More than half of the Revenant class not worth playing

[pah.4931]

> @"Odik.4587" said:

> > @"pah.4931" said:

> > The best way to make Revenant interesting and unique is to make your primary stats chance when you change legendaries. There is no synergy between legendaries (other than shiro and glint) because you kitten yourself too much with your gear/amulet to try to make both work--especially in a "zerker" all or nothing meta (both PvE and PvP, to be honest). Imagine if you could swap to centaur and your stat distribution shifted to make you better support, or you swap to demon and your stat distribution shifted o make you do condi damage.

> Inb4 everyone bandwagon so crazy OP revenant that suddenly on brink of death swap to bunker and start to puke heals/cleanses everywhere and support their team and then suddenly swap to DPS legend to kick everyone butts eksdee.

> Idea itself is good and I like it but would be too OP ?

> May be if it would be like : you lose 300 stats(play with numbers yourself to acceptable level) from somewhere in exchange for another 300 stats(see before) depending on your legend but not too much to not create some monster :bleep_bloop:

 

I agree, it would have to be done carefully and there should be SOME drawbacks to balance it out (which is why it will never happen). But it's no surprise that Shiro/Glint are the only ones that really work -- best movement and utility options (paired with s/s for most damage and staff for more movement/utility).

[Ario.8964]

> @"pah.4931" said:

> > @"Odik.4587" said:

> > > @"pah.4931" said:

> > > The best way to make Revenant interesting and unique is to make your primary stats chance when you change legendaries. There is no synergy between legendaries (other than shiro and glint) because you kitten yourself too much with your gear/amulet to try to make both work--especially in a "zerker" all or nothing meta (both PvE and PvP, to be honest). Imagine if you could swap to centaur and your stat distribution shifted to make you better support, or you swap to demon and your stat distribution shifted o make you do condi damage.

> > Inb4 everyone bandwagon so crazy OP revenant that suddenly on brink of death swap to bunker and start to puke heals/cleanses everywhere and support their team and then suddenly swap to DPS legend to kick everyone butts eksdee.

> > Idea itself is good and I like it but would be too OP ?

> > May be if it would be like : you lose 300 stats(play with numbers yourself to acceptable level) from somewhere in exchange for another 300 stats(see before) depending on your legend but not too much to not create some monster :bleep_bloop:

>

> I agree, it would have to be done carefully and there should be SOME drawbacks to balance it out (which is why it will never happen). But it's no surprise that Shiro/Glint are the only ones that really work -- best movement and utility options (paired with s/s for most damage and staff for more movement/utility).

 

Glint is also the only legend with a reliable safety net (glint heal). All the other legends (excluding shiro since the stunbreak is an evade and gap opener) are incredibly susceptible to heavy burst and cc if you miss a dodge. Glint allows you to cover a mistake or to use it against a burst in order to turn the fight into your favor, shiro lets you escape the burst, the other legends just have you stand there casting the skill that was your stunbreak and eat the burst anyways or are unable to effectively recover after taking such bursts. When rev sustain nowadays is balanced around the presence of glint heal and all the dmg is loaded onto 2 OH wep skills, it's no wonder no other revs builds are consistently viable at high levels. I'm not saying add safety nets into the other legends and make rev unkillable, I'm just saying maybe the stunbreaks or defensive skills in the other legends need a bit of tweaking before we talk about stat changes and other things.

[Sampson.2403]

I just finished playing over 200 ranked games as Rev and i am starting to wonder if this class is more busted than mirage tbh.

 

Not complaining though!

[Vancho.8750]

It is funny cause no one seems to notice that Jalis got buffed a lot when scourge was spreading the plague. Also i see people wanting to be duelist speck like war or ranger but at the same time take Shiro which fills the thief +1 role.

[Ario.8964]

> @"Sampson.2403" said:

> I just finished playing over 200 ranked games as Rev and i am starting to wonder if this class is more busted than mirage tbh.

>

> Not complaining though!

 

OH sword is busted and is the only reason rev is in the place it is right now. It should never have been reworked to function the way it does now and it certainly should never have had that much damage put onto it. Nerfing that damage is a good step to take, but rev will need compensation or you will see it disappear again because it will have no hard damage carry and no sustain/condi clear.

