Seera.5916

The way to handle what you get at what tiers is like how Final Fantasy XIV handles going to instanced content designed for lower levels.

You get access only to things you would have unlocked at that level, but you get to keep your gear (though they did have a few dungeons where they would downscale gear as well). Maps since they have a level range would be the level of the max level foe.

So starter maps would be Level 15

Lornar's Pass would be Level 40

Specializations wise you would be able to fill a line out completely if you have already unlocked all of the traits on the line - too complicated to work out what you would have had unlocked and when.

You would still downscale to those levels even.

This would allow new players who may not even be level 80 yet to join in on maps of their level or below. It would be harder, but some people want the challenge.

Also keeps it simpler for players to figure out what they would have access to no matter what class they are going for. Even if ANet adjusts things in the future.

Could even further the selection of maps by using dungeon maps or fractal maps or or strike mission maps or even raid maps.

> @"Brad.9730" said:

> > @"Seera.5916" said:

> > > @"Brad.9730" said:

> > > > @"robertthebard.8150" said:

> > > > > @"Brad.9730" said:

> > > > > > @"robertthebard.8150" said:

> > > > > > Why are you reposting the same thread again?

> > > > >

> > > > > As stated in the intro, this design is significantly modified based on the constructive feedback from the original post.

> > > > based on your apparent lack of knowledge on some classes due to how you breakup of when they get essential skills.

> > >

> > > It seems like you lack knowledge of how these "essential" skills are already broken up in the game. You do not unlock all slot skills at the same level and you do not unlock all profession skills (F1-F5) at the same level. My design, for the most part excluding Thief design, doesn't create new "breakups" that do not already exist in the game. All my design does is reorganize and redistribute the levels when these "essential" skills are unlocked.

> > >

> > > Also, if these skills are so "essential", then why are the majority of new players making it to Orr without ever needing to use anything but skills 1-3 and occasionally skill 6?

> > Where is this data on what skills players use on the way Orr so that you can claim a majority only use certain skills?

> Try leading a guild or commanding world bosses/metas/raids/strikes. I used to think I was like the average player (not the quickest reflexes and I don't bother with rotations, but I read skill descriptions and event descriptions to understand fundamental mechanics). But, then after leading a guild and commanding organized content I started paying more attention to other players. In my experience, only 25% of players in my groups could learn how to overcome moderate challenges in the game without me giving them instructions. Most players I had to remind them repeatedly of basic mechanics. When chatting with those players who needed more guidance, they didn't say their play style was a personal preference (some players getting attached to a build and never wanting to adapt it) or that their reaction time was just a little off and needed more practice (some people dodging a little too early). The issue was simply they never knew the mechanic, and my explanation gave them that "ahah!" moment. I just want to take the tutorial information that's already in the game and reformat it to make it harder to miss.

>

> > Your method would make me NEVER want to level up a character again.

> I see this sentiment in the comments the most, and I honestly think it's dramatic. But with this feedback, I will tweak this design to make some of the ability unlock delays less severe because, realistically, Anet wouldn't want to disturb its veteran players too much.

>

> Regardless, usually players who find leveling alts to be tedious just feel that way because they find nothing new or interesting about the core Tyrian maps after they've explored/completed them so many times. Usually those bored players aren't worried about their leveling builds because they steamroll through the leveling content without any challenge requiring them to use the extents of their builds. But, let's say you are _that_ type of player who is attached to the current experience of levels alts from levels 1-45. Do you (A) like it because you unlocked lots of new things and your progression felt rewarding during those early levels? Or, do you (B) like it because you just want all unlocks ASAP and you don't care for progression? If you are more of opinion A, then my design will be better to achieve a consistently rewarding sense of progression throughout all levels rather than primarily during the early levels, for example addressing the current lack of unlocks from levels 45 to 71. If you are more of opinion B, then Anet doesn't share your philosophy. Anet treats levels 1-79 as one, extended tutorial via leveling reward tutorial tips and ability unlocks. My design just breaks up those clusters of ability unlocks during this extended tutorial. I'm not reinventing the wheel or changing the game to the point where it no longer feels like GW2.

Anecdotal evidence is not the data I'm referring to. Your guild does not represent a majority of players. And unless you got everyone of them to give you a list of what skills they used and can be 100% sure they didn't lie or forget a skill they used, you can't even use that as even a decent sampling.

So until you can produce data, do not claim a majority only used a certain subset of skills.

It's not dramatic if it's true.

I'm currently leveling up a character now and find the period between unlocks to be perfect.

Here's your problem: you've found the wrong cause of the problem you're trying to- players having issue with more complex fights. It's not the leveling process. It's how the game teaches the skills needed for those complex fights. Spreading out the unlocks will not help players learn those skills.

