List of Problem Traits/Skills + Possible Solutions (In-Depth)

[apharma.3741]

> @"Dante.1763" said:

> I know alot of pvpers dont really care about what happens in PVE(the hard core ones at least), but some of the proposed ranger changes would make it really hard to be wanted in a group on ranger again :(

 

Considering most pugs haven't realised that 2 druids is one of the dumbest things to run in nearly all encounters I don't think rangers are in danger just yet. Even on the more "elitist" end where they ask for full meta comps and a billion LI they have at least 1 ranger in every raid group.

 

Here's the blunt truth though, the game needs a 20% damage reduction across the board. PvP, WvW, PvE the whole lot on every class while doing something similar to defensive cool downs and sustain. You can then adjust boss health if needed so it keeps the same time to kill as before the damage reductions so nothing really changes for PvE except you hit for a few hundred less on your 7k crits.

 

Why? It solves a lot of issues with power creep and future problems with new traits/skill interactions keeping this level of power creep and helps curb invalidating older content.

 

Edit: To clarify 20% increase to cool downs on defensive skills, 20% reduction to sustained healing/defensive boon duration. Obviously 20% damage reduction can also include longer cool downs, reducing offensive boon access and duration as well as straight damage modifier reduction.

[shadowpass.4236]

> @"apharma.3741" said:

> > @"Dante.1763" said:

> > I know alot of pvpers dont really care about what happens in PVE(the hard core ones at least), but some of the proposed ranger changes would make it really hard to be wanted in a group on ranger again :(

>

> Considering most pugs haven't realised that 2 druids is one of the dumbest things to run in nearly all encounters I don't think rangers are in danger just yet. Even on the more "elitist" end where they ask for full meta comps and a billion LI they have at least 1 ranger in every raid group.

>

> Here's the blunt truth though, the game needs a 20% damage reduction across the board. PvP, WvW, PvE the whole lot on every class while doing something similar to defensive cool downs and sustain. You can then adjust boss health if needed so it keeps the same time to kill as before the damage reductions so nothing really changes for PvE except you hit for a few hundred less on your 7k crits.

>

> Why? It solves a lot of issues with power creep and future problems with new traits/skill interactions keeping this level of power creep and helps curb invalidating older content.

 

A 20% damage reduction across the board seems like a _fantastic_ way to introduce another bunker meta.

 

Damage AND survivability have been increased over time. Nerfing one without the other will cause a lot of issues. Also, flat % nerfs isn't a good way to do it either.

[apharma.3741]

> @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > @"apharma.3741" said:

> > > @"Dante.1763" said:

> > > I know alot of pvpers dont really care about what happens in PVE(the hard core ones at least), but some of the proposed ranger changes would make it really hard to be wanted in a group on ranger again :(

> >

> > Considering most pugs haven't realised that 2 druids is one of the dumbest things to run in nearly all encounters I don't think rangers are in danger just yet. Even on the more "elitist" end where they ask for full meta comps and a billion LI they have at least 1 ranger in every raid group.

> >

> > Here's the blunt truth though, the game needs a 20% damage reduction across the board. PvP, WvW, PvE the whole lot on every class **while doing something similar to defensive cool downs and sustain.** You can then adjust boss health if needed so it keeps the same time to kill as before the damage reductions so nothing really changes for PvE except you hit for a few hundred less on your 7k crits.

> >

> > Why? It solves a lot of issues with power creep and future problems with new traits/skill interactions keeping this level of power creep and helps curb invalidating older content.

>

> A 20% damage reduction across the board seems like a _fantastic_ way to introduce another bunker meta.

>

> Damage AND survivability have been increased over time. Nerfing one without the other will cause a lot of issues. Also, flat % nerfs isn't a good way to do it either.

 

Put in bold the part you skimmed over, post was edited to add clarification to what I already implied via the bold text.

 

Edit: Also lol at this bunker meta excuse, damage atm is FAR TOO HIGH, you could happily hack away 20% off all damage and we wouldn't get bunker.

[Dante.1763]

> @"apharma.3741" said:

> > @"Dante.1763" said:

> > I know alot of pvpers dont really care about what happens in PVE(the hard core ones at least), but some of the proposed ranger changes would make it really hard to be wanted in a group on ranger again :(

>

> Considering most pugs haven't realised that 2 druids is one of the dumbest things to run in nearly all encounters I don't think rangers are in danger just yet. Even on the more "elitist" end where they ask for full meta comps and a billion LI they have at least 1 ranger in every raid group.

>

> Here's the blunt truth though, the game needs a 20% damage reduction across the board. PvP, WvW, PvE the whole lot on every class while doing something similar to defensive cool downs and sustain. You can then adjust boss health if needed so it keeps the same time to kill as before the damage reductions so nothing really changes for PvE except you hit for a few hundred less on your 7k crits.

>

> Why? It solves a lot of issues with power creep and future problems with new traits/skill interactions keeping this level of power creep and helps curb invalidating older content.

>

> Edit: To clarify 20% increase to cool downs on defensive skills, 20% reduction to sustained healing/defensive boon duration. Obviously 20% damage reduction can also include longer cool downs, reducing offensive boon access and duration as well as straight damage modifier reduction.

 

Ah, see i dont run druids, i run a Condi SB(so i dont see 7k crits, ever, Condis already do way less DPS now, and thanks to the invuln change they arent wanted anymore cause they do less DPS overall, imagine that..) for my raid group, and to even be able to be allowed in any of the groups im a part of i need those skills up there *as they are now* The Elite Skill for example is one the most major components of my build, the extra group damage it does is a massive boon that my build offers, and if its duration got reduced, id be replaced with another person entirely until i could come up with another class which just isnt possible for me.

 

 

So, if you just change the skills and at the same time dont change the bosses(this would *need* to be done) classes /would/ get kicked out of content again, which is terrible.

 

I do agree the powercreep is bad, but unless they do a *total balance overhaul of the entire game*, any changes arent going to be to great overall.

 

> @"apharma.3741" said:

> > @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > > @"apharma.3741" said:

> > > > @"Dante.1763" said:

> > > > I know alot of pvpers dont really care about what happens in PVE(the hard core ones at least), but some of the proposed ranger changes would make it really hard to be wanted in a group on ranger again :(

> > >

> > > Considering most pugs haven't realised that 2 druids is one of the dumbest things to run in nearly all encounters I don't think rangers are in danger just yet. Even on the more "elitist" end where they ask for full meta comps and a billion LI they have at least 1 ranger in every raid group.

> > >

> > > Here's the blunt truth though, the game needs a 20% damage reduction across the board. PvP, WvW, PvE the whole lot on every class **while doing something similar to defensive cool downs and sustain.** You can then adjust boss health if needed so it keeps the same time to kill as before the damage reductions so nothing really changes for PvE except you hit for a few hundred less on your 7k crits.

> > >

> > > Why? It solves a lot of issues with power creep and future problems with new traits/skill interactions keeping this level of power creep and helps curb invalidating older content.

> >

> > A 20% damage reduction across the board seems like a _fantastic_ way to introduce another bunker meta.

> >

> > Damage AND survivability have been increased over time. Nerfing one without the other will cause a lot of issues. Also, flat % nerfs isn't a good way to do it either.

>

> Put in bold the part you skimmed over, post was edited to add clarification to what I already implied via the bold text.

>

> Edit: Also lol at this bunker meta excuse, damage atm is FAR TOO HIGH, you could happily hack away 20% off all damage and we wouldn't get bunker.

 

I agree for PVP and WvW you could for sure reduce the amount of damage by up to 20% and it would make the game alot more fun.

 

*decided not to remove qoutes since i was addressing two different points*

 

[Ruufio.1496]

When was flanking strike made to be unblockable anyway? Where did my game go with only having to avoid larcenous strike? Of course flanking strike shouldn't be unblockable - neither should mirror blade be unblockable which was only made unblockable because reflect could turn someone into a tornado, neither should spear of justice be unblockable or a ton of other things.

 

All damage, healing, debilitating conditions, amount of abilities per trait and cooldowns need to be decreased by 50% (cooldowns increased by 50%) Every patch for years you would see "decreased cooldown by xx" what a joke. We need vanilla gw2 with the bug fixes. Though... I do love my scrapper.

