Revenant unwanted in raids??

[Hana.8143]

I’m a huge GW2 fan and always asked people to at least know how to play when we did fractals before HoT, I couldn’t care less if they didn’t know the fractal mechanics. But we always did those last fractals (50 back then) while being serious and having fun.

I haven’t play HoT and came back for PoF. And the way the game evolved in only 2 years is kinda disgusting, it was mind blowing when I checked the LFG.

 

All those people asking for perfect builds and knowledges while refusing newcomers makes me sick and even if I know I can do raids (I’m always doing my best cleaning the hard content in MMO, try hard my rotations because I always want to know everything about my class, test every single build I can imagine and weapons available too), I just don’t want to be part of this joke. It just doesn’t fit in the GW2 spirit.

People on GW2 became what I didn’t want to find on this game. A bunch of elitists people.

Doing raids for legendary armor ? If the price is having the community becoming a bunch of selfish people, no thanks.

I’ve seen a lot of people IG who couldn’t try raids because everyone is asking for lots of Li.

I prefer to wait and get my legendary armor with WvW. I’m fine with hard content, really, but if the price is, having this kind of community, thanks but no thanks, I’ll stick to content most of people can enjoy together even if they don’t know eachother.

I made a lot of friends on this game while playing PvE content, serious people while doing Fractals back then, but awesome people. Wanna be friend with people who say « Do you have this kind of stuff and build ? No ? Then, you have one chance since we can’t find the proper class. If you die, I’ll kick you. » (and no, it wasn’t for me, but for a friend with 70+ Li, as I said, I don’t do raids)

Also, Dps meter are just a plague reinforcing that since you can just kick people who come to learn.

 

Once again, totally fine with hard content. But look at what GW2 became. Compare the « before raids » and the « after raids ».

 

Hope Anet is happy about that. Really.

[Cynn.1659]

People that hate on rev, don't know any better,. This is a screen from last night. 

 

[Oldirtbeard.9834]

> @Hana.8143 said:

> I’m a huge GW2 fan and always asked people to at least know how to play when we did fractals before HoT, I couldn’t care less if they didn’t know the fractal mechanics. But we always did those last fractals (50 back then) while being serious and having fun.

> I haven’t play HoT and came back for PoF. And the way the game evolved in only 2 years is kinda disgusting, it was mind blowing when I checked the LFG.

>

> All those people asking for perfect builds and knowledges while refusing newcomers makes me sick and even if I know I can do raids (I’m always doing my best cleaning the hard content in MMO, try hard my rotations because I always want to know everything about my class, test every single build I can imagine and weapons available too), I just don’t want to be part of this joke. It just doesn’t fit in the GW2 spirit.

> People on GW2 became what I didn’t want to find on this game. A bunch of elitists people.

> Doing raids for legendary armor ? If the price is having the community becoming a bunch of selfish people, no thanks.

> I’ve seen a lot of people IG who couldn’t try raids because everyone is asking for lots of Li.

> I prefer to wait and get my legendary armor with WvW. I’m fine with hard content, really, but if the price is, having this kind of community, thanks but no thanks, I’ll stick to content most of people can enjoy together even if they don’t know eachother.

> I made a lot of friends on this game while playing PvE content, serious people while doing Fractals back then, but awesome people. Wanna be friend with people who say « Do you have this kind of stuff and build ? No ? Then, you have one chance since we can’t find the proper class. If you die, I’ll kick you. » (and no, it wasn’t for me, but for a friend with 70+ Li, as I said, I don’t do raids)

> Also, Dps meter are just a plague reinforcing that since you can just kick people who come to learn.

>

> Once again, totally fine with hard content. But look at what GW2 became. Compare the « before raids » and the « after raids ».

>

> Hope Anet is happy about that. Really.

 

I've been saying that for awhile now.

[GrubySzymek.1362]

qT posted raid benchmarks and renegade is a solid condi dps choice now.

 

That being said, I hate what raiding made with this game and to this day I can't accept Anet's decision of introducing this content, especially the crowd they invited into GW2. My experience is that overall quality of human interaction in game went down after raiding was introduced.

[mXz.4512]

If you know your build like the back of your hand, there really shouldn't be any reason you can't. Especially if you know all the limits and strengths of it. If you're confident enough to take each boss down, only ignorant people would be foolish to doubt you.

 

It'd be no different than when everyone was skeptic if engi would be any good in fractals, but I know a few and seen more people using engies all throughout fractals.

[ZeftheWicked.3076]

Funny how everyone is trying to pin the tail on the game or the OP, instead where it squarely belongs - the **pug raid idiots**.

Qt benchmarks are out and condi renegade is 4th dps on small targets. Only that:

 

1. If those targets move that may change to first or second place, since renegade is **the** torment profession, even more so then scourge.

