sigur.9453
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Posts posted by sigur.9453
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> @"Zagerus.8675" said:
> > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > its called (raid training) guild.
> I don't disagree with you but I still would love to see some sort of automated grouping mechanism for raids in the game itself so I can be lazy. In the meantime I've actually taken the initiative and made a roster-only guild for people who are interested in pugging/training fractal CM's and raids. Let me know if you're interested.
nice, gl with that. your EU or NA? may sometimes willing to help out.
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> @"Zagerus.8675" said:
>
> > @"maxwelgm.4315" said:
> >
> > Most people in this forum and reddit alike overestimate (or explicitly play up) the amount of "organization" raids in GW2 require compared to other MMOs. Our raids are absolutely stellar in design precisely because the mechanics are intuitive enough and the roles are flexible enough (everything has always gotten cleared in day 1 and Anet never said a word about any mechanics). A queue would not immediately change the population make up and you'd still be getting matched to players who more or less know what the key roles are, just as if you joined a LFG 250+ LI run. With kicks still being enabled it would be even easier to simply have people constantly joining in your squad until you get someone who knows/wants to do what you want. **We have no raids that require more than very basic markers and assignments organization**, nothing has an extremely short window and even backups can be assigned for absolutely most mechanics. We already play the "dumbed down" versions, though I think that term doesn't do justice to how fun it is.
> >
> > Now, that doesn't mean I think a queue is a good idea, but the reason is another altogether: the actual issue with a queue is that _the social aspect is part of game mode_. The time you spend waiting up and chatting up people is not only relevant, it is also valuable to build raiding as a separate game mode, regardless of whether or not you "just wanted to get on with it". It's an integral part of playing it just like being inside a locker room with people you may or may not like is an integral part of playing field sports. There is no getting around this and the mode will lose its identity the moment you remove the necessity for more meaningful social interactions. Waiting for a PvP queue for example also has its unique social aspect which brings the mode more flavor, to the point that I doubt people queue from outside the Mists very often even if this option is now available. When people complain about waiting several minutes to form a group or that their friends can't always be there on the static day, etc. they should realize they're actually already raiding in a sense.
>
> A majority of my groups consist of raiding for 3-4 pulls before someone has to bail (40 minutes to get the team together, we're honestly pretty sick of chatting at that point.) Then we wait another 5-10 minutes, I run through the process of explaining mechanics again ect. This is literally every time that I want to dive into this content and I know this is true for many people. When you do this waiting daily because you're earnest about learning the bosses it's just a turn off. A queue may not be the answer but there has to be some way to funnel like-minded players toward this content in a more efficient manner than the LFG.
its called (raid training) guild.
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> @"warherox.7943" said:
> This post is an example of how ascended gear got added to the game. Incredibly small group of players complain that this isn't like WoW and doesn't have gear grind. Anet adds ascended gear to cater to them.
>
>
still in pain after all those years. gl
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> @"XYLO.7031" said:
> > @"blackheartgary.8605" said:
> > Hello.
> > Guild wars 2 is a GAME. it's supposed to be FUN. if you stop having fun it becomes a job. it becomes work.
>
> 100% Yes. I don't come home from work to work again. This game has been a great wind down from everyday responsibilities.
>
> I'm thankful for everyone's hard work @ Anet as well as the engagement of the community.
>
> I'll just purchase digital items in our shared, imaginary world and hop around the vast expanse of Tyria & Elona.
>
>
That's one of the "arguments" I have a problem with. If the game is fun and if its changed in a way that it's no more fun for you. (you know, fun is different for everyone) Who's fault is it? And to add, not that I think the devs are not doing a good job, but hard work =/= good work automatically. Some things can and should be critizised.
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I don't know what the purpose of this thread is. Don't be unhappy? Noone attacked any developer, yet this gets an anet reply? It's amazing that developers made this awesome stunt that their customers call themself gamers and apearantly should be glad that they are allowed to play their game? If I'm unhappy with a product, for whatever reason, and I feel the need to critizise that, I should be allowed to to this in a responsible matter. The other way would just be so stop consuming that product. It's for all the white knights here to deside which would be on a better business interest.
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> @"Tyson.5160" said:
> > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > @"Tyson.5160" said:
> > > It’s like the same people that say they only play GW2 for Raids and raids alone. There’s better games for if you love raiding.
> > >
> > > That’s like someone who loves racing games only plays GW2 for the beetle racing, it’s a bit absurd.
> >
> > Hi, I am one of those players. Sadly there is no game currently that can compete with Gw2 fight mechanics. Which is an important part for me. And the few raids we have here are awesome. Arguable not all of them. But rest assured, at the first glance of a raid focused game with equal or better "feeling" I will leave this, for you absurd state. A win win so you may call it.
>
> Did you ever do WoW raiding?
Way back in vanilla. I'm old. 40 man squads, loved to hate.(it actually was awesome, nostalgia kicks in) But yeah, more a fan of action based combat now. They may have changed that, but well, it's not that eye pleasing anymore.
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> @"Tyson.5160" said:
> > @"Vinceman.4572" said:
> > > @"Tyson.5160" said:
> > > > @"Vinceman.4572" said:
> > > > > @"Astralporing.1957" said:
> > > > > > @"Vinceman.4572" said:
> > > > > > And that's the reason why most of the raiders have nothing against an easy mode if the rewards are very well balanced.
> > > > > Actually, the ones that do speak up about it usually want the rewards to be _below_ the incentive level. The term "few greens at best" has been used more than once. "no rewards" was used even more often. I do not remember even a single raider that actually wanted decent rewards for the mode. I do remember however people saying that easy mode would not deserve such.
