Ragnar.4257

> @"Psycoprophet.8107" said: > > @"Ragnar.4257" said: > > > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said: > > > > @"Ragnar.4257" said: > > > > Against power guardian: > > > > > > > > Shadowshot -> unblockable 3k damage -> dash out of range of counter-pressure > > > > > > > > Repeat until you win, don't even need other weapon skills. Bonus points for using the stolen 3s daze. > > > > > > Lmao just that easy eh, given guards a known hard counter to thieves and known to be in favor of guard when players are close to equal skill im surprised everyone has missed this easy tactic all these yrs, who woulda thought it was so easy lol. > > > Man these forums are sad these days. > > > > Doesn't stop it being true. And whether or not the matchup is in favour of the thief or the guard, doesn't change the fact that this is the best strategy for the thief to emply. > > > > Thieves lose to guards when they try to stay in melee and go toe-to-toe. > > > > Thieves can beat power guards when they spike-and-kite, and prioritise their unblockable stuff. > > > > Talking about a dps power guard, not a burn-bunker. > > u saying it doesnt make it true :) all ur statements says is u sit there and eat repeated shodow shots till ur dead lol what are u doing in between afking, Then complain how easy a target u are? What could it do? It can't catch the thief? The way a guardian beats a thief is by standing on point and waiting for the thief to come close and make the mistake of fighting toe-to-toe. The way a thief beats guardian is to refuse to play that game.

> @"Psycoprophet.8107" said: > > @"Ragnar.4257" said: > > Against power guardian: > > > > Shadowshot -> unblockable 3k damage -> dash out of range of counter-pressure > > > > Repeat until you win, don't even need other weapon skills. Bonus points for using the stolen 3s daze. > > Lmao just that easy eh, given guards a known hard counter to thieves and known to be in favor of guard when players are close to equal skill im surprised everyone has missed this easy tactic all these yrs, who woulda thought it was so easy lol. > Man these forums are sad these days. Doesn't stop it being true. And whether or not the matchup is in favour of the thief or the guard, doesn't change the fact that this is the best strategy for the thief to employ, which is what OP asked for. OP didn't ask "which matchup is thief favoured in", he asked "how should I go about fighting X class". You've not understood. Thieves lose to guards when they try to stay in melee and go toe-to-toe. Thieves can beat power guards when they spike-and-kite, and prioritise their unblockable stuff. Talking about a dps power guard, not a burn-bunker.

Against power guardian: Shadowshot+111 -> unblockable blind, teleport, 3k damage -> dash out of range of counter-pressure Repeat until you win, don't even need other weapon skills. Bonus points for using the stolen 3s daze.

If you've just had a series of wins, and your rating is now higher than it should be, then a series of losses is to be expected. It's just luck being evened out.

> @"WillPaharu.4837" said: > > @"Sigmoid.7082" said: > > So the crux of your argument is the build, based on metabattle, isn't strictly meta therefore shouldn't be nerfed / can in no way can be a problem or threat? > > > > ... > > > > You must be new here. > > Loads of stuff in that category has been changed in the past. > > I don't care about how often it's done, I don't see the logic behind it. have you seen "good" builds in plat games? the crux of my argument is they aren't even remotely meta. have you even seen a decap druid in high ranked games? have you seen a druid in a team that has won monthly ATs? The build is not that effective compared to broken builds. Dragon hunter and rev short bow should be the priority. The nerfs weren't that bad, but I maintain that they were uncalled for and bottom priority.

