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PvP/WvW Skill Split Release


Gaile Gray.6029

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In regards to the buff to blood is power.

 

I think the intention is fine, have it be a self damage buff for burst period. However I am pretty sure it will still not be used because the biggest issue is the cast time. I don't think anybody will spend 3/4 in combat to cast this and then try to burst especially with boon removal is in play. The most you will see is people use right before combat and then go in but that's usually not very practical. Maybe consider either reduce/remove the cast time?

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> @"Gaile Gray.6029" said:

>

> - By decreasing the power of some of the more dominant builds, we hope to give increased viability to builds that previously were pushed out by these dominant specs. We're also increasing power levels in some targeted areas that previously were underperforming.

>

> **Reduce effectiveness of offensive instant cast skills/traits**

>

> - **Instant cast spells don't give players an opportunity to respond. While we don't want to remove combos utilizing instant cast abilities, we wanted to reduce the impact they have.**

>

> ### Thief

>

> #### Skills

>

> - Heartseeker: Increased the power coefficients at all thresholds by 20% in PvP and WvW. The new values are as follows.

> - Above 50%: 1.0 to 1.2

> - Below 50%: 1.5 to 1.8

> - Below 25%: 2.0 to 2.4

> - Shadow Shot: Increased the initiative cost from 4 to 5 in PvP and WvW. Increased Increased the power coefficient from 1.325 to 1.8 (+36%) in PvP and WvW

> - Infiltrator's Strike: Increased the power coefficient from .75 to .9 (+20%) in PvP and WvW

 

> ### Mesmer

 

>BARELY TOUCHED.

 

 

You know, the two MAIN culprits of unfun one-shots, Thief and Mesmer, not only remain relatively untouched, the've got indirectly BUFFED as a result of all those defensive nerfs. This is proposterous.

 

Buffing Heart seeker only contributes to one-shots as it's often paired with a Black Powder+Hearseeker+Steal+Backstab for an almost insta down, by buffing it you're contributing to those stupid one-shots you seem to be against.

 

Shadow shot already hits ridiculously hard, it's an awesome gap closer and blinds, but its greatest perk is that it's a frikin' UNBLOCKABLE blind. It doesn't need more damage, AT ALL.

 

Same thing with Infiltrator's Strike, it doesn't need to hit harder whatsoever.

 

What about Mesmer Phantasms hitting ridiculously hard? Or the super easy to land one-shot combo from STEALTH? You could do so many relatively simple things to avoid this like Mind Wrack having a greater delay on each clone shattering, getting revealed when casting a Phantasm, reporpusing Mantra of Pain... or just flat out reducing their damage.

 

> @"Gaile Gray.6029" said:

>

> ### Ranger

>

> #### Skills

>

> - Seed of Life: Increased the cooldown from 1 second to 3 seconds in PvP and WvW

Seed of life has a delay and forces you to be static, why don't you make it remove 2 conditions as before then?

> - Rejuvenating Tides: Reduced the base healing per pulse from 650 to 550 (-15%) in PvP and WvW

Now you not only get to be a Druid only every 20 seconds, you now also get to heal for LESS.

> - Solar Beam: Reduced the power coefficient per strike from 0.3 to 0.25 (-17%) in PvP and WvW

You're nerfing a skill that already hits like a wet noodle and does irrelevant damage. Solam Beam is NOT the issue with Druid.

> - Celestial Avatar: Increased the cooldown from 15 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW

You're just getting it ALL wrong. Druid is a HEALING spec. Otherwise it's just a low damage useless Ranger that tickles you from afar with a laser-stick (which you're nerfing even farther lmao.) with the occasional pet skill. All of their skills interact with the Celestial Avatar, the healing skills, the utilities and the elite, even the staff greatly helps to fill that astral force faster. By nerfing the CD, you are gutting all of those interactions as well, while also making the spec LESS FUN to play.

 

Why don't you nerf the culprits instead? Druidic Clarity and Celestial Shadow. Something like Druidic Clarity only removes damaging conditions, remove the stunbreak and put it into something like Natural Convergence; Celestial Shadow stealth and superspeed reduced to 2s. Just throwing some ideas. Increasing Celestial Avatar CD is NOT the way to go.

 

With that said, in WvW Druids don't really accomplish their intended function as support healers at all, they are overshadowed by everything else. They are played as annoying roamers (that don't kill anyone decently geared and speced) in WvW and they are not even good at fliping camps so they are not even meta anywhere in WvW.

They are this weird roamer, bunkerish bruiser in sPvP (a little too strong at that with both traits mentioned above), but nowhere near a strict support like a Firebrand or a Tempest.

 

What could be very important skills such as CA Cosmic Ray (low AoE range and too long of a delay) or Staff skills such as Astral Whisp (pitiful damage, too long of a cast time) and Vine Surge (too long of a cast time) are downright unusable.

 

Give them more group options to make them more desirable in bigger groups like Rejuvenating tides pulsing condi cleanse on others (not you), or Natural Convergence sharing its stability to others as well. Some ideas here and there.

I insist, I don't like this balance approach to Druid at all, this heavily time-gated stuff is crap.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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> @"Forsaken.7015" said:

> Necro trait - Chill of death casts passive lesser spinal shivers that can hit for over 5k. If the goal is to nerf passives this skill on a 20 second cooldown should be looked at. 5k unavoidable damage and it removes 3 boons on a 20 second cd that procs passively zero skill involved.

>

> If this has already been talked about forgive.

 

Not sure what profession you play but if you take a look through most of necros traits particularly the offensive ones. Most of them are sub par until they hit a foe at the 50% threshold

Furthermore have you considered not dripping yourself in boons thus decreasing the damage of spinal shivers. The damage is unavoidable as it will not trigger if you never fall below 50%. Ideally if a necro gets you to 50% its when they gain the advantage. The damage is not free and requires actual work to be made to trigger it. Its not a no skill trait.