[Master Ketsu.4569]

> @"Ario.8964" said:

> > @"Sampson.2403" said:

> > I just finished playing over 200 ranked games as Rev and i am starting to wonder if this class is more busted than mirage tbh.

> >

> > Not complaining though!

>

> OH sword is busted and is the only reason rev is in the place it is right now. It should never have been reworked to function the way it does now and it certainly should never have had that much damage put onto it. Nerfing that damage is a good step to take, but rev will need compensation or you will see it disappear again because it will have no hard damage carry and no sustain/condi clear.

 

As has been said many times, the easiest way would be reverting sword 4 back to duelist prep but leaving sword 5 as new.

[torben.1532]

Old sword 4 was a shit skill that didn’t work properly in 4 out of 5 cases

[Halikus.1406]

> @"Milan.9035" said:

> Rev has one good strong buildand nothing else even viable. For non rev mains this is fine. For revs its it's boring.

>

> Imgine if anet nerfed core guard amd dragin hunter so they would not even be viable at all. Would you be ok with that being only able to play support firebrand.

>

> Revs dont want herald buffed we just want other options.

 

Exactly what this guy said.

 

Rev mains have been playing the same build, with few changes over the course of time, for YEARS. I'm sick of playing shiro/glint, don't get me wrong it's a great build, but I want something different for once.

 

We had high hopes for the new legend in pof release but we all know how that turned out right? So we are back to playing.... guess what? SHIRO / GLINT again...

 

Since HoT!!!

I don't want a buff

I don't want an OP build to play, herald is not op, oh-sword is.

-----------> I want VARIETY. <---------

 

That's all.

/rant

[Snellibee.2761]

Revert cast nerf on sword 4, nerf damage on sword 4, buff shield, give rev more viable builds

[torben.1532]

Honestly there is no other option than herald. Renegade is the worst possible Playstyle one could think of for pvp and core revenant is just garbage

[Ario.8964]

> @"Master Ketsu.4569" said:

> > @"Ario.8964" said:

> > > @"Sampson.2403" said:

> > > I just finished playing over 200 ranked games as Rev and i am starting to wonder if this class is more busted than mirage tbh.

> > >

> > > Not complaining though!

> >

> > OH sword is busted and is the only reason rev is in the place it is right now. It should never have been reworked to function the way it does now and it certainly should never have had that much damage put onto it. Nerfing that damage is a good step to take, but rev will need compensation or you will see it disappear again because it will have no hard damage carry and no sustain/condi clear.

>

> As has been said many times, the easiest way would be reverting sword 4 back to duelist prep but leaving sword 5 as new.

 

Didn't want to list specific changes but that's where I was going with that too. Duelist prep was a really nice defensive skill and I enjoyed having it on sword, not sure why they ever took it off.

 

Edit: Out of curiosity, what would you think if they changed sword 5 to a pull skill like guard's spear of justice? It would pulse like siphon and cripple or something and then when you pulled you would deliver the deathstrike attack. It would change the style of running OH sword to a more duelist and "isolate and enemy from their team, then destroy them" style while leaving axe for the "port in and damage" style. Probably unnecessary but to me it sounded like an interesting idea when you look at how that version of OH sword could be used effectively for something like renegade or core rev who don't always want to jump in head first into a fight and may open up an isolate and destroy approach, especially if deathstrike can maintain most of it's dmg.

[Sampson.2403]

I really like sword 5 the way it is now. In fact, sword 5 and phase traverse are the main reasons that i enjoy playing Rev. Taking either of those away would completely change the playstyle.

[Arkantos.7460]

omg if rev could choose their utilities , that would be great

[meri.9187]

Rev in pvp would be unplayable if not for offhand sword's ridiculous damage, the days of it being a flexible class and being able to run axe or shield, invo, ret, or condi, are long gone. We're left with a one trick build, what OP's saying has merit.

[pah.4931]

Anyone who thinks changes to sword OH making more builds viable in PvP are cray-cray. That will just make the one build that is good no longer playable. Right now rev is a great +1 because it can melt peeps with damage. Without extensive changes, it won't be able to duel like other profs or team fight like other profs.

 

Your best bet would be to hope for some centaur/dwarf synergy to make a some sort of support build that could compete with FB (again, with extensive changes). Leave the roamer alone!