> @"WillPaharu.4837" said: > > @"Ragnar.4257" said: > > > @"WillPaharu.4837" said: > > > > @"Ragnar.4257" said: > > > > Imagine referencing metabattle as some kind of argument. The site that has core engineer rated as higher than decap druid, and rates holosmith higher than renegade, DH, healbreaker..... > > > > > > ?? what site is rating holosmith higher than renegade? on metabattle the only meta builds displayed are renegade, dh, healbreaker. > > > > Explosive Sword (Holo): 5/5 > > Shortbow Shiro: 4.4/5 > > > > The fact is, that the ratings and 'meta' designation on metabattle are just some guy's opinion. It's no more valid than your opinion or mine, not based on some complex statistical analysis. > > > > Saying "metabattle says......" is the same as saying "I know this dude who says......" > > the builds on meta battle that are ranked meta are the current meta builds. they are always the meta builds. the strongest builds. you're ignoring my point and trying to say it's down to opinion. but the fact is builds listed as meta are the most popular/strongest builds. I don't care about the ratings by the users, I'm saying what is actually listed on the site as meta are the meta builds. or are you going to say that shortbow rev, dh and heal breaker aren't meta? are you going to say that every meta build ever listed as a meta build is has not been a meta build? > Metabattle.com meta builds are the way for seeing what the current strongest build and therefore a reliable place to look at what might be overpowered. > > And on the point of user ratings, they are rated by people who actually play the build. the opinions of the players are the basis for nerfs. if you're saying we can ignore popular opionon, then arena net would never have to do a nerf again. that is not so, because popular opinion dictates the game mode. if players are saying a build is only "good" and not "great" or "meta" then it's not much of a threat or a problem. No, I'm saying that Shortbow Rev, Dh, and Healbreaker are **not the only meta builds**. Where is fireweaver? Where is core-guard support? Just because something is not listed as meta on metabattle, does not mean it isn't meta. And just because decap-druid was only rated as "good" doesn't mean that it was actually worse than the great/meta rated builds. Metabattle is useful as a general guideline for new players. It is not the holy gospel of universal truth on all things meta. It usually lags behind the meta by several months.

> @"Eli.4291" said: > LOL they really nerfed ele, warrior, ranger & a cleansing rune while FIXING DH BUGS. lmao. Buckle down guys the DH meta is going to be a long one You do realise that that "bug fix" is actually a nerf, right? And is, infact, such a significant nerf that we probably won't see DH anymore at top-level play? It will, of course, continue to linger in lower ranks, because lower ranks always take 6 months to catch on to what the pros are doing.

> @"WillPaharu.4837" said: > > @"Ragnar.4257" said: > > Imagine referencing metabattle as some kind of argument. The site that has core engineer rated as higher than decap druid, and rates holosmith higher than renegade, DH, healbreaker..... > > ?? what site is rating holosmith higher than renegade? on metabattle the only meta builds displayed are renegade, dh, healbreaker. Explosive Sword (Holo): 5/5 Shortbow Shiro: 4.4/5 The fact is, that the ratings and 'meta' designation on metabattle are just some guy's opinion. It's no more valid than your opinion or mine, not based on some complex statistical analysis. Saying "metabattle says......" is the same as saying "I know this dude who says......"

Imagine referencing metabattle as some kind of argument. The site that has core engineer rated as higher than decap druid, and rates holosmith higher than renegade, DH, healbreaker.....

Of the 4 classes that OP complains about, the only one that Ranger should legitimately struggle playing into is Revenant. "How long will these classes be meme gods" -> proceeds to cite mesmer. This should be a sign of the quality of debate here.

> @"Filip.7463" said: > > @"Crab Fear.1624" said: > > I know it is not prevalent on the forums now, but this class is probably the best at 1 v 1, with like zero bad match-ups; the only problem lies with the primate at the keyboard. > > In second post you are saying guard is the strongest, in third post you are saying spirit weapons are op, in fourth post you are saying trapper rune is op... decide now pls Goldfish can only remember the last thing that killed them, and that must be the most OP thing ever.

