So is shatterer dead (pre ep4) in the lore? And a question bout Snaff.

[zealex.9410]

I was under the impression that the shatterer was a title kralk would give to his powerful minions.

 

I and alot others were also under the impression that the vanilla maps werent locked in time and instead were smartly repeating.

 

E.g shatterer dies kralk makes another one.

 

Were the players misjudging the sutuation or was it a mistake on the side of the narative team?

 

For the second question. Was taimi even alive or at the very least old enough to be zojja's aprentice when snaff was around? We hear him tell taimi that zojja told him alot about her but it kinda feels like a strech.

[derd.6413]

shatterer dies kralk makes a new one, kralk simply learned to recycle the old ones

[zealex.9410]

> @"derd.6413" said:

> shatterer dies kralk makes a new one, kralk simply learned to recycle the old ones

 

The episode treats shatterer as it was dead and raised thanks to zhaitans magic but literally 6 years of doing the meta suggest we getting new ones

 

Why would characters identify this recycled one seemingly ignoring the other ones we've killed all these years then? Why would they refer to him as being dead if we are getting more of them on a daily basis.

[derd.6413]

> @"zealex.9410" said:

> > @"derd.6413" said:

> > shatterer dies kralk makes a new one, kralk simply learned to recycle the old ones

>

> The episode treats shatterer as it was dead and raised thanks to zhaitans magic but literally 6 years of doing the meta suggest we getting new ones

>

> Why would characters identify this recycled one seemingly ignoring the other ones we've killed all these years then? Why would they refer to him as being dead if we are getting more of them on a daily basis.

 

he makes new ones but now he also brings the ones we've killed back to life. we know he's been raised from the dead because else he wouldn't be death touched

[zealex.9410]

> @"derd.6413" said:

> > @"zealex.9410" said:

> > > @"derd.6413" said:

> > > shatterer dies kralk makes a new one, kralk simply learned to recycle the old ones

> >

> > The episode treats shatterer as it was dead and raised thanks to zhaitans magic but literally 6 years of doing the meta suggest we getting new ones

> >

> > Why would characters identify this recycled one seemingly ignoring the other ones we've killed all these years then? Why would they refer to him as being dead if we are getting more of them on a daily basis.

>

> he makes new ones but now he also brings the ones we've killed back to life. we know he's been raised from the dead because else he wouldn't be death touched

 

Yeah but the characters treat it as theres no others. Like shattterer was one and gone and now its back.

[Malediktus.9250]

Yes, old shatterer was dead. You can see him explode when he flies away after defeating him. But maps are in time loops so people can keep fighting the boss

[Kirk Williford.2653]

In regards to your question about Snaff and how he knows about Taimi, it's been a long time since Eir passed. You never know how long ago Eir and Snaff crossed paths in the mists - Eir knows both Taimi and Zojja, so it's reasonable to say she told Snaff about her. :)

[zealex.9410]

> @"Kirk Williford.2653" said:

> In regards to your question about Snaff and how he knows about Taimi, it's been a long time since Eir passed. You never know how long ago Eir and Snaff crossed paths in the mists - Eir knows both Taimi and Zojja, so it's reasonable to say she told Snaff about her. :)

 

He specifically makes a remark about zojja telling him.

[Baldavier.4132]

> @"zealex.9410" said:

> > @"Kirk Williford.2653" said:

> > In regards to your question about Snaff and how he knows about Taimi, it's been a long time since Eir passed. You never know how long ago Eir and Snaff crossed paths in the mists - Eir knows both Taimi and Zojja, so it's reasonable to say she told Snaff about her. :)

>

> He specifically makes a remark about zojja telling him.

 

I assumed it's because Zoja was in the mists too , or some Asura magic allowed them to talk

 

 

Also re: awakened shatterer - I go along the lines of each map is in time loop like Malediktus says, if anyone asks, i killed zhaitan once (not 8 times, a couple of which were with the same character! I mean, come on, all the best stories (and this is one of them) require a little of that thing i learnt in year 9 English class - "Suspend your disbelief")

[Cregath.7628]

Exactly what zealex said.

[Teraphas.6210]

> @"zealex.9410" said:

 

> He specifically makes a remark about zojja telling him.

 

Snaff: You're quite precocious, aren't you? What did you say your name was?

Taimi: Taimi. Sir.

Snaff: Ah! Zojja's apprentice. That explains it.

Taimi: Uh...explains what?

Snaff: Oh, I've heard great things.

Taimi: Eeeh!

 

Doesn't say Zojja told him anything.

[Tekoneiric.6817]

> @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> Yes, old shatterer was dead. You can see him explode when he flies away after defeating him. But maps are in time loops so people can keep fighting the boss

 

Given that the maps are in time loops does that mean the maps we repeat play on are fractals in the mists and we never see the real world maps except for the first time we play the maps and the cities?

