voltaicbore.8012 Posted September 5, 2020 Share Posted September 5, 2020 I'm among those who think the impact of botting is probably minimal on the market. Although I'm pretty indifferent to the presence of PvE farming bots, _because_ of that indifference I do not want to see the kinds of changes suggested in this thread. I would think that's why folks like @"kharmin.7683" still participate in these threads even if the presence of botting doesn't bother them. Since the botting isn't a problem for us, we see nerfs to "solve" the botting problem as a penalty imposed on everyone to solve a problem that doesn't need solving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted September 5, 2020 Share Posted September 5, 2020 > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > > > > > > > . If you feel you need to keep defending and not understanding that passive gold to afk players can and will effect the market well I can't help you any more then those 3 examples I gave. > > > > > > > > I think we understand if it affects the market. The question is how significant is that impact compared to non-afk players. Given the small fraction of places that yield effective AFK farming ... it's not going to be significant at all. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No one is arguing that bots affect our ability to play the game. They don't. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, that's actually what is relevant here. If it's not a significant impact on people's ability to play and enjoy the game, it's not actually a problem. It's transparent to people that play the game. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well neither us us would know unless we left a necro in Istan for 8 hours then saw how much we got. Then multiply that by the 10 bots there and that's if they are only there 8 hours a day. The total could be significant or little affect but I or you can only speculate. All I know is any added gold from afk players can affect things in a games economy. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now whether we can play or not isn't relevant. It's can I be directly impacted in a negative way from afk farmers farming say dust. We all can. If we have 500 dust worth 10s and bots decide to farm an area that drops dust and then sell all that dust on the market everyday the price of dust goes down so we now have less value then if there were no bots. Even if it only goes down 2 silver. 2 silver x 500 is 10g. So we are impacted in a negative way. > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, there are several problems with that assessment:: > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. You don't know how much of the dust that's available on the market is due to AFK farming > > > > > > 2. the market changes price REGARDLESS of Afk farming > > > > > > 3. the price going down or up isn't a negative impact for all players. > > > > > > > > > > I'm sorry. > > > > > > > > Don't be sorry ... I'm not the one trying to convince Anet to fix AFK farming with 'market prices change and that's bad' logic to justify it. Feel sorry for those people. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yeah bad logic. > > > Here you go. > > > 20 bots farming dust all week and adding it to tp. Price drops. > > > Anet bans those 20 bots and no bots replace them > > > Over the next week is there less dust added to the market. If less dust is added to the market but demand remains the same what happens? > > > Right. The price starts to go up > > > Pretty obvious logic but ok. > > > I think bots and added gold affects the market and you must not even tho you agreed it does. I can't make this up > > > > Prices dropping/raising on the TP isn't a problem though. That's expected, EVEN if there isn't any AFK farmers. > > > > Yeah ok, The problem isn't the fluctuation of prices. It is a problem if players not actively playing the game can gain mats 24h a day to affect the prices. Well, again, it's only a problem if it had a negative impact on players. You know ... that point that no one wants to discuss. I mean, you can claim changing market prices is 'bad' for people ... but you know it isn't otherwise the market wouldn't exist because as you say: The problem isn't the fluctuation of prices. Nice back peddling. So ... if you have some negative impact you want to talk about that ISN'T about the market ... sure, let's hear it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jilora.9524 Posted September 5, 2020 Share Posted September 5, 2020 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > > > > > > > > . If you feel you need to keep defending and not understanding that passive gold to afk players can and will effect the market well I can't help you any more then those 3 examples I gave. > > > > > > > > > I think we understand if it affects the market. The question is how significant is that impact compared to non-afk players. Given the small fraction of places that yield effective AFK farming ... it's not going to be significant at all. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No one is arguing that bots affect our ability to play the game. They don't. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, that's actually what is relevant here. If it's not a significant impact on people's ability to play and enjoy the game, it's not actually a problem. It's transparent to people that play the game. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well neither us us would know unless we left a necro in Istan for 8 hours then saw how much we got. Then multiply that by the 10 bots there and that's if they are only there 8 hours a day. The total could be significant or little affect but I or you can only speculate. All I know is any added gold from afk players can affect things in a games economy. