Questionable design choices or am I just crazy?

[kinomori.1456]

I started the game a month ago now, I started off as ele and was fully geared in exotic gear and ascended weapon/jewelry within a week, but gradually moved over to a mirage mesmer. I had a bit of trouble getting all of my exotic viper gear, but ended up getting mostly everything.... Mostly.

 

I've now run into the very big problem that I am timegated, raid gated, or straight up money gated from getting all of my jewelry. Despite the fact that most other classes have zero problems with this currently. My only options to get jewelry are as follows:

 

Earrings and rings: raid (which I've attempted but have yet to clear, and I don't think I'll be getting consistent any time soon), living world season 2 or 3 (which I can't afford), fractals (I've been doing them, but only being able to get ~10 a day is just making this really difficult considering I need 100+ of them, and WvW (which is timegated behind the fact that you can only get so many WvW Skirmish Tickets a week and it's a MASSIVE grind for people who don't really enjoy the PvP.)

 

Amulet: Same as above, but fortunately I can get a budget version from finishing story journal achievements, currently using one that's close to what I'd want but still not even close to the best in slot viper version.

 

Back slot: Actually, I'm not even really sure how you're expected to get a viper back slot item... Does ad infitum even allow Viper stats?

 

I assume that later on in LWS4, we'll get the vendors the same as LWS2/3 that give Viper jewelry, but the question is... why not now? Or rather, why not through other means in the meanwhile? This seems like really assholish design, and just pushes people away from these builds if you aren't clearing raids or own LWS2/3...

 

Am I the only one who has this sentiment?

[Shirlias.8104]

I would like to see a way to craft trinkets and possibily a way to change stats through MF as armor and weapons.

 

 

[Linken.6345]

considering that the backslot item you ask about is a legendary yes it do legendary got all stats

[AliamRationem.5172]

They do make it difficult to get your hands on non-armor HoT items. Perhaps it would be a good idea to add crafting recipes for these items in HoT stat flavors and add recipes to the mystic forge so you can change stats the same way you do for armor and weapons.

[zealex.9410]

I would suggest if you have hot to see into purchasing some of the lw2 episodes. Its by far the fastest way to get them imo.

[Jojo.6140]

If you could get your ascended weapon so easily, it should also be no problem for you to get the ~250g it costs to unlock the whole lws3. Especially if you already look at ad infinitum, wich costs 1k+

[kinomori.1456]

> @"Jojo.6140" said:

> If you could get your ascended weapon so easily, it should also be no problem for you to get the ~250g it costs to unlock the whole lws3. Especially if you already look at ad infinitum, wich costs 1k+

 

Ascended weapon costs like 40g to make, and ~70g to max the crafting. That's not even comparable to the 250g it costs just to unlock the ability to get the jewlery (aka buying LWS3 through gems).

[MachineManXX.9746]

I mean, you started the game one month ago, and you are now here complaining that it is too hard or time consuming, to completely outfit multiple characters in absolute end game gear? Really?

 

Buy Bitterfrost Frontier and either Bloodstone Fen or Lake Doric and you will have easy access to all ascended trinkets, including backpacks. This game is VERY easy to get max end game gear in a very short time. Not exactly sure what you expect?

 

To answer your question, yes, you are just crazy.

[Sojourner.4621]

Aside from the back item, you can absolutely get viper stat trinkets from crafting... they're just exotic tier and not ascended.

 

It doesn't make a lot of sense to me that the collection back items from HoT don't allow HoT stat selection though... that's the only piece that you can't get in viper with your current restrictions.

[Eltiana.9420]

Viper Backslot you can also get from LWS3.

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

What's the rush? If it took you only a week to acquire all Ascended, it would seem it would not take long to acquire enough Gold to purchase whatever it is you feel you _need_.

 

I'm not sure what you need it for, anyway; you aren't interested in WvW nor Raids, and PvP doesn't require it. Maybe it's Fractals; I can't tell if that is something you enjoy or not.

 

Remember, it's not a race; take your time and smell the Red Iris Flowers.

Good luck.

[Sojourner.4621]

> @"Eltiana.9420" said:

> Viper Backslot you can also get from LWS3.

 

He doesn't have LWS3

[Drecien.4508]

Um dont forget laurels and guild commendations for trinkets also.

[Randulf.7614]

You could just unlock one episode of LS3 and farm that map (you will need to do that maps story for access to the map, so keep that in mind). That will be less expensive I'm sure

 

Laurels and commendations from Guild missions are also a route to explore (not sure if the stats you want are there mind you)

 

I will point ascended is only needed for fractals. Its use elsewhere is for optimisation or preference. I use mostly exotics and have done for 4-5 years

[Haleydawn.3764]

> @"Drecien.4508" said:

> Um dont forget laurels and guild commendations for trinkets also.

 

One problem, the OP is asking for Viper's stats, which you can't buy for either of those currencies. Haha.

