How to fix the Match making Ranked PvP system!

[OutOfOrder.3719]

I propose that when a team wins, and a player dies More than 6 times in a match, that player's hidden rating increases at a lower rate from players that performed well.

 

The same thing should happen when your team loses, the match should track when players go AFK for more than 20 seconds (anywhere on the map); those players should lose more of their hidden rating than other players that kept fighting and playing till the end.

 

The point is to reward players that are actively trying to improve and play the game from start to finish.

 

An MMR algorithm should be fairly easy to make for both situations to track when players die more than 6 times, or when players go AFK for more than 20 seconds when the team loses.

 

The reason why the top players choose to play minimal games is due to every win only rewarding +10 points and every loss penalizes them for -20 points. If top performing players were tracked and rewarded for their efforts, they probably would choose to play more PvP games each season.

 

When the risk of losing rank is greater than the benefit gained from winning one game, smart players will play fewer games each season.

 

When the Risk > Benefit, players will typically choose to play fewer games to keep their rank.

 

I sincerely believe implementing these 2 new algorithms will improve the MMR system's intelligence when pairing up teammates together, reward players for playing well and win the match, and reward players that do not go AFK when a loss is coming.

 

I know people are going to flame me for being Toxic, but any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

 

The Last 2 seasons, it was extremely difficult for me to ever get higher than platinium 1, leaving me stuck at Gold 3 the more games I played. Trying to improve is extremely discouraging as I'm penalized the more I play.

 

These 2 algorithms would not just reward the top 200 players, but also the general PvP community to create fairer match ups.

 

The more competive players would have fairer matchups, and the players that care more about having fun would be happier too.

 

Let everyone have the same amount of Pips for each win and for each loss. But change the rate the Hidden rating is effected for players that are actively trying to win, and penalize players that go AFK when a loss is incoming.

 

[Namless.4028]

If theyre going to use your algorithm im going to roll warr and just exchange autoattacks with an enemy warr for the whole match

[OutOfOrder.3719]

Please name 1 profession and role where it is ok to die more than 6 times in a match?

 

If you are a Scourge, you will be focused first. However, after the first time you die, you should be playing more careful to survive, to keep spamming conditions.

 

A team with a dead Necro who dies 6 times or more, really isn't playing there job properly.

 

Same thing with a glass cannon ranger or thief. If you are fighting 1vs1, you are playing your role wrong. Should be fighting 2vs 1 to end the fights and move on.

[OutOfOrder.3719]

Although there may be other ways to fix the match making system, these 2 issues would be very easy to program and implement to Track players activity during a match.

 

Simplicity is usually the choice that ANET tends to do when it comes to PvP.

 

For example, it would be too hard to track how many times a player dies only capping far, mid or home or even off-point throughout a game. It only makes sense to track total deaths throughout a match.

 

Can you imagine trying to write a program that tracks second objective activity?

 

It's probably the main reason they use the glicko matching making system, which only tracks how many wins and loses a player has to determine their rating:

 

However, tracking how many times a player dies a match or whether a player goes AFK for 20 seconds should be extremely easy to execute.

 

The game already tracks how many kills and deaths a player makes each match. I'm proposing that when a player dies 6 times or more in a match, they should receive a lower rating gain in the event the team wins the game.

 

Players that die multiple times going far by themselves, again and again, will be less likely to be placed in higher skill matches and not be carried by their team again and again.

[Vieux P.1238]

Lighter fluid & a match.

[OutOfOrder.3719]

Throws inflammable blanket on fire to save the day!

[OutOfOrder.3719]

..bump....

[Faux Play.6104]

If the other team is focusing you and your team doesn't counter pressure, support, or rez it can happen. If it is happening in team fights everyone involved is responsible.

 

If you are getting farmed regularly your rating will be dropping anyway.

[OutOfOrder.3719]

The intention is reduce the benefit that under performing players receive when the team wins a match. If a player dies more than 6 times in a 15 minute match, that player is doing something wrong.

 

We all know that the matching system forces players to carry their teammates in order to maintain platinium 1 or higher.