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now whether we can play or not isn't relevant. It's can I be directly impacted in a negative way from afk farmers farming say dust. We all can. If we have 500 dust worth 10s and bots decide to farm an area that drops dust and then sell all that dust on the market everyday the price of dust goes down so we now have less value then if there were no bots. Even if it only goes down 2 silver. 2 silver x 500 is 10g. So we are impacted in a negative way. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, there are several problems with that assessment:: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. You don't know how much of the dust that's available on the market is due to AFK farming > > > > > > > 2. the market changes price REGARDLESS of Afk farming > > > > > > > 3. the price going down or up isn't a negative impact for all players. > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm sorry. > > > > > > > > > > Don't be sorry ... I'm not the one trying to convince Anet to fix AFK farming with 'market prices change and that's bad' logic to justify it. Feel sorry for those people. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yeah bad logic. > > > > Here you go. > > > > 20 bots farming dust all week and adding it to tp. Price drops. > > > > Anet bans those 20 bots and no bots replace them > > > > Over the next week is there less dust added to the market. If less dust is added to the market but demand remains the same what happens? > > > > Right. The price starts to go up > > > > Pretty obvious logic but ok. > > > > I think bots and added gold affects the market and you must not even tho you agreed it does. I can't make this up > > > > > > Prices dropping/raising on the TP isn't a problem though. That's expected, EVEN if there isn't any AFK farmers. > > > > > > > Yeah ok, The problem isn't the fluctuation of prices. It is a problem if players not actively playing the game can gain mats 24h a day to affect the prices. > > Well, again, it's only a problem if it had a negative impact on players. > And it does as I showed you w examples. There's also that batch that make that heart in PoF harder because they instant kill all the mobs. That to me is a negative. To you it could be fun challenge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jilora.9524 Posted September 5, 2020 Share Posted September 5, 2020 > @"voltaicbore.8012" said: > I'm among those who think the impact of botting is probably minimal on the market. > > Although I'm pretty indifferent to the presence of PvE farming bots, _because_ of that indifference I do not want to see the kinds of changes suggested in this thread. I would think that's why folks like @"kharmin.7683" still participate in these threads even if the presence of botting doesn't bother them. Since the botting isn't a problem for us, we see nerfs to "solve" the botting problem as a penalty imposed on everyone to solve a problem that doesn't need solving. Ya well most look at things as "how does it affect me" I would rather anet ban all bots then change anything but instead of defending bots because you don't want a change to your pet or minion then say anet should just ban all bots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted September 5, 2020 Share Posted September 5, 2020 > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > > > > > > > > > . If you feel you need to keep defending and not understanding that passive gold to afk players can and will effect the market well I can't help you any more then those 3 examples I gave. > > > > > > > > > > I think we understand if it affects the market. The question is how significant is that impact compared to non-afk players. Given the small fraction of places that yield effective AFK farming ... it's not going to be significant at all. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No one is arguing that bots affect our ability to play the game. They don't. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, that's actually what is relevant here. If it's not a significant impact on people's ability to play and enjoy the game, it's not actually a problem. It's transparent to people that play the game. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well neither us us would know unless we left a necro in Istan for 8 hours then saw how much we got. Then multiply that by the 10 bots there and that's if they are only there 8 hours a day. The total could be significant or little affect but I or you can only speculate. All I know is any added gold from afk players can affect things in a games economy. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now whether we can play or not isn't relevant. It's can I be directly impacted in a negative way from afk farmers farming say dust. We all can. If we have 500 dust worth 10s and bots decide to farm an area that drops dust and then sell all that dust on the market everyday the price of dust goes down so we now have less value then if there were no bots. Even if it only goes down 2 silver. 2 silver x 500 is 10g. So we are impacted in a negative way. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, there are several problems with that assessment:: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. You don't know how much of the dust that's available on the market is due to AFK farming > > > > > > > > 2. the market changes price REGARDLESS of Afk farming > > > > > > > > 3. the price going down or up isn't a negative impact for all players. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm sorry. > > > > > > > > > > > > Don't be sorry ... I'm not the one trying to convince Anet to fix AFK farming with 'market prices change and that's bad' logic to justify it. Feel sorry for those people. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yeah bad logic. > > > > > Here you go. > > > > > 20 bots farming dust all week and adding it to tp. Price drops. > > > > > Anet bans those 20 bots and no bots replace them > > > > > Over the next week is there less dust added to the market. If less dust is added to the market but demand remains the same what happens? > > > > > Right. The price starts to go up > > > > > Pretty obvious logic but ok. > > > > > I think bots and added gold affects the market and you must not even tho you agreed it does. I can't make this up > > > > > > > > Prices dropping/raising on the TP isn't a problem though. That's expected, EVEN if there isn't any AFK farmers. > > > > > > > > > > Yeah ok, The problem isn't the fluctuation of prices. It is a problem if players not actively playing the game can gain mats 24h a day to affect the prices. > > > > Well, again, it's only a problem if it had a negative impact on players. > > > > There's also that batch that make that heart in PoF harder because they instant kill all the mobs. That to me is a negative. That is a negative ... and that can be solved by changing how mobs spawn and the conditions to finish the heart. In fact, I have also seen Anet do EXACTLY this for a Flame Legion event in core GW2 (I forget the zone) ... a much easier and more sensible approach to addressing this negative point ... and yes, people were AFK farming this because of the price of cloth at the time. Look, I'm not a fan of AFK farming ... but the fact is that nerfing how people interact with the game WITHIN the boundaries of what is acceptable because of absurd arguments about market price changes and a few heart completion locations makes no sense. You see bots messing with your ability to complete hearts? You report it. That is the mechanism and Anet has shown they fix these things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jilora.9524 Posted September 5, 2020 Share Posted September 5, 2020 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > . If you feel you need to keep defending and not understanding that passive gold to afk players can and will effect the market well I can't help you any more then those 3 examples I gave. > > > > > > > > > > > I think we understand if it affects the market. The question is how significant is that impact compared to non-afk players. Given the small fraction of places that yield effective AFK farming ... it's not going to be significant at all. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No one is arguing that bots affect our ability to play the game. They don't. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, that's actually what is relevant here. If it's not a significant impact on people's ability to play and enjoy the game, it's not actually a problem. It's transparent to people that play the game. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well neither us us would know unless we left a necro in Istan for 8 hours then saw how much we got. Then multiply that by the 10 bots there and that's if they are only there 8 hours a day. The total could be significant or little affect but I or you can only speculate. All I know is any added gold from afk players can affect things in a games economy. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now whether we can play or not isn't relevant. It's can I be directly impacted in a negative way from afk farmers farming say dust. We all can. If we have 500 dust worth 10s and bots decide to farm an area that drops dust and then sell all that dust on the market everyday the price of dust goes down so we now have less value then if there were no bots. Even if it only goes down 2 silver. 2 silver x 500 is 10g. So we are impacted in a negative way. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, there are several problems with that assessment:: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. You don't know how much of the dust that's available on the market is due to AFK farming > > > > > > > > > 2. the market changes price REGARDLESS of Afk farming > > > > > > > > > 3. the price going down or up isn't a negative impact for all players. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm sorry. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Don't be sorry ... I'm not the one trying to convince Anet to fix AFK farming with 'market prices change and that's bad' logic to justify it. Feel sorry for those people. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yeah bad logic. > > > > > > Here you go. > > > > > > 20 bots farming dust all week and adding it to tp. Price drops. > > > > > > Anet bans those 20 bots and no bots replace them > > > > > > Over the next week is there less dust added to the market. If less dust is added to the market but demand remains the same what happens? > > > > > > Right. The price starts to go up > > > > > > Pretty obvious logic but ok. > > > > > > I think bots and added gold affects the market and you must not even tho you agreed it does. I can't make this up > > > > > > > > > > Prices dropping/raising on the TP isn't a problem though. That's expected, EVEN if there isn't any AFK farmers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yeah ok, The problem isn't the fluctuation of prices. It is a problem if players not actively playing the game can gain mats 24h a day to affect the prices. > > > > > > Well, again, it's only a problem if it had a negative impact on players. > > > > > > > There's also that batch that make that heart in PoF harder because they instant kill all the mobs. That to me is a negative. > > That is a negative ... and that can be solved by changing how mobs spawn and the conditions to finish the heart. In fact, I have also seen Anet do this for a Flame Legion event in core ... a much easier and more sensible approach to addressing this negative. > > Look, I'm not a fan of AFK farming ... but the fact is that nerfing how people interact with the game WITHIN the boundaries of what is acceptable because of absurd arguments about market price changes and a few heart completion locations makes no sense. i know you aren't. You just like to argue. I'm not proposing any changes. I think bots should be removed. I do think they affect us in ways most won't notice. I'm fine if you think hey I don't like the changes by the op implemented why not just ban the bots. But some seem to shoot down everything and defend these bots as who cares don't affect me or I