Minion Rework

[Swadow.6213]

Necromancer minions have been for a long time a joke and mostly used only for autofarming bots. I would suggest a simple change that would make both issues go away. What this change would be is to reverse how minion skills work and have the minion as the secondary rather than primary and make all minions have a limited lifespan. But below is the overall changes

 

General Change

===

 

- All minion skills now use Charge System

- Minions summoned by minion skills now have a duration

- Minions now take less damage from area of effect abilities

- Minion damage now has power coefficient

 

Summon Blood Fiend

===

 

- Now called Taste of Death

- Heals when used

- Maximum charges 1, charge recovery 16 seconds

- Summons a blood fiend for 20 seconds

 

Summon Bone Fiend

===

 

- Now called Rigor Mortis

- Immobilizes target

- Maximum charges 2, charge recovery 25 seconds

- Cooldown 5 seconds

- Summons a Bone Fiend for 50 seconds

 

Summon Bone Minions

===

 

- Now called Putrid Explosion

- Creates an explosion and blast finisher at the target location

- Maximum charges 3, charge recovery 20 seconds

- Cooldown 2 seconds

- Summons 2 Bone Minions for 25 seconds

 

Summon Flesh Wurm

===

 

- Now called Necrotic Traversal

- Stun break, gain LF and teleport to target area with a blast finisher poisoning nearby enemies at both locations

- Maximum charges 1, charge recovery 32 seconds

- Summons a Flesh Wurm at the target location for 20 seconds

 

Summon Shadow Fiend

===

 

- Now called Haunt

- Shadowstep to target enemy gaining life force and inflicting conditions around the target

- Maximum charges 2, charge recovery 24 seconds

- Cooldown 4 seconds

- Summons Shadow Minion at the target for 30 seconds

 

Summon Flesh Golem

===

 

- Now called Charging Golem

- Summons a Flesh Golem behind the necromancer that charges at the target knocking or launching enemies within its' path

- Maximum charges 2, charge recovery 40 seconds

- Cooldown 5 seconds

- Flesh Golem stays on the field for 40 seconds

 

Flesh of the Master

===

 

- Now increases duration of all minion lifespan instead of health

 

Necromantic Corruption

===

- Increases damage of minions and minion type skills

- Minion skills also transfer condition when used by necromancer with ICD of 5

 

Death Nova

===

 

- Decreses charge recovery time of minion skills by 15%

- Flesh of the Master increases Jagged Horror duration

 

Summon Madness (Lich ability)

===

 

- Maximum charges 1, charge recovery 30 seconds(Same as before)

- Affected by Death Nova

[Vlad Morbius.1759]

I miss playing my minion master but it isn't feasible at high levels now, so yes i agree that it needs to be reworked.

[Mirkwood.7130]

I never even log into the forums, but I had to when I saw this. My minion condition build got me through on my first play through of the personal story, LS2, HoT, LS3, and a bit of PoF. I know how great minions are for a solo player, and this idea is perfect! It makes it so you have the minions only when you want them and it makes them more active, since the active skill is what summons them. I would definitely return to my minion build if this, or something like this were implemented. Nice idea!

[arenta.2953]

no summon duration. if u want that go play an engineer.

 

having minions that actually STICK AROUND is one reason i like them. cause i don't need to worry about them running out of summon on me durign a long fight.

[killfil.3472]

Just make "Putrid explosion" 's critical hit chance that of the necro, rather than that of the minion (4%)

[Liewec.2896]

i main MM necro because i like the perma-minions, as Arenta said, if you want temporary utility summons you should be playing engi instead :tongue:

 

its be a pain in the butt waiting on cooldowns before pulls and then having to run through all of them summoning them up,

i like running around with my undead buddies and only needing to reanimate them when they die.

[Khailyn.6248]

While I like the idea of charges and fixed duration of the summon. i dont see how it would work with the current activated skills which range from weak to necessary.

[Anchoku.8142]

What are the cast times?

[Khailyn.6248]

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Minion

[Rhyse.8179]

All they really need is their active skills to be useful.

[Nimon.7840]

> @"Rhyse.8179" said:

> All they really need is their active skills to be useful.

 

And scale withe the stats of the necro

[UnDeadFun.5824]

I don't know how feasible it is, but why can't we have the same/similar mechanic that was used in the PoF story line for controlling minions.

[Hyper Cutter.9376]

> @"arenta.2953" said:

> no summon duration. if u want that go play an engineer.

>

> having minions that actually STICK AROUND is one reason i like them. cause i don't need to worry about them running out of summon on me durign a long fight.

Yeah, that. _None_ of the summons in this game should have a duration, they should all stay on the field until they're killed or you decide to get rid of them yourself.

[Taygus.4571]

> @"arenta.2953" said:

> no summon duration. if u want that go play an engineer.

>

> having minions that actually STICK AROUND is one reason i like them. cause i don't need to worry about them running out of summon on me durign a long fight.

 

I agree.

I really dislike that elementals suddenly die (after a timer, but it feels sudden) on me when my ele summons them.

[Sublimatio.6981]

no thanks i dont want to resummon minions or have them die on timer, thats lame. they should just use necro's power/crit/cdmg and the bone minions should get bleeding on attack and like 10 poison stacks on explosion. wurm should spam burning on attacks.

[Kumouta.4985]

i like this idea. It means you can have a lot more minions out by spamming for a bit, and you're much more active and mobile(which is something necros really want).

Only issues i see are: minions then being worse for condi MMs, but if the power coefficient is low enough it just helps power without not being viable for a condi build.

and necrotic traversal not letting you burst out if an exploding wurm.

[Anchoku.8142]

If you propose using the same cast times as current minions, I do not support the change.

