Megametzler.5729

*2021 I hope :tongue:

> @"UNOwen.7132" said: > > @"Megametzler.5729" said: > > > @"UNOwen.7132" said: > > > (...) > > > That wouldnt really help, thief usually jumps in with steal, so by the time you would have that cue, its already too late. > > > > What? No, they don't. Steal probably is the one most powerful interrupt in the game. Save it if you can! > > > > It is, but without it you cant burst out of stealth reliably, and it does add quite a fair amount of damage, so you still end up using it for that most of the time. Usually in +1 situations, simply shadowshot+backstab is fine. But I admit, it might be a good option in some situations.

> @"UNOwen.7132" said: > (...) > That wouldnt really help, thief usually jumps in with steal, so by the time you would have that cue, its already too late. What? No, they don't. Steal probably is the one most powerful interrupt in the game. Save it if you can!

I'd probably start with the reward tracks which give a Black Lion Key... https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Black_Lion_Chest_Key#Reward_tracks And generally the one-time only tracks. Some give special rewards, skins and stuff, which might not be profitable in selling but easy and fun rewards. After you have done all the one-time only reward tracks and it is only about the repeatable ones... no idea tbh. I am currently stacking Desert Armor Boxes for no real reason...

> @"Aktium.9506" said: > > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > “Save your self” traited can give 45 boons granted 4 other allies are also close. > Have you considered reading what the shout actually does? ? > > It doesn't trigger Pure of Voice's condi conversion when you transfer condis from allies and the boon application is only on the caster. Doesn't it? Couldn't test it myself, but the wiki says it first converts one condition, then draws in all the remaining conditions. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/%22Save_Yourselves!%22 > @"snoow.1694" said: > What shout can give 45 boons? Also what in the world are you talking about? Who plays Shout Core Guardian? If anything they play meditations - this has to be a troll post I feel like most of his posts are troll posts today...

I agree it should be permanent in unranked. And if you want some titles which mean nothing due to horrible balance, why not? I still hate it though for its one-dimensionality but then I wouldn't have to play unranked during the mini-season. :tongue: And more options are always good!

I doubt it. But it might be fun, so why not. Better be careful if this applies to tempest too though...

> @"Multicolorhipster.9751" said: > > @"LucianTheAngelic.7054" said: > > Your revenant analysis is objectively wrong: > > > > Herald: > > 1) Herald’s +10% health bonus is a regular minor trait, not part of the “trade off” trait > > Yeah, that's because it doesn't have a tradeoff. If you're named Harold they just give you 10% health just 'cus. > > > 2) Herald trades Ancient Echo for Facet of Nature. This is a direct trade off. Echo isn’t a bad skill, and certainly better than some of the FoN skills (looking at you Glint). By ditching core you trade higher energy access for FoN. > > > > Renegade: > > 1) again Renegade trades Ancient Echo for Heroic Command, Citadel Bombardment, and Orders from Above and Kalla’s Fervor. None of these skills are particularly OP and Renegade would likely be better served with Ancient Echo instead of all 3 of them if it could choose to not give it up. Citadel Bombardment is useless in PvP most of the time. Heroic command is extra might which is relatively redundant on ren. Orders from above isn’t awful, but Rev already has low CDs anyway so alacrity is only somewhat good on it. > > 2) Kalla’s Fervor is the most non-trade off aspect of Ren since it doesn’t replace anything and is only added > > 3) yes Ren gets a lot for it’s tradeoff, but this isn’t inherently a bad thing or unbalanced. While the class is performing well now it wasn’t for years so clearly the extra bonuses you get for taking Ren over Herald or Core weren’t enough to justify using Ren. None of the trade offs are major reasons why Ren is being used now and they’re fairly well balanced already > > > > P.s. yes Ren objectively has a trade off even if you don’t think it does. And Herald’s trade off is near equivalent and not as unbalanced or nonexistent like you claim > > Ah, yes. I'm objectively wrong because they aren't OP. > >  > > ??? Well, I do agree herald and renegade do have trade offs. However, they have no major impact on the viability of the builds, for example, assassin gives life steal on herald and unblockable on core. On renegade, the utilities seem more team fight oriented. That might give an idea how renegade skills - including shortbow - should be adjusted: Team fights. However, it also means revenant's issues lie not with their elite specs' trade offs. But instead, you have to analyze why core power rev is not really strong but power herald is? Why is renegod viable, is it only because of shortbow? How can you force it into a team fighting role? But I am not sure whether you can (or need to or should) tweak the profession/specialisation mechanics to do this.

