Necros community..

[Arheundel.6451]

> @Griever.8150 said:

> Thieves don't render unplayable any spec the way Scourge does to my Scrapper so moot point.

>

> I personally don't want Scourge nerfed to dust and wouldn't mind seeing them buffed defensively in exchange of not seeing them wipe out entire teams on their own.

>

> The damage they output is just too much for what is supposed to be a support build.

 

Thieves don't rend unplayable any spec?...what? are you serious?

[silvermember.8941]

> @Griever.8150 said:

> Thieves don't render unplayable any spec the way Scourge does to my Scrapper so moot point.

>

> I personally don't want Scourge nerfed to dust and wouldn't mind seeing them buffed defensively in exchange of not seeing them wipe out entire teams on their own.

>

> The damage they output is just too much for what is supposed to be a support build.

 

I dont think you know the meaning of a moot point.

 

The thieve destroys the Necromancer and any glass canon build. It excels at killing a necromancer.

[Unholy Pillager.3791]

> @Griever.8150 said:

> Thieves don't render unplayable any spec the way Scourge does to my Scrapper so moot point.

>

> I personally don't want Scourge nerfed to dust and wouldn't mind seeing them buffed defensively in exchange of not seeing them wipe out entire teams on their own.

>

> The damage they output is just too much for what is supposed to be a support build.

 

Thieves kept mesmers out of PvP almost entirely for _years_. Same with staff elementalists. So no, it is absolutely not correct to say that thieves don't keep builds or professions out of PvP. They have, and they do.

 

Look, I'm just as irritated about engineers having such a hard time right now as you are, but when you say things that are so utterly false, you undermine your own credibility.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

After actually getting off my ass and making a Necro, I will say that they do need at the very least stab and mobility. Preferably both, but at least one or the other.

 

You cannot have a class be slow and hard hitting, and then not give them the stability to persist in a point defense or the mobility to disengage.

[Malafaia.8903]

So, everyone agrees that Scourges are broken in some way, right?

I've played Reaper since the last nerf on the pool (i still play it sometimes, but while i don't have pof, whats the purpose?).

But i WANT to play Scourge, i want that class to be balanced so we don't have those comps of 2 scourges and 2 spellbreakers in a spvp match. Seriously, everyone on your mind should know that this isn't healthy for spvp as a whole.

 

Playing now mainly as a Ranger i must say that Scourges isn't a problem on 1v1's. I can kill them (maybe sacrificing one pet, but i sure can kill them). In fact i must say they need a buff on mobility AND defenses. But come on, you can't come to a point and wipe an entire team in 2 secs, like they're doing now.

 

But let's talk about Spellbreakers too? For me, those are the real problem. This guys has everything, they can deal damage ALMOST as a Scourge, they can be as mobile as a Ranger, they can defend themselves more than Guardians and Revs combined. This should be nerfed in EVERY aspect.

[Unholy Pillager.3791]

> @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said:

> After actually getting off my kitten and making a Necro, I will say that they do need at the very least stab and mobility. Preferably both, but at least one or the other.

>

> You cannot have a class be slow and hard hitting, and then not give them the stability to persist in a point defense or the mobility to disengage.

 

I hope they give them both, as soon as the damage is toned down. It's just ridiculous that I feel like I'm sabotaging my team by not playing scourge or spellbreaker. I would love to go back to playing engineer without having to feel guilty about it.

[Omar Aschi Popp.7496]

Warrior here. I have come here to show solidarity for my Necromancer colleagues.

 

Do not nerf.

I do not play necro, do not have necro. No vested interest.

[Bigpapasmurf.5623]

> @Malafaia.8903 said:

> So, everyone agrees that Scourges are broken in some way, right?

>

 

Broken and unbalanced are 2 different things. The need balancing, not nerfing.

 

 

[Omar Aschi Popp.7496]

> @Malafaia.8903 said:

> So, everyone agrees that Scourges are broken in some way, right?

NO :) - signed core war.

>, they can be as mobile as a Ranger

 

Lol nope I was always faster and more mobile than ranger. Try again. Gonna nerf amulets sigils and weaponskills too?

 

[Aomine.5012]

> @Razor.6392 said:

> you know what I don't get, the fact that both of these problematic specs (SB and scourge) weren't even designed with PVE in mind. Spellbreaker is obvious and about Scourge I don't think in PVE you have tons of boons to corrupt constantly, not even in raids afaik, coupled with the most ineffective condition for pve (torment) AND YET THEY'RE SOMEHOW INCREDIBLY BROKEN AGAINST ACTUAL PLAYERS.