> @"Dayra.7405" said:

> > @"Seera.5916" said:

> > Unless you need Windows 7 for an older game that will not work at all on Windows 10, I would recommend just biting the bullet and getting Windows 10.

> The problem wasn't any program, but old hardware with problems after upgrade to Windows 10 https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/102000/please-not-this-again

>

My reply was the OP.

My recommendation still stands. Even if that means buying or saving up to buy a new computer instead of upgrading the OS if the OP's hardware isn't compatible.

> @"Brad.9730" said:

> > @"robertthebard.8150" said:

> > > @"Brad.9730" said:

> > > > @"robertthebard.8150" said:

> > > > Why are you reposting the same thread again?

> > >

> > > As stated in the intro, this design is significantly modified based on the constructive feedback from the original post.

> > based on your apparent lack of knowledge on some classes due to how you breakup of when they get essential skills.

>

> It seems like you lack knowledge of how these "essential" skills are already broken up in the game. You do not unlock all slot skills at the same level and you do not unlock all profession skills (F1-F5) at the same level. My design, for the most part excluding Thief design, doesn't create new "breakups" that do not already exist in the game. All my design does is reorganize and redistribute the levels when these "essential" skills are unlocked.

>

> Also, if these skills are so "essential", then why are the majority of new players making it to Orr without ever needing to use anything but skills 1-3 and occasionally skill 6?

Funny, I recall using many of skills as I leveled up my characters.

Where is this data on what skills players use on the way Orr so that you can claim a majority only use certain skills?

No one was claiming they weren't broken up. They are just saying, and I agree, that you're just breaking them apart way too much and making the leveling process a chore rather than a fun experience.

Your set up punishes experienced players to give a slightly better experience to new players. And even then I'm doubting just how much better it is. Nothing in your post indicates just how only limiting to certain skills for longer makes players learn things better. Especially with your assumption that most players only use skills 1-3 and sometimes 6.

To me a better way would be to put in more experiences out in the open world that require players to use certain types of skills in order to defeat them. Or put them into optional solo tutorial missions that give decent rewards to encourage players to do them.

Your method would make me NEVER want to level up a character again. Ever. I would want to use tomes or level up scrolls or level 80 boosts. Which defeats the purpose of your method if I do it on a class that I'm not that experienced with, now doesn't it?

I still play GW2 on a Windows 7 computer. Runs just fine given my other computer components.

Unless you need Windows 7 for an older game that will not work at all on Windows 10, I would recommend just biting the bullet and getting Windows 10. And even then I would ask if you really need that software or game that won't run on Windows 10.

I honestly don't know which OS I will get when my computer dies or needs replacing. And I still play a game (not GW2) that's notorious for being a pain to get running on Windows 10, much less running smoothly.

> @"Ardyth.9286" said:

> I'm on the NA server, and I apologize for my tone and attitude. Up to now I've been a fairly casual occasional player, but with this character I find myself caring, very much, about her success, and it's the first time I've methodically worked through the story. I will shut up now and listen to the masters...8 0

I totally get that mission being one to invoke frustration.

Went through it a few times with a little difficulty because my DPS isn't the best. Don't care about meta and generally can't be bothered to learn a rotation unless it's a very simple one.

The last time I went through it between my skill level and the RNG of where the flame would land and timing of that and to the dragon's ttacks, I swear the game was trolling me. Dragon was attacking the same spot twice in a row. And it would always happen right as the flame was being tossed into a spot guaranteed to get me blown up by one of the plant bombs.

And this wasn't even a main! I was going through the story to get the map currencies because I can't stand farming for stuff for very long.

My offer of help still stands, though. I am currently in game so feel free to send me a message in game if you want help and I can switch to a character that can go through it. Currently leveling a character and they're no where near close enough to be helpful.

Edit: Not in game at the moment, but feel free to send me a message either here on the forum or in game if you need help.

> @"Margeon.9650" said:

> (grumbles) don't tell me, let me guess, on this one if you can't gluide or have something that flies..........might as well not do it casue you will not get to em huh?

All are findable without mounts. You just may not be able to close enough to touch without mounts for some of the cats if the cats are in accessible areas. Some of them are in inaccessible areas of the map even with the griffin or skyscale mounts.

> @"Ashantara.8731" said:

> There is no efficient open world staff build for Guardian. The staff on Guardian is a support weapon (see skills), hence it works best in a support build, which is only useful in WvW or Strike Missions (or during big meta events, if you don't want to DPS and only heal/support).

>

> > @"HnRkLnXqZ.1870" said:

> > Well, there is the

>

> Condition damage builds, and damage builds in general on the Guardian, have much more efficient weaponry available than the staff.

Well, the OP doesn't care if it's meta or not. Just that it's viable. So it being support oriented with low DPS doesn't seem to be something that bothers them.