 

Viper's is a Heart of Thorns exclusive stat, you can buy ascended Back Items, Rings and Accessories to choose HoT exclusive stats on from Raids, LS3 maps, PvP Ascended League Vendor (Mist Band/Talisman/Pendant - All stats available to be selected, if you've got the relevant expansion), the Fractals vendor BUY-2046 PFR (Mist Band/Talisman/Pendant) WvW Skirmish Vendor (Mist Band/Talisman/Pendant)

 

 

 

 

> @"kinomori.1456" said:

 

> I've now run into the very big problem that I am timegated, raid gated, or straight up money gated from getting all of my jewelry. Despite the fact that most other classes have zero problems with this currently. My only options to get jewelry are as follows:

 

You have the same options as every other player.

 

 

 

> Back slot: Actually, I'm not even really sure how you're expected to get a viper back slot item... Does ad infitum even allow Viper stats?

 

*Moans about the time sink/gold sink of other acquisition methods, considers a Legendary back item first, rather than the ones mentioned from the content not willing to be bought*

 

 

> I assume that later on in LWS4, we'll get the vendors the same as LWS2/3 that give Viper jewelry, but the question is... why not now? Or rather, why not through other means in the meanwhile? This seems like really assholish design, and just pushes people away from these builds if you aren't clearing raids or own LWS2/3...

 

Most likely to get new vendors offering Path of Fire stat items, **Viper's is a Heart of Thorns exclusive stat** along with Trailblazer, Minstrel, Marauder, Commander's and Seraph.

[STIHL.2489]

> @"kinomori.1456" said:

> Am I the only one who has this sentiment?

 

Welcome to the New Anet Logic.

[kinomori.1456]

> @"MachineManXX.9746" said:

> I mean, you started the game one month ago, and you are now here complaining that it is too hard or time consuming, to completely outfit multiple characters in absolute end game gear? Really?

>

> Buy Bitterfrost Frontier and either Bloodstone Fen or Lake Doric and you will have easy access to all ascended trinkets, including backpacks. This game is VERY easy to get max end game gear in a very short time. Not exactly sure what you expect?

>

> To answer your question, yes, you are just crazy.

 

Okay, but why is it so much harder to gear up in Viper than it is compared to Berserker? I had zero trouble getting all of my Berserker gear but am currently stuck in a hole regarding Viper gear. If it's "absolute end game gear", why is it so hard for some classes, but not others? Isn't that just promoting a really bad balance in classes?

 

 

 

> @"Inculpatus cedo.9234" said:

> What's the rush? If it took you only a week to acquire all Ascended, it would seem it would not take long to acquire enough Gold to purchase whatever it is you feel you _need_.

>

> I'm not sure what you need it for, anyway; you aren't interested in WvW nor Raids, and PvP doesn't require it. Maybe it's Fractals; I can't tell if that is something you enjoy or not.

>

> Remember, it's not a race; take your time and smell the Red Iris Flowers.

> Good luck.

 

I AM interested in raids, but I'm not going to pull nearly as much DPS as I should when I'm missing 500 expertise and 700 condition damage. I'm not even talking about all ascended, I'm talking about jewelry, the stuff that on any other class I can get in 4x less time, if not more.

 

 

 

 

To everyone else just saying "just buy LW3", my point is that shouldn't be an argument, why do I HAVE to buy something that costs the same as the expansion just to be able to get accessories, compared to the fact that I could get those accessories on another class without having even bought any expansions.

 

You're missing my point, this just seems like bad design choices for it to be more difficult to gear up on certain classes compared to others, I can't think of a single MMO where this happens, and likely for good reason.

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

You need only buy the Episode(s) that offer the Trinkets you desire. At ~$2.50 an Episode, it hardly costs the same as an Expansion.

[HazyDaisy.4107]

> @"kinomori.1456" said:

> > @"MachineManXX.9746" said:

> > I mean, you started the game one month ago, and you are now here complaining that it is too hard or time consuming, to completely outfit multiple characters in absolute end game gear? Really?

> >

> > Buy Bitterfrost Frontier and either Bloodstone Fen or Lake Doric and you will have easy access to all ascended trinkets, including backpacks. This game is VERY easy to get max end game gear in a very short time. Not exactly sure what you expect?

> >

> > To answer your question, yes, you are just crazy.

>

> Okay, but why is it so much harder to gear up in Viper than it is compared to Berserker? I had zero trouble getting all of my Berserker gear but am currently stuck in a hole regarding Viper gear. If it's "absolute end game gear", why is it so hard for some classes, but not others? Isn't that just promoting a really bad balance in classes?

>

>

>

> > @"Inculpatus cedo.9234" said:

> > What's the rush? If it took you only a week to acquire all Ascended, it would seem it would not take long to acquire enough Gold to purchase whatever it is you feel you _need_.

> >

> > I'm not sure what you need it for, anyway; you aren't interested in WvW nor Raids, and PvP doesn't require it. Maybe it's Fractals; I can't tell if that is something you enjoy or not.

> >

> > Remember, it's not a race; take your time and smell the Red Iris Flowers.

> > Good luck.

