Condi mesmer still no nerf

[incisorr.9502]

condi mesmer still no buff you mean

 

in today's meta where every 2nd kid is playing core guard/revenant/thief i wonder what the most op class is ele giggle. I guess its too much of a rocket science for mr @"Ben Phongluangtham.1065" to check the leaderboard and see how there are less mesmers than any other class (xcept weaver) in top 50 in the leaderboard regularly and all the time

 

currently there's 2 legendary weavers and zero mesmers as i just lost my legendary due to getting matched with absolute clown players because that's also a thing

[Sampson.2403]

Condi mirage is just okay now. Without portal or mainhand sword their mobility sucks. The sage condi mesmer is the popular build and its a 1v1 / small fight side node build which the boonbeast is better at. Plus boonbeast has way better mobility.

 

When i see a axe/torch n staff condi mesmer on the other team i switch to a sword mainhand build and outplay them with mobility by decapping everything they cap and being quicker. Can't 1v1 them but i can dance around the map and plus one much better.

 

Tldr - axe/torch + staff mesmer team impact got nerfed hard because of portal. They're slow as hell around the map, and a boonbeast can do everything that they can much better.

[Solori.6025]

> @"Burnfall.9573" said:

> Power Mesmer damages are outrageous at the moment. So in other word; > @"DedalNort.3627" said:

> > Still OP so let's wait for another patch and nerfs to power mirage.

>

> +1

> I was about to create a thread about this

>

> Build included in video

>

>

 

Take this build into spvp and record your progress. I dare you

[DeadlySynz.3471]

> @"mortrialus.3062" said:

> > @"will de grijze jager.6594" said:

> > > @"Solori.6025" said:

> > > Make a boonbeast? Ranger has the best 1v1 specs in the game you shouldnt have an issue.

> >

> > Mate 1 of the best rangers that is streaming even have fought with a common condi mirage and he had no chance after the nerfs. Condi mesmer din't get nerfed almost. Don't forget nerf to an other class is also a buff for yours.

>

> Boonbeast hard counters condi mirage. Especially with boonbeast buffed to have access to double protection against both power and condition damage this patch, for some insane reason. If they're losing to condi mirage, they are not a good reanger.

 

It needs multiple hard counters, not just 1. Put it this way, it needs the same treatment every other class has got over the last couple years. It needs to be hit so hard that when the player logs on and looks at their condition mesmer, they thinks to themselves "this build has been completely decimated, there is no point in playing condition mez anymore, I mine as well just delete this toon"

 

That is what needs to happen to mesmer, at minimum.

[mortrialus.3062]

> @"DeadlySynz.3471" said:

> > @"mortrialus.3062" said:

> > > @"will de grijze jager.6594" said:

> > > > @"Solori.6025" said:

> > > > Make a boonbeast? Ranger has the best 1v1 specs in the game you shouldnt have an issue.

> > >

> > > Mate 1 of the best rangers that is streaming even have fought with a common condi mirage and he had no chance after the nerfs. Condi mesmer din't get nerfed almost. Don't forget nerf to an other class is also a buff for yours.

> >

> > Boonbeast hard counters condi mirage. Especially with boonbeast buffed to have access to double protection against both power and condition damage this patch, for some insane reason. If they're losing to condi mirage, they are not a good reanger.

>

> It needs multiple hard counters, not just 1. Put it this way, it needs the same treatment every other class has got over the last couple years. It needs to be hit so hard that when the player logs on and looks at their condition mesmer, they thinks to themselves "this build has been completely decimated, there is no point in playing condition mez anymore, I mine as well just delete this toon"

>

> That is what needs to happen to mesmer, at minimum.

 

The portal nerf alone has me thinking that.

 

It has a few other counters besides Boonbeast as well. Don't just take my word for it.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVzpKN1g1Wk

 

[Ovark.2514]

The reason we don't see the nerfs to mirage as sufficient is that mirage is NOT FUN TO PLAY AGAINST. Regardless of how strong it is, the fact that it's always stealthing and invuning and porting and blinding among others is reason enough for people to calmmor for nerfs. Of course what we really want is for Axe to not grant evade frames.

[EpicTurtle.8571]

> @"DeadlySynz.3471" said:

> > @"mortrialus.3062" said:

> > > @"will de grijze jager.6594" said:

> > > > @"Solori.6025" said:

> > > > Make a boonbeast? Ranger has the best 1v1 specs in the game you shouldnt have an issue.