[Ario.8964]

> @"pah.4931" said:

> Anyone who thinks changes to sword OH making more builds viable in PvP are cray-cray. That will just make the one build that is good no longer playable. Right now rev is a great +1 because it can melt peeps with damage. Without extensive changes, it won't be able to duel like other profs or team fight like other profs.

>

> Your best bet would be to hope for some centaur/dwarf synergy to make a some sort of support build that could compete with FB (again, with extensive changes). Leave the roamer alone!

 

Why leave something alone when it's entire functionality is carried by 2 skills? I'd rather nerf the overperforming stuff and buff things that need better performance ability and functionality so that more of rev is usable and impactful. I don't know about you, but it ticks me off when every class outside of mine can have multiple working builds and skills that are actually effective. I don't want to lose the roamer, but I want the roamer to be more than a 2 button class.

[xLiFToFF.5938]

> @"Tyga.7056" said:

> The current Revenant build is alright. It's a good build to play with, has a high skill cap, but a bit too much dps. There is actually nothing they need to change on the traits or weapons, its basically only the dps that is too high. And build diversity is always a bit hard to manage. All you guys do is talking about Solo or DuoQ, but thats actually not the original purpose conquest has. It's a 5 man game mode and I'm 100% sure that a proper 5v5 team has still a lot of room to theorycraft, the problem is: no one is doing that, so the chance to get to play a different rev build or having build diversity in general is dead atm.

 

this was the most idiotic post I ever seen. So nerf the dps but keep the skill cap high? Whereas I can get on my reaper and rub my face across and the keyboard and profit lol?

 

Better yet lets talk pistol mesmer lol

[BlackTruth.6813]

Dwarf + Ventari core bunker rev could be a thing but like it's not better than Guardian/Fire Brand bunker. And shiro + glint just flat out carries harder. Maybe Dwarf + Ventari is a spec that's just flat out meant for PvE.

 

Tho yeah, shiro + glint is too good to not have. Would be nice to see a viable chain CC rev build for once

[pah.4931]

> @"Ario.8964" said:

> > @"pah.4931" said:

> > Anyone who thinks changes to sword OH making more builds viable in PvP are cray-cray. That will just make the one build that is good no longer playable. Right now rev is a great +1 because it can melt peeps with damage. Without extensive changes, it won't be able to duel like other profs or team fight like other profs.

> >

> > Your best bet would be to hope for some centaur/dwarf synergy to make a some sort of support build that could compete with FB (again, with extensive changes). Leave the roamer alone!

>

> Why leave something alone when it's entire functionality is carried by 2 skills? I'd rather nerf the overperforming stuff and buff things that need better performance ability and functionality so that more of rev is usable and impactful. I don't know about you, but it ticks me off when every class outside of mine can have multiple working builds and skills that are actually effective. I don't want to lose the roamer, but I want the roamer to be more than a 2 button class.

 

That's why I said "without extensive changes" ... but there a few people in this thread asking for Sword OH nerfs/reversions without offering ideas for what rev would get to compensate. But if you think you Anet isn't making dwarf or ventari more viable because sword 4 is too strong, then I got nothing.

 

PvP is a complex ecosystem. It's not always that simple.

[DomHemingway.8436]

Sword 4 does not affect other legends. Mace and Axe this is trash. Spear and trident much better it's funny.

Healing skill herald-facet of light gives you the ability to survive AoE and herald - boon spam. As a result, if we take dwarf stance and ventari stance. We become very slow, lose the ability to survive in AoE and also we have only 2 boon-alacrity and stability(Inspiring reinforcement is a trash, water version of this spell is better because it is a sphere). IMHO the problem core rev is the absence boon spam. That's why power shiro works so well. In the Herald Boone spam for themselves and allies. In assassins additional boon spam for yourself. They complement each other for acceleration. The same should be with the support. Switching to Ventari stance should be given some boon bonuses. In order not to lose acceleration (rev style). The same can be attributed to dwarf stance and mallyx stance.

Anet released the renegade, but has not yet made changes to core rev(without affecting power shiro). If given the opportunity to combine renegade + herald for the test. I think the renegade would have a different reputation.

[apharma.3741]

> @"Tataienstein.7581" said:

> > @"everyman.4375" said:

> > > @"JayAction.9056" said:

> > > Let’s be real. PvP is endgame in gw2.

> >

> > ?

> Exatcly what i was thinking. Plus rev is one of the best PvP and WvW class.

> Op have a point tho, not all legend are worth and balance would be fun.