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> ### Revenant

>

> #### Skills

>

> - Coalescence of Ruin: Reduced the power coefficient of the second impact from 1.75 to 1.5 (-14%) in WvW only. Reduced the power coefficient of the third impact from 2.25 to 1.75 (-22%) in WvW only.

 

With all the projectile hate in the game (winds) as well as the recent removal of quickness on the shiro elite skill Impossible Odds, hammer is barely usable as is. Staff and sword/x is a much better option for roaming since hammer so slow. I don't believe CoR is an opressive or even particularly impactful aspect of zerg fights. The only from of cc hammer offers is an extremely slow and telegraphed aoe knockdown, not even comparable in power to any of the instant/reliable cc skills available in zergs.

 

My point is CoR is basically all hammer revenant has, and it cant handle any more nerfs.

 

> - Razorclaw's Rage: Increased the Bleeding duration from 2 seconds to 4 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Icerazor's Ire: Increased the Power coefficient from 3.7 to 4.6 (+24%) in PvP and WvW

 

Renegade offers no mobility or reliable damage/utility to ever be used. the buffs are neat but i doubt they will increase viability.

 

> - Soothing Stone: Increased the number of conditions cleansed from 3 to 5 in PvP and WvW

> - Vengeful Hammers: Reduced the upkeep cost from 7 to 6 in PvP and WvW

> - Forced Engagement: Reduced the energy cost from 25 to 10. Increased the cooldown from 10 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Embrace the Darkness: Increased the attribute bonus from 10% to 15% in PvP and WvW

> - Banish Enchantments: Increased the number of boons removed from 2 to 3 in PvP and WvW

> - Pain Absorption: Reduced the energy cost from 35 to 30 in PvP and WvW

 

Forced Engagement was too expensive to really use so this is a nice change. Banish Enchantments was probably fine with removing 2 boons. The extra cleanse on Soothing Stone is nice.

>

> #### Traits

>

> - Eye for an Eye: Increased the cooldown from 45 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

> - Versed in Stone: Increased the cooldown from 60 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

> - Soothing Bastion: Increased the cooldown from 25 seconds to 60 seconds in PvP only

 

These are all good things.

Please consider fixing Revenant bugs/targeting in WvW.

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Well....I think the planned split is ultimately going to change the "meta composition" squads (bus) without really changing the gameplay .... And that once again we will adapt...until the next balancing change.

 

If the goal is to really enrich the gameplay thinking global, then we could think of introducing a collision management system between characters (friend and enemy) in PvP situation. It could perhaps change deeply the gameplay, making it even more strategic and tactical.

The introduction of a collision management system beetween character (friend and ennemy) in a pvp situation should bring an end to "mono ball" quest of every CM in WvW situation, and make players think in term of land control during the fight.

In addition of such a system, Giving a different color (Purple as an exemple) to the name of the 5 people (and to their point on the map) who are in a same group Inside a big squad could help them to stay together during the fight (boon share, support, ...).

 

It's just some idea, but i'll be particularly curious to see the impact of a collision system in GW2 WvW situation.

 

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As far as Spellbreaker Dagger goes, I'm very curious why you intend to nerf Dagger AA damage, when it's already on the low side. Also the the shave off the Disrupting Stab stun duration as well? it feels like D/D is going to be a unrewarding set now compared to the safety I would get with something like Shield. Everything else though seems pretty reasonable, maybe aside from Breaching Strike but meh.

 

I do like the power buffs to sword, hopefully you'll be able to revive the pre-rework sword power builds, but I think it needs a bigger increase on power coefficients or at least a bump up in base damage. I really think too you should just either rework flurry, or perhaps greatly reduce the channel time but buff the damage, bleed application stacks. Since no one ever uses Flurry for the full channel, especially when it roots it you. Offhand sword needs some attention too...it's one of Warriors most underwhelming offhands atm, An Idea I had for it would be to have impale's secondary skill 'Rip' be a gap closer/dash. increase the power damage and applying cripple when you do successfully Rip. Current 'Rip' is way too hard to actually pull off on a moving target, and if you do happen to do so it's very unrewarding. considering the window of time you have in order to do it. Riposte attack trigger should be PbAoE, Decent power damage scaling with Bleed Stacks and weakness application.

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> @"Turk.5460" said:

> > @"Khenzy.9348" said:

>

> > Shadow shot already hits ridiculously hard, it's an awesome gap closer and blinds, but its greatest perk is that it's a frikin' UNBLOCKABLE. It doesn't need more damage, AT ALL.

>

> Shadow Shot damage is not unblockable.

 

I wrote blind at the end there, I must have accidentally deleted it when formatting. Editted. My point still stands.

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> @"Turk.5460" said:

> > @"Khenzy.9348" said:

>

> > Shadow shot already hits ridiculously hard, it's an awesome gap closer and blinds, but its greatest perk is that it's a frikin' UNBLOCKABLE. It doesn't need more damage, AT ALL.

>

> Shadow Shot damage is not unblockable.

 

It is and it isn't. The projectile is and does ~ 25% of the total skill damage. The stab after the shadowstep is not.

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> @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said:

> > @"Hiraldo.7954" said:

> > Resistance -> Immob revert is the most important change that needs to be made at the moment, please consider addressing it in this patch!

>

> We're going to discuss it. No guarantees in either way though.

 

For the love of everything good and holy, please rethink some of those Holosmith nerfs. I know you didn’t want us concentrating too much on singular class changes, but wow, how can I not? At the very least, please think about reducing the heat cost to the Photon Forge skills.

 

 

Thank you.

 

Edited for typos.

