Dantheman.3589 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 S/d was good the second pof came out but it took a decent bit to be meta. condi was decent at daredevil changes and even better with deadly arts and ppl didn’t even think it was viable until months later and meta even later than that. Staff/staff bunker was good with daredevil rework and probably meta right when scourge change happened. Now we have pistol whip which has been playable right when daredevil change allowed for condi clear on successful dodge and pulm, which was also probably way better than s/d for a long time in fact I and many ppl on NA played pistol whip at a high level and this just like every single other meta thief build since pof came out is getting forum post after forum post to point out it’s op a long time since it was playable as meta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laera Myrith.7605 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 In my opinion, it's because thief meta builds revolve more around everyone else's builds to be effective. Thief by basic design (excluding mobility) has to exploit weaknesses to do well. Edit for clarity, it takes a while to work out those weaknesses and how to exploit them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeikeNz.3526 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 because thief can spam the same skill forever, they need to add a cast time or use more init points to thief skills if they reuse it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dantheman.3589 Posted January 15, 2020 Author Share Posted January 15, 2020 > @"SeikeNz.3526" said: > because thief can spam the same skill forever, they need to add a cast time or use more init points to thief skills if they reuse it Lol so ppl thought s/d was meta still because they were to busy spamming flanking strike. makes sense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 > @"Dantheman.3589" said: > > @"SeikeNz.3526" said: > > because thief can spam the same skill forever, they need to add a cast time or use more init points to thief skills if they reuse it > > Lol so ppl thought s/d was meta still because they were to busy spamming flanking strike. makes sense "3 SPAM" -Every thief complainer since 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycoprophet.8107 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 > @"SeikeNz.3526" said: > because thief can spam the same skill forever, they need to add a cast time or use more init points to thief skills if they reuse it Exactly like infiltrator arrow for example one cast cost 6 of 12 ini or black powder cost 5 out of 12 resulting in two instantly repeatable cast with no ini left to cast any other skill which is basically the same as spamming it forever in the gw2 forum universe lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeikeNz.3526 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said: > > @"SeikeNz.3526" said: > > because thief can spam the same skill forever, they need to add a cast time or use more init points to thief skills if they reuse it > > Exactly like infiltrator arrow for example one cast cost 6 of 12 ini or black powder cost 5 out of 12 resulting in two instantly repeatable cast with no ini left to cast any other skill which is basically the same as spamming it forever in the gw2 forum universe lol you can do it way more than 2 times, you can spam it more like 4-5 times in a row, also thiefs skills are way more buffed than other classes, something have to be done to thiefs spam of the same skill. 1- make the skill cost more init if they are reused 2- lower the dmg to half 3-make the skill get a longer cast time if they are reused Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycoprophet.8107 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 Um how do u repeatedly spam infiltrator arrow 5 times in a row? Lmao that's 30 ini of 12 base or 15 max, oh wait u gonna follow ur hyperbole nonsense by spouting theirs roll for ini etc as if thieves build to produce more available ini at all cost? Maybe throw in trickery trait for ini on weapon swap to cuz u kno most thieves roll that vs slight of hand. Even then I'd love to see even four infiltrator arrows spammed on a biuld not specifically built to do just that, dont even know of 5 is possible if fully built for. U guys gotta stop embarrassing ourselves constantly going on that thief has effectively infinite ini and evades to spam as it's getting old. And u are wrong about thieves skills buffed far more than others, look at head shot daze is 1/4 sec compared to the 3/4-1 sec + other classes have, yes cuz of ini resource. What's shield bash do dps and daze wise? Anyway their skills are far from buffed more than other classes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonidrex.5649 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said: > Um how do u repeatedly spam infiltrator arrow 5 times in a row? Lmao that's 30 ini of 12 base or 15 max, oh wait u gonna follow ur hyperbole nonsense by spouting theirs roll for ini etc as if thieves build to produce more available ini at all cost? Maybe throw in trickery trait for ini on weapon swap to cuz u kno most