Ashen.2907 Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > Yes, that's really what I am saying .. because the value is already in the item you are extracting from; the extractor itself does not create value. I could sell any item with a sigil in it ... I would get about the same amount if I sold the sigil and the item separately. > > > > Unlike nodes where the value is created by the node from nothing through the action of harvesting it. > > the value -was- in the item you -were- extracting from. now, it costs REAL MONEY to extract. > > > @"AlexndrTheGreat.8310" said: > > Why is it that when people try to ask questions like this and are given actual responses, they proceed to plug their ears and ignore what people are explaining. Lol > no one is plugging any ears. the hard part is getting people to [think outside the box] and |read between the lines| One can choose to spend real money to extract, but one does not need to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wanze.8410 Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 no contract=no love Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notebene.3190 Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 Is this something you can save those scrap things (?) to buy, or is it 100% random still? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linken.6345 Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 > @"notebene.3190" said: > Is this something you can save those scrap things (?) to buy, or is it 100% random still? Even if you extact said rune with a 100% chance there is still a rng if you get a symbol from the then salvaged rune. Both extractor and salvager have to pay a fee if the extracter want the material aswell they pay dubble salvage cost since its for the rune and then for said item. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eldrjth.7384 Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 The item doesnt need a cool down, which would break it for those who have it. It shouldve been make more accessible to players from the beginning rather than being so exclusive, same could be said of permanent bank access. These items are game changing in the functionality they offer and shouldnt be bundled with "optional" cosmetic items like the permanent self style hair kit or transmutation shards (although other games allow players to customise appearance free of charge). If it was a gem store item like the salvagers it would also be more accessible to players, although I believe non of these items should be paid for in the first place and should be unlockable via in game activity (that doesnt require gold>gem conversion either). I think it could do with a few minor adjustments though. Instead of having to drag and drop an item into a window to extract an upgrade, you could simply double click/right click on the extractor to bring up an extractor icon which you then hover over each item you want to salvage by left clicking. To deactivate it you right click. This would make it easier to bulk remove upgrades and decreases the chances of accidentally dragging and destroying an item. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notebene.3190 Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 > @"Linken.6345" said: > > @"notebene.3190" said: > > Is this something you can save those scrap things (?) to buy, or is it 100% random still? > > Even if you extact said rune with a 100% chance there is still a rng if you get a symbol from the then salvaged rune. > Both extractor and salvager have to pay a fee if the extracter want the material aswell they pay dubble salvage cost since its for the rune and then for said item. > > I’m sorry, my question was, I guess, a little off topic. I was wondering how you acquire the item itself. I know they don’t sell it, it’s in the boxes. I wasn’t sure if you could save up the scraps from the chests to get one (eventually) or if it wasn’t one of the items you can “save” for, and it’s purely a random cheat reward? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linken.6345 Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 > @"notebene.3190" said: > > @"Linken.6345" said: > > > @"notebene.3190" said: > > > Is this something you can save those scrap things (?) to buy, or is it 100% random still? > > > > Even if you extact said rune with a 100% chance there is still a rng if you get a symbol from the then salvaged rune. > > Both extractor and salvager have to pay a fee if the extracter want the material aswell they pay dubble salvage cost since its for the rune and then for said item. > > > > > > I’m sorry, my question was, I guess, a little off topic. > > I was wondering how you acquire the item itself. I know they don’t sell it, it’s in the boxes. I wasn’t sure if you could save up the scraps from the chests to get one (eventually) or if it wasn’t one of the items you can “save” for, and it’s purely a random cheat reward? > @"notebene.3190" said: > > @"Linken.6345" said: > > > @"notebene.3190" said: > > > Is this something you can save those scrap things (?) to buy, or is it 100% random still? > > > > Even if you extact said rune with a 100% chance there is still a rng if you get a symbol from the then salvaged rune. > > Both extractor and salvager have to pay a fee if the extracter want the material aswell they pay dubble salvage cost since its for the rune and then for said item. > > > > > > I’m sorry, my question was, I guess, a little off topic. > > I was wondering how you acquire the item itself. I know they don’t sell it, it’s in the boxes. I wasn’t sure if you could save up the scraps from the chests to get one (eventually) or if it wasn’t one of the items you can “save” for, and it’s purely a random cheat reward? Random chest reward atm, might be put up for statuettes later but to my knowlage none of the permanent items have been in that rotation yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > @"ProverbsofHell.2307" said: > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > **That statement doesn't make sense.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We have already established that all items have an upfront one-time cost and that the extractor does not require any additional gold to use. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The item has a value; when you remove its sigil with the extractor, that item and the sigil still have value that equals that of the original item, within it's TP market price variations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **The extractor neither MAKES gold nor does it cost any gold per use.** > > > > > > I can not discuss it further without getting into how to exploit "free" "unlimited use" i guess Anet will have to figure it out or they themselves might need to think outside the box as well. I'll just ask the curious to use their imaginations on this one and leave it at that. > > > > > > > > > > Whatever the scenario you have in mind, there is absolutely no justification to make any of the changes you have suggested in this thread. I'm pretty sure there is no way for a player to get 'free' items, put them through the extractor and get a positive net value from it; everything you can salvage in this game, or extract from, has a 'cost', whether you earn it completing content (which is a time costs) or pay for it with a currency, ingame or Real Life conversion to gold. > > > > > > > > it's ok. i'll not say the way to exploit it via silverwastes, level 80 trial exotic gear and unlimited, free, without cool-down extractions. > > > > > > That's a valid point and wasn't aware of that exploit. But safe to say anyone who is making gold from doing that is going to get in trouble for it. I would not recommend being tempted into pursuing this method, if you are reading this. > > > > Exactly ... so why all this thread about trying to get cool downs on Extractor or removing costs on Salvage tools? If you think someone is abusing an unintended mechanic, just report it and describe what's happening in the report. > > why is this the only tool in game that has ZERO RNG, Costs nothing per use, has zero cool-down? > my ghost pepper node, salvage tools and harvest tools/nodes are all layered with RNG. No they aren't layered with RNG ... harvesting tools give you harvests EVERY time they get used and nodes gives you consistent amounts every time you farm them. Are you just inventing things at this point to argue? I don't argue with people that aren't being honest. If you want to have a discussion and people to take you seriously, you better start firming up your 'facts'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanner Blackfeather.6509 Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > @"ProverbsofHell.2307" said: > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > **That statement doesn't make sense.