Atticus.7194 Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 > @"lodjur.1284" said: > > > > So you think the solution to that is to geld the ability all together and effectively remove all damage from it? Well I'm glad it's not an issue for you fighting a spellbreaker but it is an issue for all the people that want to play one. > > I think the skill needs to be buffed from the current state which I very clearly stated, the dmg is a joke, making it only trigger from single target skills would allow them to imo raise it to 100% of PvE damage instead of 25%. It should still give damage immunity vs AoE My mistake, this would honestly be an elegant solution, I'd be fine with the damage decreasing and converting into more aoe CC the most players it effects that way it always remains viable. Something like 3+ players means instead of damage aoe daze + 2 condi's removed + 2 buffs given or something. Single player = more damage encouraging personal accountability and counterplay Multiple players = more CC and aoe support encouraging team support and integration Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mighty Cole.7849 Posted December 16, 2018 Share Posted December 16, 2018 Full Counter **was** a great skill that would punish enemies for mindlessly attacking the spellbreaker. This nerf was completely unjustified. Before the patch, players didn't want to be hit by Full Counter (it hurts!). Therefore, they began to learn how to evade it. Skilled players figured out ways to bait the spellbreaker in to wasting it. Now, thanks to the wounderful logic that prevails, players can go back to spamming buttons without the fear of reprisal. If you have protection and stability, you probably won't even notice that you've been hit by Full Counter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stand The Wall.6987 Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 the worst thing about the nerf imo is the daze increase, as it practically makes the stab and prot worthless since the enemy cant do anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hugedeal.5426 Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 Do not like to comment about these things because people defending the nerf, seem to be the people that cannot see the counter coming and actually get hit by it, so i assume without our proper counter our warrior class is just a bit more disabled, so one less class to worrye about, i usually defend this, if a character is op in a specific area of the game, we nerf it to match the weaker classes, so was warrior that much op because of full counter, weren't or AREN't there better classes, harder to deal with, i think there is... it's the same why nerf condition BERSERKER in pve, was it ever a OP DPS class... wasn't there more brutal classes dealing way higher damage, some classes actually being used in raid content due to their damage and not just a CRAPPY TOOL SLAVER like warriors, we bring banners and that's it, we can ignore the warrior's damage because we only want their banners... feels like spellbreaker full counter, for me it never needed a nerf... and if it did giving us a 1.5 sec daze DOES NOT compensate for the lost damage... and it was never like our dmg was that high in pvp, was high but not comparable with other classes (some of them), but warrior are the only ones that actually got the nerf hammer this bad... starts to feel like WoW warrior class, it got so nerfed it wasn't and still isn't usable in raids... i think at this point having a class warrior in any mmorpg is not worth it, they never managed to actually design the class properly, they build it then they destroy it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartacus.3192 Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 I'll say it again. People would complain less if ANET made the following changes. 1. Make Full Counter damage ONLY the person triggering it. If its a clone or minion or trap or pet then the NPC AND the enemy player gets hit. 2. Make the range 600 in order to reliably hit the ONE enemy. 3. Increase the damage back to what it was at POF release (since only one player gets hit its no longer an AOE bomb). Then the good players who see the animation and stop attacking will not be punished by FC. Button smashers will be punished. Overall damage is nerfed since it is no longer AOE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiranslee.4829 Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 > @"Spartacus.3192" said: > I'll say it again. People would complain less if ANET made the following changes. > > 1. Make Full Counter damage ONLY the person triggering it. If its a clone or minion or trap or pet then the NPC AND the enemy player gets hit. > 2. Make the range 600 in order to reliably hit the ONE enemy. > 3. Increase the damage back to what it was at POF release (since only one player gets hit its no longer an AOE bomb). > > Then the good players who see the animation and stop attacking will not be punished by FC. Button smashers will be punished. > Overall damage is nerfed since it is no longer AOE. I kinda disagree with you, and here is why. I feel like FC was made to save you from institutions where you are per say, outnumbered and it was punishing when adding +x. My exp is, when you fight skilled player FC is almost impossible to pop since those good players know already how it works and do not blindly spam skills. Every time i get hit by fc, all i can say is , i deserved it, every single time. But to me its quite clear why its nerfed - so many bad to terrible players who cant stop spamming skills in combat , got slaped back for that spam type of play, they all come here and QQ all the time , and since majority of players are just generic wvw blobling who spam everything on cd, anet goes to "help" majority. They are trying to balance game to the point skill and exp of player is all for nothing, so that any generic random player can compete with long time veteran. Times ago when active skills and active play was deciding factor for the win, are gone, now days, every single class is made around passive play. How you trait and gear your character (runes, sigils) is 95% of your fight rest is auto attack , and in war case luck if your skill actually hits the target :D . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartacus.3192 Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 > @"kiranslee.4829" said: >My exp is, when you fight skilled player FC is almost impossible to pop since those good players know already how it works and do not blindly spam skills. > Every time i get hit by fc, all i can say is , i deserved it, every single time. > I disagree with this statement. I play Spellbreaker and Holo a lot. I know how to avoid an enemy FC. 99% of the time i get hit by enemy FC is because some player next to me was spamming buttons and i got caught as collateral damage. I certainly NEVER say i deserve it. How could i if i didnt trigger it?? The 1% of the time i do get hit by FC is because the enemy Spellbreaker was really good and timed his FC properly when i was executing a telegraphed skill that i couldnt cancel in time because he popped his FC at the last millisecond. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cloud Windfoot Omega.7485 Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 > @"Spartacus.3192" said: > > @"kiranslee.4829" said: > >My exp is, when you fight skilled player FC is almost impossible to pop since those good players know already how it works and do not blindly spam skills. > > Every time i get hit by fc, all i can say is , i deserved it, every single time. > > > > I disagree with this statement. I play Spellbreaker and Holo a lot. I know how to avoid an enemy FC. 99% of the time i get hit by enemy FC is because some player next to me was spamming buttons and i got caught as collateral damage. > I certainly NEVER say i deserve it. How could i if i didnt trigger it?? > > The 1% of the time i do get hit by FC is because the enemy Spellbreaker was really good and timed his FC properly when i was executing a telegraphed skill that i couldnt cancel in time because he popped his FC at the last millisecond. > > what is situational awareness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonkeyHaxor.4052 Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > @"Blocki.4931" said: > > The skill had a nerf coming for a long time. > > > > I'm a warrior main and even I can say that. It's a harsh nerf for sure, but don't ignore what the skill is primarily used for and that is blocking damage and dealing some yourself. It still resets your F1, it still gives you stacks of Berserker's Power... But now we all get reminded that core warrior is and has been better for a long time now and more people might just start playing that again. > > You're like the abused house wife "I know he broke my jaw but I've just been reminded that handwriting is a better form of communication and has been for a long time" > > Just no. > > If a spec exists it needs to be viable and this unnecessary short sighted ham fisted nerf is way too heavy (I literally can't even kill mes clones and phantasms with it now, it's a kitten joke) and doesn't really address the problems with spellbreak. Spellbreaker is still hugely viable. Instead of complaining find an alternate build to what was nerfed. I can link you if you want when i get home, just send me a pm and i'll message you the build. Please stop complaining about warrior being bad, when it isnt. This is how games become unbalanced, because of uninformed kneejerk reactions to changes. I always wondered how anet's balance degraded so much since pre-hot, but since i started reading this forum i now understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedShark.9548 Posted December 22, 2018 Share Posted December 22, 2018 > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > @"Blocki.4931" said: > > > The skill had a nerf coming for a long time. > > > > > > I'm a warrior main and even I can say that. It's a harsh nerf for sure, but don't ignore what the skill is primarily used for and that is blocking damage and dealing some yourself. It still resets your F1, it still gives you stacks of Berserker's Power... But now we all get reminded that core warrior is and has been better for a long time now and more people might just start playing that again. > > > > You're like the abused house wife "I know he broke my jaw but I've just been reminded that handwriting is a better form of communication and has been for a long time" > > > > Just no. > > > > If a spec exists it needs to be viable and this unnecessary short sighted ham fisted nerf is way too heavy (I literally can't even kill mes clones and phantasms with it now, it's a kitten joke) and doesn't really address the problems with spellbreak. > > Spellbreaker is still hugely viable. Instead of complaining find an alternate build to what was nerfed. I can link you if you want when i get home, just send me a pm and i'll message you the build. Please stop complaining about warrior being bad, when it isnt. This is how games become unbalanced, because of uninformed kneejerk reactions to changes. I always wondered how anet's balance degraded so much since pre-hot, but since i started reading this forum i now understand. Well since anet listens to the forum so much warriors are basically forced to beg to not be nerfed anymore, just look at the mesmer forum, all they do is crying that their class is weak, and look where it has gotten them? Toptier for months in all aspects of the game. And recent nerfs didnt even hit the obnoxious condi mirage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atticus.7194 Posted December 25, 2018 Share Posted December 25, 2018 > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > @"Blocki.4931" said: > > > The skill had a nerf coming for a long time. > > > > > > I'm a warrior main and even I can say that. It's a harsh nerf for sure, but don't ignore what the skill is primarily used for and that is blocking damage and dealing some yourself. It still resets your F1, it still gives you stacks of Berserker's Power... But now we all get reminded that core warrior is and has been better for a long time now and more people might just start playing that again. > > > > You're like the abused house wife "I know he broke my jaw but I've just been reminded that handwriting is a better form of communication and has been for a long time" > > > > Just no. > > > > If a spec exists it needs to be viable and this unnecessary short sighted ham fisted nerf is way too heavy (I literally can't even kill mes clones and phantasms with it now, it's a kitten joke) and doesn't really address the problems with spellbreak. > > Spellbreaker is still hugely viable. Instead of complaining find an alternate build to what was nerfed. I can link you if you want when i get home, just send me a pm and i'll message you the build. Please stop complaining about warrior being bad, when it isnt. This is how games become unbalanced, because of uninformed kneejerk reactions to changes. I always wondered how anet's balance degraded so much since pre-hot, but since i started reading this forum i now understand. Uh my dude, a 75% nerf to THE CORE skill of an entire class is a kneejerk response. It's kinda hard to "find an alternate" build for spellbreaker when the single defining skill of the entire spec is no longer functional. Sure I could go core warrior but that's just not fun considering 75% of the time your gap closers just dont work right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonkeyHaxor.4052 Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > > @"Blocki.4931" said: > > > > The skill had a nerf coming for a long time. > > > > > > > > I'm a warrior main and even I can say that. It's a harsh nerf for sure, but don't ignore what the skill is primarily used for and that is blocking damage and dealing some yourself. It still resets your F1, it still gives you stacks of Berserker's Power... But now we all get reminded that core warrior is and has been better for a long time now and more people might just start playing that again. > > > > > > You're like the abused house wife "I know he broke my jaw but I've just been reminded that handwriting is a better form of communication and