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> @"Lexan.5930" said:

> > ### Mesmer

> >

> > #### Skills

> >

> > - Illusion of Life: Reduced the cooldown from 120 seconds to 75 seconds in PvP and WvW

> > - Phantasmal Disenchanter – Increased the cooldown from 20 seconds to 25 seconds in PvP and WvW

> >

> > #### Traits

> >

> > - Elusive Mind: This trait now applies 4 seconds of Exhaustion when breaking a stun

> > - Compounding Power: Reduced the outgoing damage buff per stack from 3% to 2% in PvP and WvW

> > - Phantasmal Force: Reduced the Might granted from 3 stacks to 2 stacks in PvP and WvW

> > - Mirror of Anguish: Increased cooldown from 60 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

>

> this is not enough. Mesmers do more burst damage and more condi sustain than necro's can do even currently in pvp, and they are only getting a few changes. barley any changes to the 30k in under 2 seconds that a shatter mesmer can do or the 10k burning that staff mirage can put out. Not to mention that they still have invulnerability which is capable of reducing an infinite amount of damage to 0.

>

> > ### Necromancer

> >

> > #### Skills

> >

> > - Garish Pillar: Increased the cooldown from 15 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW

> > - Desert Shroud: Increased the cooldown from 20 seconds to 30 seconds in PvP and WvW

> > - Ghastly Breach: Increased the cooldown from 75 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP and WvW

> > - Plague Signet: Increased the cooldown from 30 seconds to 40 seconds in PvP and WvW

> > - Trail of Anguish: Increased the cooldown from 25 seconds to 35 seconds in PvP and WvW

> > - Signet of Undeath: Reduced the cooldown from 150 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP and WvW

> > - Life Siphon: Reduced the cooldown from 12 seconds to 10 seconds in PvP and WvW

> > - Dark Pact: Reduced the cooldown from 25 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW

> > - Signet of Vampirism: Reduced the cooldown from 35 seconds to 30 seconds in PvP and WvW. Increased the base heal from 3960 to 4950 (+25%) in PvP and WvW

> > - Well of Blood: Increased the base heal from 5240 to 6026 (+15%) in PvP and WvW. Increased the heal per pulse from 280 to 490 (+75%) in PvP and WvW

> > - Spectral Grasp: Reduced the cooldown from 50 seconds to 35 seconds in PvP and WvW

> > - Blood is Power: Adjusted the Might granted from 10 stacks for 10 seconds to 15 stacks for 6 seconds in PvP and WvW

> > - Well of Suffering: Reduced the cooldown from 35 seconds to 30 seconds in PvP only. Increased the amount of Vulnerability applied per pulse from 2 stacks to 4 stacks in PvP only.

> > - Signet of the Locust: Increased the power coefficient from 0.65 to 1.0 (+54%) in PvP and WvW. Increased the base heal per hit from 970 to 1455 (+50%) in PvP and WvW

> >

> > #### Traits

> >

> > - Reaper's Protection: Increased the cooldown from 60 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

> > - Last Gasp: Increased the cooldown from 50 seconds to 75 seconds in PvP only

>

> this is kicking the legs out from an already crippled player. The .5 second delay for all cast times already hinders pve, but in pvp it was just plain annoying. Now cooldowns for our "defensive" skills on scourge are getting ripped apart and skills that are mostly useless are getting tiny little buffs.

> Signet of undeath is useless because of a 3 second cast time thats all but impossible to get off with any sort of teleportation class on you (thief, mesmer, rev, guard)

> plague signet already gets nullified but blocks or blinds or dodges.

> you can't cast life siphon unless your facing the target which makes it really bad as any kind of melee combat skill

> trail of anguish is the only reliable place we can get stab, well of power has a 1/4 cast time that can be interrupted, and only gives stab on cast

>

> necro mancer skills already take a long time to cast and require lots of precast to be any kind of combo worthy of bust combo potential that mesmers thieves or elle's get. There's no way to get away if you miss a combo, no insta telleports, 1 leap only on a specialization, no access to super speed, no blocks, no invulnerability and don't bring up shroud because it always has a limited amount of damage it can absorb where as chain blocks and especially invulnerability can prevent an infinite amount of damage.

>

> TLDR : necro's are getting burn to a crisp unessisarily, where as other clases (especially mesmer) are stil, if not more, opressive and bursty than a necro, but get almost no changes.

 

necros shouldn't be able to do the kind of burst damage that thief and mesmers do. Though, yes, mesmers crazy 100-0 bursts are indeed a problem.

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> @"Shazmataz.1423" said:

 

> So, it's all about being competitive? I don't do pvp much anymore but I can agree with some of your points but why should players be shoe horned into playing certain builds to be competitive? There should be a variety of builds that are equally competitive otherwise it's just boring.

 

This is exactly what I was trying to say earlier. But, oh well, they can look at my signature and understand what the problem is.

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Thief needs a lot more nerfs than they're getting this first draft. Just reading through these notes I can tell thief will be the most busted thing. First, the removal of surging rune, a huge defense for most classes against thief that generally have a hard time with them(rev/war for example). Second, the removal of magi amulet making FB and any support really more prone to get insta bursted by thief. As it stands right now s/d thief with double steal is one of TWO things that can kill a FB 1v1 and in a teamfight s/d plus can end the fight pretty quick by double stealing a firebrand. Third, the removal of passives from several bruisers that made them sustain the thief +1 such as defy pain/auto balanced stance/auto S/Signet of stone. You can't just gut every bruiser's sustain and ability to hold 1vx and sustain the thief + for a little bit(doesnt take good thieves long to get the kill or + till full cap), then nerf firebrand(mostly just magi amulet gone), then remove surging runes, and on top of that keep s/d thief almost EXACTLY as is. There's a reason S/D thief is meta even with un-nerfed FB/scourge/bruisers.

 

As for my 2nd point, mirage definitely needs more nerfs. I know the devs spoke on adding more nerfs to it somewhere but I can not stress this enough. Classes like druid/warrior/holo rely on their passives to hold 1vx, mirage doesn't. In the current meta, mirage is already the strongest 1v1 bruiser, most mobile, and has access to portal and infinite stun breaks. Devs please look seriously into giving mesmer a more defined role instead of having them do EVERYTHING in this current meta(and several metas before with condi chrono). As of right now, Mirage just does way too much and it being nerfed the least, while all the other bruisers getting almost gutted makes no sense.