don't think they affect the market much when we all should want them gone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted September 5, 2020 Share Posted September 5, 2020 > @"Jilora.9524" said: > I think bots should be removed. I do as well **if** they are a significant problem ... I just don't think it makes sense to change the mechanics of how classes work to do that and other than a few heart completion areas ... No, they aren't some big problem that Anet needs to fix. I also don't think absurd arguments like mat market pricing and "it's annoying" are compelling reasons for Anet to do more than they already do to address these bots. Ironic you accuse me of just liking to argue then IMMEDIATELY after claim you aren't trying to propose any change here. Classy. No one is defending the bots ... we are defending Anet's decision to handle them as they see fit, understanding they aren't the massive problem that you people want to exaggerate them to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jilora.9524 Posted September 5, 2020 Share Posted September 5, 2020 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > I think bots should be removed. > > I do as well **if** they are a significant problem ... I just don't think it makes sense to change the mechanics of how classes work to do that and other than a few heart completion areas ... No, they aren't some big problem that Anet needs to fix. I also don't think absurd arguments like mat market pricing and "it's annoying" are compelling reasons for Anet to do more than they already do to address these bots. Ironic you accuse me of just liking to argue then IMMEDIATELY after claim you aren't trying to propose any change here. Classy. > I just gave reasons how I think it can affect players and prices. If you don't like those reasons that's ok but at least we can agree get rid of the bots would be fine with us. Oh you added stuff. I never proposed any changes. The OP did. I just said they affect stuff and should be banned Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jilora.9524 Posted September 5, 2020 Share Posted September 5, 2020 You added more. You so sneaky. You and I both don't know if the problem is minor or massive. Both are just speculating Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted September 5, 2020 Share Posted September 5, 2020 > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > I think bots should be removed. > > > > I do as well **if** they are a significant problem ... I just don't think it makes sense to change the mechanics of how classes work to do that and other than a few heart completion areas ... No, they aren't some big problem that Anet needs to fix. I also don't think absurd arguments like mat market pricing and "it's annoying" are compelling reasons for Anet to do more than they already do to address these bots. Ironic you accuse me of just liking to argue then IMMEDIATELY after claim you aren't trying to propose any change here. Classy. > > > > I just gave reasons how I think it can affect players and prices. If you don't like those reasons that's ok but at least we can agree get rid of the bots would be fine with us That's where the problem is ... I don't agree that Anet should get rid of them if they aren't a significant problem on the game ... which is probably why you see them ... because they aren't. It's not about I like your reasons or not ... it's about evidence that ALREADY exists in the game and it's history that suggests you people are making this sound like a significant problem that isn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kettering.6823 Posted September 5, 2020 Share Posted September 5, 2020 > @"Mutisija.5017" said: > only afk farmers i really want to get rid of are the ones always see hanging out at that one specific heart quest area. i hate all the other tasks for that heart, but i cant just kill bunch of enemies in order to skip all the unpleasant tasks thanks to these farmers hogging all the enemies. which one? is it the ghost heart near the wall with the cannons in Iron Marches? I always saw farmers there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jilora.9524 Posted September 5, 2020 Share Posted September 5, 2020 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > > I think bots should be removed. > > > > > > I do as well **if** they are a significant problem ... I just don't think it makes sense to change the mechanics of how classes work to do that and other than a few heart completion areas ... No, they aren't some big problem that Anet needs to fix. I also don't think absurd arguments like mat market pricing and "it's annoying" are compelling reasons for Anet to do more than they already do to address these bots. Ironic you accuse me of just liking to argue then IMMEDIATELY after claim you aren't trying to propose any change here. Classy. > > > > > > > I just gave reasons how I think it can affect players and prices. If you don't like those reasons that's ok but at least we can agree get rid of the bots would be fine with us > > That's where the problem is ... I don't agree that Anet should get rid of them if they aren't a significant problem on the game ... which is probably why you see them ... because they aren't. It's not about I like your reasons or not ... it's about evidence that ALREADY exists in the game and it's history that suggests you people are making this sound like a significant problem that isn't. How many bots would we need to be significant? I mean we get threads weekly. In PvP it seems to be pretty bad. I think it's a bigger problem then you are making it out to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mutisija.5017 Posted September 5, 2020 Share Posted September 5, 2020 > @"kettering.6823" said: > > @"Mutisija.5017" said: > > only afk farmers i really want to get rid of are the ones always see hanging out at that one specific heart quest area. i hate all the other tasks for that heart, but i cant just kill bunch of enemies in order to skip all the unpleasant