Why dont people buy expansions?

[Arden.7480]

Any official statement you have that people don't buy expansions?

[jbrother.1340]

> @"zinkz.7045" said:

> > @"Dibdabs.3410" said:

> > God, I detest it when people trot out the word "literally" when they have no real point in using it other than emphasis. It makes me just ignore the rest of the post.

>

> A bit like when there is no real point to using 'God' in a sentence. ;)

 

Not sure how anyone's "god" plays into it but the poster is right.

 

Sort of the same as people over using the word literally :)

[jbrother.1340]

> @"Arden.7480" said:

> Any official statement you have that people don't buy expansions?

 

The addition of one more word to the statement and we would not get to mince all this up like meat...

 

"some" people...

[Danikat.8537]

> @"ReaverKane.7598" said:

> Also answering the OP again...

> I took a quick look at GW2 Efficiency. Flawed as it might be, it's none the less a good sample of the game's population, and according to the site, of the people registered there, 77% have BOTH expansions. 1% are Free to Play.

> Even if you stretch this by a long mile, you'll probably end up at most with 5-10% F2P players that are active, and not just "checking out" the game for a weekend.

> https://gw2efficiency.com/account/player-statistics

 

The problem with using GW2 Efficiency as a source for things like this is it's going to have a much higher proportion of 'high end'/hardcore/long-term players than the game itself. The people who sign up to GW2 Efficiency are people who a) know it exists (already excluding a lot of new and casual players) b) want to use it's services, or show off what they've achieved and see how they compare to other players. There's no point doing that unless you've been playing for a while and you're working on 'end game' goals like legendaries or playing the TP regularly.

 

Not to mention second accounts. I've thought about signing up sometimes on my main GW2 account and it never even occurred to me to sign up my second account because I don't have any use for it.

 

Of course I don't know exactly how that affects the statistics, but I don't think it can be considered representative of the game as a whole when you're looking at things like number of free accounts and number of people who own expansions.

[sephiroth.4217]

I'm purely a PvP sorta player, I only bought expansions to keep up with Elite specs.

Expansions from point of view ARE pay to win as the ONLY reason to buy expansion was to have an Elite spec.

 

Definition of Elite being: a select group that is superior in terms of ability or qualities to the rest of a group.

By all accounts, it's pay to win. That is if you use the English Dictionary, if you run off some other language it may differ.

 

Not only is it in the wording "elite specs" but it also matches the definition by being superior in terms of abilities and qualities.

 

I play other games that have expansions, for example Railroad Empire, those are true expansions, they have added content and don't make your trains run on less fuel, less maintenance nor do they rake in more money or give benefits to my account over others who didn't purchase the expansion.

[Aryan Arlande.6184]

Core gamer here.

 

Both xpacs didn't meet my expectations, so i stayed in core-Tyria

 

Plain and simple, still playing with 2 Accounts and 17 chars

[Dante.1763]

> @"sephiroth.4217" said:

> I'm purely a PvP sorta player, I only bought expansions to keep up with Elite specs.

> Expansions from point of view ARE pay to win as the ONLY reason to buy expansion was to have an Elite spec.

>

> Definition of Elite being: a select group that is superior in terms of ability or qualities to the rest of a group.

> By all accounts, it's pay to win. That is if you use the English Dictionary, if you run off some other language it may differ.

>

> Not only is it in the wording "elite specs" but it also matches the definition by being superior in terms of abilities and qualities.

>

> I play other games that have expansions, for example Railroad Empire, those are true expansions, they have added content and don't make your trains run on less fuel, less maintenance nor do they rake in more money or give benefits to my account over others who didn't purchase the expansion.

 

Elite specs werent *MEANT* to replace core specs, anet is just terrible at balance and *cant* follow what they say, your post is correct obviously, but if anet would follow what they say(in this case, elite specs being sidegrades that arent better, but alternatives to a core spec) it wouldnt be.

[robertthebard.8150]

My problem with using 3rd party sites is that nobody is required to use them to play. It's sort of like trusting Meta Critic for a game review, or Steam. In the former case, you're not even required to show a registered copy of whatever game you're reviewing, and in the latter case, any game is subject to review bombs if someone's unhappy, check out the original version of Skyrim being review bombed for the creation club, when you can't even use the creation club in that version of Skyrim.

