PvP Rank Badge on Forums

[Aza.2105]

> @"SteepledHat.1345" said:

> Thanks for posting guys, I'm going to be sure to add you all and view your ranks in game. Since it's already publicly available...

>

> Might as well put it on the forums.

 

You can if you like, not that it really matters.

[SteepledHat.1345]

> @"Aza.2105" said:

> > @"SteepledHat.1345" said:

> > Thanks for posting guys, I'm going to be sure to add you all and view your ranks in game. Since it's already publicly available...

> >

> > Might as well put it on the forums.

>

> You can if you like, not that it really matters.

 

I'm not gonna, it's an expression of the fact that this info is already accessible. When I see "bad" ideas they almost always come from bronze or silver. I check. Heck, if I wanted I could post in every "good idea fairy" thread the ranks of everyone involved. So why bother with it. Just give us the badges right now.

[Aza.2105]

> @"SteepledHat.1345" said:

> > @"Aza.2105" said:

> > > @"SteepledHat.1345" said:

> > > Thanks for posting guys, I'm going to be sure to add you all and view your ranks in game. Since it's already publicly available...

> > >

> > > Might as well put it on the forums.

> >

> > You can if you like, not that it really matters.

>

> I'm not gonna, it's an expression of the fact that this info is already accessible. When I see "bad" ideas they almost always come from bronze or silver. I check. Heck, if I wanted I could post in every "good idea fairy" thread the ranks of everyone involved. So why bother with it. Just give us the badges right now.

 

Except none of that is true. A player rank doesn't have anything to do with game balancing ideas. Those are two separate things.

 

[SteepledHat.1345]

> @"Aza.2105" said:

> > @"SteepledHat.1345" said:

> > > @"Aza.2105" said:

> > > > @"SteepledHat.1345" said:

> > > > Thanks for posting guys, I'm going to be sure to add you all and view your ranks in game. Since it's already publicly available...

> > > >

> > > > Might as well put it on the forums.

> > >

> > > You can if you like, not that it really matters.

> >

> > I'm not gonna, it's an expression of the fact that this info is already accessible. When I see "bad" ideas they almost always come from bronze or silver. I check. Heck, if I wanted I could post in every "good idea fairy" thread the ranks of everyone involved. So why bother with it. Just give us the badges right now.

>

> Except none of that is true. A player rank doesn't have anything to do with game balancing ideas. Those are two separate things.

>

 

"Omg this thing has no counters! Omg this is op" posts absolutely tend to come from bronze and silver. I've checked. People st that level don't understand the basics of the game. It's like a pinewood durby participant describing how to fix a car to a mechanical engineer.

[Aza.2105]

> @"SteepledHat.1345" said:

> > @"Aza.2105" said:

> > > @"SteepledHat.1345" said:

> > > > @"Aza.2105" said:

> > > > > @"SteepledHat.1345" said:

> > > > > Thanks for posting guys, I'm going to be sure to add you all and view your ranks in game. Since it's already publicly available...

> > > > >

> > > > > Might as well put it on the forums.

> > > >

> > > > You can if you like, not that it really matters.

> > >

> > > I'm not gonna, it's an expression of the fact that this info is already accessible. When I see "bad" ideas they almost always come from bronze or silver. I check. Heck, if I wanted I could post in every "good idea fairy" thread the ranks of everyone involved. So why bother with it. Just give us the badges right now.

> >

> > Except none of that is true. A player rank doesn't have anything to do with game balancing ideas. Those are two separate things.

> >

>

> "Omg this thing has no counters! Omg this is op" posts absolutely tend to come from bronze and silver. I've checked. People st that level don't understand the basics of the game. It's like a pinewood durby participant describing how to fix a car to a mechanical engineer.