 

Edit: I'm only speaking from a 'real' competitive comp's standpoint and PvP only. I'm aware that 90% of mesmers in ranked run 1 shot mantra GS memes.

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> # High Level Goals

> Reduce effectiveness of offensive instant cast skills/traits

> * Instant cast spells don't give players an opportunity to respond. While we don't want to remove combos utilizing instant cast abilities, we wanted to reduce the impact they have.

 

Ok, where is nerf for _oneshotfromstealth deadeye_ then? How am i supposed to react agains one shot from stealth? Its not fun to play agains this broken bullshit [https://youtu.be/cIdZ1AkIKM8](https://youtu.be/cIdZ1AkIKM8 "https://youtu.be/cIdZ1AkIKM8")

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> @"eley crey.2905" said:

> All the passive stuff needs to go from WvW too, preferably removed from the game all together.

 

Maybe, but then you have to remove all those kitten oneshot builds, otherwise they become uncontrollable, especially the ones starting from stealth will have zero counterplay whatsoever imho.

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Here are my thoughts **from WvW perspective** on some of the classes:

**Overall:** Split more skills not just from PvE but between PvP and WvW too. When you nerf popular PvP build don't nerf them in WvW too, there is no need for that.

**Warrior**: No need for dagger nerf in WvW, Shout/Standard changes are good step towards bringing vanila support war back but probably not enough. Winds of disenchantment need some big nerfs, probably to cast time and/or ticks, duration.

**Revenant**: While CoR is OP it's almost the only reason Rev is even played. He really needs some better compensations. Condi Rev could use some buffs too.

**Guardian**: Good changes, Firebrand outshines vanila and DH way too much.

**Ranger**: barely even played, Druids can't really compete with Firebrands as a support (no need for nerfs!). Maybe making "Search and Rescue" 1200 range again in WvW could at least create some niche role for them. Melee Soulbeast could use some buffs too, maybe increase leader of the pack (AoE stance trait) radius to 600?

**Engi**: Holosmith nerfs would probably kill engi in WvW altogether. He honestly even deserves some buffs since he is not even used by GvG guilds where he should in theory shine . Mortar/Toolkit will see play only with viable Scrapper/Vanila build. Buffing them by themselves is pointless.

**Ele**: both staff dps and aurashare support see almost no play, really need some buffs.

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> @"JusticeRetroHunter.7684" said:

> Druid is basically bunker cancer in spvp. I agree with nearly everything on this list. If the WVWer's complain, split it between the two seperate game modes because the bunker meta needs to finally disappear.

 

Funny thing is, in WvW it's the opposite. Druids fought all throughout HoT to have a spot in zerg fights (roaming was fine), and now that we have one, they're taking it away again. The main issue in WvW right now is the condi spam and scourges being overpowered. Having a split would be a good change I think.

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> @"SuchosCZ.2167" said:

> > # High Level Goals

> > Reduce effectiveness of offensive instant cast skills/traits

> > * Instant cast spells don't give players an opportunity to respond. While we don't want to remove combos utilizing instant cast abilities, we wanted to reduce the impact they have.

>

> Ok, where is nerf for _oneshotfromstealth deadeye_ then? How am i supposed to react agains one shot from stealth? Its not fun to play agains this broken kitten [https://youtu.be/cIdZ1AkIKM8](https://youtu.be/cIdZ1AkIKM8 "https://youtu.be/cIdZ1AkIKM8")

 

I stopped watching halfway through this. I hate to say this, but you seriously need to L2P m8. One of those downs you literally just ran into. That was like deciding to walk into on coming traffic that you see a mile away.

 

Also, Death’s Jusdgement has a pretty big tell before it hits, making it super easy to dodge.

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> @"Gaile Gray.6029" said:

> A message from the Competitive and Skills & Balance Teams:

>

> Hi folks! The Competitive team and the Skills & Balance team have been working together closely on a future balance release that focuses almost entirely on PvP and WvW skill splits. As part of this, we wanted to switch things up and approach this release similar to how we approached the PvP sigil changes we did a while back, when we released our first draft of the proposed changes.

>

> With this set of proposed changes, we'd like to get your thoughts and ideas on both our high level goals and how we're going about accomplishing them. You guys may bring up concerns or thoughts we didn't consider. While reviewing these changes, please consider them as a whole rather than focusing on individual classes.

>

> We're looking forward to a productive discussion!

>

> ## High Level Goals

>

> Reduce influence of passive traits. (PvP not WvW)

>

> - Passive skills make the game less skillful.

> - The prevalence of passives is a common competitive player complaint. (PvP only)

>

> Increase build diversity

>

> - By decreasing the power of some of the more dominant builds, we hope to give increased viability to builds that previously were pushed out by these dominant specs. We're also increasing power levels in some targeted areas that previously were underperforming.

>

> Reduce effectiveness of offensive instant cast skills/traits

>

> - Instant cast spells don't give players an opportunity to respond. While we don't want to remove combos utilizing instant cast abilities, we wanted to reduce the impact they have.