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We have already established that all items have an upfront one-time cost and that the extractor does not require any additional gold to use. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The item has a value; when you remove its sigil with the extractor, that item and the sigil still have value that equals that of the original item, within it's TP market price variations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **The extractor neither MAKES gold nor does it cost any gold per use.** > > > > > > I can not discuss it further without getting into how to exploit "free" "unlimited use" i guess Anet will have to figure it out or they themselves might need to think outside the box as well. I'll just ask the curious to use their imaginations on this one and leave it at that. > > > > > > > > > > Whatever the scenario you have in mind, there is absolutely no justification to make any of the changes you have suggested in this thread. I'm pretty sure there is no way for a player to get 'free' items, put them through the extractor and get a positive net value from it; everything you can salvage in this game, or extract from, has a 'cost', whether you earn it completing content (which is a time costs) or pay for it with a currency, ingame or Real Life conversion to gold. > > > > > > > > it's ok. i'll not say the way to exploit it via silverwastes, level 80 trial exotic gear and unlimited, free, without cool-down extractions. > > > > > > That's a valid point and wasn't aware of that exploit. But safe to say anyone who is making gold from doing that is going to get in trouble for it. I would not recommend being tempted into pursuing this method, if you are reading this. > > > > Exactly ... so why all this thread about trying to get cool downs on Extractor or removing costs on Salvage tools? If you think someone is abusing an unintended mechanic, just report it and describe what's happening in the report. > > why is this the only tool in game that has ZERO RNG, Costs nothing per use, has zero cool-down? > my ghost pepper node, salvage tools and harvest tools/nodes are all layered with RNG. I don't see a per-use cost or rng on the permanent bank access or tp express... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valeria Mudgarden.3054 Posted November 18, 2018 Author Share Posted November 18, 2018 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > @"ProverbsofHell.2307" said: > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > **That statement doesn't make sense.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We have already established that all items have an upfront one-time cost and that the extractor does not require any additional gold to use. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The item has a value; when you remove its sigil with the extractor, that item and the sigil still have value that equals that of the original item, within it's TP market price variations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **The extractor neither MAKES gold nor does it cost any gold per use.** > > > > > > > I can not discuss it further without getting into how to exploit "free" "unlimited use" i guess Anet will have to figure it out or they themselves might need to think outside the box as well. I'll just ask the curious to use their imaginations on this one and leave it at that. > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever the scenario you have in mind, there is absolutely no justification to make any of the changes you have suggested in this thread. I'm pretty sure there is no way for a player to get 'free' items, put them through the extractor and get a positive net value from it; everything you can salvage in this game, or extract from, has a 'cost', whether you earn it completing content (which is a time costs) or pay for it with a currency, ingame or Real Life conversion to gold. > > > > > > > > > > it's ok. i'll not say the way to exploit it via silverwastes, level 80 trial exotic gear and unlimited, free, without cool-down extractions. > > > > > > > > That's a valid point and wasn't aware of that exploit. But safe to say anyone who is making gold from doing that is going to get in trouble for it. I would not recommend being tempted into pursuing this method, if you are reading this. > > > > > > Exactly ... so why all this thread about trying to get cool downs on Extractor or removing costs on Salvage tools? If you think someone is abusing an unintended mechanic, just report it and describe what's happening in the report. > > > > why is this the only tool in game that has ZERO RNG, Costs nothing per use, has zero cool-down? > > my ghost pepper node, salvage tools and harvest tools/nodes are all layered with RNG. > > No they aren't layered with RNG ... harvesting tools give you harvests EVERY time they get used and nodes gives you consistent amounts every time you farm them. Are you just inventing things at this point to argue? I don't argue with people that aren't being honest. If you want to have a discussion and people to take you seriously, you better start firming up your 'facts'. yes, they are layerd with RNG. the tools, the nodes and ALL are time gated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > @"ProverbsofHell.2307" said: > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > **That statement doesn't make sense.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We have already established that all items have an upfront one-time cost and that the extractor does not require any additional gold to use. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The item has a value; when you remove its sigil with the extractor, that item and the sigil still have value that equals that of the original item, within it's TP market price variations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **The extractor neither MAKES gold nor does it cost any gold per use.