has been for a long time" > > > > > > Just no. > > > > > > If a spec exists it needs to be viable and this unnecessary short sighted ham fisted nerf is way too heavy (I literally can't even kill mes clones and phantasms with it now, it's a kitten joke) and doesn't really address the problems with spellbreak. > > > > Spellbreaker is still hugely viable. Instead of complaining find an alternate build to what was nerfed. I can link you if you want when i get home, just send me a pm and i'll message you the build. Please stop complaining about warrior being bad, when it isnt. This is how games become unbalanced, because of uninformed kneejerk reactions to changes. I always wondered how anet's balance degraded so much since pre-hot, but since i started reading this forum i now understand. > > Uh my dude, a 75% nerf to THE CORE skill of an entire class is a kneejerk response. It's kinda hard to "find an alternate" build for spellbreaker when the single defining skill of the entire spec is no longer functional. > > Sure I could go core warrior but that's just not fun considering 75% of the time your gap closers just dont work right. > > OK, i stopped reading these forums because it got boring but i came back and saw that you replied. Why does everything on this class have to do an insane amount of damage? why can some skills not be utility? full counter is still a fucking unblockable daze, for 1.5 seconds. How is this at all bad? it gives you stability, protection, and a half second evade. It blocks one attack. How is this skill bad??? I dont understand??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hitman.5829 Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > > > @"Blocki.4931" said: > > > > > The skill had a nerf coming for a long time. > > > > > > > > > > I'm a warrior main and even I can say that. It's a harsh nerf for sure, but don't ignore what the skill is primarily used for and that is blocking damage and dealing some yourself. It still resets your F1, it still gives you stacks of Berserker's Power... But now we all get reminded that core warrior is and has been better for a long time now and more people might just start playing that again. > > > > > > > > You're like the abused house wife "I know he broke my jaw but I've just been reminded that handwriting is a better form of communication and has been for a long time" > > > > > > > > Just no. > > > > > > > > If a spec exists it needs to be viable and this unnecessary short sighted ham fisted nerf is way too heavy (I literally can't even kill mes clones and phantasms with it now, it's a kitten joke) and doesn't really address the problems with spellbreak. > > > > > > Spellbreaker is still hugely viable. Instead of complaining find an alternate build to what was nerfed. I can link you if you want when i get home, just send me a pm and i'll message you the build. Please stop complaining about warrior being bad, when it isnt. This is how games become unbalanced, because of uninformed kneejerk reactions to changes. I always wondered how anet's balance degraded so much since pre-hot, but since i started reading this forum i now understand. > > > > Uh my dude, a 75% nerf to THE CORE skill of an entire class is a kneejerk response. It's kinda hard to "find an alternate" build for spellbreaker when the single defining skill of the entire spec is no longer functional. > > > > Sure I could go core warrior but that's just not fun considering 75% of the time your gap closers just dont work right. > > > > > > OK, i stopped reading these forums because it got boring but i came back and saw that you replied. Why does everything on this class have to do an insane amount of damage? why can some skills not be utility? full counter is still a kitten unblockable daze, for 1.5 seconds. How is this at all bad? it gives you stability, protection, and a half second evade. It blocks one attack. How is this skill bad??? I dont understand??? What do we gain? * Protection is given only if you trait for it * It does not block an attack, it only mitigates direct damage, conditions will still do damage. * 2.5 sec of stability * 0.5 sec evade * 1.5 Sec daze * Unblockable What do lose? * Ability to to gain 21% damage via berserker's power * Cleansing ire will only remove 1 condition instead of 3 * Burst do minimal damage * Adrenal healing is harder to achieve (must land 3 burst in a row to get full benefits) Warrior is all about bursting. The warrior design is heavily influenced by burst, so choosing SP as the specialization makes us lose a 21% damage modifier and instead our burst do 7% damage. Not only that, but with SP burst do minimal damage which means we lose even more damage. AS an example: Evicerate in certain PvE map does: * Level 3 adrenaline 584 damage * Level 1 adrenaline 390 damage So, if you calculate the percent damage lost we get: (390/584 - 1) * 100% = -33% With the SB specialization we are losing 33% damage and on top of that we are still getting nerf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ButterPeanut.9746 Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 > @"Hitman.5829" said: > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > > > > @"Blocki.4931" said: > > > > > > The skill had a nerf coming for a long time. > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm a warrior main and even I can say that. It's a harsh nerf for sure, but don't ignore what the skill is primarily used for and that is blocking damage and dealing some yourself. It still resets your F1, it still gives you stacks of Berserker's Power... But now we all get reminded that core warrior is and has been better for a long time now and more people might just start playing that again. > > > > > > > > > > You're like the abused house wife "I know he broke my jaw but I've just been reminded that handwriting is a better form of communication and has been for a long time" > > > > > > > > > > Just no. > > > > > > > > > > If a spec exists it needs to be viable and this unnecessary short sighted ham fisted nerf is way too heavy (I literally can't even kill mes clones and phantasms with it now, it's a kitten joke) and doesn't really address the problems with spellbreak. > > > > > > > > Spellbreaker is still hugely viable. Instead of complaining find an alternate build to what was nerfed. I can link you if you want when i get home, just send me a pm and i'll message you the build. Please stop complaining about warrior being bad, when it isnt. This is how games become unbalanced, because of uninformed kneejerk reactions to changes. I always wondered how anet's balance degraded so much since pre-hot, but since i started reading this forum i now understand. > > > > > > Uh my dude, a 75% nerf to THE CORE skill of an entire class is a kneejerk response. It's kinda hard to "find an alternate" build for spellbreaker when the single defining skill of the entire spec is no longer functional. > > > > > > Sure I could go core warrior but that's just not fun considering 75% of the time your gap closers just dont work right. > > > > > > > > > > OK, i stopped reading these forums because it got boring but i came back and saw that