> > >

> > > Mate 1 of the best rangers that is streaming even have fought with a common condi mirage and he had no chance after the nerfs. Condi mesmer din't get nerfed almost. Don't forget nerf to an other class is also a buff for yours.

> >

> > Boonbeast hard counters condi mirage. Especially with boonbeast buffed to have access to double protection against both power and condition damage this patch, for some insane reason. If they're losing to condi mirage, they are not a good reanger.

>

> It needs multiple hard counters, not just 1. Put it this way, it needs the same treatment every other class has got over the last couple years. It needs to be hit so hard that when the player logs on and looks at their condition mesmer, they thinks to themselves "this build has been completely decimated, there is no point in playing condition mez anymore, I mine as well just delete this toon"

>

> That is what needs to happen to mesmer, at minimum.

 

That's a terrible balancing perspective.

[Vieux P.1238]

> @"Ovark.2514" said:

> The reason we don't see the nerfs to mirage as sufficient is that mirage is NOT FUN TO PLAY AGAINST. Regardless of how strong it is, the fact that it's always stealthing and invuning and porting and blinding among others is reason enough for people to calmmor for nerfs. Of course what we really want is for Axe to not grant evade frames.

 

& i said it this week. No matter how many nerfs you ask or get, the real reason players have issues with mesmers is that they don't like to deal with clones & targeting the right target. So keep nerfing, result will remain the same. Plebs will still be crying on how OP mesmer is no matter how many nerf's it gets.

[Ovark.2514]

> @"Vieux P.1238" said:

> > @"Ovark.2514" said:

> > The reason we don't see the nerfs to mirage as sufficient is that mirage is NOT FUN TO PLAY AGAINST. Regardless of how strong it is, the fact that it's always stealthing and invuning and porting and blinding among others is reason enough for people to calmmor for nerfs. Of course what we really want is for Axe to not grant evade frames.

>

> & i said it this week. No matter how many nerfs you ask or get, the real reason players have issues with mesmers is that they don't like to deal with clones & targeting the right target. So keep nerfing, result will remain the same. Plebs will still be crying on how OP mesmer is no matter how many nerf's it gets.

 

You know what, you're right. Before the phantasm rework I would have been only frustrated at Mirages. Now, thanks to the ridiculous Phantasm rework, all mesmers are a slog to fight. Clones are shattering ALL THE TIME even when the mesmer isn't using a shatter skill. Back in the day it took me quite a while to nail how to fight a mesmer. It's like arena net saw that good players who didn't main mesmer had learned well how to competently contest them. They looked at that and said "oh shoot, mesmers actually have to try now. . . well, I guess we need to make it even more difficult to tell what's going on."

[Arheundel.6451]

> @"Vieux P.1238" said:

> > @"Ovark.2514" said:

> > The reason we don't see the nerfs to mirage as sufficient is that mirage is NOT FUN TO PLAY AGAINST. Regardless of how strong it is, the fact that it's always stealthing and invuning and porting and blinding among others is reason enough for people to calmmor for nerfs. Of course what we really want is for Axe to not grant evade frames.

>

> & i said it this week. No matter how many nerfs you ask or get, the real reason players have issues with mesmers is that they don't like to deal with clones & targeting the right target. So keep nerfing, result will remain the same. Plebs will still be crying on how OP mesmer is no matter how many nerf's it gets.

 

"Pleb" would stop crying if at least we would get an OP hardcounter to condi mirage...just one to curb their number...

[Vieux P.1238]

> @"Arheundel.6451" said:

> > @"Vieux P.1238" said:

> > > @"Ovark.2514" said:

> > > The reason we don't see the nerfs to mirage as sufficient is that mirage is NOT FUN TO PLAY AGAINST. Regardless of how strong it is, the fact that it's always stealthing and invuning and porting and blinding among others is reason enough for people to calmmor for nerfs. Of course what we really want is for Axe to not grant evade frames.

> >

> > & i said it this week. No matter how many nerfs you ask or get, the real reason players have issues with mesmers is that they don't like to deal with clones & targeting the right target. So keep nerfing, result will remain the same. Plebs will still be crying on how OP mesmer is no matter how many nerf's it gets.

>

> "Pleb" would stop crying if at least we would get an OP hardcounter to condi mirage...just one to curb their number...

 

There is a hard counter to condi mirage. It's call traiting for or use condi clears. Try it.. see how it goes instead of zerking your build with out it. In fact you'l see it work's well vs more then just condi mirages.

[XECOR.2814]

Mirage mains have arrived to flood the post with git gud and secure their broken spec.

[Vieux P.1238]

> @"XECOR.2814" said:

> Mirage mains have arrived to flood the post with git gud and secure their broken spec.

 

Says the necro main.

[Spartacus.3192]

> @"Vieux P.1238" said:

> > @"Arheundel.6451" said:

> > "Pleb" would stop crying if at least we would get an OP hardcounter to condi mirage...just one to curb their number...

>

> There is a hard counter to condi mirage. It's call traiting for or use condi clears. Try it.. see how it goes instead of zerking your build with out it. In fact you'l see it work's well vs more then just condi mirages.

 

Methinks you do not know what hard counter means. He means a class/spec that eats condi mirages for breakfast just like condi mirages eat Power Revs for breakfast.

 

 

 

 

[Master Ketsu.4569]

> @"FyzE.3472" said:

> Agreed. Still not enough of a nerf.

 

Actually it sort of was. Portal nerf was pretty big.

 

Problem is, they broke the class again with their new BS get out of jail free passive. Mirage might not have portal in its kit anymore, but it can now invuln for over 20 seconds straight on a 60 second cooldown. It's pretty freaking unreal.

 

Balance team refuses to nerf this spec without buffing it in some annoying way.

 

 

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

I feel bad for the mesmer mains that didn't lean hard into the one spec that is causing all the issues. All the power oriented mirage specs got their usability nerfed, and the condition builds got left alone.

 

 

> @"Vieux P.1238" said:

> & i said it this week. No matter how many nerfs you ask or get, the real reason players have issues with mesmers is that they don't like to deal with clones & targeting the right target. So keep nerfing, result will remain the same. Plebs will still be crying on how OP mesmer is no matter how many nerf's it gets.

 

That's not even the point that many of us are trying to make, though. There's a difference between being too incompetent to look at your target bar and realize that one mesmer has buffs on them the others do not have or is moving differently, and being competent enough to do that and land attacks, only to have the setup for those attacks nullified without needing to burn utilities because "kitten you".

 

There are multiple groups of people upset at the design of the spec. Singling out the least capable of them does not automatically invalidate the people who understand the mechanics and targeting and take issue for other reasons.

 

[everyman.4375]

By the way (talking to the OP), i checked and Helseth did indeed play recently (a bit) so you're at least right on something, HOWEVER he said that mesmer received the biggest nerf in history.

There's also the fact that he doesn't play anymore so his view on the meta doesn't realy mean much.

[Lincolnbeard.1735]

> @"Master Ketsu.4569" said:

> Mirage might not have portal in its kit anymore, but it can now invuln for over 20 seconds straight on a 60 second cooldown. It's pretty freaking unreal.

 

Yawn

[tinyreborn.1938]

> @"Lincolnbeard.1735" said:

> > @"Master Ketsu.4569" said:

> > Mirage might not have portal in its kit anymore, but it can now invuln for over 20 seconds straight on a 60 second cooldown. It's pretty freaking unreal.

>

> Yawn

 

He have a point , he said that even.

>t's pretty freaking unreal.

Thats is unreal to do ,relax ,just a troll

[Solori.6025]

> @"Master Ketsu.4569" said:

> > @"FyzE.3472" said:

> > Agreed. Still not enough of a nerf.

>

> Actually it sort of was. Portal nerf was pretty big.

>

> Problem is, they broke the class again with their new BS get out of jail free passive. Mirage might not have portal in its kit anymore, but it can now invuln for over 20 seconds straight on a 60 second cooldown. It's pretty freaking unreal.

>

 

>

 

Link the Spvp build that does this, then climb the ladder with it

Tired of people looking at traits without actually making and playing the build.

It's like if I said "Reaper has permanent damage buff its unreal"

Without actually linking a viable build.

And not even trying it out.

[Solori.6025]

> @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said:

> I feel bad for the mesmer mains that didn't lean hard into the one spec that is causing all the issues. All the power oriented mirage specs got their usability nerfed, and the condition builds got left alone.

>

>

FINALLY

Someone who understands. T_T

 

Edit: I wont say condition builds have been totally left alone, they have had a couple of nerfs here and there, but power mirage has been essentially cut out of existence.