> @"Multicolorhipster.9751" said: > > @"Megametzler.5729" said: > > Weaver has a major trade off. You cannot swap into another attunemend for 4s, making skills 3-5 inaccessible for quick reactions. > > Oh kitten, u rite... uhh.... You didn't see anything. > > That's actually very helpful though, thank you. I'll make some adjusterinos. > (...) Don't even know what we were talking about! I like the constructive way you started this. **Weaver:** That there already is a trade off makes it hard to adjust. I would mainly focus on weapon and dual skills here. I still think the fire traitline needs to be adjusted (more egocentric, maybe iCD, ...), but this is an issue for both tempest and weaver. **Chrono:** Well, I kind of agree that chrono does not have any in-build advantages. Shatters are changed, but not necessarily better. CS is great, but the loss of distortion hurt chrono so much. An option would be to increase some of chrono's sustain with wells or another trait, but nobody wants chrono bunkr times back, so... well, I will leave this to mesmer mains. **Reaper:** I feel like reaper has a good trade off. The two shrouds have very different playstyles, maybe they could improve on this? Make reaper more focused on close combat and burst, core shroud on conditions and bruiser gameplay? Again, I am not too deep into necro to make good suggestions. For most of the other classes I totally agree with your analysis. Especially revenant and holo need changes here.

Weaver has a major trade off. You cannot swap into another attunemend for 4s, making skills 3-5 inaccessible for quick reactions. Chrono's trade off is weird indeed, but a pretty hefty one.

> @"Ovark.2514" said: > > @"reikken.4961" said: > > how is it dumb? > > > > to clarify, a match has up to five rounds (first to three). and the game gives you a full minute in between rounds to make build changes > > It's dumb because instead of using the time you have being dead while your teammate is fighting, you instead have to waste EVERYONE'S time by waiting until the round is over. Also, many people just click the ready button out of habit even though they had planned on making build changes. Better to make the changes while you're thinking about it rather than risk losing the chance. Well, you are right. I used to be annoyed by this too until I found the way... But considering it is somehow possible, I would like them to address other topics first. :tongue:

> @"Dadnir.5038" said: > > @"Megametzler.5729" said: > > > @"Dadnir.5038" said: > > > > @"Megametzler.5729" said: > > > > I just can't believe someone is actually defending pure bunker bore-out gameplay, designd to make the fight go into overtime and winning theoretically without having to apply any damage... :astonished: > > > > > > Why not? Should DPS builds/strategies be the only ones that have the right to exist in the game? > > > (...) > > > > You probably only read this comment, but I said above already, that neither one-shots nor eternal sustain should be viable strategies. So far, the games clearly tend more towards bunkers and overtime instead of finishing after 20 seconds, so this nerf of unfair sustain leading to unfun strategies is not only fine, but has been very necessary. > > (....) It is only a philosophical question if you make it one. No extremes are good. If it was for me, they could instakill every single player after overtime and make it 1 - 1. That would also negate stuff like fears, knockbacks and all this nonsense. But people promoting eternal bunkers is just as awful as promoting instant kills, complaining aboutone-hits from stealth and fights lasting longer than 20 seconds. I do not want either.