>

 

Yes I must say the OP (well known rev main and we all know what those are like) seems to not realise in WvW you can play romaer with shiro/glint, hammer rev and 100-0 anyone not tanky same legends, Jalis/Glint, Mallyx/Glint in hammer situations, then there's a few condi revs I've seen breaking out with the tormenting rune changes which do good pressure when supported. In PvP there's a weird condi/hybrid build being played more and more too.

 

Yeah renegade is lacklustre compared to other PoF classes and current insane damage rev, Ventari is clunky too but rev is by no means alone in having 50% or more of it's utility skills (read legends) situational at best if not almost unviable. One of the biggest issues with rev is the mantra of "If it's dead it can't hurt me" and with so much damage in invo/devastation there's no reason to run defensive lines like salvation or retri most of the time and herald gives so much too it's hard for anything to live up without becoming overtuned.

[ArthurDent.9538]

Are people still seriously complaining about sword 4 damage? It's a 2.25 power coefficient on around a 1 second cast time which is actually quite weak damage to cast time ratio for any burst skill on any class. That cast time is closing in on gravedigger levels which hits 33% harder and roughly half the cooldown but no one in their right mind complains about grave digger and they shouldn't, because the skill is easy to avoid just like sword 4 is now. I swear some people won't be happy until rev is the lowest power damage class in the game with the lowest burst, oh wait it already is just ask any pve hero.

[Math.5123]

> @"ArthurDent.9538" said:

> Are people still seriously complaining about sword 4 damage? It's a 2.25 power coefficient on around a 1 second cast time which is actually quite weak damage to cast time ratio for any burst skill on any class. That cast time is closing in on gravedigger levels which hits 33% harder and roughly half the cooldown but no one in their right mind complains about grave digger and they shouldn't, because the skill is easy to avoid just like sword 4 is now. I swear some people won't be happy until rev is the lowest power damage class in the game with the lowest burst, oh wait it already is just ask any pve hero.

 

Pve =/= PvP. Would you say power mesmer has low damage? It does in PvE. What about reaper? It's damage is also pitiful. While the trash specs DH and berserker are reigning supreme because of their high dps and utility.

 

Don't forget about renegade being a top tier build. What works in PvE and PvP are generally not the same, so you can't really compare them.

 

Also, you're forgetting to mention that Shackling Wave has some range attached to it, revs also has on demand quickness. Something reapers (outside shroud) does not.

[witcher.3197]

> @"BlackTruth.6813" said:

> Dwarf + Ventari core bunker rev could be a thing but like it's not better than Guardian/Fire Brand bunker. And shiro + glint just flat out carries harder. Maybe Dwarf + Ventari is a spec that's just flat out meant for PvE.

>

> Tho yeah, shiro + glint is too good to not have. Would be nice to see a viable chain CC rev build for once

 

No, that sounds like a garbage spec to play. And what would you even use for offhand weapon? We got staff as a defensive one, then sword as the only main hand candidate, and what else? Only offensive weapons for offhand unless we go Herald and if we go herald then there is no reason not to play Glint. Dwarf is dogshit.

[JayAction.9056]

> @"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

> > @"ArthurDent.9538" said:

> > Are people still seriously complaining about sword 4 damage? It's a 2.25 power coefficient on around a 1 second cast time which is actually quite weak damage to cast time ratio for any burst skill on any class. That cast time is closing in on gravedigger levels which hits 33% harder and roughly half the cooldown but no one in their right mind complains about grave digger and they shouldn't, because the skill is easy to avoid just like sword 4 is now. I swear some people won't be happy until rev is the lowest power damage class in the game with the lowest burst, oh wait it already is just ask any pve hero.

>

> Pve =/= PvP. Would you say power mesmer has low damage? It does in PvE. What about reaper? It's damage is also pitiful. While the trash specs DH and berserker are reigning supreme because of their high dps and utility.

>

> Don't forget about renegade being a top tier build. What works in PvE and PvP are generally not the same, so you can't really compare them.

>

> Also, you're forgetting to mention that Shackling Wave has some range attached to it, revs also has on demand quickness. Something reapers (outside shroud) does not.

 

Rev damage is objectively low.

 

Revs play glassier than everybody because we are forced to. When I play the same play style on my Rev on warrior or Soulbeast guess what happens? People get one shot lmfao.