Everything oneshots you.

[Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365]

> @"Junkpile.7439" said:

> Funny when you throw phoenix in zerg you see 1.7k crits and reve spam 13k crits, soulbeast 8.7k autoattacks, daredevil spam 13k vaults. You start to think why you even play this kitten. :)

 

but then u swap to staff and see 9k meteors and u remeber why

[Mini Crinny.6190]

> @"Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365" said:

> > @"Junkpile.7439" said:

> > Funny when you throw phoenix in zerg you see 1.7k crits and reve spam 13k crits, soulbeast 8.7k autoattacks, daredevil spam 13k vaults. You start to think why you even play this kitten. :)

>

> but then u swap to staff and see 9k meteors and u remeber why

 

then you remember your standing still for 3 seconds and get rekt by revs and necros

[geist.4126]

You could play scepter instead

[Israel.7056]

> @"Mini Crinny.6190" said:

> > @"Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365" said:

> > > @"Junkpile.7439" said:

> > > Funny when you throw phoenix in zerg you see 1.7k crits and reve spam 13k crits, soulbeast 8.7k autoattacks, daredevil spam 13k vaults. You start to think why you even play this kitten. :)

> >

> > but then u swap to staff and see 9k meteors and u remeber why

>

> then you remember your standing still for 3 seconds and get rekt by revs and necros

 

And then you just mist away and rally off downs ez

[Mini Crinny.6190]

> @"Israel.7056" said:

> > @"Mini Crinny.6190" said:

> > > @"Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365" said:

> > > > @"Junkpile.7439" said:

> > > > Funny when you throw phoenix in zerg you see 1.7k crits and reve spam 13k crits, soulbeast 8.7k autoattacks, daredevil spam 13k vaults. You start to think why you even play this kitten. :)

> > >

> > > but then u swap to staff and see 9k meteors and u remeber why

> >

> > then you remember your standing still for 3 seconds and get rekt by revs and necros

>

> And then you just mist away and rally off downs ez

 

Then you wait 24 seconds using your other skills until Meteor is off CD again

[LetoII.3782]

> @"Mini Crinny.6190" said:

> > @"Israel.7056" said:

> > > @"Mini Crinny.6190" said:

> > > > @"Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365" said:

> > > > > @"Junkpile.7439" said:

> > > > > Funny when you throw phoenix in zerg you see 1.7k crits and reve spam 13k crits, soulbeast 8.7k autoattacks, daredevil spam 13k vaults. You start to think why you even play this kitten. :)

> > > >

> > > > but then u swap to staff and see 9k meteors and u remeber why

> > >

> > > then you remember your standing still for 3 seconds and get rekt by revs and necros

> >

> > And then you just mist away and rally off downs ez

>

> Then you wait 24 seconds using your other skills until Meteor is off CD again

 

Stabo

Stabo

Stabo

Stabo

Stabo

Cleanse

Stabo

Stabo

 

We all have our blob chore in the blob... Mostly

[Ronnie Hu.1694]


https://i.imgur.com/xNLZ4nx.jpg

i have 2600 and 25000 hp.. 1 hit took over 60% of my HP

[Solori.6025]

> @"ProverbsofHell.2307" said:

> Gotta interject here with regards to Warrior:

>

> Rifle is a gimmick weapon, no warrior who isn't memeing will be using this. One decent burst doesn't make up for a fairly meh weapon, and projectiles are horrible in WvW anyway and shouldn't be used seriously. Running mainhand axe is also a bad idea when sword is a clearly superior alternative (for sword leaps alone). And actually landing axe burst in WvW is a miracle in and of itself. Final Thrust is kinda kitten but lets face it, if you're under 50% health, you were dead anyway. 20k Final Thrust is just for jollies.

 

I don't think anyone is defending the build.

More so it was people telling another "warrior main" who seems to be so out of touch with reality and is too busy white knighting for his class that yes,

the warrior is capable of one-shotting someone.

Second vid I posted was just that, a warrior taking out someone with a 20k hit.

 

Again, it's a meme build as you said, and the chances of running into someone doing that is rare.

but it is possible.

 

 

[Burnfall.9573]

Recently revisited wvw, what's new this time?

