praqtos.9035

> @"Lighter.5631" said:

> > @"Tayga.3192" said:

> > > @"Lighter.5631" said:

> > > and now nerf weaver, soulbeast and mirage, thanks

> >

> > You're forgetting the biggest offender: Renegade.

> >

>

> > @"Tayga.3192" said:

> > > @"Lighter.5631" said:

> > > and now nerf weaver, soulbeast and mirage, thanks

> >

> > You're forgetting the biggest offender: Renegade.

> >

>

> > @"Tayga.3192" said:

> > > @"Lighter.5631" said:

> > > and now nerf weaver, soulbeast and mirage, thanks

> >

> > You're forgetting the biggest offender: Renegade.

> >

>

> > @"Tayga.3192" said:

> > > @"Lighter.5631" said:

> > > and now nerf weaver, soulbeast and mirage, thanks

> >

> > You're forgetting the biggest offender: Renegade.

> >

>

> im actually serious, condition weaver needs a nerf.

> condi mirage is still busted, not too good for conquest, but busted.

> soulbeast, can be reconsidered

Condi mirage is bad but busted... My eyes...are bleeding....

What is need to be smitersbooned is rampage with 3-4 minutes cd.

Holo damage by 50% damage and delete sic em.

> @"otto.5684" said:

> Also, holo, FB and souls beast were not touched (plus SB). Outside of pushing rev out of meta, not much has changed.

According to Anet holo is underperforming and was buffed 2 patches in a row :joy: :joy: :joy:

I'm tempted to make thread and ask to reduce all elites cd to spammable/absurd powercreep level as PLB/rampage with 60s cooldown. Spamfiesta thats what anet want ? Then make everyone equal at least

> @"Twilight Tempest.7584" said:

Wait until some 50% damage nerfs fall on their head and watch their subforum being drown in tears just like revs over perma 25 might stacks. Auto attack damage nerfed by 10% ? End of the world....

> @"mortrialus.3062" said:

> > @"praqtos.9035" said:

> > > @"mortrialus.3062" said:

> > > > @"Twilight Tempest.7584" said:

> > > > > @"praqtos.9035" said:

> > > > > > @"Twilight Tempest.7584" said:

> > > > > >I'd be rather surprised if they give any significant buffs, reworks, or even reverts until after knocking the current overperformers down first. Let's see if they at least do that right.

> > > > > Dont think holo needed a buff last 2 patches, how about you ?

> > > >

> > > > From today's update:

> > > >

> > > > * Prime Light Beam: The recharge time for this skill is now 60 seconds in all game modes.

> > > >

> > > > https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/76298/game-update-notes-may-14-2019#latest

> > > >

> > > > So basically they reverted a recharge nerf from last August. So they do revert. There's hope! /s

> > >

> > > Because a certain popular streamer plays holosmith and we have to keep him happy on his boosted af broken holo.

> > I dont think they do it to please certain boosted monkey ...

> > Buffed holo 2 patches in a row/rampage that 2shot you its totally fine bruh.

> > On the other side we have a good news, nothing else is left to nerf on the mesmer

>

> Maybe not but when multiple pvp and balance devs hang out in private discords with him and hhave 1 on 1 facetime while he whinges about mirage its going to give them a bigger impression than anyone posting here, no matter how well written or eloquent.

That boostedsmith always been crying about how weak holo is. Scrapper/holo together wins mAT. Anet: underpeforming! Revert unblockable heavy hitting knockdown elite and make it more spammable!

> @"mortrialus.3062" said:

> > @"Twilight Tempest.7584" said:

> > > @"praqtos.9035" said:

> > > > @"Twilight Tempest.7584" said:

> > > >I'd be rather surprised if they give any significant buffs, reworks, or even reverts until after knocking the current overperformers down first. Let's see if they at least do that right.

> > > Dont think holo needed a buff last 2 patches, how about you ?

> >

> > From today's update:

> >

> > * Prime Light Beam: The recharge time for this skill is now 60 seconds in all game modes.

