Raids in 2k18 became farm fiesta. Remove rewards from the old wings finally. And fix it, please

[Klipso.8653]

> @"Xar.1387" said:

> > @"Klipso.8653" said:

> > If you're looking for challenge, join a WvW guild. There's nothing challenging about memorizing a pre-scripted dance routine.

>

> WvW / Challenge

> Pick one >:P

> Sorry, but I prefer real PvP and esports rather than massive pvp mode called 'wvw' where responsibility is in the background

>

> The most important time of raiding is progress. Not farm. And yes - its challenging. First kills etc, etc.

> IMO less challenging than real PvP and esports ofc, but still

 

That's ok if you believe that. I play WvW when I want fun. I usually only jump into raids when I'm bored and want fast easy loot.

 

Edit: and sPvP cannot be considered competitive since a net has no idea what class balance is. It's why their 'eports' failed

[Xar.1387]

> @"Klipso.8653" said:

> > @"Xar.1387" said:

> > > @"Klipso.8653" said:

> > > If you're looking for challenge, join a WvW guild. There's nothing challenging about memorizing a pre-scripted dance routine.

> >

> > WvW / Challenge

> > Pick one >:P

> > Sorry, but I prefer real PvP and esports rather than massive pvp mode called 'wvw' where responsibility is in the background

> >

> > The most important time of raiding is progress. Not farm. And yes - its challenging. First kills etc, etc.

> > IMO less challenging than real PvP and esports ofc, but still

>

> That's ok if you believe that. I play WvW when I want fun. I usually only jump into raids when I'm bored and want fast easy loot

 

There's alot of that people in raids right now which does the same thing. And treat raids like dungeons. Free loot. Place to farm.

And it perfectly shows current state of raids (that "ultimate challenge"). Sadly.

 

[Blocki.4931]

> @"Xar.1387" said:

> > @"Klipso.8653" said:

> > > @"Xar.1387" said:

> > > > @"Klipso.8653" said:

> > > > If you're looking for challenge, join a WvW guild. There's nothing challenging about memorizing a pre-scripted dance routine.

> > >

> > > WvW / Challenge

> > > Pick one >:P

> > > Sorry, but I prefer real PvP and esports rather than massive pvp mode called 'wvw' where responsibility is in the background

> > >

> > > The most important time of raiding is progress. Not farm. And yes - its challenging. First kills etc, etc.

> > > IMO less challenging than real PvP and esports ofc, but still

> >

> > That's ok if you believe that. I play WvW when I want fun. I usually only jump into raids when I'm bored and want fast easy loot

>

> There's alot of that people in raids right now which does the same thing. And treat raids like dungeons. Free loot. Place to farm.

> And it perfectly shows current state of raids (that "ultimate challenge"). Sadly.

>

 

"People get good at content the more time passes so it shouldn't exist"

 

Logic

 

[IllegalChocolate.6938]

> @"Xar.1387" said:

 

> That's why IMO **_ArenaNet should delete rewards like gold and loot from old wings._** Because its very, very old content. People should do it just for achievements, and stuff like that. If they're new and still dont have it. Or if they wants to do legendary armor and things like that. But why loot? Its not new content anymore.

 

Wow, as a person who is enjoying the demise and suffering of the raiding community, even I think that's too far, no one deserves to have loot taken away from that.

 

Who in the world of MMOs advocates for LESS loot, like what player actually wants that?

[Rodrick.1942]

> @"Dante.1763" said:

> > @"Xar.1387" said:

> > > @"Cyninja.2954" said:

> > > Raids have been farm content for ages to experienced players. Only because you are done with your goodies and don't want others to have the same rewards is no reason to reduce rewards.

> >

> > I know it very well. Believe me. But more time passes and ArenaNet do nothing about it. It makes more people leave. And it is just becoming more and more visible.

> >

> > > Raiders are leaving the game due to lack of content

> >

> > I know that too. As u can see I wrote about that alot in this thread.

> >

>

> Anet doesnt do anything about it because the people who do raids are small population compared to the game and not what the game is targetted towards, that will never change, Raids will *never* be anets focus because of the nature of the game, and who they market it towards(casual/easy going players), removing rewards will do nothing but decrease the already low population even further.

 

As anet said before , raid is " the side story content of tyria"

[RaidsAreEasyAF.8652]

> @"Xar.1387" said:

> Right now we got alot of content if it comes to the raids. But its not quality content. It just becomes "farm fiesta".

 

Look at this guy over here, thinking that one wing every 9-10 Months is "a lot of content".

As long as you can do a raid fullclear in ~3h its not "a lot of content".

[Henry.5713]

Kind of goes against everything they ever intended with their system which does not see a level cap increase or the devaluation of old content.

Thus it is beyond me how removing any incentives to run old content, even if only occasionally, would suddently make ArenaNet crap out content left and right like there is no tomorrow. Their pace would hardly increase, why should it?