>

> ### General

>

> - Rune of Surging has been removed from the PvP build panel

> - Magi Amulet has been removed from the PvP build panel

>

> ### Warrior

>

> #### Skills

>

> - Full Counter: Reduced the power coefficient from 1.75 to 1.5 (-14%) in PvP and WvW

> - Dagger Autoattack chain: Reduced the power coefficients from 0.55, 0.55, 0.85 to 0.4, 0.4, 0.85 (-15% overall) in PvP and WvW

> - Aura Slicer: Increased cooldown from 6 seconds to 8 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Disrupting Stab: Reduced stun duration from 1.5 seconds to 1 second in PvP and WvW

> - Breaching Strike: Reduced the power coefficient from 1.5 to 1.2 (-20%) in PvP and WvW

> - Break Enchantments: Reduced the power coefficient from 1.0 to 0.5 (-50%). Increased the number of boons removed from 2 to 3 in PvP and WvW

> - Featherfoot Grace: Increased the cooldown from 30 seconds to 40 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Frenzy: Reduced the cooldown from 50 seconds to 40 seconds in PvP and WvW. Increased Might granted from 5 stacks to 10 stacks in PvP and WvW

> - Rampage Reduced the cooldown from 180 seconds to 100 seconds in PvP and WvW. Reduced transform duration from 15 seconds to 10 seconds

> - Kick: Reduced the cooldown from 6 seconds to 4 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Dash: Reduced the cooldown from 6 seconds to 4 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Throw Boulder: Reduced the cooldown from 12 seconds to 8 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Seismic Leap: Reduced the cooldown from 15 seconds to 10 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Battle Standard: Reduced the cooldown from 240 seconds to 180 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Crushing Blow: Increased the power coefficient from 1.2 to 1.5 (+25%) in PvP and WvW. Adjusted Vulnerability applied from 10 stacks for 10 seconds to 15 stacks for 6 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Tremor: Increased knockdown duration from 2 seconds to 3 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Sword Autoattack chain: Increased the power coefficients from 0.6, 0.6, 0.6 to 0.6, 0.6, 1.0 (+22%) in PvP and WvW

> - Flurry: Increased the power coefficient from 1.04 to 2.0 (+92%) in PvP and WvW

> - Savage Leap: Increased the power coefficient from 0.75 to 1.0 (+33%) in PvP and WvW

> - Flaming Flurry: Increased the power coefficient from 1.04 to 2.0 (+92%) in PvP and WvW

> - "To the Limit!": Increased endurance granted from 50 to 100

> - Blood Reckoning: Increased damage to healing conversion from 20% to 25% in PvP and WvW. Increased Adrenaline gained from 10 to 30 in PvP and WvW

> - "On My Mark!:" Adjusted Vulnerability applied from 10 stacks for 10 seconds to 15 stacks for 6 seconds in PvP and WvW. Reduced ammo recharge from 30 seconds to 25 seconds in PvP and WvW.

> - "For Great Justice!": Adjusted Might granted from 6 stacks for 25 seconds to 12 stacks for 15 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - "Shake It Off!:" Increased the number of conditions cleansed from 2 to 3 in PvP and WvW

>

> #### Traits

>

> - Defy Pain: Increased the cooldown from 60 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

> - Last Stand: Increased the cooldown from 40 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

> - Shrug it Off: Increased the cooldown from 25 seconds to 60 seconds in PvP only

> - Dead or Alive: Increased the cooldown from 30 seconds to 60 seconds in PvP only

>

> ### Revenant

>

> #### Skills

>

> - Coalescence of Ruin: Reduced the power coefficient of the second impact from 1.75 to 1.5 (-14%) in WvW only. Reduced the power coefficient of the third impact from 2.25 to 1.75 (-22%) in WvW only.

> - Razorclaw's Rage: Increased the Bleeding duration from 2 seconds to 4 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Icerazor's Ire: Increased the Power coefficient from 3.7 to 4.6 (+24%) in PvP and WvW

> - Soothing Stone: Increased the number of conditions cleansed from 3 to 5 in PvP and WvW

> - Vengeful Hammers: Reduced the upkeep cost from 7 to 6 in PvP and WvW

> - Forced Engagement: Reduced the energy cost from 25 to 10. Increased the cooldown from 10 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Embrace the Darkness: Increased the attribute bonus from 10% to 15% in PvP and WvW

> - Banish Enchantments: Increased the number of boons removed from 2 to 3 in PvP and WvW

> - Pain Absorption: Reduced the energy cost from 35 to 30 in PvP and WvW

>

> #### Traits

>

> - Eye for an Eye: Increased the cooldown from 45 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

> - Versed in Stone: Increased the cooldown from 60 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

> - Soothing Bastion: Increased the cooldown from 25 seconds to 60 seconds in PvP only

>

> ### Guardian

>

> #### Skills

>

> - Tome of Resolve – Epilogue: Eternal Oasis: Reduced the bonus heal effectiveness from 33% to 20% in PvP and WvW

> - Tome of Resolve – Chapter 2: Radiant Recovery: Reduced the healing power coefficient per condition cleansed from 0.77 to 0.5 (-35%) in PvP and WvW

> - Tome of Resolve – Chapter 1: Desert Bloom: Reduced the healing power coefficient from 0.96 to 0.8 (-17%) in PvP and WvW

> - Signet of Resolve: Reduced the cooldown from 35 seconds to 30 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Leap of Faith: Increased the power coefficient from 1.1 to 1.25 (+14%) in PvP and WvW

> - Signet of Mercy: Reduced the cooldown from 150 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Sword of Justice: Reduced the ammo recharge time from 25 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Bow of Truth: Reduced the ammo recharge time from 30 seconds to 25 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Hammer of Wisdom: Reduced the ammo recharge time from 30 seconds to 25 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Feel my Wrath: Reduced the cooldown from 45 seconds to 35 seconds in PvP and WvW

>

> #### Traits

>

> - Virtuous Solace: Increased the cooldown from 75 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

> - Hunter's Determination: Increased the cooldown from 75 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

> - Zealous Blade: Increased the bonus damage from 5% to 10% in PvP and WvW

>

> ### Thief

>

> #### Skills

>

> - Dagger Autoattack chain: Reduced the power coefficients from 0.8, 0.85, 1.1 to 0.6, 0.65, 1.1 (-15% overall) in PvP and WvW

> - Heartseeker: Increased the power coefficients at all thresholds by 20% in PvP and WvW. The new values are as follows.