thieves roll that vs slight of hand. Even then I'd love to see even four infiltrator arrows spammed on a biuld not specifically built to do just that, dont even know of 5 is possible if fully built for. > U guys gotta stop embarrassing ourselves constantly going on that thief has effectively infinite ini and evades to spam as it's getting old. > And u are wrong about thieves skills buffed far more than others, look at head shot daze is 1/4 sec compared to the 3/4-1 sec + other classes have, yes cuz of ini resource. What's shield bash do dps and daze wise? Anyway their skills are far from buffed more than other classes. entire InI design means that it doesnt matter how bad some of the skills are, they just dont get used then. build is weighted by the strongest ability. thats why PW is spammed, thats why flanking is spammed thats why vault is spammed thats why SB 5 is spammed. Thats why thief will always be shit to balanced. In theory every single thief ability should be shit, but they should cover specific cases, meaning you can exploit specific things out of enemies, but in reality there is nothing that can exploit evade/invuln spam so there are build that just spam 1 ability and call it a day. As to why thief builds are used now more then before? Swipe buff. Stolen skills buff. Mesmer nerfs. Warrior nerf. Holo nerfs. Rev nerf. + thief depends on meta, since its the most mobile class of all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > In theory every single thief ability should be kitten, but they should cover specific cases, meaning you can exploit specific things out of enemies, but in reality there is nothing that can exploit evade/invuln spam so there are build that just spam 1 ability and call it a day. Why are people pretending like you can't start casting a stun in the middle of pistol whip so it lands while the anim finishes? Its not nothing. any high damaging/cc move once that thief commits to pistol whip is going to hit them if you cast it in the middle of their swipes, whether or not they stow. Its like half the people upset about it have never played a fighting game where they had to learn frame data. But w/e Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycoprophet.8107 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said: > > Um how do u repeatedly spam infiltrator arrow 5 times in a row? Lmao that's 30 ini of 12 base or 15 max, oh wait u gonna follow ur hyperbole nonsense by spouting theirs roll for ini etc as if thieves build to produce more available ini at all cost? Maybe throw in trickery trait for ini on weapon swap to cuz u kno most thieves roll that vs slight of hand. Even then I'd love to see even four infiltrator arrows spammed on a biuld not specifically built to do just that, dont even know of 5 is possible if fully built for. > > U guys gotta stop embarrassing ourselves constantly going on that thief has effectively infinite ini and evades to spam as it's getting old. > > And u are wrong about thieves skills buffed far more than others, look at head shot daze is 1/4 sec compared to the 3/4-1 sec + other classes have, yes cuz of ini resource. What's shield bash do dps and daze wise? Anyway their skills are far from buffed more than other classes. > > entire InI design means that it doesnt matter how bad some of the skills are, they just dont get used then. > build is weighted by the strongest ability. > thats why PW is spammed, thats why flanking is spammed thats why vault is spammed thats why SB 5 is spammed. > Thats why thief will always be kitten to balanced. > In theory every single thief ability should be kitten, but they should cover specific cases, meaning you can exploit specific things out of enemies, but in reality there is nothing that can exploit evade/invuln spam so there are build that just spam 1 ability and call it a day. > > As to why thief builds are used now more then before? > Swipe buff. > Stolen skills buff. > Mesmer nerfs. > Warrior nerf. > Holo nerfs. > Rev nerf. > + thief depends on meta, since its the most mobile class of all. True that is when the best skill gets spammed over the others but the issue also is the imbalance of good to not great skills in thieves kit that promote this. If headshot was a rushing pistol stock to the head like a real pistol wip causing a 2 second stun (similar to warrior shield) pw wouldn't need the stun as u could do the pistol rush stun than pw but headshots 1/4 cc is only useful for inturups but if headshot did 2 sec stun I'd be used more and one skill wouldn't have to be loaded. S/d it's easy to see why dagger 4 and 5 are fillers, d4 mostly but really s2 and s3 are the only skills in the kit that deserve to be more than a filler. Anet tried making most of the skills weaker compared to other classes in comparison cuz they can be spammed in succession but the drawback is only the useful ones will be used. Ini being the global resource is also a balance decision I can guess. Anet should think about doing a better job of spreading skill value among whole weapon kits instead of having one or two outliers in each that are spammed. Would make thief more fun in the end having to combine more types of skills together to get the results that say pw gives in one press. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonidrex.5649 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > > In theory every single thief ability should be kitten, but they should cover specific cases, meaning you can exploit specific things out of enemies, but in reality there is nothing that can exploit evade/invuln spam so there are build that just spam 1 ability and call it a day. > > Why are people pretending like you can't start casting a stun in the middle of pistol whip so it lands while the anim finishes? > Its not nothing. any high damaging/cc move once that thief commits to pistol whip is going to hit them if you cast it in the middle of their swipes, whether or not they stow. > > Its like half the people upset about it have never played a fighting game where they had to learn frame data. > > But w/e > > first of all, learn to read and comprehend. I wasnt complaining about P/W. This is why you dont take words out of context. sec of all, not many abilities can be cast fast to cancel the cast, cast can be covered by terrain, can be faked and moved by steal/shadowstep/signet or whatever. And in rality even if you DO stun thief, he can remove said stun 3 times. You better have more then 3 stuns and land them all mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeikeNz.3526 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 you can compare chronophantasma, why chronophantasma have a 50% dmg reduction and 1 1/2s daze on it because of the spam, i would like to know why chrono can't spam his phantasm with full dmg potential while thiefs can Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Fear.1624 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 > @"SeikeNz.3526" said: > > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said: > > > @"SeikeNz.3526" said: > > > because thief can spam the same skill forever, they need to add a cast time or use more init points to thief skills if they reuse it > > > > Exactly like infiltrator arrow for example one cast cost 6 of 12 ini or black powder cost 5 out of 12 resulting in two instantly repeatable cast with no ini left to cast any other skill which is basically the same as spamming it forever in the gw2 forum universe lol > > you can do it way more than 2 times, you can spam it more like 4-5 times in a row, also thiefs skills are way more buffed than other classes, something have to be done to thiefs spam of the same skill. > > 1- make the skill cost more init if they are reused > 2- lower the dmg to half > 3-make the skill get a longer cast time if they are reused Max initiative pool is 15. Shortbow 5 cost is 6 initiative. So, on demand is 2 in a row. Some thieves might waste roll for initiative and get 3, but it requires an about face and a stun break waste. Then our attack potential is lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > first of all, learn to read and comprehend. I wasnt complaining about P/W. This is why you dont take words out of context. ? Okay, let's not take your words out of context. You're talking about other things of course, but none of the other things you are talking about are currently seen as egregiously unbalanced **by the forum community as it currently stands.** So I'm addressing **what is seen as unbalanced** in particular. If you think any of the other mechanics, or thief in general, is unbalanced, that's fine and dandy and not my battle. But, since you **included what is seen as unbalanced** , I replied to you. Observe. >**build is weighted by the strongest ability.** > **thats why PW is spammed** Implication: Pistol whip is strong. > Thats why thief will always be kitten to balanced. > In theory every single thief ability should be kitten, but they should cover specific cases... Assertion: Thief is hard to balance because its builds have spammable strong skills. Every thief ability should be garbage on their own but counter specific things. Whether you think that this is the ideal, or what the designers intended doesn't matter. What matters is you think it's the right direction and that some skills do not fit that. One of those skills, as you implied above, is pistol whip. That's what I'm here for. People who want to come claim thief needs to be nerfed because shortbow, flanking strike and/or vault are free to do that (and be debated). > ...but in reality **there is nothing that can exploit evade/invuln spam** so there are build that just spam 1 ability and call it a day. I provided a rebuttal to **this point in particular**. Don't know why you think I don't understand what you're saying. The only class that can spam one ability is thief, and since you mentioned that you considered pistol whip strong, it makes perfect sense to assume that you feel that thief can spam one ability and **not be exploited.**, and that the pool of those abilities that they could spam includes the one that you consider to be strong. I asserted that, at least in the case of pistol whip, they **absolutely could, very easily.