> @"Dadnir.5038" said: > > @"Megametzler.5729" said: > > I just can't believe someone is actually defending pure bunker bore-out gameplay, designd to make the fight go into overtime and winning theoretically without having to apply any damage... :astonished: > > Why not? Should DPS builds/strategies be the only ones that have the right to exist in the game? > (...) You probably only read this comment, but I said above already, that neither one-shots nor eternal sustain should be viable strategies. So far, the games clearly tend more towards bunkers and overtime instead of finishing after 20 seconds, so this nerf of unfair sustain leading to unfun strategies is not only fine, but has been very necessary.

Just a side note: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Goro%27s_Journal There were settlements of humans, norn and tengu before the Dominion arrived. Whom they belonged to I couldn't find, but the humans most likely were officially Krytans, right? No information of where they fled to either, no real information whatsoever in the story chapters either, I believe...

I just can't believe someone is actually defending pure bunker bore-out gameplay, designd to make the fight go into overtime and winning theoretically without having to apply any damage... :astonished:

> @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > @"Megametzler.5729" said: > > But that is only during overtime? A build that simply relies on stalling for the whole fight's duration and then wins by an unfair sustain mechanic, which used to be not affected by the overtime, do you really want any such a build to exist? > > > > I know I don't, but I absolutely dislike deathmatch anyway. > > Since this seems directly about me. Yes I think it should exist. 1 the mechanic is alittle flaud as it is since it’s no healing and eventually instant death. I wish it was more like wow with just reduced healing. But that’s just opinion about that but talking directly about scourge/ yes I think it should be able to do barrier though I’d be fine if it was just reduced barrier. With this change builds like 1 shot dh which were already top teir and countered this build as it was, will now guess what- be able to eventually 1 shot anyone and anyone that walks into traps and sword of justice will probably have no counter play. Basically stuff that was already over performing as dps build will now exist with even less counter. But... it is only once overtime starts.

But that is only during overtime? A build that simply relies on stalling for the whole fight's duration and then wins by an unfair sustain mechanic, which used to be not affected by the overtime, do you really want any such a build to exist? I know I don't, but I absolutely dislike deathmatch anyway.

> @"Supreme.3164" said: > > @"Megametzler.5729" said: > > > @"Supreme.3164" said: > > > > @"Megametzler.5729" said: > > > > > @"Supreme.3164" said: > > > > > (...) **MMO are all about collaboration between professions/jobs to reach a common goal not for you to have a glorius 1v1**. > > > > > (...) > > > > > > > > When a build can fight 90% of the situations (teamfights, duels, +1 situations) and gets countered by a build which only wins these duels, is this really stone-paper-scissors? > > > > > > > > > > Would have not been better in that case to add something new to the "duel only" class to bring something to teamfight while lowering the teamfight potential of the other at the same time? > > > > > > -Most players would call it "powercreep" but...for me adding a teamfight utility or trait to the "duel only" class , sounds like "increased build diversity" > > > -It has always been absurd that people would consider normal that in a game with 9 different professions, you watch a tournament being played by "mirror builds" teams in a 5vs5 gamemode > > > > > > Powercreep happens when you take something that it's already strong in its role and you make it stronger....**increasing build diversity is not powercreep**, when you have only one way to play your class...and it gets nerfed...you can't play the class anymore, can that really be called improvement? > > > > > > > > > > I don't get your point. What is it you are angry about? What changes do you not like, what philosophy? > > > > Nobody expects do be able to duel anything. but when there are builds good in almost any situation, that is somethign that needs addressing. > (...) > 1)You removed one class from the scene > 2) Less diverse team compositions > (...) But that is not what is happening. a) You nerf a build that is overperforming. Not too harshly, you adjust it by adding weaknesses, for example removing condi cleanses, reduce weakness spam, change AoE access. What happens is not you "remove a class" (if you do it properly). You adjust it to perform _comparable to all the other builds out there_. This way you actually increase build diversity, improve theory crafting and enable creativity. b) You add a specific counter to this build. This weakens the ovrperforming build too, but you only add one build to the "viable" spectrum. All the other underperforming builds still do not work, because they are still way weaker than the initial overperforming build and might actually be coutnered by the new counter build as well. You barely increase build diversity, but you indeed reduce the strength of the initial build. Option a) requires significantly more knowledge of the classes and more investment into tweaking. As an ele main myself I absolutely agree with you that Anet does not seem to know what has been wrong with for example fire Weaver. They nerfed all the wrong spots and made any sword build significantly worse instead of adjusting the defensive capabilities of the fire traitline. However, they seemed to do a better spot with thief (don't hate me), bringing down the mobility comparable to other classes. Was it too much or too little? Debatable, but the mobility was a major problem and they addressed it. So in general: I absolutely prefer option a) for build diversity. Introducing counters only enables these specific builds and barely more. The problem is knowledge and time invested these days, not the philosophy of nerfing overperforming builds.