[shadowpass.4236]

> @"apharma.3741" said:

> > @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > > @"apharma.3741" said:

> > > > @"Dante.1763" said:

> > > > I know alot of pvpers dont really care about what happens in PVE(the hard core ones at least), but some of the proposed ranger changes would make it really hard to be wanted in a group on ranger again :(

> > >

> > > Considering most pugs haven't realised that 2 druids is one of the dumbest things to run in nearly all encounters I don't think rangers are in danger just yet. Even on the more "elitist" end where they ask for full meta comps and a billion LI they have at least 1 ranger in every raid group.

> > >

> > > Here's the blunt truth though, the game needs a 20% damage reduction across the board. PvP, WvW, PvE the whole lot on every class **while doing something similar to defensive cool downs and sustain.** You can then adjust boss health if needed so it keeps the same time to kill as before the damage reductions so nothing really changes for PvE except you hit for a few hundred less on your 7k crits.

> > >

> > > Why? It solves a lot of issues with power creep and future problems with new traits/skill interactions keeping this level of power creep and helps curb invalidating older content.

> >

> > A 20% damage reduction across the board seems like a _fantastic_ way to introduce another bunker meta.

> >

> > Damage AND survivability have been increased over time. Nerfing one without the other will cause a lot of issues. Also, flat % nerfs isn't a good way to do it either.

>

> Put in bold the part you skimmed over, post was edited to add clarification to what I already implied via the bold text.

>

> Edit: Also lol at this bunker meta excuse, damage atm is FAR TOO HIGH, you could happily hack away 20% off all damage and we wouldn't get bunker.

 

Survivability is also too high.

 

Answer these please:

 

1. Are Soulbeasts easy to kill?

2. Are Holosmiths easy to kill?

3. Are Spellbreakers easy to kill?

4. Are Mirages easy to kill?

5. Are Firebrands easy to kill?

 

etc. etc.

 

In case you didn't realize, nerfing damage by 20% would make them even _harder_ to kill. And, since 2+2=4, if you can't kill anything, you get a bunker meta where nothing dies.

[mortrialus.3062]

> @"apharma.3741" said:

> > @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > > @"apharma.3741" said:

> > > > @"Dante.1763" said:

> > > > I know alot of pvpers dont really care about what happens in PVE(the hard core ones at least), but some of the proposed ranger changes would make it really hard to be wanted in a group on ranger again :(

> > >

> > > Considering most pugs haven't realised that 2 druids is one of the dumbest things to run in nearly all encounters I don't think rangers are in danger just yet. Even on the more "elitist" end where they ask for full meta comps and a billion LI they have at least 1 ranger in every raid group.

> > >

> > > Here's the blunt truth though, the game needs a 20% damage reduction across the board. PvP, WvW, PvE the whole lot on every class **while doing something similar to defensive cool downs and sustain.** You can then adjust boss health if needed so it keeps the same time to kill as before the damage reductions so nothing really changes for PvE except you hit for a few hundred less on your 7k crits.

> > >

> > > Why? It solves a lot of issues with power creep and future problems with new traits/skill interactions keeping this level of power creep and helps curb invalidating older content.

> >

> > A 20% damage reduction across the board seems like a _fantastic_ way to introduce another bunker meta.

> >

> > Damage AND survivability have been increased over time. Nerfing one without the other will cause a lot of issues. Also, flat % nerfs isn't a good way to do it either.

>

> Put in bold the part you skimmed over, post was edited to add clarification to what I already implied via the bold text.

>

> Edit: Also lol at this bunker meta excuse, damage atm is FAR TOO HIGH, you could happily hack away 20% off all damage and we wouldn't get bunker.

 

You realize it was only May when Chronobunkers were unkillable monsters and the only reason they left the meta was because their damage was heavily reduced to appropriate levels given their survivability. Heck Boonbeast right now is an almost unkillable monsters.

[Math.5123]

I'd like to see daggerstorm bring unable to have it's cooldown reset by improvisation. That's the only fix I'd think it's necessary

[babazhook.6805]

One issue I see is people tend to believe there a 1 to 1 comparison of damage versus defenses and sustain. That not the case. Damage HAS to always be larger then the various defensive tools or a kill will never be made. When you are talking about damage at the top end you are talking builds that tend to sacrifice for that damage. When you cut back the peak damage out and do so on a 1v1 basis then those persons who sacrifice defense for offense no longer gain enough advantahge to make it worthwhile. This leads them to survival mode which means bunker meta no one dying.

[apharma.3741]

> @"Dante.1763" said:

> > @"apharma.3741" said:

> > > @"Dante.1763" said:

> > > I know alot of pvpers dont really care about what happens in PVE(the hard core ones at least), but some of the proposed ranger changes would make it really hard to be wanted in a group on ranger again :(

> >

> > Considering most pugs haven't realised that 2 druids is one of the dumbest things to run in nearly all encounters I don't think rangers are in danger just yet. Even on the more "elitist" end where they ask for full meta comps and a billion LI they have at least 1 ranger in every raid group.

> >

> > Here's the blunt truth though, the game needs a 20% damage reduction across the board. PvP, WvW, PvE the whole lot on every class while doing something similar to defensive cool downs and sustain. You can then adjust boss health if needed so it keeps the same time to kill as before the damage reductions so nothing really changes for PvE except you hit for a few hundred less on your 7k crits.

> >

> > Why? It solves a lot of issues with power creep and future problems with new traits/skill interactions keeping this level of power creep and helps curb invalidating older content.

> >

> > Edit: To clarify 20% increase to cool downs on defensive skills, 20% reduction to sustained healing/defensive boon duration. Obviously 20% damage reduction can also include longer cool downs, reducing offensive boon access and duration as well as straight damage modifier reduction.

>

> Ah, see i dont run druids, i run a Condi SB(so i dont see 7k crits, ever, Condis already do way less DPS now, and thanks to the invuln change they arent wanted anymore cause they do less DPS overall, imagine that..) for my raid group, and to even be able to be allowed in any of the groups im a part of i need those skills up there *as they are now* The Elite Skill for example is one the most major components of my build, the extra group damage it does is a massive boon that my build offers, and if its duration got reduced, id be replaced with another person entirely until i could come up with another class which just isnt possible for me.

>

>

> So, if you just change the skills and at the same time dont change the bosses(this would *need* to be done) classes /would/ get kicked out of content again, which is terrible.

>

> I do agree the powercreep is bad, but unless they do a *total balance overhaul of the entire game*, any changes arent going to be to great overall.

>

> > @"apharma.3741" said:

> > > @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > > > @"apharma.3741" said:

> > > > > @"Dante.1763" said:

> > > > > I know alot of pvpers dont really care about what happens in PVE(the hard core ones at least), but some of the proposed ranger changes would make it really hard to be wanted in a group on ranger again :(

> > > >

> > > > Considering most pugs haven't realised that 2 druids is one of the dumbest things to run in nearly all encounters I don't think rangers are in danger just yet. Even on the more "elitist" end where they ask for full meta comps and a billion LI they have at least 1 ranger in every raid group.

> > > >

> > > > Here's the blunt truth though, the game needs a 20% damage reduction across the board. PvP, WvW, PvE the whole lot on every class **while doing something similar to defensive cool downs and sustain.** You can then adjust boss health if needed so it keeps the same time to kill as before the damage reductions so nothing really changes for PvE except you hit for a few hundred less on your 7k crits.

> > > >

> > > > Why? It solves a lot of issues with power creep and future problems with new traits/skill interactions keeping this level of power creep and helps curb invalidating older content.

> > >

> > > A 20% damage reduction across the board seems like a _fantastic_ way to introduce another bunker meta.

> > >

> > > Damage AND survivability have been increased over time. Nerfing one without the other will cause a lot of issues. Also, flat % nerfs isn't a good way to do it either.

> >

> > Put in bold the part you skimmed over, post was edited to add clarification to what I already implied via the bold text.

> >

> > Edit: Also lol at this bunker meta excuse, damage atm is FAR TOO HIGH, you could happily hack away 20% off all damage and we wouldn't get bunker.

>

> I agree for PVP and WvW you could for sure reduce the amount of damage by up to 20% and it would make the game alot more fun.

>

> *decided not to remove qoutes since i was addressing two different points*

>

 

> @"Dante.1763" said:

> > @"apharma.3741" said:

> > > @"Dante.1763" said:

> > > I know alot of pvpers dont really care about what happens in PVE(the hard core ones at least), but some of the proposed ranger changes would make it really hard to be wanted in a group on ranger again :(

> >

> > Considering most pugs haven't realised that 2 druids is one of the dumbest things to run in nearly all encounters I don't think rangers are in danger just yet. Even on the more "elitist" end where they ask for full meta comps and a billion LI they have at least 1 ranger in every raid group.