> >

> > https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/76298/game-update-notes-may-14-2019#latest

> >

> > So basically they reverted a recharge nerf from last August. So they do revert. There's hope! /s

>

> Because a certain popular streamer plays holosmith and we have to keep him happy on his boosted af broken holo.

I dont think they do it to please certain boosted monkey ...

Buffed holo 2 patches in a row/rampage that 2shot you its totally fine bruh.

On the other side we have a good news, nothing else is left to nerf on the mesmer

> @"LucianTheAngelic.7054" said:

>My rating has little to do with what the majority of revenants run or what the meta build is considered to be, so you can take your attempted ad hominems elsewhere because they don't do anything for your argument.

Shot back your "silver-gold" argument to you directly. As I asked a really good rev and my friend :)

It might not be as good as before because herald SE/sw3 might duration was nerfed as well. So they I wouldnt be surprised to see them change back to it. I'm not aware about NA people but I heard its Incissor clone that play rev

> @"narcx.3570" said:

> > @"praqtos.9035" said:

> > Memes aside I dont understand rev panic... Self ez 25 might stack nerf is better than get straight damage nerfs and balance the class based on having 25 might stacks.

>

> Are you serious? That's literally what already happened... They nerfed all of Revenant's weapon damage away and then re-compensated it via easy might generation since they're the "boon class" or whatever--this has always been seen as somewhat fair in a PoF world where boon removal/corruption is so abundant. I'm all for them taking away our easy might if they give us back the 50% damage to sword 2 and 80% damage to SotM tho.

Are you trying to meme me out? Crann I think... I remember his video about him getting oneshotted with single UA and after corruption he instantly regained all might...

SotM is broken on wvw, just like sw2... I stay away from WvW so I dont talk about it at all. But thats prolly fun to instagib people jsut with 2 buttons because we all want easy kills/wins.

> But ya, on top of that, the 10% flat sword aa damage is a total meme considering rev's sword cleave was its ONLY real way to finish downed foes. (Except for GoD Blindstomp, but that's only for duels and is completely useless in a team fight.) Rev was already the +1/roamer with the weakest downstate-finish... Now it's just that much worse. It's not like you even AA non-downstate foes that much in the first place...

Exactly, you arent* AA your enemies anyway...10% ... is not much... Not like I actually support this nerf or agree with.

> > @"praqtos.9035" said:

> > Last time I was seeing Shuriken and few other good revs dueling,TOP2 immortal legend rev as said they use rapid flow/song of the mists instead of LR and Roiling mists. (that was like 3-4 days ago)

> > Probably you are sitting in gold my friend but this tryhards at p3-legend.

>

> That's dueling tho...

> In the scope of an actual match, pffffttttt... Good luck doing enough damage in a team fight with that build before you get autofocused for being a rev.

That would make more sense to get pure 1x1 focused traits/runes.

They run it for swiftness and imitate real game situation as its used to be.

That top2 rev used it in actual games, not just duels, asked him about the build as I started to play rev myself. I personally like song of the mists, I dont even know why but this feels better for some reason.

My conclusion:

Rev was asburdly overperforming, it damage was through the roof and everything I should had to care about is to not being in situation without a breakstun.

My sword4 did consistently 7-9.4k damage, sw5 from 5k to 10.6k.Sw3(or sw4) with impossible odds did tremendous amount of damage and secondary (impossible odds) overall stacked damage was about 8-13k depends how many hits were connected. Of course its drained your all shiro energy and you had to manage it.

In game shiro blink and sw5 1800 range clap with a slow/chill so this guy cant even use skills back or walk away from it, wont lie, my second hit not always connected if I stepped into a wrong way.

Nerfs were needed and self 25 might stacks never been healthy/balanced. Better to nerf it instead of nerfing base values of your skills, dont you agree ?

