STIHL.2489 Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > So what classifies as "core content" for PvP and PvE? > The division between unranked, ranked and leagues is completely independent of the content itself - you play either completely the same, and if somebody has shown you a video of a PvP game, in most cases you wouldn't even be able to tell which mode it was made in. All of these modes are practically the same content, the division lies not in the content itself, but in what people you want to play that content with and against. > That's why i said Ascension is a core reward. You do have a point that having it available only through league _is_ a limiting factor. Still, a SPvP player can get it without changing the way they play at all. > Well, just to put this out.. the League is the Core and Intended sPvP Content, as E-Sport League Play what the whole intent behind sPvP to exist at all, the hot joins and private arean's are more 'practice' areas to learn the maps and the like, but those are in essence "side content" not the core game. In GW2, Raids are an offshoot addition limited to just HoT and not part of the _Core Game_ at all. Which makes them side content of an expansion. If ever there was a "Bad Move" to limit something like _Legendary Armor_ like that, that was it. At the very least they should have Put in a PoF method of attainment if for no other reason then to boost sales for that expansion as well. Which.. turning back a bit, I hate to see it, but this is just one more then that makes PoF really look like a half-baked expansion at this point, and shows a decrease in quality and content for their expansion work going from HoT to PoF, which I hope does not set a trend for them, as that will hurt them in the long and short run if they plan on putting out more expansions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > So what classifies as "core content" for PvP and PvE? > The division between unranked, ranked and leagues is completely independent of the content itself - you play either completely the same, and if somebody has shown you a video of a PvP game, in most cases you wouldn't even be able to tell which mode it was made in. All of these modes are practically the same content, the division lies not in the content itself, but in what people you want to play that content with and against. > That's why i said Ascension is a core reward. You do have a point that having it available only through league _is_ a limiting factor. Still, a SPvP player can get it without changing the way they play at all. I see your point. However, the gameplay differences between hotjoin, unranked, and league play are more noticeable than you would imagine. Although all 3 generally fall under the Conquest gametype (with the exception of TDM or Stronghold), there are many variations between the 3. Saying that a PvP player can get The Ascension without changing the way they play is a fair inaccurate representation as it generalizes the differences in division, gametype, and player skill. 1. In hotjoins, there is fairly no incentive to cap points or win the match. You'll notice one of three things. One, players clustering towards the middle trying to kill each other. Two, players roaming around the edges of the map, going from point to point avoiding combat. Three, players who have no idea what to do in PvP. 2. In unranked, you'll see many players learning how to play Conquest properly. There is still fairly low incentive to win, so you'll see many players running off-meta builds and not caring about rotations or objectives. 3. In ranked, here you'll see the biggest differences in playstyles and individual skill. The lower you go in division, the more matches begin to look like hotjoins. So, with legendary being the highest tier of player skill, bronze would be the lowest. With bruisers, roamers, and team-fight oriented builds, you have a wide array of complicated rotations and matchups to play around in higher levels of Conquest. 4. This doesn't even take into account that the achievements for the Ascension _require_ a player to change the way they play. Every tier requires **X amount of matches per class** in **Ranked/League**. So, no. I would not call the Ascension a core reward as it very clearly requires an sPvP player to change the way they play. > > Finding an example of a "core" pve gameplay is a bit harder, because it is much more divided and fragmented mode than SPvP and WvW are. Still, if you want an example of a core pve legendary, look at weapons. There's a "core" core set (gen1), and an "expansion" core set (gen2) now. > > > The whole point that Ad Infinitum isn't **the** PvE legendary backpiece because you have to do Fractals in order to get it (which happens to be PvE content) is absolutely terrible. It is the **only** PvE legendary backpiece, hence it is **the** PvE legendary backpiece. > Apparently, we think in a completely different way. I would never call something put in a content most pve players don't play to be "the pve legendary". I feel about it as you'd probably feel if SPvP legendaries (both armor and backpack) didn't exist, and people would be calling Warbringer and legendary Triumphant armor "the PVP legendaries". > > > > Yes, we do think differently. Ad Infinitum is definitely **the** PvE legendary backpiece because it is the **only** PvE legendary backpiece. There are no other legendary backpieces available in PvE so it stands to reason that it _does_ represent all of PvE. Even though I explained above the differences between the PvP gametypes above, I still view The Ascension as **the** PvP legendary backpiece the same way I view Warbringer for WvW and Ad Infinitum for PvE. Also, even if Ardent Glorious Armor and The Ascension didn't exist, I 100% disagree with the fact that people would call Warbringer and Sublime Mistforged Armor "the PvP legendaries" as WvW and PvP are two entirely separate gamemodes with drastically different structures. Instead, they would simply be called "the WvW legendaries." If this _were_ the case, with PvE having Envoy and Ad Infinitum, WvW having Sublime and Warbringer, and PvP legendaries didn't exist, I'd wager that PvPers would **definitely** be outraged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tails.9372 Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > Sure. > > If Raids and Fractals of the Mist are considered as "side-content" in PvE... > and Leagues are considered as "side-content" in PvP... > It must stand to reason that Battlegrounds and Borderlands are "side-content" in WvW. > > You are unable to earn Warbringer through any other WvW content asides from Battlegrounds/Borderlands, just as how... > You are unable to earn Ad Infinitum through any other PvE content asides from Fractals... > You are unable to earn The Ascension through any other PvP content asides from Leagues... But this is not an answer to my question. Do you **have to** play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Do you **have to** play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. You can skip the vast majority of WvW content if you want to have the legendary WvW backpack while it's also available though the vast majority of WvW content. You just can't say the same about Ad Infinitum or the raid armor. > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > Also, even if Ardent Glorious Armor and The Ascension didn't exist, I 100% disagree with the fact that people would call Warbringer and Sublime Mistforged Armor "the PvP legendaries" as WvW and PvP are two entirely separate gamemodes with drastically different structures. So that's where you draw the line? Different gameplay structures? Then how is sPvP and WvW different enough to warrant this kind of separation while raids and SAB don't? This seams to be quite the hypocritical stance to take don't you think? sPvP and WvW are both PvP based gamemodes just like how raids, OW PvM and SAB are all PvE based gamemodes. That's just fact no matter how people want to call it. > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > Instead, they would simply be called "the WvW legendaries." Just like how the Envoy set is called the raid armor and Ad Infinitum is called the fractal backpack because that's where the majority of the focus lies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 > @"Tails.9372" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > Sure. > > > > If Raids and Fractals of the Mist are considered as "side-content" in PvE... > > and Leagues are considered as "side-content" in PvP... > > It must stand to reason that Battlegrounds and Borderlands are "side-content" in WvW. > > > > You are unable to earn Warbringer through any other WvW content asides from Battlegrounds/Borderlands, just as how... > > You are unable to earn Ad Infinitum through any other PvE content asides from Fractals... > > You are unable to earn The Ascension through any other PvP content asides from Leagues... > But this is not an answer to my question. Do you **have to** play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Do you **have to** play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. You can skip the vast majority of WvW content if you want to have the legendary WvW backpack while it's also available though the vast majority of WvW content. You just can't say the same about Ad Infinitum or the raid armor. Are you kidding?? LOL Why don't you do your research a little more before you start telling other people they're wrong. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Warbringer https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/WvW_Skirmish_Claim_Ticket https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Skirmish_reward_track Yes, you do **have to** play Battlegrounds or Borderlands in order to get Warbringer. The fact that you said otherwise just shows how severe your lack of knowledge is on the subject. > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > Also, even if Ardent Glorious Armor and The Ascension didn't exist, I 100% disagree with the fact that people would call Warbringer and Sublime Mistforged Armor "the PvP legendaries" as WvW and PvP are two entirely separate gamemodes with drastically different structures. > So that's where you draw the line? Different gameplay structures? Then how is sPvP and WvW different enough to warrant this kind of separation while raids and SAB don't? This seams to be quite the hypocritical stance to take don't you think? sPvP and WvW are both PvP based gamemodes just like how raids, OW PvM and SAB are all PvE based gamemodes. That's just fact no matter how people want to call it. WvW and sPvP are obviously, extremely different gamemodes. Saying otherwise is flat out wrong no matter how you look at it. It's really quite easy to tell the differences but I'll list a few because you seem to have troubling understand that sPvP and WvW are not even remotely similar. Similarities: 1. It's Player vs. Player Differences: 1. sPvP has a stat system tied to amulets and runes while WvW has a stat system tied to gear. 2. Conquest in sPvP has 3 nodes while WvW has many different objectives to fight over. 3. The scoring system 4. The amount of players per map 5. Literally everything else. > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > Instead, they would simply be called "the WvW legendaries." > Just like how the Envoy set is called the raid armor and Ad Infinitum is called the fractal backpack because that's where the majority of the focus lies. Most people just call Envoy armor, "legendary armor," because its really the only legendary set that Anet put any effort into developing. Ad Infinitum may be called the "fractal backpack," but that doesn't change the fact that it's not **the** PvE legendary backpiece. I don't know how hard it is to understand, but Ad Infinitum is the **only** PvE legendary backpiece, so it is **the** PvE legendary backpiece. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voltekka.2375 Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 > @"Tails.9372" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > Sure. > > > > If Raids and Fractals of the Mist are considered as "side-content" in PvE... > > and Leagues are considered as "side-content" in PvP... > > It must stand to reason that Battlegrounds and Borderlands are "side-content" in WvW. > > > > You are unable to earn Warbringer through any other WvW content asides from Battlegrounds/Borderlands, just as how... > > You are unable to earn Ad Infinitum through any other PvE content asides from Fractals... > > You are unable to earn The Ascension through any other PvP content asides from Leagues... > But this is not an answer to my question. Do you **have to** play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Do you **have to** play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. You can skip the vast majority of WvW content if you want to have the legendary WvW backpack while it's also available though the vast majority of WvW content. You just can't say the same about Ad Infinitum or the raid armor. > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > Also, even if Ardent Glorious Armor and The Ascension didn't exist, I 100% disagree with the fact that people would call Warbringer and Sublime Mistforged Armor "the PvP legendaries" as WvW and PvP are two entirely separate gamemodes with drastically different structures. > So that's where you draw the line? Different gameplay structures? Then how is sPvP and WvW different enough to warrant this kind of separation while raids and SAB don't? This seams to be quite the hypocritical stance to take don't you think? sPvP and WvW are both PvP based gamemodes just like how raids, OW PvM and SAB are all PvE based gamemodes. That's just fact no matter how people want to call it. > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > Instead, they would simply be called "the WvW legendaries." > Just like how the Envoy set is called the raid armor and Ad Infinitum is called the fractal backpack because that's where the majority of the focus lies. Warbringer can only be obtained through borderlands/EB. As eotm isnt part of the mist war, its not regarded as wvw, hence NO pips (rightly so). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tails.9372 Posted March 17, 2018 Share Posted March 17, 2018 > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > The fact that you are said otherwise just shows how severe your lack of knowledge is on the subject. It just shows a severe lack of reading skills on your part. I never asked what "side content" can you play in order to obtain Warbringer, I asked which side content do you have to play in order to obtain Warbringer. Of course you actually have to play WvW in order to get the backpack but you having to list the majority of the content just proves the point that there isn't any particular side content you actually have to engage in in order to get the legendary gear unlike the PvE stuff where you have to play specific side content in order to get the respective items. > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > you seem to have troubling understand that sPvP and WvW are not even remotely similar Except I never said they had anything in common besides being PvP based (in fact the whole point was that they're just as different as OW PvE and SAB) which brings us back to the first point I made in this comment. > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > Warbringer can only be obtained through borderlands/EB. As eotm isnt part of the mist war, its not regarded as wvw, hence NO pips (rightly so). This has nothing to do with my post and doesn't stand in contradiction to anything I said so what's your point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 > @"Tails.9372" said: > > Warbringer can only be obtained through borderlands/EB. As eotm isnt part of the mist war, its not regarded as wvw, hence NO pips (rightly so). > **This has nothing to do with my post** and doesn't stand in contradiction to anything I said so what's your point? It has everything to do with your post as you blantantly stated the opposite. > @"Tails.9372" said: > Do you **have to** play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Do you **have to** play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. It's common for people to get extremely defensive when they are outed as being completely wrong. You stated that you do not have to play either Battlegrounds nor Borderlands to get Warbringer. This statement is 100% incorrect and I pointed it out and backed it up with proof. > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > Yes, you do **have to** play Battlegrounds or Borderlands in order to get Warbringer. The fact that you said otherwise just shows how severe your lack of knowledge is on the subject. > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Warbringer > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/WvW_Skirmish_Claim_Ticket > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Skirmish_reward_track Your entire argument is now based off of the differences between the words "can" and "do" which is both childish and an attempt to deflect the focus from your severe lack of knowledge to semantics. You were obviously wrong and people noticed and called you out for it. Just admit you have no idea what you're talking about and move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tails.9372 Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > It's common for people to get extremely defensive when they are outed as being completely wrong. Ah that's why you're ignoring my points and are trying to put words into my mouth. Thank's for clearing that up but as others already told you throwing ad hominems around dosen't help the discussion... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STIHL.2489 Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 While I stand by what I originally said.. this is what Anet wants to do, and the choice is take it or leave. I will say, I think it is bad form to make **THE** PvE Legendary Armor, only obtainable though a niche content in an expansion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 > @"Tails.9372" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > It's common for people to get extremely defensive when they are outed as being completely wrong. > Ah that's why you're ignoring my points and are trying to put words into my mouth. Thank's for clearing that up but as others already told you throwing ad hominems around dosen't help the discussion... Thank's but no thank's. (lol) I very clearly quoted your exact messages in my responses. No one has nor is trying to, put words in your mouth. The complete and utter nonsense you read all came directly from the source (you). Also, there's no need to address your backtracking at all. Even more so when you say stuff like: > @"Tails.9372" said: > But this is not an answer to my question. Do you **have to** play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Do you **have to** play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. Yes, you do **have to** play Battlegrounds/Borderlands in order to get Warbringer. -cough- _severe lack of knowledge_ -cough- You obviously have no idea what you're talking about. That's not ad hominem, that's a fact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 > @"STIHL.2489" said: > While I stand by what I originally said.. this is what Anet wants to do, and the choice is take it or leave. > > I will say, I think it is bad form to make **THE** PvE Legendary Armor, only obtainable though a niche content in an expansion. I think I understand this decision ... because armor obtained in PVE is used for WvW. From a gameplay decision, it attaches a story to the armor, which it wouldn't do in WvW. This can't be ignored as Anet does seem to do their best to connect things with they story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STIHL.2489 Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > @"Tails.9372" said: > > But this is not an answer to my question. Do you **have to** play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Do you **have to** play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. > > Yes, you do **have to** play Battlegrounds/Borderlands in order to get Warbringer. -cough- _severe lack of knowledge_ -cough- > > You obviously have no idea what you're talking about. That's not ad hominem, that's a fact. No, they have you on this one. What they mean is, you can get Warbringer and never set foot in EB, and just do Borderlands, **OR**, you can only do EB and never set foot in a borderland **OR**, Never set foot outside your home borderland, and still get the Backitem. Their point is that you are not forced to do EB for example if you don't want to. And they kinda of have you on that one, because it's true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linken.6345 Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > @"Linken.6345" said: > > > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > > > @"Linken.6345" said: > > > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > > > @"Linken.6345" said: > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > > You won't continue because you _can't_. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well yeah. After you insist to call a game mode "1/3rd" despite huge differences in player base, content updates and whatnot, there really isn't much I *can* do beside offering a metaphor illustrating the absurdity of your claim (which you ignored). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are 3 gamemodes. PvE is one of them. Hence it is 1 out of the 3 gamemodes. It's really quite simple. Just because one gamemode has a higher population doesn't make it "more" of a gamemode than another. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So what is PvE then? 83.4/100th of a gamemode? LUL > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your position is so far off any game design reality that there simply isn't any base for a debate. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is what I'm talking about, you have nothing else to add. The fact that you consider PvE "more" of a gamemode than the others simply because of a higher population, coupled with the fact that you can't seem to understand that legendary armor skins are exclusive to PvE, just serves to prove how little sense you actually make. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **I never said it's because of higher population**. The higher population is a result, not a cause. The cause is the overall design of the game. It has much, MUCH more content in PvE than anything else. Upon character creation you're dropped into short PvE instance which serves as a basic tutorial and is followed up by your personal story, which, again, is PvE. Under the normal levelling experience, WvW is introduced as late as level 60 and PvP at level 80. The major updates the game receives, the expansions and the Living World Seasons, extend the personal story and the open world of the game, PvE features. Really, it's not that hard to put it all together. It's a PvE game. Yes, it *supports* two pvp game modes, and even does pretty well in them. But to expect them to be treated on even grounds with PvE is unrealistic and naive. That's not the intent of the game, it never was, and it won't be. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes you did. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > > > > > You won't continue because you _can't_. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well yeah. **After you insist to call a game mode "1/3rd" despite huge differences in player base**, content updates and whatnot, there really isn't much I *can* do beside offering a metaphor illustrating the absurdity of your claim (which you ignored). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You also said it's because of content updates and "whatnot." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **Oh, and before I forget again, your made-up term "legendary skin".** There's no such thing in this game. There's legendary gear, the defining feature of which is the ability to stat-swap on demand. Access to this function on armor *IS* available through both sPvP and WvW. Fact. And there are the exclusive skins, which may or may not be tied to said function. Exclusive skins are found everywhere, across all 3 game modes, and outside of them, in the gemstore. You're just making up an excuse because for some reason you decided you're entitled to get a specific exclusive skin without playing the respective content. It would be *exactly* the same if I was asking for The Ascension to be obtainable through, say, world bosses in open world. It doesn't matter that there's Ad Infinitum, because I'm asking for the specific skin - *exactly* what you do. The only difference is, I actually don't. Because I'm well aware of the need of exclusive rewards. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Legendary_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Taken from the Official Guild Wars 2 Wiki on Legendary Armor, "Acquisition of the **PvE sets with their unique skins** is linked to raids..." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Made-up term" LUL > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The legendary backpieces aren't an issue because: > > > > > > > > > - PvE has Ad Infinitum > > > > > > > > > - PvP has The Ascension > > > > > > > > > - WvW has Warbringer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Everyone is happy because they all have their own legendary backpieces exclusive to their respective gamemodes. However, there is only _one_ way to obtain the legendary armor skins, and that is through PvE. Thus, WvWers and PvPers are left out/upset/excluded/-insert synonym for dissatisfied here-. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But you're entirely right that I have nothing to add. All this I've told time and again. And it gets ignored, as I'm sure it will get ignored again. **Because you're not looking for a debate. You're looking for free shinies.** However, this game, like any successful game, is ran by people who actually understand game design. So you won't be getting your free shinies. Deal with it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > > > > I'd be more than happy to continue debating this topic with you. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote me saying that I'm looking for free shinies. You're literally making things up and putting words into my mouth to make up for the fact that the only thing you've been saying this entire time is, "You're wrong." Yet you've failed time and time again to actually prove it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote me where I'm exaggerating. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote me on my absurd claims. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You can't. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Nice cherry picking. Also, strawman. I was listing obvious indications, I didn't say I was listing reasons. :) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nice. I cherry picked the fact that you said (that you never said) that pve is more than 1/3 of the available gamemodes due to it having a higher population. So yes, I cherry picked out a blantant lie and supported it with a quote from you that proved me correct. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It's not strawman when I didn't misrepresent your argument in any way. I literally quoted you as the response. LUL so if you're saying what I quoted is strawman, you're calling yourself a liar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. I still don't see anywhere the term "legendary skin". I see "legendary armor" and "unique skin", but not "legendary skin". :) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think if you were to go into LA map chat and say that legendary skins don't exist, you'd be laughed out of the game. Legendary skins clearly exist and the fact that you say otherwise just proves how delusional you are. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. It's almost like PvE has Envoy, WvW has Sublime Misforged and PvP has Ardent Glorious Armor. What a shocking coincidence! :lol: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious Armor is just a reskin of Glorious Hero Armor. It looks almost completely identical. Sublime Mistforged is a reskin of the Triumphant Hero Armor (again, almost completely identical) with only the chest piece having an added effect. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My point still stands. The only way to obtain PvE exclusive legendary armor skins is through PvE. The other 2 gamemodes do not have access to the transforming effects as what's available are essentially lazy reskins of already existing ones. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. Nah, I won't bother. It's all there already. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Exactly. You can't quote me because there isn't any. Called it. :] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just saying "it's there," doesn't mean it actually is. Burden of proof lies with the claimant, not the defender. Thus, saying that I'm exaggerating and incorrect, then failing to provide _any_ proof or quotes as to why it is so, is one of the _biggest_ logical fallacies. It's too bad you're entire argument sucks, hence why you can't actually provide a single piece of evidence to back up your claims. > > > > > > > > > > > > The skins you have for the spvp and wvw legendary upgrades are excluseive to those game modes aswell come again with something else please. > > > > > > The fact that you can get the same skins as ascended dont matter its still exlusive. > > > > > > > > > > Yes the skins are exclusive to their game mode, but you have got to admit it's really cheeky that they did not get any kind of graphical upgrade going to legendary. > > > > > > > > It took them what 2 years to make the raid ones? So if they start now we should see the wvw in march 2019 and spvp march 2020 boy that would be fun. > > > > I admit its kinda kitten that they made the new tech then only used it for 3 sets of full armor tho. > > > > > > > > Edit > > > > but the poster I quoted said only pve have exclusive legendary skin, when infact both the other legendary functioality skins are excluseive to their content aswell. > > > > Working on the wvw myself lvl189 of 2k so getting there ;) > > > > > > No. This is wrong. T2 and T3 skins in wvw ARE exclusive. Theyre not LEGENDARY exclusive. If we were to compare stuff, think of it as the pve precursor (ascended) skin being the same as the legendary skin of the envoy armor. > > > > Since you agree with me how can you say Im wrong? I never said that the skin was legendary exclusive were did you read that? > > I just said that the skin that was used on each of the legendary armors were exlusive to the content content were you aquired them. > > > > Just becouse its the same as the t2 and t3 skin dont take away the exclusivity of the legendary reskin. > > Remember they were originaly not even suposed to be in game and was inserted becouse alot of wvwer and spvper complained that their respective game modes dident have access to legendary functionality. > > > You somehow confused Mode exclusive with "functionality" exclusive. Is envoy armor Mode (pve content) exclude? Yes. Is envoy armor "functionality" exclusive(Meaning, is everyone who wears envoy armor guaranteed to have made legendary pve armor) ? Yes. > Is T3 wvw armor mode exclusive? Yes. Is T3 wvw armor "functionality" exclusive? Of course not. Also, above, you wrote "The fact that you can get the same skins as ascended dont matter its still exlusive.". That statement contradicts the exclusiveness... > Do you see the difference? > So please tell me were in pve I can get the t3 wvw armor since it aint wvw exclusive and the spvp armor aswell. Your reading to much into what I typed mate. I said they are exclusive to the mode of wvw not that they were only used on the legendary gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > @"Tails.9372" said: > > > But this is not an answer to my question. Do you **have to** play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Do you **have to** play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. > > > > Yes, you do **have to** play Battlegrounds/Borderlands in order to get Warbringer. -cough- _severe lack of knowledge_ -cough- > > > > You obviously have no idea what you're talking about. That's not ad hominem, that's a fact. > > No, they have you on this one. What they mean is, you can get Warbringer and never set foot in EB, and just do Borderlands, **OR**, you can only do EB and never set foot in a borderland **OR**, Never set foot outside your home borderland, and still get the Backitem. Their point is that you are not forced to do EB for example if you don't want to. And they kinda of have you on that one, because it's true. If that's what they meant, then sure, I agree. However, I wasn't the only one who misunderstood. Better wording such as yours would have cleared up any confusion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linken.6345 Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > @"Tails.9372" said: > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > It's common for people to get extremely defensive when they are outed as being completely wrong. > > Ah that's why you're ignoring my points and are trying to put words into my mouth. Thank's for clearing that up but as others already told you throwing ad hominems around dosen't help the