> >

> > Here's the blunt truth though, the game needs a 20% damage reduction across the board. PvP, WvW, PvE the whole lot on every class while doing something similar to defensive cool downs and sustain. You can then adjust boss health if needed so it keeps the same time to kill as before the damage reductions so nothing really changes for PvE except you hit for a few hundred less on your 7k crits.

> >

> > Why? It solves a lot of issues with power creep and future problems with new traits/skill interactions keeping this level of power creep and helps curb invalidating older content.

> >

> > Edit: To clarify 20% increase to cool downs on defensive skills, 20% reduction to sustained healing/defensive boon duration. Obviously 20% damage reduction can also include longer cool downs, reducing offensive boon access and duration as well as straight damage modifier reduction.

>

> Ah, see i dont run druids, i run a Condi SB(so i dont see 7k crits, ever, Condis already do way less DPS now, and thanks to the invuln change they arent wanted anymore cause they do less DPS overall, imagine that..) for my raid group, and to even be able to be allowed in any of the groups im a part of i need those skills up there *as they are now* The Elite Skill for example is one the most major components of my build, the extra group damage it does is a massive boon that my build offers, and if its duration got reduced, id be replaced with another person entirely until i could come up with another class which just isnt possible for me.

>

>

> So, if you just change the skills and at the same time dont change the bosses(this would *need* to be done) classes /would/ get kicked out of content again, which is terrible.

>

> I do agree the powercreep is bad, but unless they do a *total balance overhaul of the entire game*, any changes arent going to be to great overall.

>

> > @"apharma.3741" said:

> > > @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > > > @"apharma.3741" said:

> > > > > @"Dante.1763" said:

> > > > > I know alot of pvpers dont really care about what happens in PVE(the hard core ones at least), but some of the proposed ranger changes would make it really hard to be wanted in a group on ranger again :(

> > > >

> > > > Considering most pugs haven't realised that 2 druids is one of the dumbest things to run in nearly all encounters I don't think rangers are in danger just yet. Even on the more "elitist" end where they ask for full meta comps and a billion LI they have at least 1 ranger in every raid group.

> > > >

> > > > Here's the blunt truth though, the game needs a 20% damage reduction across the board. PvP, WvW, PvE the whole lot on every class **while doing something similar to defensive cool downs and sustain.** You can then adjust boss health if needed so it keeps the same time to kill as before the damage reductions so nothing really changes for PvE except you hit for a few hundred less on your 7k crits.

> > > >

> > > > Why? It solves a lot of issues with power creep and future problems with new traits/skill interactions keeping this level of power creep and helps curb invalidating older content.

> > >

> > > A 20% damage reduction across the board seems like a _fantastic_ way to introduce another bunker meta.

> > >

> > > Damage AND survivability have been increased over time. Nerfing one without the other will cause a lot of issues. Also, flat % nerfs isn't a good way to do it either.

> >

> > Put in bold the part you skimmed over, post was edited to add clarification to what I already implied via the bold text.

> >

> > Edit: Also lol at this bunker meta excuse, damage atm is FAR TOO HIGH, you could happily hack away 20% off all damage and we wouldn't get bunker.

>

> I agree for PVP and WvW you could for sure reduce the amount of damage by up to 20% and it would make the game alot more fun.

>

> *decided not to remove qoutes since i was addressing two different points*

>

 

Power and condition soulbeast is acceptable in any raid that is not in a competition or going for a record run if played well (just like any class) and will not make your group fail. Almost any build you can make work at an acceptable level, yes even core mesmer is capable of ~20k which is more than enough to clear raids fast and with no risk.

 

It's fine, I understand.

[apharma.3741]

> @"babazhook.6805" said:

> One issue I see is people tend to believe there a 1 to 1 comparison of damage versus defenses and sustain. That not the case. Damage HAS to always be larger then the various defensive tools or a kill will never be made. When you are talking about damage at the top end you are talking builds that tend to sacrifice for that damage. When you cut back the peak damage out and do so on a 1v1 basis then those persons who sacrifice defense for offense no longer gain enough advantahge to make it worthwhile. This leads them to survival mode which means bunker meta no one dying.

 

This would be fine if these builds were going all in on damage or were actually taking damage lines like most mesmer/thief builds. However you have builds like holo and soulbeast where they take no damage lines and have 2-3 defensive skills while having several passive proc defences doing the same damage as builds taking damage lines. By in large they aren't sacrificing servivability for damage, they're straight up getting more and more utility which translate to increasing both.

 

This is however why I said nerfing damage, healing and defences in my orginal post. I still think you could (if you wanted I personally would advocate a more varied approach and as stated defense+sustain as well) do a flat -20% damage done to players and you'd not end up with a bunker meta, nothing atm can survive 2v1 for very long.

[Chaith.8256]

Holo Leap is 450 movement skill, 600 range attack. You might wanna edit your commentary on that skill

[Bigpapasmurf.5623]

As a Mirage main, I can agree with everything mentioned for the mentioned classes, however there are more classes that need to be mentioned.

[Hyper Cutter.9376]

> @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > @"Dante.1763" said:

> > I know alot of pvpers dont really care about what happens in PVE(the hard core ones at least), but some of the proposed ranger changes would make it really hard to be wanted in a group on ranger again :(

>

> Hi! Skill splits between gamemodes would prevent PvE from being affected. ^-^

Because that worked _so well_ every time a pet got nerfed because of PVP whining...

[apharma.3741]

> @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> #### Mesmer

>

> [**Ineptitude**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ineptitude)

>

> - **Problem**: Combined with [blinding Dissipation](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Blinding_Dissipation), the confusion and blind application Mirage has access to is extremely oppressive.

> - **Solution**: Reduce the confusion per blind to 1 stack.

>

> [**Duelist’s Discipline**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Duelist%27s_Discipline)

>

> - **Problem**: Combined with [sharper Images](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sharper_Images), this trait means that [Phantasmal Duelist](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Phantasmal_Duelist) alone can apply anywhere from 8-16 stacks of long-duration bleeding. Also, coupled with Mirage’s exceptionally high access to CC’s, this means that pistol skills can recharge nearly instantly.

> - **Solution**: Currently, this trait bleeds on EVERY hit from pistol attacks from you and your illusions. Instead, change this to 33% chance to bleed on CRITICAL hits like most other bleeding-related traits. Also, remove the 25% cooldown reduction on interrupt and make it a flat 20% cooldown reduction on pistol skills.

>

> [**Sharper Images**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sharper_Images)

>

> - **Problem**: Again, this trait is 100% chance on critical hits to apply a 5-8 second bleed (Carrion vs. Deadshot amulet). This results in insane amounts of bleeding stacks with little effort on the mesmer’s part.

> - **Solution**: Similar to [sharpened Edges](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sharpened_Edges), [sharpshooter](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sharpshooter), [barbed Precision](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Barbed_Precision), and [bloodlust](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Bloodlust) (basically every single bleed-on-attack related trait), make it 33% on critical hits and reduce the bleeding duration to 3 seconds because the effect can trigger from 3 different sources.

>

> [**Infinite Horizon**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Infinite_Horizon)

>

> - **Problem**: These trait multiplies the effectiveness of a Mirage’s ambush skills by FOUR times. Instead of using lesser versions of ambush skills, every illusion uses the exact same attack the player uses. This results in: 4 dazes from [Mirage Thrust](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mirage_Thrust), [25 stacks of torment and bleeding](https://imgur.com/a/WfP4l6i) from [imaginary Axes](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Imaginary_Axes), [10-15 stacks of confusion, torment and bleeding](https://imgur.com/a/xRNXjoe) from [Ether Barrage](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ether_Barrage), and [4 stacks of burning and 10-16 stacks of torment and bleeding](https://imgur.com/a/S3fooXe) from [Chaos Vortex](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Chaos_Vortex). Keep in mind, these ambush attacks can be SPAMMED and all of these conditions I listed are applied PER USE.

> - **Solution**: The ambush attacks from illusions still trigger but ONLY the animation and minor power damage. They should NOT apply any conditions or other effects. This trait should be used to confuse enemies not obliterate them with multiple, high condition stacks.

>

> [**Mirage Cloak**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mirage_Cloak_(effect))

>

> - **Problem**: Dodging while disabled should not exist.

> - **Solution**: Remove the ability to dodge while disabled.

>

> [**Elusive Mind**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Elusive_Mind)

>

> - **Problem**: Stunbreak on dodge should not exist.

> - **Solution**: Remove the stunbreak and exhaustion. Add a 20% cooldown reduction to Deception skills.

