Exile.8160 Posted April 12, 2020 Author Share Posted April 12, 2020 > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > The Swiss AT system that just came out was designed for new players. It's worse for the better players because the AT times are much higher. However, it gives worse teams more chances to fight. > > Your suggestion to penalize good players _for being good_ is just a bad idea. Then up the reward... again my goal here is for other players to have a chance to win it and not get destroy by the same pro team over and over... this is why swiss didn't change anything it's not exciting to que up knowing the same pro team from the last 3 or so ATs is still farming people. Help with a solution and make pvp a better play mode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted April 12, 2020 Share Posted April 12, 2020 > @"Exile.8160" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > The Swiss AT system that just came out was designed for new players. It's worse for the better players because the AT times are much higher. However, it gives worse teams more chances to fight. > > > > Your suggestion to penalize good players _for being good_ is just a bad idea. > > Then up the reward... again my goal here is for other players to have a chance to win it and not get destroy by the same pro team over and over... this is why swiss didn't change anything it's not exciting to que up knowing the same pro team from the last 3 or so ATs is still farming people. > > Help with a solution and make pvp a better play mode. They changed it so you also get a gold per round now iirc. Also, I really just don't think you understand how tournaments work. The best players are supposed to win. It's not up to the developers to penalize good players just because someone worse doesn't feel good about it. Dude if you want to up your chance to win, practice more. Practice your 1v1s, find 4 other players and spam the ATs. Over time, your performance will continue to improve because you learned by playing against people better than you. Your goal should be to get better, not just to get the shiny reward at the end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exile.8160 Posted April 12, 2020 Author Share Posted April 12, 2020 > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > @"Exile.8160" said: > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > The Swiss AT system that just came out was designed for new players. It's worse for the better players because the AT times are much higher. However, it gives worse teams more chances to fight. > > > > > > Your suggestion to penalize good players _for being good_ is just a bad idea. > > > > Then up the reward... again my goal here is for other players to have a chance to win it and not get destroy by the same pro team over and over... this is why swiss didn't change anything it's not exciting to que up knowing the same pro team from the last 3 or so ATs is still farming people. > > > > Help with a solution and make pvp a better play mode. > > They changed it so you also get a gold per round now iirc. Also, I really just don't think you understand how tournaments work. The best players are supposed to win. It's not up to the developers to penalize good players just because someone worse doesn't feel good about it. > > Dude if you want to up your chance to win, practice more. Practice your 1v1s, find 4 other players and spam the ATs. Over time, your performance will continue to improve because you learned by playing against people better than you. Your goal should be to get better, not just to get the shiny reward at the end. how is giving them a better reward penalizing? anyways your not read just skipping to what proves your point. Ats right now is just one team blowing past everything else every single time not giving time for anyone to enjoy the match. Matches that are better for learning like u say are matches that are close. There's a reason why AT are unpopular and why swiss didn't change anything. I just want to give other players a chance to enjoy and feel like they can win in AT and thus making it more popular. You are literally advocating for a mode that's unpopular even for pvp and clearly not getting better. how do you expect for AT to grow as a mode if the same team stomps all the newcomer like it has for all these years? its been in a rot and leaving it like it is wont help it. so how about help it and not bash anyone that trys to help it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exile.8160 Posted April 12, 2020 Author Share Posted April 12, 2020 If only a dev and weigh in some insight on the matter -_- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avatar.3568 Posted April 12, 2020 Share Posted April 12, 2020 > @"Exile.8160" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > @"Exile.8160" said: > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > The Swiss AT system that just came out was designed for new players. It's worse for the better players because the AT times are much higher. However, it gives worse teams more chances to fight. > > > > > > > > Your suggestion to penalize good players _for being good_ is just a bad idea. > > > > > > Then up the reward... again my goal here is for other players to have a chance to win it and not get destroy by the same pro team over and over... this is why swiss didn't change anything it's not exciting to que up knowing the same pro team from the last 3 or so ATs is still farming people. > > > > > > Help with a solution and make pvp a better play mode. > > > > They changed it so you also get a gold per round now iirc. Also, I really just don't think you understand how tournaments work. The best players are supposed to win. It's not up to the developers to penalize good players just because someone worse doesn't feel good about it. > > > > Dude if you want to up your chance to win, practice more. Practice your 1v1s, find 4 other players and spam the ATs. Over time, your performance will continue to improve because you learned by playing against people better than you. Your goal should be to get better, not just to get the shiny reward at the end. > > how is giving them a better reward penalizing? anyways your not read just skipping to what proves your point. Ats