> > > >
> > > > What you describe is the disparity between both sides. Since I've read enough raiders here in this thread that are open-minded to liquid gold reward of 50s, rares and exotics and some also mentioned minis + shards in addition it's the anti-raid fraction that feels this is not enough. So, where to draw the line? If you give easy mode people access to legendary armor & ring people wouldn't run normal mode in the slightest. I'm sorry here but that's why a reasonable approach has to deny that.
> > > >
> > > > Personally I think it's enough if people get champ bags + some shards + a possibility for minis. Just compare it to other "casual" stuff, the rewards aren't better there so no easy mode raider should be entitled to demand something completely out of rationality. The actual example with the Lair of the Snowmen clearly shows it: You have a guarantee for wintersday gifts plus a *chance* for an exotic weapon but you can also get a rare (2 rares out of 3 daily runs for me).
> > > >
> > > > So in comparison, my approach is pretty generous but I tell you this won't be enough for the "loot army" which will appear in 3...2...1...
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > You can also get a mini from the Lair.
> > >
> > > I think if the easy mode gave a cap in 75 shards half of what normal mode that in my opinion is good incentive to run the content if you want something like minis or maybe exotics of the current skins. If you want more shards in the week you would have to jump to normal.
> > >
> > > I agree though, keep the Legendary stuff to normal mode.
> >
> > That's why I included minis in my post. (And it's just reasonable since minis are also thrown out like crazy/easy to get in normal mode).
> > And no, 75 shards per week is too much. 15-25 would be fine and just fair.
>
> 15 to 25 shards would mean you could buy something like an ascended Armor chest in like 4 months. That carrot would be too far and no one would do it.
Don't forget you can trade in you minis for more shards.
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> @"Tyson.5160" said:
> It’s like the same people that say they only play GW2 for Raids and raids alone. There’s better games for if you love raiding.
>
> That’s like someone who loves racing games only plays GW2 for the beetle racing, it’s a bit absurd.
Hi, I am one of those players. Sadly there is no game currently that can compete with Gw2 fight mechanics. Which is an important part for me. And the few raids we have here are awesome. Arguable not all of them. But rest assured, at the first glance of a raid focused game with equal or better "feeling" I will leave this, for you absurd state. A win win so you may call it.
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if you are not on the keyboard, its afk farming, which is a bannable offense. i would link you the statement, but i am pretty sure you can handle the searchbar yourself.
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> @"Gulbasaur.1865" said:
> I'm glad someone said this. Chrono was _broken_ to the extent that the whole meta scene was basically built up around one signet and one trait and everyone else in the squad was disposable. That should never have been the case.
>
> Some of the other mesmer changes were a bit heavy handed, but the tank with the game's biggest barbreaker who also generates _all the boons_, trivially, for everyone, repeatedly and constantly, was clearly not something that was working as intended. It had a hard rotation of to pick up at times and there were some skilled players, but it had become a vending machine for boons within the community due to an oversight.
>
> Easy mode has been removed.
what you call disposable, i call free to play what i want.
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as other already said. im not particulary looking forward to a 8/10 fixed spot meta.
while i agree that chrono was/is overpowered it allowed a variation of the other classes you want to bring into your squad. with the prepatch support meta you had only 4 spots locked (2 chrono, 1 druid, 1 bs), now when if its even a slightly change and one more spot is resserved for whatever reason, we will already have 50% of the group "set in stone". sure it very hypothetical at the moment, but i fear that if SC comes up with "their" new meta, pug groups will follow and waiting times will only increase. or to say, it will be more restictiv, which imo is the wrong direction to go.
so overall, thank you to all chrono players that allowed me to play what i want over the last few years.
edit: quite unhappy with your balance/important gear update scedule. bring 1 BIG balance/Gear patch every few months, or bring super small hotfixes each week. your current system with medíum updates, that are either based on future patches, or where future patches will make those changes already obsolet are the worst way to go. it makes me feel that your teams do not talk to each other and simply release what they have been burdend with, and the next team has to addapt to that. thy.
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one thing that i have realised, if you are just playing a specific kind of content for its rewards its shit content or a shit game.
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> @"Tyson.5160" said:
> > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > @"Tyson.5160" said:
> > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > > @"Tyson.5160" said:
> > > > > > @"Henry.5713" said:
> > > > > > Cute little "raid". They should introduce such event instances more often. The difficulty is about what people expect out of easy mode raids, I guess.
> > > > >
> > > > > Yeah, this is generally, what I would expect an easy or story mode to operate like.
> > > >
> > > > so doing it once and never look at it again?
> > >
> > > I’m going to be going back in to collect the minis that drop as well as the weapons.
> >
> > ah, loot > fun, i see.
>
> I take it you don’t like the lair of the snowmen.
Nah, it's ok. One time. Was just wondering why you only used the loot thing as lone reason to go back and didn't mentioned the fun part in any way. Since, you know, you are arguing in other threads for Raid easy mode which would be dead on arrival without a loot carotte it seams. Maybe!
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> @"Raipe.3786" said:
> People can't play without quickness/alacrity lul
people can, but its not a lot of fun gameplay wise. lul x D x D
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> @"Tyson.5160" said:
> > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > @"Tyson.5160" said:
> > > > @"Henry.5713" said:
> > > > Cute little "raid". They should introduce such event instances more often. The difficulty is about what people expect out of easy mode raids, I guess.
> > >
> > > Yeah, this is generally, what I would expect an easy or story mode to operate like.
> >
> > so doing it once and never look at it again?
>
> I’m going to be going back in to collect the minis that drop as well as the weapons.
ah, loot > fun, i see.
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> @"Tyson.5160" said:
> > @"Henry.5713" said:
> > Cute little "raid". They should introduce such event instances more often. The difficulty is about what people expect out of easy mode raids, I guess.
>
> Yeah, this is generally, what I would expect an easy or story mode to operate like.
so doing it once and never look at it again?
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> @"Nimon.7840" said:
> >
> I'd say both. Leave necro as it is right now, give it a team buff that adds 2-3k DPS to the group. Done.
