Zero.3871 Posted March 15, 2018 Author Share Posted March 15, 2018 > @"Shadowcat.2680" said: > > @"Zero.3871" said: > > #just some comparisons: > > > > > > > > # Soulbeast (with Brown Bear & Jacaranda/ GS+LB): > > > > Uptime in a time period of 60 seconds for Blocks/Invis/Invul/Dodges: > > > > * Brown Bear Defy Pain: 3 sec invul with 40 sec cd -> 4,5 sec invul uptime in 60 seconds > > * Signet of Stone: 6 seconds invul with 80 sec cd -> 4,5 sec invul in 60 seconds > > * lesser signet of Stone: 5 sec invul with 70 sec cd -> ~4,2 sec invul in 60 seconds > > * GS 4 Counterattack: 3 sec block with 15 seconds cd -> 4 x 3 sec = 12 sec block in 60 seconds > > * Longbow 3 Hunters Shoot: 3 sec invis with 10 sec cd (skilled) -> 6 x 3 sec = 18 seconds invis uptime in 60 seconds > > * lightning Reflexes: 3/4 sec dodge 32 seconds cd (skilled) -> 2 x 3/4 sec dodge = 1,5 sec dodge uptime in 60 seconds > > * normal dodges with normal endurance Regeneration of 5 per second gives 1 new dodge every 10 seconds -> 6 x 3/4 sec dodges = 4,5 seconds dodge uptime in 60 seconds time period > > * lets ignore vidor and other endurance regenerating effects > > > > than we can sum up: > > 49, 3 seconds uptime in 60 seconds for Blocks/Invis/Invul/Dodges... > > thats ~82 % Uptime in a fight where you cannot clear attack him. > > > > Heal of that class in 60 seconds: > > > > * Brown Bear Spritual Reprive: ~4200 Heal 40 sec cd -> 6300 Heal in 60 sec > > * Jacaranda Spritual Reprive: ~4200 Heal 40 sec cd -> 6300 Heal in 60 sec > > * Jacaranda Photosynthesize: ~2500 Heal 20 sec cd -> 7500 Heal in 60 sec > > * Troll unguent: 8000 Heal 20 sec cd (skilleld) -> 24000 Heal in 60 seconds. > > > > to sum up: 43.100 Heal in a Minute + lifepoints pool of Minimum 16000. > > > > to kill a soulbeast you Need to make nearly 60.000 dmg in a 10 second time window in one Minute where you can attack him. On an enemy that can leap 5 times 1000 Range with GS 3 = 5000 Range and knock back you 5 times per Minute for Minimum of 900 range. ignoring the Problem that necros first have to Close the gap to all ranger classes that can attack you on 1500 range... > I think it's worth pointing out that the theoretical soulbeast you've analyzed here doesn't exist. > > 1) Spiritual Reprieve has a singular cooldown. Swapping to a second supportive pet does not reset the cooldown. So counting it as two separate heals doesn't really work. > 2) Marksmanship is required for the traited Signet of Stone. Some soulbeasts run this traitline but far from all do as its minor traits are lackluster. > 3) The Hunter's Shot for longbow has to actually hit something to grant the stealth. It won't hit everytime, so assuming 18 seconds stealth uptime in 60 seconds is not terribly accurate and Marksmanship is needed for the cooldown reduction of the skill. > 4) Since a second supportive pet won't grant a second Spiritual Reprieve, you won't see any halfway-decent soulbeasts running both jacaranda and brown bear. It's not realistic to assume a soulbeast will have both brown bear's Defy Pain and jacaranda's Photosynthesize. > 5) Traited Lightning Reflexes and traited Troll Ungeunt require the Wilderness Survival trait line. These skills and the traits for them are fairly common across soulbeast builds as the traits bring condi clear. The 8k heal looks fantastic on paper, but keep in mind that Troll Ungeunt delivers a 1k heal per second over eight seconds, requiring the eight seconds to do its full healing. > even thoug the druid /soulbeast have finally maybe uptime of just 50% of time for any dmg Negation like warri or mesm, what i want to Show in this thread is not that class xy is Overpowered or not. i just want to Show that reaper is in a bad state in comparison to any of this classes. fun fact: a full Berserker warrior (most offensive stat Combo in game) can longer outsustain an arbitrary number of enemies than a fullminstrel (theroetically most defensive statcombo in the game) necro... that just told everything that i have to say about defensive of necros. that have to get changed...cause slowliest class in the game + less defensive than anyone else? thats not balancing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadowcat.2680 Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 > @"Zero.3871" said: > > @"Shadowcat.2680" said: > > > @"Zero.3871" said: > > > #just some comparisons: > > > > > > > > > > > > # Soulbeast (with Brown Bear & Jacaranda/ GS+LB): > > > > > > Uptime in a time period of 60 seconds for Blocks/Invis/Invul/Dodges: > > > > > > * Brown Bear Defy Pain: 3 sec invul with 40 sec cd -> 4,5 sec invul uptime in 60 seconds > > > * Signet of Stone: 6 seconds invul with 80 sec cd -> 4,5 sec invul in 60 seconds > > > * lesser signet of Stone: 5 sec invul with 70 sec cd -> ~4,2 sec invul in 60 seconds > > > * GS 4 Counterattack: 3 sec block with 15 seconds cd -> 4 x 3 sec = 12 sec block in 60 seconds > > > * Longbow 3 Hunters Shoot: 3 sec invis with 10 sec cd (skilled) -> 6 x 3 sec = 18 seconds invis uptime in 60 seconds > > > * lightning Reflexes: 3/4 sec dodge 32 seconds cd (skilled) -> 2 x 3/4 sec dodge = 1,5 sec dodge uptime in 60 seconds > > > * normal dodges with normal endurance Regeneration of 5 per second gives 1 new dodge every 10 seconds -> 6 x 3/4 sec dodges = 4,5 seconds dodge uptime in 60 seconds time period > > > * lets ignore vidor and other endurance regenerating effects > > > > > > than we can sum up: > > > 49, 3 seconds uptime in 60 seconds for Blocks/Invis/Invul/Dodges... > > > thats ~82 % Uptime in a fight where you cannot clear attack him. > > > > > > Heal of that class in 60 seconds: > > > > > > * Brown Bear Spritual Reprive: ~4200 Heal 40 sec cd -> 6300 Heal in 60 sec > > > * Jacaranda Spritual Reprive: ~4200 Heal 40 sec cd -> 6300 Heal in 60 sec > > > * Jacaranda Photosynthesize: ~2500 Heal 20 sec cd -> 7500 Heal in 60 sec > > > * Troll unguent: 8000 Heal 20 sec cd (skilleld) -> 24000 Heal in 60 seconds. > > > > > > to sum up: 43.100 Heal in a Minute + lifepoints pool of Minimum 16000. > > > > > > to kill a soulbeast you Need to make nearly 60.000 dmg in a 10 second time window in one Minute where you can attack him. On an enemy that can leap 5 times 1000 Range with GS 3 = 5000 Range and knock back you 5 times per Minute for Minimum of 900 range. ignoring the Problem that necros first have to Close the gap to all ranger classes that can attack you on 1500 range... > > I think it's worth pointing out that the theoretical soulbeast you've analyzed here doesn't exist. > > > > 1) Spiritual Reprieve has a singular cooldown. Swapping to a second supportive pet does not reset the cooldown. So counting it as two separate heals doesn't really work. > > 2) Marksmanship is required for the traited Signet of Stone. Some soulbeasts run this traitline but far from all do as its minor traits are lackluster. > > 3) The Hunter's Shot for longbow has to actually hit something to grant the stealth. It won't hit everytime, so assuming 18 seconds stealth uptime in 60 seconds is not terribly accurate and Marksmanship is needed for the cooldown reduction of the skill. > > 4) Since a second supportive pet won't grant a second Spiritual Reprieve, you won't see any halfway-decent soulbeasts running both jacaranda and brown bear. It's not realistic to assume a soulbeast will have both brown bear's Defy Pain and jacaranda's