>

> [**Illusionary Ambush**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Illusionary_Ambush)

>

> - **Problem**: This skill is a target break, free Mirage Cloak, and ambush attack (x4 with 3 illusions) on a 20 second cooldown that can be used while disabled.

> - **Solution**: Increase the cooldown to 30 seconds similar to [Lightning Reflexes](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Lightning_Reflexes) and [Roll for Initiative](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Roll_for_Initiative).

>

> [**Axes of Symmetry**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Axes_of_Symmetry)

>

> - **Problem**: This skill applies 9 stacks of confusion for 3-5 seconds (Carrion vs. Deadshot amulet), evades, teleports, leaps, and target breaks every 8 seconds while traited.

> - **Solution**: Increase the cooldown to 15 seconds (12 seconds while traited) and reduce the 6 stacks of player confusion to 3.

>

> [**Confusing Images**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Confusing_Images)

>

> - **Problem**: This skill has extraordinarily high base power damage (higher than [Rapid Fire](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Rapid_Fire) or [Maul](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Maul_(ranger_greatsword_skill)) and can hit for 4000 damage alone on Deadshot amulet without any investment into power or critical damage.

> - **Solution**: Lower the base damage from 2000 to 800.

>

> [**Illusionary Counter**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Illusionary_Counter)

>

> - **Problem**: This skill is a 4.75 second cooldown, 2 second duration block that summons 2 clones and applies 7 stacks of torment (5 on trigger, 1 per clone).

> - **Solution**: Increase the cooldown to 10 seconds (8 seconds while traited) and reduce the torment on trigger to 3.

 

Confusion isn't really an issue after they nerfed the duration to 3s, there's not a lot of ways to extend that duration too much longer than 4s. Torment is a bigger issue, look at the application and damage formula for it. Ineptitude isn't a big issue.

 

Duellist Discipline...seriously? It's a weak phantasm and you have to trait it to do the weakest condition in the game. Interrupting is easy when you fight idiots who just spam spam spam like most do now. Rewarding interrupts is needed as the counter is pretty easy especially with the prevalence of stability. This is a non issue.

 

Sharper Images, OK if it stops the crying change it to 33% chance on crit but keep the duration. However when comparing traits against other classes they get 20% increased bleed duration and a ton of ways to apply bleed outside the trait in large amounts and durations, core mesmer doesn't apply much bleed except on crit and random on staff, the duration isn't that long either. Sooo...it's grasping at straws as usual for mesmer complaints but whatever, fine nerf it and still die to mirage because nothing's been done about the torment.

 

Infinite Horizon you base this on an ideal that there is ALWAYS 3 clones at the time of getting mirage cloak however if you fight anything with good AOE damage the illusions die very fast. The trait isn't that big of an issue outside of specific instances like the axe trait and that the axe ambush is so strong on it's own. 1 dodge will usually nullify all the ambush's from the clones. Your idea is terrible and poorly thought out, anyone lording this as being balance worthy should really think if they would like their own class having a trait for show and show only that doesn't actually do anything.

 

Mirage Cloak try out removing the ability to dodge while disabled.

 

Elusive mind - Don't power creep it, make it remove 1 condition on mirage cloak, no exhaustion, no stunbreak. It doesn't need to reduce deception skill cool downs.

 

Illusionary Ambush is in no way comparable with something like lightning reflexes or roll for initiative. For a start you have 0 control where it puts you so you can end up in a worse place. It's also not a stun break so you're still a sitting duck. Additionally both roll for initiative and lightning reflexes can be traited for lower cool downs and additional benefits, I might add that wilderness knowledge is an insanely good trait that affects 4-5 very strong skills. Illusionary ambush isn't a big deal, it's strong but I wouldn't take it unless I wasn't using 3rd slot for portal.

 

Axes of Symmetry - yes the confusion is high but I think increasing the cool down to 12s to match the number 3 skills of other weapons is better, then see if it's OK.

 

Confusing Images - yeah they kept buffing the power damage because mesmer has so few main hand weapons. It does too much damage now but at the same time it's a long channelled beam and clunky. Sure a 10-20% damage reduction might be in order but not the level of reduction you're asking.

 

Illusionary counter is 6s CD... Though I didn't realise they'd reduced it as much as they did in PvP/WvW. Putting it back up to 8s is all that's needed.

 

Edit: Forgot to say, most of your suggestions aren't good and only show you don't really play and learn the class. The biggest issues with mirage atm are:

 

Has too much torment application, an argument can be made that torment and confusion don't belong on the same build.

Same issues as other elite specs, low cool downs on a lot of things.

Some ambush skills have too much condition application.

 

Axe and sceptre ambush skills need toning down in number of conditions applied ideally switching torment to another condition, the axe trait could also do with just being a CDR and no extra axe. Some cool downs need to go up just like all elite specs like axes of symmetry, maybe the deceptions but then the deception skills are actually really bad so would need improvement to compete with SoM and blink. Maybe do a slight reduction to chaos vortex durations, the problem is it's very well telegraphed and slow.

[babazhook.6805]

> @"apharma.3741" said:

> > @"babazhook.6805" said:

> > One issue I see is people tend to believe there a 1 to 1 comparison of damage versus defenses and sustain. That not the case. Damage HAS to always be larger then the various defensive tools or a kill will never be made. When you are talking about damage at the top end you are talking builds that tend to sacrifice for that damage. When you cut back the peak damage out and do so on a 1v1 basis then those persons who sacrifice defense for offense no longer gain enough advantahge to make it worthwhile. This leads them to survival mode which means bunker meta no one dying.

>

> This would be fine if these builds were going all in on damage or were actually taking damage lines like most mesmer/thief builds. However you have builds like holo and soulbeast where they take no damage lines and have 2-3 defensive skills while having several passive proc defences doing the same damage as builds taking damage lines. By in large they aren't sacrificing servivability for damage, they're straight up getting more and more utility which translate to increasing both.

>

> This is however why I said nerfing damage, healing and defences in my orginal post. I still think you could (if you wanted I personally would advocate a more varied approach and as stated defense+sustain as well) do a flat -20% damage done to players and you'd not end up with a bunker meta, nothing atm can survive 2v1 for very long.

 

The problem is the math still off. I agree that there are builds that can go into bunker mode yet output serious damage, but at the same time you have the fact that there are classes that can not and some of those classes take an 8k loss in health points out of the gate. So while you point to "mesmer holo" as builds that can have great sustain with high damage output as an example of builds breaking the rule of sacrifices made , a thief that starts with 8k less in health next to a warrior losing 20 percent damage will be all but useless no matter how it traited. This because 20 percent less damage is easily neutralized if that hit point advantage remains. Throw in all the other sustain measures (blocks , endure pain etc) even were these cut and there just too great a combinaion of things for that thief to overcome.

 

If there a 20 percent cut to damage out, there has to be equalization in health pools along with a >then 20 percent hit on sustain. It not a 1 for 1 thing. Frankly, would such a thing to occur, I would build my warrior up to 26+k health and would never worry again about dying to any thief. I can easily add more health .

 

When looking at damage done in a system where some classes have a much smaller health pool , one has to forget the raw damage and focus more on "Percentage of health one can take away from another player in a single attack). If my single attack warrior can take away 90 percent of a thief helath pool and a thief using a single attack can only take away 30 percent of my warriors, even if the raw numbers the same, warrior wins.

[mortrialus.3062]

> @"apharma.3741" said:

> > @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> > #### Mesmer

> >

> > [**Ineptitude**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ineptitude)

> >

> > - **Problem**: Combined with [blinding Dissipation](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Blinding_Dissipation), the confusion and blind application Mirage has access to is extremely oppressive.

> > - **Solution**: Reduce the confusion per blind to 1 stack.

> >

> > [**Duelist’s Discipline**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Duelist%27s_Discipline)

> >

> > - **Problem**: Combined with [sharper Images](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sharper_Images), this trait means that [Phantasmal Duelist](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Phantasmal_Duelist) alone can apply anywhere from 8-16 stacks of long-duration bleeding. Also, coupled with Mirage’s exceptionally high access to CC’s, this means that pistol skills can recharge nearly instantly.

> > - **Solution**: Currently, this trait bleeds on EVERY hit from pistol attacks from you and your illusions. Instead, change this to 33% chance to bleed on CRITICAL hits like most other bleeding-related traits. Also, remove the 25% cooldown reduction on interrupt and make it a flat 20% cooldown reduction on pistol skills.

