Will we ever see a Client upgrade? Like, native DX12 with multicore support?

[DoggySpew.4529]

Because the issues with Guild Wars 2 are now becoming more and more apparent. New, high tier PC's with a lot of CPU cores and top-notch GPU barely gets the game over 30fps when facing high-intensity scenarios. World of Warcraft had gotten an upgrade (quite a while ago even), so I hope this will also happen for GW2 one day. I just want to see GW2 at it's best.

[chrispy.7182]

I doubt it. I recently bought £85 worth of Gems. I ended up getting a refund because the lag was so bad on certain maps the game was just unplayable.

It is a catch 22 though. If we revolt and stop giving them money until they sort the performance issues out, then they might not bother at all... Since they aren't making any money....

[SinisterSlay.6973]

They might be working on it as a part of the next expansion. Every expansion they have had to make major changes to the engine. It's possible this time around the graphics in the new areas are just too dense, and they finally have to upgrade the engine.

[Khisanth.2948]

> @"SinisterSlay.6973" said:

> They might be working on it as a part of the next expansion. Every expansion they have had to make major changes to the engine. It's possible this time around the graphics in the new areas are just too dense, and they finally have to upgrade the engine.

 

They could do the same as PoF. Just increase the system requirements. The result is not the best but you can still brute force a lot with faster hardware.

[SinisterSlay.6973]

> @"Khisanth.2948" said:

> > @"SinisterSlay.6973" said:

> > They might be working on it as a part of the next expansion. Every expansion they have had to make major changes to the engine. It's possible this time around the graphics in the new areas are just too dense, and they finally have to upgrade the engine.

>

> They could do the same as PoF. Just increase the system requirements. The result is not the best but you can still brute force a lot with faster hardware.

 

POF had massive changes around the networking. Mounts moved too fast. And flying was a problem.

It's probably partially why all story instances, not just POF, now crash frequently, especially during cut scenes.

[Rihar.3465]

> @"chrispy.7182" said:

> I doubt it. I recently bought £85 worth of Gems. I ended up getting a refund because the lag was so bad on certain maps the game was just unplayable.

> It is a catch 22 though. If we revolt and stop giving them money until they sort the performance issues out, then they might not bother at all... Since they aren't making any money....

 

No way. Humans nature is to consume as much as possible, even if one doesn't need it at all. Otherwise large companies and services like Tik-Tok, Instagram, YouTube etc wouldn't exist. People will never stop spending money, doesn't matter how bad things are. They can quit, true, but as long as they play, they pay as well. There are exclusions however, but they are in the minority, unfortunately.

 

I quit ESO for the same reason. Insane lags, unstable game, very clunky combat system, awful animation quality and many more things. Even story and quests, which has always been a strong point of ESO, became worse and boring. But people still play and pay.

 

And do you know why? The answer is absurd, but:

**I have invested too much into this game to stop now.**

 

Addiction? No doubt. Lack of willpower? Yes. Psychological immaturity? Probably.

I don't know. But seeing how people struggle with making decisions makes me upset.

[maddoctor.2738]

Right now the game has far more important performance issues, as seen here:

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/comment/1358619/#Comment_1358619

and it's highly unlikely better DX versions would help with those as they are mostly server side. We can only wait until they fix the big issues affecting the game right now, before they try entirely new things.

[lare.5129]

dx12 ? not need it fo me and many others. But anyone casuals and hardcore players who need it already have it with side patch.

[Inoki.6048]

> @"chrispy.7182" said:

> Since they aren't making any money....

And you got this information from where exactly? I strongly doubt they aren’t making any money. I know because a lot of people I know, including myself, have left quite an amount of it in the gem store.

 

They COULD be making more money if they stopped neglecting a huge part of the community, WvW. PvE has seen the most updates, PvP some, WvW sadly close to nothing. The only “noteworthy” addition was the Warclaw, but that was something no one wanted, and it’s been nerfed to a point it’s really just a cosmetic. It feels like you move faster on foot and dismounting someone is super easy.

 

[Laila Lightness.8742]

They dont need upgrade engine they need a new engine

[lare.5129]

> @"Laila Lightness.8742" said:

> new engine

for what ?? I don't see any benefit to do this.

1)dx12 already exist whit side patch if someone need it

2)people, who feel some actual some unknown shaders and shadows already long time ago start play another games

3)possible huge amount if bugs can come if new engine come

4)any action is coast. Benefit from new engine can not be have positive money balance.

5)this is mmo game, most players can compare that we have at 486x or Pentium I 166mmmxwiht S3 0.5MB video card and what we have now. Now it better and enough. No any reason to update more.

