Seera.5916

It's been 7+ years since you last played.

I honestly would suggest starting a new character on whatever class you think you might want to do the mount stuff on and play from there and not use the level 80 boost. Maybe use some experience boosters to increase the leveling rate, but that's as far as I would go boost wise. It doesn't take that long to get a character to level 80. And you'll be able to pick up the necessary in game skills needed to do end game content. There was a difficulty spike between Core game and Expansion content and you're likely to face difficulty going in as an effective new player into PoF content.

The game's changed a lot since it first launched. The mount collections themselves take time and it takes time to get to the point where you can start working on those collections. And requires money to do so and if you didn't enjoy the game 7 years ago, I'd honestly make sure you are going to at least somewhat enjoy the game while working towards your end goal before you spend more money on the game.

> @"Randulf.7614" said:

> > @"Seera.5916" said:

> > > @"Randulf.7614" said:

> > > > @"GW Noob.6038" said:

> > > > > @"Danikat.8537" said:

> > > > > Weaver is exactly what I was thinking of suggesting while reading what you're looking for. It's not the easiest profession to pick up, and you can't really get a feel for it until after you've gotten to level 80 and gotten the weaver spec fully unlocked, but it's a lot of fun and ideal for what you described. Especially if you use daggers, which are melee weapons and have skills that let you move in and out of range quickly.

> > > > >

> > > > > You do need to be prepared for a lot of attunement swapping though, and remembering what all the skills do so you know what's available when you need it.

> > > >

> > > > It took me about 12 days to go from lvl 1 - 80 on my Ranger. So, assuming that holds true for the Ele, I could be practicing my Weaver skills in about 2 weeks! On the button swapping thing: the core Ele has to use those same buttons, right? What I don't know, and maybe you could tell me, is if an Elementalist gets access to the various attunments right away, or do they get them one by one, over time?

> > >

> > > Straight away. It is only traits that unlock over the course of levelling

> >

> > @"GW Noob.6038"

> >

> > Actually, the Attunements are unlocked as you level up. You originally got access to them all right away but that was changed when they did the New Player Experience update a few years ago.

> >

> > You start off with Fire attunement

> > Water is unlocked at level 5

> > Air is unlocked at level 11

> > Earth is unlocked at level 15

>

> Ah I had an inkling but I looked on wiki but didn’t see it listed so I assumed I remembered wrong.

>

> At least it’s a small level gap

It's easy to miss, I almost missed it. You have to go to the attunement's page and it's only listed in the top part of the page before the contents of the page are listed.

I only happened to know it was level gated because I've used Elementalist sometimes for occasional key runs and I don't tome them up past level 10 since they're just for getting keys. I knew you got water by level 10, but I wasn't sure on Air and Earth, which is why I went to look.

> @"Randulf.7614" said:

> > @"GW Noob.6038" said:

> > > @"Danikat.8537" said:

> > > Weaver is exactly what I was thinking of suggesting while reading what you're looking for. It's not the easiest profession to pick up, and you can't really get a feel for it until after you've gotten to level 80 and gotten the weaver spec fully unlocked, but it's a lot of fun and ideal for what you described. Especially if you use daggers, which are melee weapons and have skills that let you move in and out of range quickly.

> > >

> > > You do need to be prepared for a lot of attunement swapping though, and remembering what all the skills do so you know what's available when you need it.

> >

> > It took me about 12 days to go from lvl 1 - 80 on my Ranger. So, assuming that holds true for the Ele, I could be practicing my Weaver skills in about 2 weeks! On the button swapping thing: the core Ele has to use those same buttons, right? What I don't know, and maybe you could tell me, is if an Elementalist gets access to the various attunments right away, or do they get them one by one, over time?

>

> Straight away. It is only traits that unlock over the course of levelling

@"GW Noob.6038"

Actually, the Attunements are unlocked as you level up. You originally got access to them all right away but that was changed when they did the New Player Experience update a few years ago.

