Terrible experience for new pvp'er

[Rainbowdash.5314]

> @"voltaicbore.8012" said:

> > @"Rainbowdash.5314" said:

>

> > anything else regarding the rest of the post though?

>

> I think others (including yourself), have addressed it well enough already. @"Trevor Boyer.6524" posted what is probably the fastest way to learn the most efficient strategies for your class. But you actually hit it on the head - the people best able to exploit the most overtuned builds tend to climb the ranks, to a point. Learning a proper meta build (on classes other than thief) can allow you to hard carry a good number of matches in the silver and low- /mid-gold range. Once you cross into plat 1, it'll become necessary to develop a keen judgment for where to go, when to go, and what to do when you get there.

>

> If you want to stick with thief, I think you'll have a pretty bad time when it comes to the initial learning/rank-climbing process. Good thieves can be extremely helpful to have around, but as a thief you'll generally lack the capacity to single-handedly carry awful teams to victory. Your biggest impacts actually tend to rely on your team's ability to make use of the opportunities you open for them. You can decap mid and far all day but still lose if your 4 teammates are feeding 2 opponents at home all match.

>

>

thanks once again :)

 

[Rekt.5360]

One thing that helped me a lot when I started was just camping dueling servers for a few weeks. Back in 2014-2015 I mainly played warrior and focused on side-noding. I quickly realized that I wouldn't really be able to do my job unless I actually understood what the classes coming to 1v1/1v2 me did. So I hit dueling servers (which nowadays are far less populated than before) and would spar with random people. A lot of the builds people run there are actually the same meta builds you'll find in ranked/unranked so figuring out what to dodge/interrupt/blind and when to pressure other builds helped immensely. Naturally this also helped a lot on team fight builds because you learn which big animations from other classes to watch out for and who is squishy and what not.

 

When I started the game way back in 2013 I started playing guardian in unranked and honestly it was quite awful. I had no solid basis for what to expect from ANYONE on the enemy team even less my own team (I was super confused why the thieves on my team never stuck around for team fights when they had such insane burst, until I played thief myself). I didn't really know what my build's strengths and weaknesses were, I'd rotate terribly and yolo/feed into fights that we couldn't win and would often end up in games where I got farmed by much better players. Ranked is in general a much better place as you move further in rating but you really need to have a basis before jumping in imo.

[Stallic.2397]

Forget playing the class you want to play- there's only meta builds. Find the right class/build and you'll start climbing

Forget solo Q'ing in ranked- Ranked Pvp is literally not built for climbing as a solo Q player. Find a good DuoQ partner or forget try-harding in ranked

Forget playing for fun- GW2 ranked isn't fun. Not even on a serious note kinda fun. Throw that idea out the window. You'll have to grind a lot of bad games to get to where you want to be.

[Firebeard.1746]

> @"Rainbowdash.5314" said:

> So, i came back to the game after a 3 and a bit year break where i previously was a hardcore raider and didn't really touch pvp/wvw at all. I returned about a month ago and have tried my best to learn pvp and understand what's going on. But honestly trying to learn in unranked is a joke.

> I've been matched with plats as a new unranked player. I've seen guardians with so much aegis 3 people can't kill them while their team leave, get the bonus objective and come back go wipe my team.

> As a thief I've been hit by ranger longbow 2 and get 100-0 on a hit-tracking skill even after i stealth and run, an uncountable number of times. I've had my shortbow blink get cucked by stupid interactions on FLAT terrain.

> Condi thief kills people by mashing skill 3 and it's not even adjusted to take more than 1 finger.

>

> How have you guys let this go on for so long?

> The posts of complaints are met with essentially 'get out of gold' mindsets and 'its just how it is around here' attitudes..

> Note that my perspective on balance is indeed limited and I'm more than aware, however ranked is not something i feel safe to do given low rank, placements included, the win or loss is simply who is abusing the overtuned kits the most.