> @"Ardyth.9286" said:

> > @"Shena Fu.5792" said:

> > Smothering Shadows only appear when you are trying to create a ring of fire for the second time. they don't appear nor matter while you're fighting the boss. you are mistaking the other types of shadows, which won't affect the achievement.

>

> I'm sorry, but that IS what happens. I got as far as killing the boss, next thing I know smothering shadows appeared and doused the flames and I'm back to the beginning having to kill tendrils.

Unless your DPS is high enough you have to go through the cycle a few times. The fires eventually go out on their own even without the shadows dousing them.

And yes, sometimes the mission does seem like it's trolling you.

It does seem like you're reaching the end of wanting to play that mission. Are you on NA or EU region wise? If you want help, I'm available if you're on NA.

> @"Brad.9730" said:

> > @"Linken.6345" said:

> > One question

> >

> > Why do we need anet to reinvent the leveling experience one more time?

>

> As expected, nobody in the forums has any issue with the learning curve in GW2. But, that is because players who bother with the forums are usually more invested in the game and usually more savvy gamers in general compared to the average, casual, GW2 player. I once thought most players in the game were around my level of interest, skill, and game play hours per week as a casual player who participates in all content and game modes within a couple hours every other day. But, in the open world I noticed most players around me were wet noodles, many who would die in a few hits and never waypoint themselves, and they didn't seem to grasp mechanics or event objectives unless they had a commander tag they could follow around (which arguably they still don't learn anything while mindlessly following a tag). Because of this, I created and lead a training guild for a couple years that had mostly new/casual players. Most of my guildies didn't know how or were not comfortable with using basic combat mechanics (dodging, moving around while using skills, using or adapting utility skills, prioritizing ressing downed players rather than dead players while in combat, paying attention to stats on equipment, reading skill or event descriptions, etc.). Many of those players never left core Tyria, or they would enter PoF just to get the Raptor and then go back to core Tyria, but they still purchased things on the gem store.

>

> I'm unable to quickly find the statistic online, but I remember Anet mentioning the highest skilled players in this game outperform the average player dps by 10x or more. That gap is greater than in WoW or any other MMO I've played, which is good to have high skill cap and depth to combat, especially with Anet's philosophy is to make GW2 easy to learn and difficult to master. But, is GW2 easy enough to learn fundamental mechanics? - Well that's subjective. Was my guild full of people who are just bad at every game they play? - Objectively, no. Many of my guildies were successful in console RPGs and iOS games. After asking them more about it, the main difference in their gaming experience compared to GW2 was a tutorial that held their hand in a step-by-step, gradual pace and explained all of the fundamental features and mechanics. Is there anything in GW2 where a tutorial guide explains things to me and asks me to press "Continue" when I'm ready to move on to the next piece of info? I don't think so, and I remember learning nothing in the level 1 "tutorial" instance besides what I intuitively found out from being a savvy and inquisitive gamer. Many gamers hate a highly detailed tutorial, but there is always the option to skip or disable tutorials. Many gamers also want to have access to all of the high-skill ceiling mechanics ASAP, so I designed it so that all abilities are unlocked by mid-level. In most MMOs, you're still unlocking new abilities up until your last level, so in my design, unlocking all abilities (rather than layered on traits) by mid-level, is still sped up compared to the slower common trend in other MMOs that players there find more accessible and still enjoyable.

>

> I know everything in my design will be controversial to savvy players who use the forums. Change alone is controversial. But, at least my design for 6 combat training tutorial instances shouldn't be controversial, and at the least, these tutorial instances should be implemented into the game. Too many players forget or neglect to dodge after doing it the one and only time to get to the trapped chest in the starter zones. I ask others to think outside of ourselves and think about the average players in the game. How would this design benefit the average player and not just the players who are primarily only in level 80 zones anyways and wouldn't be affected by these changes? Why is it important to cater towards these unskilled casuals? - Because losing players, whether they're skilled or unskilled, loses revenue for the game, and making this game more digestible (and consequently enjoyable) to those unskilled casuals will make them more likely to invest their time (and consequently their money) into the game. Improved tutorials will also help to bridge the gap between the unskilled players and the players who outperform them by 10x. This is already an initiative by Anet, as seen by the resources they put towards strike missions, but these initiatives need to impact players way earlier in their game play experience. If the average player engages with more difficult content more, then we will get more development for challenging content (hence, more raids). The entire leveling process from 1-80 is already treated by Anet as an extended tutorial process via leveling rewards tutorial tips, but the current format isn't effective enough. In its essence, my design doesn't change anything about the core design of the leveling experience in the game. It shuffles some things around, spaces them out in some areas but then pulls them closer together in other areas, adds in new tutorials, and I imagine it also improves the rewarding sense of progression. Currently, I don't feel like my character progresses at all between the levels of 45 and 71. You don't really notice the stat boosts you get, and you've already unlocked all your favorite abilities/traits with hero points by mid-level. My design makes every 5 levels feel rewarding, and it makes map completion (reaching the max tier level) also feel more rewarding by rewarding profession abilities or complete trait lines, all while controlling the pace better so that new players can better digest and become savvy with the game.