Same results, Nothing Changes, being 1 shotted all over again

 

(1 shotting has been in the game since day 1. Since then, it has only gotten worse)

 

*"If you don't change

your approach than

you will never change

your results* "

 

*" If you did the same thing you did

yesterday as you did today as you

will do tomorrow, what have you

done?

The Same Thing* "

 


 

[Zenix.6198]

On a a more "on topic"-note however,

 

I have to agree with OP tho. Damage across the board is simply too high.

The two expansions we had so far have introduced massive powercreep to the game.

Higher damage, higher healing, condi and boonspam, etc.

Problem is, that player healthpools and amour rating are the same as they were back in 2012.

5-digit damage values are completely ridiculous (one-shot or not) if you look at player healthpools percentage-wise.

 

I recently advocated for some type of a damage and healing modifier in PvP-centric modes on the PvP-forums.

Other big MMOs (like WoW for instance) also had to introduce such systems at some point, so I personally think it couldnt be too bad for GW2 as well.

 

For those wondering what I mean:

Something along the lines "15% **less** dmg received from players" and "15% **less** healing received from players".

All sources, period. Any condition, any power dmg, any healing (combo fields, regen ticks, barrier, all of it).

 

Yes, this wouldnt be fixing any balance issues, but it at least would prevent people from getting 2 shot from random stuff thats flung around (like a 13k aoe arcing slice on a 8 second CD). Currently strong classes would still be strong and weak classes would still be weak. It just extends fights for 15% (assuming thats the modifier).

 

And for those of you, that fear the introduction of a "bunker" meta, since defensive skills wouldnt be affected by such a system:

Lets look at endure pain for instance and assume a fight against a warrior lasts 180 seconds (3 minutes) currently.

 

At 180 seconds the warrior gets to cast endure pain 180/30 = 6 times.

Prolong that fight by 15% and you get to 207 seconds.

At 207 seconds the warrior gets to cast endure pain 207/30 = 6.9 times.

 

So a 30 second defensive would get 1 additional cast for a 3 and a half minute long fight ....which already is an excruciatingly long, fringe-case scenario.

And the trade off is not getting absolutely demolished in 2 hits.

[Gemnaid.4219]

Too much passive invulnerable on cheese builds.

[Deax.1572]

> @"Hitman.5829" said:

> > @"SpellOfIniquity.1780" said:

> > > @"Hitman.5829" said:

> >

> > > Lets stop with the useless talk and instead show me a video where there is a one shot build for warrior and then we will talk.

> > > One shot on warrior does not exist! Warrior is the only class that cannot 1 shot and I dare you to look for a video.

> >

> > This isn't entirely relevant since it was on an NPC, but regardless, this is one of the highest crits I've ever landed in WvW

> > 

> >

> > If you'd like, I can do some recording this weekend to see how many one shots I can manage. I guarantee you it can be done, and with relative ease. In fact, it can do _true_ one shots, meaning not rapid multi-hits like a Mesmer shatter for example.

> >

> > Also, here you go. A build easily capable of one shots:

> > http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vJEQJAURjEdQdH23BuhAnIGICK9Lm+twCgIYAuyIDWeA-jFSBABLcEAoU9nNOEAmpEEPdBAcBAy/BAc1+jyvAAIA38mZzbG4m38m38m3srbzsZ28m3MpAGVrF-w

> >

> > Healing activates Peak Performance (+33% damage), using both Signets activates Signet Mastery (+200 Ferocity), Burst Mastery = +7% more damage, Warriors Sprint = +3% damage, Scholar runes = +5% damage, Berserker's Power = +21% damage. Most of which will be active _before_ you hit your target. Shouldn't be hard to get between 20 and 25k crits on squishies. And with Quickness, it's a much shorter cast time + unblockable from the Signet.

> >

> > All that aside, it _is_ extremely telegraphed and the build is a gimmick. Meaning it can't do much else besides one shot cheese. Still, even without a dedicated gimmick build, Warrior is easily capable of extremely high damage. I think you need to let go of the idea that Warrior can't pump out insane levels of damage.

>

> Video of 1 shot builds or they do not exist. HINT: they do not exist, so don't waste your time searching because I already did.