[Dawdler.8521]

> @"lare.5129" said:

> 5)this is mmo game, most players can compare that we have at 486x or Pentium I 166mmmxwiht S3 0.5MB video card and what we have now. Now it better and enough. No any reason to update more.

Just press the turbo button to run it at 233mhz and GW2 will do fine.

 

[Zohane.7208]

> @"Inoki.6048" said:

> > @"chrispy.7182" said:

> > Since they aren't making any money....

> And you got this information from where exactly? I strongly doubt they aren’t making any money. I know because a lot of people I know, including myself, have left quite an amount of it in the gem store.

>

> They COULD be making more money if they stopped neglecting a huge part of the community, WvW. PvE has seen the most updates, PvP some, WvW sadly close to nothing. The only “noteworthy” addition was the Warclaw, but that was something no one wanted, and it’s been nerfed to a point it’s really just a cosmetic. It feels like you move faster on foot and dismounting someone is super easy.

>

I read the statement slightly differently. The full quote is:

> @"chrispy.7182" said:

> I doubt it. I recently bought £85 worth of Gems. I ended up getting a refund because the lag was so bad on certain maps the game was just unplayable.

> It is a catch 22 though. If we revolt and stop giving them money until they sort the performance issues out, then they might not bother at all... Since they aren't making any money....

The way I read it is that if we stop giving them money it might backfire since they *then* wouldn't make any money.

[chrispy.7182]

> @"Inoki.6048" said:

> > @"chrispy.7182" said:

> > Since they aren't making any money....

> And you got this information from where exactly? I strongly doubt they aren’t making any money. I know because a lot of people I know, including myself, have left quite an amount of it in the gem store.

 

You misunderstand my comment. I meant if we stop giving them money, then they probably won't bother to make any improvements, since they are no longer making any money.

 

 

[chrispy.7182]

 

> I read the statement slightly differently. The full quote is:

> > @"chrispy.7182" said:

> > I doubt it. I recently bought £85 worth of Gems. I ended up getting a refund because the lag was so bad on certain maps the game was just unplayable.

> > It is a catch 22 though. If we revolt and stop giving them money until they sort the performance issues out, then they might not bother at all... Since they aren't making any money....

> The way I read it is that if we stop giving them money it might backfire since they *then* wouldn't make any money.

 

Yes that is what I meant.

 

 

[Stormcrow.7513]

Anet has made tons of changes to the engine to improve performance over the years. Who remembers the Karka attack that left us with 3fps memories.

 

I have been using p912pxy for a while now and it helps my system. I don't think i can play the game anymore without reshade either.

 

You won't get a new engine and i would be surprised if there is a API update to DX12.

[Anchoku.8142]

I'd guess Arenanet is focusing on the next expansion followed by LW updates and PvP/WvW balance. The expansion and possibly LW are probably financed. Arenanet will need players to pay real money for the expansion to cover costs and aim for a profit. If a game engine update is a selling point, maybe they are working on it. I kind of wish they would add native VR support.

[Ashantara.8731]

> @"Khisanth.2948" said:

> > @"SinisterSlay.6973" said:

> > They might be working on it as a part of the next expansion. Every expansion they have had to make major changes to the engine. It's possible this time around the graphics in the new areas are just too dense, and they finally have to upgrade the engine.

>

> They could do the same as PoF. Just increase the system requirements.

 

That won't change a thing about the latency, which happens regardless of your high-end hardware or fast internet connection.

[Khisanth.2948]

> @"Ashantara.8731" said:

> > @"Khisanth.2948" said:

> > > @"SinisterSlay.6973" said:

> > > They might be working on it as a part of the next expansion. Every expansion they have had to make major changes to the engine. It's possible this time around the graphics in the new areas are just too dense, and they finally have to upgrade the engine.

> >

> > They could do the same as PoF. Just increase the system requirements.

>

> That won't change a thing about the latency, which happens regardless of your high-end hardware or fast internet connection.

 

Well of course client side changes aren't going to fix network and server issues. Are you trying to say DX12 would be a complete waste of time?

[Astralporing.1957]

> @"Khisanth.2948" said:

> > @"Ashantara.8731" said:

> > > @"Khisanth.2948" said:

> > > > @"SinisterSlay.6973" said:

> > > > They might be working on it as a part of the next expansion. Every expansion they have had to make major changes to the engine. It's possible this time around the graphics in the new areas are just too dense, and they finally have to upgrade the engine.

> > >

> > > They could do the same as PoF. Just increase the system requirements.

> >

> > That won't change a thing about the latency, which happens regardless of your high-end hardware or fast internet connection.