>

> How? I honestly don't get it. It's not like Deadeye where buffing in pve would break it on pvp and viceversa, or Holosmith. _These specs were made for pvp_, and they managed to become incredibly over the top to the point of draining the fun out of the game.

>

> 8 (6.5) seconds for an aoe counter of the size of the node that does everything except maybe stealth. Literal AOE spam on small nodes (people DID complain a lot about DH and their traps taking entire points) on scourge that does **not** encourage smart play from the necros... what have we learned from HoT?

>

 

Lmao Scourge is OP in PVE too, having the highest damage AND the highest AOE damage in the entire game atm.

It is brain-dead easy to play in PVE too cuz everything just melt and there're tons of life force to gather.

 

Torment you say? Scourge can apply like 8 conditions in mere 1 second.

Torment is not their only dps method, bleed, burning and poison also help.

The fact that one F5 equates to 25 stacks of aoe Torment in just one click already is stupid strong in terms of Torment application too.

[Wintermute.5408]

> @Bigpapasmurf.5623 said:

> > @Malafaia.8903 said:

> > So, everyone agrees that Scourges are broken in some way, right?

> >

>

> Broken and unbalanced are 2 different things. The need balancing, not nerfing.

>

>

 

To be honest, they are literally broken, aka bugged. Question about any nerfs should be risen after it gets fixed.

[zealex.9410]

> @Razor.6392 said:

> you know what I don't get, the fact that both of these problematic specs (SB and scourge) weren't even designed with PVE in mind. Spellbreaker is obvious and about Scourge I don't think in PVE you have tons of boons to corrupt constantly, not even in raids afaik, coupled with the most ineffective condition for pve (torment) AND YET THEY'RE SOMEHOW INCREDIBLY BROKEN AGAINST ACTUAL PLAYERS.

>

> How? I honestly don't get it. It's not like Deadeye where buffing in pve would break it on pvp and viceversa, or Holosmith. _These specs were made for pvp_, and they managed to become incredibly over the top to the point of draining the fun out of the game.

>

> 8 (6.5) seconds for an aoe counter of the size of the node that does everything except maybe stealth. Literal AOE spam on small nodes (people DID complain a lot about DH and their traps taking entire points) on scourge that does **not** encourage smart play from the necros... what have we learned from HoT?

>

 

Torment base dmg is the sane as bleed.

[Crinn.7864]

> @zealex.9410 said:

> > @Razor.6392 said:

> > you know what I don't get, the fact that both of these problematic specs (SB and scourge) weren't even designed with PVE in mind. Spellbreaker is obvious and about Scourge I don't think in PVE you have tons of boons to corrupt constantly, not even in raids afaik, coupled with the most ineffective condition for pve (torment) AND YET THEY'RE SOMEHOW INCREDIBLY BROKEN AGAINST ACTUAL PLAYERS.

> >

> > How? I honestly don't get it. It's not like Deadeye where buffing in pve would break it on pvp and viceversa, or Holosmith. _These specs were made for pvp_, and they managed to become incredibly over the top to the point of draining the fun out of the game.

> >

> > 8 (6.5) seconds for an aoe counter of the size of the node that does everything except maybe stealth. Literal AOE spam on small nodes (people DID complain a lot about DH and their traps taking entire points) on scourge that does **not** encourage smart play from the necros... what have we learned from HoT?

> >

>

> Torment base dmg is the sane as bleed.

 

Torment's base damage is only the same as bleed in PvE, in PvP Torment is heavily nerfed.

 

The reason torment is still considered bad in PvE is because torment sources are generally short duration, while bleeding sources are generally very long durations (and thus better damage)

 

[Aomine.5012]

> @Crinn.7864 said:

> > @zealex.9410 said:

> > > @Razor.6392 said:

> > > you know what I don't get, the fact that both of these problematic specs (SB and scourge) weren't even designed with PVE in mind. Spellbreaker is obvious and about Scourge I don't think in PVE you have tons of boons to corrupt constantly, not even in raids afaik, coupled with the most ineffective condition for pve (torment) AND YET THEY'RE SOMEHOW INCREDIBLY BROKEN AGAINST ACTUAL PLAYERS.

> > >

> > > How? I honestly don't get it. It's not like Deadeye where buffing in pve would break it on pvp and viceversa, or Holosmith. _These specs were made for pvp_, and they managed to become incredibly over the top to the point of draining the fun out of the game.