> @"Supreme.3164" said: > > @"Megametzler.5729" said: > > > @"Supreme.3164" said: > > > (...) **MMO are all about collaboration between professions/jobs to reach a common goal not for you to have a glorius 1v1**. > > > (...) > > > > When a build can fight 90% of the situations (teamfights, duels, +1 situations) and gets countered by a build which only wins these duels, is this really stone-paper-scissors? > > > > Would have not been better in that case to add something new to the "duel only" class to bring something to teamfight while lowering the teamfight potential of the other at the same time? > > -Most players would call it "powercreep" but...for me adding a teamfight utility or trait to the "duel only" class , sounds like "increased build diversity" > -It has always been absurd that people would consider normal that in a game with 9 different professions, you watch a tournament being played by "mirror builds" teams in a 5vs5 gamemode > > Powercreep happens when you take something that it's already strong in its role and you make it stronger....**increasing build diversity is not powercreep**, when you have only one way to play your class...and it gets nerfed...you can't play the class anymore, can that really be called improvement? > > I don't get your point. What is it you are angry about? What changes do you not like, what philosophy? Nobody expects do be able to duel anything. but when there are builds good in almost any situation, that is somethign that needs addressing.

> @"Supreme.3164" said: > (...) **MMO are all about collaboration between professions/jobs to reach a common goal not for you to have a glorius 1v1**. > (...) When a build can fight 90% of the situations (teamfights, duels, +1 situations) and gets countered by a build which only wins these duels, is this really stone-paper-scissors?

> @"mynamepickle.1673" said: > is this still good? some things are missing now like earthen rush and celestial in pvp Naah, not really. Not completely trash, but very subpar. Low stability uptime, badly nerfed condition application and lots of CD increases hurt weaver a lot. The only build which is semi-viable now is stunlock power D/F. In PVP at least. However, if you like the playstyle, go for it! Just don't expect it to work all that well in higher leagues. :tongue: WvW and PvE is a whole different matter of course.

> @"Sigmoid.7082" said: > Matched with lower ranks: I only lost because of those players. > > Matched with higher ranks: I obviously carried..why is my rank not higher than theirs..something must be wrong. > > Matched with the same rank: people here are terrible...my rank should be higher. These people are holding me back. > > And more. > > I can see it now. Add to that: Matched with lower ranks: I am just gonna blame them even before the match even started. You know, anticipating. Matched with higher ranks: Better not say anything or they will just jump on me... No thanks to this. The idea is good, but in real life, this would have too many negative effects.

Play meme zerker builds. Don't take it too seriously. Have fun. :smile: It can work, but yes, mostly in lower brackets. But if you have fun, who cares for ranking? Zerker ele, sic' em soulbeast, power mesmer, yolo reaper... there are many builds which can still explode bunkers. Don't be afraid and use them!