 

By your logic Michael Jordan should be a amazing basketball coach and owner since he is a 6 time NBA champion. And a boxing coach should be a world champion if he wants to coach boxers to become champions. Most of the time the individuals who are good at making rules, laws, governing , training others to be good and understanding how the game works are people who aren't exceptional at whatever the game it is. Like I said, playing the game and balancing are entirely two different entities.

[Stand The Wall.6987]

its my belief that the very purpose of forums is that everyone has an equal say. OP idea opposes this.

[Illconceived Was Na.9781]

> @"SteepledHat.1345" said:

> When I see "bad" ideas they almost always come from bronze or silver. I check. Heck, if I wanted I could post in every "good idea fairy" thread the ranks of everyone involved. So why bother with it. Just give us the badges right now.

 

Why do you care where the ideas come from if they are "bad"? Aren't bad ideas recognizable as bad? Is an idea automatically bad because it comes from a low silver ranked player?

[Jeknar.6184]

> @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

> > @"SteepledHat.1345" said:

> > When I see "bad" ideas they almost always come from bronze or silver. I check. Heck, if I wanted I could post in every "good idea fairy" thread the ranks of everyone involved. So why bother with it. Just give us the badges right now.

>

> Why do you care where the ideas come from if they are "bad"? Aren't bad ideas recognizable as bad? Is an idea automatically bad because it comes from a low silver ranked player?

 

There is also one certain legend player who have plenty of bad ideas... Giving him a badges that technically should validade his posts would be just stupid,

[Dami.5046]

post deleted.

[DEATHsCLAW.1978]

I'd say the best achieved overall rating from all seasons should be visible.

 

there are for sure some good opinions from ppl who didnt play the actual season or stopped midway so the opinion is less valuable due to decay or inactivity despite being a good player.

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

Let me give everyone a realistic rundown of the extent of a modern plat 2+ player's knowledge of a current given meta:

 

* Although they have dabbled in most classes, they have chosen to main one thing and become super maverick at it.

* Their orientation of a given meta is from the standpoint of that one thing they have chosen to main.

* What may seem weak or strong vs. their own class, may be entirely different for another player who mains a different class. No matter how good a player is, unless they are maining something for an entire season during a given meta, they lack subjective experience on anything outside of that one thing they have chosen to main.

* They give excellent advice on how to run their class mechanically, rotationally, what to fight and what to avoid, but are surprisingly unaware of how other classes are functioning, outside of the more commonly identified facts, such as: "Don't let DEs freecast Necros" "Soulbeasts win 1v1 side nodes against everything" "FBs & Necros is stronk" "ect.. ect.." they lack knowledge on the less discussed topics that don't concern their class, things like: "Can the new sword Spellbreakers outrun a Thief?" "Are these new Scrapper builds really competent on side nodes or not?"

 

Don't get me wrong, these players all possess a generally strong knowledge of the game, which is why they are plat 2 and not gold 2. I guess my point being is that no matter how strong a player is, unless the advice they are giving is coming directly from subjective experience, there is always room for estimated opinions, class bias, and errors in feedback in general.

 

If you really wanted a system to show "a player's resume", you'd need to not only show the player's current ranking for the season, but also that pie chart that shows what kind of experience they have on every class. That would about sum it up right there.

 

[SteepledHat.1345]

> @"Trevor Boyer.6524" said:

> Let me give everyone a realistic rundown of the extent of a modern plat 2+ player's knowledge of a current given meta:

>

> * Although they have dabbled in most classes, they have chosen to main one thing and become super maverick at it.

> * Their orientation of a given meta is from the standpoint of that one thing they have chosen to main.

> * What may seem weak or strong vs. their own class, may be entirely different for another player who mains a different class. No matter how good a player is, unless they are maining something for an entire season during a given meta, they lack subjective experience on anything outside of that one thing they have chosen to main.