** > > > > > > > > I can not discuss it further without getting into how to exploit "free" "unlimited use" i guess Anet will have to figure it out or they themselves might need to think outside the box as well. I'll just ask the curious to use their imaginations on this one and leave it at that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever the scenario you have in mind, there is absolutely no justification to make any of the changes you have suggested in this thread. I'm pretty sure there is no way for a player to get 'free' items, put them through the extractor and get a positive net value from it; everything you can salvage in this game, or extract from, has a 'cost', whether you earn it completing content (which is a time costs) or pay for it with a currency, ingame or Real Life conversion to gold. > > > > > > > > > > > > it's ok. i'll not say the way to exploit it via silverwastes, level 80 trial exotic gear and unlimited, free, without cool-down extractions. > > > > > > > > > > That's a valid point and wasn't aware of that exploit. But safe to say anyone who is making gold from doing that is going to get in trouble for it. I would not recommend being tempted into pursuing this method, if you are reading this. > > > > > > > > Exactly ... so why all this thread about trying to get cool downs on Extractor or removing costs on Salvage tools? If you think someone is abusing an unintended mechanic, just report it and describe what's happening in the report. > > > > > > why is this the only tool in game that has ZERO RNG, Costs nothing per use, has zero cool-down? > > > my ghost pepper node, salvage tools and harvest tools/nodes are all layered with RNG. > > > > No they aren't layered with RNG ... harvesting tools give you harvests EVERY time they get used and nodes gives you consistent amounts every time you farm them. Are you just inventing things at this point to argue? I don't argue with people that aren't being honest. If you want to have a discussion and people to take you seriously, you better start firming up your 'facts'. > > yes, they are layerd with RNG. the tools, the nodes and ALL are time gated. Time gates are not RNG ... do you know what the concepts are behind the terms you are throwing around here? It doesn't sound like you are familiar with them. I'm going to suggest you figure out what you are saying before you continue to lose everyone in this discussion with your misuse. It's impossible to have a discussion with someone who is not familiar with the things they are speaking about. I can only be assured that everyone that needs to know, does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valeria Mudgarden.3054 Posted November 18, 2018 Author Share Posted November 18, 2018 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > @"ProverbsofHell.2307" said: > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > **That statement doesn't make sense.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We have already established that all items have an upfront one-time cost and that the extractor does not require any additional gold to use. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The item has a value; when you remove its sigil with the extractor, that item and the sigil still have value that equals that of the original item, within it's TP market price variations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **The extractor neither MAKES gold nor does it cost any gold per use.** > > > > > > > > > I can not discuss it further without getting into how to exploit "free" "unlimited use" i guess Anet will have to figure it out or they themselves might need to think outside the box as well. I'll just ask the curious to use their imaginations on this one and leave it at that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever the scenario you have in mind, there is absolutely no justification to make any of the changes you have suggested in this thread. I'm pretty sure there is no way for a player to get 'free' items, put them through the extractor and get a positive net value from it; everything you can salvage in this game, or extract from, has a 'cost', whether you earn it completing content (which is a time costs) or pay for it with a currency, ingame or Real Life conversion to gold. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > it's ok. i'll not say the way to exploit it via silverwastes, level 80 trial exotic gear and unlimited, free, without cool-down extractions. > > > > > > > > > > > > That's a valid point and wasn't aware of that exploit. But safe to say anyone who is making gold from doing that is going to get in trouble for it. I would not recommend being tempted into pursuing this method, if you are reading this. > > > > > > > > > > Exactly ... so why all this thread about trying to get cool downs on Extractor or removing costs on Salvage tools? If you think someone is abusing an unintended mechanic, just report it and describe what's happening in the report. > > > > > > > > why is this the only tool in game that has ZERO RNG, Costs nothing per use, has zero cool-down? > > > > my ghost pepper node, salvage tools and harvest tools/nodes are all layered with RNG. > > > > > > No they aren't layered with RNG ... harvesting tools give you harvests EVERY time they get used and nodes gives you consistent amounts every time you farm them. Are you just inventing things at this point to argue? I don't argue with people that aren't being honest. If you want to have a discussion and people to take you seriously, you better start firming up your 'facts'. > > > > yes, they are layerd with RNG. the tools, the nodes and ALL are time gated. > > Time gates are not RNG ... do you know what the concepts are behind the terms you are throwing around here? It doesn't sound like you are familiar with them. therefore a time gate on the extraction process wouldn't hurt it a single bit. since it has no RNG. /edit 5 per day sounds fair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > @"ProverbsofHell.2307" said: > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > **That statement doesn't make sense.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We have already established that all items have an upfront one-time cost and that the extractor does not require any additional gold to use. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The item has a value; when you remove its sigil with the extractor, that item and the sigil still have value that equals that of the original item, within it's TP market price variations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **The extractor neither MAKES gold nor does it cost any gold per use.** > > > > > > > > > > I can not discuss it further without getting into how to exploit "free" "unlimited use" i guess Anet will have to figure it out or they themselves might need to think outside the box as well. I'll just ask the curious to use their imaginations on this one and leave it at that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever the scenario you have in mind, there is absolutely no justification to make any of the changes you have suggested in this thread. I'm pretty sure there is no way for a player to get 'free' items, put them through the extractor and get a positive net value from it; everything you can salvage in this game, or extract from, has a 'cost', whether you earn it completing content (which is a time costs) or pay for it with a currency, ingame or Real Life conversion to gold. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > it's ok. i'll not say the way to exploit it via silverwastes, level 80 trial exotic gear and unlimited, free, without cool-down extractions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That's a valid point and wasn't aware of that exploit. But safe to say anyone who is making gold from doing that is going to get in trouble for it. I would not recommend being tempted into pursuing this method, if you are reading this. > > > > > > > > > > > > Exactly ... so why all this thread about trying to get cool downs on Extractor or removing costs on Salvage tools? If you think someone is abusing an unintended mechanic, just report it and describe what's happening in the report. > > > > > > > > > > why is this the only tool in game that has ZERO RNG, Costs nothing per use, has zero cool-down? > > > > > my ghost pepper node, salvage tools and harvest tools/nodes are all layered with RNG. > > > > > > > > No they aren't layered with RNG ... harvesting tools give you harvests EVERY time they get used and nodes gives you consistent amounts every time you farm them. Are you just inventing things at this point to argue? I don't argue with people that aren't being honest. If you want to have a discussion and people to take you seriously, you better start firming up your 'facts'. > > > > > > yes, they are layerd with RNG. the tools, the nodes and ALL are time gated. > > > > Time gates are not RNG ... do you know what the concepts are behind the terms you are throwing around here? It doesn't sound like you are familiar with them. > > therefore a time gate on the extraction process wouldn't hurt it a single bit. since it has no RNG. OK ... and? Just because you **think** this proves it doesn't hurt isn't a compelling reason to add a limit on use for the extractor. It actually does hurt, because the value of the extractor people get is for the functionality it offers now, not some crippled version that you think should exist to cover up an unintended mechanic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dante.1763 Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > @"ProverbsofHell.2307" said: > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > **That statement doesn't make sense.