All this would do is rip apart even more raid squads as there would be nothing left to do for them.

[Miellyn.6847]

> @"Xar.1387" said:

> > @"Klipso.8653" said:

> > > @"Xar.1387" said:

> > > > @"Klipso.8653" said:

> > > > If you're looking for challenge, join a WvW guild. There's nothing challenging about memorizing a pre-scripted dance routine.

> > >

> > > WvW / Challenge

> > > Pick one >:P

> > > Sorry, but I prefer real PvP and esports rather than massive pvp mode called 'wvw' where responsibility is in the background

> > >

> > > The most important time of raiding is progress. Not farm. And yes - its challenging. First kills etc, etc.

> > > IMO less challenging than real PvP and esports ofc, but still

> >

> > That's ok if you believe that. I play WvW when I want fun. I usually only jump into raids when I'm bored and want fast easy loot

>

> There's alot of that people in raids right now which does the same thing. And treat raids like dungeons. Free loot. Place to farm.

> And it perfectly shows current state of raids (that "ultimate challenge"). Sadly.

>

 

That's the price you pay with a cap on level and equipment. PvE content is really fast on farm status. But that is true for all MMORPGs, most of the 'challange' comes from being undergeared, not from the mechanics itself. If people would enter the new raids BiS equipped you would see the same as here.

But I still say level and equipment cap is better than the hamster wheel.

[Dante.1763]

> @"Rodrick.1942" said:

> > @"Dante.1763" said:

> > > @"Xar.1387" said:

> > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said:

> > > > Raids have been farm content for ages to experienced players. Only because you are done with your goodies and don't want others to have the same rewards is no reason to reduce rewards.

> > >

> > > I know it very well. Believe me. But more time passes and ArenaNet do nothing about it. It makes more people leave. And it is just becoming more and more visible.

> > >

> > > > Raiders are leaving the game due to lack of content

> > >

> > > I know that too. As u can see I wrote about that alot in this thread.

> > >

> >

> > Anet doesnt do anything about it because the people who do raids are small population compared to the game and not what the game is targetted towards, that will never change, Raids will *never* be anets focus because of the nature of the game, and who they market it towards(casual/easy going players), removing rewards will do nothing but decrease the already low population even further.

>

> As anet said before , raid is " the side story content of tyria"

 

My point exactly, they are a side story, not the main story, or the main content of the game.

[phs.6089]

If you ask me they should lock, raids to expac spec only. muhahaha! I wnanan see PoF raids with no druid and crono cleared.

While we are on it, lock the stats too. No harrier on druids for HoT raids

[Astralporing.1957]

> @"phs.6089" said:

> If you ask me they should lock, raids to expac spec only. muhahaha! I wnanan see PoF raids with no druid and crono cleared.

> While we are on it, lock the stats too. No harrier on druids for HoT raids

... and no vipers for condi scourges, mirages and soulbeasts?

Yeah, that would definitely work all right [/sarcasm]

[phs.6089]

> @"Astralporing.1957" said:

> > @"phs.6089" said:

> > If you ask me they should lock, raids to expac spec only. muhahaha! I wnanan see PoF raids with no druid and crono cleared.

> > While we are on it, lock the stats too. No harrier on druids for HoT raids

> ... and no vipers for condi scourges, mirages and soulbeasts?

> Yeah, that would definitely work all right [/sarcasm]

 

Condi scourge in raids ! best joke 2018 :) and yes, sb and mirage in grieving, off they go :)

[Dante.1763]

> @"phs.6089" said:

> > @"Astralporing.1957" said:

> > > @"phs.6089" said:

> > > If you ask me they should lock, raids to expac spec only. muhahaha! I wnanan see PoF raids with no druid and crono cleared.

> > > While we are on it, lock the stats too. No harrier on druids for HoT raids

> > ... and no vipers for condi scourges, mirages and soulbeasts?

> > Yeah, that would definitely work all right [/sarcasm]

>

> Condi scourge in raids ! best joke 2018 :) and yes, sb and mirage in grieving, off they go :)

 

Better idea, lock all raids to only use Core gear stats :D

[Laila Lightness.8742]

> @"Dante.1763" said:

> > @"phs.6089" said:

> > > @"Astralporing.1957" said:

> > > > @"phs.6089" said:

> > > > If you ask me they should lock, raids to expac spec only. muhahaha! I wnanan see PoF raids with no druid and crono cleared.

> > > > While we are on it, lock the stats too. No harrier on druids for HoT raids

> > > ... and no vipers for condi scourges, mirages and soulbeasts?