> There will be a lot of necros running around.
>
just to add to that,also according to raidar. in this this patch circle, power necro is one of the least played power classes. behind (ignoring hipster builds) are only : dps chrono, spb & p herald.
on condi though is 3rd place behind mirage & berserker (including BS)
un support also on 3rd spot behind chrono & druid (excluding BS since i put it in dps stats)
not wanting to say anything with this information, but i find it quite interesting ^^
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> @"Nimon.7840" said:
> > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > @"Nimon.7840" said:
> > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > > @"Nimon.7840" said:
> > > > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > > > > @"Nimon.7840" said:
> > > > > > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > > > > > > @"Farkon.2170" said:
> > > > > > > > > > @"Dace.8173" said:
> > > > > > > > > > > @"Zero.3871" said:
> > > > > > > > > > > Even when i personally never do PvE (so i cannot speak from my personal experience), i see that there is obviously a Problem with necro in gw2. i also dont understand why People prefer to wait 5 more minutes for Special classes than needing 2 more min with necro in Team. of Course it is stupid, but finally this Situation is real and anet created that by mishandling the necromancer FOR YEARS. Maybe necro could easily do that stuff but anet made community toxic AGAINST necros and **should take responsibility** for this and make the game fun for necro mains again because games should be fun and not frustrating.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > maybe at the very beginning of the game the current performance of necros would be enough, but after all the years of necro underperformance in pve we have that situation (and i really feel with OP, because his screenshoots are real and frustrating). atm, after years of mishandling the Situation there is just 1 solution left, bringing necro exactly in line with others.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Arena Net did not make people toxic against Necromancers. That's just silly and a statement you can't support. The situation is not as simplistic as you paint it and ignores far too many important factors.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Indirectly they did. Indirectly they can prevent people from being toxic to Necromancers by giving them a feasible role in which they can contribute to, whether it's DPS, Support, or another viable role.
> > > > > > > > > With a role then players will have a need for them instead of the opposite.
> > > > > > > > > Also, there's a lot of assumptions being flung around and I found it amusing when you got mad at my quotes.
> > > > > > > > > Regardless, the fact of the matter is Necros are underperforming and unfriendly to newer players due to never being updated and their innate limitations as well, we can argue the semantics until we're throwing mud around like monkeys, but it doesn't change that fact.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > But there are already viable dps an support options. They are even meta on some bosses. I think we don't need to talk about wvw. And they are quite the opposite of unfriendly to new players which imo is the main reason of the "necro hate". Regarding viability necros are in line with other professions.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Wait. We have 2 bosses where scourge is meta.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Soulless horror, but you only take one scourge there, to epi the golems and wurms
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > And sabetha to kite and kill adds.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Regarding viability necro is definetly not in line with other professions.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > No DPS spec that can compete with the other classes
> > > > > > > No support spec that is good outside of one to carry complete idiots (and then they might still not do enough damage)
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > The big issue with necromancer: anet has to make everything about booncorrupt and area damage, which is just not needed or good for engame pve.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Unless they bring a boss, that constantly applies boons to corrupt into bleed/torment/confusion/burning
> > > > > > > And also make the boss an addboss that is just killing 5billion adds in fast time (power classes might be better for this though)
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Beeing meta is not nessasary to get into pug groups. You sound like an elitist. Ironicly this thread only exists because off people with your mindset.
> > > > >
> > > > > I'm not an elitist. By far not. I just wanna be effective for my group, whatever group I play in. If it's in my static or in pugs.
> > > > >
> > > > > But if I put the same amount of work into another class, that I put work into necro, every other class id play, would do more dps
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > That's not correct, at least not on every boss.
> > > >
> > > > > or i can keep people at 100% with healing, if they aren't complete dumb players, not even having to rezz them (yeah a lot of druids fail this).
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > Necro is in line with other heal supports, your point is you have different choices? Sounds good to me.
> > > >
> > > > > So if you can play holo and necro right now, both at 90-95% what would you play?
> > > > > If you now say necro, I don't want to ever have you in my group, because that sounds like: I don't care, I just do what I want, I'm not playing for the group.
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > Since it's about pugs. If you do 90%+ dps it does not matter on which class, you will be top dps most of the times. And yes I actually play to have fun,so I will actually play the class I want to. In the static it depends, mostly it even matters less except you go for more advanced tactics. thats sounds pretty elitist to me btw.
> > > >
> > > > > I got like 4 or 5 classes equipped for raids. And there's not many bosses where I play necro. Because even if I can play other classes only at 90% while I play necro at 99 or 100%, I do more damage with other classes, than with necro. Which leads me to play other classes, because I don't want to get permanently carried by other people's dps.
> > > >
> > > > I have one power and one condi char for every class, I like to play around. While I do more dps on some classes, it really does not matter. if you do 99% you are not getting carried. I'm used to doing low man fullclears/wings.... 3k+++ dps difference when you go with a full squad does not matter.
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > As long as necro isn't on par golem DPS wise. People will always look down on necro. That's just how it is.
> > > 3k more pve-dps wouldn't hurt anywhere.
> > > Anet just has to work more with the skill split.
> > >
> > > I mean, they already did it for scourge (icd on dhuumfire)
> > > Why can't they make it so necro does 33k DPS as well?
> > > Necro is the only class, that doesn't have a benchmark in the 32-33k range.
> > > Or just make the bloodversion do 30k (it's at 27-28 right now I believe), cause with VP it could get as well to 32-33k DPS.
> > >
> > > It's just a way too selfish class, that anet always is afraid to give good DPS, cause it might end up too good in pvp-modes (even though it wouldn't matter, weaknesses will stay, and if you don't know, the weaknesses of a necro, you deserve to die).
> > > Or design more bosses with large trash mobs, or with a lot boons to corrupt.
