mortrialus.3062 Posted December 11, 2018 Share Posted December 11, 2018 > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > *Puts newspaper down for patch notes* > > > > > > So the main issue of condition oriented mirage builds melting things they run into was not addressed, but instead power oriented mesmer builds were gutted and portal was nerfed so mirages are even less mobile and thus prone to lean into the duelist build even more? > > > > > > And, to balance this, everything that could stall them out as duelists have been also nerfed? > > > > > > *Chuckles, pulls newspaper back up, sighing* _okayyy~_ > > > > The only builds getting melted by condi mirage are the three main necro builds, revs, and sick em yolo soulbeast builds and gs mesmers or garbage nonmeta specs. Core guard, firebrand, holosmith, boonbeast, spell breaker, thief and even sd weavers have the cleanses to put up a decent fight with odds varying across the board or at least stall out indefinitely. > > Realized this and adjusted my wording, but you grabbed my original post. > Still not very confident in the patch. And they hit portal to boot. > Portal nerf for mesmer and Dolyak stance buff for Boonbeast are the saltiest I think I've ever gotten about balance changes in six years of this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alatar.7364 Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 > @"Solori.6025" said: > > @"Alatar.7364" said: > > > @"Solori.6025" said: > > > > @"Alatar.7364" said: > > > > > @"Solori.6025" said: > > > > > > @"Alatar.7364" said: > > > > > > I am usually the first in line to raise a pitchfork on Mirages, but the fact is they **did** get nerfed this patch. > > > > > > > > > > > > On the other hand the true issue of seemingly infinite condi application was not touched at all, but the Axe#2 nerf definitely helps a little bit with that. (even though...2 secs...meh) > > > > > > > > > > Condi duration for condi mes also got nerfed. > > > > > > > > It did? > > > > Sorry I didn't exactly recheck the Update list after first reading. > > > > Would you post for me the change, literally can't look it up now irl. > > > > > > Signet of Midnight: This signet's passive effect now grants 180 expertise at level 80 instead of a flat condition duration in order to be consistent with other signet effects. > > > > > > ^This happened. > > > You should notice a higher drop off of condis now unless the mesmer invest in expertise then it will be roughly the same duration, but the mesmer will be a bit squishier > > > Gone are the days of speccing condi damage and having duration covered by utilities. > > > This means the Axe and jaunt nerfs are going to be a little more significant than people actually think > > > > With this change, it loses 5% from its original Duration. > > While undoubtedly a nerf, is 5% going to make literally **any** diference? > > hmm ... > Signet of Midnight gave a flat duration of 20%.. > Now in-game it's 12% > So 8% shave > We'll see? If the mobility nerfs , axe power damage nerfs, and buffing of soulbeast don't kill the spec, I'm sure people will be back with pitchforks. Ah, yeah 8%! No idea where did I get 5% since I even had to look up the Expertise/ Percentage ration before I wrote that post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jportell.2197 Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 > @"Chilli.2976" said: > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > Portal getting nerfed is the single most brutal nerf this entire patch. > > I suggested the 30s CD about 3 years ago, happy to see it finally done. Now portal is damn near worthless. Especially with a nearly 45s CD if you don't use it. And given what ranked is most of the time their wont be chances to use it anymore. This game is such a dumpster fire. I remember when they increased portal CD to 90s. Mesmer was out of the meta for nearly two years until HOT when they did that. ANet clearly has no clue how to balance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apharma.3741 Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > *Puts newspaper down for patch notes* > > > > > > So the main issue of condition oriented mirage builds melting things they run into was not addressed, but instead power oriented mesmer builds were gutted and portal was nerfed so mirages are even less mobile and thus prone to lean into the duelist build even more? > > > > > > And, to balance this, everything that could stall them out as duelists have been also nerfed? > > > > > > *Chuckles, pulls newspaper back up, sighing* _okayyy~_ > > > > The only builds getting melted by condi mirage are the three main necro builds, revs, and sick em yolo soulbeast builds and gs mesmers or garbage nonmeta specs. Core guard, firebrand, holosmith, boonbeast, spell breaker, thief and even sd weavers have the cleanses to put up a decent fight with odds varying across the board or at least stall out indefinitely. > > Realized this and adjusted my wording, but you grabbed my original post. > Still not very confident in the patch. And they hit portal to boot. > I guess now people will have to stop complaining about portal right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortrialus.3062 Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 > @"jportell.2197" said: > > @"Chilli.2976" said: > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > Portal getting nerfed is the single