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We have already established that all items have an upfront one-time cost and that the extractor does not require any additional gold to use. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The item has a value; when you remove its sigil with the extractor, that item and the sigil still have value that equals that of the original item, within it's TP market price variations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **The extractor neither MAKES gold nor does it cost any gold per use.** > > > > > > > > > > I can not discuss it further without getting into how to exploit "free" "unlimited use" i guess Anet will have to figure it out or they themselves might need to think outside the box as well. I'll just ask the curious to use their imaginations on this one and leave it at that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever the scenario you have in mind, there is absolutely no justification to make any of the changes you have suggested in this thread. I'm pretty sure there is no way for a player to get 'free' items, put them through the extractor and get a positive net value from it; everything you can salvage in this game, or extract from, has a 'cost', whether you earn it completing content (which is a time costs) or pay for it with a currency, ingame or Real Life conversion to gold. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > it's ok. i'll not say the way to exploit it via silverwastes, level 80 trial exotic gear and unlimited, free, without cool-down extractions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That's a valid point and wasn't aware of that exploit. But safe to say anyone who is making gold from doing that is going to get in trouble for it. I would not recommend being tempted into pursuing this method, if you are reading this. > > > > > > > > > > > > Exactly ... so why all this thread about trying to get cool downs on Extractor or removing costs on Salvage tools? If you think someone is abusing an unintended mechanic, just report it and describe what's happening in the report. > > > > > > > > > > why is this the only tool in game that has ZERO RNG, Costs nothing per use, has zero cool-down? > > > > > my ghost pepper node, salvage tools and harvest tools/nodes are all layered with RNG. > > > > > > > > No they aren't layered with RNG ... harvesting tools give you harvests EVERY time they get used and nodes gives you consistent amounts every time you farm them. Are you just inventing things at this point to argue? I don't argue with people that aren't being honest. If you want to have a discussion and people to take you seriously, you better start firming up your 'facts'. > > > > > > yes, they are layerd with RNG. the tools, the nodes and ALL are time gated. > > > > Time gates are not RNG ... do you know what the concepts are behind the terms you are throwing around here? It doesn't sound like you are familiar with them. > > therefore a time gate on the extraction process wouldn't hurt it a single bit. since it has no RNG. > /edit > 5 per day sounds fair. Your arguments for changing this make no freaking sense, they are hard to follow, and they constantly are changing. You arent going to have a ton of people agree with you if you cant state facts you know. ON TOPIC: given how painful this thing is to use(and no, i dont nor will i ever own one.) there already is a time gate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valeria Mudgarden.3054 Posted November 18, 2018 Author Share Posted November 18, 2018 > @"Dante.1763" said: > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > @"ProverbsofHell.2307" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > **That statement doesn't make sense.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We have already established that all items have an upfront one-time cost and that the extractor does not require any additional gold to use. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The item has a value; when you remove its sigil with the extractor, that item and the sigil still have value that equals that of the original item, within it's TP market price variations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **The extractor neither MAKES gold nor does it cost any gold per use.** > > > > > > > > > > > I can not discuss it further without getting into how to exploit "free" "unlimited use" i guess Anet will have to figure it out or they themselves might need to think outside the box as well. I'll just ask the curious to use their imaginations on this one and leave it at that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever the scenario you have in mind, there is absolutely no justification to make any of the changes you have suggested in this thread. I'm pretty sure there is no way for a player to get 'free' items, put them through the extractor and get a positive net value from it; everything you can salvage in this game, or extract from, has a 'cost', whether you earn it completing content (which is a time costs) or pay for it with a currency, ingame or Real Life conversion to gold. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > it's ok. i'll not say the way to exploit it via silverwastes, level 80 trial exotic gear and unlimited, free, without cool-down extractions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That's a valid point and wasn't aware of that exploit. But safe to say anyone who is making gold from doing that is going to get in trouble for it. I would not recommend being tempted into pursuing this method, if you are reading this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Exactly ... so why all this thread about trying to get cool downs on Extractor or removing costs on Salvage tools? If you think someone is abusing an unintended mechanic, just report it and describe what's happening in the report. > > > > > > > > > > > > why is this the only tool in game that has ZERO RNG, Costs nothing per use, has zero cool-down? > > > > > > my ghost pepper node, salvage tools and harvest tools/nodes are all layered with RNG. > > > > > > > > > > No they aren't layered with RNG ... harvesting tools give you harvests EVERY time they get used and nodes gives you consistent amounts every time you farm them. Are you just inventing things at this point to argue? I don't argue with people that aren't being honest. If you want to have a discussion and people to take you seriously, you better start firming up your 'facts'. > > > > > > > > yes, they are layerd with RNG. the tools, the nodes and ALL are time gated. > > > > > > Time gates are not RNG ... do you know what the concepts are behind the terms you are throwing around here? It doesn't sound like you are familiar with them. > > > > therefore a time gate on the extraction process wouldn't hurt it a single bit. since it has no RNG. > > /edit > > 5 per day sounds fair. > > Your arguments for changing this make no freaking sense, they are hard to follow, and they constantly are changing. You arent going to have a ton of people agree with you if you cant state facts you know. > > ON TOPIC: given how painful this thing is to use(and no, i dont nor will i ever own one.) there already is a time gate. if you dont own one, how is it painful to use? and why is this being brought up as some sort of excuse? btw, people ARE NOT going to agree with me no matter what is stated. remember where you're at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > @"Dante.1763" said: > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > @"ProverbsofHell.2307" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > **That statement doesn't make sense.