And that still angers me -_-

[babazhook.6805]

> @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said:

> I feel bad for the mesmer mains that didn't lean hard into the one spec that is causing all the issues. All the power oriented mirage specs got their usability nerfed, and the condition builds got left alone.

>

>

> > @"Vieux P.1238" said:

> > & i said it this week. No matter how many nerfs you ask or get, the real reason players have issues with mesmers is that they don't like to deal with clones & targeting the right target. So keep nerfing, result will remain the same. Plebs will still be crying on how OP mesmer is no matter how many nerf's it gets.

>

> That's not even the point that many of us are trying to make, though. There's a difference between being too incompetent to look at your target bar and realize that one mesmer has buffs on them the others do not have or is moving differently, and being competent enough to do that and land attacks, only to have the setup for those attacks nullified without needing to burn utilities because "kitten you".

>

> There are multiple groups of people upset at the design of the spec. Singling out the least capable of them does not automatically invalidate the people who understand the mechanics and targeting and take issue for other reasons.

>

 

While I do not PvP , reading the threads suggests the only Condition builds one really sees in PVP are mesmer and Necro variants. Generally this leads to people traiting less Cleanses and or not paying as much attention to their UI so as to determine what they can and can not do.

 

Torment and Confusion are conditions that require a person to pay attention to something other then Cooldowns and when one should heal.

 

There also a dichotomy between the "it faceroll easy to play a condition build mesmer" while calling for changes to make it easier to face one because a person does not want to pay attention to his UI. The impression I get is people will not be happy until everyone plays power. I just can not reconcile the demand for more nerfs to the remaining condition builds when the much greater percentage of builds out there across all specs are power.

 

Now I do not play mesmer. I leveled one up to 80 via scrolls to tinker with it but could never get into the spec. I just think build diversity needs to be maintained and everyone playing power is not build diversity. Given how a Condition build can be nuetralized with cleanses, cleanses that are just as easy to use if not easier to use than the application of said condition, I feel if the few that remain are nerfed yet more they will disappear entirely.

 

 

[gebrechen.5643]

The problem isn't condi mirage. It's mirages in general.

Even as a necro you're greatly inferior to the condition application and condition "cleanse" compared to condi mirages. And they don't trade anything for this kind of gameplay. They are mobile, they are quite tanky and they even have the option to burst. As condi necro you are mostly a sitting duck, that has to facetank damage or kite while you get your conditions (or only source of damage) cleansed away.

[Axl.8924]

> @"Vieux P.1238" said:

> > @"XECOR.2814" said:

> > Mirage mains have arrived to flood the post with git gud and secure their broken spec.

>

> Says the necro main.

 

Hey im a necro main who defended condi mirage against nerf, so no stereotypes please.

 

[Solori.6025]

> @"gebrechen.5643" said:

> The problem isn't condi mirage. It's mirages in general.

> Even as a necro you're greatly inferior to the condition application and condition "cleanse" compared to condi mirages.

 

I'm not so sure about application. The number of corrupts as well as skills that apply conditions is greater on necro iirc. And cleanses is also something I would contest as necro can either convert,transfer, or cleanse. Mirage or at least the current meta build does not have that luxury and has to avoid conditions other wise it can be loaded and killed

 

>And they don't trade anything for this kind of gameplay. They are mobile, they are quite tanky and they even have the option to burst.

Correct only on the topic of condition burst. But then corrupting on necro yields a similar effect.

They are not tanky unless built to tank. Otherwise it's a matter of utilizing clones properly. And any good players know how to deny that mechanic.

They are not that mobile unless they use sword and lol that's a power weapon.

And power mesmer is essentially dead thanks to people complaining.

 

I would highly suggest to play the class vs competent players. Their is a reason mirage is absent from leaderboard representation

>As condi necro you are mostly a sitting duck, that has to facetank damage or kite while you get your conditions (or only source of damage) cleansed away.

 

If the only thing you can do on necro is sit and get your conditions cleansed might I suggest playing a power spec on something else. The necros I have seen are able to point control, add sustain in team fights, provide cover for allies, deal with boon spam. Corrupt boons on a focus target.

 

 

You know...the team fight things necro excels at

 

Edit: revisiting the necro pvp build you have more boon corrupt than any class in the game. How are you struggling?

Like it is THE best teamfighter