2. Qtfy does **golem** tests. That means damage from Razorclaw's rage is only 1/5th of it's real value, since at boss you have actual ppl to share it with.

 

Renegade's dps is curretly hands down raid ready and kicking ass!

[Velran.1052]

Honestly hilarious how butthurt people are about other's expecting them to run optimal builds. There is literally no reason for a raid leader to believe you when you claim your build is better than the meta build. "Giving you a chance" Is simply a waste of time, When they can pick up someone who runs a build that is **proven** to be effective. And i'm very sorry to say that this game is mostly really easy, And you don't need to have 10k hours on a build to play it optimally. Just like if you run a bad build, It doesn't matter how good you are, as you will always reach a cap of usefulness.

Also just because a raid has been cleared with a certain build/class it does not make it optimal. Again, leaders have to absolutely no reason to pick your special snowflake build rather than a meta one.

Either run a meta build, start your own group or suck it up.

[Oglaf.1074]

It is really sad. The only times I see Revenants in raids are

 

1. As one of the possible classes that can Handkite during the Deimos fight.

2. If a guild/group of friends do a raid and don't give a crap about what people bring as long as the bare minimum essentials are being met.

[TexZero.7910]

> @ZeftheWicked.3076 said:

> Funny how everyone is trying to pin the tail on the game or the OP, instead where it squarely belongs - the **pug raid idiots**.

 

Except the OP clearly stated even his guild wont take him. That means the 1 common factor is the OP.

 

We all know the pug community is questionable at best, but when your own guild wont take you there's likely a much bigger issue than just one's class. I'm saying this as someone whose had to be in that position as a guild raid leader to give that speech to a person who was about as motivated to raid as sloth is to actually fight.

 

 

[Vulf.3098]

> @Scipion.7548 said:

> Blizzard succeed. Bring the player, not the class.

> Is Anet less skillfull than Blizzard ?

 

If you are speaking of WoW then this is not necessarily true. The same mentality exist in that game especially at very high difficulty content like Mythic raiding and high level mythic + dungeons where guilds/pug groups want to stack specific classes to cheese mechanics. Everything is viable but you are still going to encounter groups that refuse to take certain classes because the top guilds do not run it.

 

The big problem right now with Revanent is that it still has that pre PoF stigma of not bringing much to the raid group which is false now. Condi Renegade does great dps.

 

 

[Hana.8143]

I think all those guys working on Dps meters or on perfect builds are the one ruining the game (even if they provide quality builds), since lazy people (who happen to be the ones looking for specific person) can’t think of anything and just want to have the best, they all follow what looks like to be the best builds. And by doing that they forgot that GW2 isn’t necessary meant to be played at 100%, and so, they reject people who just happen to be good but who want to have their own playstyles. GW2 should be about diversity, not about Tempest / Chrono and whatever you found « metagame » enough.

 

[Lucentfir.7430]

> @Hana.8143 said:

> I think all those guys working on Dps meters or on perfect builds are the one ruining the game (even if they provide quality builds), since lazy people (who happen to be the ones looking for specific person) can’t think of anything and just want to have the best, they all follow what looks like to be the best builds. And by doing that they forgot that GW2 isn’t necessary meant to be played at 100%, and so, they reject people who just happen to be good but who want to have their own playstyles. GW2 should be about diversity, not about Tempest / Chrono and whatever you found « metagame » enough.

>

 

I kinda agree with this. I think Anet envisioned raid content as hard challenging content that could be completed with various compositions as long as you understood the boss mechanics and not running something trolly like magi GS warrior. Though I'd say it's the raid community's own fault as to why everything is so strict for compositions, with min-maxing every player slot with a listed meta composition and builds bible, and DPS meter add-ons if it's not meta(the best/popular) you're not worth the slot. Despite raid bosses being completed with all slots being the same profession, and some in even green gear runs.

[Rennie.6750]

> @Lucentfir.7430 said:

> > @Hana.8143 said:

> > I think all those guys working on Dps meters or on perfect builds are the one ruining the game (even if they provide quality builds), since lazy people (who happen to be the ones looking for specific person) can’t think of anything and just want to have the best, they all follow what looks like to be the best builds. And by doing that they forgot that GW2 isn’t necessary meant to be played at 100%, and so, they reject people who just happen to be good but who want to have their own playstyles. GW2 should be about diversity, not about Tempest / Chrono and whatever you found « metagame » enough.

> >

>

> I kinda agree with this. I think Anet envisioned raid content as hard challenging content that could be completed with various compositions as long as you understood the boss mechanics and not running something trolly like magi GS warrior. Though I'd say it's the raid community's own fault as to why everything is so strict for compositions, with min-maxing every player slot with a listed meta composition and builds bible, and DPS meter add-ons if it's not meta(the best/popular) you're not worth the slot. Despite raid bosses being completed with all slots being the same profession, and some in even green gear runs.