Photosynthesize. > > 5) Traited Lightning Reflexes and traited Troll Ungeunt require the Wilderness Survival trait line. These skills and the traits for them are fairly common across soulbeast builds as the traits bring condi clear. The 8k heal looks fantastic on paper, but keep in mind that Troll Ungeunt delivers a 1k heal per second over eight seconds, requiring the eight seconds to do its full healing. > > > > even thoug the druid /soulbeast have finally maybe uptime of just 50% of time for any dmg Negation like warri or mesm, what i want to Show in this thread is not that class xy is Overpowered or not. i just want to Show that reaper is in a bad state in comparison to any of this classes. > fun fact: a full Berserker warrior (most offensive stat Combo in game) can longer outsustain an arbitrary number of enemies than a fullminstrel (theroetically most defensive statcombo in the game) necro... that just told everything that i have to say about defensive of necros. that have to get changed...cause slowliest class in the game + less defensive than anyone else? thats not balancing. I completely agree with you that reaper needs help. I don't know that it'll ever be as competent a roamer as the medium armor professions as those professions have far more mobility and access to stealth (both useful things for roamers). Warriors have too much sustain built-in as a high health pool profession and as a heavy armor user that can buff that armor further through the Defense trait line. Necros, as the other high health pool profession, seem intended to have sustain built in as well with the shroud as a second health pool. But the reality is that the drain on shroud for reaper makes shroud almost nonexistent as a second health pool. My point was that you've titled this thread as an analysis, but the thing you analyze most in the initial post is a specific soulbeast build running specific pets, and you set that up as a basis of comparison with reaper without as detailed an analysis of what reaper brings. Reaper by design seems intended to be a slow-moving, hard-hitting tank. The issue with it currently is that it can't do the tank part of that, can't take a hit, so it falls apart altogether without team support. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero.3871 Posted March 16, 2018 Author Share Posted March 16, 2018 > @"Shadowcat.2680" said: > > @"Zero.3871" said: > > > @"Shadowcat.2680" said: > > > > @"Zero.3871" said: > > > > #just some comparisons: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > # Soulbeast (with Brown Bear & Jacaranda/ GS+LB): > > > > > > > > Uptime in a time period of 60 seconds for Blocks/Invis/Invul/Dodges: > > > > > > > > * Brown Bear Defy Pain: 3 sec invul with 40 sec cd -> 4,5 sec invul uptime in 60 seconds > > > > * Signet of Stone: 6 seconds invul with 80 sec cd -> 4,5 sec invul in 60 seconds > > > > * lesser signet of Stone: 5 sec invul with 70 sec cd -> ~4,2 sec invul in 60 seconds > > > > * GS 4 Counterattack: 3 sec block with 15 seconds cd -> 4 x 3 sec = 12 sec block in 60 seconds > > > > * Longbow 3 Hunters Shoot: 3 sec invis with 10 sec cd (skilled) -> 6 x 3 sec = 18 seconds invis uptime in 60 seconds > > > > * lightning Reflexes: 3/4 sec dodge 32 seconds cd (skilled) -> 2 x 3/4 sec dodge = 1,5 sec dodge uptime in 60 seconds > > > > * normal dodges with normal endurance Regeneration of 5 per second gives 1 new dodge every 10 seconds -> 6 x 3/4 sec dodges = 4,5 seconds dodge uptime in 60 seconds time period > > > > * lets ignore vidor and other endurance regenerating effects > > > > > > > > than we can sum up: > > > > 49, 3 seconds uptime in 60 seconds for Blocks/Invis/Invul/Dodges... > > > > thats ~82 % Uptime in a fight where you cannot clear attack him. > > > > > > > > Heal of that class in 60 seconds: > > > > > > > > * Brown Bear Spritual Reprive: ~4200 Heal 40 sec cd -> 6300 Heal in 60 sec > > > > * Jacaranda Spritual Reprive: ~4200 Heal 40 sec cd -> 6300 Heal in 60 sec > > > > * Jacaranda Photosynthesize: ~2500 Heal 20 sec cd -> 7500 Heal in 60 sec > > > > * Troll unguent: 8000 Heal 20 sec cd (skilleld) -> 24000 Heal in 60 seconds. > > > > > > > > to sum up: 43.100 Heal in a Minute + lifepoints pool of Minimum 16000. > > > > > > > > to kill a soulbeast you Need to make nearly 60.000 dmg in a 10 second time window in one Minute where you can attack him. On an enemy that can leap 5 times 1000 Range with GS 3 = 5000 Range and knock back you 5 times per Minute for Minimum of 900 range. ignoring the Problem that necros first have to Close the gap to all ranger classes that can attack you on 1500 range... > > > I think it's worth pointing out that the theoretical soulbeast you've analyzed here doesn't exist. > > > > > > 1) Spiritual Reprieve has a singular cooldown. Swapping to a second supportive pet does not reset the cooldown. So counting it as two separate heals doesn't really work. > > > 2) Marksmanship is required for the traited Signet of Stone. Some soulbeasts run this traitline but far from all do as its minor traits are lackluster. > > > 3) The Hunter's Shot for longbow has to actually hit something to grant the stealth. It won't hit everytime, so assuming 18 seconds stealth uptime in 60 seconds is not terribly accurate and Marksmanship is needed for the cooldown reduction of the skill. > > > 4) Since a second supportive pet won't grant a second Spiritual Reprieve, you won't see any halfway-decent soulbeasts running both jacaranda and brown bear. It's not realistic to assume a soulbeast will have both brown bear's Defy Pain and jacaranda's Photosynthesize. > > > 5) Traited Lightning Reflexes and traited Troll Ungeunt require the Wilderness Survival trait line. These skills and the traits for them are fairly common across soulbeast builds as the traits bring condi clear. The 8k heal looks fantastic on paper, but keep in mind that Troll Ungeunt delivers a 1k heal per second over eight seconds, requiring the eight seconds to do its full healing. > > > > > > > even thoug the druid /soulbeast have finally maybe uptime of just 50% of time for any dmg Negation like warri or mesm, what i want to Show in this thread is not that class xy is Overpowered or not. i just want to Show that reaper is in a bad state in comparison to any of this classes. > > fun fact: a full Berserker warrior (most offensive stat Combo in game) can longer outsustain an arbitrary number of enemies than a fullminstrel (theroetically most defensive statcombo in the game) necro... that just told everything that i have to say about defensive of necros. that have to get changed...cause slowliest class in the game + less defensive than anyone else? thats not balancing. > > I completely agree with you that reaper needs help. I don't know that it'll ever be as competent a roamer as the medium armor professions as those professions have far more mobility and access to stealth (both useful things for roamers). > > Warriors have too much sustain built-in as a high health pool profession and as a heavy armor user that can buff that armor further through the Defense trait line. Necros, as the other high health pool profession, seem intended to have sustain built in as well with the shroud as a second health pool. But the reality is that the drain on shroud for reaper makes shroud almost nonexistent as a second health pool. > > My point was that you've titled this thread