Filip.7463

> @"Khalisto.5780" said: > First thing that comes to mind reading the first paragraph (and that is all i read) is that you are not as good as you think Indeed. He is waiting to be carried instead to learn to carry.

> @"Albert.3574" said: > > @"Filip.7463" said: > > Get to higher rating and you wont meet them > > Nah plat2 tier still will fight this ...maybe only na still alive but sea eu ocx dead u will farm bot all day lol the good bot will stuck 1350+ bad bot stuck 1100 always Have you ever been in p2? Bots problem end in g2-3 If bot is in 1350 (they arent, im just making an example), p2 player would never meet him.

Get to higher rating and you wont meet them

> @"JusticeRetroHunter.7684" said: > @"Ryo.5824" > > I did a lot of research on the matchmaker a while back. I will explain how it works, and then i will explain the consequences of how the matchmaker works leads to statistcal anomalies that describe behavior that you experience in matches. > > **How The Matchmaker Works** > > The first thing to understand is that there are a number of individual component parts that make up the matchmaking system. In the code they are described a bit differently, but the best way to think about it is imagining that each component is like a little machine that organizes information. These three machines are called the following : > The Server > The Matchmaker > The Pool > > When a person hits the que button, a player enters the que. This que i will be referring to as "The pool" in which all players that are currently in the que are inside. The matchmaker is filing through the players in this pool, organizing potential sets of teams for matches. > > Every 30 seconds, the server pings the matchmaker, to initiate a match. If the matchmaker is not ready, by not having assorted a team of players it deems suitable to create a match, it will return an answer to the server (The answer in this case being that the matchmaker wasn't ready.) So the server will continue to wait every 30 seconds, reminding the matchmaker that it has a job to do. > > Meanwhile, the Matchmaker is searching in the pool for 10 players to create a match. This search is done by rating and is called "Phase 1." > > After the matchmaker finds 10 players within an acceptable range of rating for a match, it will enter "Phase 2" which organizes those 10 players into teams based on a number of parameters. These parameters include rating, *rank, *games played, party size, profession, and *dishonor. > > Once the Matchmaker has organized the teams in what it believes to be satisfactory (in which the matchmaker believes that each side has a fairly balanced distribution from the parameters above in both phase 1 and phase 2), The matchmaker will keep those players in a proverbial "basket", for when the server is ready to ping the matchmaker. The matchmaker can continue the above two phases for the players in this basket if it finds more suitable players in the pool. > > Anyway, the server pings the matchmaker, and the matchmaker gives the green light on all the players that are in the "basket," Anyone still in the pool and not in a "basket" will remain in que until those players find a suitable match by the matchmaker. > > **How Matchmaking Creates Statistical Anomalies** > > So perhaps you've already noticed how rank (rabbit-dragon), the number of games you've played in your account history, and dishonor can effect how the matchmaker places you on teams. This is enough to describe at least some of the statistical anomalies in the matchmaker, and it makes sense as to why we observe behavior where it would seem that player skill is drastically different from player to player in the same match. For now let's just ignore rating, and just focus on these parameters. > > Let's give an example that highlights one of these anomalies. > > Let's say you que into a pool of 9 other players. Out of the 9 players in que, you have the most rank (level 300 dragon) and the most games played in your account history (6000 games). Because the matchmaker first organizes players by RATING, you will automatically fall into this group of 9 players. So that means that if the matchmaker decides you belong on Team A because of those parameters in phase 2, then there will be almost no other configuration of players in which you are on a different team with different players, because the matchmaker will strive to make a balanced match. That means if you have the most, it WILL put you with a player that also has the least, because as someone that has the most, you are an outlier and outliers are balanced by this system by just giving you players with lowest value parameters. > > Notice how profession also plays into Phase 2. You could have THE LEAST rank and the LEAST games played on your account, and by simply chosing a certain profession before que, you might end up on the team in which you are grouped with players with the least value parameters, because the outlier that was supposed to balance out your team, is playing the same profession as you, and therefor they are placed on the other team. > > Now, this is just the anomolies that are caused on a micro-scopic level based on phase 2 of the matchmaker. This is a problem, but there is a more macroscopic anomoly that is much more sinister. It deals with how rating is essentially worthless in the context of the system, because of how anomolies end up shifting the real values of rating into more and more random values. > > To explain, let's propose a hypothetical matchmaking scenario. > > Player Alice, Bob, Charlie and David exist and for this example lets say that... > 1. Alice is a good player (As good as Charlie) > 2. Bob is a bad player > 3. Charlie is a good player (As good as Alice) > 4. David is a bad player > > Now, they all end up in a match together. Alice is on Bob's team (A), and Charlie is on David's team (B). At the end of the game, Team A wins, and so Alice and Bob are rewarded. where as Charlie and David are punished. In this case, we can say that the Matchmaker treats Alice and Bob as being better players then Charlie and David. > > The 2nd match comes along, and this time, Alice and David are on team A, while Bob and Charlie are on team B. Team A wins, and so Alice and David are rewarded, while Bob and Charlie are punished and we can say that for this game, the matchmaker treats Alice and David as better players then Bob and Charlie. If we take a look at how these two matches add together we can deduce the following based on the matchmakers decision. > > Alice is the best player > Bob is an average player > David is an average player > Charlie is the worst player > > So do you see the problem with the above deduction? Charlie is judged by the matchmaker as being the worst player, while Bob and David, who are supposed to be worse than Charlie, are labeled as better players than Charlie. > > So if you drag out this exercise on the order of many iterations, you will find that, the more games that are played, the more randomly distributed the allocation of good and bad players become, where players like David and Bob who are bad players, are lifted into this zone where they are considered average. Thus the most random assignment of rating happens to be the top of a bell curve. In other words, The most common rating range, is statistically the most unknown and random place in the distribution of players rating. In essence, rating means nothing, because in a setting where the win condition is based on the performance of others, your rating is essentially as good as the average rating of the team that you are on. Remember, the matchmaker is BASED on rating. If rating is meaningless, then how can a match possibly be balanced, if the number it's based on can't accurately be indicative of player skill? > > In conclusion, Ryo, you are correct that there are hidden variables that determine your place in the matchmaker. Though they aren't exactly how you describe, they are indeed similar, but with no malicious intent. It's just the result of statistical anomalies that end up cascading into large scale, and long term issues with the matchmaker. I wont read all of this but number of matches played and pvp level doesnt matter for matchmaking.