> I don't get how you stay silent when the game seems to be in such a toxic state balance-wise.

> Would love to get some dialogue with people, especially the people that reached legend without win-trading to find out their thoughts on the direction the game is going with changes.

>

> Thanks

> New player 'A'

 

You're discovering something I discovered a while back: Skill based games still have vertical progression, it's just on your skill and not on a gear grind. You can't leave for years and then expect to come in swinging. Yes there are population issues, but generally it's not as bad on the weekend/when people are just getting back from work. The biggest issues I have there are late night.

 

That said, the people who have been playing this game for 8+ years are going to understand the metas. You just have to copy them. You're not going to get something clever, I thought I would, but in practice my off-meta builds just don't usually work out well. This is when having a character of every class is nice, because you can almost instantly bring a new character online in sPVP. You have to get to like level 2 or 5. Then you just port in to the mists and buy the white versions of the weapons you want to use. And as others have stated, watch pros. Unfortunately the population issues have been basically self-selecting really really skilled players (or botters) and that's been making it difficult for normal people to get in.

 

I will say though that toxicity is not uncommon in PVP towards people who are learning, which doesn't really help the population.

[Math.5123]

https://discord.gg/fD6VxyW

 

This is the community PvP discord. Has all the tools to make you improve at the game if you wish to utilize them.

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

> @"Rainbowdash.5314" said:

> So essentially the devs have abandoned pvp?

> If so why're they releasing balance patches for it.. if no work is being done..

> Thats just a big '?' on its own

 

After several years of pve based balance, terrible design decisions, and general neglect, pvp received one major patch on feb 25 2020 that addressed _some_ of the power creep issues. Since then, its been the regular silence from devs, and we are now seeing the return of the same old balance patches that dont address any of the major issues, and tend to create new ones.

 

[mixxed.5862]

> @"Rainbowdash.5314" said:

> So essentially the devs have abandoned pvp?

> If so why're they releasing balance patches for it.. if no work is being done..

> Thats just a big '?' on its own

>

> Thanks for the points all.

> Hopefully one day something positive appears!

> Until then I'll play afk on the point then run about, while talking a lot about the need for change!

 

Well, the devs haven't abandoned the game mode at all. The PvP dev team certainly is small but they're slowly bringing good changes. No, you've just come to the right place to vent your frustrations. This forum is filled with frustrated players that love complaining about the mode, the devs, the balance, matchmaking etc.

 

Here's a short list of the changes they did this year: Swiss-style automated tournaments, mini-seasons of 2v2 or 3v3, a very big balance patch for PvP (most skills rebalanced), more regular but small balance adjustments. Later this year we can expect a big tournament, more balance patches that come more frequently, more mini-seasons, we might even see a 10v10(?) map and tournaament. Honestly for this year it's not looking too shabby. I hope the next patch isn't too far away. Condi rev and nade holo need more work.

[Salvaraez.1627]

I have to say though that the recent balance patch was kinda missing the mark in my book. Grenades are still broken af and a good condi rev does still tank like theres no tomorrow if not shut down by exactly the nade holo I was mentioning. Sure there is skill involved, but there are also numerous builds just such a big way above anything else that it's getting kinda stupid. And these builds (especially nades) carry you without even knowing that much about the class. There is a reason why all the highest rated players play either rev or holo, right? I don't want to say that these players are carried by their class at all. It's more like they pick the strongest ones for the highest place on the leaderboards which I can fully understand.

People were hoping for actual balance changes in pvp, but the meta didn't change at all since the strongest builds remained the strongest builds for the same reasons they were the strongest before. That's not what I would call succesful game balance and that's why people are complaining. We don't love to complain, we just hope to be heard somehow.

[Psycoprophet.8107]

I honestly think something has shifted in the company and the devs have either been reallocated again or just downsized and gw2 isn't their main focus moving forward, even with the pandemic happening the balance quality, frequency and just general content seems to be so scarce its seriously one notch above maintenance mode. I wouldn't expect any major changes or fixes.