 

You can't blame the community, the community takes the content that is provided and then uses it within the limits of the said content. Imagine a MMO as a country the developers rule. Guilds are like big corporations. If you think that corporations are doing something that isn't good, then you can't call on morality, you, as the government, have to change the rules to get rid of the behaviour you do not want to have in your country. In more MMO-ish terms, ANet needs to reevaluate their raid design rules to break the "must bring meta" mentality, if they care about accessibility, that is. There's no way around it, the community will never do it willingly. Never count on good will from a collective entity, that's just not a thing in the real world.

[Zlater.6789]

I would try you because rev does fine dps now for most bosses. But I wouldn't hesitate to kick you if you became a waste of space.

[Rhanoa.3960]

> @Zlater.6789 said:

> I would try you because rev does fine dps now for most bosses. But I wouldn't hesitate to kick you if you became a waste of space.

 

Welcome to entertainment at it's finest!

**it's a VIDEO GAME not the NFL! **

[zealex.9410]

> @Ashen.2907 said:

> > @Scipion.7548 said:

> > > @Chickenooble.5014 said:

> > > **If you have problems with your Rev just pick a different class to raid with**. It'll take a bit of time to level up and learn your class but you'll have more options.

> > >

> > > It's not the communities fault that they don't want you and you don't want to put in the effort to make yourself marketable.

> >

> > And if he is attached to his character ? Don't forget we play an mmo...RPG, not a MOBA.

> >

> > > @Danikat.8537 said:

> > > This isn't a problem with the game itself - Anet haven't blocked you from entering a raid on a revenant or put in mechanics which prevent groups from completing a raid if a revenant is there. It's players who are making that decision. Even if they have solid reasons for that (I honestly don't know anything about preferred raid groups so I have no idea why they wouldn't let you join) **Anet's ability to change it is limited**. For example there was never actually anything wrong with rangers in dungeons, only with certain builds (mainly ones that relied on the longbow and staying at range) but even after various balance patches "fixed" that it took months, if not years for most PUG groups to accept rangers. And during that time many groups wouldn't even give you time to say "It's ok, I'm not using longbow" or even "I'll swap to another character" - they saw you were a ranger and kicked you, end of 'discussion'.

> >

> > Blizzard succeed. Bring the player, not the class.

> > Is Anet less skillfull than Blizzard ?

>

> Honest question, as I have not played WoW in years, can someone show up on a thief expecting to fulfill the role of healer for a group in WoW raids?

 

Idk if u wonan do mythic u will prob need to bring the class because the player u will have will obv be of that skill.

[Bahamoth.8053]

Well some people in my post certainly reflect what the community does and how they think. Kind of Sad to read some you guys giving me an advice to play another class. I totally agree with @"Hana.8143" . We should be able to play whatever class we want in any group composition as long as you play your class well. Butt I thank you guys for your feedback.

[Bahamoth.8053]

 

 

> @Hana.8143 said:

> I think all those guys working on Dps meters or on perfect builds are the one ruining the game (even if they provide quality builds), since lazy people (who happen to be the ones looking for specific person) can’t think of anything and just want to have the best, they all follow what looks like to be the best builds. And by doing that they forgot that GW2 isn’t necessary meant to be played at 100%, and so, they reject people who just happen to be good but who want to have their own playstyles. GW2 should be about diversity, not about Tempest / Chrono and whatever you found « metagame » enough.

>

Well some people in my post certainly reflect what the community does and how they think. Kind of Sad to read some you guys giving me an advice to play another class. I totally agree with @"Hana.8143" . We should be able to play whatever class we want in any group composition as long as you play your class well. Butt I thank you guys for your feedback.

 

[Velran.1052]

So you want people to carry your kitten build? Make your own group. And these are the best builds, At least until someone proves that there's a better one. Absolutely no reason to take people who want to run their special snowflake build over a meta build.

[Curennos.9307]

It's not Anet's fault that people can be jerks. Find a better group of people. I ran a raid last night and got my first boss kills running 90% exotic zerk armor on a chrono. Our highest DPS was 12k. There's a raid training discord you can join that might be exactly what you're looking for - it helps people start their own raids, and helps new people get into raids without suffering elitism.

 

The problem is you for not putting in the effort to find the right group of people to run with.

[Coconut.7082]

> @Bahamoth.8053 said:

> Well some people in my post certainly reflect what the community does and how they think. Kind of Sad to read some you guys giving me an advice to play another class. I totally agree with @"Hana.8143" . We should be able to play whatever class we want in any group composition as long as you play your class well. Butt I thank you guys for your feedback.