> @"Arheundel.6451" said: > > Is this Gold rank? ..There are like 5 guardians in a match here , if somebody new would take the forum seriously they'd think that PvP is 10 rangers per match....where each pet can facetank a whole team (minimum) by itself and then the ranger comes in and Maul one shot what's left standing xd Who are you even talking to? Who was suggesting there are 10 rangers per match? As someone who has mained power-guardian in P2 EU for the past few seasons, I can tell you that the only 1v1's that I go into knowing I'm almost certainly going to eventually lose, are renegade, weaver, and ranger. Mesmer I go into fully expecting to win, and if I don't then I've been heavily outplayed. This isn't an opinion hastily cobbled together, it's a long-term trend observed over 1000s of games, against top-tier players. The fact that the rangers you get placed against can't deal with a TORCH guardian...... I mean, anything goes at that level I guess.

> @"Avatar.3568" said: > > @"Ragnar.4257" said: > > > @"Crozame.4098" said: > > > > @"Ragnar.4257" said: > > > > Guardian beats mesmer, engi, thief > > > > Guardian is 50/50 with necro, warrior, these matchups really come down to skill or 1 lucky hit turning everything around. > > > > Guardian loses to rev/ren, ranger, weaver > > > > > > > > So, no, guardian is not "the strongest". If you're a mesmer or thief I can imagine you'd think that. But if you're a renegade guardians are free food. Guardian actually has a fairly balanced mix of matchups, with some being easy and some being very hard. > > > > > > > > I'm assuming this is a troll post; the above is just an FYI for anyone else reading this. If it isn't a troll post...... yikes. Just try asking anyone in the top 100 what the strongest 1v1 class is. It'll be a looooong time before anyone says "guardian". > > > > > > > Guardian is 50/50 with necro, warrior, these matchups really come down to skill or 1 lucky hit turning everything around. > > > > Guardian loses to rev/ren, ranger, weaver > > > Depends on build right? > > > > > > Again war, FB can win quite easily? Core bunker can not loose to it and can win the node, same for rev? > > > ranger, at least it is super easy to kill the pet for a burn guard? > > > > > > > Well, yes it depends on build. The above is a general guide, not true for every possible combination of builds. FB from a year ago would beat warrior easily.... but you must have missed like 10 balance patches to think that's still true. > > > > Ranger pet will only die in a 1v1 with guard if the ranger isn't paying attention and doesn't make use of pet swap/recall. Obviously if the ranger is bad, the guardian will win. That's not really a valid comparison. > > It's possible to pay attention, but if you sawp your pet because it has 100hp and your full pet comes without cd increase, it's possible that it can survive the 15 seconds or it survives 3 seconds because it gets hit by 1 spirit sword > > Do tell me more about how a spirit sword, which will do at most 8k burning damage if all 4 hits connect, can insta-kill a pet with 28k-40k hp. In a 1v1 scenario, if your pet dies its your own fault. Simply no other way of looking at it. Obviously in big fights its different, but 1v1 its very clear.

> @"Crozame.4098" said: > > @"Ragnar.4257" said: > > Guardian beats mesmer, engi, thief > > Guardian is 50/50 with necro, warrior, these matchups really come down to skill or 1 lucky hit turning everything around. > > Guardian loses to rev/ren, ranger, weaver > > > > So, no, guardian is not "the strongest". If you're a mesmer or thief I can imagine you'd think that. But if you're a renegade guardians are free food. Guardian actually has a fairly balanced mix of matchups, with some being easy and some being very hard. > > > > I'm assuming this is a troll post; the above is just an FYI for anyone else reading this. If it isn't a troll post...... yikes. Just try asking anyone in the top 100 what the strongest 1v1 class is. It'll be a looooong time before anyone says "guardian". > > > Guardian is 50/50 with necro, warrior, these matchups really come down to skill or 1 lucky hit turning everything around. > > Guardian loses to rev/ren, ranger, weaver > Depends on build right? > > Again war, FB can win quite easily? Core bunker can not loose to it and can win the node, same for rev? > ranger, at least it is super easy to kill the pet for a burn guard? > Well, yes it depends on build. The above is a general guide, not true for every possible combination of builds. FB from a year ago would beat warrior easily.... but you must have missed like 10 balance patches to think that's still true. Ranger pet will only die in a 1v1 with guard if the ranger isn't paying attention and doesn't make use of pet swap/recall. Obviously if the ranger is bad, the guardian will win. That's not really a valid comparison.