 

A 10% margin of error from there to what happens in the game assumes that at least 90% of the population is registered. I'm not, and based on that site, you'd never know I played at all, let alone what expansions, if any, I own. Since only about 15% of an MMO's player base use the forums at all, trying to supplement your numbers from the forums is going to fall way short of getting to that 10% margin of error.

 

For myself, I'm just going to run with the irony of the OP claiming in one post that "literally no one buys expansions" and then, in a subsequent post, attempting to support that claim by stating that he "was playing with people in HoT that didn't summon mounts". Let that sink in, and see, how much debate is really needed for this thread's premise.

[Cyninja.2954]

> @"sephiroth.4217" said:

> > @"Dante.1763" said:

> > > @"sephiroth.4217" said:

> > > I'm purely a PvP sorta player, I only bought expansions to keep up with Elite specs.

> > > Expansions from point of view ARE pay to win as the ONLY reason to buy expansion was to have an Elite spec.

> > >

> > > Definition of Elite being: a select group that is superior in terms of ability or qualities to the rest of a group.

> > > By all accounts, it's pay to win. That is if you use the English Dictionary, if you run off some other language it may differ.

> > >

> > > Not only is it in the wording "elite specs" but it also matches the definition by being superior in terms of abilities and qualities.

> > >

> > > I play other games that have expansions, for example Railroad Empire, those are true expansions, they have added content and don't make your trains run on less fuel, less maintenance nor do they rake in more money or give benefits to my account over others who didn't purchase the expansion.

> >

> > Elite specs werent *MEANT* to replace core specs, anet is just terrible at balance and *cant* follow what they say, your post is correct obviously, but if anet would follow what they say(in this case, elite specs being sidegrades that arent better, but alternatives to a core spec) it wouldnt be.

>

> Hence why it's pay to win from a PvP'r perspective... Those specs are well above core capabilities and no real effort has been made to align the elite specs to it's core counterpart.

 

You are comparing apples and oranges. Spvp having no itemization or any type of requirements means there is only 1 iteration of it. Simply put, there is no classic spvp, HoT spvp or PoF spvp. There is only spvp for the current state of the game. Unlike pve where you can actually make such a distinction since the old content is just as accessible as before, more so even now with reworks on core specs.

 

Another way to think of it is this:

- the moment HoT was released, core spvp was removed from the game

- the moment PoF was released, HoT spvp was removed from the game

 

This is similar to all other MMOs and their approach with expansions. Take WoW, every expansion adds x amount of levels. The previous pvp ends the moment a new expansion launches. It is impossible to play pvp without getting the next expansion and leveling up. No one calls that pay-to-win there. The only difference in GW2 is that you are allowed to access the new content without being required to buy the expansion. Maybe it would have been better to bar all non upgraded accounts from spvp and WvW, then this entire pay-to-win discussion would never have existed since you would not have had access to the content, similar as all other MMOs besides GW2.

[SHM.7628]

I can only definitively state the reasons I haven't yet. A few years ago I took a break from playing. I didn't like the direction the game was going in. I felt like they watered down the core game (that I paid for) a lot. The Gem store and going F2P are just two examples of this. I didn't feel like rewarding them with another purchase. Despite all this, I don't dislike the core game. It's paid for and I play it. If the core game was F2P from the beginning, I might have felt differently about the expansions and the gem shop.

[SHM.7628]

> @"Dante.1763" said:

> > @"Dabrixmgp.4758" said:

> > I have played most of the big name MMOs going back to my Ultima Online days in the late 90s. So why is this literally like the only game where people just dont buy expansions? I have even seen some absurd forum posts accusing the game of being pay2win since most Elite Specs are stronger than their Cores.

>

> Well to be honest elite specs are stronger than their core, despite anet *Stating* they didnt want them to be. They wanted them to be alternate ways to play. In some cases its the *only* way to play because the core class got nerfed to make the elite spec seem more attractive, so if you are using a broad definition of pay to win i agree with that.