> * They give excellent advice on how to run their class mechanically, rotationally, what to fight and what to avoid, but are surprisingly unaware of how other classes are functioning, outside of the more commonly identified facts, such as: "Don't let DEs freecast Necros" "Soulbeasts win 1v1 side nodes against everything" "FBs & Necros is stronk" "ect.. ect.." they lack knowledge on the less discussed topics that don't concern their class, things like: "Can the new sword Spellbreakers outrun a Thief?" "Are these new Scrapper builds really competent on side nodes or not?"

>

> Don't get me wrong, these players all possess a generally strong knowledge of the game, which is why they are plat 2 and not gold 2. I guess my point being is that no matter how strong a player is, unless the advice they are giving is coming directly from subjective experience, there is always room for estimated opinions, class bias, and errors in feedback in general.

>

> If you really wanted a system to show "a player's resume", you'd need to not only show the player's current ranking for the season, but also that pie chart that shows what kind of experience they have on every class. That would about sum it up right there.

>

 

Hm, good points. I like the idea of publicly available stats. Kudos

[BadMed.3846]

Down with the elitism. Garbage post. We don't need it.

[Satenia.9025]

As far as I'm concerned, rank has been completely devalued by Anets unwillingness to deal with toxicity and cheating in the "upper tiers" of the PvP seasons.

 

To understand where I'm coming from, I have about 2.5k ranked games played and participated in every PvP season. With the recent changes/reverts to duo-queue, I have started moving up from gold T3 / plat T1 play to consistent plat 2 play. What has changed is primarily that match quality has gone down drastically while toxicity skyrocket. I exclusively play during prime-time and even (or especially?) then there just aren't enough players to offer balanced games in these tiers. The majority of games is either being steam-rolled or steam-rolling depending on whoever gets a few top 50-100 players in the team while the other one doesn't. Like I said, I've been around for a while, I know who's on the leaderboard and it's quite common that you get matched as gold T3 / low plat T1 against some top 10 pleb and his duo-partner. That's Anet quality MM for you. The main difference in plat T2 is that people usually stop trying after the initial wipe, go afk and instead stick to insults. Games just really become worse (aka one-sided). Out of the mentioned 2.5k ranked games I played, this season in plat T2 has been the first one where someone actually told me to "go kill myself" (reported, nothing is being done about it, of course). That's the "upper tier" PvP scene for you.

 

That said, it's not a huge surprise that people trying to stick to the top 250 leaderboard are getting more "creative" when it comes to staying there (aside from throwing insults). After all, the great "idols" of the PvP scene are perfectly showing how it's possible to get away with RMT, win-trading, abusing alt-accounts and so on without any real punishment. I mean gotta love how the disgusting RMT dude basically played on his second account during his 3 months "enforced break". That's your response Anet, really? Guess we can be happy that esports died.

 

Anyway, long story short, there is no need for a rank-badge on the forums. Given the low quality of matches in the upper tiers, might as well be that those players have less to offer in terms of feedback than the players getting more balanced matches in the lower tiers. As far as I'm concerned, I would take the feedback of a gold player over anything a top 250 has to offer at this point, all the latter has to offer these days is how to abuse loop-holes in order to farm points.

[SteepledHat.1345]

> @"Satenia.9025" said:

> As far as I'm concerned, rank has been completely devalued by Anets unwillingness to deal with toxicity and cheating in the "upper tiers" of the PvP seasons.

>

> To understand where I'm coming from, I have about 2.5k ranked games played and participated in every PvP season. With the recent changes/reverts to duo-queue, I have started moving up from gold T3 / plat T1 play to consistent plat 2 play. What has changed is primarily that match quality has gone down drastically while toxicity skyrocket. I exclusively play during prime-time and even (or especially?) then there just aren't enough players to offer balanced games in these tiers. The majority of games is either being steam-rolled or steam-rolling depending on whoever gets a few top 50-100 players in the team while the other one doesn't. Like I said, I've been around for a while, I know who's on the leaderboard and it's quite common that you get matched as gold T3 / low plat T1 against some top 10 pleb and his duo-partner. That's Anet quality MM for you. The main difference in plat T2 is that people usually stop trying after the initial wipe, go afk and instead stick to insults. Games just really become worse (aka one-sided). Out of the mentioned 2.5k ranked games I played, this season in plat T2 has been the first one where someone actually told me to "go kill myself" (reported, nothing is being done about it, of course). That's the "upper tier" PvP scene for you.