> That combat log only proves that you were on a serg, warrior cannot reach that damage level by itself.

>

> I am still waiting for a 1 shot video for warrior.

>

 

Sadly, it seems Grogert Wolfborn either deleted or made his vid private/unlisted. He did have a vid i could have given you where he pretty much one shots many people. Basically the build is full zerk Spellbreaker with sword/dagger and GS. Strength/Discipline/SB. Something like this http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vJAQNAsYRAldsQEYGBgIwAQ5LM92C4/4j8TG-jVROwAA2fYkyPi6DAr+jMlgkCoKJbA-w

The trick is to Bull's Charge which procs peak performance and then follow up with dagger 4# Wastrel's Ruin which doubles in damage if your target isn't using any skills, they won't be if you've successfully cc'd them. The numbers can go really high on squishy targets. The charge itself hits like a truck and then you follow up with a ~14k or higher Wastrel's Ruin. The down side is less defenses, melee and less likely to catch people off guard than say a thief. A guildie has been using this build in wvw for fun. It's definitely harder to play, but the bursts you land do feel sweet. Maybe contact Grogert, he's a very skilled warrior and a cool dude, he could share the build in greater detail.

Edit: Talked with Grogert, his vid was taken down by youtube for some reason, still im sure he'd help you out with the build should you ask him.

[Sekai.2987]

first vid on youtube when you search for one shot war, in the first 20sec you see him crit for 20k with rifle , imo the quicknes gunflame is still better (and harder to dodge) but core war is doing alot of dmg too

 

[Shroud.2307]

> @"Deax.1572" said:

 

> Sadly, it seems Grogert Wolfborn either deleted or made his vid private/unlisted.

 

I actually was going to link that exact video in my initial comment.

[apharma.3741]

> @"Zenix.6198" said:

> On a a more "on topic"-note however,

>

> I have to agree with OP tho. Damage across the board is simply too high.

> The two expansions we had so far have introduced massive powercreep to the game.

> Higher damage, higher healing, condi and boonspam, etc.

> Problem is, that player healthpools and amour rating are the same as they were back in 2012.

> 5-digit damage values are completely ridiculous (one-shot or not) if you look at player healthpools percentage-wise.

>

> I recently advocated for some type of a damage and healing modifier in PvP-centric modes on the PvP-forums.

> Other big MMOs (like WoW for instance) also had to introduce such systems at some point, so I personally think it couldnt be too bad for GW2 as well.

>

> For those wondering what I mean:

> Something along the lines "15% **less** dmg received from players" and "15% **less** healing received from players".

> All sources, period. Any condition, any power dmg, any healing (combo fields, regen ticks, barrier, all of it).

>

> Yes, this wouldnt be fixing any balance issues, but it at least would prevent people from getting 2 shot from random stuff thats flung around (like a 13k aoe arcing slice on a 8 second CD). Currently strong classes would still be strong and weak classes would still be weak. It just extends fights for 15% (assuming thats the modifier).

>

> And for those of you, that fear the introduction of a "bunker" meta, since defensive skills wouldnt be affected by such a system:

> Lets look at endure pain for instance and assume a fight against a warrior lasts 180 seconds (3 minutes) currently.

>

> At 180 seconds the warrior gets to cast endure pain 180/30 = 6 times.

> Prolong that fight by 15% and you get to 207 seconds.

> At 207 seconds the warrior gets to cast endure pain 207/30 = 6.9 times.

>

> So a 30 second defensive would get 1 additional cast for a 3 and a half minute long fight ....which already is an excruciatingly long, fringe-case scenario.

> And the trade off is not getting absolutely demolished in 2 hits.

 

My biggest issue with this kind of action is that the game since HoT and PoF has reduced cool downs across the board as part of this carebear "nerfing hurts twice as much as buffing so all we'll do is buff most of the time" idiotology. This leads to the spam you said but it doesn't make the game any more fun as the get out of jail free cards get lower making it incredibly forgiving and when you couple that with the power creep you get very forgiving builds that are a very serious threat to experienced players from even average players.