> @"CutesySylveon.8290" said: > > @"Megametzler.5729" said: > > > @"CutesySylveon.8290" said: > > > > @"Megametzler.5729" said: > > > > > @"CutesySylveon.8290" said: > > > > > > @"Megametzler.5729" said: > > > > > > > @"Exile.8160" said: > > > > > > > > @"Megametzler.5729" said: > > > > > > > > In my experience, build diversity went up quite a lot. Sure, there are still many guards and necros, but there were just as many before the patch. Now there are more variations on warriors, tempests are coming back, even seen more mesmers (though not yet statistically relevant). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Put an ICD on Eternal Armory and guard is fine. Maaaybe change Rune of the Trapper. But I am having fun blasting them out of existance from range, they are horribly slow and once out of stealth can't really surprise you with anything. Only watch out for F1, that's about it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So basically kill of the last bit of dmg/build guards have? Theyve been over neef in everytbing else. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So instead of trying to delete a class how about suguest buff on other parts before you call for nerfs > > > > > > > > > > > > You can buff Firebrand a little and maybe power core for all I care. But burn guard is way too effective while being very easy to play. As I said, i have no problems with them as I know how to counter them, but they are very present in many games. > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"CutesySylveon.8290" said: > > > > > > > *snip* > > > > > > > > > > > > I have seen scrappers, scourge MM necros, reapers, core bunker guards, condi thieves, core warrior, berserker, different rangers, condi mirages, weaver and tempest. Of course, still many core necs and DHs, but... > > > > > > > > > > > > ... and me as power chrono. :tongue: Now that there are fewer thieves, I can stay on that build more often and let those slow guards explode. > > > > > > > > > > > > Around 1550 with only playing memes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Okay, you SEEING something means absolutely nothing. I see a lot of people running things that don't work or aren't good, doesn't mean they're ***viable***. > > > > > > > > > > Scrapper is straight outclassed by Holo, scourge MM is a meme and is a constant source of mockery from EU players that NA struggles against it. Core warrior isn't killing anything with even a tiny amount of consistent cleanse, and Berserker is bad and still bad beyond meming people who panic and can't dodge obvious CC. Condi mirage might make a come back. Weaver can't do anything with a support on the enemy team. Core necro is a meat sponge that can't touch a team with cleanse support and trapper DH is the last viable guardian build. Power chrono is a glass cannon that dies to anything that looks at it hard enough and can dodge telegraphed burst and is gonna really become useless if power Shiro starts another reign of terror. > > > > > > > > > > The fact you think burn DH is an issue speaks a lot and not in a good way. Again, most of the things you listed aren't viable or just straight up outclassed by the main build the class uses. Shifting the main thing you see on a match also doesn't change the fact that what the classes can run that's viable is extremely limited. Having 1-2 builds even worth mentioning, much less actually using, means we've got no build diversity. > > > > > > > > It was on EU. MM scourge did quite well, while being as slow as it is. My power chrono destroyed dual burn DH teams easily, I didn't even die once in those games. And I am not great with that build. > > > > > > > > I did not see power rev indeed, but it is less of a hard counter to power mes than thief was (is?), so I will keep an eye on that. I only played like 4-5 games since yesterday's patch. And only around P1. In higher tiers, people will of course know how to counter a power chrono properly. > > > > > > > > €: I am not saying all these builds are viable. But the meta seems shaken up a little and I will not judge before one or two weeks came