tasks thanks to these farmers hogging all the enemies. > > which one? is it the ghost heart near the wall with the cannons in Iron Marches? I always saw farmers there... yeah, that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manasa Devi.7958 Posted September 5, 2020 Share Posted September 5, 2020 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > I think bots should be removed. > > I do as well **if** they are a significant problem ... I just don't think it makes sense to change the mechanics of how classes work to do that and other than a few heart completion areas ... No, they aren't some big problem that Anet needs to fix. I also don't think absurd arguments like mat market pricing and "it's annoying" are compelling reasons for Anet to do more than they already do to address these bots. "It's annoying" is actually the only reason. It's what most other arguments boil down to. Some people are annoyed because they think people are making untold riches without doing any "work" for it. Others are annoyed because of how they think it affects the market. Some are annoyed because there are apparently some places where the AFK-farmers (let's not call them bots) cause actual issues like with hearts. Some people are just annoyed because they associate it with botting and reject that on principle. If you're not annoyed, you don't have an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted September 5, 2020 Share Posted September 5, 2020 > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > > > I think bots should be removed. > > > > > > > > I do as well **if** they are a significant problem ... I just don't think it makes sense to change the mechanics of how classes work to do that and other than a few heart completion areas ... No, they aren't some big problem that Anet needs to fix. I also don't think absurd arguments like mat market pricing and "it's annoying" are compelling reasons for Anet to do more than they already do to address these bots. Ironic you accuse me of just liking to argue then IMMEDIATELY after claim you aren't trying to propose any change here. Classy. > > > > > > > > > > I just gave reasons how I think it can affect players and prices. If you don't like those reasons that's ok but at least we can agree get rid of the bots would be fine with us > > > > That's where the problem is ... I don't agree that Anet should get rid of them if they aren't a significant problem on the game ... which is probably why you see them ... because they aren't. It's not about I like your reasons or not ... it's about evidence that ALREADY exists in the game and it's history that suggests you people are making this sound like a significant problem that isn't. > How many bots would we need to be significant? I mean we get threads weekly. In PvP it seems to be pretty bad. > Number of threads are not an indication of how significant the impact AFK farmers are on the game. We aren't talking about PVP in this thread, we are talking about AFK farmers in PVE ... I don't even think PVP has AFK farmers ... why would you even bring that into the discussion? > @"Manasa Devi.7958" said: > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > > I think bots should be removed. > > > > I do as well **if** they are a significant problem ... I just don't think it makes sense to change the mechanics of how classes work to do that and other than a few heart completion areas ... No, they aren't some big problem that Anet needs to fix. I also don't think absurd arguments like mat market pricing and "it's annoying" are compelling reasons for Anet to do more than they already do to address these bots. > "It's annoying" is actually the only reason. Then it's not that big a problem as people want to make it out to be. Again, if being annoyed is the only reason ... then the current response to AFK farmers is already appropriate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kharmin.7683 Posted September 6, 2020 Share Posted September 6, 2020 > @"voltaicbore.8012" said: > I'm among those who think the impact of botting is probably minimal on the market. > > Although I'm pretty indifferent to the presence of PvE farming bots, _because_ of that indifference I do not want to see the kinds of changes suggested in this thread. I would think that's why folks like @"kharmin.7683" still participate in these threads even if the presence of botting doesn't bother them. Since the botting isn't a problem for us, we see nerfs to "solve" the botting problem as a penalty imposed on everyone to solve a problem that doesn't need solving. Thank you. > @"Jilora.9524" said: > > @"voltaicbore.8012" said: > > I'm among those who think the impact of botting is probably minimal on the market. > > > > Although I'm pretty indifferent to the presence of PvE farming bots, _because_ of that indifference I do not want to see the kinds of changes suggested in this thread. I would think that's why folks like @"kharmin.7683" still participate in these threads even if the presence of botting doesn't bother them. Since the botting isn't a problem for us, we see nerfs to "solve" the botting problem as a penalty imposed on everyone to solve a problem that doesn't need solving. > > Ya well most look at things as "how does it affect me" > I would rather anet ban all bots then change anything but instead of defending bots because you don't want a change to your pet or minion then say anet should just ban all bots. I'm not defending AFK farmers who break the ToS. The problem, IMO, is the current rules allow for players to farm without actively playing the game. As long as they are present, and can respond to a GM, ANet considers them to be playing the game. Rather than ban bots (which is already against the ToS), people ought to be advocating for changing the ToS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hash.8462 Posted September 6, 2020 Share Posted September 6, 2020 I'm for champion partols in those areas, 15 min spawn time and with the skills of Captain Rotbeard. You should