 

There's also a lesser brought up aspect too, ANet have been buffing core traits and skills on **some** classes since HoT and PoF when they were considered extremely poorly represented and weak in the meta by all accounts. What this leads to is some class/build combos that are incredibly strong like core guard, core S/D thief before the last nerf. You also have something like ranger which has insane synergy and power even in core but at the other end of the spectrum are things like core mesmer and I would say core necro and engy but ANet seems to be buffing them now in the last round of balance patches though the engy changes also buff holo because LUL.

 

This leads to a really sharp contrast between what is meta and what is not, it's even more harsh if you're limited by expansions or don't want to play condi or power. This makes the game a lot less fun and even more so when power creep makes the alternative to what you'd like to run stronger but your build is still back in 2014 in terms of combat ability. Ironically no-one thinks of this kind of nerfing and how much that hurts the community instead only focusing on the direct nerfs which hurt at the time but after a few months people largely don't care about.

[Brujeria.7536]

Generally speaking its okay for some skills, or skill combinations, to do high amounts of burst damage. But these kind of burst damage should always come at a a cost and a heavy amount of skill and/or risk involved. Things have been getting out of hand for a long time. Best example are Revenant Hammer and Longbow ranger. These are long range skills, yet they are able to deal huge amounts of damage. In case of Rev Hammer the skills themself completly lack counterplay as most of them are not even projectiles. Its not okay for a long range auto attack to deal that much damage. Skill 2 on both of these weapons are busted damage wise. The damage would even be too high for a meele attack. In case of rev it gets even more severe skill 5 is a ranged AOE CC skill that deals huge amount of damage. CC skills should not deal damage. Ranged skills should not deal that much damage either. To top it of the cooldown is even at 15 seconds.

 

There are usually a few very simple rules when balancing skill damage:

 

Long Ranged attacks should deal much less damage then meele attacks. (Rev Hammer, Ranger Longow, Ele Staff, Mesmer GS, Thief rifle)

CC Skills should deal lower damage. AOE CC Skills should deal much lower or no damage at all. (Rev Hammer, Scrapper Hammer, Warrior Hammer)

Skills should have a clear identity - a skill thats a gapcloser and a evade or a gapcloser and a stun should not deal much damage, thats not the purpose of the skill. (A lot of warrior skills, a lot of rev skills e.g. sword 3, staff 5, mesmer mantras to some degree)

Skills that lack counterplay should not exist, and if so, they should not do much damage. (Every attack coming from stealth, Rev sword 3)

Complete Damage immunity should not allow any actions (no stomps, no rezzes, no burst damage)

Partial damage immunity should be very rare and on a very long cooldown (Reasoning is these skills completly negate gear investment, allowing to reach very high damage trough stats without the need for defensive stats while still providing very strong defense)

Auto Attacks should not deal much damage (Thief, Ranger Longbow, Holosmith, Reaper, and so on)

 

These points all dont mean that meele skills should be allowed to deal such high amounts of damage either, but these skills should be granted more damage because thats their sole purpose.

 

Overall, the deciding factor on what deals the most damage should be stat investment. The fact that some skills and mechanics are just OP on a isolated skill damage basis and the fact that some classes get way too much defense baseline, without stat scaling is one of the biggest problems of the powercreep in this game. The other factor is that the overall balance is very biased towards power damage - there are a lot of skills to remove conditions, to prevent condition damage alltogether (in form of resistance) but no such rules apply for power damage, damage modifiers on traits are heavily biased towards power skills also.

 

The fact that these aspects got so out of hand resulted in the opposite getting a hefty powercreep as well - healing and boons - they are broken too in a attempt to easy the pain of powercreep in power damage.

 

[Dawdler.8521]

> @"Brujeria.7536" said:

> Things have been getting out of hand for a long time. Best example are Revenant Hammer and Longbow ranger. These are long range skills, yet they are able to deal huge amounts of damage. In case of Rev Hammer the skills themself completly lack counterplay as most of them are not even projectiles.

Waaaaat... pff 6k hammer autoattacks against 3k armor is nothing

 

Power pistol on engineer, now that's damage.

[DemonSeed.3528]

> @"Dawdler.8521" said:

> > @"Brujeria.7536" said:

> > Things have been getting out of hand for a long time. Best example are Revenant Hammer and Longbow ranger. These are long range skills, yet they are able to deal huge amounts of damage. In case of Rev Hammer the skills themself completly lack counterplay as most of them are not even projectiles.