you replied. Why does everything on this class have to do an insane amount of damage? why can some skills not be utility? full counter is still a kitten unblockable daze, for 1.5 seconds. How is this at all bad? it gives you stability, protection, and a half second evade. It blocks one attack. How is this skill bad??? I dont understand??? > > What do we gain? > * Protection is given only if you trait for it > * It does not block an attack, it only mitigates direct damage, conditions will still do damage. > * 2.5 sec of stability > * 0.5 sec evade > * 1.5 Sec daze > * Unblockable > > What do lose? > * Ability to to gain 21% damage via berserker's power > * Cleansing ire will only remove 1 condition instead of 3 > * Burst do minimal damage > * Adrenal healing is harder to achieve (must land 3 burst in a row to get full benefits) > > Warrior is all about bursting. The warrior design is heavily influenced by burst, so choosing SP as the specialization makes us lose a 21% damage modifier and instead our burst do 7% damage. > > Not only that, but with SP burst do minimal damage which means we lose even more damage. > AS an example: > Evicerate in certain PvE map does: > * Level 3 adrenaline 584 damage > * Level 1 adrenaline 390 damage > > So, if you calculate the percent damage lost we get: > (390/584 - 1) * 100% = -33% > > With the SB specialization we are losing 33% damage and on top of that we are still getting nerf. But you also gain Pure strike, attackers insight and magebane. From a pure damage standpoint, spb will out damage core warrior. Just not while focusing on full counter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hitman.5829 Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 > @"ButterPeanut.9746" said: > > @"Hitman.5829" said: > > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > > > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > > > > > @"Blocki.4931" said: > > > > > > > The skill had a nerf coming for a long time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm a warrior main and even I can say that. It's a harsh nerf for sure, but don't ignore what the skill is primarily used for and that is blocking damage and dealing some yourself. It still resets your F1, it still gives you stacks of Berserker's Power... But now we all get reminded that core warrior is and has been better for a long time now and more people might just start playing that again. > > > > > > > > > > > > You're like the abused house wife "I know he broke my jaw but I've just been reminded that handwriting is a better form of communication and has been for a long time" > > > > > > > > > > > > Just no. > > > > > > > > > > > > If a spec exists it needs to be viable and this unnecessary short sighted ham fisted nerf is way too heavy (I literally can't even kill mes clones and phantasms with it now, it's a kitten joke) and doesn't really address the problems with spellbreak. > > > > > > > > > > Spellbreaker is still hugely viable. Instead of complaining find an alternate build to what was nerfed. I can link you if you want when i get home, just send me a pm and i'll message you the build. Please stop complaining about warrior being bad, when it isnt. This is how games become unbalanced, because of uninformed kneejerk reactions to changes. I always wondered how anet's balance degraded so much since pre-hot, but since i started reading this forum i now understand. > > > > > > > > Uh my dude, a 75% nerf to THE CORE skill of an entire class is a kneejerk response. It's kinda hard to "find an alternate" build for spellbreaker when the single defining skill of the entire spec is no longer functional. > > > > > > > > Sure I could go core warrior but that's just not fun considering 75% of the time your gap closers just dont work right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > OK, i stopped reading these forums because it got boring but i came back and saw that you replied. Why does everything on this class have to do an insane amount of damage? why can some skills not be utility? full counter is still a kitten unblockable daze, for 1.5 seconds. How is this at all bad? it gives you stability, protection, and a half second evade. It blocks one attack. How is this skill bad??? I dont understand??? > > > > What do we gain? > > * Protection is given only if you trait for it > > * It does not block an attack, it only mitigates direct damage, conditions will still do damage. > > * 2.5 sec of stability > > * 0.5 sec evade > > * 1.5 Sec daze > > * Unblockable > > > > What do lose? > > * Ability to to gain 21% damage via berserker's power > > * Cleansing ire will only remove 1 condition instead of 3 > > * Burst do minimal damage > > * Adrenal healing is harder to achieve (must land 3 burst in a row to get full benefits) > > > > Warrior is all about bursting. The warrior design is heavily influenced by burst, so choosing SP as the specialization makes us lose a 21% damage modifier and instead our burst do 7% damage. > > > > Not only that, but with SP burst do minimal damage which means we lose even more damage. > > AS an example: > > Evicerate in certain PvE map does: > > * Level 3 adrenaline 584 damage > > * Level 1 adrenaline 390 damage > > > > So, if you calculate the percent damage lost we get: > > (390/584 - 1) * 100% = -33% > > > > With the SB specialization we are losing 33% damage and on top of that we are still getting nerf. > > But you also gain Pure strike, attackers insight and magebane. From a pure damage standpoint, spb will out damage core warrior. Just not while focusing on full counter. The traits that you mentioned cannot compete with the strength line. Warriors often opt for the Defence, Discipline, SP build, given that warrior is held hostage by Defence and discipline in competitive modes. In the current meta , Warriors are forced to chose between strength or SB in competitive modes. * Pure strike will do 7% critical damage because the boon spam is out of control. Sigil of cruelty gives you 16.66% critical damage, so it is better to equip that sigil than that useless trait. * Attacker's insight: you need to remove 5 boons to get full benefit. It can be done in large scale fight with no problem, but it is somehow tedious to achieve in a 1 vs 1 scenario. * Megabane is good nothing bad to say about this trait. Those traits that you mentioned cannot compete with the strength traits. To start off, * peak performance gives you 10% damage on ANY target, unlike megabane that gives you the benefit only in 1 target. * Forceful great sword gives you 10% more damage * And berserker power gives you 21% damage on a 3 bar adrenaline. As you can see, going SP we lose significant damage because warrior is held hostage by defence and discipline. 