> > >
> > > Then you could leave necro as it is.
> >
> > thats one of the first "non emotional" comments from someone of "your side" and i highly appreachiate it.
> > i agree, 3k dps+ wouldn´t hurt. but aslong as epi holds necro hostage anet will be scared to do so, or it will at least take some time to make small adjustments and increase the dps. and it would make necro even more broken on bosses where epi bouncing is already a pretty good strat. not that i would care, but balance team does for sure.
>
> Epi bounce is dead. Maybe to kill some adds but not to actually damage the boss.
> Also just make power reaper stronger, that wouldn't change a thing bout epi.
>
> Also for scourge. From the introduction video of scourge, I think it was called a condition based support.
> Now I have a big problem with that:
> 1) there are no real good stats combos for such a spec
> 2) if you want to do proper support you have to play dagger, which results in a power based support.
>
> I really wouldn't mind, if they gutted scourges dps- ability even more, but give him way better support (more boons).
>
>
>
> > but im quite not sure if it would fix the "look down on necro part".
> > i certainly do not want to offend anyone, but well, the amount of necros (& dh´s as well in that regard) which are highly underperforming is huge in comparisson to other classes. obviously thats no fact and my personal opinion (buildt over 2,5 years), but people i know will agree with that. as said before, i would never kick someone for beeing a certain class, but i am often more then happy if a necro/dh player actually pulls his/her weight.(80%+). might have something to do that those 2 classes are always recommended to new players.
>
>
i agree, it is certainly not on the power level it was before, but its a thin line to walk balance wise. if you boost scourge single target dps to much you are "in danger" of just stacking them when bouncing is possible and a you take the "free" 10-20% dps increase.(don´t call me out on the numbers, it was around 40% pre nerf i think).
power in fractals/raids would need some love but i think its hard for anet to balance that since its already one of the strongest OW builds. sadly they take that also in consideration. not saying that i think they should. i mean they know the numbers and had years of time, something is clearly holding them back.
> The problem I have. We accepted almost everything in our static when we were only 8 or 9 people, even power reapers.
> We all gave them a chance, but from my experience, we had one good reaper, and 40 bad ones (not only raids, also fractals).
yes, thats exactly what i was talking about and more reason that necros gets "excluded" than the balance issue, at least not directly.
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> @"Nimon.7840" said:
> > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > @"Nimon.7840" said:
> > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > > @"Nimon.7840" said:
> > > > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > > > > @"Farkon.2170" said:
> > > > > > > > @"Dace.8173" said:
> > > > > > > > > @"Zero.3871" said:
> > > > > > > > > Even when i personally never do PvE (so i cannot speak from my personal experience), i see that there is obviously a Problem with necro in gw2. i also dont understand why People prefer to wait 5 more minutes for Special classes than needing 2 more min with necro in Team. of Course it is stupid, but finally this Situation is real and anet created that by mishandling the necromancer FOR YEARS. Maybe necro could easily do that stuff but anet made community toxic AGAINST necros and **should take responsibility** for this and make the game fun for necro mains again because games should be fun and not frustrating.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > maybe at the very beginning of the game the current performance of necros would be enough, but after all the years of necro underperformance in pve we have that situation (and i really feel with OP, because his screenshoots are real and frustrating). atm, after years of mishandling the Situation there is just 1 solution left, bringing necro exactly in line with others.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Arena Net did not make people toxic against Necromancers. That's just silly and a statement you can't support. The situation is not as simplistic as you paint it and ignores far too many important factors.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Indirectly they did. Indirectly they can prevent people from being toxic to Necromancers by giving them a feasible role in which they can contribute to, whether it's DPS, Support, or another viable role.
> > > > > > > With a role then players will have a need for them instead of the opposite.
> > > > > > > Also, there's a lot of assumptions being flung around and I found it amusing when you got mad at my quotes.
> > > > > > > Regardless, the fact of the matter is Necros are underperforming and unfriendly to newer players due to never being updated and their innate limitations as well, we can argue the semantics until we're throwing mud around like monkeys, but it doesn't change that fact.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > But there are already viable dps an support options. They are even meta on some bosses. I think we don't need to talk about wvw. And they are quite the opposite of unfriendly to new players which imo is the main reason of the "necro hate". Regarding viability necros are in line with other professions.
> > > > >
> > > > > Wait. We have 2 bosses where scourge is meta.
> > > > >
> > > > > Soulless horror, but you only take one scourge there, to epi the golems and wurms
> > > > >
> > > > > And sabetha to kite and kill adds.
> > > > >
> > > > > Regarding viability necro is definetly not in line with other professions.
> > > > >
> > > > > No DPS spec that can compete with the other classes
> > > > > No support spec that is good outside of one to carry complete idiots (and then they might still not do enough damage)
> > > > >
> > > > > The big issue with necromancer: anet has to make everything about booncorrupt and area damage, which is just not needed or good for engame pve.
> > > > >
> > > > > Unless they bring a boss, that constantly applies boons to corrupt into bleed/torment/confusion/burning
> > > > > And also make the boss an addboss that is just killing 5billion adds in fast time (power classes might be better for this though)
> > > >
> > > > Beeing meta is not nessasary to get into pug groups. You sound like an elitist. Ironicly this thread only exists because off people with your mindset.
> > >
> > > I'm not an elitist. By far not. I just wanna be effective for my group, whatever group I play in. If it's in my static or in pugs.
> > >
> > > But if I put the same amount of work into another class, that I put work into necro, every other class id play, would do more dps
> > >
> >
> > That's not correct, at least not on every boss.
> >
> > > or i can keep people at 100% with healing, if they aren't complete dumb players, not even having to rezz them (yeah a lot of druids fail this).
> > >
> >
> > Necro is in line with other heal supports, your point is you have different choices? Sounds good to me.
> >
> > > So if you can play holo and necro right now, both at 90-95% what would you play?