[Megametzler.5729]

> @"Salvaraez.1627" said:

>(...) There is a reason why all the highest rated players play either rev or holo, right? (...)

 

Must... not... say... it...! :lol:

 

[Vrath.1754]

> @"Trevor Boyer.6524" said:

> > @"Rainbowdash.5314" said:

> > So, i came back to the game after a 3 and a bit year break where i previously was a hardcore raider and didn't really touch pvp/wvw at all. I returned about a month ago and have tried my best to learn pvp and understand what's going on. But honestly trying to learn in unranked is a joke.

> > I've been matched with plats as a new unranked player. I've seen guardians with so much aegis 3 people can't kill them while their team leave, get the bonus objective and come back go wipe my team.

> > As a thief I've been hit by ranger longbow 2 and get 100-0 on a hit-tracking skill even after i stealth and run, an uncountable number of times. I've had my shortbow blink get cucked by stupid interactions on FLAT terrain.

> > Condi thief kills people by mashing skill 3 and it's not even adjusted to take more than 1 finger.

> >

> > How have you guys let this go on for so long?

> > The posts of complaints are met with essentially 'get out of gold' mindsets and 'its just how it is around here' attitudes..

> > Note that my perspective on balance is indeed limited and I'm more than aware, however ranked is not something i feel safe to do given low rank, placements included, the win or loss is simply who is abusing the overtuned kits the most.

> > I don't get how you stay silent when the game seems to be in such a toxic state balance-wise.

> > Would love to get some dialogue with people, especially the people that reached legend without win-trading to find out their thoughts on the direction the game is going with changes.

> >

> > Thanks

> > New player 'A'

>

> No offense, but this is just what happens in any game when you show up to a pvp scene 9 years late.

>

> Here is what you **_must_** do if you want to keep up:

>

> 1. Understand the 4 job roles. Team Fighter - Support - +1 Roamer - Side Node Duelist

> 2. Use a proper build for the job role that your class should be playing.

> 3. Find a person with a plat badge above their head who is playing the same class as you are. Ask them for advice & tips.

>

> If you're not willing to do at least that much, you're going to have a really rough ride.

 

This is a main part of it. Players have thousands of hours on these maps and with their classes. And it takes thousands of hours to really master something.

 

Like many of the current AAA MMO pvp scenes most of the Old Guard have years of experience. These older games dont get big injections of new players and players naturally move on lowering the total pool of players. This isn't exclusive to GW2.

 

A new player with no practice coming into unranked matched with these players.They just has to adapt and tough it out. Find a role and class you enjoy and if you truly enjoy it then move to ranked. There's certainly fun that can be had with the correct attitude, if it isnt fun move on and try something else, life too short to do things we dont enjoy or to be stuck in the negative.

[Rukia.4802]

You shouldn't care about stats in ranked, its a dead mode. If you aren't completely numb to losing in this game yet you haven't played nearly long enough.

 

I would not recommend this to a new player, I'd imagine most of us are either very long time vets or newbies and there isn't enough in between so you're grouped with either of those for some real silly matches. If you want real competition go play an fps or moba, it doesn't get much better here even in high ranks so don't think of it that way and stop trying to climb lol

 

Everyone has those terrain issues, especially thief with a lot of ports. You basically have to learn to deal with it and remember where it happens, I am thief main and it still screws me over consistently after all these years.

 

I am previous legend, plat3 blah blah and I am playing core zerk shatter and can still rank plat so its possible outside of the meta if you are good enough, but thief is hard to pick up and learn your role with.

 

Maybe start with something easier, in fact try playing the clown condi build and other builds that give you problems to learn how people play against it you so you can counter it yourself. If you wanna get good in this game its essential to multi-class imo.

 

unranked has full premades so you're better off in ranked anyway, trust me it will be a lot better than unranked lul only potatoes play there.