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ButterPeanut.9746 Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 > @"Hitman.5829" said: > > @"ButterPeanut.9746" said: > > > @"Hitman.5829" said: > > > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > > > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > > > > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > > > > > > @"Blocki.4931" said: > > > > > > > > The skill had a nerf coming for a long time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm a warrior main and even I can say that. It's a harsh nerf for sure, but don't ignore what the skill is primarily used for and that is blocking damage and dealing some yourself. It still resets your F1, it still gives you stacks of Berserker's Power... But now we all get reminded that core warrior is and has been better for a long time now and more people might just start playing that again. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You're like the abused house wife "I know he broke my jaw but I've just been reminded that handwriting is a better form of communication and has been for a long time" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just no. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If a spec exists it needs to be viable and this unnecessary short sighted ham fisted nerf is way too heavy (I literally can't even kill mes clones and phantasms with it now, it's a kitten joke) and doesn't really address the problems with spellbreak. > > > > > > > > > > > > Spellbreaker is still hugely viable. Instead of complaining find an alternate build to what was nerfed. I can link you if you want when i get home, just send me a pm and i'll message you the build. Please stop complaining about warrior being bad, when it isnt. This is how games become unbalanced, because of uninformed kneejerk reactions to changes. I always wondered how anet's balance degraded so much since pre-hot, but since i started reading this forum i now understand. > > > > > > > > > > Uh my dude, a 75% nerf to THE CORE skill of an entire class is a kneejerk response. It's kinda hard to "find an alternate" build for spellbreaker when the single defining skill of the entire spec is no longer functional. > > > > > > > > > > Sure I could go core warrior but that's just not fun considering 75% of the time your gap closers just dont work right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > OK, i stopped reading these forums because it got boring but i came back and saw that you replied. Why does everything on this class have to do an insane amount of damage? why can some skills not be utility? full counter is still a kitten unblockable daze, for 1.5 seconds. How is this at all bad? it gives you stability, protection, and a half second evade. It blocks one attack. How is this skill bad??? I dont understand??? > > > > > > What do we gain? > > > * Protection is given only if you trait for it > > > * It does not block an attack, it only mitigates direct damage, conditions will still do damage. > > > * 2.5 sec of stability > > > * 0.5 sec evade > > > * 1.5 Sec daze > > > * Unblockable > > > > > > What do lose? > > > * Ability to to gain 21% damage via berserker's power > > > * Cleansing ire will only remove 1 condition instead of 3 > > > * Burst do minimal damage > > > * Adrenal healing is harder to achieve (must land 3 burst in a row to get full benefits) > > > > > > Warrior is all about bursting. The warrior design is heavily influenced by burst, so choosing SP as the specialization makes us lose a 21% damage modifier and instead our burst do 7% damage. > > > > > > Not only that, but with SP burst do minimal damage which means we lose even more damage. > > > AS an example: > > > Evicerate in certain PvE map does: > > > * Level 3 adrenaline 584 damage > > > * Level 1 adrenaline 390 damage > > > > > > So, if you calculate the percent damage lost we get: > > > (390/584 - 1) * 100% = -33% > > > > > > With the SB specialization we are losing 33% damage and on top of that we are still getting nerf. > > > > But you also gain Pure strike, attackers insight and magebane. From a pure damage standpoint, spb will out damage core warrior. Just not while focusing on full counter. > > The traits that you mentioned cannot compete with the strength line. Warriors often opt for the Defence, Discipline, SP build, given that warrior is held hostage by Defence and discipline in competitive modes. In the current meta , Warriors are forced to chose between strength or SB in competitive modes. > > * Pure strike will do 7% critical damage because the boon spam is out of control. Sigil of cruelty gives you 16.66% critical damage, so it is better to equip that sigil than that useless trait. > * Attacker's insight: you need to remove 5 boons to get full benefit. It can be done in large scale fight with no problem, but it is somehow tedious to achieve in a 1 vs 1 scenario. > * Megabane is good nothing bad to say about this trait. > > Those traits that you mentioned cannot compete with the strength traits. > To start off, > * peak performance gives you 10% damage on ANY target, unlike megabane that gives you the benefit only in 1 target. > * Forceful great sword gives you 10% more damage > * And berserker power gives you 21% damage on a 3 bar adrenaline. > > As you can see, going SP we lose significant damage because warrior is held hostage by defence and discipline. Ya I wasn't speaking PvP strictly I guess. The meta build for the past few months has been strength/disp/Spb. Can drop defense with that setup Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borgs.6103 Posted January 4, 2019 Share Posted January 4, 2019 When Full Counter damage **traited** is lower than sword auto, you know they over-nerfed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caedmon.6798 Posted January 5, 2019 Share Posted January 5, 2019 I do understand the reasoning behind it,but as above they over nerfed it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortrialus.3062 Posted January 5, 2019 Share Posted January 5, 2019 > @"Spartacus.3192" said: > I'll say it again. People would complain less if ANET made the following changes. > > 1. Make Full Counter damage ONLY the person triggering it. If its a clone or minion or trap or pet then the NPC AND the enemy player gets hit. > 2. Make the range 600 in order to reliably hit the ONE enemy. > 3. Increase the damage back to what it was at POF release (since only one player gets hit its no longer an AOE bomb). > > Then the good players who see the animation and stop attacking will not be punished by FC. Button smashers will be punished. > Overall damage is nerfed since it is no longer AOE. Aside from right when Path of Fire Launched Spellbreakers were mostly doing sidenoding. There was a slight window where they would just run into teamfights and just spam full counter back when Discipline traits could bump it down to a 6 second cooldown. But it that was a year ago now and full counter's damage and triggering on teammates has never been a problem with the spec so dedicated to 1v1. I think the damage should just be unnerfed. Not a spellbreaker, I just fight them a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonkeyHaxor.4052 Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 > @"Hitman.5829" said: > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > > > > @"Blocki.4931" said: > > > > > > The skill had a nerf coming for a long time. > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm a warrior main and even I can say that. It's a