> - Above 50%: 1.0 to 1.2

> - Below 50%: 1.5 to 1.8

> - Below 25%: 2.0 to 2.4

> - Sword Autoattack chain: Reduced the power coefficients from 0.8, 0.8, 1.3 to 0.6, 0.6, 1.3 (-14% overall) in PvP and WvW

> - Roll for Initiative: Increased the cooldown from 35 seconds to 40 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Shadow Shot: Increased the initiative cost from 4 to 5 in PvP and WvW. Increased Increased the power coefficient from 1.325 to 1.8 (+36%) in PvP and WvW

> - Infiltrator's Strike: Increased the power coefficient from .75 to .9 (+20%) in PvP and WvW

> - Cloak and Dagger: Reduced the initiative cost from 6 to 5 in PvP and WvW

> - Signet of Shadows: Reduced the cooldown from 30 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Assassin's Signet: Reduced the cooldown from 30 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Smoke Screen: Reduced the cooldown from 30 seconds to 25 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Dagger Storm: Reduced the cooldown from 90 seconds to 60 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Hide in Shadows: Increased the base healing from 5240 to 6026 (+15%) in PvP and WvW

> - Skelk Venom: Increased the venom heal per hit from 965 to 1206 (+25%) in PvP and WvW

>

> #### Traits

>

> - Pulmonary Impact: Reduced the power coefficient from 2.8 to 2.0 (-29%) in PvP and WvW

> - Upper Hand: Increased the cooldown from 3 seconds to 5 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Panic Strike: Increased the cooldown from 20 seconds to 30 seconds in PvP and WvW. The WvW version of this trait will now use the PvP immobilize duration of 1.5 seconds

> - Instant Reflexes: Increased the cooldown from 40 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

> - Pain response: Increased the cooldown from 16 seconds to 40 seconds in PvP only

> - Hard to Catch: Increased the cooldown from 45 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

>

> ### Ranger

>

> #### Skills

>

> - Seed of Life: Increased the cooldown from 1 second to 3 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Rejuvenating Tides: Reduced the base healing per pulse from 650 to 550 (-15%) in PvP and WvW

> - Solar Beam: Reduced the power coefficient per strike from 0.3 to 0.25 (-17%) in PvP and WvW

> - Signet of Stone: Reduced the duration from 6 seconds to 3 seconds in PvP and WvW. Reduced the cooldown from 80 seconds to 40 in PvP and WvW

> - Celestial Avatar: Increased the cooldown from 15 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Ricochet: Increased the power coefficient from 0.7 to 0.8 (+14%) in PvP and WvW. Increased Might duration from 5 seconds to 10 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Winter's Bite: Increased the power coefficient from 1.25 to 1.5 (+20%) in PvP and WvW. Increased the Bleeding duration from 8 seconds to 12 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Splitblade: Increased the power coefficient per axe from 0.3 to 0.4 (+33%) in PvP and WvW

> - Instinctive Engage: Increased the power coefficient from 0.6 to 1 (+67%) in PvP and WvW

> - Healing Spring: Increased the number of conditions cleansed per pulse from 1 to 2 in PvP and WvW

>

> #### Traits

>

> - Stoneform: Increased the cooldown from 70 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

> - Shared Anguish: Increased the cooldown from 60 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

> - Protective Ward: Increased the cooldown from 18 seconds to 30 seconds in PvP only

> - Refined Toxins: Increased the cooldown from 5 seconds to 15 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Rugged Growth: Reduced the healing power coefficient from 0.245 to 0.1225 (-50%) in PvP and WvW

> - Grace of the Land: Reduced the number of Might stacks applied from 3 to 2 in PvP and WvW

> - Fortifying Bond: Reduced duration of shared Might stacks from 10 seconds to 5 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - "We Heal as One!:" Reduced duration of copied Might stacks from 10 seconds to 5 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Fresh Reinforcement: Reduced shared Might duration 10 seconds to 5 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Ambidexterity: Increased the Condition Damage granted from 150 to 240 in PvP and WvW

> - Two-Handed Training: Increased the bonus damage from 5% to 10% in PvP and WvW

>

> ### Engineer

>

> #### Skills

>

> - Crystal Configuration: Eclipse: The stability portion of this trait will now be applied only upon successful hits of Corona Burst

> - Light Strike: Reduced the power coefficient from 1.0 to 0.6 (-40%) in PvP and WvW

> - Holo Leap: Reduced the power coefficient from 1.8 to 1.5 (-17%) in PvP and WvW

> - Corona Burst: Reduced the Might stacks granted per pulse from 2 to 1 in PvP and WvW

> - Holographic Shockwave: Reduced the power coefficient from 0.96 to 0.75 (-22%) in PvP and WvW

> - Spectrum Shield: Increased the shield duration from 3 seconds to 4 seconds in PvP and WvW. Increased the cooldown from 30 seconds to 40 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Poison Dart Volley: Reduced the cooldown from 10 seconds to 8 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Glue Shot: Reduced the cooldown from 25 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Mortar Shot: Increased the power coefficient from 0.8 to 1.0 (+25%) in PvP and WvW

> - Poison Gas Shell: Increased the power coefficient from 0.75 to 1.0 (+33%) in PvP and WvW. Reduced the cooldown from 12 seconds to 10 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Endothermic Shell: Increased the power coefficient from 0.75 to 1.0 (+33%) in PvP and WvW. Reduced the cooldown from 20 seconds to 15 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Flash Shell: Increased the power coefficient from 0.75 to 1.0 (+33%) in PvP and WvW. Reduced the cooldown from 25 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Box of Nails: Reduced the cooldown from 10 seconds to 8 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Magnet: Reduced the cooldown from 25 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Throw Mine: Increased the damage from 1.8 to 2.0 (+11%) in PvP and WvW

