ArenaNet can we get a test server pls?

[zealex.9410]

Its getting silly how with each patch shit breaks and ppl get constantly dc'ed to the extent of even days when new a lw patch drops. A ptr server would not only help dealing with that so when the actual launch of updates and content happens things go smoothly but also give feedback before it makes it into the game and have a dialogue with the system's team developers to better change the game.

 

Its a good picture to give to ppl interested in the game when streamers and content creators deal with constant rollbacks and crashes during their streams.

[Illconceived Was Na.9781]

> @"zealex.9410" said:

> Its getting silly how with each patch kitten breaks and ppl get constantly dc'ed to the extent of even days when new a lw patch drops. A ptr server would not only help dealing with that so when the actual launch of updates and content happens things go smoothly but also give feedback before it makes it into the game and have a dialogue with the system's team developers to better change the game.

>

> Its a good picture to give to ppl interested in the game when streamers and content creators deal with constant rollbacks and crashes during their streams.

 

You're assuming that this actually works to prevent more bugs. It doesn't necessarily, because most people don't use test servers to test and most aren't able to articulate the issues they run into. Instead, people use it as a way to prepare in advance for new content (or new markets). It's also incredibly costly, because it requires setting up an entirely new system that's ready for the vast majority of players, as even those going into a "test" environment expect most everything to work. That means keeping track of more versions of the game, having to pay attention to which changes get merged and which don't.

 

In the end, the costs often exceed any benefits.

[Ashantara.8731]

It would be enough if ANet properly tested their patches before distributing them... I can't imagine how things break this badly every time a patch goes live. This is getting beyond ridiculous.

[Swagger.1459]

> @"Ashantara.8731" said:

> It would be enough if ANet properly tested their patches before distributing them... I can't imagine how things break this badly every time a patch goes live. This is getting beyond ridiculous.

 

Anet does test things "properly". Throwing patches into the live environment/actual game can cause unforeseen issues or problems.

 

[zealex.9410]

> @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

> > @"zealex.9410" said:

> > Its getting silly how with each patch kitten breaks and ppl get constantly dc'ed to the extent of even days when new a lw patch drops. A ptr server would not only help dealing with that so when the actual launch of updates and content happens things go smoothly but also give feedback before it makes it into the game and have a dialogue with the system's team developers to better change the game.

> >

> > Its a good picture to give to ppl interested in the game when streamers and content creators deal with constant rollbacks and crashes during their streams.

>

> You're assuming that this actually works to prevent more bugs. It doesn't necessarily, because most people don't use test servers to test and most aren't able to articulate the issues they run into. Instead, people use it as a way to prepare in advance for new content (or new markets).

 

U dont need to do testing to see if ppl get crashes or general bugs, having those exist in a diff client that gets updated first is in it of it self a huge boon for the image of the game. A big number of ppl (the ones that usually care for the game go in and actually test stuff and give feedback (this is the case in wow and i dont see why it wouldnt be for gw2)

 

> It's also incredibly costly, because it requires setting up an entirely new system that's ready for the vast majority of players, as even those going into a "test" environment expect most everything to work.

 

As for the cost, idk how much it costs but its a pretty normal practice for mmos and every mmo that uses it seems to avoid alot of bugs in launch. (having followed bfa the test builds for ptr always suffer from bugs crashes and other issues which get called out and fixed during from ptr. Test servers also only serve as an early stage ground, sort of limited beta before a patch drops if you might, ppl going in expecting a smooth experience are clueless and we shouldnt be denied systems because of such expectation.

 

> That means keeping track of more versions of the game, having to pay attention to which changes get merged and which don't.

>

 

The test server doesnt need to be up all the time to require constant upkeep and attention, it can very much only be turned on when they need/want to test updates to make sure they actually run before they go to live. And yes, the point of is to make sure which changes make it to live and which dont (after player testing and feedback)

 

> In the end, the costs often exceed any benefits.

 

And i believe in this case the benefits heavily outweight the costs as the image and betterment of the game are on the line.

 

 

[kharmin.7683]

> @"zealex.9410" said:

 

> ... and every mmo that uses it seems to avoid alot of bugs in launch.

 

wut?

 

[zealex.9410]

> @"Ashantara.8731" said:

> It would be enough if ANet properly tested their patches before distributing them... I can't imagine how things break this badly every time a patch goes live. This is getting beyond ridiculous.

 

Idk how anet works internally but looking at the record they arent as effiecient as we would like and they dont necessarily seem to be improving much. To that end i think the server would help them alot improve the quality of their releasese. Ideally they would push out great and stable updates from inhouse, but tbh id prefer they have less stress to test stuff and focus more on the content and give players instead the means to test.