>

> Well of course client side changes aren't going to fix network and server issues. Are you trying to say DX12 would be a complete waste of time?

_Complete_ waste of time? I don't think so. Worth the effort required to implement it? Probably not.

That's because most of the engine efficiency problems lie completely elsewhere, but a rework to dx12 would be extremely costly in terms of game resources required.

 

[Zephire.8049]

> @"lare.5129" said:

> > @"Laila Lightness.8742" said:

> > new engine

> for what ?? I don't see any benefit to do this.

> 1)dx12 already exist whit side patch if someone need it

> 2)people, who feel some actual some unknown shaders and shadows already long time ago start play another games

> 3)possible huge amount if bugs can come if new engine come

> 4)any action is coast. Benefit from new engine can not be have positive money balance.

> 5)this is mmo game, most players can compare that we have at 486x or Pentium I 166mmmxwiht S3 0.5MB video card and what we have now. Now it better and enough. No any reason to update more.

 

There's no doubt that a new engine would be a huge undertaking, but GW2's engine is a _heavily_ modified GW1 engine making it 16+ years old now. It's doing things that the original engine was not designed to support and is 16+ years of code on code on code. Not only that but there's been massive leaps in tech—both in coding and hardware—since then and the gap between generations is smaller now than they were in the 00s.

 

And to illustrate just how old the engine is with another engine more people are familiar with, Unreal Engine 2 was the latest and greatest at the time with Unreal 3 still being 2+ years away at the time of GW1's engine. Unreal 5 is due out in approximately a year. Frankly it's amazing that Arenanet has managed to do so much with such an old engine, but its age is definitely showing and has been showing for a number of years now.

 

The engine will have to be updated sooner rather than later to better future-proof the game and make development easier so while the upfront resources may be higher for a new engine compared to "just" adding DX12, it will be cheaper in the long run. Also, the engine was written when single-core CPUs were the norm which is why GW2 cannot utilize multiple cores even though the majority of CPUs on the market for the past 10 years have been multi-core. It's much more likely that letting the game utilize multiple cores will provide a greater impact to more player than going from DX9 to DX12, especially as the CPU is generally the location where game performance bottlenecks.

[knite.1542]

Probably not.

[wrathmagik.3518]

This game still looks better and performs better then 90% of the other mmo's out there. You ever played wow when alot of things are on screen? Chug chug chug. Just like gw2. And thats just raid scenarios at times. They're new open world events (rip off of gw2 events) makes it worse.

 

I think we should just be grateful for what we have, and if you want better performance the answer is very simple. Open up your wallet and buy a faster CPU.

[Hannelore.8153]

Its really not that bad, and upgrading to DX12 wouldn't fix it, that's a myth.

 

Everything available in newer APIs is always provided to older APIs via vendor extension. In fact, the features were around before those APIs were even developed, how do you think they ended up being needed? The whole "using a newer version of DirectX makes it look better" is marketing propoganda, all DX11/DX12 features predated it and that's how they became standardised.

 

Yes, DX12 does make *threading* easier, but its not a magic bullet. Threading isn't just free speed, it has its own issues. Games can be written to be fully threaded and end up slower than single-threaded if the design isn't very good and stalls out alot on shared resources.

 

What dx12pxy and DXVK do is pretty much as good as you're going to get.

 

The core of the problem is that GW2's game world is just too detailed. It tries to have the detail level of an FPS while being an MMO. If you look at other MMOs, almost none of them look like this (especially WoW), they cut alot of corners on graphics and favor engine qualities like animation over detail. This gives the illusion that the game worlds are more detailed than they really are, its an age-old game developer's trick. That's why if you take a still image of say, ESO or FF14, they'll actually look worse, but they look better *in motion*.

 

This is why, for example, the effects that players complain about like infusions are standard-issue equipment in other games, because animated textures, lighting effects, and smooth movement can make lower levels of detail unnoticeable during gameplay.

 

This isn't done in GW2 because the devs envisioned it as using more traditional artwork, like a living painting.

 

(The biggest problem affecting GW2 right now is lack of server side optimisations and limiting effects, ironically.)

[Lord of the Fire.6870]

I don't think it will come GW3 is ad this point more likely the game has too many problems, Yes in theory you can do a lot of optimization on server and client side with dx12 , multi threading, avx2 support. But there is the question of cost and how long will the game be around in the future ?

 

Before I mention what kind of problem the game has can you envision what the game would look whit ray tracing which comes with dx12 ultimate? unplayable thanks to all the infusion and legendary effects. Okay yes the open world would look much nicer.