You start off with Fire attunement

Water is unlocked at level 5

Air is unlocked at level 11

Earth is unlocked at level 15

> @"Court.7180" said:

> Please read carefully what is written.. because a lot of you are just responding to what you think is being said, instead of what was actually said even though you quote them. To put hard definitions like "disability" on not being able to perform like someone else is extreme in this case.. We all have different skill sets and capabilities.. Whats so bad about an OPTION, (key word: "option", not forced on everyone, since some of you keep putting words in my mouth) so that others less capable can enjoy playing a game where skill and SUCCESS is ultimately determined by mechanics execution.. and on the flip side what if ANET was to just one day say: "this game is too EZ because the, falsely claimed majority, think we should have to press more buttons" will people rejoice or shift sides of the debate then? When is too much too much and enough enough?

>

> If more people can have success in this game, the better in my opinion. But the popular individualistic view of todays society says otherwise. Success should be determined in this game by ones work and determination, not solely on whether they can meet what might be impossible requirements for them. And please spare everyone the extreme scenarios, your not losing your precious elitism by considering others difficulties. We were all noobs at one point.

The thing is, your options you're talking about are mutually exclusive. You can't have DPS be the same between weapon swap and not weapon swap within the same class.

If an easy button was put in, it would give players currently operating at max DPS when they make no mistakes in their rotation want to switch those because it's less complex and therefore less prone to errors but still giving the same DPS. Which means players would end up forced to use that easy button in order to not get kicked from PUG groups. Turning your option into a requirement.

We can be against your idea and against ANet making it more complicated. Because it's just fine to say that the complexity is just fine as it is right now.

Plus, you already have the option of not swapping your weapon. It's not meta and it's not top DPS but you can do all of the content in this game successfully with a build that does not weapon swap. You just have to find a group that's willing to accept that.

Yes, we were all noobs once. But those of us against your idea also put in the time or are putting in the time to reach our max potential. And we're just fine if that max potential isn't exactly max DPS. We're just fine failing at doing something. Because we learn from failures. I personally think we learn more from failing than we do from succeeding. It's a really really really good feeling to finally be able to defeat an enemy that you weren't able to do before. And your easy button will rob that from people.

> @"Court.7180" said:

> > @"Rogue.4756" said:

>

> > So basically, they want a gimmie instead of learning the mechanics like everyone else. Waaaaaaaa it's too hard.

>

> I think your confusing learning the mechanics with being able to actually perform the mechanics.. To know that as a weaver i am capable of attaining some of the highest dps in the game, but im having trouble attaining it due to the fact i can't press the buttons i **know** that i need to press fast enough for whatever reason , is completely different from me just randomly button mashing and hoping for what the class is capable of.

So those of us who are able to do so are supposed to have to be satisfied with less complex combat just because a minority of players can't?

Macros don't solve the problem for those you are arguing for. They will still not be able to perform at the same potential as those without disabilities on average.

This game is very very forgiving and people do not need to operate at 100% max DPS on their class in order to be successful in this game. Even in raids. Players who can't reach maximum DPS are not left unable to complete the game's content. They may need to find static groups rather than rely on LFG's if their disability is bad enough - and that is not a bad thing.

The cost to do your solution would also be too great for what benefits are received.

> @"SeikeNz.3526" said:

> > @"Menadena.7482" said:

> > > @"SeikeNz.3526" said:

> > > > @"Menadena.7482" said:

> > > > > @"SeikeNz.3526" said:

> > > > > > @"Menadena.7482" said:

> > > > > > > @"SeikeNz.3526" said:

> > > > > > > > @"Menadena.7482" said:

> > > > > > > > Umm, no?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > PVE players will not use it because they do not want to get ganked doing PVE stuff.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > PVP players will not use it because they will see it as diluting PVP.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > WVW players will just laugh.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Who is this actually FOR?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > for the players that like both pve and pvp, wvw players are not even worth mentioning since they play the most broken boring mode ever made in any game

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Oh? I thought PVP was the most boring mode ever made in any game? :)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I am a PVE player. Open world PVPVE is a showstopper for me when I am looking at games.

