Warclaw has Revolutioned Roaming

[Stand The Wall.6987]

> @"Mechanix.9315" said:

> Revolutioned? maybe you meant Killed?

>

> 9 of 10 "fights" i had these days, at 1v1 or even numbers 3v3 5v5, they all just run away with mounts, people dont want to fight, they want to karma train with the blob, get the thingy for the mount collection, or just PPT and run inside walls to shoot you siege.

 

considering how bad balance is, its not much of a surprise. 10k soulbeast longbow aa's, uncatchable rifle teef, mirage, unkillable holo… basically everything is cancer so I don't know why people would bother trying to roam in such a horrid state of class balance.

 

[BlueMelody.6398]

> @"jakt.9381" said:

 

> If you are getting 1 shot from invis you are bad. Period.

 

Possibly the most ridiculous statement I have ever seen posted in these forums, and that's saying a LOT.

 

[borgs.6103]

For me, it revolutionized roaming in a way that if some tower or maybe even a keep looks undefended, roamers can get inside without breaking any wall or gate and capture it fast and easy.

[coro.3176]

> @"Mechanix.9315" said:

> Revolutioned? maybe you meant Killed?

>

> 9 of 10 "fights" i had these days, at 1v1 or even numbers 3v3 5v5, they all just run away with mounts, people dont want to fight, they want to karma train with the blob, get the thingy for the mount collection, or just PPT and run inside walls to shoot you siege.

>

> The only people who fight now, is the people who WANT to fight you back, and sadly thats a really low number of people, if you get into a mode which have player vs player action, why you gonna avoid the fights? Also do you realize that the gamemode is actually a big team of people, which during defenses of objectives, small groups can actually do a lot for the team, by cutting people off, stopping reinforcements, thats gone.

>

> I feel like this people want to ranked spvp and just afk in spawn because they dont want to fight.

>

>

 

This.

 

In my experience, it's much much harder to ACTUALLY fight people now. Most of the time they just run away and it's difficult to stop them because you need to demount to do enough damage to get them off, but if you demount, they're too far away by the time you've attacked them - especially in enemy territory. You need ridiculous ranged burst (soulbeast) or teleport burst (guard, thief) or you'll never stop anyone.

 

I really think hard CC ought to affect mounts - possibly even demounting on hard CC.

[kash.9213]

One good thing about the mount is people on them seem to have even more tunnel vision. Set up some ballistas on partly hidden vantage points that have reach to two or three running routes and you can basically go fishing. As far as fights and WvW in general, player interaction and team work are probably the main thing that keeps people logging in but character builds are right up there and we're going to have to be careful to not creep too far into gimmicky mechanics and distractions that take away from or cheapen the importance of a good build or team composition. I enjoy mounts but for WvW it should mostly be for making desert map easier.

[Silverwing.8750]

People do not like change, so the first reaction to something new is often negative, we need to adapt our builds to the new meta.

 

So far I like the mount, as it means we can use other builds not just those with fast travel.

 

Give the mount a chance, it is still early days. I for one will reserve my final judgement until after a month or so of play.

[zinkz.7045]

> @"borgs.6103" said:

> For me, it revolutionized roaming in a way that if some tower or maybe even a keep looks undefended, roamers can get inside without breaking any wall or gate and capture it fast and easy.

 

This has been a feature since day 1 of the game.

[UmbraNoctis.1907]

> @"borgs.6103" said:

> For me, it revolutionized roaming in a way that if some tower or maybe even a keep looks undefended, roamers can get inside without breaking any wall or gate and capture it fast and easy.

 

Quite sure that getting into structures without breaking a wall or gate is not how it is supposed to work and therefore bug exploiting.

[borgs.6103]

> @"zinkz.7045" said:

> > @"borgs.6103" said:

> > For me, it revolutionized roaming in a way that if some tower or maybe even a keep looks undefended, roamers can get inside without breaking any wall or gate and capture it fast and easy.

>

> This has been a feature since day 1 of the game.

 

I guess you're right. Mesmer portals exist.

 

> @"UmbraNoctis.1907" said:

> > @"borgs.6103" said:

> > For me, it revolutionized roaming in a way that if some tower or maybe even a keep looks undefended, roamers can get inside without breaking any wall or gate and capture it fast and easy.

>

> Quite sure that getting into structures without breaking a wall or gate is not how it is supposed to work and therefore bug exploiting.

Nah. I don't think so. Mesmer portals exist.