discussion... > > Thank's but no thank's. (lol) > > I very clearly quoted your exact messages in my responses. No one has nor is trying to, put words in your mouth. The complete and utter nonsense you read all came directly from the source (you). > > Also, there's no need to address your backtracking at all. Even more so when you say stuff like: > > > @"Tails.9372" said: > > But this is not an answer to my question. Do you **have to** play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Do you **have to** play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. > > Yes, you do **have to** play Battlegrounds/Borderlands in order to get Warbringer. -cough- _severe lack of knowledge_ -cough- > > You obviously have no idea what you're talking about. That's not ad hominem, that's a fact. If your going to quote someone atleast dont cut up the quote. Tails.9372 But this is not an answer to my question. Do you have to play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Do you have to play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. You can skip the vast majority of WvW content if you want to have the legendary WvW backpack while it's also available though the vast majority of WvW content. You just can't say the same about Ad Infinitum or the raid armor. Do you have to play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Answer correct you can get it only playing in the 3 borderlands. Do you have to play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. Answer correct you can get it only playing in ethernal battlegrounds. Edit I see it was already pointed out before I posted and thread got updated for me, maybe next time read the full section before jumping ha got you in the first 2 out of 3 lines? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 > @"Linken.6345" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > @"Tails.9372" said: > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > It's common for people to get extremely defensive when they are outed as being completely wrong. > > > Ah that's why you're ignoring my points and are trying to put words into my mouth. Thank's for clearing that up but as others already told you throwing ad hominems around dosen't help the discussion... > > > > Thank's but no thank's. (lol) > > > > I very clearly quoted your exact messages in my responses. No one has nor is trying to, put words in your mouth. The complete and utter nonsense you read all came directly from the source (you). > > > > Also, there's no need to address your backtracking at all. Even more so when you say stuff like: > > > > > @"Tails.9372" said: > > > But this is not an answer to my question. Do you **have to** play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Do you **have to** play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. > > > > Yes, you do **have to** play Battlegrounds/Borderlands in order to get Warbringer. -cough- _severe lack of knowledge_ -cough- > > > > You obviously have no idea what you're talking about. That's not ad hominem, that's a fact. > > **If your going to quote someone atleast dont cut up the quote.** > > Tails.9372 > But this is not an answer to my question. Do you have to play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Do you have to play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. You can skip the vast majority of WvW content if you want to have the legendary WvW backpack while it's also available though the vast majority of WvW content. You just can't say the same about Ad Infinitum or the raid armor. > > Do you have to play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Answer correct you can get it only playing in the 3 borderlands. > Do you have to play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. Answer correct you can get it only playing in ethernal battlegrounds. > > Edit > I see it was already pointed out before I posted and thread got updated for me, maybe next time read the full section before jumping ha got you in the first 2 out of 3 lines? Read up a bit more and/or click "show previous quotes" in the one below. > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > @"Tails.9372" said: > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > Sure. > > > > > > If Raids and Fractals of the Mist are considered as "side-content" in PvE... > > > and Leagues are considered as "side-content" in PvP... > > > It must stand to reason that Battlegrounds and Borderlands are "side-content" in WvW. > > > > > > You are unable to earn Warbringer through any other WvW content asides from Battlegrounds/Borderlands, just as how... > > > You are unable to earn Ad Infinitum through any other PvE content asides from Fractals... > > > You are unable to earn The Ascension through any other PvP content asides from Leagues... > > But this is not an answer to my question. Do you **have to** play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Do you **have to** play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. You can skip the vast majority of WvW content if you want to have the legendary WvW backpack while it's also available though the vast majority of WvW content. You just can't say the same about Ad Infinitum or the raid armor. > > Are you kidding?? LOL > > Why don't you do your research a little more before you start telling other people they're wrong. > > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Warbringer > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/WvW_Skirmish_Claim_Ticket > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Skirmish_reward_track > > Yes, you do **have to** play Battlegrounds or Borderlands in order to get Warbringer. The fact that you said otherwise just shows how severe your lack of knowledge is on the subject. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linken.6345 Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > @"Linken.6345" said: > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > @"Tails.9372" said: > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > It's common for people to get extremely defensive when they are outed as being completely wrong. > > > > Ah that's why you're ignoring my points and are trying to put words into my mouth. Thank's for clearing that up but as others already told you throwing ad hominems around dosen't help the discussion... > > > > > > Thank's but no thank's. (lol) > > > > > > I very clearly quoted your exact messages in my responses. No one has nor is trying to, put words in your mouth. The complete and utter nonsense you read all came directly from the source (you). > > > > > > Also, there's no need to address your backtracking at all. Even more so when you say stuff like: > > > > > > > @"Tails.9372" said: > > > > But this is not an answer to my question. Do you **have to** play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Do you **have to** play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. > > > > > > Yes, you do **have to** play Battlegrounds/Borderlands in order to get Warbringer. -cough- _severe lack of knowledge_ -cough- > > > > > > You obviously have no idea what you're talking about. That's not ad hominem, that's a fact. > > > > **If your going to quote someone atleast dont cut up the quote.