right now is just one team blowing past everything else every single time not giving time for anyone to enjoy the match. Matches that are better for learning like u say are matches that are close. There's a reason why AT are unpopular and why swiss didn't change anything. I just want to give other players a chance to enjoy and feel like they can win in AT and thus making it more popular. > > You are literally advocating for a mode that's unpopular even for pvp and clearly not getting better. how do you expect for AT to grow as a mode if the same team stomps all the newcomer like it has for all these years? its been in a rot and leaving it like it is wont help it. so how about help it and not bash anyone that trys to help it. > It's like "hey you are silver 2, do you want to compete in the csgo world series, it's an easy win for everyone" Tournaments were created to see, which team is the best, not which team are the guys who cryed in the forum, that they want to win something that they clearly not deserve, this is not Pve were a mesmer can port you to the end of the jumping puzzle, you need to do your own work. If only 1 team winning everything, than it's clearly not their fault, it's the fault of the rest of the players, that they don't want to improve because "those guys just win" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazsi.2734 Posted April 12, 2020 Share Posted April 12, 2020 > @"Exile.8160" said: > Im tired of seeing the same team in AT (Automatic Tournaments) Win every single time abusing it even more at off hours..... give others a try for first place for once and enjoy the game. AT-s are literally the only part of the game where you cannot get a participation trophy and here you are asking for it... lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exile.8160 Posted April 12, 2020 Author Share Posted April 12, 2020 > @"Avatar.3568" said: > > @"Exile.8160" said: > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > @"Exile.8160" said: > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > The Swiss AT system that just came out was designed for new players. It's worse for the better players because the AT times are much higher. However, it gives worse teams more chances to fight. > > > > > > > > > > Your suggestion to penalize good players _for being good_ is just a bad idea. > > > > > > > > Then up the reward... again my goal here is for other players to have a chance to win it and not get destroy by the same pro team over and over... this is why swiss didn't change anything it's not exciting to que up knowing the same pro team from the last 3 or so ATs is still farming people. > > > > > > > > Help with a solution and make pvp a better play mode. > > > > > > They changed it so you also get a gold per round now iirc. Also, I really just don't think you understand how tournaments work. The best players are supposed to win. It's not up to the developers to penalize good players just because someone worse doesn't feel good about it. > > > > > > Dude if you want to up your chance to win, practice more. Practice your 1v1s, find 4 other players and spam the ATs. Over time, your performance will continue to improve because you learned by playing against people better than you. Your goal should be to get better, not just to get the shiny reward at the end. > > > > how is giving them a better reward penalizing? anyways your not read just skipping to what proves your point. Ats right now is just one team blowing past everything else every single time not giving time for anyone to enjoy the match. Matches that are better for learning like u say are matches that are close. There's a reason why AT are unpopular and why swiss didn't change anything. I just want to give other players a chance to enjoy and feel like they can win in AT and thus making it more popular. > > > > You are literally advocating for a mode that's unpopular even for pvp and clearly not getting better. how do you expect for AT to grow as a mode if the same team stomps all the newcomer like it has for all these years? its been in a rot and leaving it like it is wont help it. so how about help it and not bash anyone that trys to help it. > > > > It's like "hey you are silver 2, do you want to compete in the csgo world series, it's an easy win for everyone" > > Tournaments were created to see, which team is the best, not which team are the guys who cryed in the forum, that they want to win something that they clearly not deserve, this is not Pve were a mesmer can port you to the end of the jumping puzzle, you need to do your own work. > > If only 1 team winning everything, than it's clearly not their fault, it's the fault of the rest of the players, that they don't want to improve because "those guys just win" So silver cant have a chance to win an At ever? let them for ever get completely rolled 0 - 500 by pros? see this is why AT is so unpopular and swiss didnt change anything. Im trying to get fresh air to a stale gamemode have more people join in and enjoy it why is that so bad? or maybe instead of shutting ppl down give your own Idea to help the gamemode instead of bashing others down. anyways I've went over this with someone else read the later post not gonna repeat myself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avatar.3568 Posted April 12, 2020 Share Posted April 12, 2020 Of course a silver team should never be able To defeat legends Just get better, that your silver team is a Plat 3/legend team Again this is not some kind of Pve, where the legends are a raid or world boss This are humans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazsi.2734 Posted April 12, 2020 Share Posted April 12, 2020 > @"Exile.8160" said: > > @"Avatar.3568" said: > > > @"Exile.8160" said: > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > @"Exile.8160" said: > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > The Swiss AT system that just came out was designed for new players. It's worse for the better players because the AT times are much higher. However, it gives worse teams more chances to fight. > > > > > > > > > > > > Your suggestion to penalize good players _for being good_ is just a bad idea. > > > > > > > > > > Then up the reward... again my goal here is for other players to have a