> > >

> > > 8 (6.5) seconds for an aoe counter of the size of the node that does everything except maybe stealth. Literal AOE spam on small nodes (people DID complain a lot about DH and their traps taking entire points) on scourge that does **not** encourage smart play from the necros... what have we learned from HoT?

> > >

> >

> > Torment base dmg is the sane as bleed.

>

> Torment's base damage is only the same as bleed in PvE, in PvP Torment is heavily nerfed.

>

> The reason torment is still considered bad in PvE is because torment sources are generally short duration, while bleeding sources are generally very long durations (and thus better damage)

>

 

Have you tried Scourge?

 

~35 stacks of Torments in a few seconds by -> Press F1 -> F5 -> F1 -> F1 (Along with 10 stacks of burning if traited. Oh, as well as 25 stacks of vulnerability in the process)

 

Even if you didn't use double proc bug, one click of F5 -> 20 stacks of Torment.

 

Mirage has numerous skills that causes huge torment as well.

 

Torment is almost as plentiful and easily applicable as Bleeding nowadays.

Same goes to Burning.

 

Your info is incredibly outdated.

[Crinn.7864]

> @Aomine.5012 said:

> > @Crinn.7864 said:

> > > @zealex.9410 said:

> > > > @Razor.6392 said:

> > > > you know what I don't get, the fact that both of these problematic specs (SB and scourge) weren't even designed with PVE in mind. Spellbreaker is obvious and about Scourge I don't think in PVE you have tons of boons to corrupt constantly, not even in raids afaik, coupled with the most ineffective condition for pve (torment) AND YET THEY'RE SOMEHOW INCREDIBLY BROKEN AGAINST ACTUAL PLAYERS.

> > > >

> > > > How? I honestly don't get it. It's not like Deadeye where buffing in pve would break it on pvp and viceversa, or Holosmith. _These specs were made for pvp_, and they managed to become incredibly over the top to the point of draining the fun out of the game.

> > > >

> > > > 8 (6.5) seconds for an aoe counter of the size of the node that does everything except maybe stealth. Literal AOE spam on small nodes (people DID complain a lot about DH and their traps taking entire points) on scourge that does **not** encourage smart play from the necros... what have we learned from HoT?

> > > >

> > >

> > > Torment base dmg is the sane as bleed.

> >

> > Torment's base damage is only the same as bleed in PvE, in PvP Torment is heavily nerfed.

> >

> > The reason torment is still considered bad in PvE is because torment sources are generally short duration, while bleeding sources are generally very long durations (and thus better damage)

> >

>

> Have you tried Scourge?

>

> ~35 stacks of Torments in a few seconds by -> Press F1 -> F5 -> F1 -> F1 (Along with 10 stacks of burning if traited. Oh, as well as 25 stacks of vulnerability in the process)

>

> Even if you didn't use double proc bug, one click of F5 -> 20 stacks of Torment.

>

> Mirage has numerous skills that causes huge torment as well.

>

> Torment is almost as plentiful and easily applicable as Bleeding nowadays.

> Same goes to Burning.

>

> Your info is incredibly outdated.

 

You obviously did non understand what I wrote.

 

[PierPiero.9142]

> @Kiritodatrth.1548 said:

> Lol... Chrono was broken for 3 years thiefs are broken forever and DH is a broken mechanics, no matter how nerfed it is... and Now comes scourge, the linethat separates the OP for the unsuitable is so thin (due to low defenses) that a small modification can put a class into oblivion, but every mesmer, DH and thief seems to forget that this is a game and today you are on top tomorrow you are not... these are the same ppl who didnt change their utilities bar...

> Mesmer has a transfer of arcane thievery that is probably the best transfer in the game... if you are playing Condi Mirage with sage you will MELT a scourge in seconds making they pay for they own application... But mesmer is too important and it cannot lose a portal or mobility, then better is to nerf whoever is preventing them to play their 7 buttons push...

> DH is the same, FB has so many condi cleans it can survive against a Scourge IN THE POINT for centuries... But most of guardians wanna still push 3 buttons in DH and area of denial...

> thiefs are still a hard counter if played right, even for scourge... DE is nightmare, DD you need to burst right, otherwise they will melt you as well...