> > > Yeah, that would definitely work all right [/sarcasm]

> >

> > Condi scourge in raids ! best joke 2018 :) and yes, sb and mirage in grieving, off they go :)

>

> Better idea, lock all raids to only use Core gear stats :D

 

Core specs to so we have the amazing warrior dps meta from dungeon days

[Miellyn.6847]

> @"Laila Lightness.8742" said:

> > @"Dante.1763" said:

> > > @"phs.6089" said:

> > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said:

> > > > > @"phs.6089" said:

> > > > > If you ask me they should lock, raids to expac spec only. muhahaha! I wnanan see PoF raids with no druid and crono cleared.

> > > > > While we are on it, lock the stats too. No harrier on druids for HoT raids

> > > > ... and no vipers for condi scourges, mirages and soulbeasts?

> > > > Yeah, that would definitely work all right [/sarcasm]

> > >

> > > Condi scourge in raids ! best joke 2018 :) and yes, sb and mirage in grieving, off they go :)

> >

> > Better idea, lock all raids to only use Core gear stats :D

>

> Core specs to so we have the amazing warrior dps meta from dungeon days

 

Core Warrior is actually used on some bosses.

[Holy Security.9724]

Didn't get the answers you liked on reddit and now you turn up here.

Must be pretty desperate to differ yourself from "new" players who you think are "worse" than you.

The intention is for sure to drive newer players away, what you still forget to mention: You need money for legendary armour and when someone just wants to raid and only has time for that, this will not work out. You will cut the money income to 2 wings. Genious idea.

Although you stated at reddit that "fractals etc work differently", that is nonesense as well. Fractals are no less of a farm fest, yet you want to nerf raids.

Something is off here and whatever it is, I hope you get over it.

[Chris McSwag.4683]

> @"Xar.1387" said:

> > @"Klipso.8653" said:

> > > @"Xar.1387" said:

> > > > @"Klipso.8653" said:

> > > > If you're looking for challenge, join a WvW guild. There's nothing challenging about memorizing a pre-scripted dance routine.

> > >

> > > WvW / Challenge

> > > Pick one >:P

> > > Sorry, but I prefer real PvP and esports rather than massive pvp mode called 'wvw' where responsibility is in the background

> > >

> > > The most important time of raiding is progress. Not farm. And yes - its challenging. First kills etc, etc.

> > > IMO less challenging than real PvP and esports ofc, but still

> >

> > That's ok if you believe that. I play WvW when I want fun. I usually only jump into raids when I'm bored and want fast easy loot

>

> There's alot of that people in raids right now which does the same thing. And treat raids like dungeons. Free loot. Place to farm.

> And it perfectly shows current state of raids (that "ultimate challenge"). Sadly.

>

 

Removing loot from old content does not make the new content more challenging, nor will it create incentive to release more raids. Poorly thought out idea, go back to roleplay

[Sleepwalker.1398]

And in the meantime, WvW still remains the most unrewarding and neglected part of this game.

[Xar.1387]

> @"Chris McSwag.4683" said:

> > @"Xar.1387" said:

> > > @"Klipso.8653" said:

> > > > @"Xar.1387" said:

> > > > > @"Klipso.8653" said:

> > > > > If you're looking for challenge, join a WvW guild. There's nothing challenging about memorizing a pre-scripted dance routine.

> > > >

> > > > WvW / Challenge

> > > > Pick one >:P

> > > > Sorry, but I prefer real PvP and esports rather than massive pvp mode called 'wvw' where responsibility is in the background

> > > >

> > > > The most important time of raiding is progress. Not farm. And yes - its challenging. First kills etc, etc.

> > > > IMO less challenging than real PvP and esports ofc, but still

> > >

> > > That's ok if you believe that. I play WvW when I want fun. I usually only jump into raids when I'm bored and want fast easy loot

> >

> > There's alot of that people in raids right now which does the same thing. And treat raids like dungeons. Free loot. Place to farm.

> > And it perfectly shows current state of raids (that "ultimate challenge"). Sadly.

> >

>

> Removing loot from old content does not make the new content more challenging, nor will it create incentive to release more raids. Poorly thought out idea

 

How do u know that? Ofc I may be wrong (i hope tbh), but IMO there's strong correlation between it. But we will see in the future then ;)

I prefer less raids, but more hardcore. Rather than alot which changes into farm.

 

There's 6 active wings atm. So its ALOT if u look at it, right? That's why there is no pressure on ArenaNet anymore to create any new hardcore raid wings that fast.

Cause in theory there's already alot of them. And people are starting to treat this mode as another place to farm - forgetting about challenges, etc etc.

They are getting used to it. Anyway, this topic shows it too.

Meantime word "RAID" is slowly being desecrated by GW2...

 

And imo its a bit pathetic when raiders have to find some challengies in this mode on their own. And do the same bosses over and over in a bit different way to do anything "new".

Because developers can not provide them with the right level of difficulty.

 

> go back to roleplay

I hope role play wong be more "hardcore" than raids someday ;) But it slowly happens... Some hardcore roleplayers does alot more than some raiders tbh.

