it was the former. The frustrating thing is that ANet has created a god, and will not properly adjust it for about 6 months. People whine about balance so much and so hard b/c the balance cycle is stupidly slow, and changes are usually way too small given the long wait. And yea...mes ruins pvp. I have been in a couple matches with two of them on one team, and its hilarious as there is a literal army of AI chasing people. And actually fightin mesmers is like banging your head against a brick wall, trying to time damage into short windows where they aren't invuln, while trying to survive under heavy pressure they can put out b/c dodges don't interrupt their offense, and then you just get instant CC when there finally is an opening b/c instant-cast CC is just the BEST balance! I also love how downstate dps from mesmers outpaces most people's live dps...smh...dead game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnderzShadow.2506 Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 > @"Diesel Stelar.3709" said: > > @"ToPNoP.2493" said: > > > @"Diesel Stelar.3709" said: > > > > @"ToPNoP.2493" said: > > > > > @"Diesel Stelar.3709" said: > > > > > Your statement that mes is more immobile is laughable, but otherwise... > Ye buddy, I'm main mes in plat 2 and don't know what I'm talking about. You right. > > What's your definition of mobile? I've never seen a mesmer beat me to a point so fast. Soulbeast is not stronger. As a druid, I'd happily go back to the condi mes. Necros aren't nerfed--they are tankier than they've ever been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToPNoP.2493 Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 > @"EnderzShadow.2506" said: > > @"Diesel Stelar.3709" said: > > > @"ToPNoP.2493" said: > > > > @"Diesel Stelar.3709" said: > > > > > @"ToPNoP.2493" said: > > > > > > @"Diesel Stelar.3709" said: > > > > > > > > Your statement that mes is more immobile is laughable, but otherwise... > > Ye buddy, I'm main mes in plat 2 and don't know what I'm talking about. You right. > > > > > > What's your definition of mobile? I've never seen a mesmer beat me to a point so fast. > > Soulbeast is not stronger. As a druid, I'd happily go back to the condi mes. > > Necros aren't nerfed--they are tankier than they've ever been. Definition of mobile, go invis and be very far away when they become visible again. Maybe I should have stressed "evasive" over mobility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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