[Dadnir.5038]

come one... At least name blood fiend active _kiss of death_... outside of that, you could have suggested a golem that know how to swim...

[Runiir.6425]

Not just no but hell no. If you want timed summons Engineer is there for you.

Honestly I'd like to see an elite trait line that has us have MORE permanent summons. The whole point of a Necromancer that specializes in minions in /any/ game is to have an army with you wherever you go.

Our current minions have only 2 problems;

1) There stats are fixed instead of scaling with ours. Frankly their health should be based upon our own. Yes, this means our minions should be capable of taking a beating as Necromancers typically have the largest health pools in this game. Not just health, their critical chance and every other stat of the minions should be boosted by our own. Minions need to be a /threat/. In PvP when a minion master rolls up people need to have a mindset of "if I ignore the minions I am DEAD".

2) Minions need higher defensive co-efficients to make them actually survive. They should flat out ignore 80% of any AoE damage and take reduced condition damage. The reason being is simple, they cannot dodge and have no awareness. Now I am completely fine with them not having such defensive boosts if they give minions an AI that has them dodge attacks and run out of AOEs. When I say dodge, I mean player dodge...IE immune to everything during the dodge. A part of defensive management is that all minions need to be able to attack while moving! It is beyond stupid that you can kite a minion so easily by just strafe circling within it's attack range and it can't ever hit you because the AI can't attack and move at the same time.

 

The defensive changes need made to Ranger pets as well. I find it HORRIBLY stupid and beyond rediculous that the melee mesmer clones can attack while moving but not necro minions or ranger pets.

[Swagg.9236]

Timed summons are fine. I don't know why everyone has their pants in a bunch about it except for maybe wanting to RP as a horror herder. The ammo charges, effects and durations that you have lined up all synchronize nicely to allow players to field huge amounts of creatures or keep a measured number constantly in play. Making all the important abilities happen up front and independent of bad AI gimmicks is also a good decision. Just feels bad that now there is nothing to do with the minions post-cast except to let them run around brainlessly like a ranger pet.

[BrokenGlass.9356]

This is a great idea.

 

What the detractors here are failing to see is that you *aren't summoning them more* and *the timers mean nothing*.

 

If I cast Putrid Explosion, I get damage right away, and minions who will live *almost* as long as the recharge. Thus means that if you cast Putrid Explosion whenever you would, you get minions...

 

If you have a quick bar full of minions... Then every fight you'd have more minions each fight as you rotate through your utilities...

 

 

Your armies are BIGGER than before, and you don't telegraph what build your running to enemy players from the edge of the game's draw distance.

 

 

Not to mention the purely thematically appropriate concept of a *necromancer calling forth undead from the ground* every time he's in danger.

[Runiir.6425]

BrokenGlass, the theme of necromancers in fantasy isn't one of summoning minions while in danger. When in sudden danger they erect bone walls, conjure forth bone armor, or wail like a banshee to force people away. On the attack? A necromancer is supposed to have an ARMY. My problem so far is even our current minions don't feel like an army. Double (hell in GW1 you could have as many as 20+ minions if you were a true minion master and your group moved quickly) even tripple the number of minions we summon and it'll finally have the TRUE thematic look of a necromancer.

 

Actual thematic look and vibe for a necromancer is the general at the back of an undead army that never goes away until you smash it to pieces. No timer, and no piddly limit. We should be fielding 10+ minions that are a true pain to try and fight against. 1v1 a minion master should be seen as something you have to commit to the battle if you want to kill it. IE your only chance at winning is to completely give up on having any escape plan at all, victory or death being the only options. Yes, this means thieves and mesmers would have to completely change their entire thought processes or just accept that necromancer=death (ironic that they AREN'T seen that way right?) to fight against.

And before the cries of "that would be too OP!" start...many...many games give necromancers the ability to summon even more minions (I can think of one such game I capped out around 70 minions, yes...a game with pvp...even perma death! mind you in that game you needed a corpse to summon a minion so no corpses meant no minions) and it was balanced around the same idea our minions in this game should be balanced. You do not carve a path through them, you use skirmish hit and run tactics to weaken them and kite them away from the master. You whittle down the minions before making a strike at the character. Though I am aware that players in this game often have the FPS mindset of "if I can't cleave through it than it is too hard/OP and needs nerfed till I can" sadly.

 

Timed minions...pfah! You want that go summon elementals. It makes sense there. The undead do not just fall apart, they stay shambling ever onward toward their prey and only damage sustained can ever stop them.

 

Mind you I also feel our summons shouldn't go away when we die, they should lock onto the person that killed us and continue the attack. If said person runs away fast enough, then they stay where they are attacking anyone that comes near. When we revive, they come back to us. No, it would not be overpowered...it just makes sense. They are UNDEAD! If you don't kill them they should remain a problem. Ranger pets going away makes sense, they are partners that fight only alongside their character. Necromancer minions already have the spark of unlife in them...without the necromancer they are no longer controlled but they are still there. Thus they should follow simple minded protocals. Attack what attacked the controller until destruction. GW1 had this in it and it was considered balanced! When you died your minions stayed, they targeted whoever landed the killing blow on you, if the person died or got out of there quickly enough thent he minions would remain as nuetrals and attack whoever was close to them (friend or foe but not each other). If the necromancer was ressurected by a monk then the minions that were still standing re-aquired your ownership tag and would only attack the other side again. frankly I find it wierd as heck that our current minions don't follow the same ideology.

[killfil.3472]

Here's the big problem for me : buffing our own minions seems like something we should be able to to with relative ease. It isn't.

Also, why ô why is PUTRID EXPLOSION's critical hit chance not that of the necromancer!?