> >

> > [**Sharper Images**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sharper_Images)

> >

> > - **Problem**: Again, this trait is 100% chance on critical hits to apply a 5-8 second bleed (Carrion vs. Deadshot amulet). This results in insane amounts of bleeding stacks with little effort on the mesmer’s part.

> > - **Solution**: Similar to [sharpened Edges](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sharpened_Edges), [sharpshooter](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sharpshooter), [barbed Precision](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Barbed_Precision), and [bloodlust](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Bloodlust) (basically every single bleed-on-attack related trait), make it 33% on critical hits and reduce the bleeding duration to 3 seconds because the effect can trigger from 3 different sources.

> >

> > [**Infinite Horizon**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Infinite_Horizon)

> >

> > - **Problem**: These trait multiplies the effectiveness of a Mirage’s ambush skills by FOUR times. Instead of using lesser versions of ambush skills, every illusion uses the exact same attack the player uses. This results in: 4 dazes from [Mirage Thrust](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mirage_Thrust), [25 stacks of torment and bleeding](https://imgur.com/a/WfP4l6i) from [imaginary Axes](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Imaginary_Axes), [10-15 stacks of confusion, torment and bleeding](https://imgur.com/a/xRNXjoe) from [Ether Barrage](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ether_Barrage), and [4 stacks of burning and 10-16 stacks of torment and bleeding](https://imgur.com/a/S3fooXe) from [Chaos Vortex](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Chaos_Vortex). Keep in mind, these ambush attacks can be SPAMMED and all of these conditions I listed are applied PER USE.

> > - **Solution**: The ambush attacks from illusions still trigger but ONLY the animation and minor power damage. They should NOT apply any conditions or other effects. This trait should be used to confuse enemies not obliterate them with multiple, high condition stacks.

> >

> > [**Mirage Cloak**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mirage_Cloak_(effect))

> >

> > - **Problem**: Dodging while disabled should not exist.

> > - **Solution**: Remove the ability to dodge while disabled.

> >

> > [**Elusive Mind**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Elusive_Mind)

> >

> > - **Problem**: Stunbreak on dodge should not exist.

> > - **Solution**: Remove the stunbreak and exhaustion. Add a 20% cooldown reduction to Deception skills.

> >

> > [**Illusionary Ambush**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Illusionary_Ambush)

> >

> > - **Problem**: This skill is a target break, free Mirage Cloak, and ambush attack (x4 with 3 illusions) on a 20 second cooldown that can be used while disabled.

> > - **Solution**: Increase the cooldown to 30 seconds similar to [Lightning Reflexes](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Lightning_Reflexes) and [Roll for Initiative](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Roll_for_Initiative).

> >

> > [**Axes of Symmetry**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Axes_of_Symmetry)

> >

> > - **Problem**: This skill applies 9 stacks of confusion for 3-5 seconds (Carrion vs. Deadshot amulet), evades, teleports, leaps, and target breaks every 8 seconds while traited.

> > - **Solution**: Increase the cooldown to 15 seconds (12 seconds while traited) and reduce the 6 stacks of player confusion to 3.

> >

> > [**Confusing Images**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Confusing_Images)

> >

> > - **Problem**: This skill has extraordinarily high base power damage (higher than [Rapid Fire](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Rapid_Fire) or [Maul](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Maul_(ranger_greatsword_skill)) and can hit for 4000 damage alone on Deadshot amulet without any investment into power or critical damage.

> > - **Solution**: Lower the base damage from 2000 to 800.

> >

> > [**Illusionary Counter**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Illusionary_Counter)

> >

> > - **Problem**: This skill is a 4.75 second cooldown, 2 second duration block that summons 2 clones and applies 7 stacks of torment (5 on trigger, 1 per clone).

> > - **Solution**: Increase the cooldown to 10 seconds (8 seconds while traited) and reduce the torment on trigger to 3.

>

> Confusion isn't really an issue after they nerfed the duration to 3s, there's not a lot of ways to extend that duration too much longer than 4s. Torment is a bigger issue, look at the application and damage formula for it. Ineptitude isn't a big issue.

>

> Duellist Discipline...seriously? It's a weak phantasm and you have to trait it to do the weakest condition in the game. Interrupting is easy when you fight idiots who just spam spam spam like most do now. Rewarding interrupts is needed as the counter is pretty easy especially with the prevalence of stability. This is a non issue.

>

> Sharper Images, OK if it stops the crying change it to 33% chance on crit but keep the duration. However when comparing traits against other classes they get 20% increased bleed duration and a ton of ways to apply bleed outside the trait in large amounts and durations, core mesmer doesn't apply much bleed except on crit and random on staff, the duration isn't that long either. Sooo...it's grasping at straws as usual for mesmer complaints but whatever, fine nerf it and still die to mirage because nothing's been done about the torment.

>

> Infinite Horizon you base this on an ideal that there is ALWAYS 3 clones at the time of getting mirage cloak however if you fight anything with good AOE damage the illusions die very fast. The trait isn't that big of an issue outside of specific instances like the axe trait and that the axe ambush is so strong on it's own. 1 dodge will usually nullify all the ambush's from the clones. Your idea is terrible and poorly thought out, anyone lording this as being balance worthy should really think if they would like their own class having a trait for show and show only that doesn't actually do anything.

>

> Mirage Cloak try out removing the ability to dodge while disabled.

>

> Elusive mind - Don't power creep it, make it remove 1 condition on mirage cloak, no exhaustion, no stunbreak. It doesn't need to reduce deception skill cool downs.

>

> Illusionary Ambush is in no way comparable with something like lightning reflexes or roll for initiative. For a start you have 0 control where it puts you so you can end up in a worse place. It's also not a stun break so you're still a sitting duck. Additionally both roll for initiative and lightning reflexes can be traited for lower cool downs and additional benefits, I might add that wilderness knowledge is an insanely good trait that affects 4-5 very strong skills. Illusionary ambush isn't a big deal, it's strong but I wouldn't take it unless I wasn't using 3rd slot for portal.

>

> Axes of Symmetry - yes the confusion is high but I think increasing the cool down to 12s to match the number 3 skills of other weapons is better, then see if it's OK.

>

> Confusing Images - yeah they kept buffing the power damage because mesmer has so few main hand weapons. It does too much damage now but at the same time it's a long channelled beam and clunky. Sure a 10-20% damage reduction might be in order but not the level of reduction you're asking.

>

> Illusionary counter is 6s CD... Though I didn't realise they'd reduced it as much as they did in PvP/WvW. Putting it back up to 8s is all that's needed.

>

> Edit: Forgot to say, most of your suggestions aren't good and only show you don't really play and learn the class. The biggest issues with mirage atm are:

>

> Has too much torment application, an argument can be made that torment and confusion don't belong on the same build.

> Same issues as other elite specs, low cool downs on a lot of things.

> Some ambush skills have too much condition application.

>

> Axe and sceptre ambush skills need toning down in number of conditions applied ideally switching torment to another condition, the axe trait could also do with just being a CDR and no extra axe. Some cool downs need to go up just like all elite specs like axes of symmetry, maybe the deceptions but then the deception skills are actually really bad so would need improvement to compete with SoM and blink. Maybe do a slight reduction to chaos vortex durations, the problem is it's very well telegraphed and slow.

 

Regarding Infinite Horizon, I showed with testing and match on the previous page how his claims that it increases ambush damage by FOUR TIMES is wrong. And that aside from the Staff Ambush, which is extremely difficult to land with your own character let alone clones, Infinite Horizon doesn't even get close to that even with three clones and as much investment in damage as possible.

[tinyreborn.1938]

> @"apharma.3741" said:

> Sharper Images, OK if it stops the crying change it to 33% chance on crit but keep the duration. However when comparing traits against other classes they get 20% increased bleed duration and a ton of ways to apply bleed outside the trait in large amounts and durations, core mesmer doesn't apply much bleed except on crit and random on staff, the duration isn't that long either. Sooo...it's grasping at straws as usual for mesmer complaints but whatever, fine nerf it and still die to mirage because nothing's been done about the torment.

All those traits he complaint about increase duration/damage by bleeds and caused by owner attacks ,phantasms/illusions die in 1 hit and used as shatter fodder. Nothign to compare . Also chance to crit taken from mesmer himself ,fury on mesmer doenst affect clones ,with carrion its still 5% to crit. To have 50% chance for bleed you need alot of precision . Even with wizard you have ~30 % .

> Elusive mind - Don't power creep it, make it remove 1 condition on mirage cloak, no exhaustion, no stunbreak. It doesn't need to reduce deception skill cool downs.