>

>

> For spellbreaker... War always have been a counter to thiefs, not due to FC but mainly due to CC, Spellbreaker has lower access to high CC - Headbutt, or Bull, but a 'small' CC Daze in FC, also the dmg is not as big as core war or old zerker., what has increased the length of the encounters.. for mesmers (used to kill war in 1 vs 1) Now they cant shatter and press 2,3 in sequency, and War has a lot of resistance to deal with their condi burst. they get frustrated, but still a mirage goes very well against spellbreaker if played right... (they same way that warrior had to play against chronos in the past). It's easy to complain when your class is not on top....

>

> FC is the best thing that has happened to this game, I would not change a bit, for scourge, I think the mechanics in general was a big mistake (huge mistake), if they nerf adding a casting or decreasing the burst, will enable ppl just to sit in front of scourge (not dying) and the scourge will face palm all dmg cause he has nothing else to do...

>

> DH is other class that suffers from same bad design... LB, pierce, knock and area of denial added to blocks is still stronger than any other mechanics in the game (even scourge).

>

> If I was Anet I would not nerf any of this classes meantime I'm seeing ppl doing 0 to adapt... it's just crying and desire to go back on top.

>

 

Sage Mirage and Chrono can kill a scourge ? Yes but it is hard, not an easy task. Arcane Thievery reflects only 3 conditions with a cd of 30 secs. You can kil scourge in 2 ways : with chrono with luck and a good use of moa , with mirage staying away and kyting aoe continuously with staff2 , jaunt and blink . Problem of mirage in this case is that staff output a bad damage from far so the fight can last 3... 4. ..5 minutes, .... time in which the point is completely of the scourge. This is in a conqust game something broken. In dueling or in wvw roaming it can be ok , i can kyte you for an hour, kill you at the end and win my fight but in a capture point game this makes scourge too strong becouse even if you can win him , you wlll hardly win the match . Problem is relevant only for SPVP imho, for the rest there are many options to kill a scourge and then it becomes only a problem to l2p against a class ( even if it is really difficult )

[Griever.8150]

> @"Unholy Pillager.3791" said:

> > @Griever.8150 said:

> > Thieves don't render unplayable any spec the way Scourge does to my Scrapper so moot point.

> >

> > I personally don't want Scourge nerfed to dust and wouldn't mind seeing them buffed defensively in exchange of not seeing them wipe out entire teams on their own.

> >

> > The damage they output is just too much for what is supposed to be a support build.

>

> Thieves kept mesmers out of PvP almost entirely for _years_. Same with staff elementalists. So no, it is absolutely not correct to say that thieves don't keep builds or professions out of PvP. They have, and they do.

>

> Look, I'm just as irritated about engineers having such a hard time right now as you are, but when you say things that are so utterly false, you undermine your own credibility.

 

Credibility? Here? Its an anonymous forums where everyone is biased as fuck, its just as bad as the WoW PvP forums, not that i really expected otherwise. Who gives a shit about "credibility" here?

[Crinn.7864]

> @Griever.8150 said:

> > @"Unholy Pillager.3791" said:

> > > @Griever.8150 said:

> > > Thieves don't render unplayable any spec the way Scourge does to my Scrapper so moot point.

> > >

> > > I personally don't want Scourge nerfed to dust and wouldn't mind seeing them buffed defensively in exchange of not seeing them wipe out entire teams on their own.

> > >

> > > The damage they output is just too much for what is supposed to be a support build.

> >

> > Thieves kept mesmers out of PvP almost entirely for _years_. Same with staff elementalists. So no, it is absolutely not correct to say that thieves don't keep builds or professions out of PvP. They have, and they do.

> >

> > Look, I'm just as irritated about engineers having such a hard time right now as you are, but when you say things that are so utterly false, you undermine your own credibility.

>

> Credibility? Here? Its an anonymous forums where everyone is biased as kitten, its just as bad as the WoW PvP forums, not that i really expected otherwise. Who gives a kitten about "credibility" here?

 

Because if you have no credibility, nobody cares what you say.

[Aomine.5012]

> @Crinn.7864 said:

> > @Aomine.5012 said:

> > > @Crinn.7864 said:

> > > > @zealex.9410 said:

> > > > > @Razor.6392 said:

> > > > > you know what I don't get, the fact that both of these problematic specs (SB and scourge) weren't even designed with PVE in mind. Spellbreaker is obvious and about Scourge I don't think in PVE you have tons of boons to corrupt constantly, not even in raids afaik, coupled with the most ineffective condition for pve (torment) AND YET THEY'RE SOMEHOW INCREDIBLY BROKEN AGAINST ACTUAL PLAYERS.