most brutal nerf this entire patch. > > > > I suggested the 30s CD about 3 years ago, happy to see it finally done. > > Now portal is kitten near worthless. Especially with a nearly 45s CD if you don't use it. And given what ranked is most of the time their wont be chances to use it anymore. This game is such a dumpster fire. I remember when they increased portal CD to 90s. Mesmer was out of the meta for nearly two years until HOT when they did that. ANet clearly has no clue how to balance. To put this into perspective, if you drop portal on Waterfall and then run towards mid, with base movement speed by the time you reach mid that's 15 seconds. That's half of your time to portal back gone. Right there. It's worthless. Smiter's Booned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kin korn karn.9023 Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 I didn't think Condi Mirage was much of a problem even before patch. Probably the most overrated build, based on all the whiners here in this forum anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FyzE.3472 Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Agreed. Still not enough of a nerf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UfoCoffee.2084 Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 They are still an utter joke. I was actually dueling a friend recently to see how long he could stay invulnerable whilst still doing damage. It was just ridiculous. Such bad class design. It's like god mode. Do damage whilst immune to damage and unstunnable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteepledHat.1345 Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 No nerf will ever be enough for you lot. Literally demolished mesmer and the complaints continue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apharma.3741 Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 > @"SteepledHat.1345" said: > No nerf will ever be enough for you lot. Literally demolished mesmer and the complaints continue. The problem is it demolished mesmer in every way that didn't really affect the current condi build. The current meta build saw barely any drop in effectiveness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteepledHat.1345 Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 The portal destruction is a massive reduction in capabilities. Probably the biggest nerf to mesmer ever. Condi mesmer has tons of counters especially with boonbeast about to see even more play after its "nerf." Just about anything with solid cleave and condi cleanse checks condi mes. It's lost its only real utility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DedalNort.3627 Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 Still OP so let's wait for another patch and nerfs to power mirage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rowdy.5107 Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 "Durr I cant kill a Mesmer because I don't learn how to play so you need to nerf it and dumb it down to my level so I don't die from it anymore and cry" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rizigmar.2681 Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 > @"rowdy.5107" said: > "Durr I cant kill a Mesmer because I don't learn how to play so you need to nerf it and dumb it down to my level so I don't die from it anymore and cry" > Hilariously enough Mirage is dumbed down 'a lot' compared to how you used to play it before the phantasm rework , now a days it's a class monkeys play that rewards bad gameplay. Edit: Mostly condi mirage, power isn't so bad but still pretty obnoxious if you face a good one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Ketsu.4569 Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 Problem: Class has "Ability X" which is overpowered and lacks counterplay which makes the class not fun to deal with. Anet Balance team: Nerf Abilities W, Y, and Z for the class. Buff Ability X. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solori.6025 Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 > @"Rizigmar.2681" said: > > @"rowdy.5107" said: > > "Durr I cant kill a Mesmer because I don't learn how to play so you need to nerf it and dumb it down to my level so I don't die from it anymore and cry" > > > > Hilariously enough Mirage is dumbed down 'a lot' compared to how you used to play it before the phantasm rework , now a days it's a class monkeys play that rewards bad gameplay. > > Edit: Mostly condi mirage, power isn't so bad but still pretty obnoxious if you face a good one. > > > > If that were the case then it would be present much more in higher teirs of the game. In reality that isn't the case. Mirage is noob stomper, found in the lowest brackets of SPvP and severely falls apart when put up against competent players. Condi-mirage is still an issue, as I have said before - Conditions should never be burst. On ANY class ( so necro,thief,mesmer, etc. ) it shouldn't exist. Arena-Net unfortunately doesn't seem to realize this and takes balancing suggestions from the people stuck in silver tier skill clicking abilities. I would love if they actually had a testing server and **actually** listened to the people that play the class and not just list abilities from the wiki and pretend to know how things function ( cause EM would never have launched if they listened to the mesmer mains that said it was a bad