> > > > >

> > > > > that's why they need do it a alternative map? so you can choose to play whatever you want? but if u enter in a map with pvp enabled you cant complain

> > > >

> > > > So sort of like, oh, separating PVP and PVE and WVW maps? Maybe someone should suggest that to anet. :)

> > >

> > > you sound like " i don't want anet doing a new pvp map for others players because i don't play it"

> >

> > Oh, I have no problem with a new PVP map if that is what your community really wants and it does not affect planned development of the other game modes. Assuming there is a PVP team tell them that is what you need, do not try to co-opt the teams on other projects, kay? I DO have a problem with PVPVE maps though as I have seen games that implemented them. While it is technically optional to stay out of them all the good PVE content eventually is only in those style of maps. If I am battling a mob the last thing I need is a roaming bunch of gankers going after me.

>

> well that can't be the case of gw because the max item that you can get is a legendary and you can get it without doing any pvp at all and there's alot of content for pve only players, so adding other forms of game modes will be a plus

Not if it comes at the expense of all of the other game modes and isn't likely to have more fans than any of the other game modes alone.

Especially when 2 of the 3 modes they have are hurting.

PvP hasn't gotten a new mode in ages, if at all. I don't PvP, but I know I haven't heard or seen anything about a new PvP mode. That's 7 years of the same mode over and over and over again. For some reason ANet doesn't let groups of 5 queue up for PvP matches in ranked, I think. I don't PvP and I don't know what ANet was thinking with that. Sure some groups may be better than each other due to their teamwork, but isn't that what the PvP ranks are for? To keep similarly skilled groups fighting against each other and not with groups that are much stronger or weaker than they are? Why find PvP friends if you can't play with them on a regular basis and may end up fighting against them instead on a regular basis?

WvW has a population imbalance problem that has caused huge population retention issues which only causes more population imbalances as people try to find populated, winning servers. Yet, ANet doesn't seem to be trying to figure out how to fix WvW beyond Alliances and they are taking their sweet time with that and not being very open about the status. This is a case where their policy of being tight lipped until things are about to be released is biting them in the rear. They need to be more open about the progress and ask for feedback on things. And then take that feedback and apply it as appropriate. And if they wait too long, Alliances won't even help if the populations are too low.

And that's not even talking about the balancing issues the game has.

Until those two modes are healthier, ANet doesn't need to be adding another game mode.

> @"Zhaid Zhem.6508" said:

> For a chatcode ?

There's also the equipment tabs which do not have a chat code and do have the ability to store equipment outside of the inventory.

> @"Eddbopkins.2630" said:

> > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > @"Eddbopkins.2630" said:

> > > 100-200 charging for QOL is petty imo.

> >

> > Is it? Consider how much difference there is in specially skinned gathered tools vs. unbreakable ones. It's 200 gems EACH. Petty or not, if 200 gems is inline with the visual of a skin, it's not out to lunch for a convenience.

>

> There's specially skinned gathering tools that people buy vs endless gathering tools skins? If people spend money on useless utilities/ skin i can see why they have the gual to charge for something so inferior to it's predesessor.

> I for one am not a child and understand the value of money vs what on the market. Games for children shouldn't have a gem store in it. Would you go up to a kid in a baseball field and try to sell him fancy baseball socks? Or a new glove paint? No so why do it in a video game for children?

Games for children shouldn't use predatory tactics to get kids to spend money.

This is not predatory in the least. Regardless of what price point you think they should be.

> @"Conncept.7638" said:

> > @"Seera.5916" said:

> > So what misinformation am I spreading?

>

> You really have the gall to ask that following a post that is literally nothing but a string of assumptions? I'm not saying your post doesn't make sense or is out of the realm of possibility but NONE of that has been confirmed in any official capacity, and is reaching so far for justification that it reads like one of those conspiracy theory strings that winds up being a "Half-Life 3 Confirmed" meme.

Yet this thread is based on making assumptions of how ANet plans to sell things.....

A reasonable price depends on how ANet plans to sell them. If we don't define how we assume they are going to be sold, then there's no way any meaning can be derived from the costs people post. There's no way to compare if we think a person's pricing is too high for us or not.

This thread depends on making an assumption of how ANet plans to sell the slots.

Since it's reasonable to assume that they will be sold independently, asking the OP what slots they are referring to is logical.