> @"Armen.1483" said: > > @"Ragnar.4257" said: > > Guardian beats mesmer, engi, thief > Actually mesmer counters DH. You can trigger their traps with phantasms if they want to meme trap you on node. > True, but guardian is more than just trapper-DH. TBH, everything counters trapper-DH. Beating trapper-DH isn't about classes or builds, it's just about applying 3% of brain power. But try telling that to this community....

Guardian beats mesmer, engi, thief Guardian is 50/50 with necro, warrior, these matchups really come down to skill or 1 lucky hit turning everything around. Guardian loses to rev/ren, ranger, weaver So, no, guardian is not "the strongest". If you're a mesmer or thief I can imagine you'd think that. But if you're a renegade guardians are free food. Guardian actually has a fairly balanced mix of matchups, with some being easy and some being very hard. I'm assuming this is a troll post; the above is just an FYI for anyone else reading this. If it isn't a troll post...... yikes. Just try asking anyone in the top 100 what the strongest 1v1 class is. It'll be a looooong time before anyone says "guardian".

> @"Supreme.3164" said: > > @"Yasai.3549" said: > > No they aren't. > > They have had their power level severely neutered, that much is true, but so did most of the Professions. > > > > Only few builds (not professions, builds) are left largely untouched and are truly thriving. > > I'd argue that ranger is truly the only profession I don't see spammed left and right anylonger, I'd say that at best you can reach gold 3 on ranger with good luck on yourside and playing just +1 zerk core hit and run. Not enough sustain for anything else really atm on ranger, they gutted any possibility for a competitive duellist. > > With all the buffs to mobility, pretty much any class can keep up with a ranger trying to kite away and that was the main source of sustain for ranger with the other being the GS block which has been severely nerfed to uselness, it's the only source of blocking on the class and now the long CD made it that much worst. > > I really don't see nearly as many rangers as before...actually I see many more eles than rangers now and it's a first, the best PvP build for the class is rated as good for max Gold rank so...I don't think my thread is that wrong Ranger GS block has the exact same cooldown as the equivalent skills of Warrior Shield Block and Engineer Shield Block, and as a measure of seconds-blocked-per-seconds-CD also has the same value as Rev Staff block. Also has a lower CD than guardian focus block, lower CD than chrono shield block, and when traited has better block uptime than Scrapper hammer. "nerfed to uselness" - when infact its as good as, or better, than everyone else's block skills. Your bias is showing. Also, I see plenty of rangers in plat-2. Honestly, if Renegade gets the nerfs it deserves in the next patch (whenever that is....), I can totally see Ranger being meta on sides again. It's only real competition atm is weaver. Ranger's only issue in PvP right now is the exact same issue it has had since the launch of the game, which is that its abilities don't scale up when the size of the fights scales up. I.e. its value drops way off when things escalate to 4+ vs 4+.