 

Dante, You know why I bought the expansions in GW1? I loved the game and wanted more! "IF" I ever buy the expansions for GW2 it will be for mounts, gliding, and elite specs. I find that problematic and a little sad!

[Khisanth.2948]

> @"Dabrixmgp.4758" said:

> > @"maddoctor.2738" said:

> > > @"Dabrixmgp.4758" said:

> > > So why is this literally like the only game where people just dont buy expansions?

> >

> > How do you know people don't buy the expansions?

>

> proly the obvious signs like the fact metabattle takes the time to make guides for core builds? Or when people request core builds and state they dont own any expansions. Or when I join HP trains in HoT and people arent using mounts. Or leveling new alts and seeing other people leveling but they dont use mounts.

 

That is pretty silly. Metabattle tries to cover builds that work well. That only criteria is that the build needs to work well for its intended purpose.

 

Then there is the fact that running around with partially unlocked elite spec and then trying to do hero challenges is not a particularly smart move so it is also useful for that situation.

[mauried.5608]

The only thing about expansions I dont like is the use of mastery points to gate content behind.

Its effectively a defacto way of using mastery points as a form of levels since the game limits you to L80.

In the original world, mastery points simply made your character a bit better, but didnt stop you from doing any of the content as you could go anywhere regardless of how many mastery points you had.

In HOT , with the introduction of gliding mastery points then became mandatory to progress in the zone otherwise you were limited in where you could go, and in POF its even worse because far more content is gated behind mastery points, because of the mounts and the need for them to get to many of the locations in the zones.

Future expansions will simply make this worse.

 

[Cristalyan.5728]

> @"Dabrixmgp.4758" said:

>

> proly the obvious signs like the fact metabattle takes the time to make guides for core builds? Or when people request core builds and state they dont own any expansions. Or when I join HP trains in HoT and people arent using mounts. Or leveling new alts and seeing other people leveling but they dont use mounts.

 

I don't know the data you use when stating that the people did not buy the expansions. But - regarding the core Tyria detail ans speaking for me only - even if I level my alts in Tyria and doing map completion **I don't use mounts in core**. I'm one of the persons still believing that the usage of mounts in Tyria is not a good addition for the game and I avoid using them. (or maybe not the dislike to have them in core makes me to do this - maybe because I stop to each and every harvesting node? HM? Maybe this).

[robertthebard.8150]

> @"Cristalyan.5728" said:

> > @"Dabrixmgp.4758" said:

> >

> > proly the obvious signs like the fact metabattle takes the time to make guides for core builds? Or when people request core builds and state they dont own any expansions. Or when I join HP trains in HoT and people arent using mounts. Or leveling new alts and seeing other people leveling but they dont use mounts.

>

> I don't know the data you use when stating that the people did not buy the expansions. But - regarding the core Tyria detail ans speaking for me only - even if I level my alts in Tyria and doing map completion **I don't use mounts in core**. I'm one of the persons still believing that the usage of mounts in Tyria is not a good addition for the game and I avoid using them. (or maybe not the dislike to have them in core makes me to do this - maybe because I stop to each and every harvesting node? HM? Maybe this).

 

I know I'm hard pressed to use a mount in core because I do stop at every node, and it gets sort of dizzying...

[Dawdler.8521]

I recall seeing some data on this but I cant find it... And if I remember correctly, only a very tiny part had f2p while the vast majority was expansions, with a smaller part still being on vanilla.

[Tanner Blackfeather.6509]

> @"mauried.5608" said:

> The only thing about expansions I dont like is the use of mastery points to gate content behind.

> Its effectively a defacto way of using mastery points as a form of levels since the game limits you to L80.

> In the original world, mastery points simply made your character a bit better, but didnt stop you from doing any of the content as you could go anywhere regardless of how many mastery points you had.

> In HOT , with the introduction of gliding mastery points then became mandatory to progress in the zone otherwise you were limited in where you could go, and in POF its even worse because far more content is gated behind mastery points, because of the mounts and the need for them to get to many of the locations in the zones.

> Future expansions will simply make this worse.