> > > > >

> > > > > How? I honestly don't get it. It's not like Deadeye where buffing in pve would break it on pvp and viceversa, or Holosmith. _These specs were made for pvp_, and they managed to become incredibly over the top to the point of draining the fun out of the game.

> > > > >

> > > > > 8 (6.5) seconds for an aoe counter of the size of the node that does everything except maybe stealth. Literal AOE spam on small nodes (people DID complain a lot about DH and their traps taking entire points) on scourge that does **not** encourage smart play from the necros... what have we learned from HoT?

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > Torment base dmg is the sane as bleed.

> > >

> > > Torment's base damage is only the same as bleed in PvE, in PvP Torment is heavily nerfed.

> > >

> > > The reason torment is still considered bad in PvE is because torment sources are generally short duration, while bleeding sources are generally very long durations (and thus better damage)

> > >

> >

> > Have you tried Scourge?

> >

> > ~35 stacks of Torments in a few seconds by -> Press F1 -> F5 -> F1 -> F1 (Along with 10 stacks of burning if traited. Oh, as well as 25 stacks of vulnerability in the process)

> >

> > Even if you didn't use double proc bug, one click of F5 -> 20 stacks of Torment.

> >

> > Mirage has numerous skills that causes huge torment as well.

> >

> > Torment is almost as plentiful and easily applicable as Bleeding nowadays.

> > Same goes to Burning.

> >

> > Your info is incredibly outdated.

>

> You obviously did non understand what I wrote.

>

 

"The reason torment is still considered bad in PvE is because torment sources are generally short duration, while bleeding sources are generally very long durations (and thus better damage)" is literally what you said.

 

But for Scourge, Torment stack higher than bleed now.

[Griever.8150]

> @Crinn.7864 said:

> > @Griever.8150 said:

> > > @"Unholy Pillager.3791" said:

> > > > @Griever.8150 said:

> > > > Thieves don't render unplayable any spec the way Scourge does to my Scrapper so moot point.

> > > >

> > > > I personally don't want Scourge nerfed to dust and wouldn't mind seeing them buffed defensively in exchange of not seeing them wipe out entire teams on their own.

> > > >

> > > > The damage they output is just too much for what is supposed to be a support build.

> > >

> > > Thieves kept mesmers out of PvP almost entirely for _years_. Same with staff elementalists. So no, it is absolutely not correct to say that thieves don't keep builds or professions out of PvP. They have, and they do.

> > >

> > > Look, I'm just as irritated about engineers having such a hard time right now as you are, but when you say things that are so utterly false, you undermine your own credibility.

> >

> > Credibility? Here? Its an anonymous forums where everyone is biased as kitten, its just as bad as the WoW PvP forums, not that i really expected otherwise. Who gives a kitten about "credibility" here?

>

> Because if you have no credibility, nobody cares what you say.

 

And your heavy use of hyperbole in some other threads builds that how, exactly?

[Crinn.7864]

> @Aomine.5012 said:

> > @Crinn.7864 said:

> > > @Aomine.5012 said:

> > > > @Crinn.7864 said:

> > > > > @zealex.9410 said:

> > > > > > @Razor.6392 said:

> > > > > > you know what I don't get, the fact that both of these problematic specs (SB and scourge) weren't even designed with PVE in mind. Spellbreaker is obvious and about Scourge I don't think in PVE you have tons of boons to corrupt constantly, not even in raids afaik, coupled with the most ineffective condition for pve (torment) AND YET THEY'RE SOMEHOW INCREDIBLY BROKEN AGAINST ACTUAL PLAYERS.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > How? I honestly don't get it. It's not like Deadeye where buffing in pve would break it on pvp and viceversa, or Holosmith. _These specs were made for pvp_, and they managed to become incredibly over the top to the point of draining the fun out of the game.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > 8 (6.5) seconds for an aoe counter of the size of the node that does everything except maybe stealth. Literal AOE spam on small nodes (people DID complain a lot about DH and their traps taking entire points) on scourge that does **not** encourage smart play from the necros... what have we learned from HoT?

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Torment base dmg is the sane as bleed.

> > > >

> > > > Torment's base damage is only the same as bleed in PvE, in PvP Torment is heavily nerfed.

> > > >

> > > > The reason torment is still considered bad in PvE is because torment sources are generally short duration, while bleeding sources are generally very long durations (and thus better damage)

> > > >

> > >

> > > Have you tried Scourge?