as an analysis, but the thing you analyze most in the initial post is a specific soulbeast build running specific pets, and you set that up as a basis of comparison with reaper without as detailed an analysis of what reaper brings. Reaper by design seems intended to be a slow-moving, hard-hitting tank. The issue with it currently is that it can't do the tank part of that, can't take a hit, so it falls apart altogether without team support. my Intention was to Show other good working classes, and show that These classes have a very great uptime for complete dmg Negation. to be viable a class Needs same amount of dmg Negation. anet easily could increase number of dodges reapers can use by implementing some vigor on that class. they also could implement more blinds on skills to negate more dmg. in other threats i had read suggestions for example give necro 50 endurance when leaving the shroud on trait "life from death". that are Options. but i also learned in all the years since 2012, that anet never implemented anything community suggested. so i just wanted to Show difference between some classes, without making suggestions (because suggestions are useless here). anet finally get some informations about my ( and maybe other necro palyers) Point of view to theProblem that necros have. and ist not important wether rangers are using ALL of those traits and skills or not. the fact is, that sskills like signet of Stone existing there and are used. necro dont have that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jalmari.3906 Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 well, i used to roam a lot with reaper it's not bad but pof classes are just op like many have pointed out anet nerfed all the fun out of necro, or just created some new op stuff which made reaper or power necro less decent it is kind of funny that they first nerfed shroud flashing now they boosted some stuff to "encourage" flashing. like wtf. one very bad "nerf" was fixing that old ds bug that let you block big hits since it didn't bleed through. **They really should recreate it and call it a feature.** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nimon.7840 Posted March 19, 2018 Share Posted March 19, 2018 > @"jalmari.3906" said: > well, i used to roam a lot with reaper it's not bad but pof classes are just op > > like many have pointed out anet nerfed all the fun out of necro, or just created some new op stuff which made reaper or power necro less decent > > it is kind of funny that they first nerfed shroud flashing now they boosted some stuff to "encourage" flashing. like kitten. > > one very bad "nerf" was fixing that old ds bug that let you block big hits since it didn't bleed through. **They really should recreate it and call it a feature.** > > > Fun fact: even a core class can easily kill reaper: Guardian. There are 2 possible scenarios: 1. He jumps at you. You dont activate shroud. You die 2. He jumps at you. You activate shroud. He bursts down your whole shroud. And even if you manage to run away, he just jumps at you again and burst you to death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrHome.1920 Posted March 19, 2018 Share Posted March 19, 2018 > @"Nimon.7840" said: > > @"jalmari.3906" said: > > well, i used to roam a lot with reaper it's not bad but pof classes are just op > > > > like many have pointed out anet nerfed all the fun out of necro, or just created some new op stuff which made reaper or power necro less decent > > > > it is kind of funny that they first nerfed shroud flashing now they boosted some stuff to "encourage" flashing. like kitten. > > > > one very bad "nerf" was fixing that old ds bug that let you block big hits since it didn't bleed through. **They really should recreate it and call it a feature.** > > > > > > > > Fun fact: even a core class can easily kill reaper: > > Guardian. There are 2 possible scenarios: > 1. He jumps at you. You dont activate shroud. You die > 2. He jumps at you. You activate shroud. He bursts down your whole shroud. And even if you manage to run away, he just jumps at you again and burst you to death. Not on this build: WvW: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vRAQNAndRnc0Ad2g12AWbC0biFcBD6qFAOAUdh2wXI+K+FDjA-j1BFABIt/Qhq/km+gFOFANp8LQlgA8EACAcAcezb+5BO/8zP/8z77zP/8zP/8zP/8zLFQEjBA-w sPvP: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vRAQNAndRnc0Ad2g12AWbC0biFcBjqL0G+CQXtAwBI+K+FDjA-jJxHQBF8JAYvyA9Y/BAcKAAA (Sigil of Exposure because of Decimate Defenses synergy) Utility Slot 3 is situational. Against Guardians "NCSY!" is obviously the best choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nimon.7840 Posted March 20, 2018 Share Posted March 20, 2018 > @"KrHome.1920" said: > > @"Nimon.7840" said: > > > @"jalmari.3906" said: > > > well, i used to roam a lot with reaper it's not bad but pof classes are just op > > > > > > like many have pointed out anet nerfed all the fun out of necro, or just created some new op stuff which made reaper or power necro less decent > > > > > > it is kind of funny that they first nerfed shroud flashing now they boosted some stuff to "encourage" flashing. like kitten. > > > > > > one very bad "nerf" was fixing that old ds bug that let you block big hits since it didn't bleed through. **They really should recreate it and call it a feature.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > Fun fact: even a core class can easily kill reaper: > > > > Guardian. There are 2 possible scenarios: > > 1. He jumps at you. You dont activate shroud. You die > > 2. He jumps at you. You activate shroud. He bursts down your whole shroud. And even if you manage to run away, he just jumps at you again and burst you to death. > Not on this build: > > WvW: > http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vRAQNAndRnc0Ad2g12AWbC0biFcBD6qFAOAUdh2wXI+K+FDjA-j1BFABIt/Qhq/km+gFOFANp8LQlgA8EACAcAcezb+5BO/8zP/8z77zP/8zP/8zP/8zLFQEjBA-w > > sPvP: > http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vRAQNAndRnc0Ad2g12AWbC0biFcBjqL0G+CQXtAwBI+K+FDjA-jJxHQBF8JAYvyA9Y/BAcKAAA > (Sigil of Exposure because of Decimate Defenses synergy) > > Utility Slot 3 is situational. Against Guardians "NCSY!" is obviously the best choice. > @"KrHome.1920" said: > > @"Nimon.7840" said: > > > @"jalmari.3906" said: > > > well, i used to roam a lot with reaper it's not bad but pof classes are just op > > > > > > like many have pointed out anet nerfed all the fun out of necro, or just created some new op stuff which made reaper or power necro less decent > > > > > > it is kind of funny that they first nerfed shroud flashing now they boosted some stuff to "encourage" flashing. like kitten. > > > > > > one very bad "nerf" was fixing that old ds bug that let you block big hits since it didn't bleed through. **They really should recreate it and call it a feature.