>

> That said, it's not a huge surprise that people trying to stick to the top 250 leaderboard are getting more "creative" when it comes to staying there (aside from throwing insults). After all, the great "idols" of the PvP scene are perfectly showing how it's possible to get away with RMT, win-trading, abusing alt-accounts and so on without any real punishment. I mean gotta love how the disgusting RMT dude basically played on his second account during his 3 months "enforced break". That's your response Anet, really? Guess we can be happy that esports died.

>

> Anyway, long story short, there is no need for a rank-badge on the forums. Given the low quality of matches in the upper tiers, might as well be that those players have less to offer in terms of feedback than the players getting more balanced matches in the lower tiers. As far as I'm concerned, I would take the feedback of a gold player over anything a top 250 has to offer at this point, all the latter has to offer these days is how to abuse loop-holes in order to farm points.

 

Good points. Eh, maybe this was a bad idea. I'd still want usage statistics and play type/class pie chart stats on players though.

[voltaicbore.8012]

> @"Satenia.9025" said:

>As far as I'm concerned, I would take the feedback of a gold player over anything a top 250 has to offer at this point, all the latter has to offer these days is how to abuse loop-holes in order to farm points.

 

As someone who had to work hard in solo queue for my Merciless Legend title, I take a bit of offense to this, even though I know you aren't directing that comment at folks like me.

 

I think, as usual, people are actually having two different discussions without realizing it here. I think OP and some others in favor of the rank-badges-on-forum are much more concerned about being able to quickly assess (and most likely dismiss) feedback from lower tier players. This is very, very, very different from claiming that anyone with a plat badge and above deserves to be taken seriously. Again, saying that one group of people (lower tier players) _don't_ deserve the time of day is *not* the same as saying another group of people _automatically deserve_ to be listened to each and every time.

 

I ultimately think the only thing rank badges would do on the forums would be silencing lower tier players. As stupid as many of their posts are, I still prefer having a system where they get to post their opinions and the rest of the community gets to respond. At least this way, the bad idea gets aired out, and those who know better on that particular issue can offer corrections or counter-information on the matter.

[Vicariuz.1605]

> @"Aaralyna.3104" said:

> Bad idea, everyone should be equal. And its not saying much anyways... When I only do 10 ranked matches at end of pvp season I just end up on gold... If I play more matches I end up lower.

 

No, THIS is the bad idea.

Every one IS NOT equal, no matter how bad you wish it to be.

Sometimes, actually all the time in the world, one person is better than another at something.

It's REALITY that there are people with more valuable and more valid viewpoints than others.

When you are making a business decision, do you take the opinion of some one established and successful in that field or a random average person who barely and or does not have any experience (verifiable or not) in said field?

 

A person with silver or gold rating would still be free to post whatever they want, there would be no silencing, however, the validity and credibility of balance decisions proposed would have justified skepticism.

[Illconceived Was Na.9781]

> @"Vicariuz.1605" said:

> A person with silver or gold rating would still be free to post whatever they want, there would be no silencing, however, the validity and credibility of balance decisions proposed would have justified skepticism.

 

Except that platinum doesn't make a person's opinion more valid; it just means they have experience playing at that level.

 

Bad ideas are bad regardless of who makes them. It's the merits of the suggestion|critique that should carry weight, not the source.

[Aktium.9506]

I totally agree.

 

Can we have WvW rank and LI count badges next to our PvP rank one too?

[voltaicbore.8012]

> @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

> Except that platinum doesn't make a person's opinion more valid; it just means they have experience playing at that level.