> > > If you now say necro, I don't want to ever have you in my group, because that sounds like: I don't care, I just do what I want, I'm not playing for the group.
> > >
> >
> > Since it's about pugs. If you do 90%+ dps it does not matter on which class, you will be top dps most of the times. And yes I actually play to have fun,so I will actually play the class I want to. In the static it depends, mostly it even matters less except you go for more advanced tactics. thats sounds pretty elitist to me btw.
> >
> > > I got like 4 or 5 classes equipped for raids. And there's not many bosses where I play necro. Because even if I can play other classes only at 90% while I play necro at 99 or 100%, I do more damage with other classes, than with necro. Which leads me to play other classes, because I don't want to get permanently carried by other people's dps.
> >
> > I have one power and one condi char for every class, I like to play around. While I do more dps on some classes, it really does not matter. if you do 99% you are not getting carried. I'm used to doing low man fullclears/wings.... 3k+++ dps difference when you go with a full squad does not matter.
> >
> >
>
> As long as necro isn't on par golem DPS wise. People will always look down on necro. That's just how it is.
> 3k more pve-dps wouldn't hurt anywhere.
> Anet just has to work more with the skill split.
>
> I mean, they already did it for scourge (icd on dhuumfire)
> Why can't they make it so necro does 33k DPS as well?
> Necro is the only class, that doesn't have a benchmark in the 32-33k range.
> Or just make the bloodversion do 30k (it's at 27-28 right now I believe), cause with VP it could get as well to 32-33k DPS.
>
> It's just a way too selfish class, that anet always is afraid to give good DPS, cause it might end up too good in pvp-modes (even though it wouldn't matter, weaknesses will stay, and if you don't know, the weaknesses of a necro, you deserve to die).
> Or design more bosses with large trash mobs, or with a lot boons to corrupt.
>
> Then you could leave necro as it is.
thats one of the first "non emotional" comments from someone of "your side" and i highly appreachiate it.
i agree, 3k dps+ wouldn´t hurt. but aslong as epi holds necro hostage anet will be scared to do so, or it will at least take some time to make small adjustments and increase the dps. and it would make necro even more broken on bosses where epi bouncing is already a pretty good strat. not that i would care, but balance team does for sure.
but im quite not sure if it would fix the "look down on necro part".
i certainly do not want to offend anyone, but well, the amount of necros (& dh´s as well in that regard) which are highly underperforming is huge in comparisson to other classes. obviously thats no fact and my personal opinion (buildt over 2,5 years), but people i know will agree with that. as said before, i would never kick someone for beeing a certain class, but i am often more then happy if a necro/dh player actually pulls his/her weight. (80%+). might have something to do that those 2 classes are always recommended to new players.
-
> @"Talindra.4958" said:
> > @"Linken.6345" said:
> > > @"Talindra.4958" said:
> > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > type "-sell" in the filter for a quick fix.
> > > > but yeah, would harm/hurt anyone i guess. wouldn´t be my top priority though.
> > >
> > > This.
> > > -sell
> > > It filters all selling lfm out
> >
> > sadly it dont always work sellers want to be seen and use ë or é or or the wierd number presses to make it look like a e so you still see them.
>
> I have never seen seller do that. There only few sellers in EU
they do on EU aswell. but as @"Eramonster.2718" said, i don´t know how sellers would think that would be usefull in anyway. "oh no, they outsmarted my filter, now i will buy a kill".
-
> @"Nimon.7840" said:
> > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > @"Nimon.7840" said:
> > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > > @"Farkon.2170" said:
> > > > > > @"Dace.8173" said:
> > > > > > > @"Zero.3871" said:
> > > > > > > Even when i personally never do PvE (so i cannot speak from my personal experience), i see that there is obviously a Problem with necro in gw2. i also dont understand why People prefer to wait 5 more minutes for Special classes than needing 2 more min with necro in Team. of Course it is stupid, but finally this Situation is real and anet created that by mishandling the necromancer FOR YEARS. Maybe necro could easily do that stuff but anet made community toxic AGAINST necros and **should take responsibility** for this and make the game fun for necro mains again because games should be fun and not frustrating.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > maybe at the very beginning of the game the current performance of necros would be enough, but after all the years of necro underperformance in pve we have that situation (and i really feel with OP, because his screenshoots are real and frustrating). atm, after years of mishandling the Situation there is just 1 solution left, bringing necro exactly in line with others.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Arena Net did not make people toxic against Necromancers. That's just silly and a statement you can't support. The situation is not as simplistic as you paint it and ignores far too many important factors.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Indirectly they did. Indirectly they can prevent people from being toxic to Necromancers by giving them a feasible role in which they can contribute to, whether it's DPS, Support, or another viable role.
> > > > > With a role then players will have a need for them instead of the opposite.
> > > > > Also, there's a lot of assumptions being flung around and I found it amusing when you got mad at my quotes.
> > > > > Regardless, the fact of the matter is Necros are underperforming and unfriendly to newer players due to never being updated and their innate limitations as well, we can argue the semantics until we're throwing mud around like monkeys, but it doesn't change that fact.
> > > >
> > > > But there are already viable dps an support options. They are even meta on some bosses. I think we don't need to talk about wvw. And they are quite the opposite of unfriendly to new players which imo is the main reason of the "necro hate". Regarding viability necros are in line with other professions.
> > >
> > > Wait. We have 2 bosses where scourge is meta.
> > >
> > > Soulless horror, but you only take one scourge there, to epi the golems and wurms
> > >
> > > And sabetha to kite and kill adds.
> > >
> > > Regarding viability necro is definetly not in line with other professions.
> > >
> > > No DPS spec that can compete with the other classes
> > > No support spec that is good outside of one to carry complete idiots (and then they might still not do enough damage)
> > >
> > > The big issue with necromancer: anet has to make everything about booncorrupt and area damage, which is just not needed or good for engame pve.
