New thing called dpsmeter

[AliamRationem.5172]

> @"Pimpology.6234" said:

> Ingame dps meters are clearly now a toxic/ negative part of this game that wasn't present pre raids. :( wrong direction the game is going imo.

> The game was suppose to stand out and be different from the rest, sadly its just conforming to the norms.

 

Are you sure? I mean, I've personally never been in a group where any toxicity occurred as a result of a DPS meter. I've certainly been in enough fractal groups that disbanded or had people drop out over poor performance, but that had nothing to do with DPS meters. Some people are just looking for a smooth run, and when they don't get what they want they act out. You don't need a DPS meter to act like a tool.

[Illconceived Was Na.9781]

> @"Ashen.2907" said:

> > @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

> > > @"Laila Lightness.8742" said:

> > > Report so maybe anet banns use of it if enough

> >

> > You can report the behavior of people and the account owners will get punished, if appropriate. But the use of the DPS meter itself is neutral.

>

> True, but anet has shown a willingness to act against the object if its users are sufficiently toxic to impact the game.

 

They have? Can you give an example in which ANet banned the use of a tool because "too many" of the people who used it were jerks?

 

Regardless, as a practical matter, I think it's moot: it doesn't change what we as players ought to do:

* If people behave badly enough, report them.

* ANet will decide whether it's sufficiently onerous to act.

* And sure, if there are a sufficient number of circumstances in which they have acted, they'll take a look at what they can do to calm things down.

[dolcolax.1268]

> @"Samnang.1879" said:

> improve your dps. why r some ppl content with being mediocre?

> it's not toxic, for me, i always aim to improve myself and learn all the classes... why can't others do the same.

 

the people youre calling mediocre might actually be successful irl. i mean its a game not an achievement ladder. its not like you can put in a resume:

 

*top dps raid/fractals

*can play all classes

*1 million AP

*unlocked all skins

[Ashen.2907]

> @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

> > @"Ashen.2907" said:

> > > @"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:

> > > > @"Laila Lightness.8742" said:

> > > > Report so maybe anet banns use of it if enough

> > >

> > > You can report the behavior of people and the account owners will get punished, if appropriate. But the use of the DPS meter itself is neutral.

> >

> > True, but anet has shown a willingness to act against the object if its users are sufficiently toxic to impact the game.

>

> They have? Can you give an example in which ANet banned the use of a tool because "too many" of the people who used it were jerks?

>

> Regardless, as a practical matter, I think it's moot: it doesn't change what we as players ought to do:

> * If people behave badly enough, report them.

> * ANet will decide whether it's sufficiently onerous to act.

> * And sure, if there are a sufficient number of circumstances in which they have acted, they'll take a look at what they can do to calm things down.

 

To be clear, I used the word object when subject might have been more appropriate.

 

The instance that came to mind was the Queensdale champion farm. Toxicity and the potential negative impression for newer players led to action beyomd just that against specific abusive players.

 

Dont get me wrong, I am not speaking for or against potential action, just believe that anet is willing to take action if they believe that something is too much of a focus for contention.

[Illconceived Was Na.9781]

> @"Ashen.2907" said:

> To be clear, I used the word object when subject might have been more appropriate.

>

> The instance that came to mind was the Queensdale champion farm. Toxicity and the potential negative impression for newer players led to action beyomd just that against specific abusive players.

Sure, but you do see how that's wildly different from the impact of a DPS meter?

 

The QD champ farm literally created competing rewards for different sorts of players: those who wanted the easy champ bags and those who wanted a starter zone, with a few challenging events.

 

In contrast, DPS meters don't create the tension between "meta or bust" and "why can't I run whatever" players; it only exposes the different styles more quickly. Arguably, it actually makes it easier for the two groups to avoid each other (although, of course, people being people, some of us like to join a group and impose our style on everyone already in it, ignoring the opportunity to find a more-fitting option for themselves).

 

> Dont get me wrong, I am not speaking for or against potential action, just believe that anet is willing to take action if they believe that something is too much of a focus for contention.

Gotcha. I agree that they do sometimes act to reduce "contention" as you put it.

[TheOrlyFactor.8341]

Reporting doesn't work. Might as well save yourself a few extra keystrokes and just block them, then either make your own group or join a like-minded guild.