Your design makes it so I would never want to make another new character again without having either tomes of knowledge or a level 80 boost to bypass the long slog your method makes leveling up. Even for classes I don't know that well. Which defeats the purpose of your method, doesn't it?

Your design level will turn a fun part of the game for me - map completion - into a chore because now I have to do it to fully unlock my characters' skills.

Your method turns leveling into a chore.

Your design heavily punishes the experienced just to make it slightly easier on new players. In other words: the cons of this proposal far outweigh any pros this proposal brings.

> @"Danikat.8537" said:

> > @"Infusion.7149" said:

> > I strongly recommend against playing core engineer as it is regarded not new player friendly. With core engineer you only have access to rifle and pistol mainhand and rely on kits for damage. It's gotten better due to changes to core engineer kits & skills (bomb kit, grenade kit, turrets) but generally holosmith (sword and photon forge) and scrapper (hammer) elite specs are much easier.

>

> You're not wrong, but I consider a variation of that the worst gaming advice I ever recieved (except maybe advice on finding Mew in Pokemon Red, which was all lies). When I first started Baldur's Gate (which was the first RPG where I had any clue what I was doing) I was told to make my first character a human fighter and not to play anything else until I'd completed the game like that because otherwise it would be too confusing. Thankfully that's a game where you have to play your whole party anyway, you can't just focus on one character. But I soon found I was spending all my time focusing on the other characters and almost totally ignoring mine because for me simple and easy to learn is also boring, there was so little to do that I could pretty much select a target and then ignore her while I worried about chaining spells together because that was much more interesting and felt more impactful.

>

> If I had been stuck only playing that fighter with no idea what the rest of the party was doing I'd probably have never finished the game at all because I'd have concluded it was boring and not worth bothering with, which would have been a huge mistake. Instead I rerolled as a cleric and loved it.

>

> Same thing in GW2. I literally had to bite my tongue when my husband (who doesn't have much experience with RPGs) picked a mesmer as his first character. I was worried he'd find it too complicated, die a lot and give up. I did persuade him to check out warrior as well, but like my fighter he found it boring and while he did struggle with learning to play a mesmer he enjoyed it a lot more and therefore had more of an incentive to learn to play it well because he was enjoying it.

>

> I suspect the same is true for most people, if you're enjoying the game you'll be more inclined to put in the time and effort to learn how to play it, however complicated it is. It's nice to know there are simple options available in case what you chose is too difficult and you're not enjoying it, but I don't think it's a good idea to insist that everyone start with the simplest option just in case they struggle with the others.

>

This.

I would not have a blanket general I would not recommend class for a new player. Especially not for a stranger.

I would explain which classes are easier and harder. Then let the player choose. Now if it was someone I knew in real life and I knew what their preferences were for a first play through of a game or what type of character they like the best or what type they hate, then I would give them a recommendation. But still would let that player decide without making them think that I think they made a wrong choice.

GW2 was my first MMO. I played in the last beta weekend for the first time at the invitation of my brother. I played warrior there first just so I would have an easier character to get my feet wet on. But I also played a little Ranger and a little Elementalist during that beta weekend. Definitely not enough time on any class to have learned the game or the mechanics.

Game launch comes and I make an Elementalist. Because it's one of the hardest classes. I harder class would make bad habits more punishing and therefore less likely to become habits in the first place.

Did I die a lot? Yea. Needed help with a story step that's in the chapters from before you join an Order. Still die a lot on her. Took me several deaths to figure out to do Eater of Souls in PoF's story and even then I didn't do it at the ideal method (didn't break the breakbar, I still struggle with that). And she's still my main.

And even looking back, I wouldn't change what class I started with. Or what character I take through content first.

> @"Super Hayes.6890" said:

> If the hard to get skins were gemstore items we wouldn't be debating. I could get the skin I want while supporting the game without being blocked by a zero fun grind wall. I do not see gemstore skins as an issue at all. Buying gold with gems to get skins isn't a big deal either until it crosses an unreasonable line because the rarity is out of line with the gaming population for a given item or skin.

But is the item out of line with other similar items? IE: is there an Asura helm that's more common?

If it's out of line many won't get it. And at that point ANet will assess if there are enough generated to match what it thinks should be the right amount in game. This is independent on cost for this item as it's not a building block for other items.

You either want the item enough to buy it with time or money, or you don't. ANet will decide if the ratio of who is willing to and not willing to is where they want it and will adjust accordingly.

My biggest tip is to play whatever you want when you want.

You'll earn gold over time.

What's the point in getting all of the gold and the item you're looking for if you end up burnt out before you get to that point or right as you get it and therefore not get to enjoy your reward?