> > >
> > > Unless they bring a boss, that constantly applies boons to corrupt into bleed/torment/confusion/burning
> > > And also make the boss an addboss that is just killing 5billion adds in fast time (power classes might be better for this though)
> >
> > Beeing meta is not nessasary to get into pug groups. You sound like an elitist. Ironicly this thread only exists because off people with your mindset.
>
> I'm not an elitist. By far not. I just wanna be effective for my group, whatever group I play in. If it's in my static or in pugs.
>
> But if I put the same amount of work into another class, that I put work into necro, every other class id play, would do more dps
>
That's not correct, at least not on every boss.
> or i can keep people at 100% with healing, if they aren't complete dumb players, not even having to rezz them (yeah a lot of druids fail this).
>
Necro is in line with other heal supports, your point is you have different choices? Sounds good to me.
> So if you can play holo and necro right now, both at 90-95% what would you play?
> If you now say necro, I don't want to ever have you in my group, because that sounds like: I don't care, I just do what I want, I'm not playing for the group.
>
Since it's about pugs. If you do 90%+ dps it does not matter on which class, you will be top dps most of the times. And yes I actually play to have fun,so I will actually play the class I want to. In the static it depends, mostly it even matters less except you go for more advanced tactics. thats sounds pretty elitist to me btw.
> I got like 4 or 5 classes equipped for raids. And there's not many bosses where I play necro. Because even if I can play other classes only at 90% while I play necro at 99 or 100%, I do more damage with other classes, than with necro. Which leads me to play other classes, because I don't want to get permanently carried by other people's dps.
I have one power and one condi char for every class, I like to play around. While I do more dps on some classes, it really does not matter. if you do 99% you are not getting carried. I'm used to doing low man fullclears/wings.... 3k+++ dps difference when you go with a full squad does not matter.
-
> @"DragonFury.6243" said:
> > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > @"DragonFury.6243" said:
> > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > > @"DragonFury.6243" said:
> > > > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > > > > @"DragonFury.6243" said:
> > > > > > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > > > > > > @"DragonFury.6243" said:
> > > > > > > > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > > > > > > > Btw. this happend out of boredom with my static + 2 randoms (we don´t do w3 normaly)
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > https://www.gw2raidar.com/encounter/TonnesPunchesNervousTrustsDrinking
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > setup was:
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > 2 chronos
> > > > > > > > > > 4 pReaper
> > > > > > > > > > 2 cScouges
> > > > > > > > > > 1 cReaper(!)
> > > > > > > > > > 1 support scourge
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > don´t mind the low dps numbers
> > > > > > > > > > a) mayor hickups in orb phase (we tried to insta pull in a circle with GS5, which happend 0/6 times)
> > > > > > > > > > b) most of us have never been on the golem with necro (okok, we honestly suck with that class)
> > > > > > > > > > c) not min max gear + buffood
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > it was a pretty chill (hehe) first try though.
> > > > > > > > > > we also 6 or 7(?) manned escort beforehand with 1 chrono rest necro.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > necro does fine in raids.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > no one here is arguing the capability of any profession to clear contents what we are here discussing is why a certain profession keep getting kicked from PUGs before they are allowed to do content
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > so you finaly agree that its not a balance issues, perfect. can we now talk about the social issue why necro(an dh also in that regard) have a chance of not beeing accepted?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > its is NOT a social issue its A PURE BALANCE issue as in a one certain profession doing way less than any other profession and it did stay at the bottom for too long
> > > > > > > and you want it to stay the lowest for some reason
> > > > > > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > > > > > sry, you sound like you want necro to be the be all, end all meta dps/support/power/condi class.
> > > > > > > i want necro to be treated inline with other profession i can only assume where this irrational hatred toward necro is coming from
> > > > > >
> > > > > > as long as a good player on necro can outdps every other profession played by an average player, its not a balance issue.
> > > > > LMAO
> > > > > what a sound argument that good necro can out DPS other profession played by bad players
> > > > > and a good player on any other profession can out preform god tier necro player by alot
> > > > > and by your definition its called a social issue
> > > > > and its not in the middle here is a hint [sC benchmark](https://snowcrows.com/benchmarks/ "SC benchmark") you ll see both necro elites are in the bottom
> > > >
> > > > it might me a shocker but golem =/= actuall raidboss. you sound like an elitist!
> > > > look at the global stats https://www.gw2raidar.com/global_stats an filter by boss.
> > > >
> > >
> > > from the data of gw2raidar stat filter by each boss and by taking the most effective DPS build for each profession on every boss and rank them on scale 1 to 9 (1 top 9 bottom) if a profession have 2 DPS build i ll take the highest and it will be counted as 1
> > > the result was
> > > encounter_____________necromancer rank __ necromancer DPS/NO.1 DPS
> > > Vale Guardian___________________6________________19.9/24.2
> > > Gorseval the Multifarious__________5________________18/21.3
> > > Sabetha the Saboteur____________6_________________19.7/23.2
> > > Slothasor______________________8_________________17.5/23.8
> > > Matthias Gabrel_________________5________________19.6/25
> > > Keep Construct_________________7_________________23.8/29
> > > Xera_________________________6_________________15.3/18.7
> > > Cairn the Indomitable___________9__________________24.4/35.9
> > > Mursaat Overseer______________9__________________25.7/33.2
> > > Samarog_____________________6__________________14.2/16.3
> > > Deimos______________________8__________________16.7/26.8
> > > Soulless Horror________________9__________________24.4/32.9
> > > Voice in the Void______________4__________________13.9/16.4
> > > Conjured Amalgamate__________6__________________35.1/46.5
> > > Twin Largos__________________5__________________17.7/25.2
> > > Qadim______________________7__________________13.9/18
> > >
> > > conclusion so the global stat from necromancer is 6.25 (highest possible score is 1 and lowest possible score is 9)
> > > but the fact that necromancer out DPS warrior in most of the time because warrior is a support DPS and taking in account total DPS increase to the whole group , warrior will out perform necromancer and taking that in account the new corrected global stat from necromancer is 7.25 (highest possible score is 1 and lowest possible score is 9)
> > > and i like to call that necromancer performance coefficient in raid
> > > and you claim that neromancer is in the middle of pack is as obscured as you claim that the game is balanced because
> > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > as long as a good player on necro can outdps every other profession played by an average player, its not a balance issue.