harsh nerf for sure, but don't ignore what the skill is primarily used for and that is blocking damage and dealing some yourself. It still resets your F1, it still gives you stacks of Berserker's Power... But now we all get reminded that core warrior is and has been better for a long time now and more people might just start playing that again. > > > > > > > > > > You're like the abused house wife "I know he broke my jaw but I've just been reminded that handwriting is a better form of communication and has been for a long time" > > > > > > > > > > Just no. > > > > > > > > > > If a spec exists it needs to be viable and this unnecessary short sighted ham fisted nerf is way too heavy (I literally can't even kill mes clones and phantasms with it now, it's a kitten joke) and doesn't really address the problems with spellbreak. > > > > > > > > Spellbreaker is still hugely viable. Instead of complaining find an alternate build to what was nerfed. I can link you if you want when i get home, just send me a pm and i'll message you the build. Please stop complaining about warrior being bad, when it isnt. This is how games become unbalanced, because of uninformed kneejerk reactions to changes. I always wondered how anet's balance degraded so much since pre-hot, but since i started reading this forum i now understand. > > > > > > Uh my dude, a 75% nerf to THE CORE skill of an entire class is a kneejerk response. It's kinda hard to "find an alternate" build for spellbreaker when the single defining skill of the entire spec is no longer functional. > > > > > > Sure I could go core warrior but that's just not fun considering 75% of the time your gap closers just dont work right. > > > > > > > > > > OK, i stopped reading these forums because it got boring but i came back and saw that you replied. Why does everything on this class have to do an insane amount of damage? why can some skills not be utility? full counter is still a kitten unblockable daze, for 1.5 seconds. How is this at all bad? it gives you stability, protection, and a half second evade. It blocks one attack. How is this skill bad??? I dont understand??? > > * It does not block an attack, it only mitigates direct damage, conditions will still do damage. OK, I had a lot of problems with that post you made, but I honestly can't be bothered to respond much anymore, so i'll leave it at this. WHAT block skill in this game blocks condi damage, I want you to link me one, or tell me the name of one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cloud Windfoot Omega.7485 Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > @"Hitman.5829" said: > > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > > > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > > > > > @"Blocki.4931" said: > > > > > > > The skill had a nerf coming for a long time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm a warrior main and even I can say that. It's a harsh nerf for sure, but don't ignore what the skill is primarily used for and that is blocking damage and dealing some yourself. It still resets your F1, it still gives you stacks of Berserker's Power... But now we all get reminded that core warrior is and has been better for a long time now and more people might just start playing that again. > > > > > > > > > > > > You're like the abused house wife "I know he broke my jaw but I've just been reminded that handwriting is a better form of communication and has been for a long time" > > > > > > > > > > > > Just no. > > > > > > > > > > > > If a spec exists it needs to be viable and this unnecessary short sighted ham fisted nerf is way too heavy (I literally can't even kill mes clones and phantasms with it now, it's a kitten joke) and doesn't really address the problems with spellbreak. > > > > > > > > > > Spellbreaker is still hugely viable. Instead of complaining find an alternate build to what was nerfed. I can link you if you want when i get home, just send me a pm and i'll message you the build. Please stop complaining about warrior being bad, when it isnt. This is how games become unbalanced, because of uninformed kneejerk reactions to changes. I always wondered how anet's balance degraded so much since pre-hot, but since i started reading this forum i now understand. > > > > > > > > Uh my dude, a 75% nerf to THE CORE skill of an entire class is a kneejerk response. It's kinda hard to "find an alternate" build for spellbreaker when the single defining skill of the entire spec is no longer functional. > > > > > > > > Sure I could go core warrior but that's just not fun considering 75% of the time your gap closers just dont work right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > OK, i stopped reading these forums because it got boring but i came back and saw that you replied. Why does everything on this class have to do an insane amount of damage? why can some skills not be utility? full counter is still a kitten unblockable daze, for 1.5 seconds. How is this at all bad? it gives you stability, protection, and a half second evade. It blocks one attack. How is this skill bad??? I dont understand??? > > > > * It does not block an attack, it only mitigates direct damage, conditions will still do damage. > > OK, I had a lot of problems with that post you made, but I honestly can't be bothered to respond much anymore, so i'll leave it at this. > > WHAT block skill in this game blocks condi damage, I want you to link me one, or tell me the name of one. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Block "A blocked attack deals no damage, and other effects that would have been applied on the target are also ignored." Conditions are an effect. Full counter does not block, so it still gains any conditions applied. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cloud Windfoot Omega.7485 Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 > @"Cloud Windfoot Omega.7485" said: > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > @"Hitman.5829" said: > > > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > > > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > > > > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > > > > > > @"Blocki.4931" said: > > > > > > > > The skill had a nerf coming for a long time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm a warrior main and even I can say that. It's a harsh nerf for sure, but don't ignore what the skill is primarily used for and that is blocking damage and dealing some yourself. It still resets your F1, it still gives you stacks of Berserker's Power... But now we all get reminded that core warrior is and has been better for a long time now and more people might just start playing that again. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You're like the abused house wife "I know he broke my jaw but I've just been reminded that handwriting is a better form of communication and has been for a long time" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just no. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If a spec exists it needs to be viable and this unnecessary short sighted ham fisted nerf is way too heavy (I literally can't even kill mes clones and phantasms with it now, it's a kitten joke) and doesn't really address the problems with spellbreak. > > > > > > > > > > > > Spellbreaker is still hugely viable. Instead of complaining find an alternate build to what was nerfed. I can link you if you want when i get home, just send me a pm and i'll message you the build. Please stop complaining about warrior being bad, when it isnt. This is how games become unbalanced, because of uninformed kneejerk reactions to changes. I always wondered how anet's balance degraded so much since pre-hot, but since i started reading this forum i now understand. > > > > > > > > > > Uh my dude, a 75% nerf to THE CORE skill of an entire class is a kneejerk response. It's kinda hard to "find an alternate" build for spellbreaker when the single defining skill of the entire spec is no longer functional. > > > > > > > > > > Sure I could go core warrior but that's just not fun considering 75% of the time your gap closers just dont work right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > OK, i stopped reading these forums because it got boring but i came back and saw that you replied. Why does everything on this class have to do an insane amount of damage? why can some skills not be utility? full counter is still a kitten unblockable daze, for 1.5 seconds. How is this at all bad? it gives you stability, protection, and a half second evade. It blocks one attack. How is this skill bad??? I dont understand??? > > > > > > * It does not block an attack, it only mitigates direct damage, conditions will still do damage. > > > > OK, I had a lot of problems with that post you made, but I honestly can't be bothered to respond much anymore, so i'll leave it at this. > > > > WHAT block skill in this game blocks condi damage, I want you to link me one, or tell me the name of one. > > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Block > > "A blocked attack deals no damage, and other effects that would have been applied on the target are also ignored." > Conditions are an effect. > Full counter does not block, so it still gains any conditions applied. coincidentally, warrior can also be stunned through full counter, but you cannot stun though block (without unblockable.) full counter is a shitty block, since it doesn't do even half what a block does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonkeyHaxor.4052 Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 > @"Cloud Windfoot Omega.7485" said: > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > @"Hitman.5829" said: > > > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > > > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > > > > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > > > > > > @"Blocki.4931" said: > > > > > > > > The skill had a nerf coming for a long time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm a warrior main and even I can say that. It's a harsh nerf for sure, but don't ignore what the skill is primarily used for and that is blocking damage and dealing some yourself. It still resets your F1, it still gives you stacks of Berserker's Power... But now we all get reminded that core warrior is and has been better for a long time now and more people might just start playing that again. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You're like the abused house wife "I know he broke my jaw but I've just been reminded that handwriting is a better form of communication and has been for a long time" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just no. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If a spec exists it needs to be viable and this unnecessary short sighted ham fisted nerf is way too heavy (I literally can't even kill mes clones and phantasms with it now, it's a kitten joke) and doesn't really address the problems with spellbreak. > > > > > > > > > > > > Spellbreaker is still hugely viable. Instead of complaining find an alternate build to what was nerfed. I can link you if you want when i get home, just send me a pm and i'll message you the build. Please stop complaining about warrior being bad, when it isnt. This is how games become unbalanced, because of uninformed kneejerk reactions to changes. I always wondered how anet's balance degraded so much since pre-hot, but since i started reading this forum i now understand. > > > > > > > > > > Uh my dude, a 75% nerf to THE CORE skill of an entire class is a kneejerk response. It's kinda hard to "find an alternate" build for spellbreaker when the single defining skill of the entire spec is no longer functional. > > > > > > > > > > Sure I could go core warrior but that's just not fun considering 75% of the time your gap closers just dont work right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > OK, i stopped reading these forums because it got boring but i came back and saw that you replied. Why does everything on this class have to do an insane amount of damage? why can some skills not be utility? full counter is still a kitten unblockable daze, for 1.5 seconds. How is this at all bad? it gives you stability, protection, and a half second evade. It blocks one attack. How is this skill bad??? I dont understand??? > > > > > > * It does not block an attack, it only mitigates direct damage, conditions will still do damage. > > > > OK, I had a lot of problems with that post you made, but I honestly can't be bothered to respond much anymore, so i'll leave it at this. > > > > WHAT block skill in this game blocks condi damage, I want you to link me one, or tell me the name of one. > > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Block > > "A blocked attack deals no damage, and other effects that would have been applied on the target are also ignored." > Conditions are an effect. > Full counter does not block, so it still gains any conditions applied. That isn't what he said though, but yes you are correct... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonkeyHaxor.4052 Posted January 8, 2019 Share Posted January 8, 2019 > @"Cloud Windfoot Omega.7485" said: > > @"Cloud Windfoot Omega.7485" said: > > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > > @"Hitman.5829" said: > > > > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > > > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > > > > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > > > > > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Blocki.4931" said: > > > > > > > > > The skill had a nerf coming for a long time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm a warrior main and even I can say that. It's a harsh nerf for sure, but don't ignore what the skill is primarily used for and that is blocking damage and dealing some yourself. It still resets your F1, it still gives you stacks of Berserker's Power... But now we all get reminded that core warrior is and has been better for a long time now and more people might just start playing that again. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You're like the abused house wife "I know he broke my jaw but I've just been reminded that handwriting is a better form of communication and has been for a long time" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just no. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If a spec exists it needs to be viable and this unnecessary short sighted ham fisted nerf is way too heavy (I literally can't even kill mes clones and phantasms with it now, it's a kitten joke) and doesn't really address the problems with spellbreak. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Spellbreaker is still hugely viable. Instead of complaining find an alternate build to what was nerfed. I can link you if you want when i get home, just send me a pm and i'll message you the build. Please stop complaining about warrior being bad, when it isnt. This is how games become unbalanced, because of uninformed kneejerk reactions to changes. I always wondered how anet's balance degraded so much since pre-hot, but since i started reading this forum i now understand. > > > > > > > > > > > > Uh my dude, a 75% nerf to THE CORE skill of an entire class is a kneejerk response. It's kinda hard to "find an alternate" build for spellbreaker when the single defining skill of the entire spec is no longer functional. > > > > > > > > > > > > Sure I could go core warrior but that's just not fun considering 75% of the time your gap closers just dont work right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > OK, i stopped reading these forums because it got boring but i came back and saw that you replied. Why does everything on this class have to do an insane amount of damage? why can some skills not be utility? full counter is still a kitten unblockable daze, for 1.5 seconds. How is this at all bad? it gives you stability, protection, and a half second evade. It blocks one attack. How is this skill bad??? I dont understand??? > > > > > > > > * It does not block an attack, it only mitigates direct damage, conditions will still do damage. > > > > > > OK, I had a lot of problems with that post you made, but I honestly can't be bothered to respond much anymore, so i'll leave it at this. > > > > > > WHAT block skill in this game blocks condi damage, I want you to link me one, or tell me the name of one. > > > > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Block > > > > "A blocked attack deals no damage, and other effects that would have been applied on the target are also ignored." > > Conditions are an effect. > > Full counter does not block, so it still gains any conditions applied. > > coincidentally, warrior can also be stunned through full counter, but you cannot stun though block (without unblockable.) > > > full counter is a kitten block, since it doesn't do even half what a block does. Yes, you can get stunned through full counter, but you have to be hit by a boon rip that does no damage. There are very few of those in this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedShark.9548 Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > @"Cloud Windfoot Omega.7485" said: > > > @"Cloud Windfoot Omega.7485" said: > > > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > > > @"Hitman.5829" said: > > > > > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > > > > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > > > > > > @"DonkeyHaxor.4052" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Atticus.7194" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Blocki.4931" said: > > > > > > > > > > The skill had a nerf coming for a long time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm a warrior main and even I can say that. It's a harsh nerf for sure, but don't ignore what the skill is primarily used for and that is blocking damage and dealing some yourself. It still resets your F1, it still gives you stacks of Berserker's Power... But now we all get reminded that core warrior is and has been better for a long time now and more people might just start playing that again. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You're like the abused house wife "I know he broke my jaw but I've just been reminded that handwriting is a better form of communication and has been for a long time" > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just no. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If a spec exists it needs to be viable and this unnecessary short sighted ham fisted nerf is way too heavy (I literally can't even kill mes clones and phantasms with it now, it's a kitten joke) and doesn't really address the problems with spellbreak. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Spellbreaker is still hugely viable. Instead of complaining find an alternate build to what was nerfed. I can link you if you want when i get home, just send me a pm and i'll message you the build. Please stop complaining about warrior being bad, when it isnt. This is how games become unbalanced, because of uninformed kneejerk reactions to changes. I always wondered how anet's balance degraded so much since pre-hot, but since i started reading this forum i now understand. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Uh my dude, a 75% nerf to THE CORE skill of an entire class is a kneejerk response. It's kinda hard to "find an alternate" build for spellbreaker when the single defining skill of the entire spec is no longer functional. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sure I could go core warrior but that's just not fun considering 75% of the time your gap closers just dont work right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > OK, i stopped reading these forums because it got boring but i came back and saw that you replied. Why does everything on this class have to do an insane amount of damage? why can some skills not be utility? full counter is still a kitten unblockable daze, for 1.5 seconds. How is this at all bad? it gives you stability, protection, and a half second evade. It blocks one attack. How is this skill bad??? I dont understand??? > > > > > > > > > > * It does not block an attack, it only mitigates direct damage, conditions will still do damage. > > > > > > > > OK, I had a lot of problems with that post you made, but I honestly can't be bothered to respond much anymore, so i'll leave it at this. > > > > > > > > WHAT block skill in this game blocks condi damage, I want you to link me one, or tell me the name of one. > > > > > > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Block > > > > > > "A blocked attack deals no damage, and other effects that would have been applied on the target are also ignored." > > > Conditions are an effect. > > > Full counter does not block, so it still gains any conditions applied. > > > > coincidentally, warrior can also be stunned through full counter, but you cannot stun though block (without unblockable.) > > > > > > full counter is a kitten block, since it doesn't do even half what a block does. > > Yes, you can get stunned through full counter, but you have to be hit by a boon rip that does no damage. There are very few of those in this game. Or an unblockable booncorrupt, instantly turning that stab into fear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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