[Elite spec suggestion] Vanguard – Legendary Prince Stance

[Lametoile.7394]

> @"Dadnir.5038" said:

> > @"Scar.1793" said:

> > By the way, I do not recall of King Adelbern ever mentionning the White Mantle, he said he didn’t want ascalonians to live under Kryta. I may be wrong though, it’s been ages since I’ve played GW1.

> >

> > Just my 2 cents.

>

> In the first zone of ascalon after everything was burnt (note that the charrs were responsible for this not adelbern unlike what history in gw2 say), you've got an emissary of the white mantle which is the one that convince rurik to move on. If you do the quests of the area properly, you'll have rurik and adelbern in an argument on this map where adelbern voice his distrust over this "envoy". (I've replayed the full core campaign last year... Fire Islands were hell... until I decided to use fire mantra)

>

> Really, rurik didn't do anything worse becoming a legend. Ventarii birthed a new race he is more than worse legendary material, Mallyx was the leader of the demons and margonite that carried on the late will of abbadon and opposed the gods, gaining it's "unyielding" title. If someone that didn't bow to the god and even led it's kin against the god isn't worse being a legendary then who? Really rurik did almost nothing, even it's father have more value as a legendary since he stayed all the way to the last stand despite being pit against the whole charr army, even to the point of staying as a ghost even in these days to oppose the charrs.

 

What is a legend?

 

It's not about what you do. It's about how much you inspire people through centuries.

 

When you think about it, all ascalonians in the game are alive and well thanks to rurik. Because he led his people safely to Kryta, where they could grow free. Because he trained the ebon vanguard that later founded Ebonhawke and ensure Ascalon's survival on its homeland.

 

You're right. Rurik was not a god, a demon, a legendary assassins or such...He was just a man. A man who chose to assume its responsability. Who chose to do what was right in desesparate times. He was rejected by his father, called a coward, but he didn't care and carried on because he knew it was the right thing to do. Shall he had not initated the escape, we as a player would have never completed. We would have probably died in Ascalon and...the world would have never been saved.

 

Rurik deserve to be a legend because he was a reponsible leader who ensure the perennenity of an entire people and ended up acclaimed for it.

And to clarify: he didn't sacrificed recklessly (though he was someone bold), he was trapped. And I don't think he knew about the white mantle. Appart for a bunch of shining blade outcast, no one knem. You know who else has been deceived? Our character from GW1...

 

Aldenbern fought until the end for a glory that was already in ashes without caring about its people. Rurik accepted to be called a coward and flee to save as many lives as possible. He did what only a true good leader would do. Even if he had stayed, Ascalon would have fallen eventually. And who know? Sohotin could had been lost.

 

Rurik does not deserve less to be a legend than Jalis or Karlla. In fact, i think a revenant can channel great powers from any legend, provided it has enough resonance for him as a person.

 

You have the right to not like Rurik. I will always like him.

 

Have a good day.

 

 

 

"Farewell Prince Rurik. You and I will meet again in the Hall of heroes."

"I would have followed you my brother. My captain. My king"

[Scar.1793]

> @"Alchimist.4738" said:

> It looks interesting, though the unique Vanguard mechanic is nothing else than the Guardian virtues brought on the Revenant, and it doesn't really change how Revenant interacts with the legends, or with energy, and similarly to Renegade and Herald it just add a few "f" skills.

>

> Which is in my opinion one of the worst failure of the especs we have so far on Revenant, none of them change the way you play Revenant, unlike the especs on let's say Elementalist, which give us sightly different play style, for instance core Elementalist can quickly swap between attunements, Tempest is encouraged to stay in one attunement longer to overload, and then the attunement has a longer cooldown, and Weaver cannot quickly move between each attunements, but can merge them.

 

And I agree with you. But note that I only came up with these ideas on a saturday afternoon (few tweaks on monday).

 

Takes a lot of time to come with something really solid and original in terms of gameplay. This is basically just a few ideas together or a skeleton.

[starlinvf.1358]

> @"Alchimist.4738" said:

> It looks interesting, though the unique Vanguard mechanic is nothing else than the Guardian virtues brought on the Revenant, and it doesn't really change how Revenant interacts with the legends, or with energy, and similarly to Renegade and Herald it just add a few "f" skills.

>

> Which is in my opinion one of the worst failure of the especs we have so far on Revenant, none of them change the way you play Revenant, unlike the especs on let's say Elementalist, which give us sightly different play style, for instance core Elementalist can quickly swap between attunements, Tempest is encouraged to stay in one attunement longer to overload, and then the attunement has a longer cooldown, and Weaver cannot quickly move between each attunements, but can merge them.