in. Then maybe we can talk about guard, maybe necro or whatever comes up. > > > > > > > > > > If you can destroy DH with power mesmer, how can you reasonably say it's way too effective for how easy it is to play? How hard a build is doesn't mean it should have any standard of viability attached to it, even if you literally just auto attack. This build is make or break by trapper runes and Dragon's Maw, remove either of those things or just dodge Dragon's Maw and you've got a build that can't hope to do anything but F1 and that's also severely jeopardizing their effectiveness even if it lands. Once it's gone, guardian is without any viable builds left baring some new discovery or such a serious shakeup in the meta that an old build comes back. > > > > > > I seriously doubt much will change. If power thief were to be out then power Shiro will likely fill in its place again, even if it is a compromise on mobility in exchange for better team-fighting capabilities. This could let condi mirage come back and keep it in check but I doubt it. I agree the meta could be shaken up a bit, but I don't see it being so much so that Berserker, non holo engis, non tempest ele's, etc etc will be able to come back. One or two things might shift, but we'll still be in a stagnant state of little build variety. > > > > 40+ notifications, what the kitten. Stop quoting! > > > > I don't understand your reasoning. It can be not OP and still be incredibly easy to play. I can jump on burn guard myself and without any knowledge or combos do well in P1 (well, who can't?). No learning curve, no improvement necessary, no positioning, kiting, no anything. I don#t think it is fun to play or play against, but that's subjective as usual. It won't carry people to actually high ranks, but it will carry bad players and I don't like that. > > > > I don't think berserkers will pop up. That one was acutally quite bad and didn't do much indeed. But seeing some more mesmers without having had to buff them? More supports than warrior? Non-support warriors? Any change is a good change, so I take this as a step in the right direction. Not perfect, not a big step, but it's something. > > I don't agree it's overperforming though, even if it's pretty braindead. I use a non trapper version in WvW with Spirit Sword and Purging Flames as a defense build in structures vs attackers. It's literally just drop AoE on siege and watch 5-10k burn ticks happen, this is WvW so stats and yadayadayada but you get my point. It's easy, but it's also a gimmick that's easily shut down by anything with defensive aspects to their build. Resistance, teleports, blocks on everything besides Maw and F1, and any invuln for a few seconds effectively render it useless. > Build carrying bad players isn't going to change, and certainly not when the surrounding playerbase refuse to adapt to it and just start asking for it to be nerfed and made irrelevant, I believe this is a much bigger indicator of a bad player: people who refuses to adapt their build or playstyle for the predicted environment. If you know Trapper DH is likely to be in your match, then you bring tools to deal with it, but this might make you weaker to other builds; this is what we should want even if it means we can't just rely on a single template for every scenario. > > Zerk is probably gone until they get another massive damage buff that will be nerfed again. Like I said, Tempest coming back as shoutbreaker leaves didn't change much, you aren't ever going to see support scrapper, druid, or Ventari. It's not really a step anywhere except back to what we had before the most recent build was nerfed. > > And yes the ping overflow lol I am not saying it is OP. I am saying it is way too dominant for low investment of skill and learning. They have repeatedly nerfed non-op builds which are "unfun to play against", "one-trick ponies" and "noob filters". If it is even uses in top mAT-teams? I doubt it will remain unchanged and in my view rightfully so. That does not mean they should straight up nerf guard! Just shift the damage more to DPS instead of burst and buff other builds as well.