>

 

You're describing this like there was a progression from Core masteries to HoT masteries. There weren't - the entire mastery system launched with HoT (with some preparatory changes to the game before).

[Ashantara.8731]

> @"Dabrixmgp.4758" said:

> Or when I join HP trains in HoT and people arent using mounts.

 

HP trains are usually for newbies. You can't expect a newbie to already have all content unlocked.

 

Also, this:

> @"Blanche Neige.7241" said:

> If they are in HoT, they bought an expansion.

 

Exactly. Don't know where the OP gets their "data", but I have rarely encountered GW2 players who haven't bought the expansions - except for those free2play accounts who are new and still trying out the game.

[Eloc Freidon.5692]

Some people like playing content in order. That's why when I first played I didn't TOUCH Heart of Thorns until I could afford Living World Season 2. So long I played without masteries despite being level 80. I could have gotten auto loot but for some reason the devs absolutely must spoil new players entire story beats in order for us to get QoL features.

[Brandon Uzumaki.1524]

I don't buy cause i can't only, i've been playing for almost 2 years, played as f2p for around 1 year and a half, and i think that the core game is on itfelf so vast, and has a lot of content (albeit very easy content), that some people want to "do everything" before getting an expansion, but trust me, a lot of people that are in the "post lvl 80" stuff don't have an expansion cause they can't buy one, not cause they want to "leech" of the f2p version or something.

 

What "saved" me for the moment, is that i got lucky in that Kung Fu thing and someone send me a code for the Heroic Edition on Reddit, so even tough i don't have xpack content, i don't have the f2p restrictions anymore and that gave a "breath of fresh air" into the game so to speak hehe, i even bought LWS2 in that promo two days ago, but despite all that i will get an expansion one day (HoT cause i want to do things in order hehe), they are really worth it, and it's not cool feeling like you are "leeching" of the game or something hehe.

 

Also, about the "p2w" stuff i don't think it applies to elite specs, bear in mind that elite specs traits still requrires the use of 2 core traits to compliment it, that's why it's kinda hard to "buff core specs to match elites", cause in buffing core traits you can make elite even more powerfull than they already are.

[Knighthonor.4061]

Get bored of elite Specs and sometimes want to run core since it has more options to pick from (3) compared to elite Specs (2)

[RoRo.8270]

> @"Dabrixmgp.4758" said:

> I have played most of the big name MMOs going back to my Ultima Online days in the late 90s. So why is this literally like the only game where people just dont buy expansions? I have even seen some absurd forum posts accusing the game of being pay2win since most Elite Specs are stronger than their Cores.

 

When I played heart of thorns almost all elite specs were better than the core ones. I can't say if it's still like that for path of fire. Yes that would then entail it is pay 2 win

[Biff.5312]

You're talking about two separate issues. People not wanting to play an elite spec isn't always because they don't have the expansion. The argument you refer to is simply that they shouldn't HAVE to, i.e. core builds should be viable. Lots of people don't get the expansions right away but I have no idea how many do or don't buy them eventually, and I doubt anyone else here does either.

[Dabrixmgp.4758]

> @"RoRo.8270" said:

> > @"Dabrixmgp.4758" said:

> > I have played most of the big name MMOs going back to my Ultima Online days in the late 90s. So why is this literally like the only game where people just dont buy expansions? I have even seen some absurd forum posts accusing the game of being pay2win since most Elite Specs are stronger than their Cores.

>

> When I played heart of thorns almost all elite specs were better than the core ones. I can't say if it's still like that for path of fire. Yes that would then entail it is pay 2 win

 

how is that pay 2 win when its normal game progression to buy an expansion? pay2win is if they started selling ascended gear for gems.

[LaGranse.8652]

> @"Dabrixmgp.4758" said:

> I have played most of the big name MMOs going back to my Ultima Online days in the late 90s. So why is this literally like the only game where people just dont buy expansions? I have even seen some absurd forum posts accusing the game of being pay2win since most Elite Specs are stronger than their Cores.

 

There are more people with expansions than you think. The table is from [gw2efficiency.com](https://gw2efficiency.com/ "gw2efficiency.com"), not sure how they gather the information, I think it is from everyone that uses their API key on the website.