Too weak , wouldnt be taken ever over IH .

> Confusing Images - yeah they kept buffing the power damage because mesmer has so few main hand weapons. It does too much damage now but at the same time it's a long channelled beam and clunky. Sure a 10-20% damage reduction might be in order but not the level of reduction you're asking.

Its rly strong skill but lets be real , 900 range and pretty slow casting laser... I dont care for future of this skill because scepter never been good weapon even after its buff.

> Illusionary counter is 6s CD... Though I didn't realise they'd reduced it as much as they did in PvP/WvW. Putting it back up to 8s is all that's needed.

BTW Once axe would be nerfed . Mirage would struggle to kill anyone with their cleanse spamming anyway

Also I like how he trying to 'nerf' ranger while every suggestion is a buff xDDDDDD

Perma moa stance with 100% share to allies . A better offensive version of rampage as one with a breakstun/stab/ low cd . When ppl wanted Timewarp to be 50% duration and 50% cut cd everyone been like ITS OP, NO NEED TO BUFF OPSMER!

Want to move 2 minor traits that alrdy good into 1 insane trait that will reduce recharge on pet swap,increase pet damage by 10%, movespeed and give ferocity bonus and make new trait ... like wtf? Its a nerf????????

He didnt even listed how dumb plasma and all this boons as 10s with 0% boon duration anywhere.

Buff my class to hell and nerf others.

Most not biased balance suggestions ! /sarcasm

At this point i'm glad they never listen to players when it comes to balance , even random buffs and nerfs are better than this

[apharma.3741]

> @"tinyreborn.1938" said:

> > @"apharma.3741" said:

> > Sharper Images, OK if it stops the crying change it to 33% chance on crit but keep the duration. However when comparing traits against other classes they get 20% increased bleed duration and a ton of ways to apply bleed outside the trait in large amounts and durations, core mesmer doesn't apply much bleed except on crit and random on staff, the duration isn't that long either. Sooo...it's grasping at straws as usual for mesmer complaints but whatever, fine nerf it and still die to mirage because nothing's been done about the torment.

> All those traits he complaint about increase duration/damage by bleeds and caused by owner attacks ,phantasms/illusions die in 1 hit and used as shatter fodder. Nothign to compare . Also chance to crit taken from mesmer himself ,fury on mesmer doenst affect clones ,with carrion its still 5% to crit. To have 50% chance for bleed you need alot of precision . Even with wizard you have ~30 % .

> > Elusive mind - Don't power creep it, make it remove 1 condition on mirage cloak, no exhaustion, no stunbreak. It doesn't need to reduce deception skill cool downs.

> Too weak , wouldnt be taken ever over IH .

> > Confusing Images - yeah they kept buffing the power damage because mesmer has so few main hand weapons. It does too much damage now but at the same time it's a long channelled beam and clunky. Sure a 10-20% damage reduction might be in order but not the level of reduction you're asking.

> Its rly strong skill but lets be real , 900 range and pretty slow casting laser... I dont care for future of this skill because scepter never been good weapon even after its buff.

> > Illusionary counter is 6s CD... Though I didn't realise they'd reduced it as much as they did in PvP/WvW. Putting it back up to 8s is all that's needed.

> BTW Once axe would be nerfed . Mirage would struggle to kill anyone with their cleanse spamming anyway

> Also I like how he trying to 'nerf' ranger while every suggestion is a buff xDDDDDD

> Perma moa stance with 100% share to allies . A better offensive version of rampage as one with a breakstun/stab/ low cd . When ppl wanted Timewarp to be 50% duration and 50% cut cd everyone been like ITS OP, NO NEED TO BUFF OPSMER!

> Want to move 2 minor traits that alrdy good into 1 insane trait that will reduce recharge on pet swap,increase pet damage by 10%, movespeed and give ferocity bonus and make new trait ... like kitten? Its a nerf????????

> He didnt even listed how dumb plasma and all this boons as 10s with 0% boon duration anywhere.

> Buff my class to hell and nerf others.

> Most not biased balance suggestions ! /sarcasm

> At this point i'm glad they never listen to players when it comes to balance , even random buffs and nerfs are better than this

 

Yeah I wrote a....scathing review of his changes to ranger earlier.

 

I know sceptre is clunky and everything I do play it but there's no reason to keep confusing images as doing the ludicrous damage it does in power nor having cool downs so low. Bear in mind I advocate increasing cool downs fo a lot of skills across all classes to be more in line with how core was pre HoT. The power creep has not made the game more fun.

 

I would 100% use elusive mind for the cleanse on power mes as I stated, look at my specific wording, whenevery you gain mirage cloak you cleanse a condition. Mirrors and iAmbush would each cleanse a condition each.

[mortrialus.3062]

> @"apharma.3741" said:

> > @"tinyreborn.1938" said:

> > > @"apharma.3741" said:

> > > Sharper Images, OK if it stops the crying change it to 33% chance on crit but keep the duration. However when comparing traits against other classes they get 20% increased bleed duration and a ton of ways to apply bleed outside the trait in large amounts and durations, core mesmer doesn't apply much bleed except on crit and random on staff, the duration isn't that long either. Sooo...it's grasping at straws as usual for mesmer complaints but whatever, fine nerf it and still die to mirage because nothing's been done about the torment.

> > All those traits he complaint about increase duration/damage by bleeds and caused by owner attacks ,phantasms/illusions die in 1 hit and used as shatter fodder. Nothign to compare . Also chance to crit taken from mesmer himself ,fury on mesmer doenst affect clones ,with carrion its still 5% to crit. To have 50% chance for bleed you need alot of precision . Even with wizard you have ~30 % .

> > > Elusive mind - Don't power creep it, make it remove 1 condition on mirage cloak, no exhaustion, no stunbreak. It doesn't need to reduce deception skill cool downs.

> > Too weak , wouldnt be taken ever over IH .

> > > Confusing Images - yeah they kept buffing the power damage because mesmer has so few main hand weapons. It does too much damage now but at the same time it's a long channelled beam and clunky. Sure a 10-20% damage reduction might be in order but not the level of reduction you're asking.

> > Its rly strong skill but lets be real , 900 range and pretty slow casting laser... I dont care for future of this skill because scepter never been good weapon even after its buff.

> > > Illusionary counter is 6s CD... Though I didn't realise they'd reduced it as much as they did in PvP/WvW. Putting it back up to 8s is all that's needed.

> > BTW Once axe would be nerfed . Mirage would struggle to kill anyone with their cleanse spamming anyway

> > Also I like how he trying to 'nerf' ranger while every suggestion is a buff xDDDDDD

> > Perma moa stance with 100% share to allies . A better offensive version of rampage as one with a breakstun/stab/ low cd . When ppl wanted Timewarp to be 50% duration and 50% cut cd everyone been like ITS OP, NO NEED TO BUFF OPSMER!

> > Want to move 2 minor traits that alrdy good into 1 insane trait that will reduce recharge on pet swap,increase pet damage by 10%, movespeed and give ferocity bonus and make new trait ... like kitten? Its a nerf????????

> > He didnt even listed how dumb plasma and all this boons as 10s with 0% boon duration anywhere.

> > Buff my class to hell and nerf others.

> > Most not biased balance suggestions ! /sarcasm

> > At this point i'm glad they never listen to players when it comes to balance , even random buffs and nerfs are better than this

>

> Yeah I wrote a....scathing review of his changes to ranger earlier.

>

> I know sceptre is clunky and everything I do play it but there's no reason to keep confusing images as doing the ludicrous damage it does in power nor having cool downs so low. Bear in mind I advocate increasing cool downs fo a lot of skills across all classes to be more in line with how core was pre HoT. The power creep has not made the game more fun.

>

> I would 100% use elusive mind for the cleanse on power mes as I stated, look at my specific wording, whenevery you gain mirage cloak you cleanse a condition. Mirrors and iAmbush would each cleanse a condition each.

 

It got buffed because no one was using scepter. Barely anyone is using scepter now either.

[tinyreborn.1938]

> @"apharma.3741" said:

> > @"tinyreborn.1938" said:

> > > @"apharma.3741" said:

> > > Sharper Images, OK if it stops the crying change it to 33% chance on crit but keep the duration. However when comparing traits against other classes they get 20% increased bleed duration and a ton of ways to apply bleed outside the trait in large amounts and durations, core mesmer doesn't apply much bleed except on crit and random on staff, the duration isn't that long either. Sooo...it's grasping at straws as usual for mesmer complaints but whatever, fine nerf it and still die to mirage because nothing's been done about the torment.