> @"Filip.7463" said: > > @"Math.5123" said: > > > @"Bazsi.2734" said: > > > > @"Filip.7463" said: > > > > > @"Ragnar.4257" said: > > > > > > @"Filip.7463" said: > > > > > > > @"Math.5123" said: > > > > > > > > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Math.5123" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Brokensunday.4098" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > > > > > > > I'd rather they add a little more...What to call it, variety? Depth? To the setup. Traps as a concept are all well and good, but maybe it isn't a good idea to have a trap with such narrow counters. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Stability, blocks, ports out, invul. Does not seem narrow at all to counter it .. just saying if you get stuck on it with 0 cooldows yes i see how you can die to it but thats not dm fault. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > stability works. > > > > > > > > > > invuln works > > > > > > > > > > block does not work, you get cced back into the trap > > > > > > > > > > teleports kind of work, you do teleport but when teleport ends you still get knocked down. > > > > > > > > > > As a mesmer I never really gave a kitten cuz I had jaunt/blink and F4, but when I started playing ranger its kitten awfull. > > > > > > > > > > god forbids you dont have 100% cooldowns else you dead from full hp, no counterplay. > > > > > > > > > > like the only thing you can do is dodge out, and use stun-break during knockdown animation, and hope to gods that the trap bugs and lets you out, otherwise you die from full hp > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On ranger you have 3/4 cleanse utilities. Meaning you can cleanse the stacks whenever they get out of hand if you don't have the stability to get out. How is this any different from the old holo that could 100 to zero you in a prime light beam you didn't dodge? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > difference is that holo cant do that anymore and DH can. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Don't get me wrong, burn dh is beyond dumb. But Maw or damage isn't the reason. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Any class with triple offensive trait-lines and no stunbreak will be able to pump. Just remove trapper runes and the build will be gone. > > > > > > > > > > > > Then trapper ranger is also gone, killing 2 builds for reason of one? > > > > > > > > > > Does anyone really want to see trapper rangers every game? It's just as obnoxious, just not as effective. Same with old trapper thief. > > > > > > > > With removing the rune they destroy one build that was not needed to be destroyed. > > > > > > And by keeping the rune they destroy an enitre gamemode that was not needed to be destroyed lol. Are we seriously justifying trapper DH with trapper ranger now? > > > > Agreed, the rune is anti fun to play against. Its just that trap dh is a stronger build than trap ranger. They are both equally unfun to play vs. > > nerf other things on dh then - VoJ maybe? Trapper rune destroys multiple builds if it gets removed You're still missing the point. Nobody wants those other builds either. The fact that they get destroyed is not a negative. Not to mention the hypocrisy of your own words. Nerfing VoJ nerfs many other core guard and FB builds. I thought nerfing other builds because of 1 problem build was bad?

> @"Filip.7463" said: > > @"Math.5123" said: > > > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > > > > @"Math.5123" said: > > > > > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > > > > > > @"Brokensunday.4098" said: > > > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > > I'd rather they add a little more...What to call it, variety? Depth? To the setup. Traps as a concept are all well and good, but maybe it isn't a good idea to have a trap with such narrow counters. > > > > > > > > > > > > Stability, blocks, ports out, invul. Does not seem narrow at all to counter it .. just saying if you get stuck on it with 0 cooldows yes i see how you can die to it but thats not dm fault. > > > > > > > > > > stability works. > > > > > invuln works > > > > > block does not work, you get cced back into the trap > > > > > teleports kind of work, you do teleport but when teleport ends you still get knocked down. > > > > > As a mesmer I never really gave a kitten cuz I had jaunt/blink and F4, but when I started playing ranger its kitten awfull. > > > > > god forbids you dont have 100% cooldowns else you dead from full hp, no counterplay. > > > > > like the only thing you can do is dodge out, and use stun-break during knockdown animation, and hope to gods that the trap bugs and lets you out, otherwise you die from full hp > > > > > > > > On ranger you have 3/4 cleanse utilities. Meaning you can cleanse the stacks whenever they get out of hand if you don't have the stability to get out. How is this any different from the old holo that could 100 to zero you in a prime light beam you didn't dodge? > > > > > > difference is that holo cant do that anymore and DH can. > > > > Don't get me wrong, burn dh is beyond dumb. But Maw or damage isn't the reason. > > > > Any class with triple offensive trait-lines and no stunbreak will be able to pump. Just remove trapper runes and the build will be gone. > > Then trapper ranger is also gone, killing 2 builds for reason of one? Does anyone really want to see trapper rangers every game? It's just as obnoxious, just not as effective. Same with old trapper thief.