** Don't know why that made you angry. As for the rest: > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > sec of all, not many abilities can be cast fast to cancel the cast... Fair, but some can. MoD, for example, is instant. For the others, you dont need to cancel the cast. You can interrupt the aftercast. > cast can be covered by terrain, can be faked and moved by steal/shadowstep/signet or whatever. Mindgames/Terrain based play really doesn't count as making the skill itself broken. At some point a player being cunning with how they approach you needs to not be attributed to the class being broken. > And in rality even if you DO stun thief, he can remove said stun 3 times. You better have more then 3 stuns and land them all mate. Or you can use a high damaging move instead and give him direct damage, even besides the fact that moves that stun recharge almost twice as fast, if not faster, than the thief's stunbreaks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stand The Wall.6987 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 sindrener happened. where is that culprit? anyway people want easy wins, especially with reward heavy online games. also mmorpg type games with metas that have fewer choices (when much more are possible) will always fail over time. if we compare gw1 with gw2 (brace yourself), the results are staggering. in competitive modes, gw1 had a meta build for every elementalist element, total of four. not even counting hybrid builds like e/mo and e/rt and possibly a few others. gw2 has one for ele. yes yes you can play staff, dagger, or scepter, but can you on the top level? no. that's the point so stop arguing, no one cares about your meme build. continuing on, this is because if the lack of each professions total weapon/ utility skill pool. naturally if there are fewer meta choices, there are more people playing each professions meta (assume 1 meta for each profession which is generally true unfortunately), so the more people are effected by strong builds in other professions. if there is a more diverse meta, many builds per profession, then the more counters there are and the less total people effected by op builds in other professions. all of this stems from conquest. the mode dictates the build. conquest imo is a total failure as soon as they took away team queue. right now you have a bunch of randoms competing for a single place on the ladder in a team orientated environment. its a cluster fuck. oh and the only way to communicate to each other is to type. in combat and need help? too bad! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zexanima.7851 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > > first of all, learn to read and comprehend. I wasnt complaining about P/W. This is why you dont take words out of context. > > ? > > Okay, let's not take your words out of context. > > You're talking about other things of course, but none of the other things you are talking about are currently seen as egregiously unbalanced **by the forum community as it currently stands.** So I'm addressing **what is seen as unbalanced** in particular. If you think any of the other mechanics, or thief in general, is unbalanced, that's fine and dandy and not my battle. But, since you **included what is seen as unbalanced** , I replied to you. > > Observe. > > >**build is weighted by the strongest ability.** > > **thats why PW is spammed** > > Implication: Pistol whip is strong. > > > Thats why thief will always be kitten to balanced. > > In theory every single thief ability should be kitten, but they should cover specific cases... > > Assertion: Thief is hard to balance because its builds have spammable strong skills. Every thief ability should be garbage on their own but counter specific things. Whether you think that this is the ideal, or what the designers intended doesn't matter. What matters is you think it's the right direction and that some skills do not fit that. > One of those skills, as you implied above, is pistol whip. > > That's what I'm here for. > People who want to come claim thief needs to be nerfed because shortbow, flanking strike and/or vault are free to do that (and be debated). > > > ...but in reality **there is nothing that can exploit evade/invuln spam** so there are build that just spam 1 ability and call it a day. > > I provided a rebuttal to **this point in particular**. Don't know why you think I don't understand what you're saying. The only class that can spam one ability is thief, and since you mentioned that you considered pistol whip strong, it makes perfect sense to assume that you feel that thief can spam one ability and **not be exploited.**, and that the pool of those abilities that they could spam includes the one that you consider to be strong. > > I asserted that, at least in the case of pistol whip, they **absolutely could, very easily.