[Linken.6345]

> @"Blaeys.3102" said:

> > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > > @"Blaeys.3102" said:

> > > > @"Sakiko.5432" said:

> > > > Well, the best way to fight that is creating your own LFG and adding something like "chill" or "all welcome". Peeps like that usually don't come in that kind of LF

> > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > > > ArcDPS is a greenlit DPS meter, you cannot report people for using it. You automatically agree to it's usage when joining a group or squad.

> > >

> > > But you can report someone when they use it to be toxic or hateful to another player.

> > People can be toxic as much as they want in their own group. Dont like it? leave group

>

> Joining a group doesn't suspend the game's terms of service (which state very clearly "you may not defraud, harass, threaten, embarrass or cause distress and/or unwanted attention to other players") nor provide an excuse for being a jerk in a party. People can and should report people choosing to use these meters as a way to shame or harrass other players.

>

> If someone cannot behave like a rational person within the confines of the very clear TOS, then they're probably playing the wrong kind of game.

 

If asking a player why is your dps crap, by that I mean 5k when it should be atleast 15 if the top is 28-32 thats 50% of whats optimal.

if people see that as harrasment and embaressment then they need to grow a thicker skin.

[Trae.2384]

> @"dolcolax.1268" said:

> > @"Samnang.1879" said:

> > improve your dps. why r some ppl content with being mediocre?

> > it's not toxic, for me, i always aim to improve myself and learn all the classes... why can't others do the same.

>

> the people youre calling mediocre might actually be successful irl. i mean its a game not an achievement ladder. its not like you can put in a resume:

>

> *top dps raid/fractals

> *can play all classes

> *1 million AP

> *unlocked all skins

 

LOLOZ right. Try this line on a first date with your ultimate dream girl, "well sweety I know Im fat, ugly, broke, unemployed and still living at home at 45, but let me tell you baby, I can nail my weaver rotation and put everyone to shame on the dps meter, as well as hit the benchmarks on all classes with one arm tied behind my back"

[Blaeys.3102]

> @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > @"Blaeys.3102" said:

> > > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > > > @"Blaeys.3102" said:

> > > > > @"Sakiko.5432" said:

> > > > > Well, the best way to fight that is creating your own LFG and adding something like "chill" or "all welcome". Peeps like that usually don't come in that kind of LF

> > > > > @"Malediktus.9250" said:

> > > > > ArcDPS is a greenlit DPS meter, you cannot report people for using it. You automatically agree to it's usage when joining a group or squad.

> > > >

> > > > But you can report someone when they use it to be toxic or hateful to another player.

> > > People can be toxic as much as they want in their own group. Dont like it? leave group

> >

> > Joining a group doesn't suspend the game's terms of service (which state very clearly "you may not defraud, harass, threaten, embarrass or cause distress and/or unwanted attention to other players") nor provide an excuse for being a jerk in a party. People can and should report people choosing to use these meters as a way to shame or harrass other players.

> >

> > If someone cannot behave like a rational person within the confines of the very clear TOS, then they're probably playing the wrong kind of game.

> Try to report them. Nothing will happen. Those legal documents are always stricter than reality so they have all options when they feel like it.

>

> 90%+ of the games population would be permanently banned by now if Anet would take everything in the legal documents literally and apply it with a zero tolerance policy.

 

It's not about zero tolerance. It is about ongoing behavior. When people step over the civility line, it is worth reporting just so Anet can keep track of those individuals that continually make the game a more toxic place. If it happens enough with the same people, I feel confident action would be taken. Anet is historically pretty good at quashing long term toxic behavior.

 

Keep in mind I am not debating whether or not meters should be allowed - just discussing the players options when someone choses to use them to justify behavior that is literally against the game's terms of service.

[Illconceived Was Na.9781]

> @"Trae.2384" said:

> Try this line on a first date with your ultimate dream girl, "well sweety I know Im fat, ugly, broke, unemployed and still living at home at 45, but let me tell you baby, I can nail my weaver rotation and put everyone to shame on the dps meter, as well as hit the benchmarks on all classes with one arm tied behind my back"

 

To be fair, the ultimate dream girl would be impressed by that (an actual romantic partner? right, not so much). We know of [at least one case in which someone's significant other left because the player was bad at PvP](https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/gf-left-me-coz-of-ladderboard).