> >
> > good job,well done.
> > now it would be interessting what scores the other classes have. then we can compare where necro actually stands.
>
> 1-THIEF___________3
> 2-REVENANT______3.4375
> 3-ELEMENTALIST___3.9375
> 4-ENGINEER_______4
> 5-MESMER_______4.4375
> 6-GUARDIAN_____5.5625
> 7-NECROMANCER_6.625
> 8-WARRIOR______6.9375
> 9-RANGER_______7.1875
>
> ranger as a profession wont suffer because PUGs still want 1 to 2 as a healer druids(kiter/pusher)
> warrior as a profession wont suffer because PUGs still want at least 1 for banner
> necromancer give nothing( boon removal that SB banner job)
>
>
Good job again. But sadly you still don't get it and show once again that you are at best a beginner when it comes to raids or let's say only playing it super casually. 2 druids is worse than one druid and a sup scourge. Sb banner for boon removal? Seriously?
But to get back to the topic. Why I can join pug groups as a DPS warrior and a DPS soulbeast (and necro obviously) while you can't as a dps necro? What are the variables that change in my experience and yours? Do make it easier: it's certainly not balance since we both play the same game. Think about it and maybe you will see the major differences................
It's the person that wants to join a group. And it's the groups that you want to join.
-
> @"Nimon.7840" said:
> > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > @"Farkon.2170" said:
> > > > @"Dace.8173" said:
> > > > > @"Zero.3871" said:
> > > > > Even when i personally never do PvE (so i cannot speak from my personal experience), i see that there is obviously a Problem with necro in gw2. i also dont understand why People prefer to wait 5 more minutes for Special classes than needing 2 more min with necro in Team. of Course it is stupid, but finally this Situation is real and anet created that by mishandling the necromancer FOR YEARS. Maybe necro could easily do that stuff but anet made community toxic AGAINST necros and **should take responsibility** for this and make the game fun for necro mains again because games should be fun and not frustrating.
> > > > >
> > > > > maybe at the very beginning of the game the current performance of necros would be enough, but after all the years of necro underperformance in pve we have that situation (and i really feel with OP, because his screenshoots are real and frustrating). atm, after years of mishandling the Situation there is just 1 solution left, bringing necro exactly in line with others.
> > > >
> > > > Arena Net did not make people toxic against Necromancers. That's just silly and a statement you can't support. The situation is not as simplistic as you paint it and ignores far too many important factors.
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > Indirectly they did. Indirectly they can prevent people from being toxic to Necromancers by giving them a feasible role in which they can contribute to, whether it's DPS, Support, or another viable role.
> > > With a role then players will have a need for them instead of the opposite.
> > > Also, there's a lot of assumptions being flung around and I found it amusing when you got mad at my quotes.
> > > Regardless, the fact of the matter is Necros are underperforming and unfriendly to newer players due to never being updated and their innate limitations as well, we can argue the semantics until we're throwing mud around like monkeys, but it doesn't change that fact.
> >
> > But there are already viable dps an support options. They are even meta on some bosses. I think we don't need to talk about wvw. And they are quite the opposite of unfriendly to new players which imo is the main reason of the "necro hate". Regarding viability necros are in line with other professions.
>
> Wait. We have 2 bosses where scourge is meta.
>
> Soulless horror, but you only take one scourge there, to epi the golems and wurms
>
> And sabetha to kite and kill adds.
>
> Regarding viability necro is definetly not in line with other professions.
>
> No DPS spec that can compete with the other classes
> No support spec that is good outside of one to carry complete idiots (and then they might still not do enough damage)
>
> The big issue with necromancer: anet has to make everything about booncorrupt and area damage, which is just not needed or good for engame pve.
>
> Unless they bring a boss, that constantly applies boons to corrupt into bleed/torment/confusion/burning
> And also make the boss an addboss that is just killing 5billion adds in fast time (power classes might be better for this though)
Beeing meta is not nessasary to get into pug groups. You sound like an elitist. Ironicly this thread only exists because off people with your mindset.
-
> @"DragonFury.6243" said:
> > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > @"DragonFury.6243" said:
> > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > > @"DragonFury.6243" said:
> > > > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > > > > @"DragonFury.6243" said:
> > > > > > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > > > > > > @"DragonFury.6243" said:
> > > > > > > > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > > > > > > > > @"DragonFury.6243" said:
> > > > > > > > > > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > @"DragonFury.6243" said:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Btw. this happend out of boredom with my static + 2 randoms (we don´t do w3 normaly)
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > https://www.gw2raidar.com/encounter/TonnesPunchesNervousTrustsDrinking
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > setup was:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2 chronos
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4 pReaper
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2 cScouges
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1 cReaper(!)
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1 support scourge
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > don´t mind the low dps numbers
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > a) mayor hickups in orb phase (we tried to insta pull in a circle with GS5, which happend 0/6 times)
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > b) most of us have never been on the golem with necro (okok, we honestly suck with that class)
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > c) not min max gear + buffood
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > it was a pretty chill (hehe) first try though.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > we also 6 or 7(?) manned escort beforehand with 1 chrono rest necro.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > necro does fine in raids.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > no one here is arguing the capability of any profession to clear contents what we are here discussing is why a certain profession keep getting kicked from PUGs before they are allowed to do content
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > so you finaly agree that its not a balance issues, perfect. can we now talk about the social issue why necro(an dh also in that regard) have a chance of not beeing accepted?
