Price incoherences

[Venser.9631]

Hello fellow players,

During my tribulations in this quite entertaining game I've come across a few balance issues/incoherence and I'd like to talk about one of them with you today:

Why is it that a two-handed weapon costs generally the same or just slightly more than a one-handed one? It would seem logical to me to make them cost twice as much as they act like two one-handed weapons combined anyways, double the stats, double the rune slots and double the infusions slots. Is there anything I'm missing?

[DeanBB.4268]

You'll have to be a bit more specific. Which weapons, from which source?

 

If you mean the Trading Post, those prices are set according to buying and selling -- the players, in other words.

 

If you mean vendors, there are a great many currencies, so you'd have to specify. For example, plain white weapons from a Weaponsmith generally do have more expensive gold cost for one-handed vs. two-handed.

 

Crafting? Karma vendor? Lots of possibilities...

[Linken.6345]

I think its the sab weapons right?

[Khisanth.2948]

You could say the same for Black Lion Weapon skins. They all cost 1 ticket each.

 

That pricing scheme is both right and wrong depending on how you look at it.

[Illconceived Was Na.9781]

> @"Venser.9631" said:

> Why is it that a two-handed weapon costs generally the same or just slightly more than a one-handed one? It would seem logical to me to make them cost twice as much as they act like two one-handed weapons combined anyways, double the stats, double the rune slots and double the infusions slots. Is there anything I'm missing?

 

If you look at vendor prices, you'll see that single-handed are more expensive than off-hands and less than two-handed. Any price that people are willing to pay above that is due to supply & demand. There's zero demand for most L80 masterwork weapons, so they tend to trade at vendor+18% (minimum TP listing price).

 

Real life also offers strange pricing. For example, the cost of serving a 16 oz soda at a fast food restaurant is marginally more than providing a 12 oz, but the additional price we pay is always much more than marginally more.

 

Regardless, though, in-game pricing also has to take into account for other aspects than just the "obvious." Just because it seems "logical" for something to work one way doesn't mean that it _should_. Thus two-handed weapons don't cost twice as much because the game designers determined that it ultimately wouldn't be as good a game if they did.

[Khisanth.2948]

Prices fairly consistent.

 

For example ...

Funerary weapons: 2h cost twice as much as 1h/offhand

Fractal weapons: all the same price

 

[Linken.6345]

dungeon weapons 210 for 1hand and 390 for 2h

[Hibiskus.8294]

Well...i think he maybe talks about the ascended wvw weapons....when i look at the cost...it is the exact same ammount of gold / tickets, so if you buy a two handed you are fully equiped, but when you buy a one handed weapon...well then you have some slots free...or you pay 10 gold (tickets, etc....)so you need the double ammount of gold, etc to get both hands equipped.....i never thought about the price though...i farm the things i need...but because of that i focus on getting the two handed weapons first....

look at the wiki...i really think he means these prices....(i cant think of other weapons that have the exact same priece):

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Skirmish_Supervisor

[Illconceived Was Na.9781]

According to GW2 Efficiency (and at the time I'm posting),

* a Power Mirage might get [Zojja's Axe & Shield for ~90g](https://gw2efficiency.com/crafting/calculator/a~0!b~1!c~0!d~1-46759;1-46770)

* a "bearbow" Mesmer would [spend 48g for the GS](https://gw2efficiency.com/crafting/calculator/a~0!b~1!c~0!d~1-46762)

 

I can see why the OP might think that's "unfair", but that's not the same thing as being "unbalanced. The alternative would be requiring two-handed weapons to use e.g. more dowels or inscriptions, which would make things even more complicated for crafting, while doing little except making the one-time costs more comparable.

 

 

[Linken.6345]

> @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

> According to GW2 Efficiency (and at the time I'm posting),

> * a Power Mirage might get [Zojja's Axe & Shield for ~90g](https://gw2efficiency.com/crafting/calculator/a~0!b~1!c~0!d~1-46759;1-46770)

> * a "bearbow" Mesmer would [spend 48g for the GS](https://gw2efficiency.com/crafting/calculator/a~0!b~1!c~0!d~1-46762)

>

> I can see why the OP might think that's "unfair", but that's not the same thing as being "unbalanced. The alternative would be requiring two-handed weapons to use e.g. more dowels or inscriptions, which would make things even more complicated for crafting, while doing little except making the one-time costs more comparable.