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We have already established that all items have an upfront one-time cost and that the extractor does not require any additional gold to use. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The item has a value; when you remove its sigil with the extractor, that item and the sigil still have value that equals that of the original item, within it's TP market price variations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **The extractor neither MAKES gold nor does it cost any gold per use.** > > > > > > > > > > > > I can not discuss it further without getting into how to exploit "free" "unlimited use" i guess Anet will have to figure it out or they themselves might need to think outside the box as well. I'll just ask the curious to use their imaginations on this one and leave it at that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever the scenario you have in mind, there is absolutely no justification to make any of the changes you have suggested in this thread. I'm pretty sure there is no way for a player to get 'free' items, put them through the extractor and get a positive net value from it; everything you can salvage in this game, or extract from, has a 'cost', whether you earn it completing content (which is a time costs) or pay for it with a currency, ingame or Real Life conversion to gold. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > it's ok. i'll not say the way to exploit it via silverwastes, level 80 trial exotic gear and unlimited, free, without cool-down extractions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That's a valid point and wasn't aware of that exploit. But safe to say anyone who is making gold from doing that is going to get in trouble for it. I would not recommend being tempted into pursuing this method, if you are reading this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Exactly ... so why all this thread about trying to get cool downs on Extractor or removing costs on Salvage tools? If you think someone is abusing an unintended mechanic, just report it and describe what's happening in the report. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > why is this the only tool in game that has ZERO RNG, Costs nothing per use, has zero cool-down? > > > > > > > my ghost pepper node, salvage tools and harvest tools/nodes are all layered with RNG. > > > > > > > > > > > > No they aren't layered with RNG ... harvesting tools give you harvests EVERY time they get used and nodes gives you consistent amounts every time you farm them. Are you just inventing things at this point to argue? I don't argue with people that aren't being honest. If you want to have a discussion and people to take you seriously, you better start firming up your 'facts'. > > > > > > > > > > yes, they are layerd with RNG. the tools, the nodes and ALL are time gated. > > > > > > > > Time gates are not RNG ... do you know what the concepts are behind the terms you are throwing around here? It doesn't sound like you are familiar with them. > > > > > > therefore a time gate on the extraction process wouldn't hurt it a single bit. since it has no RNG. > > > /edit > > > 5 per day sounds fair. > > > > Your arguments for changing this make no freaking sense, they are hard to follow, and they constantly are changing. You arent going to have a ton of people agree with you if you cant state facts you know. > > > > ON TOPIC: given how painful this thing is to use(and no, i dont nor will i ever own one.) there already is a time gate. > > if you dont own one, how is it painful to use? and why is this being brought up as some sort of excuse? Excuse for maintaining the game as it is? Are we in the twilight zone here? There is never an excuse **needed** to leave something alone that works as intended and isn't broken. :confused: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valeria Mudgarden.3054 Posted November 18, 2018 Author Share Posted November 18, 2018 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > @"Dante.1763" said: > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"ProverbsofHell.2307" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **That statement doesn't make sense.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We have already established that all items have an upfront one-time cost and that the extractor does not require any additional gold to use. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The item has a value; when you remove its sigil with the extractor, that item and the sigil still have value that equals that of the original item, within it's TP market price variations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **The extractor neither MAKES gold nor does it cost any gold per use.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > I can not discuss it further without getting into how to exploit "free" "unlimited use" i guess Anet will have to figure it out or they themselves might need to think outside the box as well. I'll just ask the curious to use their imaginations on this one and leave it at that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever the scenario you have in mind, there is absolutely no justification to make any of the changes you have suggested in this thread. I'm pretty sure there is no way for a player to get 'free' items, put them through the extractor and get a positive net value from it; everything you can salvage in this game, or extract from, has a 'cost', whether you earn it completing content (which is a time costs) or pay for it with a currency, ingame or Real Life conversion to gold. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > it's ok. i'll not say the way to exploit it via silverwastes, level 80 trial exotic gear and unlimited, free, without cool-down extractions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That's a valid point and wasn't aware of that exploit. But safe to say anyone who is making gold from doing that is going to get in trouble for it. I would not recommend being tempted into pursuing this method, if you are reading this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Exactly ... so why all this thread about trying to get cool downs on Extractor or removing costs on Salvage tools? If you think someone is abusing an unintended mechanic, just report it and describe what's happening in the report. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > why is this the only tool in game that has ZERO RNG, Costs nothing per use, has zero cool-down? > > > > > > > > my ghost pepper node, salvage tools and harvest tools/nodes are all layered with RNG. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No they aren't layered with RNG ... harvesting tools give you harvests EVERY time they get used and nodes gives you consistent amounts every time you farm them. Are you just inventing things at this point to argue? I don't argue with people that aren't being honest. If you want to have a discussion and people to take you seriously, you better start firming up your 'facts'. > > > > > > > > > > > > yes, they are layerd with RNG. the tools, the nodes and ALL are time gated. > > > > > > > > > > Time gates are not RNG ... do you know what the concepts are behind the terms you are throwing around here? It doesn't sound like you are familiar with them. > > > > > > > > therefore a time gate on the extraction process wouldn't hurt it a single bit. since it has no RNG. > > > > /edit > > > > 5 per day sounds fair. > > > > > > Your arguments for changing this make no freaking sense, they are hard to follow, and they constantly are changing. You arent going to have a ton of people agree with you if you cant state facts you know. > > > > > > ON TOPIC: given how painful this thing is to use(and no, i dont nor will i ever own one.) there already is a time gate. > > > > if you dont own one, how is it painful to use? and why is this being brought up as some sort of excuse? > > Excuse for maintaining the game as it is? Are we in the twilight zone here? There is never an excuse **needed** to leave something alone that works as intended and isn't broken. :confused: > > changing builds without templates hurts my fingers. why isn't THAT fixed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dante.1763 Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > @"Dante.1763" said: > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > @"ProverbsofHell.2307" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > **That statement doesn't make sense.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We have already established that all items have an upfront one-time cost and that the extractor does not require any additional gold to use. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The item has a value; when you remove its sigil with the extractor, that item and the sigil still have value that equals that of the original item, within it's TP market price variations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **The extractor neither MAKES gold nor does it cost any gold per use.** > > > > > > > > > > > > I can not discuss it further without getting into how to exploit "free" "unlimited use" i guess Anet will have to figure it out or they themselves might need to think outside the box as well. I'll just ask the curious to use their imaginations on this one and leave it at that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever the scenario you have in mind, there is absolutely no justification to make any of the changes you have suggested in this thread. I'm pretty sure there is no way for a player to get 'free' items, put them through the extractor and get a positive net value from it; everything you can salvage in this game, or extract from, has a 'cost', whether you earn it completing content (which is a time costs) or pay for it with a currency, ingame or Real Life conversion to gold. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > it's ok. i'll not say the way to exploit it via silverwastes, level 80 trial exotic gear and unlimited, free, without cool-down extractions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That's a valid point and wasn't aware of that exploit. But safe to say anyone who is making gold from doing that is going to get in trouble for it. I would not recommend being tempted into pursuing this method, if you are reading this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Exactly ... so why all this thread about trying to get cool downs on Extractor or removing costs on Salvage tools? If you think someone is abusing an unintended mechanic, just report it and describe what's happening in the report. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > why is this the only tool in game that has ZERO RNG, Costs nothing per use, has zero cool-down? > > > > > > > my ghost pepper node, salvage tools and harvest tools/nodes are all layered with RNG. > > > > > > > > > > > > No they aren't layered with RNG ... harvesting tools give you harvests EVERY time they get used and nodes gives you consistent amounts every time you farm them. Are you just inventing things at this point to argue? I don't argue with people that aren't being honest. If you want to have a discussion and people to take you seriously, you better start firming up your 'facts'. > > > > > > > > > > yes, they are layerd with RNG. the tools, the nodes and ALL are time gated. > > > > > > > > Time gates are not RNG ... do you know what the concepts are behind the terms you are throwing around here? It doesn't sound like you are familiar with them. > > > > > > therefore a time gate on the extraction process wouldn't hurt it a single bit. since it has no RNG. > > > /edit > > > 5 per day sounds fair. > > > > Your arguments for changing this make no freaking sense, they are hard to follow, and they constantly are changing. You arent going to have a ton of people agree with you if you cant state facts you know. > > > > ON TOPIC: given how painful this thing is to use(and no, i dont nor will i ever own one.) there already is a time gate. > > if you dont own one, how is it painful to use? and why is this being brought up as some sort of excuse? > btw, people ARE NOT going to agree with me no matter what is stated. remember where you're at. Simple, i have nearly 250 *regular* upgrade extractors that ive gotten from BLCs and i never use them because of the idiotic click, drag, click "mechanics" needed to use them, that alone adds 5-10 seconds to each one usage, its not an excuse, its a fact. And "People will never agree with me" is so wrong on so many levels especially on this forum, if you make good points with lots of factual evidence, you will have people agreeing with you, it wont be everyone, but facts can change and do change minds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palador.2170 Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > why is this the only tool in game that has ZERO RNG, Costs nothing per use, has zero cool-down? > my ghost pepper node, salvage tools and harvest tools/nodes are all layered with RNG. > /edit > in fact, i think this is the ONLY tool that isn't or doesn't have some sort of RNG layered into it. Hi! I'm jumping into this thread again because I hope I can clear up an important point here. Now, you've compared the Endless Extractor with both your Ghost Pepper Node, and Endless Harvesting Tools. I'm going to go with that. You've also compared it against the expendable harvesting tools you can get in-game, but that's really more on the level of the expendable upgrade extractors in that you have to pay to use them. So, they're kind of a side distraction to the whole thing, let's just set them aside for a moment. You can use an endless harvesting tool on your ghost pepper node to get one harvest per day, and only one harvest per day. Compared to the endless extractor, that does seem a bit unfair. But... you're comparing TWO seperate items to one. We need to separate that. The Ghost Pepper Node can be used only once per day, that is true. (We'll ignore letting others into your home instance to use it as well, as that's also a side argument that we don't really need for this.) However, it provides one easy access per day to a potentially valuable harvest item. It "creates" the item, you just need to gather it somehow. The fact that it creates items is why it's limited in uses per day. It's very dissimilar to the other two items in question. Now, the Endless Harvesting Tool doesn't create anything. (Also ignoring glyphs, thank you.) What it does do is give you a way to collect items (harvest node output) without paying a per-use fee. It's important to note that this can be used on as many nodes per day as you can reach, be it one or one thousand. The large cost is to pay for not having to worry about the per-use cost later or worrying about running out of tools. The Endless Upgrade Extractor actually works much like the endless harvesting tool. You simply replace "node" with "upgraded item". You can use it as often as you want, limited only by how many you can get to. Like the endless harvesting tool, the large cost is to avoid the per-use cost you'd normally get with a standard extractor. It can be seen, at best, as an endless gathering tool that is "powered" by loot, where the gathering tools are powered by gathering nodes. If you were to take into account the fact that removing the upgrade reduces the value of the remaining item, and how glyphs can also create more resources when used in harvesting tools, it's suddenly not the upgrade extractor that looks unbalanced. In short, you'd have better luck pressing for a restriction on the Endless Gathering Tools, or for keeping visitors to your home instance from gathering from your nodes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > @"Dante.1763" said: > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"ProverbsofHell.2307" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **That statement doesn't make sense.