> @"Majy.6792" said: > > @"Ragnar.4257" said: > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > @"Ragnar.4257" said: > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > @"Brokensunday.4098" said: > > > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > > > I'd rather they add a little more...What to call it, variety? Depth? To the setup. Traps as a concept are all well and good, but maybe it isn't a good idea to have a trap with such narrow counters. > > > > > > > > > > > > Stability, blocks, ports out, invul. Does not seem narrow at all to counter it .. just saying if you get stuck on it with 0 cooldows yes i see how you can die to it but thats not dm fault. > > > > > > > > > > Stab - yes, after Anet has stripped down stab access across the board. > > > > > > > > > > Blocks - iirc this doesn't work? It'll knock you back into it similar to how dodging into the barrier will bounce you off. I've tried this multiple times (as a warr with shield5, most recently) and it has never worked if I try it after the trap has procced. I can still get yoinked into it too due to the unblockable spear. > > > > > > > > > > Ports - GW2 has some issues where even if you port, it still considers you as having 'passed through'. They do work but it can be very wonky. > > > > > > > > > > Invul - yes. > > > > > > > > > > I'm not here to debate semantics and the nature of language and humanity. You're welcome to disagree with my word choice. > > > > > > > > > > The issue is that trap stacking eliminates each others' counters (and the design of Maw negates other things - like as the OP mentions, blind) and the stuff that is available is either rare or self-defeating (ex: yes, I can certainly evade across a node to proc all the traps. And then I can't stand on it for a while, and the CD of said traps likely is already down or close to it so it happens again in short order. What is the point of this). Individually I find the traps fine, but stacked together it gets ridiculous. And then there're the slows, so anything you do is extremely vulnerable to everything ever. > > > > > > > > > > Just...consider this. There's a Maw trap you have to get out of. You're slowed and you're taking damage from the spinny thing. Sure, fine - on my warr I'll use Stomp, no big deal. But I'm slowed, so it takes a bit and I'll take a decent chunk of damage regardless. But wait, there's another trap that damages me if I leave its circumference - which is fine, but there's still the spinny one that is gonna hit me if I stay in there. And then there's an unblockable spear that can yoink me back into it (the yoink goes through dodge, too). > > > > > > > > > > All of these things are fine alone - trap that damages you if you cross it? Okay, dont' cross it. It has a pretty decent radius. Or there's a trap that damages you if you stay inside it and you can just walk/dodge out. But then, and then, etcetc - and then comes the part where the goal of the entire mode is to capture a point. Do you see how all of these things have conflicting counters? Are there counters? Yes. But they're totally inadequate, conflicting, convoluted...however you would like to describe them. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You keep talking about spear. > > > > > > > > I don't think you have even the tiniest understanding of what it is you're complaining about. > > > > > > > > Burn DH will not use spear to pull into traps, because then it loses all pressure from VoJ. If you're against a burn DH, the BEST THING that can happen to you is that it uses spear. It's literally the DH giving you a free win and going "hey, guess I won't do any damage for the next 20 seconds". > > > > > > I'm explaining how the mechanics can stack and create convoluted counters resulting in unfun gameplay. Not being paid to read things to you, but you can copy/paste things into google for some help if you need it. > > > > Nope, sorry, your "counters" only make sense if you're imagining some magical DH build that is somehow both simultaneously a power build (the references you make to the damage from Test of Faith) and a condi-build. A magical build that is somehow able to use spear, and also retain VoJ damage. > > > > All while ignoring the most obvious counter, which is that if a DH blows its entire utility bar to make a point un-contestable for 3 seconds, then the DH has made itself super vulnerable to any pressure outside of those 3 seconds. > > > > If a necro uses all its utilities on Wells, then you can't go on point when it drops them all. Does that mean necro wells are OP? Or does it mean you are expected to be able to apply the 3 brain cells it takes to not stand on point for that short duration, and then punish the necro afterwards for having 0 sustain utility? > > > > Just imagine it was a PvE boss. Every 20 seconds, for a period of 3 seconds, it farts out massive damage in its immediate vicinity. Even PvE players can grasp the concept of "don't be near the boss when the big damage is happening". Although I guess they did have to make the PvE boss damage fields ultra-bright in order for people to understand something so basic. > > Necro wells disappear after a short period of time, traps do not. If you want to avoid DH traps that typically means giving up the node for a considerable amount of time. That's not true of wells. No, traps disappear faster than Wells if you actually trigger them. If you trigger them immediately, you need to give up the node for LESS time than with Wells. There's only 1 trap that can actually pressure you off a node, that's Procession of Blades. How long does that spin for? 2 seconds? Don't willfully misunderstand me here. I'm not saying Wells>Traps. I'm saying that the method of counterplay is the same.