> @"CutesySylveon.8290" said: > > @"Megametzler.5729" said: > > > @"CutesySylveon.8290" said: > > > > @"Megametzler.5729" said: > > > > > @"Exile.8160" said: > > > > > > @"Megametzler.5729" said: > > > > > > In my experience, build diversity went up quite a lot. Sure, there are still many guards and necros, but there were just as many before the patch. Now there are more variations on warriors, tempests are coming back, even seen more mesmers (though not yet statistically relevant). > > > > > > > > > > > > Put an ICD on Eternal Armory and guard is fine. Maaaybe change Rune of the Trapper. But I am having fun blasting them out of existance from range, they are horribly slow and once out of stealth can't really surprise you with anything. Only watch out for F1, that's about it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So basically kill of the last bit of dmg/build guards have? Theyve been over neef in everytbing else. > > > > > > > > > > So instead of trying to delete a class how about suguest buff on other parts before you call for nerfs > > > > > > > > You can buff Firebrand a little and maybe power core for all I care. But burn guard is way too effective while being very easy to play. As I said, i have no problems with them as I know how to counter them, but they are very present in many games. > > > > > > > > > @"CutesySylveon.8290" said: > > > > > *snip* > > > > > > > > I have seen scrappers, scourge MM necros, reapers, core bunker guards, condi thieves, core warrior, berserker, different rangers, condi mirages, weaver and tempest. Of course, still many core necs and DHs, but... > > > > > > > > ... and me as power chrono. :tongue: Now that there are fewer thieves, I can stay on that build more often and let those slow guards explode. > > > > > > > > Around 1550 with only playing memes. > > > > > > > > > > Okay, you SEEING something means absolutely nothing. I see a lot of people running things that don't work or aren't good, doesn't mean they're ***viable***. > > > > > > Scrapper is straight outclassed by Holo, scourge MM is a meme and is a constant source of mockery from EU players that NA struggles against it. Core warrior isn't killing anything with even a tiny amount of consistent cleanse, and Berserker is bad and still bad beyond meming people who panic and can't dodge obvious CC. Condi mirage might make a come back. Weaver can't do anything with a support on the enemy team. Core necro is a meat sponge that can't touch a team with cleanse support and trapper DH is the last viable guardian build. Power chrono is a glass cannon that dies to anything that looks at it hard enough and can dodge telegraphed burst and is gonna really become useless if power Shiro starts another reign of terror. > > > > > > The fact you think burn DH is an issue speaks a lot and not in a good way. Again, most of the things you listed aren't viable or just straight up outclassed by the main build the class uses. Shifting the main thing you see on a match also doesn't change the fact that what the classes can run that's viable is extremely limited. Having 1-2 builds even worth mentioning, much less actually using, means we've got no build diversity. > > > > It was on EU. MM scourge did quite well, while being as slow as it is. My power chrono destroyed dual burn DH teams easily, I didn't even die once in those games. And I am not great with that build. > > > > I did not see power rev indeed, but it is less of a hard counter to power mes than thief was (is?), so I will keep an eye on that. I only played like 4-5 games since yesterday's patch. And only around P1. In higher tiers, people will of course know how to counter a power chrono properly. > > > > €: I am not saying all these builds are viable. But the meta seems shaken up a little and I will not judge before one or two weeks came in. Then maybe we can talk about guard, maybe necro or whatever comes up. > > > > If you can destroy DH with power mesmer, how can you reasonably say it's way too effective for how easy it is to play? How hard a build is doesn't mean it should have any standard of viability attached to it, even if you literally just auto attack. This build is make or break by trapper runes and Dragon's Maw, remove either of those things or just dodge Dragon's Maw and you've got a build that can't hope to do anything but F1 and that's also severely jeopardizing their effectiveness even if it lands. Once it's gone, guardian is without any viable builds left baring some new discovery or such a serious shakeup in the meta that an old build comes back. > > I seriously doubt much will change. If power thief were to be out then power Shiro will likely fill in its place again, even if it is a compromise on mobility in exchange for better team-fighting capabilities. This could let condi mirage come back and keep it in check but I doubt it. I agree the meta could be shaken up a bit, but I don't see it being so much so that Berserker, non holo engis, non tempest ele's, etc etc will be able to come back. One or two things might shift, but we'll still be in a stagnant state of little build variety. 40+ notifications, what the fuck. Stop quoting! I don't understand your reasoning. It can be not OP and still be incredibly easy to play. I can jump on burn guard myself and without any knowledge or combos do well in P1 (well, who can't?). No learning curve, no improvement necessary, no positioning, kiting, no anything. I don#t think it is fun to play or play against, but that's subjective as usual. It won't carry people to actually high ranks, but it will carry bad players and I don't like that. I don't think berserkers will pop up. That one was acutally quite bad and didn't do much indeed. But seeing some more mesmers without having had to buff them? More supports than warrior? Non-support warriors? Any change is a good change, so I take this as a step in the right direction. Not perfect, not a big step, but it's something.