Khailyn.6248 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 > @"Strider Pj.2193" said: > > @"Rusty.9348" said: > > There was > > https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/71247/the-great-warclaw-experiment-has-officially-failed > > but I can't open it anymore. Looks like Anet is perfectly aware of the problem and they don't like it to be discussed. > > > @"Kylden Ar.3724" said: > > Of course. The lovely open forums. > > And people blamed Gaile. ? Other than Gaile isnt with the company anymore and so had nothing to do with the current discussions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LetoII.3782 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 > @"Spartacus.3192" said: > > @"Graymalkyn.8076" said: > >Anet folks didn't simply sit in a room and say "Hey...Know what would be cool...?" The Warclaw, like most changes, is in response to what a significant percentage of the population asked for. That's how businesses keep afloat...giving the customers what they want. So coming out here and saying "no one will use it" or "no one wants it" is basically the same thing as saying "I have no clue how a business is run." > > Actually the WVW community asked for many many things. I don't recall mounts being at the top. > When you said "Anet folks didn't simply sit in a room and say "Hey...Know what would be cool...?" " > > Well i agree with you. What they probably did was "Hey...you know how we could generate more gem store cash...?" And also, "we're all setup to make mounts this expansion, let's make an extra for WvW" Warclaw didn't appear as a game mode specific idea, it got a BOGO leftover from the pve mill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justine.6351 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 > @"Khailyn.6248" said: > > @"Strider Pj.2193" said: > > > @"Rusty.9348" said: > > > There was > > > https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/71247/the-great-warclaw-experiment-has-officially-failed > > > but I can't open it anymore. Looks like Anet is perfectly aware of the problem and they don't like it to be discussed. > > > > > @"Kylden Ar.3724" said: > > > Of course. The lovely open forums. > > > > And people blamed Gaile. ? > > Other than Gaile isnt with the company anymore and so had nothing to do with the current discussions. Get your facts straight. Reading comprehension, he is hinting at that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jen.6021 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 > @"Turkeyspit.3965" said: > > @"Mechanix.9315" said: > > So you basically will join wvw again in the next double xp event, not because the game mode is fun per se. > > Danikat never said that. > > > @"Mechanix.9315" said: > > The problem is that, exactly that behaviour, not your fault, well maybe a bit, because players like you seems to have huge influence in anet decisions. > You don't know that. You cannot know that. You need to swap legends and stop channeling Alex Jones. > > > @"Mechanix.9315" said: > > Its totally okay to play like you do, but because of this anet will only just keep doing these kind of low effort events to some how hide the main problem, that isnt making the game mode attractive for players like you besides just giving you things in a easy mode. > > Did you even read their post? I mean seriously, they are saying THE EXACT OPPOSITE of what you claim they said. > > You say you want to bring players into WvW, but your posts sure are working towards the opposite goal. > > LOL ok suddenly i feel attacked by a forum warrior. I dont even feel the urge to actually split the quote in multiple fragments to try to explain each one of the points to you, forum is serious bussiness huh? Its not very hard to understand, every wvw player knew this gonna happen, temporary influx of players, get the mount, get the bonus xp, and back to pveland. Anet decisions over the years were based on opinions of players who play only 1-2hrs daily, and not even everyday, and thats the path the game took, decisions based on casuals that complains, when they dont even know how to give proper feedback, because its common sense, not enough time to actually know whats happening in detail. (you can see some of my other posts, giving proper feedback on the mount and even resolving "unknown bugs" with mount hp) Thats how we ended with a business model like living story, working months in a map and a few story instances that are useless after 2 weeks, empty, dead. People who said that HoT expansion was super hard, and we ended with half-expansion PoF with solo maps fully dead too. Reddit people asking for years for the rifle meme thief, and then anet forced to create a meme spec, which every thief main player never took serious. Decisions, based on desperate attempts of making those 1-2hrs players, to play more the game, instead focusing on the players who plays a lot of time, even just 4-5hrs. Because if you ignore those players, you doomed, players will bring more players, its simple. Decisions like the current wvw situation is the most easy example to understand, its really hard to me, to think how some people still dont get it. Majority of the WvW population didnt want the mount, but we still get it, ok, the mount its here, then lets work together to fix it, to balance it. No, anet just dosent care anymore, the mount is broken, the exploits are everywhere, we didnt even have an "emergency disable" just pve players and skins in gemstore. Do u understand something? if not then just its pointless, feel free to answer me if want, i wont. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simonoly.4352 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 The key to keeping WvW alive isn't enticing PvE players with promises of riches, but actually drawing new players to the game that want to get involved in WvW. Social PvP experiences - battle royales etc - are so incredibly popular right now that I'm surprised Anet aren't making an obvious attempt at trying to get onboard with this. Even something as simple as increasing the accessibility of the game mode could work wonders. For example: when a new player makes a character, instead of loading into the beginning of the personal story, the new player should be able to go straight into WvW with an appropriate tutorial. They shouldn't need to gear up either - just give them exactly what they need to play competitively. All the barriers to get involved in WvW are just so unnecessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DemonSeed.3528 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 Anet (or whoever is seemingly in charge) haven't learned anything from the forums... we have the best PvP right here staring them in the face. This is the true endgame. I am currently thinking of my next forum build right now using Arial font as my armor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alain.1659 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 All this talk about wxp-event hype is ok. But before mounts and wxp we had q's like 40-50 at EB. Now no q and even no comms. I am not even gonna mention other bl's. This is sad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danikat.8537 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 > @"Mechanix.9315" said: > > @"Turkeyspit.3965" said: > > > @"Mechanix.9315" said: > > > So you basically will join wvw again in the next double xp event, not because the game mode is fun per se. > > > > Danikat never said that. > > > > > @"Mechanix.9315" said: > > > The problem is that, exactly that behaviour, not your fault, well maybe a bit, because players like you seems to have huge influence in anet decisions. > > You don't know that. You cannot know that. You need to swap legends and stop channeling Alex Jones. > > > > > @"Mechanix.9315" said: > > > Its totally okay to play like you do, but because of this anet will only just keep doing these kind of low effort events to some how hide the main problem, that isnt making the game mode attractive for players like you besides just giving you things in a easy mode. > > > > Did you even read their post? I mean seriously, they are saying THE EXACT OPPOSITE of what you claim they said. > > > > You say you want to bring players into WvW, but your posts sure are working towards the opposite goal. > > > > > > LOL ok suddenly i feel attacked by a forum warrior. > I dont even feel the urge to actually split the quote in multiple fragments to try to explain each one of the points to you, forum is serious bussiness huh? > > Its not very hard to understand, every wvw player knew this gonna happen, temporary influx of players, get the mount, get the bonus xp, and back to pveland. > > Anet decisions over the years were based on opinions of players who play only 1-2hrs daily, and not even everyday, and thats the path the game took, decisions based on casuals that complains, when they dont even know how to give proper feedback, because its common sense, not enough time to actually know whats happening in detail. (you can see some of my other posts, giving proper feedback on the mount and even resolving "unknown bugs" with mount hp) > > Thats how we ended with a business model like living story, working months in a map and a few story instances that are useless after 2 weeks, empty, dead. People who said that HoT expansion was super hard, and we ended with half-expansion PoF with solo maps fully dead too. > Reddit people asking for years for the rifle meme thief, and then anet forced to create a meme spec, which every thief main player never took serious. > > Decisions, based on desperate attempts of making those 1-2hrs players, to play more the game, instead focusing on the players who plays a lot of time, even just 4-5hrs. Because if you ignore those players, you doomed, players will bring more players, its simple. > > Decisions like the current wvw situation is the most easy example to understand, its really hard to me, to think how some people still dont get it. Majority of the WvW population didnt want the mount, but we still get it, ok, the mount its here, then lets work together to fix it, to balance it. No, anet just dosent care anymore, the mount is broken, the exploits are everywhere, we didnt even have an "emergency disable" just pve players and skins in gemstore. > > Do u understand something? if not then just its pointless, feel free to answer me if want, i wont. Well what do you want? You can't have a game mode which only appeals to a minority of players but gets the majority of the development effort - that just doesn't work. And in any game the majority of players are going to be people who "only" play for 1-2 hours a day, because most people are not going to devote all their free time to one activity. So either you get a game mode which accommodates casual, as well as hardcore, play or you get a niche mode for the few people willing and able to commit to it and it gets an equally small portion of the developers time given to it. (Although incidentally when I said I will go back to WvW but I'm not sure when I was actually thinking later this week, because I do enjoy it, but I'm sure with a bit more effort people like you could successfully make WvW unpleasant enough that it's not fun for people like me and then we will stay away completely. Honestly right now that seems to be a bigger issue than anything the game mode does or does not offer. No matter how much you enjoy the gameplay being constantly told you are not good enough and shouldn't be there because your mere presence is an annoyance to everyone around you can make any game unenjoyable.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danikat.8537 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 > @"StrawHat.2639" said: > > @"Danikat.8537" said: > > Speaking as one of the "PvEers" who came back to WvW for the event and then didn't log in last night it's simply that with the end of the events other things once again took precedence. (In my case specifically a similar event which is currently going on in my other MMO, which I had been largely ignoring so I could play WvW.) > > > > Fact is I'm _never_ going to be one of those people who is in WvW every single evening, I'm not even playing GW2 every evening, sometimes I'm not at home at all. But missing one night just after the event ended is also not the same as abandoning WvW forever and refusing to go back, or ignoring it until the next event. I am planing to keep playing WvW, I just don't know when exactly that will be. > > > > If you really want more people in WvW I think you have to accept that's going to involve a range of different commitment levels. You're never going to get the majority of players to abandon other game modes and focus almost exclusively on WvW. Instead you'll get some people who choose to do that, some who come in every night for a week and then disappear for a week or two, some who play for a few hours every few days and yes, some who only show up when there's a special event or other incentive. > > It's fine and all your view but with pve add-ons you loose committed players...emptier maps because they are the base and yous ("casuals") are the sprinkles on the icecream so to speak... > > Anyways I wont re-reply to your post ive seen your views in other discussions about ganking and what not, we just don't see eye to eye... Are you sure you're thinking of me? I don't remember ever talking about ganking on this forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strider Pj.2193 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 > @"Danikat.8537" said: > > @"Mechanix.9315" said: > > > @"Turkeyspit.3965" said: > > > > @"Mechanix.9315" said: > > > > So you basically will join wvw again in the next double xp event, not because the game mode is fun per se. > > > > > > Danikat never said that. > > > > > > > @"Mechanix.9315" said: > > > > The problem is that, exactly that behaviour, not your fault, well maybe a bit, because players like you seems to have huge influence in anet decisions. > > > You don't know that. You cannot know that. You need to swap legends and stop channeling Alex Jones. > > > > > > > @"Mechanix.9315" said: > > > > Its totally okay to play like you do, but because of this anet will only just keep doing these kind of low effort events to some how hide the main problem, that isnt making the game mode attractive for players like you besides just giving you things in a easy mode. > > > > > > Did you even read their post? I mean seriously, they are saying THE EXACT OPPOSITE of what you claim they said. > > > > > > You say you want to bring players into WvW, but your posts sure are working towards the opposite goal. > > > > > > > > > > LOL ok suddenly i feel attacked by a forum warrior. > > I dont even feel the urge to actually split the quote in multiple fragments to try to explain each one of the points to you, forum is serious bussiness huh? > > > > Its not very hard to understand, every wvw player knew this gonna happen, temporary influx of players, get the mount, get the bonus xp, and back to pveland. > > > > Anet decisions over the years were based on opinions of players who play only 1-2hrs daily, and not even everyday, and thats the path the game took, decisions based on casuals that complains, when they dont even know how to give proper feedback, because its common sense, not enough time to actually know whats happening in detail. (you can see some of my other posts, giving proper feedback on the mount and even resolving "unknown bugs" with mount hp) > > > > Thats how we ended with a business model like living story, working months in a map and a few story instances that are useless after 2 weeks, empty, dead. People who said that HoT expansion was super hard, and we ended with half-expansion PoF with solo maps fully dead too. > > Reddit people asking for years for the rifle meme thief, and then anet forced to create a meme spec, which every thief main player never took serious. > > > > Decisions, based on desperate attempts of making those 1-2hrs players, to play more the game, instead focusing on the players who plays a lot of time, even just 4-5hrs. Because if you ignore those players, you doomed, players will bring more players, its simple. > > > > Decisions like the current wvw situation is the most easy example to understand, its really hard to me, to think how some people still dont get it. Majority of the WvW population didnt want the mount, but we still get it, ok, the mount its here, then lets work together to fix it, to balance it. No, anet just dosent care anymore, the mount is broken, the exploits are everywhere, we didnt even have an "emergency disable" just pve players and skins in gemstore. > > > > Do u understand something? if not then just its pointless, feel free to answer me if want, i wont. > > Well what do you want? **You can't have a game mode which only appeals to a minority of players but gets the majority of the development effort** - What we want is at least the perception that the mode isn’t ignored. We get that WvW won’t be the primary mode. It never has been. I am not going to go down the road of the examples of issues and the perceived length of time to fix them, as it’s been rehashed over and over. Ghost thief is only one example Of not being dealt with until it became a ‘raid’ (PvE) issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Straegen.2938 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 Our T4 server link is still q'ing two maps during prime which is two more than we had before the mount. So it is yet another thread calling WvW dead or similar despite having to wait in a q... in T4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ali.1420 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 > @"Ok I Did It.2854" said: > For a week we had players to fill the maps, i understand some where just in it for the mount, but that only took an hour maybe 2 to get, this time yesterday we had Q's on 2 maps at 9:45am UK time, the buff was removed last night and today its a ghost town, even across all maps we dont have enough to make up 20/30 people at most, > > Can anet not see what is stirring them in the face, if you remove a reason/rewards to be in WvW no one goes into WvW, you seriously need to consider an overhaul of WxP to make people want to spend time in them maps. > > You need to make a mastery that allows people in WvW to increase the WxP they get, or double it permanently across the board. I have exclusively played WvW and then abandoned it for other parts of the game during the last 6 years. WvW is very grindy and it gets old not getting decent rewards there that you can obtain much more readily in Pve. For instance... the tickets. Once you fill the required levels from wood to diamond that's it. No more tickets until reset. That does not feel very rewarding and I know a lot of WvW players once they fill diamond for the week they stop playing. I really enjoy WvW but I do get tired of not feeling like the rewards for playing are balanced with other parts of the game. I didn't play eotm much so my rank is not inflated due to that. It has taken me 6 years of hours upon hours in WvW and my rank is still only 1600. I can't imagine what the new players must feel like facing such an enormous grind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balthazzarr.1349 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 > @"tobin.6754" said: > > @"StrawHat.2639" said: > > > @"tobin.6754" said: > > > hate to say this but, we told you so! All the fresh blood left, and the WvW community are stuck with a mount they don't want. > > > > > > > You should more look at it this way: > > A very small fresh blood influx probably almost none seeable in the coming weeks will remain. > > As for the WvW community...its probably skewed 1/3 don't want mount, 1/3 don't give a... \either way and 1/3 like it. > > > > anyways sigh > > Yea and if a portion of that 1/3 got fed up and left, we'll be worse off off than before mount. And I'm sure there are more than 1/3 of the wvw community that hate the mount. I like the extra speed of the mount. But to be honest my gametime has gone from daily to twice in the last 5 days. It has really killed my desire to go in and PLAY wvw. For me it’s really just a pve bit of fun and has caused my desire to race back in to wvw to all but fade away. Currently I’m ranked 3900 and from the looks of things that won’t change anytime soon. meh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tobin.6754 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 > @"Balthazzarr.1349" said: > > @"tobin.6754" said: > > > @"StrawHat.2639" said: > > > > @"tobin.6754" said: > > > > hate to say this but, we told you so! All the fresh blood left, and the WvW community are stuck with a mount they don't want. > > > > > > > > > > You should more look at it this way: > > > A very small fresh blood influx probably almost none seeable in the coming weeks will remain. > > > As for the WvW community...its probably skewed 1/3 don't want mount, 1/3 don't give a... \either way and 1/3 like it. > > > > > > anyways sigh > > > > Yea and if a portion of that 1/3 got fed up and left, we'll be worse off off than before mount. And I'm sure there are more than 1/3 of the wvw community that hate the mount. > > I like the extra speed of the mount. But to be honest my gametime has gone from daily to twice in the last 5 days. It has really killed my desire to go in and PLAY wvw. For me it’s really just a pve bit of fun and has caused my desire to race back in to wvw to all but fade away. > > Currently I’m ranked 3900 and from the looks of things that won’t change anytime soon. meh It's not just you. Many of the people I know who mainly played wvw, they felt the same way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crepuscular.9047 Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 I think it's fine to have some quiet period, just that Anets need to have these bonus WvW reward more often, and make no down state a permanent thing forgot on who's stream that I heard from, maybe teapot or WP, there were rumors that WvW servers were so overloaded they had to lower the population cap by 10% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cristalyan.5728 Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 > @"Turkeyspit.3965" said: > > @"Ok I Did It.2854" said: > > Can anet not see what is stirring them in the face, if you remove a reason/rewards to be in WvW no one goes into WvW, you seriously need to consider an overhaul of WxP to make people want to spend time in them maps. > > > > You need to make a mastery that allows people in WvW to increase the WxP they get, or double it permanently across the board. > > The reason you see a spike in participation isn't because the WXP was doubled, but that it was doubled for 1 week only. You will see the exact same thing the next time ANET launches an event + double XP (though I doubt we'll see queues like this again). Players who don't spend much time in WvW see an opportunity to bang out some ranks, maybe complete a reward track faster, and also perhaps realize that the game mode will be an utter kittenshow that they will be able to run around and do whatever, and fit right in. > > If you make double XP standard, it stops being double XP and just becomes XP, and while people will rank up faster, it won't draw players in to the game mode because there will be no urgency. Indeed, in my opinion too, the way to bring more players in WvW is to redesign the rewards for this game mode. Without rewards only the "hardcore" WvW-rs will play this mode and no matter what 1 week event you will invent, you won't have the new players you want. This week the reward was the bonus XP and the mount. Now that this ended, you will have (at most) the same players as before in WvW. In the presentation of the mount one of the devs stated about WvW something like: "the less played game mode". I want to try a rewording of this: WvW is the **less rewarding** game mode. Increase (or redesign) the rewards and you will se that the situation may change. Is as with the dungeons: In the past the dungeons were very popular content, played by many. After "reworking" the rewards in the sense of making them less appealing, the dungeons are now a ghost town. You can say the dungeons are the less played area of the PvE mode. @ANet - if you want new players in WvW, not a mount was needed. But the rework of the rewards from WvW. Without this you can do anything you want - you won't have the "new blood" to refresh this game mode. But you will have the satisfaction to be right by saying that "WvW is the less played game mode". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krizek.5672 Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 An opinion of PVE player. Since there was an event for double XP and of course Warclaw mount I have logged into the WvW. All the time I have heard "go back PVE players", "useless s***" and other encouraging things. When I asked for help how to improve only one, ONE person helped me, check metabattle. So I did and changed mine build. There are some tips how to play, but for the player who really dont have much experience with WvW it was a little bit confusing. I know something when I farmed 2 gifts of battle. So I asked again with mine build if I can get some tips for improvement. Nothing. Same talks "go home PVE" and kicked out of squad. I have farmed several Gifts of battle, event ended and most likely I will never show up again in WvW. Why? Well because of really toxic community over there and absolutely not helpful. I would say even more than in raids and thats something (at least in raids you have training groups). And I m not some beginner player, I play GW 2 since the launch. So its only your own fault that people left. You had a huge chance how to keep more players, but with this behaviour you have just burned it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vayne.8563 Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 1. Anet makes a change to encourage more people to try WvW ...check 2. WvWers scream about the influx of new people. About having to wait in queue. About people who don't know what's going on...check 3. People who might have stayed leave....check 4. WvWers blame only the game...it's never anyone's fault but Anet....of course I've seen plenty of negativity from WvWers and while some did welcome the influx with open arms, the loudest portion of the community (and probably a minority) bordered on abusive. At very least they were very negative. If I were a new player going into WvW for the first time, I wouldn't want to go back there even for the buff. Of course, if the buff were doubled permanently, no one would go in because they could do it any time. It would solve nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strider Pj.2193 Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 > @"Krizek.5672" said: > An opinion of PVE player. > > Since there was an event for double XP and of course Warclaw mount I have logged into the WvW. All the time I have heard "go back PVE players", "useless s***" and other encouraging things. When I asked for help how to improve only one, ONE person helped me, check metabattle. So I did and changed mine build. There are some tips how to play, but for the player who really dont have much experience with WvW it was a little bit confusing. I know something when I farmed 2 gifts of battle. So I asked again with mine build if I can get some tips for improvement. Nothing. Same talks "go home PVE" and kicked out of squad. I have farmed several Gifts of battle, event ended and most likely I will never show up again in WvW. Why? Well because of really toxic community over there and absolutely not helpful. I would say even more than in raids and thats something (at least in raids you have training groups). And I m not some beginner player, I play GW 2 since the launch. > > So its only your own fault that people left. You had a huge chance how to keep more players, but with this behaviour you have just burned it. So... you take the experience of (your) one server and apply it to all of WvW? That’s fair? But in the same paragraph, you note there are training groups for raids? How do you find those? That would be research. Did you come into the forums and ask for a guild in WvW that is on your server that would be willing to guide you? Like: https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/71438/question-for-the-ruins-of-surmia-people#latest Or a search like : https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/search?Page=p2&adv=1&cat=29&search=Looking+for+guild Would show you a way to find the help you are looking for. But that would presume you are actually looking for help. If you really feel like Warclaw was some great chance to keep players in WvW, you haven’t been paying attention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strider Pj.2193 Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 > @"Vayne.8563" said: > 1. Anet makes a change to encourage more people to try WvW ...check Which, to call it a controversial change that was expected to create more problems than it solved (see exploits at arena.net) would be an understatement > 2. WvWers scream about the influx of new people. About having to wait in queue. About people who don't know what's going on...check Primarily of people who didn’t research what would make them successful in wvw. Or that two servers in T1 would use the remaining time in a weeks matchup to assist those same players in getting the Warclaw by ktraining to allow for rank gain and completion of the collection. > 3. People who might have stayed leave....check Because they got their mount. > 4. WvWers blame only the game...it's never anyone's fault but Anet....of course A vocal minority, yes. > > I've seen plenty of negativity from WvWers and while some did welcome the influx with open arms, the loudest portion of the community (and probably a minority) bordered on abusive. At very least they were very negative. Of course as those people exist in every mode: - elitists in Raids and fractals - Trolls who ruin meta events and who troll chests - Etc - > > If I were a new player going into WvW for the first time, I wouldn't want to go back there even for the buff. And if you had looked at the WvW forums and seen the ‘concerns’ that WvW players have begged to be addressed for years, and note that something that, arguably was only implemented to pull in revenue, and was likely one of the most controversial adds in the past three years, you might understand some of that negativity. > > Of course, if the buff were doubled permanently, no one would go in because they could do it any time. It would solve nothing. This is likely the one piece I agree with you on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cristalyan.5728 Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 > @"Vayne.8563" said: > 1. Anet makes a change to encourage more people to try WvW ...check Wrong, in my opinion. Because ANet made this change to give the players the illusion of work and to increase its income by selling skins. Not even a single intention to change WvW into a better thing. > 2. WvWers scream about the influx of new people. About having to wait in queue. About people who don't know what's going on...check This is true. But this was not an influx. It was more like an invasion generated by the smell of a new booty. They cried that during the time waited into queues, the looters had no intention to fight for the server. Becasue the invaders purpose was to get the loot. And the WvW-ers lost a game because of this. > 3. People who might have stayed leave....check That's obvious. The loot ended. The things are as before. What reason to stay they have now more than before? > 4. WvWers blame only the game...it's never anyone's fault but Anet....of course You have right here. It is ANet fault. But I don't think the WvW-ers blame the game. They know as well as you that the game cannot update WvW. They know that the game cannot create something new for WvW (even if 7 years passed). They know very well that the game cannot improve the rewards. They know very well who **can**. And who refused to do this. Because, you know, they were busy creating the **illusion of work**. > > I've seen plenty of negativity from WvWers and while some did welcome the influx with open arms, the loudest portion of the community (and probably a minority) bordered on abusive. At very least they were very negative. I have also seen a lot of negativity in PvE. And, maybe you don't see this, but not the influx of the players was the reason. Double XP events + other change happened before too. And no toxicity was reported. At last not as now. What we have now as an extra? **The mount**! This is the reason of so much toxicity. The mount was not asked. Moreover, the WvW-rs asked to NOT be introduced. As an answer, ANet introduced it, and put gas on the flame allowing it to be used in PvE. The PvE is perceived now as the main reason for the existence of the mount in WvW. I think this is the real reason of (some) toxicity. > > If I were a new player going into WvW for the first time, I wouldn't want to go back there even for the buff. :) A new player entering into WvW for the buff - this is hilarious. If you don't enter WvW for the WvW, then, no matter what, you will not stay. > > Of course, if the buff were doubled permanently, no one would go in because they could do it any time. It would solve nothing. You wrong. I will for sure play WvW even if the buff will became permanently. Because not the XP is important (at least for me). WvW is the less rewarding game mode. And still the WvW-rs play this mode. If the reward is so important for the PvE players and if the reason they enter WvW is the reward, then why ANet don't change the rewards if they truly have the intention to bring new players in this game mode? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auri.1365 Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 > @"Cristalyan.5728" said: > > @"Vayne.8563" said: > > If I were a new player going into WvW for the first time, I wouldn't want to go back there even for the buff. > > :) A new player entering into WvW for the buff - this is hilarious. If you don't enter WvW for the WvW, then, no matter what, you will not stay. > In my opinin people who enter wvw for the wvw are already in wvw or have tried it out. So the only way to get new blood into wvw is to add something that people want who aren't intested yet. They may not come for the fights at first, but if they have fun in wvw and are welcome, they may join a wvw guild and become good fighters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrawHat.2639 Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 > @"Strider Pj.2193" said: > > @"Vayne.8563" said: > > 1. Anet makes a change to encourage more people to try WvW ...check > > Which, to call it a controversial change that was expected to create more problems than it solved (see exploits at arena.net) would be an understatement > > > 2. WvWers scream about the influx of new people. About having to wait in queue. About people who don't know what's going on...check > > Primarily of people who didn’t research what would make them successful in wvw. > > Or that two servers in T1 would use the remaining time in a weeks matchup to assist those same players in getting the Warclaw by ktraining to allow for rank gain and completion of the collection. > > > 3. People who might have stayed leave....check > > Because they got their mount. > > > 4. WvWers blame only the game...it's never anyone's fault but Anet....of course > > A vocal minority, yes. > > > > > I've seen plenty of negativity from WvWers and while some did welcome the influx with open arms, the loudest portion of the community (and probably a minority) bordered on abusive. At very least they were very negative. > > Of course as those people exist in every mode: > - elitists in Raids and fractals > - Trolls who ruin meta events and who troll chests > - Etc > - > > > > > If I were a new player going into WvW for the first time, I wouldn't want to go back there even for the buff. > > And if you had looked at the WvW forums and seen the ‘concerns’ that WvW players have begged to be addressed for years, and note that something that, arguably was only implemented to pull in revenue, and was likely one of the most controversial adds in the past three years, you might understand some of that negativity. > > > > > Of course, if the buff were doubled permanently, no one would go in because they could do it any time. It would solve nothing. > > This is likely the one piece I agree with you on. > > Awesome reply mate...some have so much tunnel vision blindness unfortunately . WvWers scream about the influx of new people. Not true our link had commanders taking time and heard not all that much rumbling in our link your conjecturing.... About having to wait in queue. We called their would be but now they already gone mostly... About people who don't know what's going on You have gw2 wiki and plenty of forum resources posted before mounts became live and were known to be going live...do some research like Raids/Fractals before joining seems only right if your clueless on WvW...this one I could say to so many. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrawHat.2639 Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 > @"Auri.1365" said: > > @"Cristalyan.5728" said: > > > @"Vayne.8563" said: > > > > If I were a new player going into WvW for the first time, I wouldn't want to go back there even for the buff. > > > > :) A new player entering into WvW for the buff - this is hilarious. If you don't enter WvW for the WvW, then, no matter what, you will not stay. > > > In my opinin people who enter wvw for the wvw are already in wvw or have tried it out. So the only way to get new blood into wvw is to add something that people want who aren't intested yet. They may not come for the fights at first, but if they have fun in wvw and are welcome, they may join a wvw guild and become good fighters. Did we really see all that much improvement with players pop after links, after pips, after legendaries, after reward chests, (after mounts)...I don't like this reply because of the mentioned...plus it was mounts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blocki.4931 Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 > @"Cristalyan.5728" said: > > @"Vayne.8563" said: > > 1. Anet makes a change to encourage more people to try WvW ...check > > Wrong, in my opinion. Because ANet made this change to give the players the illusion of work and to increase its income by selling skins. Not even a single intention to change WvW into a better thing. > You can't deny that they have worked and are still working on the mode. It gets changes all the time, just because many people disagree with them doesn't make them non existant. > > 2. WvWers scream about the influx of new people. About having to wait in queue. About people who don't know what's going on...check > > This is true. But this was not an influx. It was more like an invasion generated by the smell of a new booty. They cried that during the time waited into queues, the looters had no intention to fight for the server. Becasue the invaders purpose was to get the loot. And the WvW-ers lost a game because of this. > This anti-pve player attitude is one of the main reasons the mode is disliked. If less PvE players made a negative experience whenever they tried it they would feel much more inclined to come back. There are enough people out there who will tell you "oh yeah, that mode where I was insulted for whatever reason" and then never came back. The mode needs those people. > > 3. People who might have stayed leave....check > > That's