> @"Conncept.7638" said:

> > @"Seera.5916" said:

> > All three are bought independent of each other.

>

> You don't know that. The announcement article said they are sold as "build storage spaces" with no indication as to what that entails. It could refer to each one, or the set of three sold as a group.

>

> Stop trying to spark outrage by spreading misinformation.

>

> As for me, I don't know, 1-200 gems seems fairish as they are character bound, but to be honest this whole thing is stupid.

>

> The top tier of gear is account bound, it makes ABSOLUTELY NO SENSE WHATSOEVER for gear templates to be character bound, if I want to use the exact same build on my reaper and mesmer, I should be able to without having to buy/make the entire ASCENDED gear set and a template for them TWICE. And I would much rather pay 800-1000 gems for account bound templates than 100-200 gems for one character bound template. That is kittening WHY ascended gear was made account bound IN THE FIRST PLACE.

>

> And what makes it worse, ANet has already made this mistake with the infinite gathering tools. They were character bound, they were massively overpriced for a character bound item, and they didn't become popular until ANet finally made them account bound and raised the price by a pitiful 25%, demonstrating how much they tend to overprice character bound items. If it's only 1000 gems for every character on your account, 800 gems for one character is downright obscene, even 400 gems would be. And were I a betting man, my money would be on ANet making the exact same stupid mistake again.

>

> To be clear, I am 100% okay with ANet charging for templates, they are a convenience, charging for convenience is not predatory. But I swear, ANet doesn't give their past mistakes so much as a passing thought while they charge headlong into the next mistake.

Because they have different limits with different starting amounts. They'd have to be sold primarily independent of each other to avoid players buying excess. They may sell bundles for players getting new characters started.

There are 6 equipment tabs and we start with 2.

There are 6 build template slots and we start with 3.

There are 24 build storage template slots and we start with 3.

They are offering a set of 3 build storage template slots for free for one month after it launches. So we know these are sold independent of the build template slots and the equipment tabs. Whether they are sold in sets of 3 only is unknown. Whether people want to price out per slot or per 3 slots is up to them as we don't know if they will do a buy more and get more per gem.

So what misinformation am I spreading?

> @"DoRi Silvia.4159" said:

> If you are against paying for templates then this thread is not for you

>

> I have played GW and GW2 since launch

> I understand the frustration people are feeling over this but hey, times are changing and this is 2019 not 2006, ANET probably needs the money but I don't want to expand about it on this thread.

>

> I wanted to see for people who are keen to buy additional template slots to support the game,

> what do you think is a reasonable amount for additional slots? and where would you draw the line on it being overpriced?

>

> Personally hoping they are somewhere between 200~400 gems per slot

>

>

>

Which slots are you talking about?

The build template slots?

The build template storage slots?

The equipment tab slots?

All three are bought independent of each other. I would value each slot differently given their purpose and function and workarounds that exist.

> @"Swagger.1459" said:

> Nobody forces you when something is optional folks. But I’m sure you’d all love the increased content and updates more revenue provides lol

>

> Seems like some don’t want Anet to perform better as a company, yet y’all want Anet to produce all this stuff for you instead. Strange way of thinking.

Since when does how a company earns its money equate to performing better as a company and/or producing content?

You don't seem to be getting what we are saying.

We are saying that we can't think of any time when an optional sub didn't turn out badly for the players who choose not to or worse can't afford the optional sub.

Because the only way to get people to pay monthly for something is to put something that players want locked behind that paywall. And that's what many of us are saying that we don't like. That we've seen it way too often end up with the players who don't sub getting the short end of the stick and the game gets a hard split between those who have the optional sub and those who do not. We've yet to find an MMO where that doesn't happen. If you know of one, please speak up.

For me, I wouldn't do an optional sub (I wouldn't do a required sub either). I would feel too pressured that I had to play GW2 for several hours each month to make the sub worth it and I don't know in advance which months I will and will not be playing often. And I don't want to feel forced to play the game.

I'm not afraid to buy gems with real money when I want something from the gem store. Or want more gold.

Those games with optional subs in them might be great games with great content being added to the game, but that doesn't change my opinion on optional subs or make me want to play them. Because those games have such a deep divide between what you can and can't do with and without the sub. And that doesn't get into my opinion on subs to games in the first place.