chance to win it and not get destroy by the same pro team over and over... this is why swiss didn't change anything it's not exciting to que up knowing the same pro team from the last 3 or so ATs is still farming people. > > > > > > > > > > Help with a solution and make pvp a better play mode. > > > > > > > > They changed it so you also get a gold per round now iirc. Also, I really just don't think you understand how tournaments work. The best players are supposed to win. It's not up to the developers to penalize good players just because someone worse doesn't feel good about it. > > > > > > > > Dude if you want to up your chance to win, practice more. Practice your 1v1s, find 4 other players and spam the ATs. Over time, your performance will continue to improve because you learned by playing against people better than you. Your goal should be to get better, not just to get the shiny reward at the end. > > > > > > how is giving them a better reward penalizing? anyways your not read just skipping to what proves your point. Ats right now is just one team blowing past everything else every single time not giving time for anyone to enjoy the match. Matches that are better for learning like u say are matches that are close. There's a reason why AT are unpopular and why swiss didn't change anything. I just want to give other players a chance to enjoy and feel like they can win in AT and thus making it more popular. > > > > > > You are literally advocating for a mode that's unpopular even for pvp and clearly not getting better. how do you expect for AT to grow as a mode if the same team stomps all the newcomer like it has for all these years? its been in a rot and leaving it like it is wont help it. so how about help it and not bash anyone that trys to help it. > > > > > > > It's like "hey you are silver 2, do you want to compete in the csgo world series, it's an easy win for everyone" > > > > Tournaments were created to see, which team is the best, not which team are the guys who cryed in the forum, that they want to win something that they clearly not deserve, this is not Pve were a mesmer can port you to the end of the jumping puzzle, you need to do your own work. > > > > If only 1 team winning everything, than it's clearly not their fault, it's the fault of the rest of the players, that they don't want to improve because "those guys just win" > > So silver cant have a chance to win an At ever? YES. >let them for ever get completely rolled 0 - 500 by pros? YES. >see this is why AT is so unpopular and swiss didnt change anything. Im trying to get fresh air to a stale gamemode have more people join in and enjoy it why is that so bad? Are we getting trolled here? > or maybe instead of shutting ppl down give your own Idea to help the gamemode instead of bashing others down. anyways I've went over this with someone else read the later post not gonna repeat myself Bad ideas need to be "bashed" down. Taking competetiveness out of a competetive gamemode is destroying it, not making it better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trigr.6481 Posted April 12, 2020 Share Posted April 12, 2020 > @"Exile.8160" said: > Its always the same people that win and they play every single day specially at off hours to abuse the system. I say to limit there wins so other people have a chance at first place How are they abusing something by simply playing in the events regardless of the time, you just sound bitter. You also make it sound like you lack the capability to actually get better at the game, and are calling for the game to intervene on your behalf because you don't wanna put in the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exile.8160 Posted April 12, 2020 Author Share Posted April 12, 2020 > @"Bazsi.2734" said: > > @"Exile.8160" said: > > > @"Avatar.3568" said: > > > > @"Exile.8160" said: > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > @"Exile.8160" said: > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > The Swiss AT system that just came out was designed for new players. It's worse for the better players because the AT times are much higher. However, it gives worse teams more chances to fight. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your suggestion to penalize good players _for being good_ is just a bad idea. > > > > > > > > > > > > Then up the reward... again my goal here is for other players to have a chance to win it and not get destroy by the same pro team over and over... this is why swiss didn't change anything it's not exciting to que up knowing the same pro team from the last 3 or so ATs is still farming people. > > > > > > > > > > > > Help with a solution and make pvp a better play mode. > > > > > > > > > > They changed it so you also get a gold per round now iirc. Also, I really just don't think you understand how tournaments work. The best players are supposed to win. It's not up to the developers to penalize good players just because someone worse doesn't feel good about it. > > > > > > > > > > Dude if you want to up your chance to win, practice more. Practice your 1v1s, find 4 other players and spam the ATs. Over time, your performance will continue to improve because you learned by playing against people better than you. Your goal should be to get better, not just to get the shiny reward at the end. > > > > > > > > how is giving them a better reward penalizing? anyways your not read just skipping to what proves your point. Ats right now is just one team blowing past everything else every single time not giving time for anyone to enjoy the match. Matches that are better for learning like u say are matches that are close. There's a reason why AT are unpopular and why swiss didn't change anything. I just want to give other players a chance to enjoy and feel like they can win in AT and thus making it more popular. > > > > > > > > You are literally advocating for a mode that's unpopular even for pvp and clearly not getting better. how do you expect for AT to grow as a mode if the same team stomps all the newcomer like it has for all these years? its been in a rot and leaving it like it is wont help it. so how about help it and not bash anyone that trys to help it. > > > > > > > > > > It's like "hey you are silver 2, do you want to compete in