> > All those traits he complaint about increase duration/damage by bleeds and caused by owner attacks ,phantasms/illusions die in 1 hit and used as shatter fodder. Nothign to compare . Also chance to crit taken from mesmer himself ,fury on mesmer doenst affect clones ,with carrion its still 5% to crit. To have 50% chance for bleed you need alot of precision . Even with wizard you have ~30 % .

> > > Elusive mind - Don't power creep it, make it remove 1 condition on mirage cloak, no exhaustion, no stunbreak. It doesn't need to reduce deception skill cool downs.

> > Too weak , wouldnt be taken ever over IH .

> > > Confusing Images - yeah they kept buffing the power damage because mesmer has so few main hand weapons. It does too much damage now but at the same time it's a long channelled beam and clunky. Sure a 10-20% damage reduction might be in order but not the level of reduction you're asking.

> > Its rly strong skill but lets be real , 900 range and pretty slow casting laser... I dont care for future of this skill because scepter never been good weapon even after its buff.

> > > Illusionary counter is 6s CD... Though I didn't realise they'd reduced it as much as they did in PvP/WvW. Putting it back up to 8s is all that's needed.

> > BTW Once axe would be nerfed . Mirage would struggle to kill anyone with their cleanse spamming anyway

> > Also I like how he trying to 'nerf' ranger while every suggestion is a buff xDDDDDD

> > Perma moa stance with 100% share to allies . A better offensive version of rampage as one with a breakstun/stab/ low cd . When ppl wanted Timewarp to be 50% duration and 50% cut cd everyone been like ITS OP, NO NEED TO BUFF OPSMER!

> > Want to move 2 minor traits that alrdy good into 1 insane trait that will reduce recharge on pet swap,increase pet damage by 10%, movespeed and give ferocity bonus and make new trait ... like kitten? Its a nerf????????

> > He didnt even listed how dumb plasma and all this boons as 10s with 0% boon duration anywhere.

> > Buff my class to hell and nerf others.

> > Most not biased balance suggestions ! /sarcasm

> > At this point i'm glad they never listen to players when it comes to balance , even random buffs and nerfs are better than this

>

> Yeah I wrote a....scathing review of his changes to ranger earlier.

>

> I know sceptre is clunky and everything I do play it but there's no reason to keep confusing images as doing the ludicrous damage it does in power nor having cool downs so low. Bear in mind I advocate increasing cool downs fo a lot of skills across all classes to be more in line with how core was pre HoT. The power creep has not made the game more fun.

>

> I would 100% use elusive mind for the cleanse on power mes as I stated, look at my specific wording, whenevery you gain mirage cloak you cleanse a condition. Mirrors and iAmbush would each cleanse a condition each.

 

To bring every POF spec in line with other they need to make HUGE nerfs on everything . Just an example is holosmith . Its reaper v3.0 that dont need lf/can use heal/utilities/elite and sustain himself and reduce heat with dodge spam ,hello permavigor/quickness etc.

About ranger by the way , just make any boon share trait give ranger only 1 stack of might, not all . in other words remove access to easy 25 might on top of other damage/survivability nerfs.

Pick your winner: lazynet are

A) Dont know how to balance

B)Dont want to balanace

C) Too busy with gemshop

[mortrialus.3062]

> @"tinyreborn.1938" said:

> > @"apharma.3741" said:

> > > @"tinyreborn.1938" said:

> > > > @"apharma.3741" said:

> > > > Sharper Images, OK if it stops the crying change it to 33% chance on crit but keep the duration. However when comparing traits against other classes they get 20% increased bleed duration and a ton of ways to apply bleed outside the trait in large amounts and durations, core mesmer doesn't apply much bleed except on crit and random on staff, the duration isn't that long either. Sooo...it's grasping at straws as usual for mesmer complaints but whatever, fine nerf it and still die to mirage because nothing's been done about the torment.

> > > All those traits he complaint about increase duration/damage by bleeds and caused by owner attacks ,phantasms/illusions die in 1 hit and used as shatter fodder. Nothign to compare . Also chance to crit taken from mesmer himself ,fury on mesmer doenst affect clones ,with carrion its still 5% to crit. To have 50% chance for bleed you need alot of precision . Even with wizard you have ~30 % .

> > > > Elusive mind - Don't power creep it, make it remove 1 condition on mirage cloak, no exhaustion, no stunbreak. It doesn't need to reduce deception skill cool downs.

> > > Too weak , wouldnt be taken ever over IH .

> > > > Confusing Images - yeah they kept buffing the power damage because mesmer has so few main hand weapons. It does too much damage now but at the same time it's a long channelled beam and clunky. Sure a 10-20% damage reduction might be in order but not the level of reduction you're asking.

> > > Its rly strong skill but lets be real , 900 range and pretty slow casting laser... I dont care for future of this skill because scepter never been good weapon even after its buff.

> > > > Illusionary counter is 6s CD... Though I didn't realise they'd reduced it as much as they did in PvP/WvW. Putting it back up to 8s is all that's needed.

> > > BTW Once axe would be nerfed . Mirage would struggle to kill anyone with their cleanse spamming anyway

> > > Also I like how he trying to 'nerf' ranger while every suggestion is a buff xDDDDDD

> > > Perma moa stance with 100% share to allies . A better offensive version of rampage as one with a breakstun/stab/ low cd . When ppl wanted Timewarp to be 50% duration and 50% cut cd everyone been like ITS OP, NO NEED TO BUFF OPSMER!

> > > Want to move 2 minor traits that alrdy good into 1 insane trait that will reduce recharge on pet swap,increase pet damage by 10%, movespeed and give ferocity bonus and make new trait ... like kitten? Its a nerf????????

> > > He didnt even listed how dumb plasma and all this boons as 10s with 0% boon duration anywhere.

> > > Buff my class to hell and nerf others.

> > > Most not biased balance suggestions ! /sarcasm

> > > At this point i'm glad they never listen to players when it comes to balance , even random buffs and nerfs are better than this

> >

> > Yeah I wrote a....scathing review of his changes to ranger earlier.

> >

> > I know sceptre is clunky and everything I do play it but there's no reason to keep confusing images as doing the ludicrous damage it does in power nor having cool downs so low. Bear in mind I advocate increasing cool downs fo a lot of skills across all classes to be more in line with how core was pre HoT. The power creep has not made the game more fun.

> >

> > I would 100% use elusive mind for the cleanse on power mes as I stated, look at my specific wording, whenevery you gain mirage cloak you cleanse a condition. Mirrors and iAmbush would each cleanse a condition each.

>

> To bring every POF spec in line with other they need to make HUGE nerfs on everything . Just an example is holosmith . Its reaper v3.0 that dont need lf/can use heal/utilities/elite and sustain himself and reduce heat with dodge spam ,hello permavigor/quickness etc.

> Pick your winner: lazynet are

> A) Dont know how to balance

> B)Dont want to balanace

> C) Too busy with gemshop

 

Holosmith's problem is more that it synergizes far too well with defensive trait lines (Specifically elixir) much more so than it straight powercreeps over scrapper. Scrapper has a wealth of defensive and supportive capabilities the way Holo has a wealth of offensive options. But combining holo with elixers creates a build that has both top tier offensive capabilities and defensive capabilities, completely muscling out Scrapper. A lot of the defensive options in elixir(And holosmith) should be rolled directly into scrapper, and while this will nerf core engineer capabilities, it is worth it for making both holo a slightly less mandatory build and scrapper a more attractive build.

 

Beyond the crazy top tier burst holo provides engineer through photon forge alone, the defensive capabilities of the two trees provide:

 

* Free Fury, Might, Swiftness, and Retaliation (Synergies with...)

* Free Vigor when they gain swiftness (This)

* Free automatic condition conversion into boons when they reach three conditions on them at once.

* Auto Elixir S 3 second Invuln which is always used with the Elixir S utility skill

* Free healing whenever they gain a boon

* Free 16% boon duration.

* 20% cooldown reduction on Elixir S and Lesser Elixir S

* 1-2X Condition Conversion into boons when they leave Photon Forge depending on heat threshold

* Healing upon heat loss.