> @"Swagger.1459" said:

> > @"crepuscular.9047" said:

> > I'm not against games with subscription model

> >

> > but Guild Wars from the inception had always targeted a different demographic of gamers, those who dont want a subscription model

> >

> > the game and the company had also come too long and far down the track with the model, any sudden shift will cause mass chaos and split the community

>

> Again, the key word here is “optional”. Those that don’t like it don’t have to use it.

The problem is there aren't any optional subscription models out there that don't heavily penalize players who do not have the sub. Maybe not at the start, but it always seems to end up that way.

So again, no to any official optional subscription.

You want one? There's already a way to do that. Open your wallet on the 1st of each month and buy $20 worth of gems. Or whatever you want to give them. There. There's your optional subscription.

No. There already is an optional subscription. It's called opening your wallet and paying for gems each month. Then you can do whatever you want with those gems.

> @"borgs.6103" said:

> I have a potential solution, albeit forced and dirty:

>

> **DON'T INCLUDE ANY GEAR YOU SHARE AMONG YOUR CHARACTERS IN THE EQUIPMENT TEMPLATE**

> For example: You have a legendary sword you use for your thief, revenenant and guardian. When you make their gear templates, exclude the sword when you save it. This way, it *doesn't go in the armory* or whatever they call it.

>

> Unless of course, gear templates are auto-saved in which case, disregard this potential solution.

Gear templates auto save.

> @"Vinceman.4572" said:

> > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > Maybe. I won't know until I've tried it

>

> Then you haven't watched their stream which is a pity because then you'll realize - and every intelligent human being will - that their system is not well-thought. The splitting into three different parts is not due to qol for the players. It's the monetization aspect only which is understandable from the business point but not for the greater good of the game.

>

> > But that's a moot point anyways because Anet is a business that is providing a paid feature within the context of the game.

>

> This argument never gets old. Of course they are a business but everyone of us has their own opinion and can measure for himself if this decision is a good one or not. I won't convince you that I found it terrible and you won't convince me. The market will tell but since we're lacking an expansion that peaked revenues in the past, observed the layoffs, encountered the Deroir & JP debacle, had a disappointing LS announcement + MO leaving the company I doubt that there will be nice numbers in the next months. Where should they come from? That's a serious question for me. There's no indication for a stable evolution of income for Arenanet.

>

>

I don't think it was due to the monetization. It was done to keep the spots where you set the build up in the same place.

I thought the system was well thought out. I don't know how much I will use it or how easy it is to swap builds out between template storage and the build template slots, especially if you have more than the max number of them.

I'd imagine those that have a large number of unique builds on a single character (like 20+) or a large number of characters with more than 2-3 builds per character is likely a minority of players who would use the system in the first place. So while I do feel for those who did fully utilize arc's templates to the fullest extent and now have a problem, I don't think ANet needs to drastically change anything.

They should give a 3rd equipment tab for free as very few builds share the same equipment set up.

I do hope that the build templates are relatively cheap as they won't sell many otherwise since those are done via chat codes. I'd max out on equipment tabs likely well before I would buy another build template slot or storage - beyond any offered for free.

I'm also like Obtena and I watched the stream. I don't judge something until I can actually play with it. Especially if the explicitly state in the stream that things can change. I can get a feel for if I think I will or will not like something, but I can't be sure until I've actually played with it.

I don't judge the prices because we don't know specifics. Only a possible method to base it on, but nothing in the gem store is really like that. Nothing holds 60 items max (including duplicates) but can only hold one helm at a time max. So it's hard to say how that would be priced even knowing what bag and bank slots are. But I can see how people are getting the estimates that they are and agreeing that those estimates make this new system fairly cost prohibitive for people who like to have one character fulfill multiple roles.

> @"Calistin.6210" said:

>

> F2p games are free to download and play but they have a cash shop where storage space, sometimes UI and other things like this are monetized in a cash shop.