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We have already established that all items have an upfront one-time cost and that the extractor does not require any additional gold to use. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The item has a value; when you remove its sigil with the extractor, that item and the sigil still have value that equals that of the original item, within it's TP market price variations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **The extractor neither MAKES gold nor does it cost any gold per use.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I can not discuss it further without getting into how to exploit "free" "unlimited use" i guess Anet will have to figure it out or they themselves might need to think outside the box as well. I'll just ask the curious to use their imaginations on this one and leave it at that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever the scenario you have in mind, there is absolutely no justification to make any of the changes you have suggested in this thread. I'm pretty sure there is no way for a player to get 'free' items, put them through the extractor and get a positive net value from it; everything you can salvage in this game, or extract from, has a 'cost', whether you earn it completing content (which is a time costs) or pay for it with a currency, ingame or Real Life conversion to gold. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > it's ok. i'll not say the way to exploit it via silverwastes, level 80 trial exotic gear and unlimited, free, without cool-down extractions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That's a valid point and wasn't aware of that exploit. But safe to say anyone who is making gold from doing that is going to get in trouble for it. I would not recommend being tempted into pursuing this method, if you are reading this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Exactly ... so why all this thread about trying to get cool downs on Extractor or removing costs on Salvage tools? If you think someone is abusing an unintended mechanic, just report it and describe what's happening in the report. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > why is this the only tool in game that has ZERO RNG, Costs nothing per use, has zero cool-down? > > > > > > > > > my ghost pepper node, salvage tools and harvest tools/nodes are all layered with RNG. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No they aren't layered with RNG ... harvesting tools give you harvests EVERY time they get used and nodes gives you consistent amounts every time you farm them. Are you just inventing things at this point to argue? I don't argue with people that aren't being honest. If you want to have a discussion and people to take you seriously, you better start firming up your 'facts'. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > yes, they are layerd with RNG. the tools, the nodes and ALL are time gated. > > > > > > > > > > > > Time gates are not RNG ... do you know what the concepts are behind the terms you are throwing around here? It doesn't sound like you are familiar with them. > > > > > > > > > > therefore a time gate on the extraction process wouldn't hurt it a single bit. since it has no RNG. > > > > > /edit > > > > > 5 per day sounds fair. > > > > > > > > Your arguments for changing this make no freaking sense, they are hard to follow, and they constantly are changing. You arent going to have a ton of people agree with you if you cant state facts you know. > > > > > > > > ON TOPIC: given how painful this thing is to use(and no, i dont nor will i ever own one.) there already is a time gate. > > > > > > if you dont own one, how is it painful to use? and why is this being brought up as some sort of excuse? > > > > Excuse for maintaining the game as it is? Are we in the twilight zone here? There is never an excuse **needed** to leave something alone that works as intended and isn't broken. :confused: > > > > > > changing builds without templates hurts my fingers. why isn't THAT fixed? Hey, if you want build templates, make a thread about it. That has zero to do with putting a CD or daily limited use on Endless Extractor. It also doesn't refute my statement: There is no need for an excuse to leave well intended and well functioning mechanics alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valeria Mudgarden.3054 Posted November 18, 2018 Author Share Posted November 18, 2018 Thanks for the post Palador. What is your take on having to buy extractors with real money now, in order to extract a rune/sigil? since the update, i havent recovered a single rune/sigil via the "old" methods (copper/silver fed etc) . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaaCrow.3076 Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > @"Dante.1763" said: > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"ProverbsofHell.2307" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **That statement doesn't make sense.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We have already established that all items have an upfront one-time cost and that the extractor does not require any additional gold to use. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The item has a value; when you remove its sigil with the extractor, that item and the sigil still have value that equals that of the original item, within it's TP market price variations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **The extractor neither MAKES gold nor does it cost any gold per use.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I can not discuss it further without getting into how to exploit "free" "unlimited use" i guess Anet will have to figure it out or they themselves might need to think outside the box as well. I'll just ask the curious to use their imaginations on this one and leave it at that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever the scenario you have in mind, there is absolutely no justification to make any of the changes you have suggested in this thread. I'm pretty sure there is no way for a player to get 'free' items, put them through the extractor and get a positive net value from it; everything you can salvage in this game, or extract from, has a 'cost', whether you earn it completing content (which is a time costs) or pay for it with a currency, ingame or Real Life conversion to gold. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > it's ok. i'll not say the way to exploit it via silverwastes, level 80 trial exotic gear and unlimited, free, without cool-down extractions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That's a valid point and wasn't aware of that exploit. But safe to say anyone who is making gold from doing that is going to get in trouble for it. I would not recommend being tempted into pursuing this method, if you are reading this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Exactly ... so why all this thread about trying to get cool downs on Extractor or removing costs on Salvage tools? If you think someone is abusing an unintended mechanic, just report it and describe what's happening in the report. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > why is this the only tool in game that has ZERO RNG, Costs nothing per use, has zero cool-down? > > > > > > > > > my ghost pepper node, salvage tools and harvest tools/nodes are all layered with RNG. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No they aren't layered with RNG ... harvesting tools give you harvests EVERY time they get used and nodes gives you consistent amounts every time you farm them. Are you just inventing things at this point to argue? I don't argue with people that aren't being honest. If you want to have a discussion and people to take you seriously, you better start firming up your 'facts'. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > yes, they are layerd with RNG. the tools, the nodes and ALL are time gated. > > > > > > > > > > > > Time gates are not RNG ... do you know what the concepts are behind the terms you are throwing around here? It doesn't sound like you are familiar with them. > > > > > > > > > > therefore a time gate on the extraction process wouldn't hurt it a single bit. since it has no RNG. > > > > > /edit > > > > > 5 per day sounds fair. > > > > > > > > Your arguments for changing this make no freaking sense, they are hard to follow, and they constantly are changing. You arent going to have a ton of people agree with you if you cant state facts you know. > > > > > > > > ON TOPIC: given how painful this thing is to use(and no, i dont nor will i ever own one.) there already is a time gate. > > > > > > if you dont own one, how is it painful to use? and why is this being brought up as some sort of excuse? > > > > Excuse for maintaining the game as it is? Are we in the twilight zone here? There is never an excuse **needed** to leave something alone that works as intended and isn't broken. :confused: > > > > > > changing builds without templates hurts my fingers. why isn't THAT fixed? This thread and the OP'S statements have been truly painfull to read, they remind me too much of the Potus's twitter. Hope they increase the cd on your node harvests to 72 hours pal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valeria Mudgarden.3054 Posted November 18, 2018 Author Share Posted November 18, 2018 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > @"Dante.1763" said: > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"ProverbsofHell.2307" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Valeria Mudgarden.3054" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **That statement doesn't make sense.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We have already established that all items have an upfront one-time cost and that the extractor does not require any additional gold to use. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The item has a value; when you remove its sigil with the extractor, that item and the sigil still have value that equals that of the original item, within it's TP market price variations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **The extractor neither MAKES gold nor does it cost any gold per use.** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I can not discuss it further without getting into how to exploit "free" "unlimited use" i guess Anet will have to figure it out or they themselves might need to think outside the box as well. I'll just ask the curious to use their imaginations on this one and leave it at that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whatever the scenario you have in mind, there is absolutely no justification to make any of the changes you have suggested in this thread. I'm pretty sure there is no way for a player to get 'free' items, put them through the extractor and get a positive net value from it; everything you can salvage in this game, or extract from, has a 'cost', whether you earn it completing content (which is a time costs) or pay for it with a currency, ingame or Real Life conversion to gold. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > it's ok. i'll not say the way to exploit it via silverwastes, level 80 trial exotic gear and unlimited, free, without cool-down extractions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > That's a valid point and wasn't aware of that exploit. But safe to say anyone who is making gold from doing that is going to get in trouble for it. I would not recommend being tempted into pursuing this method, if you are reading this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Exactly ... so why all this thread about trying to get cool downs on Extractor or removing costs on Salvage tools? If you think someone is abusing an unintended mechanic, just report it and describe what's happening in the report. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > why is this the only tool in game that has ZERO RNG, Costs nothing per use, has zero cool-down? > > > > > > > > > > my ghost pepper node, salvage tools and harvest tools/nodes are all layered with RNG. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No they aren't layered with RNG ... harvesting tools give you harvests EVERY time they get used and nodes gives you consistent amounts every time you farm them. Are you just inventing things at this point to argue? I don't argue with people that aren't being honest. If you want to have a discussion and people to take you seriously, you better start firming up your 'facts'. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > yes, they are layerd with RNG. the tools, the nodes and ALL are time gated. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Time gates are not RNG ... do you know what the concepts are behind the terms you are throwing around here? It doesn't sound like you are familiar with them. > > > > > > > > > > > > therefore a time gate on the extraction process wouldn't hurt it a single bit. since it has no RNG. > > > > > > /edit > > > > > > 5 per day sounds fair. > > > > > > > > > > Your arguments for changing this make no freaking sense, they are hard to follow, and they constantly are changing. You arent going to have a ton of people agree with you if you cant state facts you know. > > > > > > > > > > ON TOPIC: given how painful this thing is to use(and no, i dont nor will i ever own one.) there already is a time gate. > > > > > > > > if you dont own one, how is it painful to use? and why is this being brought up as some sort of excuse? > > > > > > Excuse for maintaining the game as it is? Are we in the twilight zone here? There is never an excuse **needed** to leave something alone that works as intended and isn't broken. :confused: > > > > > > > > > > changing builds without templates hurts my fingers. why isn't THAT fixed? > > Hey, if you want build templates, make a thread about it. That has zero to do with putting a CD or daily limited use on Endless Extractor. It also doesn't refute my statement: There is no need for an excuse to leave well intended and well functioning mechanics alone. if it's hurting people to use, how is it "well intended and well functioning" mechanics? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inculpatus cedo.9234 Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 You don't _have_ to buy extractors to remove rune/sigils. You can use a BL Salvage Kit from the Daily Log-in Rewards. Or exchange Gold for Gems and acquire an extractor or BLSK at no real money cost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valeria Mudgarden.3054 Posted November 18, 2018 Author Share Posted November 18, 2018 > @"Inculpatus cedo.9234" said: > You don't _have_ to buy extractors to remove rune/sigils. You can use a BL Salvage Kit from the Daily Log-in Rewards. > Or exchange Gold for Gems and acquire an extractor of BLSK at no real money cost. I haven't had one of those given to me in quite some time, in fact, there was a time i had to store them on mules. I guess it's good that i've been playing since the Headstart. Hopefully new(er) people get them though. /edit https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/60902/salvage-kits-cant-extract-runes-anymore-this-is-stupid#latest interesting feedback Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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