> - Static Shock (A.E.D.): Increased the stun duration from 1 second to 2 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Elixir X: Reduced the duration of Tornado and Rampage transforms from 15 seconds to 10 seconds in PvP and WvW. Reduced the cooldown from 105 seconds to 75 seconds in PvP and WvW

>

> #### Traits

>

> - Aim Assisted Rocket: Reduced the power coefficient from 1.0 to 0.5 (-50%) in PvP and WvW

> - Minesweeper: Reduced the power coefficient of each mine from 1.0 to 0.67 (-33%) in PvP and WvW

> - Vent Exhaust: Reduced the power coefficient from 1.1 to 0.75 (-32%) in PvP and WvW

> - Protection Injection: Increased the cooldown from 10 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP only

> - Self-Regulating Defenses: Increased the cooldown from 75 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

> - Reactive Lenses: Increased the cooldown from 40 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

>

> ### Elementalist

>

> #### Skills

>

> - Glyph of Renewal: Reduced the cooldown from 165 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Stone Resonance: Increased the base Barrier granted per pulse from 972 to 1069 in PvP and WvW

> - Lesser Stone Resonance: Increased the base Barrier granted per pulse from 972 to 1069 in PvP and WvW

> - Shatterstone Increased the power coefficient from 1.0 to 1.66 (+66%) in PvP and WvW

> - Impale: Increased the power coefficient from 0.6 to 0.77 (+28%) in PvP and WvW

> - Ashen Blast: Increased the power coefficient from 0.77 to 1.1 (+43%) in PvP and WvW

> - Steam Surge: Increased the power coefficient from 1.0 to 1.5 (+50%) in PvP and WvW

> - Lightning Touch: Increased the power coefficient from 1.0 to 1.5 (+50%) in PvP and WvW

> - Ring of Earth: Increased the number of Bleeding stacks from 1 to 3 in PvP and WvW

> - Tornado: Reduced the cooldown from 150 seconds to 100 seconds in PvP and WvW. Reduced the transform duration from 15 seconds to 10 seconds in PvP and WvW.

> - Elemental Requiem: Reduced the cooldown from 5 seconds to 3 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Dust Charge: Reduced the cooldown from 10 seconds to 7 seconds in PvP and WvW

>

> #### Traits

>

> - Burning Fire: Increased the cooldown from 40 seconds to 60 seconds in PvP only

> - Tempest Defense: Increased the cooldown from 25 seconds to 60 seconds in PvP only

> - Earth's Embrace: Increased the cooldown from 75 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

> - Soothing Ice: Increased the cooldown from 20 seconds to 30 seconds in PvP only

> - Final Shielding: Increased the cooldown from 60 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

> - Gale Song: Increased the cooldown from 60 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

> - Pyromancer's Puissance: Adjusted the Might granted from 1 stack for 15 seconds to 2 stacks for 10 seconds in PvP and WvW

>

> ### Mesmer

>

> #### Skills

>

> - Illusion of Life: Reduced the cooldown from 120 seconds to 75 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Phantasmal Disenchanter – Increased the cooldown from 20 seconds to 25 seconds in PvP and WvW

>

> #### Traits

>

> - Elusive Mind: This trait now applies 4 seconds of Exhaustion when breaking a stun

> - Compounding Power: Reduced the outgoing damage buff per stack from 3% to 2% in PvP and WvW

> - Phantasmal Force: Reduced the Might granted from 3 stacks to 2 stacks in PvP and WvW

> - Mirror of Anguish: Increased cooldown from 60 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

> ### Necromancer

>

> #### Skills

>

> - Garish Pillar: Increased the cooldown from 15 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Desert Shroud: Increased the cooldown from 20 seconds to 30 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Ghastly Breach: Increased the cooldown from 75 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Plague Signet: Increased the cooldown from 30 seconds to 40 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Trail of Anguish: Increased the cooldown from 25 seconds to 35 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Signet of Undeath: Reduced the cooldown from 150 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Life Siphon: Reduced the cooldown from 12 seconds to 10 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Dark Pact: Reduced the cooldown from 25 seconds to 20 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Signet of Vampirism: Reduced the cooldown from 35 seconds to 30 seconds in PvP and WvW. Increased the base heal from 3960 to 4950 (+25%) in PvP and WvW

> - Well of Blood: Increased the base heal from 5240 to 6026 (+15%) in PvP and WvW. Increased the heal per pulse from 280 to 490 (+75%) in PvP and WvW

> - Spectral Grasp: Reduced the cooldown from 50 seconds to 35 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Blood is Power: Adjusted the Might granted from 10 stacks for 10 seconds to 15 stacks for 6 seconds in PvP and WvW

> - Well of Suffering: Reduced the cooldown from 35 seconds to 30 seconds in PvP only. Increased the amount of Vulnerability applied per pulse from 2 stacks to 4 stacks in PvP only.

> - Signet of the Locust: Increased the power coefficient from 0.65 to 1.0 (+54%) in PvP and WvW. Increased the base heal per hit from 970 to 1455 (+50%) in PvP and WvW

>

> #### Traits

>

> - Reaper's Protection: Increased the cooldown from 60 seconds to 90 seconds in PvP only

> - Last Gasp: Increased the cooldown from 50 seconds to 75 seconds in PvP only

 

I like the aim and the incentive as this shows that unlike popular belief the devs want the game to be more skillful.

 

My problem is with the aproach u take on this. esp on how you are toning down passive defesives/traits. Just reducing dur while upping the cd is imo lazy and simply gutts them instead of making them something thats better for the game.

 

Instead of playing a numbers game why not rework these trait and make their perks something u get through active/interactive gameplay? Some of these arent picked in pve anyways so reworking them wouldnt be a big issue and it would instead enhance the overall gameplay

 

Also i dont agree with the way u go about nerfing EM. iv seen alot of good suggestions like making it so the trait turns hard cc into a daze instead when you dodge and also playing with icd and ui elements that show u when it is available.