Probably revenant is still good and we will see them in mAT anyway. We will see soon

((I'm not against to give revenant/renegade buffs but I dont play it that often to give proper suggestions))

> @"Multicolorhipster.9751" said:

> > @"praqtos.9035" said:

> > Counter play to spellbreaker with a rampage?

> > Step 1 get exhasted by spellbreaker normal cooldowns. (Or accidently facetank bullcharge and die to BC->arcingslice>GS3.

> > Step 2 die to rampage without cooldowns ,alternatively exhaust all of your left cooldowns.

> > Step 3 if you survived step 2, get bullcharged and die for sure,alternatively massively outplay spellbreaker.

>

> OR! Or everything I mentioned throughout the past several posts. Blocks, stability, blinds, weakness, slow, chill, boon corruption, kiting, ~~and just dodge teehee~~

Good, good ! Lets bring scourge and mirage to their prime strenght level and spit in everyone with words : Just cleanse, just dodge,just block.

> > If you are that bad at spb and in dire need to be carried by rampage, get better at it?

> > Why you think monthly AT winner complain about this skill,may be he is bad and need to git gud himself ?

>

> I think this is a more psychological question moreso than a technical one, and to that extent; I don't know or particularly care how the monthly AT winner sees it. I guess there's supposed to be this expectation that their success is supposed to make my opinion less valid? Isn't that a logical fallacy?

What? Here responded very good players and even they are think rampage is dumb,its not just only bias of one person.

> Anyway, all I can really offer there is that there's probably a personal bias that exists with that monthly AT winner and their own class, just like I have mine, and you likely have yours. I tend to think rampage is holding Spellbreaker up, and that it's a pretty weak class in general. Same person we're talking about thinks the same thing about rampage, only their class(Soulbeast) is the weak one. At the end of it all, they're still the monthly AT winner; with Soulbeast. ~~B-Tier btw~~

Its competitive AT tier list. Have you seen rangers at the last mAT? I didnt for example. May be you did ?

> @"LucianTheAngelic.7054" said:

> > @"praqtos.9035" said:

>

> > Memes aside I dont understand rev panic... Self ez 25 might stack nerf is better than get straight damage nerfs and balance the class based on having 25 might stacks.

>

> Wait what? Did you miss the straight damage nerf to the autos? And the drop in crit chance? That directly changes how much reliable DPS a rev can put out.

10% is not much on autos for my taste. Its not 50% as someone class :joy:

You still can maintain a lot of might but for short period of time and not carry it with yourself around, i'm sorry :)

> > More over Roiling mists was dropped in favor of song of the mists(equilibrium 2.0) and might from fury was dropped in favor of rapid flow for perma swiftness.

> > I honestly ... dont understand panic at all.they nerfed something rev alrdy dropped... Just played a rev and still nearly the same, just I had not perma 25 might as before .

>

> Also what???? The best Revs in pvp are not running either Song of the Mists or Rapid Flow. Like that's either a hard troll or you're not familiar with the higher levels of competition at all. Sure, maybe some silver or gold revs are running SotM or RF, but the build that monthly AT winners and higher level competitors are running is Incensed Response + Roiling Mists. Full stop.

Last time I was seeing Shuriken and few other good revs dueling,TOP2 immortal legend rev as said they use rapid flow/song of the mists instead of LR and Roiling mists. (that was like 3-4 days ago)

Probably you are sitting in gold my friend but this tryhards at p3-legend.

> @"Multicolorhipster.9751" said:

> > @"praqtos.9035" said:

> > > I get what you're saying, but these are some hefty exaggerations.

> > Where is ax7oRkQany exaggeraion made by me ? I am exaggerated about damage? About damage reducton/health gain? Ridiculously low cooldown ? ? ?

> > If spellbreaker kit isnt enough for you to kill people , git gud, play another class ?

>

> Damage, counterplay, and Spellbreaker's effectiveness otherwise.

>

> I'm not the biggest fan of the other classes personally. The solution should never be "just play something else." Just ask Thief and Ele mains, it doesn't really solve anything.

Counter play to spellbreaker with a rampage?