[zealex.9410]

> @"Swagger.1459" said:

> > @"Ashantara.8731" said:

> > It would be enough if ANet properly tested their patches before distributing them... I can't imagine how things break this badly every time a patch goes live. This is getting beyond ridiculous.

>

> Anet does test things "properly". Throwing patches into the live environment/actual game can cause unforeseen issues or problems.

>

 

Thats were a test server that acts as pseudo live environment comes in.

[zealex.9410]

> @"kharmin.7683" said:

> > @"zealex.9410" said:

>

> > ... and every mmo that uses it seems to avoid alot of bugs in launch.

>

> wut?

>

 

I wasnt clear? I meant to say mmos that use test server seem to go live with quite abit less bugs than they would otherwise. (thats from my experience in wow and some eso) Plus anything exploitative relating to the economy doesnt happen in the live game where the devs would have to rollback everyone for it (even ppl that didnt interact with such exploits) and instead happens in test server where the gold you make from exploits doesnt move to live.

[kharmin.7683]

> @"zealex.9410" said:

> > @"kharmin.7683" said:

> > > @"zealex.9410" said:

> >

> > > ... and every mmo that uses it seems to avoid alot of bugs in launch.

> >

> > wut?

> >

>

> I wasnt clear? I meant to say mmos that use test server seem to go live with quite abit less bugs than they would otherwise. (thats from my experience in wow and some eso)

 

hmmm... well, maybe if people didn't whine so much about paying for stuff in the gem store and actually supported the game by buying stuff rather than wanting everything free, then Anet might have more resources available to produce content with less issues than a subscription based MMO that doesn't seem to have such problems? Not directing this specifically at you @"zealex.9410"

[zealex.9410]

> @"kharmin.7683" said:

> > @"zealex.9410" said:

> > > @"kharmin.7683" said:

> > > > @"zealex.9410" said:

> > >

> > > > ... and every mmo that uses it seems to avoid alot of bugs in launch.

> > >

> > > wut?

> > >

> >

> > I wasnt clear? I meant to say mmos that use test server seem to go live with quite abit less bugs than they would otherwise. (thats from my experience in wow and some eso)

>

> hmmm... well, maybe if people didn't whine so much about paying for stuff in the gem store and actually supported the game by buying stuff rather than wanting everything free, then Anet might have more resources available to produce content with less issues than a subscription based MMO that doesn't seem to have such problems? Not directing this specifically at you @"zealex.9410"

 

Arena net has been on a steady stream of income which rose in the last q. The subscription based mmo also pukes content out compaired to gw2 so its not like all the difference in income gets eaten from the test server plus eso is a hybrid with an optional sub. Arena net hasnt made a statement afaik regarding the cost of test servers being to high and they have been alot more aggressive with their monetisation of the game. To that extent i would like to see the stability of updates rise which hasnt happened.

[MokahTGS.7850]

So back before HoT I was part of the player tester group that played on special server with a special client. This was the same system they used with the closed beta testers. I'm not sure if that system is still running, as I quit as a tester due to lack of time, but I know they do test things. Bugs happen...go outside until it's fixed.

 

In my experience GW2 is by far the smoothest running MMO I've ever played. Sure, they have bugs...everyone does...but so does WoW and ESO. Heck ESO had massive problems on launch...really bad bugs...anyone remember the phasing issues?

[Ashantara.8731]

> @"Swagger.1459" said:

> Anet does test things "properly". Throwing patches into the live environment/actual game can cause unforeseen issues or problems.

 

I have not seen this happen to this extent in any other online game, though...

[zealex.9410]

> @"MokahTGS.7850" said:

> So back before HoT I was part of the player tester group that played on special server with a special client. This was the same system they used with the closed beta testers. I'm not sure if that system is still running, as I quit as a tester due to lack of time, but I know they do test things. Bugs happen...go outside until it's fixed.

>

> In my experience GW2 is by far the smoothest running MMO I've ever played. Sure, they have bugs...everyone does...but so does WoW and ESO. Heck ESO had massive problems on launch...really bad bugs...anyone remember the phasing issues?

 

Sure everyone has bugs thats a given, mmos are man made products after all. But this is by far not the smoothest running mmo performance wise or update stability wise (unless u mean that it never goes down for maintenance or smth). I cant tell about eso on launch as it wasnt there at the time but i was there for pof launch, which was unplayable for a good couple of days, also was there for long live the lich which was also broken and unplayable for days.

 

Also if they already have the server it would prob be not as much money and effort as build the system from the ground up to make it public.

 

As for wow, it does have bugs, latest expansion is jokingly called beta for azeroth to give u an idea, but even with those bugs the game launches content alot more smoothly and bug free than gw2 does.