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > Fun fact: even a core class can easily kill reaper: > > > > Guardian. There are 2 possible scenarios: > > 1. He jumps at you. You dont activate shroud. You die > > 2. He jumps at you. You activate shroud. He bursts down your whole shroud. And even if you manage to run away, he just jumps at you again and burst you to death. > Not on this build: > > WvW: > http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vRAQNAndRnc0Ad2g12AWbC0biFcBD6qFAOAUdh2wXI+K+FDjA-j1BFABIt/Qhq/km+gFOFANp8LQlgA8EACAcAcezb+5BO/8zP/8z77zP/8zP/8zP/8zLFQEjBA-w > > sPvP: > http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vRAQNAndRnc0Ad2g12AWbC0biFcBjqL0G+CQXtAwBI+K+FDjA-jJxHQBF8JAYvyA9Y/BAcKAAA > (Sigil of Exposure because of Decimate Defenses synergy) > > Utility Slot 3 is situational. Against Guardians "NCSY!" is obviously the best choice. Even with this build (the wvw one) you are just food for guardians. They have way better burst than you have as a reaper. They have way better def-options than you have as a reaper. They have way better healing thab you have as a reaper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero.3871 Posted March 20, 2018 Author Share Posted March 20, 2018 > @"Nimon.7840" said: > > @"KrHome.1920" said: > > > @"Nimon.7840" said: > > > > @"jalmari.3906" said: > > > > well, i used to roam a lot with reaper it's not bad but pof classes are just op > > > > > > > > like many have pointed out anet nerfed all the fun out of necro, or just created some new op stuff which made reaper or power necro less decent > > > > > > > > it is kind of funny that they first nerfed shroud flashing now they boosted some stuff to "encourage" flashing. like kitten. > > > > > > > > one very bad "nerf" was fixing that old ds bug that let you block big hits since it didn't bleed through. **They really should recreate it and call it a feature.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Fun fact: even a core class can easily kill reaper: > > > > > > Guardian. There are 2 possible scenarios: > > > 1. He jumps at you. You dont activate shroud. You die > > > 2. He jumps at you. You activate shroud. He bursts down your whole shroud. And even if you manage to run away, he just jumps at you again and burst you to death. > > Not on this build: > > > > WvW: > > http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vRAQNAndRnc0Ad2g12AWbC0biFcBD6qFAOAUdh2wXI+K+FDjA-j1BFABIt/Qhq/km+gFOFANp8LQlgA8EACAcAcezb+5BO/8zP/8z77zP/8zP/8zP/8zLFQEjBA-w > > > > sPvP: > > http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vRAQNAndRnc0Ad2g12AWbC0biFcBjqL0G+CQXtAwBI+K+FDjA-jJxHQBF8JAYvyA9Y/BAcKAAA > > (Sigil of Exposure because of Decimate Defenses synergy) > > > > Utility Slot 3 is situational. Against Guardians "NCSY!" is obviously the best choice. > > > @"KrHome.1920" said: > > > @"Nimon.7840" said: > > > > @"jalmari.3906" said: > > > > well, i used to roam a lot with reaper it's not bad but pof classes are just op > > > > > > > > like many have pointed out anet nerfed all the fun out of necro, or just created some new op stuff which made reaper or power necro less decent > > > > > > > > it is kind of funny that they first nerfed shroud flashing now they boosted some stuff to "encourage" flashing. like kitten. > > > > > > > > one very bad "nerf" was fixing that old ds bug that let you block big hits since it didn't bleed through. **They really should recreate it and call it a feature.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Fun fact: even a core class can easily kill reaper: > > > > > > Guardian. There are 2 possible scenarios: > > > 1. He jumps at you. You dont activate shroud. You die > > > 2. He jumps at you. You activate shroud. He bursts down your whole shroud. And even if you manage to run away, he just jumps at you again and burst you to death. > > Not on this build: > > > > WvW: > > http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vRAQNAndRnc0Ad2g12AWbC0biFcBD6qFAOAUdh2wXI+K+FDjA-j1BFABIt/Qhq/km+gFOFANp8LQlgA8EACAcAcezb+5BO/8zP/8z77zP/8zP/8zP/8zLFQEjBA-w > > > > sPvP: > > http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vRAQNAndRnc0Ad2g12AWbC0biFcBjqL0G+CQXtAwBI+K+FDjA-jJxHQBF8JAYvyA9Y/BAcKAAA > > (Sigil of Exposure because of Decimate Defenses synergy) > > > > Utility Slot 3 is situational. Against Guardians "NCSY!" is obviously the best choice. > > Even with this build (the wvw one) you are just food for guardians. > They have way better burst than you have as a reaper. > They have way better def-options than you have as a reaper. > They have way better healing thab you have as a reaper. true, reaper just have the same amount of dmg if he stack up 25 stacks vulnerability on enemy and stack some might, while other classes do the same dmg just by pressing Greatsword skill 5 or 2. no sideefects needed on warrior, thief or mesmer... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justine.6351 Posted March 20, 2018 Share Posted March 20, 2018 > @"EremiteAngel.9765" said: > I'm just thankful I experienced the 7 seconds shroud + Deathly Chill (3 bleed) era. > That was the Reaper's golden era. > Now, like roy said above, just Reaper for the fashion wars and place less emphasis on the effectiveness of it. I'm just thankful they finally nerfed that face tanking garbage play carry build called chill shout bleed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrHome.1920 Posted March 20, 2018 Share Posted March 20, 2018 > @"Nimon.7840" said: > Even with this build (the wvw one) you are just food for guardians. My K/D ratio against Vaabi- and FSP- (atm. the servers with the most competent roamers) Burst Guardians with their shiny sPvP wings tells a different story. > They have way better burst than you have as a reaper. > They have way better def-options than you have as a reaper. > They have way better healing thab you have as a reaper. In theory... Practically the only matchups where there are no win-options for Reapers atm. are D/D condi Thieves, all kinds of Druids and that new hybrid sustained damage illusion spam Mesmer build everybody runs now - all 3 of them have too much mobility/anti CC and too much invuln/evasion/distorsion uptime. And Reaper is not the only spec that is destroyed by these 3 builds. I still vote for 8s shroud base cooldown and the Plague Signet nerf in the next update is just stupid. Besides that, Reaper is pretty balanced. It's the other specs that need to be looked at and nerfed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nimon.7840 Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 > @"KrHome.1920" said: > > @"Nimon.7840" said: > > Even with this build (the wvw one) you are just food for guardians. > My K/D ratio against Vaabi- and FSP- (atm. the servers with the most competent roamers) Burst Guardians with their shiny sPvP wings tells a different story. > > > They have way better burst than you have as a reaper. > > They have way better def-options than you have as a reaper. > > They have way better healing thab you have as a reaper. > In theory... > > Practically the only matchups where there are no win-options for Reapers atm. are D/D condi Thieves, all kinds of Druids and that new hybrid sustained damage illusion spam Mesmer build everybody runs now - all 3 of them have too much mobility/anti CC and too much invuln/evasion/distorsion uptime. > > And Reaper is not the only spec that is destroyed by these 3 builds. > > I still vote for 8s shroud base cooldown and the Plague Signet nerf in the next update is just stupid. Besides that, Reaper is pretty balanced. It's the other specs that need to be looked at and nerfed. So you are basically donating them kills. 