> Waaaaat... pff 6k hammer autoattacks against 3k armor is nothing

>

> Power pistol on engineer, now that's damage.

 

You reminded me of the squirt gun my engi had :(

[DeadlySynz.3471]

> @"Zenix.6198" said:

> On a a more "on topic"-note however,

>

> I have to agree with OP tho. Damage across the board is simply too high.

> The two expansions we had so far have introduced massive powercreep to the game.

> Higher damage, higher healing, condi and boonspam, etc.

> Problem is, that player healthpools and amour rating are the same as they were back in 2012.

> 5-digit damage values are completely ridiculous (one-shot or not) if you look at player healthpools percentage-wise.

>

> I recently advocated for some type of a damage and healing modifier in PvP-centric modes on the PvP-forums.

> Other big MMOs (like WoW for instance) also had to introduce such systems at some point, so I personally think it couldnt be too bad for GW2 as well.

>

> For those wondering what I mean:

> Something along the lines "15% **less** dmg received from players" and "15% **less** healing received from players".

> All sources, period. Any condition, any power dmg, any healing (combo fields, regen ticks, barrier, all of it).

>

> Yes, this wouldnt be fixing any balance issues, but it at least would prevent people from getting 2 shot from random stuff thats flung around (like a 13k aoe arcing slice on a 8 second CD). Currently strong classes would still be strong and weak classes would still be weak. It just extends fights for 15% (assuming thats the modifier).

>

> And for those of you, that fear the introduction of a "bunker" meta, since defensive skills wouldnt be affected by such a system:

> Lets look at endure pain for instance and assume a fight against a warrior lasts 180 seconds (3 minutes) currently.

>

> At 180 seconds the warrior gets to cast endure pain 180/30 = 6 times.

> Prolong that fight by 15% and you get to 207 seconds.

> At 207 seconds the warrior gets to cast endure pain 207/30 = 6.9 times.

>

> So a 30 second defensive would get 1 additional cast for a 3 and a half minute long fight ....which already is an excruciatingly long, fringe-case scenario.

> And the trade off is not getting absolutely demolished in 2 hits.

 

Damage is too high **Only** for people who run tanky builds.

 

One can run power with toughness and vitality and still benefit from other damage enhancing modifiers in a group setting (and there are many). The end result, is this tanky build can run around critting till the cows come home with fairly high damage, even against other classes who run tanky. But what happens when this same tanky build hits a zerk class? They kill them in 2-4 hits.. soooo why exactly is this allowed?

 

If a player chooses to run zerker, they should always be able to down someone even in the tankiest build with damage reduction modifiers in 1-4 hits. The trade-off is, they get whacked usually in 1-4 hits from any class, no matter what gear or build they're running. The game is far too forgiving damage wise for people who run tanky.

 

I've said this before; power, precision, and ferocity should not exist on any gear containing toughness or vitality. Furthermore, those who choose to run lots of toughness and vitality, should barely benefit (or not benefit at all) from might, ferocity, or even quickness. Think of it this way, if a tanky dude was to sit in front of a zerker target and just continually press "1", it should take probably a good 30-60 seconds to kill that zerker target if they remained stationary.

 

That's what needs to happen; people that want to run tanky need to have their damage massively scaled down at least 75% or more. Then the problem is solved, an entire tanky melee train leaps on you swinging.. they'd be lucky to knock out 10% of the targets health. But those who choose to live on the edge and go glassy, absolutely must have the ability to down any class in any build in the tankiest of gear in 1-4 hits, because they go down in 1-4 hits.

 

I havn't forgotten about condition damage either. Condition damage or duration should not exist on toughness or vitality gear either.

[Zenix.6198]

> @"DeadlySynz.3471" said:

> > @"Zenix.6198" said:

> > On a a more "on topic"-note however,

> >

> > I have to agree with OP tho. Damage across the board is simply too high.

> > The two expansions we had so far have introduced massive powercreep to the game.

> > Higher damage, higher healing, condi and boonspam, etc.

> > Problem is, that player healthpools and amour rating are the same as they were back in 2012.