[UmbraNoctis.1907]

> @"borgs.6103" said:

> Nah. I don't think so. Mesmer portals exist.

 

Mesmers need broken walls/gates too in order to get into enemy keeps or towers (unless exploiting/cheating is involved).

 

[zinkz.7045]

> @"borgs.6103" said:

> > @"zinkz.7045" said:

> > > @"borgs.6103" said:

> > > For me, it revolutionized roaming in a way that if some tower or maybe even a keep looks undefended, roamers can get inside without breaking any wall or gate and capture it fast and easy.

> >

> > This has been a feature since day 1 of the game.

>

> I guess you're right. Mesmer portals exist.

>

> > @"UmbraNoctis.1907" said:

> > > @"borgs.6103" said:

> > > For me, it revolutionized roaming in a way that if some tower or maybe even a keep looks undefended, roamers can get inside without breaking any wall or gate and capture it fast and easy.

> >

> > Quite sure that getting into structures without breaking a wall or gate is not how it is supposed to work and therefore bug exploiting.

> Nah. I don't think so. Mesmer portals exist.

 

You've been able to exploit into various keeps and towers on certain classes for most of the game. They generally take years to fix those exploits and some still exist now, even before the new exploits that mounts added.

[displayname.8315]

The mount is pretty cool and I begrudgingly commend Anet for this addition. Sigh... dilly dilly gj

[borgs.6103]

> @"UmbraNoctis.1907" said:

> > @"borgs.6103" said:

> > Nah. I don't think so. Mesmer portals exist.

>

> Mesmers need broken walls/gates too in order to get into enemy keeps or towers (unless exploiting/cheating is involved).

>

Do they really?

> @"zinkz.7045" said:

> > @"borgs.6103" said:

> > > @"zinkz.7045" said:

> > > > @"borgs.6103" said:

> > > > For me, it revolutionized roaming in a way that if some tower or maybe even a keep looks undefended, roamers can get inside without breaking any wall or gate and capture it fast and easy.

> > >

> > > This has been a feature since day 1 of the game.

> >

> > I guess you're right. Mesmer portals exist.

> >

> > > @"UmbraNoctis.1907" said:

> > > > @"borgs.6103" said:

> > > > For me, it revolutionized roaming in a way that if some tower or maybe even a keep looks undefended, roamers can get inside without breaking any wall or gate and capture it fast and easy.

> > >

> > > Quite sure that getting into structures without breaking a wall or gate is not how it is supposed to work and therefore bug exploiting.

> > Nah. I don't think so. Mesmer portals exist.

>

> You've been able to exploit into various keeps and towers on certain classes for most of the game. They generally take years to fix those exploits and some still exist now, even before the new exploits that mounts added.

 

:o Absolutely reprehensible behavior!

 

Nah, I can't keep a straight face doing this. Of course I know all about that crap. Clearly the new mount exacerbated the issue. Even more so than the gliding exploits and the skill exploits before that, not including 3rd party exploits. Yeah, they all still exist. I'm so jaded that I honestly don't care anymore.

[jakt.9381]

> @"BlueMelody.6398" said:

> > @"jakt.9381" said:

>

> > If you are getting 1 shot from invis you are bad. Period.

>

> Possibly the most ridiculous statement I have ever seen posted in these forums, and that's saying a LOT.

>

 

If you're going to disagree, at least explain why.

[Elmo Benchwarmer.3025]

> @"Kondor.2904" said:

> I'm not that profound myself but wasn't there supposed to be a reason as to why such classes as necromancer lacked mobility ?

 

That reason was forgotten on 23.6.2015.

[Strider Pj.2193]

> @"zinkz.7045" said:

> > @"borgs.6103" said:

> > > @"zinkz.7045" said:

> > > > @"borgs.6103" said:

> > > > For me, it revolutionized roaming in a way that if some tower or maybe even a keep looks undefended, roamers can get inside without breaking any wall or gate and capture it fast and easy.

> > >

> > > This has been a feature since day 1 of the game.

> >

> > I guess you're right. Mesmer portals exist.

> >

> > > @"UmbraNoctis.1907" said:

> > > > @"borgs.6103" said:

> > > > For me, it revolutionized roaming in a way that if some tower or maybe even a keep looks undefended, roamers can get inside without breaking any wall or gate and capture it fast and easy.

> > >

> > > Quite sure that getting into structures without breaking a wall or gate is not how it is supposed to work and therefore bug exploiting.

> > Nah. I don't think so. Mesmer portals exist.