 

And the problem is that many players are rated much higher than they should be. There is no reason why silver players should be matched with 1 platinium player vs an entire team of gold players. But the matching system does this.

 

And if players were penalized for going idle for 20 seconds after respawning, this would be an easy fix towards players that give up and go AFK immediately after falling 100 points behind in the match.

[bigo.9037]

> @"OutOfOrder.3719" said:

> The intention is reduce the benefit that under performing players receive when the team wins a match. If a player dies more than 6 times in a 15 minute match, that player is doing something wrong.

>

> We all know that the matching system forces players to carry their teammates in order to maintain platinium 1 or higher.

>

> And the problem is that many players are rated much higher than they should be. There is no reason why silver players should be matched with 1 platinium player vs an entire team of gold players. But the matching system does this.

>

> And if players were penalized for going idle for 20 seconds after respawning, this would be an easy fix towards players that give up and go AFK immediately after falling 100 points behind in the match.

 

what you're proposing is gonna make everything worse. you said yourself how high rank players play few games to keep their rank. if you're worse off dying a bit more than everyone else there community will be toxic and turn against their own team.

 

player 1 died 5 times. he's afraid he's gonna die again. he sees player 2 in downed state. he has time to res him, but if he does, then player 1 has a higher chance of dying himself. why should he risk his own rank to save an ally?

 

furthermore, if someone has died 6 times already that will probably just further encourage them to go afk...

[OutOfOrder.3719]

Making an effort to not die multiple times really should be encouraged.

 

Although there is more to winning a match than not dying, it's really the only metric that is already being tracked and would be easy to implement and execute.

 

The problem is that unfair matches are set up way too frequently and are not fun in general to play. The problem is really how the matching system is set up and how quickly players gain and lose their rating.

 

If AFK players were penalized for going AFK for 20 seconds, they would be less inclined to do this at any point.

 

Sure, someone could still intentionally give up and run in place and accomplish nothing, at least it would require more effort for them to do this.

[polvere.2805]

Thread no. 30102939401 about this subject

 

Let's roll boyz

[OutOfOrder.3719]

For example, if a ranger/dead eye uses a high burst build and makes lots of kills, they should not receive a higher rating as those builds rely on having other players with 1vs1 ability and sustain to cap the point while killing the enemy from long range.

 

So although killing people is important to win a match, I really think "not dying" is even more important and applies to all classes.

 

I would argue that not dying more than 6 times really is one of the best metrics to determine player skill when a team wins the match and applies to everyone on the team.

 

We all have played those games where 1 guy will keep charging middle by himself into 1vs3 or even push far all game only to die every time.

 

All I'm proposing is that if your team manages to win despite having a player repeatedly die multiple times, the player that is clearly being carried should receive less of a rating gain than other players who will receive full credit for the win.

 

Keep in mind that everyone loses the same experience for losing a match. This will hopefully reduce the chance of having less experienced players being matched up with higher skilled players, since those players really should never have been rated that high due to being carried in previous matches.

 

And it seems like a no brainer to not give any experience/rating gain to players that go AFK for 20 seconds or more and the team manages to still win.

 

In fact, double experience loss should be given to players that prematurely go AFK and the team loses. Although I don't mind playing with less experienced players, nothing makes me more upset than players that go AFK immediately once the team is a 100 points behind.

 

Players should be encouraged to play from the beginning till the end of a match. I have posted in numerous other threads about how Pips should be awarded differently to discourage AFKing in matches, but this would probably cause players to play fewer games and make Ranked PvP games have an even smaller population.

 

[Namless.4028]

"since were going to loose this match anyway, lets hunt down the player that carried the enemy team to fuck his rating"

[OutOfOrder.3719]

Let's hunt down the player how?

 

Not heal him and Rez him? Let him die in the middle and run away and force him to play 1vs3 on a node?

 

Well this is exactly why players that lose a match, all lose the same experience.

 

It's only when the team wins, and that team has a player that dies 6 times or more, only then does that one player receives less experience for the teams win.

 

And if you simply go AFK to tank the player's rating, guess who is going to be punished more?