the csgo world series, it's an easy win for everyone" > > > > > > Tournaments were created to see, which team is the best, not which team are the guys who cryed in the forum, that they want to win something that they clearly not deserve, this is not Pve were a mesmer can port you to the end of the jumping puzzle, you need to do your own work. > > > > > > If only 1 team winning everything, than it's clearly not their fault, it's the fault of the rest of the players, that they don't want to improve because "those guys just win" > > > > So silver cant have a chance to win an At ever? > > YES. > > >let them for ever get completely rolled 0 - 500 by pros? > > YES. > > >see this is why AT is so unpopular and swiss didnt change anything. Im trying to get fresh air to a stale gamemode have more people join in and enjoy it why is that so bad? > > Are we getting trolled here? > > > or maybe instead of shutting ppl down give your own Idea to help the gamemode instead of bashing others down. anyways I've went over this with someone else read the later post not gonna repeat myself > > Bad ideas need to be "bashed" down. Taking competetiveness out of a competetive gamemode is destroying it, not making it better. > > Destroying it? They can still play it and they will always win at it. This just limits it a lil bit for a chance for others to shine jeez. you make it sound like pvp is getting deleted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted April 12, 2020 Share Posted April 12, 2020 > @"Exile.8160" said: > Destroying it? They can still play it and they will always win at it. This just limits it a lil bit for a chance for others to shine jeez. you make it sound like pvp is getting deleted. If you don't win against the best, what's the point of winning? If other people manage to win the AT but all of the good players were unable to achieve first due to artificial limitations set upon them by unhappy, lower tier players, that win means absolutely _nothing_. The issue here is that you believe that everyone is motivated only by the reward at the end. Rather, some people enjoy improvement, playing with friends, competition, and a chance to test their skills and see where they stand against other people. Your argument would make sense for ranked if matchmaking didn't exist - to bracket the system where one didn't exist before in order to give every player a fair shot at winning. However, in a tournament setting, your argument is a joke. By nature, the ATs were designed to be competitive... and you wish to limit the competition. It makes no sense and that's the reason why every single person in this thread is vehemently disagreeing with your flawed logic. I've said it before and I'll say it again. You don't deserve wins. Nobody does. Work for it. If you're still not good enough to win, then you need to keep practicing. I've worked with children in the past and this is literally the same mindset that spoiled kids have when they get beaten in a game by their friends, whereas their parents would have normally let them win every single time. And it upsets them, and they don't like it, and they end up throwing an embarrassing tantrum and running to the teacher because they never learned how to take a loss with grace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sovari.7246 Posted April 12, 2020 Share Posted April 12, 2020 Yeah it's the same people all of the same with the most safe cheesy team and the worst part of it is waiting for the tournament to start which can be a huge time consuming thing only to lose early on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exile.8160 Posted April 12, 2020 Author Share Posted April 12, 2020 > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > @"Exile.8160" said: > > Destroying it? They can still play it and they will always win at it. This just limits it a lil bit for a chance for others to shine jeez. you make it sound like pvp is getting deleted. > > If you don't win against the best, what's the point of winning? > > If other people manage to win the AT but all of the good players were unable to achieve first due to artificial limitations set upon them by unhappy, lower tier players, that win means absolutely _nothing_. The issue here is that you believe that everyone is motivated only by the reward at the end. Rather, some people enjoy improvement, playing with friends, competition, and a chance to test their skills and see where they stand against other people. > > Your argument would make sense for ranked if matchmaking didn't exist - to bracket the system where one didn't exist before in order to give every player a fair shot at winning. However, in a tournament setting, your argument is a joke. By nature, the ATs were designed to be competitive... and you wish to limit the competition. It makes no sense and that's the reason why every single person in this thread is vehemently disagreeing with your flawed logic. > > I've said it before and I'll say it again. You don't deserve wins. Nobody does. Work for it. If you're still not good enough to win, then you need to keep practicing. I've worked with children in the past and this is literally the same mindset that spoiled kids have when they get beaten in a game by their friends, whereas their parents would have normally let them win every single time. And it upsets them, and they don't like it, and they end up throwing an embarrassing tantrum and running to the teacher because they never learned how to take a loss with grace. You still don't get it... Im not wasting more time with you honestly. Keep the game mode in the bad state that it is and probably will be for more years... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted April 12, 2020 Share Posted April 12, 2020 > @"Exile.8160" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > @"Exile.8160" said: > > > Destroying it? They can still play it and they will always win at it. This just limits it a lil bit for a chance for others to shine jeez. you make it sound like pvp is getting deleted. > > > > If you don't win against the best, what's the point of winning? > > > > If other people manage to win the AT but all of the good players were unable to achieve first due to artificial limitations set upon them by unhappy, lower tier players, that win means absolutely _nothing_. The issue here is that you believe that everyone is motivated only by the reward at the end. Rather, some people enjoy improvement, playing with friends, competition, and a chance to test their skills and see where they stand against other people. > > > > Your argument would make sense for ranked if matchmaking didn't exist - to bracket the system where one didn't exist before in order to give every player a fair shot at winning. However, in a tournament setting, your argument is a joke. By nature, the ATs were designed to be competitive... and you wish to limit the competition. It makes no sense and that's the reason why every single person in this thread is vehemently disagreeing with your flawed logic. > > > > I've said it before and I'll say it again. You don't deserve wins. Nobody does. Work for it. If you're still not good enough to win, then you need to keep practicing. I've worked with children in the past and this is literally the same mindset that spoiled kids have when they get beaten in a game by their friends, whereas their parents would have normally let them win every single time. And it upsets them, and they don't like it, and they end up throwing an embarrassing tantrum and running to the teacher because they never learned how to take a loss with grace. > > You still don't get it... Im not wasting more time with you honestly. Keep the game mode in the bad state that it is and probably will be for more years... No, you don't get it. You want to increase the rewards for the ATs but limit the amount of times people can get first place. Yet you seem to believe that both the top players and the lower tiers are motivated simply due to the rewards. I'm saying that plenty of top players and lower tier players play in the ATs because the competition is higher and the matches are harder. Limiting the amount of times people can place first not only invalidates the sense of achievement people get by beating a good team (because the good teams won't play), but it makes the game less fun for both parties as both higher and lower tier players will have less of a reason to do the ATs in the first place. Again, not everyone is motivated just for the shiny reward at the end. This is one of the only gamemodes in GW2 that doesn't hand out the top rewards for little to no effort or skill required. Listening to you is actually hilarious btw. You think because the top teams win almost every time that the gamemode is in a bad state? :joy: That's how it should be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trevor Boyer.6524 Posted April 12, 2020 Share Posted April 12, 2020 > @"Exile.8160" said: > Im tired of seeing the same team in AT (Automatic Tournaments) Win every single time abusing it even more at off hours..... give others a try for first place for once and enjoy the game. ATs are a competitive game mode and should never be designed like a time-gated fractal gold farm. If you want to sink some final round AT wins, form a real team and get to practicing like the rest of us. Furthermore without spending much time on the explanation, your proposed suggestion would greatly harm what little remains of our active player base. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seera.5916 Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 When people that don't play PvP can fully understand that this would be bad for the game mode, maybe it's time to stop and think if it's actually good or not. This change would make me less likely to want to get into PvP and get better. Because as soon as I get good, I risk limiting myself to only playing one aspect of PvP up to 2 times a day. Wouldn't you want your better players playing as much time as possible? Because that's how you get your weaker players to improve - by playing against better players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trevor Boyer.6524 Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 > @"Seera.5916" said: > When people that don't play PvP can fully understand that this would be bad for the game mode, maybe it's time to stop and think if it's actually good or not. > > This change would make me less likely to want to get into PvP and get better. Because as soon as I get good, I risk limiting myself to only playing one aspect of PvP up to 2 times a day. > > **Wouldn't you want your better players playing as much time as possible? Because that's how you get your weaker players to improve - by playing against better players.** Agree with what you're saying but the bolded is really not necessarily true at all... I think the core of the issue the OP is posting about really isn't AT format but low population, where new players are too often going against older veteran top players. Unfortunately, this problem has no quick fix. The only way to solve a problem like this would be some kind of long term plan with good execution to pull more player base. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotte in space.2158 Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 > @"Exile.8160" said: > Im tired of seeing the same team in AT (Automatic Tournaments) Win every single time 1) Its not always the same team, its always the same teams 2) Any P3 team has a realistic chance to win, apart from prime time ATs 3) In off times even a good P2 team can win (eventually) 4) The rest doesnt deserve it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drennon.7190 Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 Have you tried... getting good? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revolution.5409 Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 If you are a noob player you will have the same zero chance of winning. The only solution is to improve yourself by playing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choovanski.5462 Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 ah yes, the old 'ban the good players from playing so I can win for once' post imagine playing a competitive skill based gear equalised game mode without a competitive spirit. yikes! you obviously don't understand the point of playing with a team and competing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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