>

> B2p generally was you pay for the game once, it free for life and no cash shop, then they whined we need to eat we poor poor game dev/company so along cash shop in b2p with cosmetics only and then they added storage space etc etc once people got acclimatized to this and then it was UI features and now it's basic mechanics like this.

>

> So that's what I mean by double dipping. If you buy a game you should get all the features and not get nickel and dimed cause they purposely lock out some stuff so they can charge you in a cash shop.

>

> Guess it's why in my old age I am little by little losing interest in "online" games and starting to go back to offline single players that have great stories. I know this isn't going to be a popular opinion in these forum but frankly idc if some of the hardcore fans think I am "entitled". I know I am not as I can see the difference in paying for a game then being nickel and dime on far too many things versus expecting everything for free on a silver platter.

I actually agree with Obtena here and if you've been following the threads here you'll know that that isn't usual.

I've yet to see ANet double dip for anything.

We've known since before launch that there would be a gem store where unnecessary QoL features and cosmetics would be sold.

B2P means you buy once and you can play for how long computers can run the game or the server stays up depending on the game and if it needs online access. That is GW2. I don't have to give ANet more money in order to play the game.

Sims 3 is a buy to play game. It has an online store. No one accused EA of double dipping for that. And if any company would be accused of that, it's EA. And they have gotten accused of it in Sims 4 when they released a stuff pack that required a specific expansion pack to be installed that was mostly recolors from that same specific expansion pack.

> @"reative.4093" said:

> > @"Seera.5916" said:

> > > @"reative.4093" said:

> > > > @"VAHNeunzehnsechundsiebzig.3618" said:

> > > > I am pumping real money into the game every month, because I like it. But I am against that 'premium' idea. I would like to be able to customize my home instance a bit tbh - and I would pay for that priviledge. But it is something I can happily live without.

> > >

> > > I pumping money also every month, like 20$ every month even if i don't need. Because i like game. This is why i post this idea, because i like GW2 and i don't want see this game dead.

> > > And also i see what is trendy now in MMO games - housing.

> >

> > But many of us would take our money and go elsewhere.

> >

> > Would the number who buy the premium outweigh those of us that leave?

>

> I think is better try then just sitting, complaining and do nothing.

Or just maybe they should offer decent items in their Gem store and give good quality content out for free.

Like is their current policy. Whether they succeed at that or not is subjective.

> @"reative.4093" said:

> > @"VAHNeunzehnsechundsiebzig.3618" said:

> > I am pumping real money into the game every month, because I like it. But I am against that 'premium' idea. I would like to be able to customize my home instance a bit tbh - and I would pay for that priviledge. But it is something I can happily live without.

>

> I pumping money also every month, like 20$ every month even if i don't need. Because i like game. This is why i post this idea, because i like GW2 and i don't want see this game dead.

> And also i see what is trendy now in MMO games - housing.

But many of us would take our money and go elsewhere.

Would the number who buy the premium outweigh those of us that leave?

> @"Ashantara.8731" said:

> > @"Seera.5916" said:

> > > @"Ashantara.8731" said:

> > > > @"Seera.5916" said:

> > > > The above only counts for the storage needed by build templates and not for anything else that needs to be stored.

> > >

> > > "Storage" in reality is just a couple of characters that define an in-game item in the database of a game server. It's not like you are paying for _real_ storage space to store your old possessions. ;)

> >

> > Still takes up storage space.

>

> My point was: _Not nearly as much as you make it sound._ Those few bits per player are _not_ expensive, hence the argument that this was a valid reason to pay a fortune per slot is nonsense.

For the build templates and build template storage slots I can definitely agree that if they are priced like the bag and bank slots will be too expensive.

The equipment tabs since they do free up inventory space I can see why they have a price. Maybe 1/2 to 2/3 of the cost of a bag slot since while there are more "slots" in the equipment tab than the current max bag, we're limited as to what type and how many of each type we can put into them - we won't even be able to access that max amount at launch and only if they make a legendary tier for everything. Technically you should get a build template slot when you get an equipment tab since very few builds share the exact same traits and skills so might as well just max out the build template stuff (slots & storage slots) and just have people purchase the equipment tabs at a reasonable price per slot. Given the chat code, I don't think many will purchase more than maybe a slot or two and just use out of game spots to store additional builds.