>

> You've been able to exploit into various keeps and towers on certain classes for most of the game. They generally take years to fix those exploits and some still exist now, even before the new exploits that mounts added.

 

 

True statement.

 

I guess though (and I am not saying you are advocating for this) why not add the bunny and griffin with that logic. Even though we know it’ll be a problem, let’s add it because we haven’t been able to fix other issues.

[Shadowcat.2680]

> @"Turkeyspit.3965" said:

> > @"Dawdler.8521" said:

> > I still hold my judgement on it until a couple of weeks when the craze has died down. Once you accept that Anet has basicly made PoF and the warclaw mandatory for WvW

>

> Sigh, so tired of seeing this statement.

>

> Look, of the 9 Elite specs introduced in PoF, how many are the dominant specs for the current WvW meta? Anyone who knows anything about WvW knows the answer.

>

> So if a player doesn't have PoF but wants to WvW, not having access to the mount is the LEAST of their disadvantages.

>

> I'm more concerned about future new players, who are l337 enough to actually own PoF, struggling to explore WvW when everyone they fight with and against has a mount.

>

> @"EremiteAngel.9765" Agree with everything you listed,

 

I play WvW on an HoT-only account. The account was absolutely viable in both large and smallscale until the introduction of the mount. There are a number of HoT specs that are still viable (some even meta) for both aspects of the mode. It's the mount that detracts from that account, not any lack of access to PoF elites. Enemies I engage on that account have 12k more health and 3 more dodges (that are gap closers) than my character does, regardless of the profession I'm on.

 

TLDR: The mount is the BIGGEST disadvantage a HoT-only player has in WvW assuming they know which HoT or core specs work in the mode (core guard, core warr, core ranger, core thief, dh, reaper, herald, daredevil, chrono, etc.).

[whoknocks.4935]

I finally managed to solo roam today after a bit of queue time, I don't have the mount yet, but I didn't find that big disadvantage like many people are saying, gankers are always the same with mount or not.

 

Maybe because I am running an off meta build who seems a zerg build lot of mount players jumped on me feeling invincible on their big cat, but after they engaged and dismounted they got a pretty good surprise who sent them to downed state and back to spawn.

 

The only advantage a mount has it's faster map travelling and a tool for players to run from fights they don't wanna take.

 

Today a group of 5 people with mounts was chasing me, just one teleport on a higher ground and nobody could chase me anymore and nobody decided to dismount.

 

Mount might be good in open space, but in jumping puzzle zones it's like a boat in the wood.

 

So far right now it's a great environment to test out builds and skills on those footmen pve heroes, at least now I find people to kill and I don't need to spend hours roaming before to find an encounter.

 

But yeah if in a week the situation stabilizes and people only use mounts all the time there will be less and less roaming fight, but only chicken players running away from fights.

[Brendan.1309]

> @"coro.3176" said:

> > @"Mechanix.9315" said:

> > Revolutioned? maybe you meant Killed?

> >

> > 9 of 10 "fights" i had these days, at 1v1 or even numbers 3v3 5v5, they all just run away with mounts, people dont want to fight, they want to karma train with the blob, get the thingy for the mount collection, or just PPT and run inside walls to shoot you siege.

> >

> > The only people who fight now, is the people who WANT to fight you back, and sadly thats a really low number of people, if you get into a mode which have player vs player action, why you gonna avoid the fights? Also do you realize that the gamemode is actually a big team of people, which during defenses of objectives, small groups can actually do a lot for the team, by cutting people off, stopping reinforcements, thats gone.

> >

> > I feel like this people want to ranked spvp and just afk in spawn because they dont want to fight.

> >

> >

>

> This.

>

> In my experience, it's much much harder to ACTUALLY fight people now. Most of the time they just run away and it's difficult to stop them because you need to demount to do enough damage to get them off, but if you demount, they're too far away by the time you've attacked them - especially in enemy territory. You need ridiculous ranged burst (soulbeast) or teleport burst (guard, thief) or you'll never stop anyone.

>

> I really think hard CC ought to affect mounts - possibly even demounting on hard CC.

 

Something similar killed open world PVP in WoW which was arguably what made classic WoW so iconic.

[Simonoly.4352]

From my observations, the addition of Warclaw is actually having the unfortunate effect of causing players to totally ignore each other in the open field. Just groups of players that might have brawled on their way to objectives now galloping right past each other. Seems to be reducing player interactivity in this respect, which is a bit sad.