> > >

> > > ~35 stacks of Torments in a few seconds by -> Press F1 -> F5 -> F1 -> F1 (Along with 10 stacks of burning if traited. Oh, as well as 25 stacks of vulnerability in the process)

> > >

> > > Even if you didn't use double proc bug, one click of F5 -> 20 stacks of Torment.

> > >

> > > Mirage has numerous skills that causes huge torment as well.

> > >

> > > Torment is almost as plentiful and easily applicable as Bleeding nowadays.

> > > Same goes to Burning.

> > >

> > > Your info is incredibly outdated.

> >

> > You obviously did non understand what I wrote.

> >

>

> "The reason torment is still considered bad in PvE is because torment sources are generally short duration, while bleeding sources are generally very long durations (and thus better damage)" is literally what you said.

>

> But for Scourge, Torment stack higher than bleed now.

 

I was talking about why Torment is perceived as a bad condition for PvE.

 

Context is everything.

[Volrath.1473]

Ok i understand your new elite is not good for PvP. Guess what?! Ours (thieves) is not better...

DD still dominate wile DEs are cannon fodder...

 

So... why would you cry about thieves until they get nerfed?

 

I don't see the point...

 

You should be crying for buffs for necro instead...

[Daffan.8924]

Why don't they just balance pvp numbers different to pvE?

 

 

[Vertep.2498]

> @"silent killer.5732" said:

> > @Griever.8150 said:

> > Thieves don't render unplayable any spec the way Scourge does to my Scrapper so moot point.

> >

> > I personally don't want Scourge nerfed to dust and wouldn't mind seeing them buffed defensively in exchange of not seeing them wipe out entire teams on their own.

> >

> > The damage they output is just too much for what is supposed to be a support build.

>

> We are not a support either

> In the pve it works but in pvp

> All we can do is giving 2k barrior and 5k if you stavk with the player you want to lend that barrior to.. And mainly we remove the condi from our allays

>

> And we are not aoe class nor melee

> What we are idk

>

> But we dont have the survive ability as what the melee classes has

> And we cant one shot people from distance as what the range classess does

>

> We only have this thing. We destroy everything in our 300 radies . Except for the spellbreaker for sure.

>

>

>

> So if everyone cry about how strong the scourge at melee range.

> We are totally fine with removing the sand shade and its no longer placeable

> And let us have our death shroud with the sand shade skills on it with 1200 range and thats good again and its only hits one target

>

> You think thats another form of op??

>

> Thats the exact power as the one shot theif with one different. This is condi and the other one is power

 

and tbh if you have 2 scrouges in team you are mostly in win team if ther is no thieves in enemies and at al arnt they that much playable now because of their insane aoe condi? in every pvp match I see mostly atleast 2 scrouges if not more, rarely see less than 2

 

so they dont have this mobility and survivability etc...but they have in compensate that high **AOE CONDI** in melee range as its more brainless than DE with unlad spam and if you arnt this SB or guard with condi cleanse nothing will save you from scrouge if you let him catch you in melee range (Im looking at you criple)

 

its so funny gow this scrouge is "weak" and with this it shoud be unplayabe but thanks to this inconceivable aoe condis we see scrouges in every match and they are dominating classes to win along with warriors

 

so if we want scrouge with more survivability, mobility etc then we should take away that insane condis from him with range of his aoe's

 

now the only good counter to this scrouge is just stand in range and killing him becaunse in melee range you will got melted instantly...even condi cleanse wont help you because of his huge range aoe with new condi stacks in just moment

[silent killer.5732]

> @Volrath.1473 said:

> Ok i understand your new elite is not good for PvP. Guess what?! Ours (thieves) is not better...

> DD still dominate wile DEs are cannon fodder...

>

> So... why would you cry about thieves until they get nerfed?

>

> I don't see the point...

>

> You should be crying for buffs for necro instead...

 

> @Volrath.1473 said:

> Ok i understand your new elite is not good for PvP. Guess what?! Ours (thieves) is not better...

> DD still dominate wile DEs are cannon fodder...

>

> So... why would you cry about thieves until they get nerfed?

>

> I don't see the point...

>

> You should be crying for buffs for necro instead...

 

I really don't know what im gonna say to you

You said your new elite isn't any good but you mentioned you have your dd who already dominating .

 

In other hand we have only one meta build which is tge scourge and we can't play with the reaper anymore because of all the PoF elite specializations how you compare your class with any other class while yours can outclass any other classes and i mean all your builds are doing great in the current meta.

We only have this build to play with right now and even this build will get nerfed to the bottom