Step 1 get exhasted by spellbreaker normal cooldowns. (Or accidently facetank bullcharge and die to BC->arcingslice>GS3.

Step 2 die to rampage without cooldowns ,alternatively exhaust all of your left cooldowns.

Step 3 if you survived step 2, get bullcharged and die for sure,alternatively massively outplay spellbreaker.

If you are that bad at spb and in dire need to be carried by rampage, get better at it?

Why you think monthly AT winner complain about this skill,may be he is bad and need to git gud himself ?

![](https://i.imgur.com/1yH75c7.jpg")

72s cd ... for that... on demolisher amulet is fine...

> @"otto.5684" said:

> Lol.. I am all for might stacking nerf (even though rev is not the only culprit in here), but Roiling Mists?! The trait has been the same since rev was released 3.5 years ago. Now it is a problem?!

You know thats remind me about blurred frenzy that was left alone since 2k15.

Memes aside I dont understand rev panic... Self ez 25 might stack nerf is better than get straight damage nerfs and balance the class based on having 25 might stacks.

More over Roiling mists was dropped in favor of song of the mists(equilibrium 2.0) and might from fury was dropped in favor of rapid flow for perma swiftness.

I honestly ... dont understand panic at all.they nerfed something rev alrdy dropped... Just played a rev and still nearly the same, just I had not perma 25 might as before .

After seeing this

> @"WraithOfStealth.1624" said:

> Not to kick rev mains in PvP while they're down, but the nerf to Roiling Mists in PvP is so stupid i couldn't stop laughing.

Do revs mains think herald was bad? It was crazy . Tho cant be said the same about renegade

> @"Twilight Tempest.7584" said:

>I'd be rather surprised if they give any significant buffs, reworks, or even reverts until after knocking the current overperformers down first. Let's see if they at least do that right.

Dont think holo needed a buff last 2 patches, how about you ?

> @"Euthymias.7984" said:

> > @"praqtos.9035" said:

> > Holo got yet another buff second patch in the row. Tuned down you say ?

>

> its just returning PLB back to what it was when it was introduced. not that much of a buff.

> I'm guessing they wanted it to be more competitive to the Elixir X elite since its lost value by comparison, even with Power Wrench.

All elites need CD increases, not cd reduction to support spamfiesta. If anything it should get way higher cooldown than it is, not less. Alternatively every other elites should get on the same spam level field, FGS, epidemic,thief guild etcetcetc. Give every elite 60s cd !

Some anet dev loves holo too much,thus, holo gets buffed when its need nerfs, I have very strange feeling about it.

> @"KryTiKaL.3125" said:

> > @"praqtos.9035" said:

> > > @"KryTiKaL.3125" said:

> > >You said why you think it is OP/overtuned, I explained my position on why it isn't. You really don't become an unstoppable killing machine, you become a beefcake with easily predicted attacks.

> > You being in a denial doesnt help the situation tbh...

>

> In denial of what? I said I don't use it nor do I intend to use it because of the reasons I listed and explained to you. There is no denial about it, I just acknowledge the reality and the aspects that technically make Rampage a problem and its not the skill itself...its the game mode. Take out the rigid structure of Conquest and the Capture Points and where does that leave Rampage? Not a problem.

What is your problem ...? You keep babbling about conquest on PVP forum... and blame it .... what?

Talking with you makes no sense ,never had,so I'll stop here :joy:

> @"EnderzShadow.2506" said:

> Seems ok to me.

> The over performing classes Engi, Warrior and Rev got tuned.

Rampage evaded much needed nerf. Holo got ,yet, another buff second patch in the row. Tuned down you say ?

Scourge/FB wasnt nerfed as well.

> $h*t happens.**

> @"KryTiKaL.3125" said:

>You said why you think it is OP/overtuned, I explained my position on why it isn't. You really don't become an unstoppable killing machine, you become a beefcake with easily predicted attacks.

You being in a denial doesnt help the situation tbh...