** Don't know why that made you angry. > > > As for the rest: > > > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > > sec of all, not many abilities can be cast fast to cancel the cast... > Fair, but some can. MoD, for example, is instant. For the others, you dont need to cancel the cast. You can interrupt the aftercast. > > cast can be covered by terrain, can be faked and moved by steal/shadowstep/signet or whatever. > Mindgames/Terrain based play really doesn't count as making the skill itself broken. At some point a player being cunning with how they approach you needs to not be attributed to the class being broken. > > And in rality even if you DO stun thief, he can remove said stun 3 times. You better have more then 3 stuns and land them all mate. > Or you can use a high damaging move instead and give him direct damage, even besides the fact that moves that stun recharge almost twice as fast, if not faster, than the thief's stunbreaks. > > Can't we just agree that **most** every profession had some broken kitten that needs to be fixed instead of wagging our fingers at each other like "Nuh uh, my professions fine, yours is the broken one!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonidrex.5649 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > > first of all, learn to read and comprehend. I wasnt complaining about P/W. This is why you dont take words out of context. > > ? > > Okay, let's not take your words out of context. > > You're talking about other things of course, but none of the other things you are talking about are currently seen as egregiously unbalanced **by the forum community as it currently stands.** So I'm addressing **what is seen as unbalanced** in particular. If you think any of the other mechanics, or thief in general, is unbalanced, that's fine and dandy and not my battle. But, since you **included what is seen as unbalanced** , I replied to you. > > Observe. > > >**build is weighted by the strongest ability.** > > **thats why PW is spammed** > > Implication: Pistol whip is strong. > > > Thats why thief will always be kitten to balanced. > > In theory every single thief ability should be kitten, but they should cover specific cases... > > Assertion: Thief is hard to balance because its builds have spammable strong skills. Every thief ability should be garbage on their own but counter specific things. Whether you think that this is the ideal, or what the designers intended doesn't matter. What matters is you think it's the right direction and that some skills do not fit that. > One of those skills, as you implied above, is pistol whip. > > That's what I'm here for. > People who want to come claim thief needs to be nerfed because shortbow, flanking strike and/or vault are free to do that (and be debated). > > > ...but in reality **there is nothing that can exploit evade/invuln spam** so there are build that just spam 1 ability and call it a day. > > I provided a rebuttal to **this point in particular**. Don't know why you think I don't understand what you're saying. The only class that can spam one ability is thief, and since you mentioned that you considered pistol whip strong, it makes perfect sense to assume that you feel that thief can spam one ability and **not be exploited.**, and that the pool of those abilities that they could spam includes the one that you consider to be strong. > > I asserted that, at least in the case of pistol whip, they **absolutely could, very easily.** Don't know why that made you angry. > > > As for the rest: > > > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > > sec of all, not many abilities can be cast fast to cancel the cast... > Fair, but some can. MoD, for example, is instant. For the others, you dont need to cancel the cast. You can interrupt the aftercast. > > cast can be covered by terrain, can be faked and moved by steal/shadowstep/signet or whatever. > Mindgames/Terrain based play really doesn't count as making the skill itself broken. At some point a player being cunning with how they approach you needs to not be attributed to the class being broken. > > And in rality even if you DO stun thief, he can remove said stun 3 times. You better have more then 3 stuns and land them all mate. > Or you can use a high damaging move instead and give him direct damage, even besides the fact that moves that stun recharge almost twice as fast, if not faster, than the thief's stunbreaks. > > In theory every single thief ability should be kitten, but they should cover specific cases, meaning you can exploit specific things out of enemies, but in reality there is nothing that can exploit evade/invuln spam so there are build that just spam 1 ability and call it a day. -> to counter 1 ability hard hitters use blind. -> to counter builds that spam boons use ability that steals boons -> to counter builds with low CD that relay on spamming them use abilities with chill -> to counter long cast time builds use skills with slow etc etc. if those things where spread out across the board for thief, they could use specific abilities to center then against specific enemies. but as it stands that is not the case and implementing it would be tough. What I ment is that there is no way to counter evades/invulnerabilities. No abilities in thief arsenal can specifically target evades. What I was saying wasnt targeting P/W at all. there is no boon, no condition and no ability nothing that screws with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 > @"Zexanima.7851" said: > Can't we just agree that **most** every profession had some broken kitten that needs to be fixed instead of wagging our fingers at each other like "Nuh uh, my professions fine, yours is the broken one!" **NEVER** Jokes aside: I'm totally fine with a nerf to the -stun- portion of the thief skill, just not the evade. Regarding that in particular, you're going to have to drag that evade away from my thief's cold dead fingers/claws/charr-grabbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > What I ment is that there is no way to counter evades/invulnerabilities. No abilities in thief arsenal can specifically target evades. > What I was saying wasnt targeting P/W at all. > there is no boon, no condition and no ability nothing that screws with it. I apologize. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zexanima.7851 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"Zexanima.7851" said: > > Can't we just agree that **most** every profession had some broken kitten that needs to be fixed instead of wagging our fingers at each other like "Nuh uh, my professions fine, yours is the broken one!" > > **NEVER** > > Jokes aside: I'm totally fine with a nerf to the -stun- portion of the thief skill, just not the evade. But in this instance in particular, you're going to have to drag that evade away from my thief's cold dead fingers/claws/charr-grabbers. > > > Honestly the stun is the only thing I have a problem with. Being able to spam something that removes agency from the player just isn't fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 > @"Zexanima.7851" said: > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > @"Zexanima.7851" said: > > > Can't we just agree that **most** every profession had some broken kitten that needs to be fixed instead of wagging our fingers at each other like "Nuh uh, my professions fine, yours is the broken one!" > > > > **NEVER** > > > > Jokes aside: I'm totally fine with a nerf to the -stun- portion of the thief skill, just not the evade. But in this instance in particular, you're going to have to drag that evade away from my thief's cold dead fingers/claws/charr-grabbers. > > > > > > > > Honestly the stun is the only thing I have a problem with. Being able to spam something that removes agency from the player just isn't fun. Then we're on the same page. As I mentioned in the other thread, I use it defensively. The stun is just frosting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zexanima.7851 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"Zexanima.7851" said: > > > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > > > @"Zexanima.7851" said: > > > > Can't we just agree that **most** every profession had some broken kitten that needs to be fixed instead of wagging our fingers at each other like "Nuh uh, my professions fine, yours is the broken one!" > > > > > > **NEVER** > > > > > > Jokes aside: I'm totally fine with a nerf to the -stun- portion of the thief skill, just not the evade. But in this instance in particular, you're going to have to drag that evade away from my thief's cold dead fingers/claws/charr-grabbers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Honestly the stun is the only thing I have a problem with. Being able to spam something that removes agency from the player just isn't fun. > > Then we're on the same page. As I mentioned in the other thread, I use it defensively. The stun is just frosting. Just imagine bulls rush if it had something like 3 charges (heh, pun). Other than the fact it's already OP and it would be super busted, that would really be un-fun to play against. That's how PW feels Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 > @"Zexanima.7851" said: > Just imagine bulls rush if it had something like 3 charges (heh, pun). Other than the fact it's already OP and it would be super busted, that would really be un-fun to play against. That's how PW feels. ~~How dare you call bull's rush OP~~ Nah I've been on the receiving end as necro after hearing frustration from a friend who mains necro vs it. The only thing that saved me from getting stunlocked is foot in the grave, doom, and running staff if they are traited to rip swiftness from me. I can def see how it is annoying. Vs necro though. I have no sympathy for any other class fighting it. Especially soulbeast. And I need that evade. It's the only thing stopping me from bitter 18k backstabs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zexanima.7851 Posted January 15, 2020 Share Posted January 15, 2020 > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said: > > @"Zexanima.7851" said: > > Just imagine bulls rush if it had something like 3 charges (heh, pun). Other than the fact it's already OP and it would be super busted, that would really be un-fun to play against. That's how PW feels. > > ~~How dare you call bull's rush OP~~ > Nah I've been on the receiving end as necro. The only thing that saved me from getting stunlocked is foot in the grave, doom, and running staff if they are traited to rip swiftness from me. I can def see how it is annoying. > Vs necro though. I have no sympathy for any other class fighting it. Especially soulbeast. > Is there anyone who doesn't dislike soulbeast besides soulbeast players? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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