And they engage much more.

Also it already happened with PvP which is dead. And just another "farm fiesta" right now. No esport.

If this continues, we will return to the times when roleplay was the only sensible endgame in GW2 (2012) <.<

 

ArenaNet fortunately just cant destroy hardcore roleplaying because this mode is fully created by people. And based on their own systems.

 

 

 

[HELLruler.4820]

3 days later and I still fail to understand how old raids giving rewards are related to slowdown on new content. This is like saying that we don't have 10 expansions yet because RIBA farming is still available

 

But the real answer to why we don't have more raids is because that is not the focus of the dev team. This is not a raiding game like WoW or FFXIV. Check the progress on the Living story, how there are new chapters and maps constantly being released. That's where the focus of the dev team is and removing rewards from old raids will not make them work on new ones

 

/thread

[SkyShroud.2865]

I had a few very very active pve players quit the game when they nerfed dungeons reward. Not because it lost its reward but because people stop doing it and they simply foresee that anet and the community gonna do this to every content that runs out of favor.

 

And here we see OP suggesting to do the same to the old raid wing, you see that history repeat itself.

[Raizel.8175]

This is one of the dumbest threads I've ever read in this forum. The raiding community is already digging its own grave using excessive KP-requirements and often displaying a cancerous pseudo-elitistic toxicity. W1-W4 are fine. It's hard, but you at least somewhat get into them as newbie or person who doesn't has a static. It's W5 and W6 that are problematic health-wise for the game. It's utterly hard to get into them due to KP-requirements (not everyone has the luxury of a static - most statics already demand excessive requirements anyway). For most people, it's more pragmatic to simply buy at least Dhuum and Qadim once rather than doing them themselves, even if they're sufficiently skilled. To be honest, this game wasn't made for raids in the first place anyway. The combat-system is far too rudimentary; that's why ANet has to use a lot of gimmicky stuff in instanced PvE. Don't get me wrong, I like doing raids (when I get into them anyway), but I do think that raids should never be something ANet should really focus on.

[Linken.6345]

> @"Raizel.8175" said:

> This is one of the dumbest threads I've ever read in this forum. The raiding community is already digging its own grave using excessive KP-requirements and often displaying a cancerous pseudo-elitistic toxicity. W1-W4 are fine. It's hard, but you at least somewhat get into them as newbie or person who doesn't has a static. It's W5 and W6 that are problematic health-wise for the game. It's utterly hard to get into them due to KP-requirements (not everyone has the luxury of a static - most statics already demand excessive requirements anyway). For most people, it's more pragmatic to simply buy at least Dhuum and Qadim once rather than doing them themselves, even if they're sufficiently skilled. To be honest, this game wasn't made for raids in the first place anyway. The combat-system is far too rudimentary; that's why ANet has to use a lot of gimmicky stuff in instanced PvE. Don't get me wrong, I like doing raids (when I get into them anyway), but I do think that raids should never be something ANet should really focus on.

 

Well 1-2 raid wings a year I wouldent say that is focusing on it honestly.

[Raizel.8175]

> @"Linken.6345" said:

> > @"Raizel.8175" said:

> > This is one of the dumbest threads I've ever read in this forum. The raiding community is already digging its own grave using excessive KP-requirements and often displaying a cancerous pseudo-elitistic toxicity. W1-W4 are fine. It's hard, but you at least somewhat get into them as newbie or person who doesn't has a static. It's W5 and W6 that are problematic health-wise for the game. It's utterly hard to get into them due to KP-requirements (not everyone has the luxury of a static - most statics already demand excessive requirements anyway). For most people, it's more pragmatic to simply buy at least Dhuum and Qadim once rather than doing them themselves, even if they're sufficiently skilled. To be honest, this game wasn't made for raids in the first place anyway. The combat-system is far too rudimentary; that's why ANet has to use a lot of gimmicky stuff in instanced PvE. Don't get me wrong, I like doing raids (when I get into them anyway), but I do think that raids should never be something ANet should really focus on.

>

> Well 1-2 raid wings a year I wouldent say that is focusing on it honestly.

 

Aye. But one raid per year is sufficient, considering the raiding-community is small to begin with and considering that new wings (W5 onward) are mostly reserved for a small part of the already small community. ANet should rather focus on delivering quality OW-content which is really lacking lately, maybe some new additions to PvP or WvW too.

[Gehenna.3625]

Well, a bit off topic but why would you turn 2018 into 2k18? I may be getting old but I don't get using abbreviations that don't actually make it less to write.

 

On topic. This game has no level cap raises so the content, old or not, is still valid for endgame. In fact the entire game has a lot of old content that still rewards the usual loot.

 

Aside from that, it's unlikely that we'll get 6 full raids a year, so what else are raiders going to do but repeat what they have?