> @"Kylden Ar.3724" said:

> > @"praqtos.9035" said:

> > > @"Shiyo.3578" said:

> > > Soulbeast is anets current "must buff this every patch" spec tbh.

> > You spelled engineer wrong

Called !

> @"Solori.6025" said:

> > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said:

> > > @"mortrialus.3062" said:

> > > No single skill should have one shot potential. Period. Glassy builds should have potential to rush down opponents and combo them to death quickliy, but no single ability from any should be reaching close to 20k no mater how glassy they build. Heck, few skills should be hitting 10k unless they're long channels like Hundred Blades.

> >

> > If its mirage or thief nerf it to ground, if it's any other class just dodge it

> > -community

>

> So

> Much

> This

First time ever ... He nailed it

> @"mortrialus.3062" said:

Most likely ,thats why I play revenant and I feel like its absurdly broken with everything it can do. Sword4-5 on marauder crit for 9-10k EACH. UA with impossible odds does 20k damage and its fine?! Cant believe anyone can defend this and say its just revenant thats skilled, lying to themselves thinking they are actually good, lol (Also immune to nerfs and trade offs, confirmed by anet in last patch)

> @"Solori.6025" said:

> People seem to forget the years worth of nerfs and ask for more?

Forgot to add this to my post but wanted to xD

What else they want to take away from the mesmer in its current state? Give us at least something to play with. Mirage offer nothing when picking up this traitline.

Its traits are worse copies of alrdy existing traits, the only traits is worth in entire elite spec is IH, without that mirage cant exist at all.

Such infrequent access to CS makes everyone scream "reeeeeeee mesmer does it twice is too op!" regardless of absurd long cooldown. I wish it wouldnt exist @"viquing.8254" had a thread about it.

> @"Hoodie.1045" said:

> ArenaNet taking the elite specialization trade off route is a good thing in my opinion. Berserker now has its own F1 skills that are completely different to both core warrior and Spellbreaker. Thief got Swipe and while it received mixed to mostly negative reception and I think it would be nice for it to be buffed in the next balance patch, it's still a noticeable trade off.

>

> This is what mesmer's elite specializations currently don't have. Instead they do the things core mesmer does, but better. Take core power shatter mesmer: it's got little to no mobility besides Blink, cleansing and sustain, but with Mirage you've got tons of mobility thanks to the ambush skill Mirage Thrust, Jaunt and Blink. Nerfing the elite specializations over and over won't create more build variety, instead what the core professions need is their own identity or something that the elite specs can't have, like core revenant. Nobody saw this coming, but I'm glad ArenaNet did this. Giving Ancient Echo to core revenant only is a proper way of making trade offs.

Revenant is not trading off this new F2 which is nearly useless almost in every legend, his new F skills being massively upgraded if you would compare.So its not a trade off,its just as same core revenant but infinitely better, wasnt that your point when you made your post? To put it simple... you gives X class useless F skill and remove it when you spec for elite spec and call it trade off and unique thing that elite spec cant do, sounds incredibly stupid, no ?

Will mirage get new shattrs?Chrono ? About trade off... F5 on chrono has a price and its clones and insane huge cooldown that none of the classes have, its freaking 105s cd mate. While playing chrono I dont get the feeling I play with unique elite spec, better than core for sure.

Mirage lose its ability to evade for the same distance and basically sit in every aoe you got caught into. Ambush mechanic is dumb now because you cant even cover your own ambush that does even less damage than warrior unblockable dodge...

Core mesmer was terrible before any nerf but every nerf was pointed out at CORE mesmer instead of elite specs, guess why ? Sales!

Let me give you clear example, phantasm rework, core overperforming? No, mirage phantasm overperforming? No (actually mirage evade was culript for being so good)

Chrono? Yes

People said NERF CP ! But instead they nerfed all phantasm including these which does no damage arldy to begin with. They kept nerfing everything until they finally nerf CP,still not deleted...