>

>

What have mesmers taken over the ranger jobb???

 

How do I become a bearbow mesmer.

 

[Illconceived Was Na.9781]

> @"Linken.6345" said:

> What have mesmers taken over the ranger jobb???

>

> How do I become a bearbow mesmer.

>

 

It's off-topic, of course. I'm surprised you haven't seen scenarios like this before:

* One player pulls/taunts/kites foes into a clump right on top of everyone's AoEs

* The "bearbow" mesmer (running GS, rather than LB) uses Illusionary Wave `[5]`, spreading the mobs to the five corners of the combat area, and putting them safely out of harm's way of the cleverly laid down AoEs.

 

(To be fair, every profession has access to a non-meta build that offers skills or rotations that can do more harm than good. It's never been unique to rangers.)

 

[mercury ranique.2170]

As stated by others, please be more specific. A generic answer would be that you are not buying the weapon, but more the skin attached to it. If you dual fuel axes you can apply this skin to both axes for the price of one.

[Venser.9631]

Sorry for the huge delay, didn't get email notifications....

What I meant was mainly fractal weapons which cost the same regardless of 1h or 2h so you end up having to buy it twice to get your stuff. The same can also be said for Knight of the Thorn. By doing the quest once you either get one 1h weapon or one 2h weapon. So for the guy playing sword/shield he has to complete the quest twice to get both those ascended weapons whereas the guy playing greatsword only has to do it once. Same reasoning can be applied to weapon chests.

[Eloc Freidon.5692]

There is a problem. Simply pointing out an example where it is consistent doesn't excuse all the other instances that aren't.

[Illconceived Was Na.9781]

> @"Eloc Freidon.5692" said:

> There is a problem.

No, it's just different from how some people would design the game. It's not a "problem" for people who aren't letting their expectations get in the way of how the game actually plays out.

 

> Simply pointing out an example where it is consistent doesn't excuse all the other instances that aren't.

And simply saying it's "inconsistent with my expectations" doesn't make it an issue.

 

[Biff.5312]

Prices are going to depend more on the cost of manufacture, and demand, than how 'big' they are.

[Venser.9631]

> @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

> > @"Eloc Freidon.5692" said:

> > There is a problem.

> No, it's just different from how some people would design the game. It's not a "problem" for people who aren't letting their expectations get in the way of how the game actually plays out.

>

> > Simply pointing out an example where it is consistent doesn't excuse all the other instances that aren't.

> And simply saying it's "inconsistent with my expectations" doesn't make it an issue.

>

 

Either it's accidental and then we can fairly say it needs some attention or it is intentional and the question then is : Is it a good design? I would say no because it applies unecessary friction on the playstyle choices of the users. Choosing between 1h or 2h shouldn't be in my opinion for monetary reasons.

[DarcShriek.5829]

Weapons are cheap. The price does not decide if I use a one handed or two handed weapon. Prices only determine what skin I use. I’m cool with that

[Illconceived Was Na.9781]

> @"Venser.9631" said:

> Either it's accidental and then we can fairly say it needs some attention

We can say it's intentional. Prices for weapons in GW1 are usually identical (e.g. Holy Staff costs 5 white mantle emblems; it costs 10 to buy a scepter and focus with the same trophy). Similarly in GW2, costs & vendor values for 2-handed weapons have consistently been lower than the price of any combination of main- plus off-hand.

 

> Is it a good design? I would say no because it applies unecessary friction on the playstyle choices of the users. Choosing between 1h or 2h shouldn't be in my opinion for monetary reasons.

If that's you're only worry, the design is fine. Who actually chooses a 2h weapon over a main-hand or off-hand because of monetary reasons? Even for legendaries, people decide to make the effort based primarily on design (they like it enough or they don't) and secondarily on the details of the grind. If all else is equal, people will sometimes start with a 2-handed weapon when upgrading, because it's a faster route to having e.g. two infusion slots on ascended, but they don't undermine their build by choose 2H over main+o/h.

 

Game design doesn't much care about whether things are equivalent or equal; the primary criteria is whether it ends up being fun. Forcing 2H weapons to equal the cost of Main+Off doesn't make the game more fun.

 

PS there are some real life analogues. All-in-one computers typically cost less on the retail market than buying an equivalent computer with a separate equivalent monitor. Part of it is that people are willing to pay more for the flexibility plus the retailers spend a little less on building a single product