[Malediktus.9250]

> @"Tekoneiric.6817" said:

> > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > Yes, old shatterer was dead. You can see him explode when he flies away after defeating him. But maps are in time loops so people can keep fighting the boss

>

> Given that the maps are in time loops does that mean the maps we repeat play on are fractals in the mists and we never see the real world maps except for the first time we play the maps and the cities?

 

Pretty much this. It is the only way to make a MMO with limited content work

[Zoltar MacRoth.7146]

> @"Tekoneiric.6817" said:

> > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > Yes, old shatterer was dead. You can see him explode when he flies away after defeating him. But maps are in time loops so people can keep fighting the boss

>

> Given that the maps are in time loops does that mean the maps we repeat play on are fractals in the mists and we never see the real world maps except for the first time we play the maps and the cities?

 

It makes you think, doesn't it? Especially since the new map has those bubbles of repeating reality... it's almost as if Kralk's damage to the Space/Time continuum has reverberated into the past and parts of the past and the present and the future are all literally happening at the same time all over Tyria, not as a game device but as a literal part of the GW2 reality. It's like the Dark Tower. We're on an endless journey, repeatedly trying to stop K from destroying reality when in fact it's already destroyed and we're just in a loop. *head explodes*

[Malediktus.9250]

I think the game Quantum Break did a very good job on showing how the end of time and space could look like, too bad the devs of it do not plan on making a sequel on it despite ending the game with a huge cliffhanger

[Tekoneiric.6817]

> @"Zoltar MacRoth.7146" said:

> > @"Tekoneiric.6817" said:

> > > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > > Yes, old shatterer was dead. You can see him explode when he flies away after defeating him. But maps are in time loops so people can keep fighting the boss

> >

> > Given that the maps are in time loops does that mean the maps we repeat play on are fractals in the mists and we never see the real world maps except for the first time we play the maps and the cities?

>

> It makes you think, doesn't it? Especially since the new map has those bubbles of repeating reality... it's almost as if Kralk's damage to the Space/Time continuum has reverberated into the past and parts of the past and the present and the future are all literally happening at the same time all over Tyria, not as a game device but as a literal part of the GW2 reality. It's like the Dark Tower. We're on an endless journey, repeatedly trying to stop K from destroying reality when in fact it's already destroyed and we're just in a loop. *head explodes*

 

Maybe our ability to resurrect from a defeated state is because we are in the mysts.

[Malediktus.9250]

Likely our whole universe could be viewed as a fractal. It seems like in a very long (timescales beyond human imagination and even the lifetime of supermassive blackholes) but finite time everything happens again and again.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poincar%C3%A9_recurrence_theorem

[Blocki.4931]

> @"Tekoneiric.6817" said:

> > @"Zoltar MacRoth.7146" said:

> > > @"Tekoneiric.6817" said:

> > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > > > Yes, old shatterer was dead. You can see him explode when he flies away after defeating him. But maps are in time loops so people can keep fighting the boss

> > >

> > > Given that the maps are in time loops does that mean the maps we repeat play on are fractals in the mists and we never see the real world maps except for the first time we play the maps and the cities?

> >

> > It makes you think, doesn't it? Especially since the new map has those bubbles of repeating reality... it's almost as if Kralk's damage to the Space/Time continuum has reverberated into the past and parts of the past and the present and the future are all literally happening at the same time all over Tyria, not as a game device but as a literal part of the GW2 reality. It's like the Dark Tower. We're on an endless journey, repeatedly trying to stop K from destroying reality when in fact it's already destroyed and we're just in a loop. *head explodes*

>

> Maybe our ability to resurrect from a defeated state is because we are in the mysts.

 

Game mechanic =/= Lore

 

That's why it was such a big deal that Balthazar *actually* killed us.

[zealex.9410]

> @"Teraphas.6210" said:

> > @"zealex.9410" said:

>

> > He specifically makes a remark about zojja telling him.

>

> Snaff: You're quite precocious, aren't you? What did you say your name was?

> Taimi: Taimi. Sir.

> Snaff: Ah! Zojja's apprentice. That explains it.

> Taimi: Uh...explains what?

> Snaff: Oh, I've heard great things.

> Taimi: Eeeh!

>

> Doesn't say Zojja told him anything.

 

Ahh yes you are right. I assume Eir could've told his something but thats even .ore of a strech than zojja telling him xd.

[Zoltar MacRoth.7146]

> @"Blocki.4931" said:

> > @"Tekoneiric.6817" said:

> > > @"Zoltar MacRoth.7146" said:

> > > > @"Tekoneiric.6817" said:

> > > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > > > > Yes, old shatterer was dead. You can see him explode when he flies away after defeating him. But maps are in time loops so people can keep fighting the boss

> > > >

> > > > Given that the maps are in time loops does that mean the maps we repeat play on are fractals in the mists and we never see the real world maps except for the first time we play the maps and the cities?