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > its is NOT a social issue its A PURE BALANCE issue as in a one certain profession doing way less than any other profession and it did stay at the bottom for too long
> > > > > > > > > > > and you want it to stay the lowest for some reason
> > > > > > > > > > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > > > > > > > > > sry, you sound like you want necro to be the be all, end all meta dps/support/power/condi class.
> > > > > > > > > > > i want necro to be treated inline with other profession i can only assume where this irrational hatred toward necro is coming from
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > as long as a good player on necro can outdps every other profession played by an average player, its not a balance issue.
> > > > > > > > > LMAO
> > > > > > > > > what a sound argument that good necro can out DPS other profession played by bad players
> > > > > > > > > and a good player on any other profession can out preform god tier necro player by alot
> > > > > > > > > and by your definition its called a social issue
> > > > > > > > > and its not in the middle here is a hint [sC benchmark](https://snowcrows.com/benchmarks/ "SC benchmark") you ll see both necro elites are in the bottom
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > it might me a shocker but golem =/= actuall raidboss. you sound like an elitist!
> > > > > > > > look at the global stats https://www.gw2raidar.com/global_stats an filter by boss.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > from the data of gw2raidar stat filter by each boss and by taking the most effective DPS build for each profession on every boss and rank them on scale 1 to 9 (1 top 9 bottom) if a profession have 2 DPS build i ll take the highest and it will be counted as 1
> > > > > > > the result was
> > > > > > > encounter_____________necromancer rank __ necromancer DPS/NO.1 DPS
> > > > > > > Vale Guardian___________________6________________19.9/24.2
> > > > > > > Gorseval the Multifarious__________5________________18/21.3
> > > > > > > Sabetha the Saboteur____________6_________________19.7/23.2
> > > > > > > Slothasor______________________8_________________17.5/23.8
> > > > > > > Matthias Gabrel_________________5________________19.6/25
> > > > > > > Keep Construct_________________7_________________23.8/29
> > > > > > > Xera_________________________6_________________15.3/18.7
> > > > > > > Cairn the Indomitable___________9__________________24.4/35.9
> > > > > > > Mursaat Overseer______________9__________________25.7/33.2
> > > > > > > Samarog_____________________6__________________14.2/16.3
> > > > > > > Deimos______________________8__________________16.7/26.8
> > > > > > > Soulless Horror________________9__________________24.4/32.9
> > > > > > > Voice in the Void______________4__________________13.9/16.4
> > > > > > > Conjured Amalgamate__________6__________________35.1/46.5
> > > > > > > Twin Largos__________________5__________________17.7/25.2
> > > > > > > Qadim______________________7__________________13.9/18
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > conclusion so the global stat from necromancer is 6.25 (highest possible score is 1 and lowest possible score is 9)
> > > > > > > but the fact that necromancer out DPS warrior in most of the time because warrior is a support DPS and taking in account total DPS increase to the whole group , warrior will out perform necromancer and taking that in account the new corrected global stat from necromancer is 7.25 (highest possible score is 1 and lowest possible score is 9)
> > > > > > > and i like to call that necromancer performance coefficient in raid
> > > > > > > and you claim that neromancer is in the middle of pack is as obscured as you claim that the game is balanced because
> > > > > > > > @"sigur.9453" said:
> > > > > > > > as long as a good player on necro can outdps every other profession played by an average player, its not a balance issue.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > good job,well done.
> > > > > > now it would be interessting what scores the other classes have. then we can compare where necro actually stands.
> > > > > > and since appearently you don´t know, warrior has a dps build, so you really should not take banners into account when you compare the dps values.
> > > > >
> > > > > i know necro is underperforming so i did the math its necromancer forum after all and the warrior builds provided by gw2raidar is with banner and we all know that is better than warrior DPS and i did say i ll take the most effective DPS build
> > > > > if you want to do the math for other profession be my guest and from what i saw when i did my calculation necro would be at the bottom and the only other profession that might come close to necro will be ranger
> > > >
> > > > no, full stop!
> > > > first: the warrior build on raidar are WITH an WITHOUT Banners, they sadly share the same "slot". but be assured that the top numbers are done WITHOUT banners. on condi at least, on power psb should be better then core, and then also, without banners.
> > > > second: dont get me wrong here, i don´t mean it hostile, but your score for necro is pretty meaningless if you dont compare it with other classes.
> > > >
> > > > did a "quick one" for warrior and got a "score" of 7,06. so WORSE then necro overall. yet i was perfectly able to join every group as war dps player so far (2 years +). ---> balance doesn´t matter.
> > >
> > > i did told that i ll take the most effective build for each profession so warrior with banner is the most effective build for warriors (DPS increase to the whole group is added to warrior DPS)
> > > and trying to compare warrior to necro is obscured
> > > BTW by taking warrior banner into consideration warrior score will be higher and the corrected necro score is 7.25
> >
> > you just can´t change values because they don´t fit you good madam/Sir.
> > or do you want do do the math vor chrono dps group increase with the boon share? keep it real here.
> > why is it obscure? explain.
> > what are you talking about? waah?!
> >
>
> i did not change any value and if you want to ignore that warrior is better with banner that is you problem not mine
> and you want to keep it real well warrior give banner necro give nothing
> and chrono boon share is a support(not DPS) and this was about the most effective DPS build
>
warrior with banners is support!
warrior without banners is dps.
i think you have no clue about raiding and classes in general and thats the problem.
Rate GW2 2018
in Guild Wars 2 Discussion
Posted
voted for 6, the only relevant content for me released this year was wing 6. without my ingame friends i would have left already. step up your game, not a lot of friends left to keep me playing sadly.