** > > > > Tails.9372 > > But this is not an answer to my question. Do you have to play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Do you have to play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. You can skip the vast majority of WvW content if you want to have the legendary WvW backpack while it's also available though the vast majority of WvW content. You just can't say the same about Ad Infinitum or the raid armor. > > > > Do you have to play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Answer correct you can get it only playing in the 3 borderlands. > > Do you have to play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. Answer correct you can get it only playing in ethernal battlegrounds. > > > > Edit > > I see it was already pointed out before I posted and thread got updated for me, maybe next time read the full section before jumping ha got you in the first 2 out of 3 lines? > > Read up a bit more. > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > @"Tails.9372" said: > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > Sure. > > > > > > > > If Raids and Fractals of the Mist are considered as "side-content" in PvE... > > > > and Leagues are considered as "side-content" in PvP... > > > > It must stand to reason that Battlegrounds and Borderlands are "side-content" in WvW. > > > > > > > > You are unable to earn Warbringer through any other WvW content asides from Battlegrounds/Borderlands, just as how... > > > > You are unable to earn Ad Infinitum through any other PvE content asides from Fractals... > > > > You are unable to earn The Ascension through any other PvP content asides from Leagues... > > > But this is not an answer to my question. Do you **have to** play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Do you **have to** play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. You can skip the vast majority of WvW content if you want to have the legendary WvW backpack while it's also available though the vast majority of WvW content. You just can't say the same about Ad Infinitum or the raid armor. > > > > Are you kidding?? LOL > > > > Why don't you do your research a little more before you start telling other people they're wrong. > > > > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Warbringer > > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/WvW_Skirmish_Claim_Ticket > > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Skirmish_reward_track > > > > Yes, you do **have to** play Battlegrounds or Borderlands in order to get Warbringer. The fact that you said otherwise just shows how severe your lack of knowledge is on the subject. > If you add his first two questions with the following line s/he follows up with. You can skip the vast majority of WvW content if you want to have the legendary WvW backpack while it's also available though the vast majority of WvW content. That means that you can play any wvw map and still get the backpack. Can you play any pve map and still get ad infinitum? No I dident think so. See now why you should read the whole 3 lines instead of stoping after the second question? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 > @"Linken.6345" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > @"Linken.6345" said: > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > @"Tails.9372" said: > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > It's common for people to get extremely defensive when they are outed as being completely wrong. > > > > > Ah that's why you're ignoring my points and are trying to put words into my mouth. Thank's for clearing that up but as others already told you throwing ad hominems around dosen't help the discussion... > > > > > > > > Thank's but no thank's. (lol) > > > > > > > > I very clearly quoted your exact messages in my responses. No one has nor is trying to, put words in your mouth. The complete and utter nonsense you read all came directly from the source (you). > > > > > > > > Also, there's no need to address your backtracking at all. Even more so when you say stuff like: > > > > > > > > > @"Tails.9372" said: > > > > > But this is not an answer to my question. Do you **have to** play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Do you **have to** play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. > > > > > > > > Yes, you do **have to** play Battlegrounds/Borderlands in order to get Warbringer. -cough- _severe lack of knowledge_ -cough- > > > > > > > > You obviously have no idea what you're talking about. That's not ad hominem, that's a fact. > > > > > > **If your going to quote someone atleast dont cut up the quote.** > > > > > > Tails.9372 > > > But this is not an answer to my question. Do you have to play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Do you have to play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. You can skip the vast majority of WvW content if you want to have the legendary WvW backpack while it's also available though the vast majority of WvW content. You just can't say the same about Ad Infinitum or the raid armor. > > > > > > Do you have to play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Answer correct you can get it only playing in the 3 borderlands. > > > Do you have to play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. Answer correct you can get it only playing in ethernal battlegrounds. > > > > > > Edit > > > I see it was already pointed out before I posted and thread got updated for me, maybe next time read the full section before jumping ha got you in the first 2 out of 3 lines? > > > > Read up a bit more. > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > @"Tails.9372" said: > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > Sure. > > > > > > > > > > If Raids and Fractals of the Mist are considered as "side-content" in PvE... > > > > > and Leagues are considered as "side-content" in PvP... > > > > > It must stand to reason that Battlegrounds and Borderlands are "side-content" in WvW. > > > > > > > > > > You are unable to earn Warbringer through any other WvW content asides from Battlegrounds/Borderlands, just as how... > > > > > You are unable to earn Ad Infinitum through any other PvE content asides from Fractals... > > > > > You are unable to earn The Ascension through any other PvP content asides from Leagues... > > > > But this is not an answer to my question. Do you **have to** play Battlegrounds in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't. Do you **have to** play Borderlands in order to get Warbringer? No, you don't either. You can skip the vast majority of WvW content if you want to have the legendary WvW backpack while it's also available though the vast majority of WvW content. You just can't say the same about Ad Infinitum or the raid armor. > > > > > > Are you kidding?? LOL > > > > > > Why don't you do your research a little more before you start telling other people they're wrong. > > > > > > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Warbringer > > > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/WvW_Skirmish_Claim_Ticket > > > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Skirmish_reward_track > > > > > > Yes, you do **have to** play Battlegrounds or Borderlands in order to get Warbringer. The fact that you said otherwise just shows how severe your lack of knowledge is on the subject. > > > > If you add his first two questions with the following line s/he follows up with. > > > You can skip the vast majority of WvW content if you want to have the legendary WvW backpack while it's also available though the vast majority of WvW content. > > > That means that you can play any wvw map and still get the backpack. > Can you play any pve map and still get ad infinitum? No I dident think so. > > See now why you should read the whole 3 lines instead of stoping after the second question? Again, read up a bit more and/or click "show previous quotes." "If you're going to quote someone at least don't cut up the quote." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > Also, even if Ardent Glorious Armor and The Ascension didn't exist, I 100% disagree with the fact that people would call Warbringer and Sublime Mistforged Armor "the PvP legendaries" as WvW and PvP are two entirely separate gamemodes with drastically different structures. Instead, they would simply be called "the WvW legendaries." If this _were_ the case, with PvE having Envoy and Ad Infinitum, WvW having Sublime and Warbringer, and PvP legendaries didn't exist, I'd wager that PvPers would **definitely** be outraged. The differences between different sidecontents of PvE can actually be greater than those between SPvP and WvW. The only difference is that PvP got officially divided by devs into 2 distinct modes, while equally distinct submodes of PvE were all put into one big container. Raids and Fractals have about as much in common with LS and open world as WvW has with SPvP. If you'll continue to call Ad Infinitum and Envoy Armor **the** PvE legendaries, i'd have to insist that PvE has only one set of those, while PvP has _two_. You don't like SPvP being grouped together with WvW? Then understand that a lot of PvErs don't like to be lumped together with raiders either. And many raiders are very vocal about their dislike of many core PvE content types and modes. > @"Tails.9372" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > Instead, they would simply be called "the WvW legendaries." > Just like how the Envoy set is called the raid armor and Ad Infinitum is called the fractal backpack because that's where the majority of the focus lies. This. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tails.9372 Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > No one has nor is trying to, put words in your mouth. Then tell me, where for example have I ever said anything like "sPvP and WvW are pretty much the same"? Exactly I didn't, you just made that up. I said that sPvP and WvW are both PvP based gamemodes (which is something you actually agreed with) but that's about it. > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > "If you're going to quote someone at least don't cut up the quote." You're the last person who should quote this, what you were doing was just defining everything as "side content" in order to list the mayority of it but this doesn't tell me which one of it a nessesary is, in case you've forgotten: > @"Tails.9372" said: > Of course you actually have to play WvW in order to get the backpack but you having to list the majority of the content just proves the point that there isn't any particular side content you actually have to engage in Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crossaber.8934 Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 > @"Voltekka.2375" said: > > @"Linken.6345" said: > > > @"STIHL.2489" said: > > > > @"Linken.6345" said: > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > > > > > You won't continue because you _can't_. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well yeah. After you insist to call a game mode "1/3rd" despite huge differences in player base, content updates and whatnot, there really isn't much I *can* do beside offering a metaphor illustrating the absurdity of your claim (which you ignored). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There are 3 gamemodes. PvE is one of them. Hence it is 1 out of the 3 gamemodes. It's really quite simple. Just because one gamemode has a higher population doesn't make it "more" of a gamemode than another. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So what is PvE then? 83.4/100th of a gamemode? LUL > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your position is so far off any game design reality that there simply isn't any base for a debate. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is what I'm talking about, you have nothing else to add. The fact that you consider PvE "more" of a gamemode than the others simply because of a higher population, coupled with the fact that you can't seem to understand that legendary armor skins are exclusive to PvE, just serves to prove how little sense you actually make. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **I never said it's because of higher population**. The higher population is a result, not a cause. The cause is the overall design of the game. It has much, MUCH more content in PvE than anything else. Upon character creation you're dropped into short PvE instance which serves as a basic tutorial and is followed up by your personal story, which, again, is PvE. Under the normal levelling experience, WvW is introduced as late as level 60 and PvP at level 80. The major updates the game receives, the expansions and the Living World Seasons, extend the personal story and the open world of the game, PvE features. Really, it's not that hard to put it all together. It's a PvE game. Yes, it *supports* two pvp game modes, and even does pretty well in them. But to expect them to be treated on even grounds with PvE is unrealistic and naive. That's not the intent of the game, it never was, and it won't be. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes you did. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Feanor.2358" said: > > > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > > > You won't continue because you _can't_. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well yeah. **After you insist to call a game mode "1/3rd" despite huge differences in player base**, content updates and whatnot, there really isn't much I *can* do beside offering a metaphor illustrating the absurdity of your claim (which you ignored). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You also said it's because of content updates and "whatnot." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **Oh, and before I forget again, your made-up term "legendary skin".** There's no such thing in this game. There's legendary gear, the defining feature of which is the ability to stat-swap on demand. Access to this function on armor *IS* available through both sPvP and WvW. Fact. And there are the exclusive skins, which may or may not be tied to said function. Exclusive skins are found everywhere, across all 3 game modes, and outside of them, in the gemstore. You're just making up an excuse because for some reason you decided you're entitled to get a specific exclusive skin without playing the respective content. It would be *exactly* the same if I was asking for The Ascension to be obtainable through, say, world bosses in open world. It doesn't matter that there's Ad Infinitum, because I'm asking for the specific skin - *exactly* what you do. The only difference is, I actually don't. Because I'm well aware of the need of exclusive rewards. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Legendary_armor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Taken from the Official Guild Wars 2 Wiki on Legendary Armor, "Acquisition of the **PvE sets with their unique skins** is linked to raids..." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Made-up term" LUL > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The legendary backpieces aren't an issue because: > > > > > > > - PvE has Ad Infinitum > > > > > > > - PvP has The Ascension > > > > > > > - WvW has Warbringer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Everyone is happy because they all have their own legendary backpieces exclusive to their respective gamemodes. However, there is only _one_ way to obtain the legendary armor skins, and that is through PvE. Thus, WvWers and PvPers are left out/upset/excluded/-insert synonym for dissatisfied here-. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But you're entirely right that I have nothing to add. All this I've told time and again. And it gets ignored, as I'm sure it will get ignored again. **Because you're not looking for a debate. You're looking for free shinies.** However, this game, like any successful game, is ran by people who actually understand game design. So you won't be getting your free shinies. Deal with it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > > > > > > > I'd be more than happy to continue debating this topic with you. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote me saying that I'm looking for free shinies. You're literally making things up and putting words into my mouth to make up for the fact that the only thing you've been saying this entire time is, "You're wrong." Yet you've failed time and time again to actually prove it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote me where I'm exaggerating. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote me on my absurd claims. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You can't. > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Nice cherry picking. Also, strawman. I was listing obvious indications, I didn't say I was listing reasons. :) > > > > > > > > > > Nice. I cherry picked the fact that you said (that you never said) that pve is more than 1/3 of the available gamemodes due to it having a higher population. So yes, I cherry picked out a blantant lie and supported it with a quote from you that proved me correct. > > > > > > > > > > It's not strawman when I didn't misrepresent your argument in any way. I literally quoted you as the response. LUL so if you're saying what I quoted is strawman, you're calling yourself a liar. > > > > > > > > > > > 2. I still don't see anywhere the term "legendary skin". I see "legendary armor" and "unique skin", but not "legendary skin". :) > > > > > > > > > > I think if you were to go into LA map chat and say that legendary skins don't exist, you'd be laughed out of the game. Legendary skins clearly exist and the fact that you say otherwise just proves how delusional you are. > > > > > > > > > > > 3. It's almost like PvE has Envoy, WvW has Sublime Misforged and PvP has Ardent Glorious Armor. What a shocking coincidence! :lol: > > > > > > > > > > Ardent Glorious Armor is just a reskin of Glorious Hero Armor. It looks almost completely