> @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > > @"CutesySylveon.8290" said: > > > @"Leonidrex.5649" said: > > > > @"Brokensunday.4098" said: > > > > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > > I'd rather they add a little more...What to call it, variety? Depth? To the setup. Traps as a concept are all well and good, but maybe it isn't a good idea to have a trap with such narrow counters. > > > > > > > > Stability, blocks, ports out, invul. Does not seem narrow at all to counter it .. just saying if you get stuck on it with 0 cooldows yes i see how you can die to it but thats not dm fault. > > > > > > stability works. > > > invuln works > > > block does not work, you get cced back into the trap > > > teleports kind of work, you do teleport but when teleport ends you still get knocked down. > > > As a mesmer I never really gave a kitten cuz I had jaunt/blink and F4, but when I started playing ranger its kitten awfull. > > > god forbids you dont have 100% cooldowns else you dead from full hp, no counterplay. > > > like the only thing you can do is dodge out, and use stun-break during knockdown animation, and hope to gods that the trap bugs and lets you out, otherwise you die from full hp > > > > By blocking they mean to just stand and block during the duration of the trap instead of trying to escape it. Only thing that will hurt you if you're blocking is crossing ToF and F1, which the DH shouldn't do anyway, especially if you're caught in the trap already. > > F1 removes GS block or whatever other channeled blocks you might have, to survive you gotta do cute kitten like dodge F1 and dodge spam through the kitten and then escape with sliver of health or abuse the stun-break bug. DH doesnt need F1 damage to kill you if he can actually land sword-spin hits. Really? You too? > @"Ragnar.4257" said: > > @"Curennos.9307" said: > > > > Stab - yes, after Anet has stripped down stab access across the board. > > > > Blocks - iirc this doesn't work? It'll knock you back into it similar to how dodging into the barrier will bounce you off. I've tried this multiple times (as a warr with shield5, most recently) and it has never worked if I try it after the trap has procced. I can still get yoinked into it too due to the unblockable spear. > > > > Ports - GW2 has some issues where even if you port, it still considers you as having 'passed through'. They do work but it can be very wonky. > > > > Invul - yes. > > > > I'm not here to debate semantics and the nature of language and humanity. You're welcome to disagree with my word choice. > > > > The issue is that trap stacking eliminates each others' counters (and the design of Maw negates other things - like as the OP mentions, blind) and the stuff that is available is either rare or self-defeating (ex: yes, I can certainly evade across a node to proc all the traps. And then I can't stand on it for a while, and the CD of said traps likely is already down or close to it so it happens again in short order. What is the point of this). Individually I find the traps fine, but stacked together it gets ridiculous. And then there're the slows, so anything you do is extremely vulnerable to everything ever. > > > > Just...consider this. There's a Maw trap you have to get out of. You're slowed and you're taking damage from the spinny thing. Sure, fine - on my warr I'll use Stomp, no big deal. But I'm slowed, so it takes a bit and I'll take a decent chunk of damage regardless. But wait, there's another trap that damages me if I leave its circumference - which is fine, but there's still the spinny one that is gonna hit me if I stay in there. And then there's an unblockable spear that can yoink me back into it (the yoink goes through dodge, too). > > > > All of these things are fine alone - trap that damages you if you cross it? Okay, dont' cross it. It has a pretty decent radius. Or there's a trap that damages you if you stay inside it and you can just walk/dodge out. But then, and then, etcetc - and then comes the part where the goal of the entire mode is to capture a point. Do you see how all of these things have conflicting counters? Are there counters? Yes. But they're totally inadequate, conflicting, convoluted...however you would like to describe them. > > > > > > You keep talking about spear. > > I don't think you have even the tiniest understanding of what it is you're complaining about. > > Burn DH will not use spear to pull into traps, because then it loses all pressure from VoJ. If you're against a burn DH, the BEST THING that can happen to you is that it uses spear. It's literally the DH giving you a free win and going "hey, guess I won't do any damage for the next 20 seconds".