be able to solo them or avoid them, but afk farmers with pets will get one shooted by his aoe skill :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katelynn.6593 Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 People get XP simply standing in an event. Also the XP at bronze medal is nothing to scoff at. Why wouldn't they want to watch YouTube instead if they're only there for the XP? As far as I'm concerned not enough people AFK for it to be a problem. I also wouldn't want punishment for no bronze medal XP, because it's possible to make the effort to contribute but still not be able to tag stuff in time. Also after Drizzlewood I feel a mix between burnt out but also a desire to still progress in the game. If I see someone AFKing at Drizzlewood, I just assume they're taking a breather, but they still want the XP. They just need a bit of a break. Being disappointed about AFKing in events that literally have no breaks is like being disappointed that people are sitting down to catch their breath after a marathon. I don't see people AFKing at events that only happen at certain times. I only see them AFKing at events that are on almost all the time. An event has never been ruined because a few people in a zerge of 50 have just stood in the event area somewhere relatively out of the enemies way looking pretty. The fact they miss out on any significant loot is punishment enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casualkenny.9817 Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 yknow what would be kinky? remember the spider that grabs u n ur bff when u first retake sun's refuge? with a more generous response time. ppl who dun even try to respond get carried to a pit and thrown inside Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Storm.6974 Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 > @"Smoosh.2718" said: > The mobs here appear to respawn every 40s. these mobs drop 1 silver 4 magic and chance for T6 materials. Aproximately 7 mobs spawn on this spot providing the player with 7s + 28 magic and potentially 91s in T6. > > Over the course of 60m this player who has not touched his keyboard has now earnt the following: > 1.05g Silver from raw gold drops > 420 magic > X amount of karma > X amount of spirit shards > Up to 13.6g from T6 drops > > So if said player stays an entire night without playing and farms this same spot all night long for 10 hours.. you can see a problem. By allowing this you are allowing other companies/players to exploit this opotunity and create farming accounts. > > Don't picture this as a long term player, picture this as a NEW player. What impression does it give you when you run into a blob of players like this? > Bots? Dead support system? RTM ("Oh i can buy gold with real money from gold sellers?!")? Cheating is ok? Using bots to play is ok? ITs a mobile like game designed to be played by not playing? > > Picture that you are going into this area for the first time and running into this: >  > Your post is wrong, you are providing entirely fake data. That farm, with Engineer, is worth about 3g per hour of drop (+ about 600 Volatile Magic and some Karma). These numbers even require the effort to summon Elite turrets as soon as the other turrets despawn. Necromancer is even worse, its gain is mostly far lower. There are people there manually summoning their turrets every 5 minutes. Since there are few farming spots that are better than others, and since people have to gather together to not be killed by mobs, ArenaNet can easily and rapidly jump from one place to another to check who is farming legitimately and who is not. Nerfing these spots would just support the real afk farmers, and would make checking if people are farming legitimately truly hard. Many people think that ArenaNet don’t care, but often the reality is that ArenaNet is just better than those people at thinking at fair and manageable solutions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aplethoraof.2643 Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 Man, anet delivers content slow enough as is. Imagine begging them to deliver content slower in order to "solve" (until another way is found) a non-issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kichwas.7152 Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 Just log out anyone AFK more than X mins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnDeadFun.5824 Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 > @"Smoosh.2718" There are maps where bots are teleporting from resource node to resource node, both above and below the map. This has been reported numerous times and has been going on for years. This type of action is far worse than afk farmers, in my humble opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kharmin.7683 Posted September 7, 2020 Share Posted September 7, 2020 > @"Kichwas.7152" said: > Just log out anyone AFK more than X mins. How do you prove this? How would Anet know if someone is truly AFK? A GM could whisper them and see if they respond. Wait... they do this already. A GM could move the character and see if they respond. Wait... they do this already. It could be that a GM checks each and every report made in game about potential AFK players. It could be that those same GMs check and get responses. Since it is their policy to not divulge the results of any probe or action, we will never know. If a player responds to GM action, then they are not breaking any rules as they are currently written. If you don't like players who appear to be AFK, then perhaps work toward Anet changing their ToS. (again, I do not advocate for those who play AFK. Neither do I play in this way, despite some here who think otherwise) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted September 8, 2020 Share Posted September 8, 2020 > @"Kichwas.7152" said: > Just log out anyone AFK more than X mins. That's already a thing you know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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