[Swagger.1459]

> @"zealex.9410" said:

> > @"Swagger.1459" said:

> > > @"Ashantara.8731" said:

> > > It would be enough if ANet properly tested their patches before distributing them... I can't imagine how things break this badly every time a patch goes live. This is getting beyond ridiculous.

> >

> > Anet does test things "properly". Throwing patches into the live environment/actual game can cause unforeseen issues or problems.

> >

>

> Thats were a test server that acts as pseudo live environment comes in.

 

Test environments and live are different.

 

I get that players are frustrated, and you better believe the devs get frustrated too, but it's unrealistic to expect updates to be 100% perfect... There are millions of factors and code to deal with, and Anet has done a damn great job at updating and working on the game.

[kharmin.7683]

> @"zealex.9410" said:

> Arena net has been on a steady stream of income which rose in the last q. The subscription based mmo also pukes content out compaired to gw2 so its not like all the difference in income gets eaten from the test server plus eso is a hybrid with an optional sub. Arena net hasnt made a statement afaik regarding the cost of test servers being to high and they have been alot more aggressive with their monetisation of the game. To that extent i would like to see the stability of updates rise which hasnt happened.

ANet's financials are equivalent to ESO or WoW? If so, then I'd say you have an argument for a test environment or such.

 

I do agree that that stability of updates needs a lot of help.

 

[Blocki.4931]

Most issues come from scaling it up to tens of thousands of players. There is only so much you can simulate in terms of load on server etc.

[Swagger.1459]

> @"Ashantara.8731" said:

> > @"Swagger.1459" said:

> > Anet does test things "properly". Throwing patches into the live environment/actual game can cause unforeseen issues or problems.

>

> I have not seen this happen to this extent in any other online game, though...

 

Riiiight…

 

And Anet does amazing for not shutting the down the game for weekly or monthly maintenance, unlike other games need to.

 

 

Listen, I get that you are frustrated bc you lost your new black lion chair, so write to support and be patient like everyone else.

 

[zealex.9410]

> @"Swagger.1459" said:

> > @"zealex.9410" said:

> > > @"Swagger.1459" said:

> > > > @"Ashantara.8731" said:

> > > > It would be enough if ANet properly tested their patches before distributing them... I can't imagine how things break this badly every time a patch goes live. This is getting beyond ridiculous.

> > >

> > > Anet does test things "properly". Throwing patches into the live environment/actual game can cause unforeseen issues or problems.

> > >

> >

> > Thats were a test server that acts as pseudo live environment comes in.

>

> Test environments and live are different.

>

> I get that players are frustrated, and you better believe the devs get frustrated too, but it's unrealistic to expect updates to be 100% perfect... There are millions of factors and code to deal with, and Anet has done a kitten great job at updating and working on the game.

 

I dont expect 100% perfect updates, id be fine with 60% perfect/playable ones too...

[zealex.9410]

> @"Blocki.4931" said:

> Most issues come from scaling it up to tens of thousands of players. There is only so much you can simulate in terms of load on server etc.

 

Which means test servers open to a sizable amount of ppl can generate these issue for anet to deal with early.

[Swagger.1459]

> @"zealex.9410" said:

> > @"Swagger.1459" said:

> > > @"zealex.9410" said:

> > > > @"Swagger.1459" said:

> > > > > @"Ashantara.8731" said:

> > > > > It would be enough if ANet properly tested their patches before distributing them... I can't imagine how things break this badly every time a patch goes live. This is getting beyond ridiculous.

> > > >

> > > > Anet does test things "properly". Throwing patches into the live environment/actual game can cause unforeseen issues or problems.

> > > >

> > >

> > > Thats were a test server that acts as pseudo live environment comes in.

> >

> > Test environments and live are different.

> >

> > I get that players are frustrated, and you better believe the devs get frustrated too, but it's unrealistic to expect updates to be 100% perfect... There are millions of factors and code to deal with, and Anet has done a kitten great job at updating and working on the game.

>

> I dont expect 100% perfect updates, id be fine with 60% perfect/playable ones too...

 

Anet far exceeds those numbers. And we always get a rapid response and fix when things are broken.

 

Again, I get that players are frustrated, but you need to be reasonable here. Public Test Server will do squat to prevent issues that can occur on live.

 

[zealex.9410]

> @"kharmin.7683" said:

> > @"zealex.9410" said:

> > Arena net has been on a steady stream of income which rose in the last q. The subscription based mmo also pukes content out compaired to gw2 so its not like all the difference in income gets eaten from the test server plus eso is a hybrid with an optional sub. Arena net hasnt made a statement afaik regarding the cost of test servers being to high and they have been alot more aggressive with their monetisation of the game. To that extent i would like to see the stability of updates rise which hasnt happened.