[Pimpology.6234]

> @"AliamRationem.5172" said:

> > @"Pimpology.6234" said:

> > Ingame dps meters are clearly now a toxic/ negative part of this game that wasn't present pre raids. :( wrong direction the game is going imo.

> > The game was suppose to stand out and be different from the rest, sadly its just conforming to the norms.

>

> Are you sure? I mean, I've personally never been in a group where any toxicity occurred as a result of a DPS meter. I've certainly been in enough fractal groups that disbanded or had people drop out over poor performance, but that had nothing to do with DPS meters. Some people are just looking for a smooth run, and when they don't get what they want they act out. You don't need a DPS meter to act like a tool.

 

Yes, post raids the toxicity level in groups has gone up quite a bit, because of dps meters and Fractals is one of the main places you see it outside of raids. I've been in several groups that i've listed where players whine about "you're dps sucks" because their meters show them something that's illegal and breaks TOS in the first place. It's a red flag and that person will probably ruin the cohesiveness of your run.

[TheOrlyFactor.8341]

> @"Blaeys.3102" said:

>Anet is historically pretty good at quashing long term toxic behavior.

 


 

[Lahemic.6097]

> @"pepebart.5187" said:

> I met someone in a fractal party that was going near toxic on me because he was monitoring my dps it wasn’t enough at his taste. This is the first time I see this since I’m returning back to the game after 2 - 3 years of stop (I’m a veteran player)

>

> What can I do against that?

>

> It remind me the early meta people of cof p1 full zerk under 1 min epidemic

>

 

I am not really against the use of DPS meters in MMO games to help people improve their DPS output or practice, but players jumping down the throat of another over bad DPS is in poor taste IMHO.

 

Jerks will be jerks, the best way to handle them is to /ignore them and move on.

 

[Menadena.7482]

> @"pepebart.5187" said:

> I met someone in a fractal party that was going near toxic on me because he was monitoring my dps it wasn’t enough at his taste. This is the first time I see this since I’m returning back to the game after 2 - 3 years of stop (I’m a veteran player)

>

> What can I do against that?

>

> It remind me the early meta people of cof p1 full zerk under 1 min epidemic

>

 

You can monitor your own dps, usually by using arcdps. Monitoring other people is a potential grey area (ie, they can consent). Monitoring people who did not consent is a quick route to getting your kitten reported.

[Menadena.7482]

> @"dolcolax.1268" said:

> > @"Samnang.1879" said:

> > improve your dps. why r some ppl content with being mediocre?

> > it's not toxic, for me, i always aim to improve myself and learn all the classes... why can't others do the same.

>

> the people youre calling mediocre might actually be successful irl. i mean its a game not an achievement ladder. its not like you can put in a resume:

>

> *top dps raid/fractals

> *can play all classes

> *1 million AP

> *unlocked all skins

 

Now I am hoping some of these toxic types brag about their game skills when they get performance reviews at work. :-)

 

[Nightlark.4029]

> @"dolcolax.1268" said:

> > @"Samnang.1879" said:

> > improve your dps. why r some ppl content with being mediocre?

> > it's not toxic, for me, i always aim to improve myself and learn all the classes... why can't others do the same.

>

> the people youre calling mediocre might actually be successful irl. i mean its a game not an achievement ladder. its not like you can put in a resume:

>

> *top dps raid/fractals

> *can play all classes

> *1 million AP

> *unlocked all skins

 

Well... you could put those on your resume. Probably wouldn't help much unless you're applying for some form of competitive gaming team. Starting and leading a guild could be resume/interview material if presented in the right way; that experience might have come up in the interview I had for my current job.

[AliamRationem.5172]

> @"dolcolax.1268" said:

> > @"Samnang.1879" said:

> > improve your dps. why r some ppl content with being mediocre?

> > it's not toxic, for me, i always aim to improve myself and learn all the classes... why can't others do the same.

>

> the people youre calling mediocre might actually be successful irl. i mean its a game not an achievement ladder. its not like you can put in a resume:

>

> *top dps raid/fractals

> *can play all classes

> *1 million AP

> *unlocked all skins

 

On the other hand, it's not like you can keep your spot in a raid by telling everyone you own your own business. Congrats, bud! We're still kicking you for causing us to fail that enrage timer. