I want to move away from the Race based and Commander based Living Story. I want Class based LS

[Randulf.7614]

> @"SoulGuardian.6203" said:

> > @"Randulf.7614" said:

> > The Commander stuff is fine, although I'd have preferred a more traditional hero role. The problem is when we aren't the central character. the writers have actively said Aurene is who they centre the story around and that GW2 is her story. It's what has sent the narrative spinning completely off track. Her involvement, all this 'dragons-are-people-too and don't kill the dragons because it is bad, is the issue for me.

> >

> > The only real issue with the Commander is that because they treat them the same no matter the race, they talk and act often in conflict to their likely instinctive behaviours. My Norn is often too serious or mopey and that isn't what I want from my grizzled, legend seeking warrior

>

> Me too.

> I'm not really fond of the "killing dragons is bad" narrative.

> Kinda contradicts itself.

> But I guess originality in videogames is a hard thing to come by these days.

> There's gotta be drama and suspense, right? ...yet the need to come up with something unique.

> We don't wanna replay zhaitan over and over, but with different skins.

 

It is a problem agreed, but the Dragons have been at their most interesting when in the background. Kralk and Primordus were more effective as background for the story against Balthazar. As soon as they focused on Kralk, it went completely silly. That last episode was shockingly bad.

 

Where the best stories occur, it doesnt need us Vs the Dragons. The Dragons could have stayed as forces of nature whilst we focused on White Mantle, Balthazar, Joko and the Scarab Plague, Dhuum, Lazarus etc etc. That would have allowed for more interesting stories and more depth to the ones I mentioned above.

 

The Joko ending is a classic example having been heavily criticised by a lot of the community, regretted by the writers and all to rush headlong into a ridiculous fan fiction plot revolving around a baby dragon killing off something infinitly more powerful that also happened to be its grandpa and in need of redemption..!!

 

Then we have HoT where a focus on Aurene and the distraction of running headlong to kill mordy took away from constructing a story about the sylvari, malyk, the nightmare court, the pale tree, divisions between races.

 

Jormag has kind of bucked the trend so far, so I hope finally they get it right even though they screwed up the Tooth story.

[SoulGuardian.6203]

@"Randulf.7614"

Yep.

I would have liked to see more of a Sylvari highlight in HoT, since, after all they are Mordremoth's creation; according to the lore.

That was their moment to shine.

We got to see some of their story in LWS2, and how Nightmare Court came to be.

Also the dungeon reveals some interesting points, such as Caithe's love affair.

 

The rest, I just kinda nod and go along with it.

 

What I really think, imo, is that path of fire kinda suggests primordious, and should have been left to the final episode.

However, it's the Asura that have a sort of connection with it, and I'm curious when and where we will get to see more of it.

I'm thinking that it will be somewhere underground.

Maybe huge subterranean cave systems?

A massive army of nasty destroyers.

 

For now, I think Icebrood is going fine.

Wonder if we'll go to Boreal Station and EotN?

 

By the way.

The creature that was under the frozen lake, and corrupted Jora's brother, Svanir.

That was defo Jormag, right?

[Randulf.7614]

> @"SoulGuardian.6203" said:

> @"Randulf.7614"

> Yep.

> I would have liked to see more of a Sylvari highlight in HoT, since, after all they are Mordremoth's creation; according to the lore.

> That was their moment to shine.

> We got to see some of their story in LWS2, and how Nightmare Court came to be.

> Also the dungeon reveals some interesting points, such as Caithe's love affair.

>

> The rest, I just kinda nod and go along with it.

>

> What I really think, imo, is that path of fire kinda suggests primordious, and should have been left to the final episode.

> However, it's the Asura that have a sort of connection with it, and I'm curious when and where we will get to see more of it.

> I'm thinking that it will be somewhere underground.

> Maybe huge subterranean cave systems?

> A massive army of nasty destroyers.

>

> For now, I think Icebrood is going fine.

> Wonder if we'll go to Boreal Station and EotN?

>

> By the way.

> The creature that was under the frozen lake, and corrupted Jora's brother, Svanir.

> That was defo Jormag, right?

 

No that was Drakkar and you will see it next episode. Jormag was much further north off screen

 

There is a a pretty strong clue EoTN will in the saga due to references to scrying in the new pve feature we are getting

[Aaralyna.3104]

> @"Knighthonor.4061" said:

> > @"Inculpatus cedo.9234" said:

> > Are you asking the Devs to create 9 different stories each release? Would you be willing to wait 18 months for a release? 12 months? 6 months?

>

> Wasn't RoM able to do that with less?

 

If you mean the RoM which is that dead p2w wow clone by some German publisher.... I don't remember that game having any class related stories and I have played it for years. There were 3 starter zones for all 3 races but GW2 has same. There were some secondary class quests but this was not class specific. The main questline (Morrok line) was also working your way to kill a big villain. The only class related things were quests for elite skills and moa weapons but even those weren't class specific, it was for a cluster of classes the same. As for content coming out, it was like 1 year for 1 map (and later on even longer) and its dungeon was always bugged so taken out to be back in game after 6 months or longer.

 

As for GW2, I like we play as commander and go after big treaths. Personal story actually does have changes based on race and choices you made when you start the game. Even open world npcs act alike based on your choices. In some expansion stories and living world stories you will see dialog and some other changes based on your race. And in certain stories you even play as an NPC (i.e. Caithe as thief in LWs2). Every companion NPC in story will also represent a specific class and order and will show you their abilities. Same goes for enemy encounters. And there are some NPC's with class information (specializations) around. You mention the information is on the wiki but the wiki is made by players who got their information fromout the game itself (and some info from the main website about the classes).

 

You may be looking out for "Visions of the Past" tho. This upcoming content says you step out the shoe of the commander and follow the warband of a young charr. We don't know into detail what to expect gameplay wise but this may be the exact thing you are seeking for (in some way).

[Dante.1763]

> @"SoulGuardian.6203" said:

 

> By the way.

> The creature that was under the frozen lake, and corrupted Jora's brother, Svanir.

> That was defo Jormag, right?

 

 

Drakkar, one of its minions.

 

[SoulGuardian.6203]

> @"Dante.1763" said:

> > @"SoulGuardian.6203" said:

>

> > By the way.

> > The creature that was under the frozen lake, and corrupted Jora's brother, Svanir.

> > That was defo Jormag, right?

>

>

> Drakkar, one of its minions.

>

 

Oh ok.

I never looked it up on wiki.

So I didn't know why the area was called drakkar lake until now.

It is kinda obvious really, if you think about it.

Thanks.

[ugrakarma.9416]

> @"Inculpatus cedo.9234" said:

> Are you asking the Devs to create 9 different stories each release? Would you be willing to wait 18 months for a release? 12 months? 6 months?

 

and even worse the story writers having a big decision-choice map in had to write anything.

[Brycar.2651]

The could have at least had a small side mission handed out by the PoF elite spec mentors. Something required to unlock the elite spec. Instead the mentors have only lore dialogue.

[Konig Des Todes.2086]

GW2 began on too grand a scale for the PC to be doing things of lesser quality than the greatest threats to the nations, imo. Even side stories have, for a long time, been either on a personal level, or on a national scale.

 

While I disagree on doing little but grand epic storylines, I feel that having more down to earth plots will just feel jarring because of how famous the Commander is. Unless it involves going to new, unexplored lands (in GW2). But even then, we're still famous - when entering Elona for the first time, despite the lack of communications between Tyria and Elona, we were still the Dragonslayer even if also an Outlander.

 

> @"SoulGuardian.6203" said:

> Oh ok.

> I never looked it up on wiki.

> So I didn't know why the area was called drakkar lake until now.

> It is kinda obvious really, if you think about it.

> Thanks.

 

It's kind of a paradox, the names. The name "Drakkar" originated as a nickname for the creature, which was originally left unnamed because the creature was found in Drakkar Lake. During GW2 development, some devs had nicknamed it "the Drakkar Beast" for the same reasons (unnamed creature found in Drakkar Lake in GW1).

 

However, Drakkar Lake itself is called such as a reference to the unnamed draconic creature in the lake. The term "Drakkar" comes from the viking longships which had dragon designs on it, which were called "drakkar", coming from the term "dreki" ("dragon"). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Longship#Drakkar

 

Now, _originally_, it was planned that the creature to lie in Drakkar Lake would be Jormag (then unnamed as well), but during development of GW2, the model was deemed "too small" thus was made a dragon champion instead.

 

So Drakkar is named after Drakkar Lake which was named after Drakkar.

[Swagger.1459]

> @"SoulGuardian.6203" said:

> I don't mind simple dialogue, like the one in PoF instead of full 3D animated characters.

> The bit when you talk to the airship owner in Lions Arch it's quite funny and pleasant to watch.

> It's also somewhat interactive as you can walk with her around the steps.

>

> I agree with people in other posts saying that we have so many maps not being used for a great deal of things.

>

> Why not make quick side stories in between IBS chapters that do just what OP suggested?