> > 5-digit damage values are completely ridiculous (one-shot or not) if you look at player healthpools percentage-wise.

> >

> > I recently advocated for some type of a damage and healing modifier in PvP-centric modes on the PvP-forums.

> > Other big MMOs (like WoW for instance) also had to introduce such systems at some point, so I personally think it couldnt be too bad for GW2 as well.

> >

> > For those wondering what I mean:

> > Something along the lines "15% **less** dmg received from players" and "15% **less** healing received from players".

> > All sources, period. Any condition, any power dmg, any healing (combo fields, regen ticks, barrier, all of it).

> >

> > Yes, this wouldnt be fixing any balance issues, but it at least would prevent people from getting 2 shot from random stuff thats flung around (like a 13k aoe arcing slice on a 8 second CD). Currently strong classes would still be strong and weak classes would still be weak. It just extends fights for 15% (assuming thats the modifier).

> >

> > And for those of you, that fear the introduction of a "bunker" meta, since defensive skills wouldnt be affected by such a system:

> > Lets look at endure pain for instance and assume a fight against a warrior lasts 180 seconds (3 minutes) currently.

> >

> > At 180 seconds the warrior gets to cast endure pain 180/30 = 6 times.

> > Prolong that fight by 15% and you get to 207 seconds.

> > At 207 seconds the warrior gets to cast endure pain 207/30 = 6.9 times.

> >

> > So a 30 second defensive would get 1 additional cast for a 3 and a half minute long fight ....which already is an excruciatingly long, fringe-case scenario.

> > And the trade off is not getting absolutely demolished in 2 hits.

>

> Damage is too high **Only** for people who run tanky builds.

>

> One can run power with toughness and vitality and still benefit from other damage enhancing modifiers in a group setting (and there are many). The end result, is this tanky build can run around critting till the cows come home with fairly high damage, even against other classes who run tanky. But what happens when this same tanky build hits a zerk class? They kill them in 2-4 hits.. soooo why exactly is this allowed?

>

> If a player chooses to run zerker, they should always be able to down someone even in the tankiest build with damage reduction modifiers in 1-4 hits. The trade-off is, they get whacked usually in 1-4 hits from any class, no matter what gear or build they're running. The game is far too forgiving damage wise for people who run tanky.

>

> I've said this before; power, precision, and ferocity should not exist on any gear containing toughness or vitality. Furthermore, those who choose to run lots of toughness and vitality, should barely benefit (or not benefit at all) from might, ferocity, or even quickness. Think of it this way, if a tanky dude was to sit in front of a zerker target and just continually press "1", it should take probably a good 30-60 seconds to kill that zerker target if they remained stationary.

>

> That's what needs to happen; people that want to run tanky need to have their damage massively scaled down at least 75% or more. Then the problem is solved, an entire tanky melee train leaps on you swinging.. they'd be lucky to knock out 10% of the targets health. But those who choose to live on the edge and go glassy, absolutely must have the ability to down any class in any build in the tankiest of gear in 1-4 hits, because they go down in 1-4 hits.

>

> I havn't forgotten about condition damage either. Condition damage or duration should not exist on toughness or vitality gear either.

 

I think its less about gear tbh and more about how some classes have developed over the years.

Maybe my PoV is a bit different in that regard, since im mainly a PvP player and not really invested in the WvW meta.

 

The access to 25 might, perma fury, quickness and a vast array of damage modifiers paired with low CD defensives and high uptime of defensive boons simply allows for insanely forgiving playstyles.

 

If I have easy access to 25 might and high fury uptime, I can built very defensively and still hit like a truck. If I have tons of low CD defenses and damage mitigation I can built very offensively and still survive just fine.

Its not uncommon to see people use defensives just to cover their burst windows instead of saving them for opportune counter-play moments.

Which is a big part why GW2 player combat feels like a massive spamfest. There is very little tactical/systematical gameplay anymore.

 

Regardless of spec and gear: It is completely unacceptable to be able to kill anybody in 1-4 hits.