95% of their roamers are thiefes, mesmers or rangers. And most of the pvp guys rlly suck, when it comes to wvw roaming and fighting. So what server are you? Id love to fight against you with my reaper. Im currently on Drakkar lake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero.3871 Posted March 21, 2018 Author Share Posted March 21, 2018 > @"KrHome.1920" said: > > @"Nimon.7840" said: > > Even with this build (the wvw one) you are just food for guardians. > My K/D ratio against Vaabi- and FSP- (atm. the servers with the most competent roamers) Burst Guardians with their shiny sPvP wings tells a different story. > > > They have way better burst than you have as a reaper. > > They have way better def-options than you have as a reaper. > > They have way better healing thab you have as a reaper. > In theory... > > Practically the only matchups where there are no win-options for Reapers atm. are D/D condi Thieves, all kinds of Druids and that new hybrid sustained damage illusion spam Mesmer build everybody runs now - all 3 of them have too much mobility/anti CC and too much invuln/evasion/distorsion uptime. > > And Reaper is not the only spec that is destroyed by these 3 builds. > > I still vote for 8s shroud base cooldown and the Plague Signet nerf in the next update is just stupid. Besides that, Reaper is pretty balanced. It's the other specs that need to be looked at and nerfed. the most obvious clue that your class is underperforming heavily is, when someone come to your class subforum and say your class is good balanced xD... and like nimon already said, 95% of Players Play the classes you listed. so reaper is absolutely not in the meta, and next Balance patch will nerf reaper again hardly with nerf to plague signet...so how reaper should come to an equal lvl with your listed classes if both get nerfed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nimon.7840 Posted March 21, 2018 Share Posted March 21, 2018 > @"Zero.3871" said: > > @"KrHome.1920" said: > > > @"Nimon.7840" said: > > > Even with this build (the wvw one) you are just food for guardians. > > My K/D ratio against Vaabi- and FSP- (atm. the servers with the most competent roamers) Burst Guardians with their shiny sPvP wings tells a different story. > > > > > They have way better burst than you have as a reaper. > > > They have way better def-options than you have as a reaper. > > > They have way better healing thab you have as a reaper. > > In theory... > > > > Practically the only matchups where there are no win-options for Reapers atm. are D/D condi Thieves, all kinds of Druids and that new hybrid sustained damage illusion spam Mesmer build everybody runs now - all 3 of them have too much mobility/anti CC and too much invuln/evasion/distorsion uptime. > > > > And Reaper is not the only spec that is destroyed by these 3 builds. > > > > I still vote for 8s shroud base cooldown and the Plague Signet nerf in the next update is just stupid. Besides that, Reaper is pretty balanced. It's the other specs that need to be looked at and nerfed. > > the most obvious clue that your class is underperforming heavily is, when someone come to your class subforum and say your class is good balanced xD... > > and like nimon already said, 95% of Players Play the classes you listed. so reaper is absolutely not in the meta, and next Balance patch will nerf reaper again hardly with nerf to plague signet...so how reaper should come to an equal lvl with your listed classes if both get nerfed? Well. I also think, that reaper is in a pretty balanced state. He can do good dmg and has some weaknesses. Other classes are just way too over the top. Lets take mirage as example. You can build full deff. With dodgefood and all utility skills defensive. But you still do a shitload of dmg. Def shouldnt be the thing to do dmg. Oh well i guess its the same for reaper. But shroud is different. You cant flash it constantly without loosing something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycoprophet.8107 Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 > @"Zero.3871" said: > > @"Shadowcat.2680" said: > > > @"Zero.3871" said: > > > #just some comparisons: > > > > > > > > > > > > # Soulbeast (with Brown Bear & Jacaranda/ GS+LB): > > > > > > Uptime in a time period of 60 seconds for Blocks/Invis/Invul/Dodges: > > > > > > * Brown Bear Defy Pain: 3 sec invul with 40 sec cd -> 4,5 sec invul uptime in 60 seconds > > > * Signet of Stone: 6 seconds invul with 80 sec cd -> 4,5 sec invul in 60 seconds > > > * lesser signet of Stone: 5 sec invul with 70 sec cd -> ~4,2 sec invul in 60 seconds > > > * GS 4 Counterattack: 3 sec block with 15 seconds cd -> 4 x 3 sec = 12 sec block in 60 seconds > > > * Longbow 3 Hunters Shoot: 3 sec invis with 10 sec cd (skilled) -> 6 x 3 sec = 18 seconds invis uptime in 60 seconds > > > * lightning Reflexes: 3/4 sec dodge 32 seconds cd (skilled) -> 2 x 3/4 sec dodge = 1,5 sec dodge uptime in 60 seconds > > > * normal dodges with normal endurance Regeneration of 5 per second gives 1 new dodge every 10 seconds -> 6 x 3/4 sec dodges = 4,5 seconds dodge uptime in 60 seconds time period > > > * lets ignore vidor and other endurance regenerating effects > > > > > > than we can sum up: > > > 49, 3 seconds uptime in 60 seconds for Blocks/Invis/Invul/Dodges... > > > thats ~82 % Uptime in a fight where you cannot clear attack him. > > > > > > Heal of that class in 60 seconds: > > > > > > * Brown Bear Spritual Reprive: ~4200 Heal 40 sec cd -> 6300 Heal in 60 sec > > > * Jacaranda Spritual Reprive: ~4200 Heal 40 sec cd -> 6300 Heal in 60 sec > > > * Jacaranda Photosynthesize: ~2500 Heal 20 sec cd -> 7500 Heal in 60 sec > > > * Troll unguent: 8000 Heal 20 sec cd (skilleld) -> 24000 Heal in 60 seconds. > > > > > > to sum up: 43.100 Heal in a Minute + lifepoints pool of Minimum 16000. > > > > > > to kill a soulbeast you Need to make nearly 60.000 dmg in a 10 second time window in one Minute where you can attack him. On an enemy that can leap 5 times 1000 Range with GS 3 = 5000 Range and knock back you 5 times per Minute for Minimum of 900 range. ignoring the Problem that necros first have to Close the gap to all ranger classes that can attack you on 1500 range... > > I think it's worth pointing out that the theoretical soulbeast you've analyzed here doesn't exist. > > > > 1) Spiritual Reprieve has a singular cooldown. Swapping to a second supportive pet does not reset the cooldown. So counting it as two separate heals doesn't really work. > > 2) Marksmanship is required for the traited Signet of Stone. Some soulbeasts run this traitline but far from all do as its minor traits are lackluster. > > 3) The Hunter's Shot for longbow has to actually hit something to grant the stealth. It won't hit everytime, so assuming 18 seconds stealth uptime in 60 seconds is not terribly accurate and Marksmanship is needed for the cooldown reduction of the skill. > > 4) Since a second supportive pet won't grant a second Spiritual Reprieve, you won't see any halfway-decent soulbeasts running both jacaranda and brown bear. It's not realistic to assume a soulbeast will have both brown bear's Defy Pain and jacaranda's Photosynthesize. > > 5) Traited Lightning Reflexes and traited Troll Ungeunt require the Wilderness Survival trait line. These skills and the traits for them are fairly common across soulbeast builds as the traits bring condi clear. The 8k heal looks fantastic on paper, but keep in mind that Troll Ungeunt delivers a 1k heal per second over eight seconds, requiring the eight seconds to do its full healing. > > > > even thoug the druid /soulbeast have finally maybe uptime of just 50% of time for any dmg Negation like warri or mesm, what i want to Show in this thread is not that class xy is Overpowered or not. i just want to Show that reaper is in a bad state in comparison to any of this classes. > fun fact: a full Berserker warrior (most offensive stat Combo in game) can longer outsustain an arbitrary number of enemies than a fullminstrel (theroetically most defensive statcombo in the game) necro... that just told everything that i have to say about defensive of necros. that have to get changed...cause slowliest class in the game + less defensive than anyone else? thats not balancing. You would think the class with least mobility would have the best defenses aspecially in a game like this but no lol arenet thinks that being the slowest you should also have no blocks or invulnerability or any real protection that actually mitigates the high damage classes put out. Necro will always be a sitting duck because people who don’t play it don’t want it to be mobile or have defenses and will always argue their strong, I often even think some posters will even claim to main necro and actually don’t will say their in a fine spot cuz who doesn’t want fee bags,and seems arenet actually listens to whiners instead of making the game how they want it,Oh wait shrouds another hp bar lol, not even close! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycoprophet.8107 Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 Just chose a diff class,soulbeast,mirage or holo are good right now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenix the One.4071 Posted December 23, 2018 Share Posted December 23, 2018 Well you say we got no mobility, but we got Desth’s Charge every 10 CD, and it is pretty effective with quickness and all.. I zoom around the map. And it is easy to stack Lifeforce :) But yeah not as mobile as my thief:) But I feel like I hit harder than my DD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dace.8173 Posted December 23, 2018 Share Posted December 23, 2018 > @"Zero.3871" said: > > @"Shadowcat.2680" said: > > > @"Zero.3871" said: > > > > @"Shadowcat.2680" said: > > > > > @"Zero.3871" said: > > > > > #just some comparisons: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > # Soulbeast (with Brown Bear & Jacaranda/ GS+LB): > > > > > > > > > > Uptime in a time period of 60 seconds for Blocks/Invis/Invul/Dodges: > > > > > > > > > > * Brown Bear Defy Pain: 3 sec invul with 40 sec cd -> 4,5 sec invul uptime in 60 seconds > > > > > * Signet of Stone: 6 seconds invul with 80 sec cd -> 4,5 sec invul in 60 seconds > > > > > * lesser signet of Stone: 5 sec invul with 70 sec cd -> ~4,2 sec invul in 60 seconds > > > > > * GS 4 Counterattack: 3 sec block with 15 seconds cd -> 4 x 3 sec = 12 sec block in 60 seconds > > > > > * Longbow 3 Hunters Shoot: 3 sec invis with 10 sec cd (skilled) -> 6 x 3 sec = 18 seconds invis uptime in 60 seconds > > > > > * lightning Reflexes: 3/4 sec dodge 32 seconds cd (skilled) -> 2 x 3/4 sec dodge = 1,5 sec dodge uptime in 60 seconds > > > > > * normal dodges with normal endurance Regeneration of 5 per second gives 1 new dodge every 10 seconds -> 6 x 3/4 sec dodges = 4,5 seconds dodge uptime in 60 seconds time period > > > > > * lets ignore vidor and other endurance regenerating effects > > > > > > > > > > than we can sum up: > > > > > 49, 3 seconds uptime in 60 seconds for Blocks/Invis/Invul/Dodges... > > > > > thats ~82 % Uptime in a fight where you cannot clear attack him. > > > > > > > > > > Heal of that class in 60 seconds: > > > > > > > > > > * Brown Bear Spritual Reprive: ~4200 Heal 40 sec cd -> 6300 Heal in 60 sec > > > > > * Jacaranda Spritual Reprive: ~4200 Heal 40 sec cd -> 6300 Heal in 60 sec > > > > > * Jacaranda Photosynthesize: ~2500 Heal 20 sec cd -> 7500 Heal in 60 sec > > > > > * Troll unguent: 8000 Heal 20 sec cd (skilleld) -> 24000 Heal in 60 seconds. > > > > > > > > > > to sum up: 43.100 Heal in a Minute + lifepoints pool of Minimum 16000. > > > > > > > > > > to kill a soulbeast you Need to make nearly 60.000 dmg in a 10 second time window in one Minute where you can attack him. On an enemy that can leap 5 times 1000 Range with GS 3 = 5000 Range and knock back you 5 times per Minute for Minimum of 900 range. ignoring the Problem that necros first have to Close the gap to all ranger classes that can attack you on 1500 range... > > > > I think it's worth pointing out that the theoretical soulbeast you've analyzed here doesn't exist. > > > > > > > > 1) Spiritual Reprieve has a singular cooldown. Swapping to a second supportive pet does not reset the cooldown. So counting it as two separate heals doesn't really work. > > > > 2) Marksmanship is required for the traited Signet of Stone. Some soulbeasts run this traitline but far from all do as its minor traits are lackluster. > > > > 3) The Hunter's Shot for longbow has to actually hit something to grant the stealth. It won't hit everytime, so assuming 18 seconds stealth uptime in 60 seconds is not terribly accurate and Marksmanship is needed for the cooldown reduction of the skill. > > > > 4) Since a second supportive pet won't grant a second Spiritual Reprieve, you won't see any halfway-decent soulbeasts running both jacaranda and brown bear. It's not realistic to assume a soulbeast will have both brown bear's Defy Pain and jacaranda's Photosynthesize. > > > > 5) Traited Lightning Reflexes and traited Troll Ungeunt require the Wilderness Survival trait line. These skills and the traits for them are fairly common across soulbeast builds as the traits bring condi clear. The 8k heal looks fantastic on paper, but keep in mind that Troll Ungeunt delivers a 1k heal per second over eight seconds, requiring the eight seconds to do its full healing. > > > > > > > > > > even thoug the druid /soulbeast have finally maybe uptime of just 50% of time for any dmg Negation like warri or mesm, what i want to Show in this thread is not that class xy is Overpowered or not. i just want to Show that reaper is in a bad state in comparison to any of this classes. > > > fun fact: a full Berserker warrior (most offensive stat Combo in game) can longer outsustain an arbitrary number of enemies than a fullminstrel (theroetically most defensive statcombo in the game) necro... that just told everything that i have to say about defensive of necros. that have to get changed...cause slowliest class in the game + less defensive than anyone else? thats not balancing. > > > > I completely agree with you that reaper needs help. I don't know that it'll ever be as competent a roamer as the medium armor professions as those professions have far more mobility and access to stealth (both useful things for roamers). > > > > Warriors have too much sustain built-in as a high health pool profession and as a heavy armor user that can buff that armor further through the Defense trait line. Necros, as the other high health pool profession, seem intended to have sustain built in as well with the shroud as a second health pool. But the reality is that the drain on shroud for reaper makes shroud almost nonexistent as a second health pool. > > > > My point was that you've titled this thread as an analysis, but the thing you analyze most in the initial post is a specific soulbeast build running specific pets, and you set that up as a basis of