> @"Nick.5276" said:

> > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > @"Seera.5916" said:

> > > Since when are 2 equipment tabs, 3 build template slots, and 3 build storage slots a bunch? Even if you throw in the 3 build storage templates being offered for free, that's still not a bunch.

> >

> > From what I have seen, we are getting some as part of the core game, just like every other quantity-based feature they sell in the GS. That's not a bunch to you? Sounds like something you should get over. No reasonable person is going to argue what 'a bunch' means.

> >

> > You think Anet should offer volume pricing/etc? ... you, me and everyone should already have a really high certainty of how these things are going to be priced ... just like every other quantity-based feature in the GS. If you think of things Anet should do ... and you know they aren't ... you're expectations aren't realistic. In the last 7 years, have you ever seen Anet offer volume-pricing or discounting for bank slots, inventory slots, character slots, shared bags, etc .... ? I haven't. I wouldn't expect such a thing for this feature or any other.

> >

> > My advice is that you watch for sales on the GS, because we know Anet has them. Get your 'volume-discount' then.

>

> I do believe that any, as you say, reasonable person would say that after 7(!) years, for Anet to release an inferior build/gear swapping system to something a gamer did for free and charge for it, is unreasonable. For them to offer far less flexibility and not make it free is unreasonable. For them to expect players to pay for it with their time to make it even a pale shadow of the free version, is unreasonable. To remove the option of using ArcDPS and taking all the risks associated with it into their own hands sounds like monopolising to monetise for the sake of it.

I wasn't expecting it to be completely free, at least not anything that would free up actual inventory. But the quantities given for free are lower than what the average person that build templates are the most useful for use. I'm not saying that the people who have 20+ builds needed to be able to put all of their builds in for free. But more than the 2 complete builds we're currently set to be given for free (how many builds use the same equipment?). Complete build = traits, skills, and equipment.

I think people may not have been at least not as angry if the build templates and storage were just set to maximum and were free, but the equipment tabs cost some money. Or an upfront cost to unlock it all account wide with maxed out build templates and build template storage slots and 3 equipment tabs (1 for each mode or 1 for WvW, open world, and raid/fractal) and then pay for additional equipment tabs.

> @"Ashantara.8731" said:

> > @"Seera.5916" said:

> > The above only counts for the storage needed by build templates and not for anything else that needs to be stored.

>

> "Storage" in reality is just a couple of characters that define an in-game item in the database of a game server. It's not like you are paying for _real_ storage space to store your old possessions. ;)

Still takes up storage space. I kind of sort of am paying for _real_ storage space. It's just a really small spot on a server ;)

> @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > @"Seera.5916" said:

> > Since when are 2 equipment tabs, 3 build template slots, and 3 build storage slots a bunch? Even if you throw in the 3 build storage templates being offered for free, that's still not a bunch.

>

> From what I have seen, we are getting some as part of the core game, just like every other quantity-based feature they sell in the GS. That's not a bunch to you? Sounds like something you should get over. No reasonable person is going to argue what 'a bunch' means.

>

> You think Anet should offer volume pricing/etc? ... you, me and everyone should already have a really high certainty of how these things are going to be priced ... just like every other quantity-based feature in the GS. If you think of things Anet should do ... and you know they aren't ... you're expectations aren't realistic. In the last 7 years, have you ever seen Anet offer volume-pricing or discounting for bank slots, inventory slots, character slots, shared bags, etc .... ? I haven't. I wouldn't expect such a thing for this feature or any other.

>

> My advice is that you watch for sales on the GS, because we know Anet has them. Get your 'volume-discount' then.

So which is it: are they giving us a bunch or are they giving us some? Because now, you've said both. No reasonable person will say that a bunch is the same quantity as some. Except for bananas.

So just because I have feeling that ANet's not going to do something means I just be quiet and not give my opinion on the matter? Already fully aware of just how likely ANet is to do what I'm suggesting. If you noticed, I said ANet should. Not that ANet will likely.

