Weindrasi.3805 Posted December 2, 2019 Share Posted December 2, 2019 I have a theory. We know that fire magic--both Primord's magic and Jotun fire spells--are Jormag's weakness. Braham was able to damage Jormag's tooth because he enchanted his bow with a Jotun fire spell. However, the Jotun have degenerated into brutes and more Jotun fire spells are not available--other then an old scroll or two, which is nowhere near enough. Additionally, since we can't risk Jormag and Primord killing each other, Taimi's original idea to make them fight each other is out. So who is left? How about the faction that's full of expert fire elementalists, who possess a magical eternal flame, and who are determined to make friends with us? Seems like it's time to take Ephram and crew into the Shiverpeaks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ayrilana.1396 Posted December 2, 2019 Share Posted December 2, 2019 Searing 2.0? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patty.3268 Posted December 2, 2019 Share Posted December 2, 2019 The problem was not having two Elder Dragons fight and kill each other, but that another Elder Dragons death would mean the (definitve) end of the world. So we would have the same problem when the Flame Legion fights Jormag. Luckily, we now know a safe way to kill dragons, so the Flame Legion fighting him shouldn't be a problem as long as we are able to go the safe route again. That also means that technically, having Primordus and Jormag fight would also be an option again. But since this has happened before, the Flame Legion is probably the more likely outcome storywise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scraggy.3814 Posted December 2, 2019 Share Posted December 2, 2019 That's so true! I forgot about the Flame Legion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fenom.9457 Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 The bigger question is if aurene can keep sucking up dragon magic forever because if not we gotta find another dragon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nazuuka.6784 Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 If it went down the route of Aurene sucking all dragon magic, that feels cheap honestly :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannelore.8153 Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 Just adding here that we wouldn't've defeated Zhaitan without their Searing magic, the use of a Searing Couldron was one of the key turning points in the war in Orr, and pretty much the only reason we successfully invaded Cursed Shore. You don't need to be weak to Flame Legion magic for it to be effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen.6312 Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 > @"Patty.3268" said: > The problem was not having two Elder Dragons fight and kill each other, but that another Elder Dragons death would mean the (definitve) end of the world. So we would have the same problem when the Flame Legion fights Jormag. Luckily, we now know a safe way to kill dragons, so the Flame Legion fighting him shouldn't be a problem as long as we are able to go the safe route again. That also means that technically, having Primordus and Jormag fight would also be an option again. But since this has happened before, the Flame Legion is probably the more likely outcome storywise. I wonder if the whole "end of the world" thing is a misunderstanding. The Antikytheria Mechanism focuses on continental Tyria, a small portion of the world. Maybe the Mechanism measures the magical world, rather than the world as a whole. Hence, killing the other dragons isn't really an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyuDragnier.9476 Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 > @"Fenom.9457" said: > The bigger question is if aurene can keep sucking up dragon magic forever because if not we gotta find another dragon Or just a vessel. I wonder if we can seal the magic into something similar to a Bloodstone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ugrakarma.9416 Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 the problem is over-use of "fire magic" or whatsover... balthazar, aurene, sohotin, flame legion, braham bow.......... just more fire will be the "solution"? i hope the writers be more creative than this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cristalyan.5728 Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 > @"Stephen.6312" said: > > @"Patty.3268" said: > > The problem was not having two Elder Dragons fight and kill each other, but that another Elder Dragons death would mean the (definitve) end of the world. So we would have the same problem when the Flame Legion fights Jormag. Luckily, we now know a safe way to kill dragons, so the Flame Legion fighting him shouldn't be a problem as long as we are able to go the safe route again. That also means that technically, having Primordus and Jormag fight would also be an option again. But since this has happened before, the Flame Legion is probably the more likely outcome storywise. > > I wonder if the whole "end of the world" thing is a misunderstanding. The Antikytheria Mechanism focuses on continental Tyria, a small portion of the world. Maybe the Mechanism measures the magical world, rather than the world as a whole. Hence, killing the other dragons isn't really an issue. LOL! This can be the worst way the story can go. In the first instance we saved Jormag and Primodius from Balthy, then we fought a god in order to make sure we have the two dragons safe, for what? To find that all our efforts were not necessary? As a commander I think I will hang Taimi of her ears. > @"RyuDragnier.9476" said: > > @"Fenom.9457" said: > > The bigger question is if aurene can keep sucking up dragon magic forever because if not we gotta find another dragon > Or just a vessel. I wonder if we can seal the magic into something similar to a Bloodstone. This is my option too - an artificial artifact able to absorb the magic when it reaches a certain level and to release it when a lower threshold is reached. The artifacts should be heavily guarded and protected - any tyrian "terrorist" may be tempted to break one of them :# Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fenom.9457 Posted December 3, 2019 Share Posted December 3, 2019 > @"RyuDragnier.9476" said: > > @"Fenom.9457" said: > > The bigger question is if aurene can keep sucking up dragon magic forever because if not we gotta find another dragon > Or just a vessel. I wonder if we can seal the magic into something similar to a Bloodstone. I’d definitely like to revisit the bloodstone, track down the last chunk or two that we’ve heard nothing about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Konig Des Todes.2086 Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 There's also the Spirit of Fire which Bitterfrost Frontier is all about... And seems to be the source of power of the jotun scroll Braham found. However, as said: > @"Patty.3268" said: > The problem was not having two Elder Dragons fight and kill each other, but that another Elder Dragons death would mean the (definitve) end of the world. So we would have the same problem when the Flame Legion fights Jormag. Is still true. But... > Luckily, we now know a safe way to kill dragons, so the Flame Legion fighting him shouldn't be a problem as long as we are able to go the safe route again. Is not so much true. Unless they decide to retcon a bit of PoF and S4 lore, Aurene was only able to replace one Elder Dragon. We're basically back to start with being able to kill the other three Elder Dragons - we need more replacements. Ideally, we should be looking for replacements for Zhaitan and Mordremoth. Hopefully we'll touch that topic, and ArenaNet won't go the very bland, boring and in-character very dangerous route of Aurene becoming the One True Elder Dragon. > @"Stephen.6312" said: > > @"Patty.3268" said: > > The problem was not having two Elder Dragons fight and kill each other, but that another Elder Dragons death would mean the (definitve) end of the world. So we would have the same problem when the Flame Legion fights Jormag. Luckily, we now know a safe way to kill dragons, so the Flame Legion fighting him shouldn't be a problem as long as we are able to go the safe route again. That also means that technically, having Primordus and Jormag fight would also be an option again. But since this has happened before, the Flame Legion is probably the more likely outcome storywise. > > I wonder if the whole "end of the world" thing is a misunderstanding. The Antikytheria Mechanism focuses on continental Tyria, a small portion of the world. Maybe the Mechanism measures the magical world, rather than the world as a whole. Hence, killing the other dragons isn't really an issue. The All / Antikytheria focuses on **the world Tyria**. Not Central Tyria. And if an Elder Dragon dies, it is the world Tyria that'll die. Not continental Tyria. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Konig Des Todes.2086 Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 > @"RyuDragnier.9476" said: > > @"Fenom.9457" said: > > The bigger question is if aurene can keep sucking up dragon magic forever because if not we gotta find another dragon > Or just a vessel. I wonder if we can seal the magic into something similar to a Bloodstone. I don't think a Bloodstone will work. If the only issue was merely containing magic, then we had no reason to stop Balthazar. The balance of magic and the balance of The All are two separate but linked issues, based on Flashpoint, and it is The All's balance - the Elder Dragon balance - which is a more immediate concern. If we just couldn't have too much magic, then taking an Elder Dragon's worth out of the equation entirely would help solve that side of the issue entirely. Thus utterly negating the entire purpose of antagonizing Balthazar. I do hope they play future roles, but I don't think they hold any significance in solving The All's imbalance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brycar.2651 Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 > @"Weindrasi.3805" said: > I have a theory. We know that fire magic--both Primord's magic and Jotun fire spells--are Jormag's weakness. Braham was able to damage Jormag's tooth because he enchanted his bow with a Jotun fire spell. However, the Jotun have degenerated into brutes and more Jotun fire spells are not available--other then an old scroll or two, which is nowhere near enough. Additionally, since we can't risk Jormag and Primord killing each other, Taimi's original idea to make them fight each other is out. So who is left? How about the faction that's full of expert fire elementalists, who possess a magical eternal flame, and who are determined to make friends with us? Seems like it's time to take Ephram and crew into the Shiverpeaks. I think you’re on to something. But they need Braham’s bow to carry the fire magic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tulki.1458 Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 > @"Ayrilana.1396" said: > Searing 2.0? This has been my secret theory since the prologue. Though I guess it's not so secret any more. I don't really expect them to write it in an unexpected way like this, but my pet theory is that Bangar is actually not stupid at all. He goes after Jormag, doesn't get corrupted, doesn't get persuaded by her. In a bit of subversion he actually turns out to be a brilliant and feared tactician rather than a villain. He ends up building and launching a new searing cauldron and ultimately kills Jormag. And he knows, even more, that just killing Jormag with nothing to take her place would end the world. But the searing cauldron binds the souls of those it affects to Tyria and forces them to relive their deaths over and over. So the searing ends up pinning Jormag's magic to the Far Shiverpeaks forever, leaving her still dangerous but unable to escape the site of her death. It would also leave a story hook, either with Jormag's ghost acting as a honey pot for something else (DSD or Primordus), or throwing a wrench in the Eternal Alchemy and attracting some other kind of intervention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Konig Des Todes.2086 Posted December 4, 2019 Share Posted December 4, 2019 > @"Tulki.1458" said: > But the searing cauldron binds the souls of those it affects to Tyria and forces them to relive their deaths over and over. So the searing ends up pinning Jormag's magic to the Far Shiverpeaks forever, leaving her still dangerous but unable to escape the site of her death. That's the Foefire. Two completely separate events caused by two completely separate sources of magic. And **not** something that Bangar can currently replicate unless he secretly obtained Magdaer somehow. But even then, the Foefire only affects **human souls**. The charr in the city were merely killed, while the charr throughout Ascalon untouched; similarly while some cows and cats can be seen as ghosts, they're too few to have been affected by the Foefire whole. And _even then_, the Elder Dragons' magic gets unleashed on death, and nothing implies that a soul can hold the same power or position - otherwise, why would killing an Elder Dragon's physical body even matter? Technically, what we did with Mordremoth _was_ kill his soul, since mind and soul tend to be linked or the same and we battled his mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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