* Stability and barrier on Photon Forge 3

* Dodge rolls proc healing if you haven't overheated

 

All available to a specialization that's supposed to be SOOOO high risk high reward it's supposed to be in danger of blowing itself up (Which won't happen if you're remotely paying attention lol) for massive damage for how high reward photon forge is. A lot of that should be rolled into Scrapper and the holo defensive options should just be eliminated and changed and holo should be forced into a more high risk high reward spec akin to a revenant or power mesmer. There's just too much free healing, free condition cleanse, free boons, and free healing on boons for holo at this point. It's just too much. And this doesn't even cover their double vigor regeneration with the tools tree they're always taking. It's just too much.

 

> @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> @"Jaka.3182"

>

> I play multiple ranger builds on stream mon-thurs starting at 5pm est. One of those builds is core glass ranger.

>

> If you're interested in learning more about the class, feel free to ask as many questions as you want or stop by to check out the gameplay. ^-^

>

>

 

I've been meaning to ask but which is the VoD where I killed you and called you Shadow Pass Gas as I stomped you? I've been hoping to clip that.

[Ryan.9387]

Fortifying bond to beastmastery would be a soulbeasts dream. We can take traited heal as one + fortifying bond for another boon copy.

 

20s->16s on the proc of revenant runes. Extra 3s of resistance per 16s.

 

Then ranger can merge with 25might/quickness and get all the bm passive stats for their burst. Also gives us taunt on demand or another quickness source. Super op.

[Silinsar.6298]

> @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> #### Engineer

>

> [**Kinetic Battery**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Kinetic_Battery)

>

> - **Problem**: Gives Holosmith 7 seconds of quickness every 7 seconds (100% uptime).

> - **Solution**: Reduce Quickness and Superspeed duration to 3 seconds and add an internal cooldown of 12 seconds (25% uptime).

 

No. First you seem to take 40% boon duration for granted, which isn't the case for every setup and takes additional investment somewhere else. Then, even if you run Both rifle turret and photon wall in combination with healing turret and another 20-30sec TB you basically have to spam everything on CD and always enter and leave photon forge as soon as possible. With such a setup it's possible, but not really practical. Better to get less quickness and use your skills better.

The problem with this trait on holo is actually that both PF (enter and leave) count as TB skill. Which makes holo amazingly apt at triggering kinetic battery compared to other specs. The solution would be to make either enter or leave pf not count as a TB skill, nerfing the frequency in which holo can proc it without making it totally underwhelming for core and scrapper.

Also, I think it's strange to say the quickness is the problem and then suggest to not only cut that down by 3/4 (using your numbers) but also nerf the super speed into the ground.

 

> @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> [**Lock On**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Lock_On)

>

> - **Problem**: This trait can reveal someone for 12 seconds every 25 seconds (50% uptime). Hitting a stealthed foe triggers [invisible Analysis](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Invisible_Analysis), but disabling a foe triggers [Controlled Analysis](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Controlled_Analysis). These are 2 entirely different skills that do the exact same thing but share separate cooldowns.

> - **Solution**: Remove the double proc and change them to [Analyze](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Analyze). This means the trait will function properly and only reveals someone for 6 seconds every 25 seconds (24% uptime).

 

Lock on is basically a band-aid counter for builds that have too much access to stealth, so as long stealth gets toned downed too a nerf's fine. I don't quite get the wording of the solution, the trait already pretty much does what Analyze does. Just say you want the procs to share the CD.

 

> @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> [**Power Wrench**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Power_Wrench)

>

> - **Problem**: 3 seconds of cooldown reduction on your elite skill every time you dodge is WAY too strong. With Vigor, players can dodge once every 7 seconds. If you do the math for a traited [Elixir X](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Elixir_X) (60 - 60 / 7 * 3), it goes on a 34 second cooldown. For [Prime Light Beam](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Prime_Light_Beam) (75 - 75 / 7 * 3), it goes on a 42 second cooldown.

> - **Solution**: Reduce the cooldown reduction on dodge to 1 second. For [Elixir X](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Elixir_X) (60 - 60 / 7 * 1), it goes on a 51 second cooldown. For [Prime Light Beam](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Prime_Light_Beam) (75 - 75 / 7 * 1), it goes on a 64 second cooldown.

 

If you just spam dodge any time you can the 34 elite CD won't help you because you'll be dead before that. Tbh, I don't know why the trait even got this functionality (even builds without tool kit use it now, and it was basically meant to be a tool kit trait). So I wouldn't mind seeing it removed and replaced with something that better works with tool kit.

 

> @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> [**Photon Forge Autos**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Light_Strike)

>

> - **Problem**: The range on these auto attacks (240) are nearly [double the range](https://imgur.com/a/C7gXAJT) of other melee attacks (130 for 1-handed, 150 for 2-handed).

> - **Solution**: Reduce the range on the autos to 150 to be in-line with other melee skills.

 

I'd say 170/170/220 to match reaper's melee mode would fit.

 

> @"shadowpass.4236" said:

> [**Holo Leap**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Holo_Leap)

>

> - **Problem**: 2 second cooldown, 600 range, 1000 base damage leap. This is essentially a 1200 range movement skill on a 4 second cooldown that can critically hit you for 6000+ damage (3000+ per hit).

> - **Solution**: Increase the cooldown to 4 seconds. This makes it a bit easier to kite a Holo, lowers the overall dps, but still allows them to maintain permanent swiftness.

 

The range of the leap plus the attack is 600, the leap itself is shorter. The distance gained compared to someone running is actually not that much due to the short animation locks where you don't move at the start and end of the skill. Distance gained is comparable to about 1-1,5sec super speed. Saying that it's a 1200 range movement every 4sec is vastly exaggerated. And yeah, it does some damage, but not something auto attacks wouldn't do in the mean time.

I can see an argument for an increased CD only if the actual jump distance is increased too.

 

> [**Corona Burst**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Corona_Burst)

>

> - **Problem**: Requires 2 dodges to avoid giving the Holo stab when traited with [Crystal Configuration: Eclipse](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Crystal_Configuration:_Eclipse) and gives the holo permanent stability due to the 1.5 second delay between pulses. With one pulse, the uptime on stab is 88% (5.25/6). However, the double pulse causes the downtime between stab to be nearly nonexistent (less than a quarter of a second).

> - **Solution**: Move both stacks of stability to the initial hit and increase the cooldown to 8 seconds (65% uptime on stab).

 

It doesn't require two dodges, it just requires any form of kiting, soft or hard CC on an enemy that's probably locked into leap animations during which he can't even dodge while closing in. And again you're taking up to 50% boon duration for granted. Even then it's not a permanent stability because a Holo won't be able to hit everytime and be in melee and in photon forge 24/7. I think the conditional stab application for an engi forced into melee is fitting and offers enough counter play, what should be cut down is the damage amplification due to vuln+might and maybe the barrier gain.

 

> [**Holographic Shockwave**](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Holographic_Shockwave)

>

> - **Problem**: The range on this skill is [ridiculously far](https://imgur.com/a/rAOuXGE). Currently, if you stand in the center of Legacy Mid and use this skill, you will hit every single person on the point.

> - **Solution**: Reduce the range to 300 to match [Corona Burst’s range](https://imgur.com/a/3Kz3mrd).

 

It has 600 range. The range's the same as every other skill with 600 range, why suddenly base a nerf not on numbers but on the subjective impression ("ridiculously far") of the skill's range? It hitting people on a point is a complaint about the area covered, which does not necessarily have to be nerfed by cutting the range.

Anyway, as I said somewhere else, imo the visualization of the skill's the issue. Unlike fields you just don't know exactly where it ends which can make attempts to counter it by moving frustrating.

As for the area covered: I'd suggest making it a 180° cone instead of a 360° skill. If you want to stick to a range nerf I'd make it an instant impact in return.

 

[Bazsi.2734]

Wow you sure like to shoot at sparrows with a cannon.

 

Ranger changes - well maybe...

Holosmith changes - some shaves are needed, but this is absolutely overkill.

Mirage changes - on top of removing the cheese of dodgeing while stunned (without EM), you want to remove the condi specs ability to do condi damage.

Warrior changes - meh... maybe?

Thief changes - another nerf to S/D, seriously? The build is already unable to duel/contest/do even teamfights, but that's still not enough, lets take away some more damage from the decap-bot! And just for good measure, also smitersbooning rifle on DE.

 

You should aim for balance, not nuking metabuilds into oblivion. Just for example, Revenant and reaper have absurd power burst&pressure. If the six classes you mentioned are toned down even half as much as you mentioned, these two cant stay untouched either, unless you want a meta where these two reign supreme.

 

You do well with identifying whats too strong at the moment, but your suggested solutions are to hiroshima the nagasaki out of everything thats slightly overperforming.