> @"Super Hayes.6890" said:

> "It's okay for some things in the game to be rare until it is something you want." Fixed that for you and, trust me, it's true.

I'd still be fine with it. It might change my desire for it once I realize how expensive or time consuming it would be to obtain it. I might grumble a bit, but I'd still be fine with how rare it is.

Or it becomes my new long term goal to work toward.

Maybe you have problems with things being rare if you want them, but don't assume everyone else does.

> @"Khisanth.2948" said:

> That fight is pretty easy unless you are going Migraine mode which is meant to be a challenge. There is also the Flight of Fancy achievement and well sometimes achievements try to live up to their name. Other than that just ignore the gliding and many problems go away.

From reading the bug post looks like he got hit by lag during the phase where you have to use your glider. I can see how lagging out there can cause problems due to how the game handles lag.

Here's the thing. They have to have some rare to get items or players will complain there's no rewards worth doing metas for. You can't have it both ways.

I'd rather have metas with worthwhile rewards to get players to do them.

If the playerbase doesn't value the charr helm at whatever price it is now, it will go down as more players get it and put it up for sale cheaper than what the last guy did until it gets to a price point that people will pay for.

On the very rare occasion ANet does step in and alter things if the item is not in the price range it wants but those are usually the building blocks for crafting and not end products. Or if there were other items of similar type (like other racial helms) that have a much higher creation rate than the charr helm, then they'd likely step in then.

> @"Jilora.9524" said:

> > @"Wraith.8127" said:

> > > @"Jilora.9524" said:

> > > Try making multiple threads complaining about the same thing. Oh, too late

> >

> > Is that what passes for edgy these days? shame.

> >

>

> Nope, it's when someone who reads most threads and just happened to see the same kitten twice. Maybe someone will hold your hand and tell you how to play your game with no idea what interests you. Like one boot from a map and you act like the path you wanted is now closed is the shame. It will happen again by d/c or accidentally walking to the edge of a map down the line. Frustrating yes game altering no

That's the thing, he didn't cross post. He posted in the bug forum in hopes that his problem can be fixed.

He also posted here in Players Helping Players to get an idea of what to do next since he wasn't sure what to do since his original plan got derailed.

He's not sure what the end of the HoT fight entails so he wanted to make sure that if he continued to the next step he wouldn't be missing anything major. At least that's what I got out of what he posted.

> @"zealex.9410" said:

> > @"Hot Boy.7138" said:

> > > @"zealex.9410" said:

> > > Ik full well that legendaries will lose alot of their value once legendary armory is out and ppl start making the weapon and armor types they still need but i still think that even for the cosmetic aspect that it would be nice to see a third gen of weapons.

> >

> > i actually think the legendary armory will give greater value to have legendaries. it doesn't take away the value from them.

>

> Look at it this way, the armory makes it so when you make a gs you will never need anoter greatsword because the armory will take care of the statswapping for all your characters, therefor any other greatsword has the value of a skin to you but with the same pricepoint.

>

> It makes any legendaries past the first of a type way less lucrative so why i think a gen 3 would be overall less desired by most ppl.

Or it could get a lot of people who didn't want to bother with legendaries due to the hassle of switching them between characters the desire to actually do so.

Especially legendary armor. Even more so if skins are unique to the build and you don't have to reskin them each time you switch character.

You could watch the HoT end boss fight on YouTube - that way you get the story. That way you're still able to follow the story without missing anything.

> @"gravekeeper.8352" said:

> > @"Seera.5916" said:

> > It's unreasonable to ask ANet to give content away for free. It's fine to ask for a discount on Living Story if bundling with an expansion pack. But asking for it for free is unreasonable. ANet needs to make money. They're nice by giving the story away for free to players who are currently at least logging into the game while that chapter is active.

>

> The original Guild Wars had paid DLC episodes that were totally parallel to the main story arc. That was awesome and I bought all of them!

> The problem with Guild Wars 2 is that customers buy the full product offered by ANet's website, which is advertised as being complete (including past expansion), as mentioned in the post above yours, thinking they'd get the full story. A few days afterwards they find out they have to pay for multiple packages in order to get the main story. That's not OK.

>

And if you read my posts you would have seen that I agree that ANet could do a better job at making that known.

> @"Teratus.2859" said:

> > @"Seera.5916" said:

> > > @"Teratus.2859" said:

> > > > @"robertthebard.8150" said:

> > > > > @"Teratus.2859" said:

> > > > > > @"robertthebard.8150" said:

> > > > > > > @"Teratus.2859" said:

> > > > > > > And this is exactly what i've been warning about for years.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I'm sorry you have to deal with this, I have pointed out this major flaw in living world for many years as well as the reality that it gets worse and worse the more living world chaptors are introduced to the game.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Bringing new players to the game is all well and good but if they cannot complete the main game story despite buying both expansions then there is a serious problem there.