> @"snoow.1694" said: > I was thinking the same a few days ago while watching MightyTeapots AT stream. In Guild Wars 1 EVERYONE could watch the matches and it was a big reason why PvP was bigger relative to other game modes when compared to Guild Wars 2. I don't know how after all those years this hasn't been reworked. > > And to the "exploiting" argument - just add a one minute delay to the matches the public will be able to see and the problem is solved. I am not sure but I think spectating in Guild Wars 1 acutally had a delay of a few minutes (not sure if intended or not) Mighty is also streaming his matches with delay

It shouldn’t be enabled for anyone. Also for streamers - some players might not like to share their gameplay/builds.

There is no hidden points. There is no any luck, either carry or be carried. Hidden points doesn’t exist here, if you are good enough you will get real points. :)

Make CD 7-8s, problem solved

> @"Multicolorhipster.9751" said: > Alright boys, we've got two tempests on the other team. One is a tanky support, the other is FA. Make sure you focus down the FA first so you don't get one shot. > > Now if only we knew which is which... HMMMM > > I mean as far as ideas go; this isn't really a bad one, just kind of pointless. > Would rather see that dev time go into fixing actual problems You dont have to use that option. Still you can look at armor or actuall damage doing and target him.

> @"Ovark.2514" said: > I would be in favor of this except that I imagine toxicity will increase the more we dehumanize players. Also, what if there are multiple players using the same elite spec and you have standard character models on (which most if not all long-term pvpers do)? You'd have to have a number after their spec name or change it's color or something. . . Maybe changing character colour depending on their class would be also a good idea. If there are 2 chronos in oppo team, i think it doesnt matter which chrono is which.

> @"noiwk.2760" said: > > @"Filip.7463" said: > > > @"noiwk.2760" said: > > > > @"Filip.7463" said: > > > > Bot is better than average player. Get better, you wont meet them in plat (Maybe you stop meeting them even in g2-3) > > > > > > wrong. they are in plat aswell ! > > > > Maybe on NA servers, never met one on EU > > > > > > im in EU and im telling you they go all the way to plat . or idk if they are actually plat.. but if you are plat you still gonna see bots and definitely tons of hackers. then you have never been plat, here is no bots and i have never seen a hacker even if i do 500+ matches a season ? i saw some teleporters in local arena, but never in ranked match. Idk how teleporting would help then win a match.

> @"noiwk.2760" said: > > @"Filip.7463" said: > > Bot is better than average player. Get better, you wont meet them in plat (Maybe you stop meeting them even in g2-3) > > wrong. they are in plat aswell ! Maybe on NA servers, never met one on EU

Bot is better than average player. Get better, you wont meet them in plat (Maybe you stop meeting them even in g2-3)

> @"Yasai.3549" said: > > @"Filip.7463" said: > > > No they are squishy and they can be revealed. Shiro has perma superspeed with impossible odds and too strong burst with sword 3,4. Also their infuse light healing skill on dragon gives them full hp back and has low cd (30s) > > Are yu living in the past? > Shiro no longer has Superspeed, no matter the game mode. > > What Burst? Play any meta build and the Burst barely hurts for more than 4k damage. > And Infuse Light is Glint from Herald, not from Shiro, so why nerf Core for something that an Espec does? > > > Get lost, people have more important things to discuss about. > > > Im talking about power shiro, thats herald...

In 8v8 single player doesnt matter that much. So someone who is p3 (5v5) will be possibly s2 (8v8)