 

I guess your funny statement could have meant "let's only kill the high rating player to tank his rating". But if you couldn't do it before, and your team couldn't coordinate a strategy to begin with, I doubt you are going to be able to focus fire 1 specific player LoL.

 

Everyone can make mistakes in a match and fight 1vs2 or 1vs3 and die. But good players have map awareness and will avoid some of these encounters and definitely will avoid this situation 6 times in a match. In fact, being able to fight 1vs2 and consistently win is what allows player to hit the legendary tier.

 

But even Cellofrag does not die more than 6 times a match when fighting 1vs2 or 1vs3 to create a numbers advantage elsewhere on the map for his team.

[Namless.4028]

i mean hunt the enemy carry down and kill him 6 times to kitten his rating

[shadowpass.4236]

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/53443/new-scoreboard

[Spartacus.3192]

I am sorry but i don't agree. If i play a high burst squishy build and i get 15 kills, helping my team to snowball the map, but i die 7 times i'm punished. But if i roll an immortal tank war with wet noodle dps that can only bunker a point, rely on my team mates to win, get zero kills and die 5 times i am not punished?

 

Yeah no thanks.

[OutOfOrder.3719]

The only way you would be in position to make 15 kills, is because your team is fighting on point with sustain and 1vs1 builds.

 

Although you are definitely helping your team +1 and make kills and win the game, typically you will lose if all your allies are fighting off point and rotating like you.

 

"Not dying" is more important for all PvP professions and roles, but also important when you are running a high burst squishy build.

 

 

[OutOfOrder.3719]

Shadowpass, although I love your idea of having more ways to track player activity in a game, it would be extremely complicated to write any of those algorithms.

 

Calculating invisible value and negative value would require the entire PvP system to be overhauled and unfortunately I don't think ANET will invest the effort to do so.

 

However, tracking how often a player dies is already being tracked in "deaths" every match. Imagine trying to track players that fight and die on point versus players that die off point. So for simplicity sake, just tracking how many times a player dies is what is really important.

 

Although writing a code to track when a player actually becomes AFK for 20 seconds or more would be more challenging, it would be possible.

[Stand The Wall.6987]

I think a positive kdr would be a much better alternative to a fixed amount of deaths.

[Abazigal.3679]

> @"OutOfOrder.3719" said:

> The only way you would be in position to make 15 kills, is because your team is fighting on point with sustain and 1vs1 builds.

>

> Although you are definitely helping your team +1 and make kills and win the game, typically you will lose if all your allies are fighting off point and rotating like you.

>

> "Not dying" is more important for all PvP professions and roles, but also important when you are running a high burst squishy build.

>

>

 

This is more complicated than that. I've had games where i purposely went to far the whole game, making sure i was 1v2 or 1v3. Thus, my teamates should get easier fights on other points, and it's quite likely i'm going to die a lot ( maybe not 7 times though).

Also there are totally unbalanced fights ending up into 500-10 where one team will have all players dying 8 times, but it's likely due to matchmaking..

 

I mean, i agree that most of the time, a player that keeps dying over and over is going to cost the game. I get mad when i see people reviving up, and straight going to die on mid point over and over. But you will find cases where this cannot apply..

[OutOfOrder.3719]

Ok I can understand why some players don't want to be penalized for dying more than 6 times.

 

But would there be any drawbacks for penalizing players that go AFK at any point for more than 20 seconds? I think it will reduce pip farming or people randomly giving up or becoming toxic to make sure their team loses.

[megilandil.7506]

> @"OutOfOrder.3719" said:

 

> We all have played those games where 1 guy will keep charging middle by himself into 1vs3 or even push far all game only to die every time.

and if they can manage to figh a long time, they keep 3 players atached to mid where the other 4 players could dominate sidenodes in a 4v2

> All I'm proposing is that if your team manages to win despite having a player repeatedly die multiple times, the player that is clearly being carried should receive less of a rating gain than other players who will receive full credit for the win.

in the case said before the player that does so carries the others holding longs 1v3 and finally dying maybe more than 6 times and with your system it will be penalized for carrying the whole team

 

[JusticeRetroHunter.7684]

No

/

End thread.