> > > > > > > Granted Anet have been pretty generous with expansions overall, atm you buy PoF and get full game access and HoT for free which is awesome.

> > > > > > > But you need that living world to fill in a lot of story gaps and frankly there is so much of it now that price tag is pretty bloated.

> > > > > > > Yes you can farm in game gold and buy them that way but that's a long and tedious process..

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I've said for years that if you buy the special editions of expansions then they should come with the previous season of living world as a bonus.

> > > > > > > Likewise we need more living world season bundle discounts and more so.. a reasonable heads up on when that is due to happen so people have time to put money aside to buy them.

> > > > > > > It is infuriating when something you really want goes on sale in the store and you can't afford it.. specially when if you had known it was coming you could have put some money aside for it.. I recently went through this with character slots myself and missed the sale only to buy one shortly after for full price.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Living world is a big part of this game so it needs to be made easier to obtian for newer players who missed it, otherwise I see it as more of a reason for new players not to bother with this game and that's just unfortunate and I don't want anyone to feel that way about one of my favourite games.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I am a Gw2 Collectors owner as well as an owner of both HoT and PoF ultimate editions and will be adding Expansion 3's ultimate edition to this collection as well.

> > > > > > > I've played the game since Beta and been present for all the free living world over the last 8 years and i've put god knows how much into the gemstore over the years on account upgrades, keys, cosmetics, toys etc.. and that's just Gw2, I played Gw1 too for many years and invested a bit in that game as well.

> > > > > > > I think i've payed my fair share is all im saying there, so I think i've earned the status of longtime paying customer of this franchise.. so any weight that has to support my above statements please add it.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Except that you can complete the main game's story w/out spending a dime now, since it's F2P. The main game story ends at Zhaitan, after all, and you're not required to buy anything. But, let's look at this from my perspective: I am relatively new. I missed LS 1, 2 and 3. I got LS 4 for free, as I was actively playing when it released. Guess what? I harbor no resentment, or ill will. Just like I don't expect I should be able to get any rewards that were offered for special promotions for the time I wasn't here. I wasn't here, and I shouldn't get it any differently than anyone else did. If someone that was playing somehow missed a window, and had to buy content, then it shouldn't be any different for me, and it shouldn't be any different for someone that starts tomorrow.

> > > > >

> > > > > It's not so much about the principle of it, more the negative effects of it.

> > > > >

> > > > > Sure you can buy the core game and the expansions in one go for pretty cheap now but if you know that you are going to have to spend a significant amount of money to fill in story gaps that are not included with the paid expansions you bough then that is a big turn off for a lot of people.

> > > > > When you buy something you expect it to be a complete product.. not something that is essentially cut up into parts.

> > > > >

> > > > > I'd argue including HoT with PoF is actually a worse deal than including Season 2 with HoT and Season 3 with PoF.

> > > > > If I were a new player I would much rather buy 2 expansions seperately with their previous living worlds included rather than buy 1 expansion and get the other for free.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > Ok, and? I purchased HoT and PoF, and then purchased the LSs that I could that I was missing, so 2 and 3, and still spent less than I did over 6 months of DDO VIP. I get why people want to play the "new player card" in these threads, but what is it that anyone doing so is expecting? Is it that they're expecting devs to think "Hey, they're right, those new players don't understand the concept of "this was introduced for free for a limited time" so we need to change our practices"? That's what it looks like from where I'm sitting, all as a justification for things like "I'd get another account, but I don't want to have to buy all that stuff again, so they need to make concessions". I mean, it's not like I didn't offer my perspective on it, as a new player, and not as someone that got them all for free. I'd pay a sub, if I had to, in order to play. The options we have now are far cheaper than maintaining a sub all year, or for however long over a month or two.

> > >

> > > I would say you're in a minority on that front.

> > > From personal experience I've tried to get many of my friends into Gw2, several of them back into Gw2 as they used to play back in the day before expansions.

> > > The one thing that makes all of them decide not to is becuase of how much living world they would have to buy to catch up.

> > > It's not so much the price that bothers them although it is a contributing factor, it's their placement in the game's story that bothers them most of all.

> > > Simply put they do not want to buy 2 expansions that are seperated by 2 seasons of content they have to buy seperately to understand the story and they are not ok with skipping ahead to play the content they have bought and then going back at a later time.

> > >

> > > Considering they want to play it together they also don't want to have everyone buy the expansions and then wait around for everyones financial situation to allow for filling in the living world stuff.

> > > It's just too messy and ultimately puts them off coming back to the game.

> >

> > I wouldn't claim either side was a majority or a minority. There's also the minority that doesn't care for the story and only tolerates it long enough for things locked behind the story.