 

Your post is hilarious, because not only Condi Renegade is currently one of the top DPS builds, before PoF Condi Revenant was a decent DPS choice that could work on most bosses (excluding some like KC, which clearly favors bursty Power builds etc'), in fact it was even used in a Cairn record by qT.

I had no issue what so ever joining groups on Renegade since PoF release, so where is the problem exactly? Is it really Revenant hate, or maybe it's your build/attitude?

 

You cannot play whatever class you want in any composition, simply because you are playing in a team, which requires **team play**!

[Sojourner.4621]

> @Velran.1052 said:

> So you want people to carry your kitten build? Make your own group. And these are the best builds, At least until someone proves that there's a better one. Absolutely no reason to take people who want to run their special snowflake build over a meta build.

 

He never said he's not playing a meta build, he said he is playing Revenant, which on Renegade according to qT is one of the top five DPS on small hitbox roughly tied with Soulbeast and so is absolutely a part of the meta. There are definitely groups out there who have decided ages ago that Revenant is useless to the meta, and still refuse to take them despite all information pointing towards the contrary. That is VERY MUCH a community issue, not an issue necessarily with the OP. A lot of you seem to be inferring an awful lot of information that was never stated, and those people SPECIFICALLY are the actual problem.

[Sojourner.4621]

> @Rennie.6750 said:

> > @Lucentfir.7430 said:

> > > @Hana.8143 said:

> > > I think all those guys working on Dps meters or on perfect builds are the one ruining the game (even if they provide quality builds), since lazy people (who happen to be the ones looking for specific person) can’t think of anything and just want to have the best, they all follow what looks like to be the best builds. And by doing that they forgot that GW2 isn’t necessary meant to be played at 100%, and so, they reject people who just happen to be good but who want to have their own playstyles. GW2 should be about diversity, not about Tempest / Chrono and whatever you found « metagame » enough.

> > >

> >

> > I kinda agree with this. I think Anet envisioned raid content as hard challenging content that could be completed with various compositions as long as you understood the boss mechanics and not running something trolly like magi GS warrior. Though I'd say it's the raid community's own fault as to why everything is so strict for compositions, with min-maxing every player slot with a listed meta composition and builds bible, and DPS meter add-ons if it's not meta(the best/popular) you're not worth the slot. Despite raid bosses being completed with all slots being the same profession, and some in even green gear runs.

>

> You can't blame the community, the community takes the content that is provided and then uses it within the limits of the said content. Imagine a MMO as a country the developers rule. Guilds are like big corporations. If you think that corporations are doing something that isn't good, then you can't call on morality, you, as the government, have to change the rules to get rid of the behaviour you do not want to have in your country. In more MMO-ish terms, ANet needs to reevaluate their raid design rules to break the "must bring meta" mentality, if they care about accessibility, that is. There's no way around it, the community will never do it willingly. Never count on good will from a collective entity, **that's just not a thing in the real world.**

 

Maybe that's "not a thing in the real world" but it absolutely should be. You can absolutely blame the community for behaving in a way that is shitty to other human beings. Just because you can't realistically expect shitty people to not be shitty doesn't make their shitty behavior any more acceptable. Don't blame the victim or the game developers, because no matter how a game is designed shitty people will continue to find new ways to shit up the place. But you can 100% **absolutely** blame the people being shitty.

[Sojourner.4621]

> @TexZero.7910 said:

> > @ZeftheWicked.3076 said:

> > Funny how everyone is trying to pin the tail on the game or the OP, instead where it squarely belongs - the **pug raid idiots**.

>

> Except the OP clearly stated even his guild wont take him. That means the 1 common factor is the OP.

>

> We all know the pug community is questionable at best, but when your own guild wont take you there's likely a much bigger issue than just one's class. I'm saying this as someone whose had to be in that position as a guild raid leader to give that speech to a person who was about as motivated to raid as sloth is to actually fight.

>

>

 

Even guilds can become highly biased against specific classes, and refuse to take that class even after patches and new specs have proven the old ideology to be false.

[CptAurellian.9537]

> @TexZero.7910 said:

> > @ZeftheWicked.3076 said:

> > Funny how everyone is trying to pin the tail on the game or the OP, instead where it squarely belongs - the **pug raid idiots**.

>

> Except the OP clearly stated even his guild wont take him. That means the 1 common factor is the OP.

>

> We all know the pug community is questionable at best, but when your own guild wont take you there's likely a much bigger issue than just one's class. I'm saying this as someone whose had to be in that position as a guild raid leader to give that speech to a person who was about as motivated to raid as sloth is to actually fight.

Normally I'd agree with you, but I've seen too many guilds which are, in some aspects at least, on the level of "pug raid idiots". For that reason, I would not be overly surprised if it's actually not an issue with the OP, but with the guild.