Again, please don't put words in my mouth. I've not stated my expectations so please don't assume what they are. But here they are so that you can stop putting words into my mouth. My expectations are that the equipment tabs will be priced like bag and bank slots - which is what they've said. I have no clue nor expectation on what the price will be for the build templates or the build template storage slots, but I expect a forum outcry unless they are dirt cheap or free, even if the price is reasonable. My expectations are also that I will likely never buy a single equipment tab since they are character specific and will likely be priced like bag slots. I haven't purchased any bag slots, not even on sale. Only have a few because they came in bundles with other things I wanted that made the cost more inline with I think they are worth. Not that I've used them. I don't know which character to put them on. I don't farm, can't stand the monotony, so I don't run into inventory issues often enough on any character. For the build templates and the build template storage slots I have no expectations on if I will buy more than the free build template storage slot pack that ANet will be offering for free when the templates are released. Will likely depend on cost and how many you get per pack.

I don't overhype things or draw unrealistic expectations on things when there's precedent for what to expect. I look for posts and comments that give me the facts on what an expansion, release, patch, etc will have. Not the posts that look like it's just a hype thread. I thoroughly believe that satisfaction in something is when you're expectations are met or exceeded for that something. I don't tend to watch trailers or other such promotional material as they only really serve to hype up something rather than state what features are coming or what the gist of the premise of the story is for that content. For most games I expect to get what I am told is going to be in something, that there will be glitches, and that most of the glitches will get fixed at some point, but not necessarily quickly. The games not covered by this expectation are those made by EA.

> @"Linken.6345" said:

> > @"Inculpatus cedo.9234" said:

> > It's probably determined by how long the player has had the item. Usually, the refund period is 30 days, but sometimes, more or less.

>

> Yea thats for a normal refund but they totaly changed the functionality on it its pretty useless anywere else then home instance and guild halls.

But if they had for long enough period they got enough value out of it.

I do think that they could offer players who purchased the glyph prior to it being changed but too far back to get a refund the option to switch to a different glyph of the same cost. That gives ANet a way to please everyone without setting a bad precedent - same cost and same function.

> @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > @"Seera.5916" said:

> > > @"Patty.3268" said:

> > > > @"Taygus.4571" said:

> > > > That punishes hardcore players and loyal spenders even more....are you crazy?

> > > >

> > > > If anything buying more should get cheaper.

> > >

> > > No, I'm not. If slots start out more expensive and become cheaper the more you buy, that instead punishes non-hardcore players who only need a few additional slots instead of large numbers. There are a lot more non-hardcore players than hardcore players and loyal spenders. I was looking at it taking all types of players into account, not just some. I agree that my approach would make templates more expensive for hardcore players, but would also increase availability of additional slots for the overall player base by having lower entry prizes.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> > Then it should be the first one is at a reduced charge (aka entry fee), then any additional are the original charge. So first for 100, then the remaining are 200. Not this 100(x+1) where x is the number of slots you've purchased.

> >

> > What they should do is discount bulk purchases.

>

> You mean something like getting a whole bunch for free for instance? Done.

Since when are 2 equipment tabs, 3 build template slots, and 3 build storage slots a bunch? Even if you throw in the 3 build storage templates being offered for free, that's still not a bunch. And just the 3 build storage templates being offered in the store for free is a not a bunch on its own either.

A bunch would be the build templates and the equipment tabs set to max for say up to 3 characters and the build template storage at max for free That's a bunch for free. AKA 9 build templates, 12 equipment tabs, and 21 build storage slots. That's a bunch.

What I said was they should offer the first one at a discount and any further at the regular price. Whether they put that discount at free or 50% or whatever.

Offering the first one cheaper makes it easier for people to buy the first one. Once they've bought one, it gets easier to buy more, even if the price is higher. Because they've seen the benefit they gained from having another one. On a permanent basis

And I haven't heard them doing that. Just a temporary one on just the build template storage slots. And to me, that comes off as they know the limits are set too low so they're offering that one pack to attempt to appease us and make them think they're being nice.

Unless you can link to people where ANet says we're going to get a bunch for free. I'm sure everyone would actually like that. Means they've listened to feedback and have altered their plans to make more people happy.

So please, don't put words in my mouth. I'm very literal. I say what I mean.