> > >

> > > It makes you think, doesn't it? Especially since the new map has those bubbles of repeating reality... it's almost as if Kralk's damage to the Space/Time continuum has reverberated into the past and parts of the past and the present and the future are all literally happening at the same time all over Tyria, not as a game device but as a literal part of the GW2 reality. It's like the Dark Tower. We're on an endless journey, repeatedly trying to stop K from destroying reality when in fact it's already destroyed and we're just in a loop. *head explodes*

> >

> > Maybe our ability to resurrect from a defeated state is because we are in the mysts.

>

> Game mechanic =/= Lore

>

> That's why it was such a big deal that Balthazar *actually* killed us.

 

It wasn't really a big deal. It didn't even stick. I often die six times before breakfast and come back in time for lunch.

[zealex.9410]

> @"Zoltar MacRoth.7146" said:

> > @"Blocki.4931" said:

> > > @"Tekoneiric.6817" said:

> > > > @"Zoltar MacRoth.7146" said:

> > > > > @"Tekoneiric.6817" said:

> > > > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > > > > > Yes, old shatterer was dead. You can see him explode when he flies away after defeating him. But maps are in time loops so people can keep fighting the boss

> > > > >

> > > > > Given that the maps are in time loops does that mean the maps we repeat play on are fractals in the mists and we never see the real world maps except for the first time we play the maps and the cities?

> > > >

> > > > It makes you think, doesn't it? Especially since the new map has those bubbles of repeating reality... it's almost as if Kralk's damage to the Space/Time continuum has reverberated into the past and parts of the past and the present and the future are all literally happening at the same time all over Tyria, not as a game device but as a literal part of the GW2 reality. It's like the Dark Tower. We're on an endless journey, repeatedly trying to stop K from destroying reality when in fact it's already destroyed and we're just in a loop. *head explodes*

> > >

> > > Maybe our ability to resurrect from a defeated state is because we are in the mysts.

> >

> > Game mechanic =/= Lore

> >

> > That's why it was such a big deal that Balthazar *actually* killed us.

>

> It wasn't really a big deal. It didn't even stick. I often die six times before breakfast and come back in time for lunch.

 

I kinda was. To the point it even carried relevance into lw.

[Cragga the Eighty Third.60]

> @"zealex.9410" said:

> > @"Teraphas.6210" said:

> > > @"zealex.9410" said:

> >

> > > He specifically makes a remark about zojja telling him.

> >

> > Snaff: You're quite precocious, aren't you? What did you say your name was?

> > Taimi: Taimi. Sir.

> > Snaff: Ah! Zojja's apprentice. That explains it.

> > Taimi: Uh...explains what?

> > Snaff: Oh, I've heard great things.

> > Taimi: Eeeh!

> >

> > Doesn't say Zojja told him anything.

>

> Ahh yes you are right. I assume Eir could've told his something but thats even .ore of a strech than zojja telling him xd.

 

Not really. I assume that if Eir and Snaff were chatting in the mists, Zojja and everything she was up to would be the first subject of conversation (including her brilliant apprentice!)

[foozlesprite.8051]

Almorra probably knows it's not the same Shatterer, since the Vigil helped bring the previous one down. But whether she does or not, she has a _very_ big beef with Kralkatorrik and the Shatterer, enough that she's willing to crash another fleet of airships and bring the full force of the Vigil to help.

[Dante.1763]

> @"Zoltar MacRoth.7146" said:

> > @"Blocki.4931" said:

> > > @"Tekoneiric.6817" said:

> > > > @"Zoltar MacRoth.7146" said:

> > > > > @"Tekoneiric.6817" said:

> > > > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > > > > > Yes, old shatterer was dead. You can see him explode when he flies away after defeating him. But maps are in time loops so people can keep fighting the boss

> > > > >

> > > > > Given that the maps are in time loops does that mean the maps we repeat play on are fractals in the mists and we never see the real world maps except for the first time we play the maps and the cities?

> > > >

> > > > It makes you think, doesn't it? Especially since the new map has those bubbles of repeating reality... it's almost as if Kralk's damage to the Space/Time continuum has reverberated into the past and parts of the past and the present and the future are all literally happening at the same time all over Tyria, not as a game device but as a literal part of the GW2 reality. It's like the Dark Tower. We're on an endless journey, repeatedly trying to stop K from destroying reality when in fact it's already destroyed and we're just in a loop. *head explodes*

> > >

> > > Maybe our ability to resurrect from a defeated state is because we are in the mysts.

> >

> > Game mechanic =/= Lore

> >

> > That's why it was such a big deal that Balthazar *actually* killed us.

>

> It wasn't really a big deal. It didn't even stick. I often die six times before breakfast and come back in time for lunch.

 

we also got killed in GW1 Factions and it lasts even less time than the player death in GW2.