Lets look at mirage . Swordmainhand seen tonns of nerfs,since 2015 its stopped and it was fine but to NERF MIRAGE evades which was ,again, thanks to 1s dodge, felt too much, they gutted sword on CORE which impact all three specs. Gutted vigor which impact all 3 core specs, gutted scepter(dont care tbh) which carried mesmer all variations.

Mirage gets insane mobility ? Do you aware about its cost? Thats your vigor and ability to evade incoming attacks. Have u seen cmirage started with having sword and then completely ditched? Lack of damage and lack of vigor.

As I Curunen said, they dont revert unnecessary nerfs

> @"MrForz.1953" said:

> > @"praqtos.9035" said:

> > > @"Shiyo.3578" said:

> > > Soulbeast is anets current "must buff this every patch" spec tbh.

> > You spelled engineer wrong

>

> But that's not a spec.

Buffing core have an impact on both "specs" and their builds :)

> @"Multicolorhipster.9751" said:

> > @"praqtos.9035" said:

> > You think 10s is not long? No invul/block lasts that long LOL . Mobility skills? Too bad rampage has 2 mobility skills and throw boulder that will act like a hot seeking missle if you try to leap away.

>

> Well... Unless you're an engineer running HGH. Then you get the exact same skill for **longer than warrior would**. Rampage isn't an invul/block either.

And what is your point with it? 50% for rampage, just in case, may be you dont know. Not like Its my fault HGH prolong duration of elixirs.

I never said rampage is invul/block either ?

At this point you sounds like a broken record... You pretend its not OP/overtuned, I just said why it is.

You become unstoppable killing machine, with ridiculous 72s cd, that twoshot people while having demolisher amulet . You dont have to just avoid 2 skills ,you have to avoid all of them. Even when you completely failed your rampage you forced your opponent to waste a lot of his cooldowns or give up a node completely.

You think 10s is not long? No invul/block lasts that long LOL . Mobility skills? Too bad rampage has 2 mobility skills and throw boulder that will act like a hot seeking missle if you try to leap away.

Who even care about point when they see rampage? Even with 180s cd traited it would be 144, way more acceptable cd rather than 72s cd. Each time warrior use rampage you have 2 options : run or die.

Even another "strong" transform as Lichform is 140s cd and doesnt have trait that can reduce it. Rampage in its current form have no right to exist.

> @"Curunen.8729" said:

> >I really dont understand, its hard to nerf overperforming skill by 10-25% and see if its need more? Waiting for months and then suddenly nuke it from orbit with 50-67% is fine?

>

> That's just their m.o. sadly - can look at it as forced meta changes by Anet in attempt to keep things "fresh", because balancing so that everything is on par with maximum build variety may be impossible.

>

> For the record I don't like it either.

They taking away all possible damage, its not for sake keeping things FRESH. Its attempt to kill the class and all possible builds, do u remember mesmer having highest build variety ? You expect class to survive 50-70% damage nerfs all over the place? Now to do 50% of what other classes do u have to go full glass zerk with full offense while other classes dont even slot so hardcore for damage and traitlines. Compensations in damage anywhere?

Where are all compensations for taking away ACTIVE defenses from the class that rely on them the most? Its not holo with all passive boons with a turret or ele with lots of cleanses/sustain/ heals to keep himself alive, not a facetank machine like warrior or soulbeast/fb.Even at evasion its fallen behind the most, only necro/guardian lacking here .

In another thread someone pointed out they shaved holo leap with 17% twice, mesmer getting AXED with 50-75%. What the hell is this?

I really really hate how weak is greatsword and how its stuck in the past,especially GS5, 30 seconds ...for that? Look at engi rifle, holo is far away from underperforming classes and rifle every skill got buffed, even overcharge bug became a "feature", certain dev love the class too much apparently.

GS2/pistol5 if you incorrectly faced your enemy will go on full cooldown meanwhile GS4 on warrior was fixed and no more goes on full cooldown.

If that not bias and hate towards the mesmer even from devs side I dont know then, their favorite child privilege