> @"Shieldbash.5304" said: > > @"Ragnar.4257" said: > > Without seeing a build, it's hard to say what's going wrong for you. > > > > Ranger, if built correctly, is one of the hardest classes to kill. Alot of that survivability doesn't come from directly taking hits to the face and tanking through them, but rather from using mobility to mean you don't get hit in the first place, keeping them away from you with cripple/immob, or stopping them from attacking with CC. > > > > You don't need to use burning in order to do damage, ranger has plenty of other sources of damage. If you're trying to use Torch and flame-trap, that's probably where you're going wrong, as neither of these are very good. > > This is pretty much what I am running. http://gw2skills.net/editor/?POwAMdflZwyYasQ2JO0PaL/Sk6cA-e I'm not a ranger main, so maybe someone else can add more, but some comments on this build: - Longbow and Axe/Axe are both damage-focused ranged sets. I'd swap out one or the other for either greatsword or sword/dagger to give you some melee options and also some more defense. - Signets aren't great, most ranger builds take Survival skills (things like lightning reflexes) - Survival skills combine really well with the trait Wilderness Knowledge for condition cleanses - Wilderness Knowledge also works with the other traits Child of Earth and Zephyr Speed for even more cleanse - Troll Unguent, with the benefits of Wilderness Knowledge, is a much more powerful heal than We Heal As One, which is only really beneficial if you're playing a more bunkery Nature Magic build. - Smokescale is pretty much the best pet, you need a really good reason to not take it So I'd recommend something more like: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?POgAMFlFw6YesQ2JO2Ppr1SOXaA-z5IeIZKF6VEUyCwxDA And the way you'd want to play it is to try and stay at a safe distance as much as possible and let your bow and your pet do as much damage as possible. That doesn't just mean finding a place and standing still to pewpew, you need to be constantly moving, use the stealth from longbow #3 to relocate, etc. Then, if you get jumped up close, swap to greatsword, especially the block on #4 can really save you, and the leap on #3 to move out of harms way and then swap back to bow.

Without seeing a build, it's hard to say what's going wrong for you. Ranger, if built correctly, is one of the hardest classes to kill. Alot of that survivability doesn't come from directly taking hits to the face and tanking through them, but rather from using mobility to mean you don't get hit in the first place, keeping them away from you with cripple/immob, or stopping them from attacking with CC. You don't need to use burning in order to do damage, ranger has plenty of other sources of damage. If you're trying to use Torch and flame-trap, that's probably where you're going wrong, as neither of these are very good.

Funny, because if you ask most people on this forum, they'll say that damage has been reduced way too much, and that things were better in the "good old days" when damage was way higher. According to them. Even though, as you point out, stuff will still 1-shot you right now if you don't always have an invuln/evade/block up your sleeve.

Just earlier today, someone whispered me saying they would totally have won if I hadn't been able to cover my heal with stability. And I was like...... 'but my build doesn't have any stability'. Literally 0 stability. People just assume that any guardian build must have the features of EVERY guardian build. It's a guardian, so, it must have stability right? I also frequently get whispers complaining about burning..... when I'm playing zerker. It's a guardian, so it must do big burns right? No ability to consider that, actually, not every build is able to simultaneously have every possible feature of a class. I will say it again very slowly: If the DH is playing a burn build, then it can't also be doing big power damage, and it can't use Spear. And if it has a full utility bar of traps, then it can't also have stunbreaks, stability, cleanses, invulns etc.