 

Readjusting how Warclaw works though could remedy this. I think it needs to be easier to dismount a player in particular. Using Battle Maul on an enemy player that is also mounted should dismount both players so that, if a player chooses to dismount and engage, something actually occurs (players can still evade to prevent a forced dismount). I'd possibly even make it so CC works on mounts so you can actually stop a player that's trying to run past.

 

Anyway, Warclaw is cool and I look forward to the changes Anet bring to it to make it really gel with the game mode.

[Star.8401]

It’s not equal to a ram and is a waste of supply.

[Turk.5460]

> @"whoknocks.4935" said:

> The only advantage a mount has it's faster map travelling and a tool for players to run from fights they don't wanna take.

 

??????

11k extra hp that you have to use skills to chew through

3 dodges/gap closers/wideners

 

If you were unmounted and your opponents were mounted and they still decided to skill1 on you without utilizing that advantage, then they were PvE potatoes that don't understand the clear advantage they held.

[reddie.5861]

> @"EremiteAngel.9765" said:

> * No more 1-hit KO from invis

> * No more foes with starting Range advantage

> * No more downstate

> * No more easy escape on foot

> * No more easy cheap ganking of Zerglings

> * Mobile Ram

> * Mobile Watchtower

> * Faster scouting and roaming

> * Faster ferrying of supplies to repair or build siege

> * For the first time in history, Necros are now certified roamers who can pick and choose their fights!

>

> The whole experience with Warclaw has been very refreshing, fluid and natural.

> It felt like Warclaw had always been part of WvW.

> Great job Anet!

 

all warclaw did was making WvW even more of a newbie blob fight style..

warclaw is to fast for WvW it should get nerfed.

warclaw is immune to CC it shouldnt be immune to anything

warclaw HP should get halved to more of a 2 hit material or 1 hit for a DD.

warclaw dodge should get reduced to 1 or 2 and shouldnt leap forward at all.

warclaw shouldnt be able to get boons especially not swiftness.

warclaw it self wont change a shit to roaming, i do not understand why a necro for example thinks he can roam now moment u pop into a ranger/mesmer/thief ur dead these chars still have mobility over you during a fight and will completely destroy you just like they did before. (<-- obviously i mean fight wise ones u decide to go for the fight ur dead meat again cus u cant get away from them)

 

 

i mean like today i watched a core warrior 2 hit a guy, so i went in on my warclaw without intention to kill the warrior (i couldnt do it anyway on scourge)

all i did was kept him in combat and run rounds around him dodge around him etc he tried kill me but obviously he cant i just trolled him till he figured out i wasnt gonna kill him and he could never have got me off my mount.. so basically i could have sticked for ever around him and he couldnt do anything untill reinforcement came for me.. he cant get out of combat he cant get away he cant kill me.. yes as WvW was suppose to be..

 

or this

i chased a thief today with a other guy obviously i cant catch a thief he would have made it away but i decide to run away from thief while my mate kept chasing him

thief stays in combat i got out of combat (thief stays in combat cus of my buddy) i hop on my warclaw i storm towards thief again i CC him and he died..

yes totally how WvW was suppose to be, in my eyes this thief should have killed both of us or should have gotten away. thief is suppose to be the char to be able to pick his fight or leave them not me on my slow ass necro.

^ this why mount is retarded

 

 

so all in all warclaw only added negative things to WvW if u ask me.

 

or give rangers/mesmers/thiefs jobs to do give rangers massive AoEs from 1500 range making scourge useless give thief boon strip on each dagger storm hit and AoE swings on everythingit does and massive armor boost. give mesmers lower cd's on their wells and priority strip on stability and make them poop out perma boons again.

 

so its not just rev/scourge/fb as main squad fillers anymore but i guess above is a no go also..

every1 had their job in WvW but this mounts kind of ruined everything maybe when we can actually CC mounts (which i dont see how it helps thief/mesmer) it might change a little again untill mounts have this super speed and immunity to CC WvW will just turn into a pure blob festival and be in favor of blob players which is what WvW was already.

[displayname.8315]

Big thing it did is remove the running simulator that so many hated. Giving situation anecdotes about 1v1's doesn't mean much of anything. In actual WvW fights it doesn't change much.. the skill group wins, or in unskilled fights the bigger numbers wins. But removal of the running simulator was a huge boon.. again begrudging props to anet.

[Blockhead Magee.3092]

I've roamed and fought with my own various builds for years. Now is worse than ever. However, after the PVE mount only crowd thins out, we'll see how it is.