comparison with reaper without as detailed an analysis of what reaper brings. Reaper by design seems intended to be a slow-moving, hard-hitting tank. The issue with it currently is that it can't do the tank part of that, can't take a hit, so it falls apart altogether without team support. > > my Intention was to Show other good working classes, and show that These classes have a very great uptime for complete dmg Negation. to be viable a class Needs same amount of dmg Negation. anet easily could increase number of dodges reapers can use by implementing some vigor on that class. they also could implement more blinds on skills to negate more dmg. > in other threats i had read suggestions for example give necro 50 endurance when leaving the shroud on trait "life from death". that are Options. but i also learned in all the years since 2012, that anet never implemented anything community suggested. so i just wanted to Show difference between some classes, without making suggestions (because suggestions are useless here). anet finally get some informations about my ( and maybe other necro palyers) Point of view to theProblem that necros have. > and ist not important wether rangers are using ALL of those traits and skills or not. the fact is, that sskills like signet of Stone existing there and are used. necro dont have that. It's worth noting that you undermine your analysis when you add in a build that people don't play. When @"Shadowcat.2680" pointed out that the Soulbeast you created doesn't exist you should have dropped it instead of defending it. Defending the use of a non-existent build makes it appear that you are purposely slanting the analysis so that it says what you want it to say as opposed to giving a true look at the WvW environment. Your free to keep it but do know that your points hold little weight when they rely on you manipulating the "data." Also, damage negation isn't the only thing one needs to be viable. There are other ways to be viable. Deadeye is viable but once it starts taking solid hits it can fold if the player doesn't have any Stealth left. > @"Nimon.7840" said: > > @"Zero.3871" said: > > > @"KrHome.1920" said: > > > > @"Nimon.7840" said: > > > > Even with this build (the wvw one) you are just food for guardians. > > > My K/D ratio against Vaabi- and FSP- (atm. the servers with the most competent roamers) Burst Guardians with their shiny sPvP wings tells a different story. > > > > > > > They have way better burst than you have as a reaper. > > > > They have way better def-options than you have as a reaper. > > > > They have way better healing thab you have as a reaper. > > > In theory... > > > > > > Practically the only matchups where there are no win-options for Reapers atm. are D/D condi Thieves, all kinds of Druids and that new hybrid sustained damage illusion spam Mesmer build everybody runs now - all 3 of them have too much mobility/anti CC and too much invuln/evasion/distorsion uptime. > > > > > > And Reaper is not the only spec that is destroyed by these 3 builds. > > > > > > I still vote for 8s shroud base cooldown and the Plague Signet nerf in the next update is just stupid. Besides that, Reaper is pretty balanced. It's the other specs that need to be looked at and nerfed. > > > > the most obvious clue that your class is underperforming heavily is, when someone come to your class subforum and say your class is good balanced xD... > > > > and like nimon already said, 95% of Players Play the classes you listed. so reaper is absolutely not in the meta, and next Balance patch will nerf reaper again hardly with nerf to plague signet...so how reaper should come to an equal lvl with your listed classes if both get nerfed? > > Well. I also think, that reaper is in a pretty balanced state. He can do good dmg and has some weaknesses. > > Other classes are just way too over the top. > Lets take mirage as example. > You can build full deff. > With dodgefood and all utility skills defensive. > > But you still do a shitload of dmg. Def shouldnt be the thing to do dmg. > > Oh well i guess its the same for reaper. But shroud is different. You cant flash it constantly without loosing something I would agree with this. I think Reaper is balanced for WvW. The problem is power creep and the solution isn't to make power creep worse by making Reaper even more powerful. That's just going to have negative consequences down the road. Mirage really is too strong, as an example. It's ability to do so many dodges available and then insane mobility on top of that while laying down some serious hurt makes other builds viable. This isn't a problem with the build itself but with the power level of Mirage. I'm also going to say not being able to roam doesn't mean there is a balance problem. Balance doesn't mean that Necromancer (or any profession really) is capable of doing all the things. Balance would mean being viable in the mode of play. The fact that Scourge and Reaper can do very well in zergs means that Necromancer is balanced for WvW. If it can't roam, it can't roam but lacking that ability is not an issue related to balance but one of playstyle preference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycoprophet.8107 Posted December 23, 2018 Share Posted December 23, 2018 IMHO necro is unbalanced because it has less defensive options as well as mobility compared to every other class and does good damage yeah but so do all other classes. Yes scourge is wvw Zerg meta by aoe spam which isn’t to healthy but least it’s got that I gues. Again my opinion only, just think it would make necro and its elites more fun in pvp and wvw if it had an increase in mobility and better defensive option Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycoprophet.8107 Posted December 23, 2018 Share Posted December 23, 2018 It seems a lot of people share that opinion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sigmoid.7082 Posted December 23, 2018 Share Posted December 23, 2018 > @"Phoenix the One.4071" said: > Well you say we got no mobility, but we got Desth’s Charge every 10 CD, and it is pretty effective with quickness and all.. I zoom around the map. > And it is easy to stack Lifeforce :) > But yeah not as mobile as my thief:) > But I feel like I hit harder than my DD. Quickness and slow so not have an effect on leap skills, which deaths charge is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenix the One.4071 Posted December 23, 2018 Share Posted December 23, 2018 > @"Sigmoid.7082" said: > > @"Phoenix the One.4071" said: > > Well you say we got no mobility, but we got Desth’s Charge every 10 CD, and it is pretty effective with quickness and all.. I zoom around the map. > > And it is easy to stack Lifeforce :) > > But yeah not as mobile as my thief:) > > But I feel like I hit harder than my DD. > > Quickness and slow so not have an effect on leap skills, which deaths charge is. I know some leapes have been changes to be unaffected, but I felt like Death’s Charge still was :0 I mean it probably isn’t, but I just gonna test it later, it just feels like I dash longer than 600 range :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sigmoid.7082 Posted December 23, 2018 Share Posted December 23, 2018 > @"Phoenix the One.4071" said: > > @"Sigmoid.7082" said: > > > @"Phoenix the One.4071" said: > > > Well you say we got no mobility, but we got Desth’s