> >

> I meant minority in regard to a new player defending the way it works currently that's all, I could be wrong but from my experiences with friends and new players etc the more common opinion of the catch up requirements is often negative rather than positive.

>

> > Really only Living Story 3 and on needs to be purchased to get the bulk of the story. Since Living Story 2 does not have maps that are locked to players with the Living Story unlocked, friends can tag along for the ride and enter the instances with players. The only thing would miss is anything that would only show up to a player during the portions that are open world in dialogue menus with NPC's. And nothing there is super critical to the story I don't recall.

> >

> Between expansions sure season 3 is important but Season 1 and 2 do fill in a lot between Personal Story and HoT too which if you are invested in the story you will want to fill those blanks in.

> Unfortunately that remains impossible with season 1 but hopefully not for too much longer.

> I think the biggest thing in season 2 that might confuse players in HoT is the Egg and Caithe going from friend to suspected enemy.

> That might throw a few people off if they skip season 2.

>

> > I would liken it to the way Sims 4 does its additional packs. HoT and PoF are expansion packs. Living Story are game packs. They add a little extra game play for a smaller cost than an expansion pack. ANet however encourages players to at least log into the game by offering those game packs for free if you log in during the time that they are the most recently released story.

> >

> > By the time your friends finished the HoT story, they would know if they wanted to spend more money for Living Story 3 or not. Or have earned enough gold to convert to gems to do so.

> >

> It's not that they didn't know if they wanted to spend money on the game or not, more that they wanted to buy an expansion and get everything they needed upto that expansion in a single payment which is usually how DLC/expansions work.

> They didn't want to buy 2 expansions and have to buy the filler inbetween them seperately.. it just made it akward due to everyones different financial situations controlling who could buy what and when, they were basically left with a choice of leave people behind or spend money on content you wont play for potentially months until all your friends can afford it.. it was just messy and everyone just felt like it wasn't worth it.

>

> > And speaking as someone who barely did any of Living Story 3 and has completed PoF's story, I wasn't that confused by things. I could still follow the story and anything crucial was referenced. I might not know the exact how certain things happened, but that they happened.

> >

> For some people that's fine but for others it's something they can't do.

> Personally can relate there, skipping story bugs me immensely.. it's why I have no characters half way through PoF without having done literally every story episode prior to it.. I just can't do it.

> It's also why the absense of living world 1 really bothers me too XD

>

> > But it's not unreasonable for them to ask for players to buy the content that they've spent time working on. We active players should actually be glad that they give them out for free if we're logged in. What other game gives content away regularly for free to active players that doesn't have a more aggressive cash shop (aka pay to win) or a subscription model?

>

> I'm not asking for them to be made free, just more sensible.

> Rather than Buy PoF and get HoT free It would be better if they did, Buy HoT, get season 2 free and likewise the same for PoF and season 3.

> They'd make the same amount of money if not more and it would just be a cleaner method of distribution that doesn't totally botch the story continuity like the current one does.

> They can still have their big HoT/PoF bundle too it would just be a tad more expensive and contain 2 seasons of living world with it.. hell they could even keep the current deal too for those who just want the expansions and don't give a toss about the story.

> Guess what i'm asking for is simply options that appeal to a larger audience to entice more people to come play this awesome game.

And I gave the solution for the Season 2 story. Have someone who can afford it to buy it and they can run up to 4 players who can't afford it through the story at a time. None of the maps Season 2 brought to the game are locked to players who unlocked/purchased the living story.

That still doesn't address the fact that by the time they got through the core story, had played Season 2 alongside someone who had the ability to purchase Season 2 (which is offered as a bundle on the sale page), and then played HoT, a new player would likely have the gold to buy season 3. Or enjoy content that would help them earn the gold to buy season 3.

Also remember the Living Story episodes can be purchased by using gems and you can convert gold to gems. Which means that players strapped for cash in real life can use time in game to earn gold to turn into gems to buy the Living Story. Or you and your friends that could buy the story outright can also give gold to your friends who can't to help them convert the required gold to gems.

There's a lot of content in this game to spend time on if you wanted to do the story together but had to wait for friends to earn money/gold to buy the episodes. Dungeons, Fractals (and their masteries), WvW, PvP, Core Tyria and HoT map exploration, World bosses, jumping puzzles, Core Tyria and HoT achievement hunting, Core map masteries (auto loot, precursor crafting, etc), HoT map masteries (gliding being the big one), creating additional characters to level up, crafting, among other things.

It's unreasonable to ask ANet to give content away for free. It's fine to ask for a discount on Living Story if bundling with an expansion pack. But asking for it for free is unreasonable. ANet needs to make money. They're nice by giving the story away for free to players who are currently at least logging into the game while that chapter is active.