 

[Straegen.2938]

Deadeye, its "one shot" has a massive tell and most of those one-shot builds have zero additional toughness. When a player hears the bhrrrrrr, dodge. It is that simple. Backstab versions are far more dangerous but also have to get up close and personal typically on a glassy build. Thieves also self-cannibalize their own class mates. Most that run a thief, die a lot outside of the most careful carrion players.

 

Winters Bite is an entirely different problem but at least it requires a fairly decent windup... course it doesn't have a tell so when it lands it can one shot even hardened players. IMO it is the current hardest hitting skill in the game. Barrage is its own sort of pain particularly when there are two of them pew-pew'ing.

 

Warrior Kill Shot is a joke except it is on a class with a massive HP pool, heavy armor, solid escape, multi-invulns, tons of boon, reflect, etc. If it had a clean "one shot", the warrior which is already strong would easily be the most OP class in small scale.

 

Mirage blow up is real but requires decent play and a bit glassy to pull off. Mirage condi that drops dozen plus stacks of torment is far more prevalent, easier to play and ultimately more dangerous due to its tanky nature. No class should have stealth, evasion, teleports and invuln in the same build.

 

Engi variants... see Mirage. They are broken in my opinion. Virtually no downside to running one. Strong escape, stealth, evasion, multi-invuln, stuns, etc.

 

Necro and its variants... they can hit hard but they are easy to kite. They are mostly a walking bag outside of a zerg.

 

Ele and its variants can be deadly. The electrical attacks coupled with stuns can drop a heavily armored player in about a second. They also own the opposite end where they are virtually unkillable outside of multiple attackers. They move well but are a bit clunky in their rotations.

 

Guardians... see Ele above. They move slow but their spike can be devastating. Their sustain is also impressive when built tanky.

 

Revs... eh... some dangerous builds but mostly easily kited.

[Xtinct.7031]

I have a feeling that Anet believes the current version of the power creep is hilarious for wvw roaming.

[

"https://youtube.com/watch?time_continue=453&v=pvYjXF11k8I")

[beatthedown.2651]

Everyone is complaining how much powercreep we have right now while people don't even know what you could have pulled off back in (for example) 2013. While its true that access to might was pretty limited, protection wasn't as common either. Quickness was +100% attack speed, Longbow had 1800 range, stacking buffs were a thing and you could get additional stats from builds. Yes oneshots were not that common but counterpressuring such builds wasn't easy either. Look at old Youtube footage and see what people pulled off with Rapidfire or even DD oneshot Thief.

 

So yes I agree that a few classes should be toned down, but for the love of god don't argue that everything was better back in the days. Maybe some of you want post HOT meta back (right after the expansion) where everything hits like a wet noodle...

 

 

[Solori.6025]

> @"beatthedown.2651" said:

 

 

> So yes I agree that a few classes should be toned down, but for the love of god don't argue that everything was better back in the days. Maybe some of you want post HOT meta back (right after the expansion) where everything hits like a wet noodle...

>

>

 

If you havent been following the forums for the last several months, that actually is what people want. No one likes to die, so obviously being immortal is what the pvp community wants, fights never ending until a friend shows up or you mess up your sustain rotation.

[Substance E.4852]

> @"MUDse.7623" said:

> > @"Substance E.4852" said:

> > > @"Dawdler.8521" said:

> > > The problem with this argument is that there is *also* incredibly tanky builds that are nearly unkillable by any sigle player unless they spec full damage.

> > >

> > > Counterplay definetly exist. People are just generally too lazy to see it, its easier to complain about what kills them. The short version is damage counter bunker, hybrid counter damage and the bunker give both hybrid and damage time to do their job.

> >

> > Ya except this isn't spvp and most people can't just swap to nomads to take out the deadeye dancing around spawn.

>

> i would really like to see how you kill a deadeye while you are in nomads, first time i hear that this stat combo was a good thing to take out a deadeye.

>

>

 

It's called an example.

 

> @"beatthedown.2651" said:

> Look at old Youtube footage and see what people pulled off with Rapidfire or even DD oneshot Thief.

 

In what universe is pre-PoF rapid fire hitting for more than post with the benefit of beastmode stats, modern trait bonuses, and +40% from sic em?

 

You also used to have to blow multiple utilities to get a 5 digit stealth hit on a thief. It also required a melee hit.