Charge every 10 CD, and it is pretty effective with quickness and all.. I zoom around the map. > > > And it is easy to stack Lifeforce :) > > > But yeah not as mobile as my thief:) > > > But I feel like I hit harder than my DD. > > > > Quickness and slow so not have an effect on leap skills, which deaths charge is. > > I know some leapes have been changes to be unaffected, but I felt like Death’s Charge still was :0 > I mean it probably isn’t, but I just gonna test it later, it just feels like I dash longer than 600 range :) Leap speed and range all aren't effected by it. You're also better off canceling the landing so you don't stutter in place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenix the One.4071 Posted December 23, 2018 Share Posted December 23, 2018 > @"Sigmoid.7082" said: > > @"Phoenix the One.4071" said: > > > @"Sigmoid.7082" said: > > > > @"Phoenix the One.4071" said: > > > > Well you say we got no mobility, but we got Desth’s Charge every 10 CD, and it is pretty effective with quickness and all.. I zoom around the map. > > > > And it is easy to stack Lifeforce :) > > > > But yeah not as mobile as my thief:) > > > > But I feel like I hit harder than my DD. > > > > > > Quickness and slow so not have an effect on leap skills, which deaths charge is. > > > > I know some leapes have been changes to be unaffected, but I felt like Death’s Charge still was :0 > > I mean it probably isn’t, but I just gonna test it later, it just feels like I dash longer than 600 range :) > > Leap speed and range all aren't effected by it. You're also better off canceling the landing so you don't stutter in place. Okay, never seen the stutter at the end, but thx for the tip :) Maybe due to I cancel it as soon as possible, to make the Shroud go on CD:) Could it be interesting if another passive effect would be Spectal armors “Life force on hits”? So necros always gain a small potion of life force, even when CC’ed and just taking dmg? The Spectal Armor could grant stab and prot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dace.8173 Posted December 23, 2018 Share Posted December 23, 2018 > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said: > IMHO necro is unbalanced because it has less defensive options as well as mobility compared to every other class and does good damage yeah but so do all other classes. Yes scourge is wvw Zerg meta by aoe spam which isn’t to healthy but least it’s got that I gues. Again my opinion only, just think it would make necro and its elites more fun in pvp and wvw if it had an increase in mobility and better defensive option Having fewer options don't inherently make something unbalanced. As an example, Scrapper having fewer Stealth options than Daredevil doesn't mean its unbalanced. Or take being a glass cannon, having a higher level of damage output but lower level of defense is perfectly fine if the damage output is strong enough. Balance is not about everyone having the exact same things or equal number of things. Balance is about relative power levels. The fact that Necromancer has good damage and so do the other professions doesn't mean it's unbalanced either. Again, balance is about relative power level not the number of things it has. Necromancer is actually strong in PvP and WvW, both Reaper and Scrouge. The things you speak of are player preference or quality of life issues. That isn't to say they aren't important. Just that you can't frame them as balance issues. It is more productive to discuss them as the player preference issues that they are. Insisting they are balance issues when they aren't, undermines your position and makes it easy for people to dismiss your issues. Once the balance part of it is picked apart you're left with nothing left of your point. It's just best if you're upfront that you want these things because they would increase your fun. Not everything that needs to be fixed is a balance issue. > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said: > It seems a lot of people share that opinion People sharing the opinion doesn't make it right. Balance isn't about the number of things any give profession has but relative power levels and how it compares with the rest of the game. The game is filled with uneven abilities but balanced professions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycoprophet.8107 Posted December 23, 2018 Share Posted December 23, 2018 > @"Dace.8173" said: > > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said: > > IMHO necro is unbalanced because it has less defensive options as well as mobility compared to every other class and does good damage yeah but so do all other classes. Yes scourge is wvw Zerg meta by aoe spam which isn’t to healthy but least it’s got that I gues. Again my opinion only, just think it would make necro and its elites more fun in pvp and wvw if it had an increase in mobility and better defensive option > > Having fewer options don't inherently make something unbalanced. As an example, Scrapper having fewer Stealth options than Daredevil doesn't mean its unbalanced. Or take being a glass cannon, having a higher level of damage output but lower level of defense is perfectly fine if the damage output is strong enough. Balance is not about everyone having the exact same things or equal number of things. Balance is about relative power levels. The fact that Necromancer has good damage and so do the other professions doesn't mean it's unbalanced either. Again, balance is about relative power level not the number of things it has. Necromancer is actually strong in PvP and WvW, both Reaper and Scrouge. The things you speak of are player preference or quality of life issues. That isn't to say they aren't important. Just that you can't frame them as balance issues. It is more productive to discuss them as the player preference issues that they are. Insisting they are balance issues when they aren't, undermines your position and makes it easy for people to dismiss your issues. Once the balance part of it is picked apart you're left with nothing left of your point. It's just best if you're upfront that you want these things because they would increase your fun. > > Not everything that needs to be fixed is a balance issue. > > > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said: > > It seems a lot of people share that opinion > > People sharing the opinion doesn't make it right. Balance isn't about the number of things any give profession has but relative power levels and how it compares with the rest of the game. The game is filled with uneven abilities but balanced professions. I understand what you’re saying and ur right. I’m just expressing my opinion that I feel as though given the fact that necro is slow hard hitting it should have better ways to sustain itself. Other classes that hit just as hard also have far better mobility AND better defensive skills like blocks and invulnerability etc and in most cases multiple accesses to them and the class that has the least mobility doesn’t warrant those skills too? Or atleast a higher damage which it has neither. This in my opinion puts necro at a disadvantage in any pvp setting when playing against good players.im speaking of pvp and wvw mods of course. Than again my opinion could be very wrong as I’m not a game designer or developer so Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now