>

> I AM interested in raids, but I'm not going to pull nearly as much DPS as I should when I'm missing 500 expertise and 700 condition damage. I'm not even talking about all ascended, I'm talking about jewelry, the stuff that on any other class I can get in 4x less time, if not more.

>

>

>

>

> To everyone else just saying "just buy LW3", my point is that shouldn't be an argument, why do I HAVE to buy something that costs the same as the expansion just to be able to get accessories, compared to the fact that I could get those accessories on another class without having even bought any expansions.

>

> You're missing my point, this just seems like bad design choices for it to be more difficult to gear up on certain classes compared to others, I can't think of a single MMO where this happens, and likely for good reason.

 

Beserker stats are 5 years old, vipers is just under 2 years old. New players can waltz in and insta 80 their toons complete with full exotic gear in mere minute now, where as many older players had to wait months to level both their toons and crafting to get exotic gear of any core stat or wait to save gold and purchase it. Ascended? Try waiting a year for just the first set of ascended armor, forget jewerly, that used to be dependant on waiting a whole month for 1 piece of jewerly per character purchased with end of the month laurels.

 

I mean, no offense but the system in place now is as quick as it's ever been and it's kind of insulting to those that have waited through all of it for you to come in and say it's not good enough.

[IndigoSundown.5419]

> @"kinomori.1456" said:

>

> Okay, but why is it so much harder to gear up in Viper than it is compared to Berserker? I had zero trouble getting all of my Berserker gear but am currently stuck in a hole regarding Viper gear. If it's "absolute end game gear", why is it so hard for some classes, but not others? Isn't that just promoting a really bad balance in classes?

>

I believe ANet tied the acquisition of Viper and the other expansion-specific prefixes to XPac purchases specifically to: promote sales of the XPac (and later, the LS episodes); and to promote ongoing play in the maps (for trinkets, the LS3 maps where one can get stat-select trinkets with those options). I believe it was very much intentional.

This is little different than WoW tying BiS gear to the raids in whatever XPac is current. I also believe that ANet did not, when designing this aspect of gearing, even consider the "plight" of people joining the game 2+ years post HoT.

 

It can be true that -- as far as PvE metas go -- this GW2 variant to gear progression only applies to specific builds. That said, I know that -- on Metabattle at least -- the WvW Direct damage builds are all calling for Marauders, which is also a HoT prefix. Again, iirc, WvW does not offer any means to get Marauder trinkets. I guess that's a more level playing field as far as gearing for WvW metas, with the added zinger that some WvW players dislike the PvE they have to do to get that gear.

 

Is that bad design? Maybe. Did ANet think that PvE meta builds for direct damage would switch to Marauders because raids would be "harder" than anything before seen in PvE, and maybe the Vitality on Marauders would be seen as being needed? I can readily believe that. ANet has been trying for years to respond to the PvE critics who claim that the PvE game is too easy. So far, all such attempts have been futile insofar as getting the player-driven metas to deviate from all-glass all-the-time.

[Trinnitty.8256]

welcome to the step backwards from GW1 design. GW1 could bing/load builds, swap stats easily through skill point system..

[Ayumi Spender.1082]

I got my ascended within a week. The Trinkets at least.

I'm Necro, but it's also vipers.

Backpack: Ember Bay

Accessory 1: Ember Bay

Accessory 2: Bitterfrost

Amulet: Lake Doric

Ring 1: Bitterfrost

Ring 2: Draconis Mons

 

For 2 of my weapons, I got one from Scourge Specialization Ascended and the other from Firebrand Specialization Ascended.

My other 2 weapons, I crafted. I only have exotic armour though and see no way to get those easily.

[Evolute.6239]

In effect you can get any Base+HOT stat ascended trinket from only THREE LWS3 maps (Bitterfrost, Ember Bay, Draconis Mons) which is only 150g for "infinite" amount of ascended accessories that cover all 5 slots + backpack.

 

150g is about one week of dailies (14g a week), fractal dailies (105g~ a week, usually more via drops to sell), and meta events (30g~ a week if you just do the hot ones on reset, much more if you have Istan access or get any lucky drops).

 

How do you propose they make it even EASIER to get them than they already are? That's not including just buying the DLC on its own and then being able to jump straight into LWS3 maps.

[Haleydawn.3764]

> @"IndigoSundown.5419" said:

 

> It can be true that -- as far as PvE metas go -- this GW2 variant to gear progression only applies to specific builds. That said, I know that -- on Metabattle at least -- the WvW Direct damage builds are all calling for Marauders, which is also a HoT prefix. Again, iirc, WvW does not offer any means to get Marauder trinkets.

 

 

All stats available to be selected, (if you've got the relevant expansion);-

 

-PvP Ascended League Vendor (Mist Band/Talisman/Pendant.

-Fractals vendor BUY-2046 PFR (Mist Band/Talisman/Pendant).

-**WvW Skirmish Vendor (Mist Band/Talisman/Pendant)**

 

The Mist accessories are not unique either.

[Feanor.2358]

LS3 maps addressed the issue really. They added easy to get trinkets with selectable stats, scattered across the maps.