They do have a discounted Season 2 bundle (60% of the total cost, the gem store sales are usually 80% of the total cost) when buying the expansion packs. They really do need to put at least Season 3 on there with at least the same level of discount. And then do the same with LS4 and the Icebrood Saga and future LS and Sagas released when EP3 comes out.

But my other points still stand for ways around it for your friends.

> @"Aridon.8362" said:

> They allow you to change it but you have to submit a ticket for it and give a good reason for doing so. They allowed me to change the one on my old account because it had my real name on it.

And that really good reason has to be one of a very few set of reasons.

The reason is changing display name has a tendency to irreversibly break accounts. And given that that's not changed in the 7+ years the game has been active, there's a high chance that that code is too built into other things and the time spent fixing it, outweighs the benefits of having the possibility there to change names without breaking things.

> @"Merzhin Hudour.4698" said:

> I stopped playing one year or maybe two years after launch, for a lot of reasons including the fact that I couldn't play my elementalist the way I wanted to if I wanted to be efficient in pve or pvp.

> One of the things I loved with GW was that I could play the way I wanted with my Elem, except for some specific missions or high-end elite areas.

> And it was the first mmorpg which made me want to play another class, and I did a Ritualist which I could also play the way I wanted in 90% of the game content.

> This wasn't the case with Gw2 at launch, and it still doesn't seem to be the case now neither, and that's why I don't really like these "elite specs".

> Also, to dive a bit deeper in the subject, gw had a marvelous and rare gameplay mechanic which required players to hunt down and steal elite skills from bosses all over the world, to make them stronger. We also had the Ascension which allowed us to bring our avatars closer to gods by allowing them a second class.

> Which means that our characters really grew in strength, power and knowledges long after reaching max level.

>

> Now, after two expansions, two new elite specs for each class, our characters are not more powerful, they're just useful in a different way but still limited with only 3 possible active specializations, making the previous time invested and specs useless, and even requiring to change weapons in order to be efficient.

> It doesn't make sense at all for me.

>

> They did it because it's easier for sure. But the easy path is not always the best. Balance isn't a matter of gameplay mechanics, it's a matter of skills, damages, numbers, and they have all the control on these to balance the game even if they allowed 4 specs, because all players could have them.

> So it's a false argument.

It's not a false argument. I never said they made the right choice or the best choice in the long run. Just that they made the choice because it was easier to balance than what it was. Since you didn't give a time frame on when you left and I couldn't remember when the change happened.

I can't talk to Guild Wars 1 as I never played it so I can't speak to how progression felt in that game vs this game. My brother and his friends played it and my brother did mention he liked build crafting. But did mention that all the build combinations the game had made it virtually impossible to balance.

ANet chose what it did with the elite specs because they didn't want those who chose not get the expansion packs for whatever reason to not be left behind those who did buy the expansion packs in PvP, WvW, or high end content where builds matter. Granted they did miss the mark and most of the elite specs do end up outperforming the core specs, but that was their goal. And they're not so overpowered that there aren't still close to meta core builds.

> @"Merzhin Hudour.4698" said:

> Coming back to the game after years without playing it, I don't find any interesting "Elite Specialization" for my characters. Elem can chose between support spec and weird double affinity spec, neither of them feeling attractive, and my recently leveled up ranger can pick .. between support healer and weird pokemon spec which makes you turn into one of your pets.

> First, none of them do justice to these 2 classes in my opinion, but moreover, I find it totally dumb that we need to replace one of our older specs in order to choose a new one. It feels like your character suddenly forget what he was able to do and which abilities and strengths you spent hours improving and masterizing just to get lost in a new strange way.

> It would make sense and really feel like an improvement and boost of power if they added a fourth slot to use the new spec, but no.

>

> So for now I just keep playing with my basic skills and abilities with both of my lv80 characters

Funny, I'm doing plenty of DPS as my Tempest with very few things chosen for support and I didn't find Weaver to be weird, just more complex. Can't speak on Ranger elite specs as I haven't played them. Personally, it sounds like to me you went in hating the elite specs and went to find a reason to do so given your descriptions.

I play a Fresh Air Tempest which is DPS oriented - look it up for a non-support Tempest build.

Weaver to me actually sounds like a natural progression of an Elementalist. One decided that instead of just playing around in one element at a time that it would try playing around in two at the same time and even mixing the two for a few spells.

Also how is the fact that you can only choose 2 core specs if you choose to do an elite spec different than just core with there being 5 core specs and you only being able to choose 3?

Unless you stopped before they changed from the time where you could pick some from each spec line to only being able to choose to go fully down 3 spec lines. But they did that for balance reasons as it's fewer combinations so it's easier to balance.

> @"WinterSolstice.7829" said:

> I mean for every Build template for a character is another character you don't need to buy/make for builds as a swap convenience.

Considering that they allow you to store them as chat codes that can be easily stored in say a Notepad document, they're overpriced for the QoL. They should have been much cheaper.