idea) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axl.8924 Posted December 15, 2018 Share Posted December 15, 2018 > @"will de grijze jager.6594" said: > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > @"will de grijze jager.6594" said: > > > > @"Solori.6025" said: > > > > Make a boonbeast? Ranger has the best 1v1 specs in the game you shouldnt have an issue. > > > > > > Mate 1 of the best rangers that is streaming even have fought with a common condi mirage and he had no chance after the nerfs. Condi mesmer din't get nerfed almost. Don't forget nerf to an other class is also a buff for yours. > > > > Boonbeast hard counters condi mirage. Especially with boonbeast buffed to have access to double protection against both power and condition damage this patch, for some insane reason. If they're losing to condi mirage, they are not a good reanger. > > Mate the guys is known to be 1 of the top players and evne Helseth says that Condi mirage is broken even playing against there counters, but i din't expect less from a mesmer main to defend the broken condi mirage. Mirages got hit by the nerf bat already, what do you want? for them stand still and die? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JusticeRetroHunter.7684 Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 > @"Axl.8924" said: > > @"will de grijze jager.6594" said: > > > @"mortrialus.3062" said: > > > > @"will de grijze jager.6594" said: > > > > > @"Solori.6025" said: > > > > > Make a boonbeast? Ranger has the best 1v1 specs in the game you shouldnt have an issue. > > > > > > > > Mate 1 of the best rangers that is streaming even have fought with a common condi mirage and he had no chance after the nerfs. Condi mesmer din't get nerfed almost. Don't forget nerf to an other class is also a buff for yours. > > > > > > Boonbeast hard counters condi mirage. Especially with boonbeast buffed to have access to double protection against both power and condition damage this patch, for some insane reason. If they're losing to condi mirage, they are not a good reanger. > > > > Mate the guys is known to be 1 of the top players and evne Helseth says that Condi mirage is broken even playing against there counters, but i din't expect less from a mesmer main to defend the broken condi mirage. > > Mirages got hit by the nerf bat already, what do you want? for them stand still and die? > Uhhh ya? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnfall.9573 Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 Power Mesmer damages are outrageous at the moment. So in other word; > @"DedalNort.3627" said: > Still OP so let's wait for another patch and nerfs to power mirage. +1 I was about to create a thread about this Build included in video Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phokus.8934 Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 > @"Burnfall.9573" said: > Power Mesmer damages are outrageous at the moment. So in other word; > @"DedalNort.3627" said: > > Still OP so let's wait for another patch and nerfs to power mirage. > > +1 > I was about to create a thread about this > > Build included in video > > The music alone adds +10k to Mesmer DPS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crius.5487 Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 There's only two nerfs to mirage from the last patch that affect mirage in the current meta. The first is the physical damage reduction on axe #3 however this ability isn't used for physical damage but for confusion application and an evade frame so the physical damage reduction has very little impact. The biggest change is the portal duration. Portal was used for mobility but due to the changes it's ineffective to run portal. What happened is mesmers now have three utility skills to fight with instead of two. The portal nerf actually buffed mesmers in 1v1's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EpicTurtle.8571 Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 > @"Burnfall.9573" said: > Power Mesmer damages are outrageous at the moment. So in other word; > @"DedalNort.3627" said: > > Still OP so let's wait for another patch and nerfs to power mirage. > > +1 > I was about to create a thread about this > > Build included in video > > You linked a PvE test golem video. On the sPvP subforum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lincolnbeard.1735 Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 > @"Burnfall.9573" said: > Power Mesmer damages are outrageous at the moment. So in other word; > @"DedalNort.3627" said: > > Still OP so let's wait for another patch and nerfs to power mirage. > > +1 > I was about to create a thread about this > > Build included in video > > Power mesmer has awful sustain damage. Dodge the burst and you've won. But of course it's easier to let ANet play for you and they're doing a wonderful job at it, every single patch hits power mesmer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arekai.5698 Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 Î wish they'd buff power mes enough to make it viable. It's so much more fun than condi mesmer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vieux P.1238 Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 Yeah git rid of Condi mirage & also power shatter while your at it. Mez players can have what's left.. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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