obvious. The loot ended. The things are as before. What reason to stay they have now more than before? > That's how events work. Do you complain that the streets are empty after a festival has ended? That those people were just greedy, fun-loving and loathsome creatures? > > 4. WvWers blame only the game...it's never anyone's fault but Anet....of course > > You have right here. It is ANet fault. But I don't think the WvW-ers blame the game. They know as well as you that the game cannot update WvW. They know that the game cannot create something new for WvW (even if 7 years passed). They know very well that the game cannot improve the rewards. They know very well who **can**. And who refused to do this. Because, you know, they were busy creating the **illusion of work**. > > Not going to talk about the last sentence. Yes, they CAN improve the rewards and they should, but they won't. Know what they should do? Get rid of the weekly reset for diamond chests UNTIL you have finished the last diamond one. Would be a HUGE upgrade for people who simply cannot spend the required time ingame. Sure, there will be edge cases where peope would then finish the last chest very early on because they were so close and then not get any tickets and coins that week, but in general it would be better for a majority of people. The ones who don't care get more stuff over time, the ones that play a ton won't have the issue. The core gamemode does not need any mechanical changes. AI could be upgraded to do more cool things perhaps, but the core with objectives + siege and killing a champion at the end works perfectly fine. In other games this is called a "gameplay loop" and as long as that is solid, generally people agree that a game is fun and enjoyable. If you're there for this specific gameplay loop and you don't sit in a hopeless matchup where everything is tier 3 and nothing will ever get taken away from them because they have 50 people on the map, this is a lot of fun at its core. They have most certainly added gliding and now the mount to add something new to WvW. They have changed siege for the same reason. They can't touch that gameplay loop because that's what holds it together. What else can they do? Oh yeah, add another map. Oh, nobody likes that map and many don't even give it a chance? Well, let's not do it ever again. I don't think the people demanding new stuff know what they want at all. They don't want a change to that loop either, they just don't want to run into that negative experience of fighting a losing battle. > > I've seen plenty of negativity from WvWers and while some did welcome the influx with open arms, the loudest portion of the community (and probably a minority) bordered on abusive. At very least they were very negative. > > I have also seen a lot of negativity in PvE. And, maybe you don't see this, but not the influx of the players was the reason. Double XP events + other change happened before too. And no toxicity was reported. At last not as now. What we have now as an extra? **The mount**! This is the reason of so much toxicity. The mount was not asked. Moreover, the WvW-rs asked to NOT be introduced. As an answer, ANet introduced it, and put gas on the flame allowing it to be used in PvE. The PvE is perceived now as the main reason for the existence of the mount in WvW. I think this is the real reason of (some) toxicity. > > > > If I were a new player going into WvW for the first time, I wouldn't want to go back there even for the buff. > > :) A new player entering into WvW for the buff - this is hilarious. If you don't enter WvW for the WvW, then, no matter what, you will not stay. > Yes, there was toxicity at every single event. You can't blame the mount for any of this. People have always liked to complain about those filthy (((pvers))) that are somehow lesser people for not having already played 2000 hours of WvW before entering. The general mood was far more negative for sure, but most people came out of this indifferent or even positive about the mount so I don't think it matters at all. Nowhere does the game tell you "hey, here's this gamemode you can try". You have to find it on your own. Now imagine if an event tells you that this thing exists? You try it, because before you were not even aware it was there. > > > Of course, if the buff were doubled permanently, no one would go in because they could do it any time. It would solve nothing. > > You wrong. I will for sure play WvW even if the buff will became permanently. Because not the XP is important (at least for me). WvW is the less rewarding game mode. And still the WvW-rs play this mode. If the reward is so important for the PvE players and if the reason they enter WvW is the reward, then why ANet don't change the rewards if they truly have the intention to bring new players in this game mode? > Rewards are awful and should be increased in one way or another. Rewards ARE important, but as I mentioned before, the gameplay loop is satisfying enough to keep people playing. Then there are group fights that don't care about any of that stuff anyway, so the entire structure around it becomes irrelevant. People who only want don't care about the rest. He's right in the sense that the "double exp" would just become the new normal. Level ups don't mean anything as is. If all it took was a couple camps and a sentry to level up all the time then it would mean even less. Obviously that is not enticing. People came because the event made them feel like they were missing out. Now there was also a mount to miss out on, so the effect was a bit more drastic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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