 

Its kind of not possible when Energy is baked into Core Rev the way it is. You can't not have a skill that costs energy, and each Legend already represents a significant change in how the Rev operates mechanically (at least in their original designs). Especially when you look at Ventari, Mallyx, and Glint, where their game play functionality is heavily bound to having the Legend active, you can't use those builds without them. Both Shiro and Jalis are pretty neutral (ie flat value) in buildcraft, because they're largely built around basic combat (damage and defense respectively). Kalla's design is also pretty tactical, effectively giving Revs Well-type skills to modify the battlefield and capitalize on positioning. There also one point where I could had sworn Kalla's fervor was meant to be a group buff that the Rev could manipulate to some extent.

 

With that kind of design its core, the only thing you really can do is change its game play utility via skills and effects at the that mechanical level, rather then the mechanics of the Class, which are mostly Resource Management oriented.

[Justine.6351]

Not to ruin everyone's excitement but this is pretty generic stuff and looks to be some copy paste of current items of stuff in game already without a twist to them.

 

I saw,

 

Swoop

Grave Digger

Binding Blade

Riposte

Facet of Darkness

Signet of Fury + Signet Mastery

Healing Signet

Glyph of Elemental Harmony [water]

Jade Winds

Shield of Courage

Eye of the Storm + Stand Your Ground

Impossible Odds

Fast Hands

 

The crazy part is, we have access to a good portion of this list already.

[Aeolus.3615]

I feel stormcaler would be more the skin for the offhand horn that Ruric elite spec would receive......

 

For GS i find Jora, Turai better.

 

Altough a gunslinger theme for Rev would be nice to have it has well ._.

[Scar.1793]

> @"Aeolus.3615" said:

> I feel stormcaler would be more the skin for the offhand horn that Ruric elite spec would receive......

>

> For GS i find Jora, Turai better.

>

> Altough a gunslinger theme for Rev would be nice to have it has well ._.

 

Can’t be, it’s already a HoM reward. Unless they pull a Sohothin trick if we ever gonna have Rurik.

 

Also both Turai and Jora were sword&shield users as greatswords never existed in Guild Wars 1.

[Aeolus.3615]

> @"Scar.1793" said:

> > @"Aeolus.3615" said:

> > I feel stormcaler would be more the skin for the offhand horn that Ruric elite spec would receive......

> >

> > For GS i find Jora, Turai better.

> >

> > Altough a gunslinger theme for Rev would be nice to have it has well ._.

>

> Can’t be, it’s already a HoM reward. Unless they pull a Sohothin trick if we ever gonna have Rurik.

>

> Also both Turai and Jora were sword&shield users as greatswords never existed in Guild Wars 1.

 

Ahaha would not be the 1st time they would pull that ;)

 

Greatsword was a sword skin :P so anything that carries big swords were good candidates ^^.

[ScottBroChill.3254]

The only thing I'm opposed to is the whole human, rurik, warrior thematics as I find them a wee bit boring for me personally and that we may end up with similar visiuals or colors as kalla. But in terms of skills and kit and everything it's a lot more brought together and unified than most things rev has gotten thus far.

 

but again, do we need another generic greatswordsman class? with passives and straightforward skills does it not feel that we are just getting a regular warrior/guardian/ranger option? I think something unorthodox, like mesmer greatsword, would be a better direction for the overall design of rev and also thematically with its already unorthodox use of weapons.

 

Either way, nice job! Sorry if I seem like a Debbie Downer.

[Scar.1793]

> @"ScottBroChill.3254" said:

> The only thing I'm opposed to is the whole human, rurik, warrior thematics as I find them a wee bit boring for me personally and that we may end up with similar visiuals or colors as kalla. But in terms of skills and kit and everything it's a lot more brought together and unified than most things rev has gotten thus far.

>

> but again, do we need another generic greatswordsman class? with passives and straightforward skills does it not feel that we are just getting a regular warrior/guardian/ranger option? I think something unorthodox, like mesmer greatsword, would be a better direction for the overall design of rev and also thematically with its already unorthodox use of weapons.

>

> Either way, nice job! Sorry if I seem like a Debbie Downer.

 

It’s ok lol I don’t mind critics or people having a different opinion.

 

But I’m wondering where the idea of Rev having to get “unorthodox” weapon skills came from. I think it was from a very old dev stream showing the revenant.

 

The only weapons I can think of are Hammer and Axe offhand. Melee staff is not really unorthodox as far as MMOs are concerned.

Sure you get some flashy skills on all weapon sets but it’s true for all classes.

 

My sword is melee, mace too, short bow is ranged and the shield acts like a shield. We already got a ranged condi weapon with Renegade (was originally GS I heard since Kalla carries a GS on her statue in Black Citadel). An alternative to a second set like staff in pve and hammer in wvw for power builds would be nice imo.