> ANet's financials are equivalent to ESO or WoW? If so, then I'd say you have an argument for a test environment or such.

>

> I do agree that that stability of updates needs a lot of help.

>

 

Their financials would be higher if the image of the game in terms of stability and quality was better, do you remember how pof was on launch? Entire zones were unplayable, that extented up to lw updates too.

[MokahTGS.7850]

> @"zealex.9410" said:

> > @"MokahTGS.7850" said:

> > So back before HoT I was part of the player tester group that played on special server with a special client. This was the same system they used with the closed beta testers. I'm not sure if that system is still running, as I quit as a tester due to lack of time, but I know they do test things. Bugs happen...go outside until it's fixed.

> >

> > In my experience GW2 is by far the smoothest running MMO I've ever played. Sure, they have bugs...everyone does...but so does WoW and ESO. Heck ESO had massive problems on launch...really bad bugs...anyone remember the phasing issues?

>

> Sure everyone has bugs thats a given, mmos are man made products after all. But this is by far not the smoothest running mmo performance wise or update stability wise (unless u mean that it never goes down for maintenance or smth). I cant tell about eso on launch as it wasnt there at the time but i was there for pof launch, which was unplayable for a good couple of days, also was there for long live the lich which was also broken and unplayable for days.

>

> Also if they already have the server it would prob be not as much money and effort as build the system from the ground up to make it public.

 

I don't think the issue is cost of the server. The biggest issue is security of the economy. I don't know about WoW...I don't play it. I do know the ESO doesn't have a TP and its "economy" is really just an odd system of p2p trading. It's the main reason I don't play ESO anymore. With GW2, you have an economy with the TP that is very much affected by changes to the game. One days millionaire is tomorrows pauper.

 

One thing that happened with testers was the issue of leaking and TP speculation which lead ANet to change how they test where item ingredients on the testing server were different then the live version. This way, testers found it difficult to speculate on what would be valuable for a future patch. I can't see how they would be able to secure the TP from rampant insider trading with a public test server.

[Turkeyspit.3965]

> @"MokahTGS.7850" said:

> In my experience GW2 is by far the smoothest running MMO I've ever played. Sure, they have bugs...everyone does...but so does WoW and ESO. Heck ESO had massive problems on launch...really bad bugs...anyone remember the phasing issues?

 

When ANET releases a patch you get the odd bug, but generally it's still playable, and you have to endure 2,3 or 4 more patches over the next 48hours. Annoying as you have to drop group, etc, but you can still play.

 

Compare that to Blizzard who takes the servers offline for 8hours at a time to deploy a patch.

 

I've been through both, and ANET definitely does it better.

 

 

[zealex.9410]

> @"MokahTGS.7850" said:

> > @"zealex.9410" said:

> > > @"MokahTGS.7850" said:

> > > So back before HoT I was part of the player tester group that played on special server with a special client. This was the same system they used with the closed beta testers. I'm not sure if that system is still running, as I quit as a tester due to lack of time, but I know they do test things. Bugs happen...go outside until it's fixed.

> > >

> > > In my experience GW2 is by far the smoothest running MMO I've ever played. Sure, they have bugs...everyone does...but so does WoW and ESO. Heck ESO had massive problems on launch...really bad bugs...anyone remember the phasing issues?

> >

> > Sure everyone has bugs thats a given, mmos are man made products after all. But this is by far not the smoothest running mmo performance wise or update stability wise (unless u mean that it never goes down for maintenance or smth). I cant tell about eso on launch as it wasnt there at the time but i was there for pof launch, which was unplayable for a good couple of days, also was there for long live the lich which was also broken and unplayable for days.

> >

> > Also if they already have the server it would prob be not as much money and effort as build the system from the ground up to make it public.

>

> I don't think the issue is cost of the server. The biggest issue is security of the economy. I don't know about WoW...I don't play it. I do know the ESO doesn't have a TP and its "economy" is really just an odd system of p2p trading. It's the main reason I don't play ESO anymore. With GW2, you have an economy with the TP that is very much affected by changes to the game. One days millionaire is tomorrows pauper.

>

> One thing that happened with testers was the issue of leaking and TP speculation which lead ANet to change how they test where item ingredients on the testing server were different then the live version. This way, testers found it difficult to speculate on what would be valuable for a future patch. I can't see how they would be able to secure the TP from rampant insider trading with a public test server.

 

I mean i dont know how wow handles the economy side of things either, but instead of relying in leaks, speculation etc i feel it would be simpler if anet made that knowledge public through the updates being on a public test environment. Or you simply dont providethe numeric values of materials etc and simply provide ppl with the items u want them to test. But, i can see a case for having the market value on updates known so they can get feedback and prevent extreme market shifts like the null sigils or the massive drops in materials during the pof launch.