identical. Sublime Mistforged is a reskin of the Triumphant Hero Armor (again, almost completely identical) with only the chest piece having an added effect. > > > > > > > > > > My point still stands. The only way to obtain PvE exclusive legendary armor skins is through PvE. The other 2 gamemodes do not have access to the transforming effects as what's available are essentially lazy reskins of already existing ones. > > > > > > > > > > > 4. Nah, I won't bother. It's all there already. > > > > > > > > > > Exactly. You can't quote me because there isn't any. Called it. :] > > > > > > > > > > Just saying "it's there," doesn't mean it actually is. Burden of proof lies with the claimant, not the defender. Thus, saying that I'm exaggerating and incorrect, then failing to provide _any_ proof or quotes as to why it is so, is one of the _biggest_ logical fallacies. It's too bad you're entire argument sucks, hence why you can't actually provide a single piece of evidence to back up your claims. > > > > > > > > The skins you have for the spvp and wvw legendary upgrades are excluseive to those game modes aswell come again with something else please. > > > > The fact that you can get the same skins as ascended dont matter its still exlusive. > > > > > > Yes the skins are exclusive to their game mode, but you have got to admit it's really cheeky that they did not get any kind of graphical upgrade going to legendary. > > > > It took them what 2 years to make the raid ones? So if they start now we should see the wvw in march 2019 and spvp march 2020 boy that would be fun. > > I admit its kinda kitten that they made the new tech then only used it for 3 sets of full armor tho. > > > > Edit > > but the poster I quoted said only pve have exclusive legendary skin, when infact both the other legendary functioality skins are excluseive to their content aswell. > > Working on the wvw myself lvl189 of 2k so getting there ;) > > No. This is wrong. T2 and T3 skins in wvw ARE exclusive. Theyre not LEGENDARY exclusive. If we were to compare stuff, think of it as the pve precursor (ascended) skin being the same as the legendary skin of the envoy armor. The wvw armor are exclusively ugly to begin with, look at obsidian weapon as well, they are never designed with the same affort level as to all RAID exclusive weapon and armor. I personally don’t want the same legendary armor skin for wvw or pvp, but the overall lower quality of pvp / wvw skin do pissed me off. Competitive players are not 2nd class citizens of gw2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 > @"Tails.9372" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > No one has nor is trying to, put words in your mouth. > Then tell me, where for example have I ever said anything like "sPvP and WvW are pretty much the same"? Exactly I didn't, you just made that up. I said that sPvP and WvW are both PvP based gamemodes (which is something you actually agreed with) but that's about it. "How are PvP and WvW **different enough** to warrant this kind of separation." Then I proceeded to list several of the ways PvP and WvW are "different enough." > @"Tails.9372" said: > So that's where you draw the line? Different gameplay structures? Then how is sPvP and WvW different enough to warrant this kind of separation while raids and SAB don't? > > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > "If you're going to quote someone at least don't cut up the quote." > You're the last person who should quote this, what you were doing was just defining everything as "side content" in order to list the mayority of it but this doesn't tell me which one of it a nessesary is, in case you've forgotten: You're completely missing the point. Someone said that The Ascension wasn't **the** PvE legendary backpiece because you had to do "side content" (raids) to get it. That doesn't make any sense. So, I said that every gamemode has their own "side content" that are required in order to make their respective legendary backpieces. My point was, it doesn't matter what you need to do to get them, the fact that there is only one PvE legendary backpiece makes it **the** PvE legendary backpiece. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 > @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > Also, even if Ardent Glorious Armor and The Ascension didn't exist, I 100% disagree with the fact that people would call Warbringer and Sublime Mistforged Armor "the PvP legendaries" as WvW and PvP are two entirely separate gamemodes with drastically different structures. Instead, they would simply be called "the WvW legendaries." If this _were_ the case, with PvE having Envoy and Ad Infinitum, WvW having Sublime and Warbringer, and PvP legendaries didn't exist, I'd wager that PvPers would **definitely** be outraged. > The differences between different sidecontents of PvE can actually be greater than those between SPvP and WvW. The only difference is that PvP got officially divided by devs into 2 distinct modes, while equally distinct submodes of PvE were all put into one big container. Raids and Fractals have about as much in common with LS and open world as WvW has with SPvP. If you'll continue to call Ad Infinitum and Envoy Armor **the** PvE legendaries, i'd have to insist that PvE has only one set of those, while PvP has _two_. > You don't like SPvP being grouped together with WvW? Then understand that a lot of PvErs don't like to be lumped together with raiders either. And many raiders are very vocal about their dislike of many core PvE content types and modes. This has nothing to do with my personal prefences on whether or not **I** don't like sPvP and WvW being grouped together. The Official Guild Wars 2 Wiki clearly classifies Raids and Fractals of the Mist as PvE content. WvW may be a PvP gamemode, but it is **not** categorized at sPvP and vice versa. You insist on grouping sPvP and WvW together when they are clearly 2 completely separate gamemodes. The fact that they are both related to PvP doesn't mean they are the same. Again, this is in contrast to Raids and Fractals being **officially classified** as PvE content. - [Raids](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Raid) (sub content) are "10 player squad-based PvE instances." - [Fractals of the Mists](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Fractals_of_the_Mists) (sub content) are "a special type of dungeon." - [Dungeons](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Dungeon) (sub content) are "optional party-based PvE instances." Meanwhile... - [WvW](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/World_versus_World) (main content) is "a combination Player versus Player/Player versus Environment." - [sPvP](https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Structured_PvP) (main content) is "a Player versus Player mode." The comparison you're making would be like saying: - "A lot of League players don't like being lumped together with sPvPers either. And many League players are very vocal about their dislike of many core sPvP content types and modes." or... - "A lot of Battlegrounds/Borderlands players don't like being lumped together with WvWers either. And many Battlegrounds/Borderlands players are very vocal about their dislike of many core WvW content types and modes." However, League players **do** consider themselves sPvPers and Battlegrounds/Borderlands players **do** consider themselves WvWers. Therefore, Raiders and Fractals of the Mists players **are** PvErs regardless of whether or not they "like/dislike" it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tails.9372 Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > "How are PvP and WvW **different enough** to warrant this kind of separation." Question: where is the punctuation mark coming from? I'm missing the "while raids and SAB don't?" part, so we're back to cutting of the quotes again... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shadowpass.4236 Posted March 18, 2018 Share Posted March 18, 2018 > @"Tails.9372" said: > > @"shadowpass.4236" said: > > "How are PvP and WvW **different enough** to warrant this kind of separation." > Question: where is the punctuation mark coming from? I'm missing the "while raids and SAB don't?" part, so we're back to cutting of the quotes again... Read down 3 lines. It's all there buddy. :] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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