 

Because that drains time and resources from the teams who are responsible for creating the main story... And the main story is more important, even if you don't like it.

[Einlanzer.1627]

I agree with your criticism of the "you're the grand hero" style of storytelling, but I'm not sure I agree that it would be feasible to overhaul it in this way at this point.

[Swagger.1459]

> @"SoulGuardian.6203" said:

> > @"Randulf.7614" said:

> > The Commander stuff is fine, although I'd have preferred a more traditional hero role. The problem is when we aren't the central character. the writers have actively said Aurene is who they centre the story around and that GW2 is her story. It's what has sent the narrative spinning completely off track. Her involvement, all this 'dragons-are-people-too and don't kill the dragons because it is bad, is the issue for me.

> >

> > The only real issue with the Commander is that because they treat them the same no matter the race, they talk and act often in conflict to their likely instinctive behaviours. My Norn is often too serious or mopey and that isn't what I want from my grizzled, legend seeking warrior

>

> Me too.

> I'm not really fond of the "killing dragons is bad" narrative.

> Kinda contradicts itself.

> But I guess originality in videogames is a hard thing to come by these days.

> There's gotta be drama and suspense, right? ...yet the need to come up with something unique.

> We don't wanna replay zhaitan over and over, but with different skins.

 

Do you even understand why anet went the "killing dragons is bad" route? And it's only a contradiction if you expect the same old "dragons are bad and must be killed" plot and story lines found in many other games and writings. Anet actually thought out of the box on this one.

 

Before criticizing about "originality" again, I think you should probably read up on the past stories so you have a better understanding of the bigger story pictures.

[Zephire.8049]

In addition to all the extra work it would take for the writers to create 9 different stories, it's unrealistic to expect artists and animators to make 9 different cinematics and missions, and having to cast/pay for 9 different episodes worth of voice actors for what amounts to a single episode release. Especially since Anet has been upfront in some of their dev videos about how they have to plan the story around VAs being available, so if they know they can't bring in someone that means that character has to be cut.

 

Now imagine if several VAs aren't available and not one, not two, but three or more full episodes had to be rewritten with different characters partway into the allotted production time and how that would affect not just the quality of the story but could start a domino effect on things not even directly story-related.

 

The writing is actually the easiest part of it. The time, resources, and cost of everything increases by 9 fold by doing profession paths. (And then people will complain if elites don't get their own unique story part in addition to the people who currently complain that their race/background not being mentioned)

 

The Commander-style design works well for an MMO without costs and time shooting through the roof. The separate racial stories and background stories were unfeasible to keep up with without having a giant pile of money to throw at problems and people—there's a reason (several actually) that they merged all characters onto the same story by level 60 and they're not going to suddenly reverse course on that at this point. Continuing getting unique bits of dialogue is probably all we're going to get since it doesn't change the story and it's something a VA can say in the booth while recording all their other stuff.

[tinymurder.5791]

> @"Knighthonor.4061" said:

> The Commander stuff been one of the worst decisions by Anet's storytelling development in my opinion. And I say that respectfully but critically.

>

> It lacks in immersion from my perspective since it creates a story around my character being some kind of grand leader yet among other players that are also my equals. Then it has us soloing major Lore figures and stuff like that. It's immersion breaking.

> I rather we move away from this format and use Living Story to flush out more Class Lore and Lore on the new Elite specs we get instead of reading about it on the Wiki.

> This way our individual characters can do their thing but their overall impact on the global story is scaled down to a class Lore level instead of this grand Commander who solos God's and stuff like that.

>

> Revenant is one of the new classes, would love to see story instances that explain what it is, how it came to be, and what can it potentially do.

>

> A thief class story can have the characters trying to do a Stealth mission to steal something important to their story.

>

> Necromancer story instance can go over the how the character learned the ritual to summon their specific minion type.

>

> Etc etc

>

 

While I like this idea in theory, I have to agree with what others have said about how this would greatly expand the amount of work required for each LS/Expansion without increasing the _**actual**_ amount of content on a given playthrough.

[SoulGuardian.6203]

Personal story could have been extended in the expac related to each race.

We're getting a bit of that with charr, and got other bits in lw seasons in the past, but it's way gone now.

 

[Fenella.2634]

I'm afraid splitting the story would come with a severe quality loss. I rather like the storytelling style and scope of the latest episodes, compared to the very first chapters of PS where we really had separate stories following our decisions.

 

However, I do like the flavor dialog they put in from time to time. And the class-based prison breakout was really fun. I'd like to have details like this more often, even when we all still play the same story, essentially.