>

> Bad ideas are bad regardless of who makes them. It's the merits of the suggestion|critique that should carry weight, not the source.

 

Yes, this would be the key distinction. Badges would only blur the distinction. I think if someone posts something ludicrously uninformed and parades it around as well-researched fact, they deserve to be roundly criticized based on the badness of the idea itself. However, adding badges would likely encourage critics to attack their badge as well, rather than sticking to talking about the merits of the poster's ideas. I mean we already do that, and we don't even have badges on the forums! People already say "sounds like you're a silver, git gud" when someone posts something ill-informed or just plain inaccurate.

 

As for silencing, perhaps "chilling effect" would be more accurate, to borrow terminology from the courts. Lower-tier players would of course remain free to post, but if they get repeatedly shut down or shamed with reference to their badge, there's only so much most people can take before they start to think "this isn't worth it, I'll just get ignored/shamed/shut down again."

 

 

[meri.9187]

Being platinum doesn't make your opinions anywhere near more valid.

 

Case in point, the guy crying saying condi mirage is underpowered and he's only in plat because of his "skill."

[Vicariuz.1605]

> @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

> > @"Vicariuz.1605" said:

> > A person with silver or gold rating would still be free to post whatever they want, there would be no silencing, however, the validity and credibility of balance decisions proposed would have justified skepticism.

>

> Except that platinum doesn't make a person's opinion more valid; it just means they have experience playing at that level.

>

> Bad ideas are bad regardless of who makes them. It's the merits of the suggestion|critique that should carry weight, not the source.

 

Right, and person with a PHD has a more valid opinion on the subject than some one who does not.

[Stand The Wall.6987]

> @"Vicariuz.1605" said:

> > @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

> > > @"Vicariuz.1605" said:

> > > A person with silver or gold rating would still be free to post whatever they want, there would be no silencing, however, the validity and credibility of balance decisions proposed would have justified skepticism.

> >

> > Except that platinum doesn't make a person's opinion more valid; it just means they have experience playing at that level.

> >

> > Bad ideas are bad regardless of who makes them. It's the merits of the suggestion|critique that should carry weight, not the source.

>

> Right, and person with a PHD has a more valid opinion on the subject than some one who does not.

 

difference being you cant cheese your way to a phd with an op build lol.

also ppl irl are less prone to using their titles if the other person has a good argument; logic matters more then achievement which makes dismissal of possibly good ideas less likely to happen.

[Vicariuz.1605]

> @"Stand The Wall.6987" said:

> > @"Vicariuz.1605" said:

> > > @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

> > > > @"Vicariuz.1605" said:

> > > > A person with silver or gold rating would still be free to post whatever they want, there would be no silencing, however, the validity and credibility of balance decisions proposed would have justified skepticism.

> > >

> > > Except that platinum doesn't make a person's opinion more valid; it just means they have experience playing at that level.

> > >

> > > Bad ideas are bad regardless of who makes them. It's the merits of the suggestion|critique that should carry weight, not the source.

> >

> > Right, and person with a PHD has a more valid opinion on the subject than some one who does not.

>

> difference being you cant cheese your way to a phd with an op build lol.

> also ppl irl are less prone to using their titles if the other person has a good argument; logic matters more then achievement which makes dismissal of possibly good ideas less likely to happen.

 

are you claiming that every one in plat and above cheeses their way to their rating?

 

if rating is arbitrary then theres no reason not to show it.

 

using your own argument that its only the context of whats said that matters, then showing the badge/rating, should, not matter to you.

[Math.5123]

I made a fresh account, rolled the new scepter / staff Chrono build and made it to 1802 rating in just under three days.

 

I have played a grand total of 9 mesmer games since the 2014 spec patch before this. Give me legend badge please, I totally earned it.

 

Literally anyone can make it to legend now by cheesing whatever flavor of the month build is currently hot. Doesn't make you a great player. All I did was push far every game winning all but a few 1vX's.