[ScottBroChill.3254]

> @"Scar.1793" said:

>

> It’s ok lol I don’t mind critics or people having a different opinion.

>

> But I’m wondering where the idea of Rev having to get “unorthodox” weapon skills came from. I think it was from a very old dev stream showing the revenant.

>

> The only weapons I can think of are Hammer and Axe offhand. Melee staff is not really unorthodox as far as MMOs are concerned.

> Sure you get some flashy skills on all weapon sets but it’s true for all classes.

>

> My sword is melee, mace too, short bow is ranged and the shield acts like a shield. We already got a ranged condi weapon with Renegade (was originally GS I heard since Kalla carries a GS on her statue in Black Citadel). An alternative to a second set like staff in pve and hammer in wvw for power builds would be nice imo.

 

Well I guess its not that they "have to" get unorthodox weapons, I guess its more animations than anything and you got that covered.

 

I guess where I'm coming from is that Im just biased against the vanilla warrior types in most games hahah so like I'm just against a spec that makes my beautiful rev just a warrior. But to be honest I think you've added enough flavor to make it different. I like you're skills descriptions and the portal on skill 2 is something I've thought about putting on greatsword if we got it. and we do need a staff alternative really bad lol I don't want to have to craft nevermore.

[InsaneQR.7412]

Not a fan of the class mechanic because it looks very similar to renegades (the vanguard frenzy part that is) . But otherwise it looks great and would make sense.

The altheas kiss adept trait should not need a CD. It should refresh out of combat.

[VocalThought.9835]

Nice!! We need more well thought out ideas like this. What other legend do you have in mind. I'd love to see your ideas!

[Blue.1207]

It’s going to suck when ANET delivers and it comes no where close to this masterpiece.

 

 

[DonArkanio.6419]

I love the way you show your concept - It's very clean and transparent. I love the weapon skills.

 

Personally, I'm not a fan of Revenant getting Greatsword as there are some other less over-used weapons. But I love the weapon skills - very straight-forward without needless conditions and not packed up with tons of everything.

 

**I see Revenant getting access to one of these:**

- Razah

- Vizier Khilbron

- one of The Six

- Mursaat

- Forgotten

- Seer

- Tengu (but for me it's just meh)

- Please no Asura

- Nightmare Sylvari

 

We need another bad guy in the team. Atm it's just Mallyx who shows that he wants to hurt us.

 

Anyway, great job!

 

[LucianDK.8615]

Revenants doesnt need greatswords. Its already setting them apart from the other plate classes that they dont have it baseline. Dont try to homogenize the classes.

Razah would definitely make sense but is weaker in chance since we are in 'Nightfall' right now, but Khilbron or Master Togo is also strong contenders.

If next expansion is in Cantha, then Master Togo seems like 'the choice', especially if going for a proper ritualist bent for Revenant. Id love to see that rising lightning ball attack come back. Cant remember what it was called.

[Blue.1207]

> @"LucianDK.8615" said:

> Revenants doesnt need greatswords. Its already setting them apart from the other plate classes that they dont have it baseline. Dont try to homogenize the classes.

> Razah would definitely make sense but is weaker in chance since we are in 'Nightfall' right now, but Khilbron or Master Togo is also strong contenders.

> If next expansion is in Cantha, then Master Togo seems like 'the choice', especially if going for a proper ritualist bent for Revenant. Id love to see that rising lightning ball attack come back. Cant remember what it was called.

 

Revenant **literally** needs greatswords. Not from an aesthetic perspective, but from a gameplay perspective. Revenants currently lack a huge burst damage melee weapon, they have sustained damage after small burst, but what they lack in their tool kit (and what ultimately get's rev's kicked from high level groups/not invited) is high burst followed by sustained dps (s/s). Revenant NEEDS a high burst damage weapon, that can pair well with s/s so it can compete with Holo, DH and Weaver in regards to burst DPS for raids/ CM fractals.

 

As of right now I solely play condi Renegade in ALL fractal/raid encounters simply because a CONDI CLASS out bursts and dps's power rev by 10k+ dps.

 

Rev got support spec with Herald, they got condi with Renegade, it's time for a high burst power damage spec.

 

 

[Nath Forge Tempete.1645]

What annoys me is the elite spec name ... The Vanguard which reminds me of the Ebon Vanguard which has nothing to do with prince Rurik ... or very very far away.

 

And I don't like the spirit feeling about this honestly ... feels wrong to me

 

But still great work ! it's a job well done.

[Catchyfx.5768]

I like F2-F3-F4 buttons are energy free so there is chance to use them in combat which is cool(yes I'm looking at you Renegade! bad bad boy)