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> @"Ghos.1326" said:

> > @"Shadowcat.2680" said:

> > > @"Ghos.1326" said:

> > > > @"Shadowcat.2680" said:

> > > > > @"Ghos.1326" said:

> > > > > > @"liurencija.2684" said:

> > > > > > Okay so... After playing holosmith in wvw for quite a while now, I came to love this class very very much. Seeing the changes made to engi makes me wonder if anet even cares for this class at all and if they make ''balances'' to it based only on other people's complaints.

> > > > > > Holosmith is already an unviable class for zergs in the current wvw condi meta, having low damage, extremely low survivability and self sustain compared to other classes like scourge or spellbreaker. Why nerf it even more? Seriously, ruining the only skill that gives stability, not giving any proper condi cleanses and even reducing the main source of damage is not simply nerfing an already disadvantaged class, it's putting a final nail to its coffin.

> > > > > > Since I don't play pvp often, I really can't say much about the effect these changes have there, but if holosmiths are indeed so OP in pvp as many say, why include these nerfs in wvw?

> > > > >

> > > > > Not sure what kind of holosmith you are playing that has low damage, and extremely low survivability and self sustain, but any holosmith I have run into has a brontosaurus poop ton of damage and survivability, thanks to the heat mechanic/perma stab on corona burst. These changes are much needed. I myself play an Engineer, and if another Engineer agrees that corona burst's perma stab is a problem, then it's gotta be a problem. Holosmith is supposed to be a damage dealing spec, both bursting and sustained damage. Giving it perma stab would then put it in a position to fulfill both of these roles with the utmost expertise, with no counterplay or drawbacks. Just CC them you say? How? They have perma stab, remember? Causing the stab to be applied on hit is good, and if they did keep stab off hit, then reducing its uptime is essential, else, once a holosmith gets going (corona burst before jumping in), there is no stopping him before he bursts your poor body from full to pieces within 3 seconds.

> > > >

> > > > Holosmith does not have permanent stability on Corona Burst with Eclipse (the only viable trait in that line for most encounters since holosmith has no other sources of stability). Eclipse offers 4 seconds of 2 stacks of stability on the use of a skill with a 6 second cooldown that generates a lot of heat on use. 36% boon duration (Alchemy traited plus Durability runes) will push the duration of the stability up to 5 1/2 seconds, but the claim "permanent stability" implies holosmith can stay in the forge and camp Corona Burst on cooldown. The heat mechanic prevents this.

> > > >

> > > > If holosmith is thought to have too much stability because of Eclipse, then lowering the base duration or the number of stacks makes more sense over adding the stipulation of hitting a target. No support trait/skill should rely on hitting a target for its function to be achieved (looking at you Aqua Siphon). If this change to the trait goes live, then holosmith will have zero access to stability if Corona Burst is dodged or the enemy simply moves out of range, and the flashy tells for everything in the photon forge makes such a dodge/disengage almost a guarantee if this change is implemented.

> > >

> > > you are also forgetting that, this stability pulses 2 times, one at the beginning, and one at the end. Also, dodging vents exhaust traited, so it's basically perma stab. On top of vigor uptime per swiftness gained and elixir that restores endurance, you can easily have perma stab by just spamming corona burst off cd, all while staying in forge a great deal of time. heat also does not take too long to dissipate when you only have 100 heat, so you have a lot of forge uptime, and when you don't, you're out of range from cc in the current meta build.

> >

> > Changing Eclipse to give both stacks of stability on the initial pulse (thus keeping the base duration to a true 4 secs) or lowering the base duration outright would be a more sensible change than adding an on hit stipulation to the stability. Holosmiths need the stability to have any hope of engaging with the backline of a zerg (where holosmith can shine in zerg vs zerg play), and requiring a target for the stability will kill any hope a holosmith has for engaging the enemy's backline without being cced to oblivion before they get close enough to do a Corona Burst that'll actually hit something.

> >

> > Putting an on hit stipulation on something with a radius of 300 will make holosmiths easy kills for all those things that enjoy 900 and 1200 range ccs.

>

> you'll still be able to get in though. There are other ways to engage than to corona burst before engaging. It's possible, with a build i have been testing and got to plat 2 with, i think it's proven.

 

I'm looking at the holosmith changes purely from a WvW perspective. WvW has much more room on its maps for maneuverability and ranged cc/burst. The change to Eclipse might make sense in PvP, but I don't play that mode and can't comment on it.

 

I do know the change would gut holosmith's access to stability in WvW. Adding an on-hit stipulation to any support oriented (and Eclipse itself is pure support as a trait) trait or skill with a small range/radius is an inherently flawed design in WvW. Ask any sword weaver how often they land Aqua Siphon in WvW for its recently buffed healing.

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> @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" said:

> One additional note: The changes we're targeting here are nearly all focused on areas we could split between game modes. Please try to keep feedback focused in that area.

>

> Things outside of basic numbers changes (changing the way a skill works) are not splittable.

 

Number changes?

 

* Nothing about 100% heat tier skills and traits for Holosmith?

* Some traits on invention tree could have larger radius on WvW.

* May be good if mortar rounds (1 - 5) travels faster, least in WvW.

* What about increase travel speed, radius and coeficient of "Rocket", least on WvW?

* Decrease boon duration and boon application interval on trait " Experimental Turrets".

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> @"Anchoku.8142" said:

> It is about time the game modes were split. Thank you.

>

> p.s.

> I would like to see a major reduction in boon and condition availability in WvW and PvP. The opportunity cost for both is generally too low. The split notes do not go far enough.

>

> Scourge is part of your boon-counter strategy and deserves a nerf to corruption rate but boon generation is the root of the problem. Make it so boons, conditions, and control effects really cost something tangible versus direct damage.

 

Scourge boon corruption has already been nerfed....anymore and it won't be boon corruption at all. Wvw feels much better now since the most recent changes, spellbreaker bubble is the most over powered skill in wvw atm.

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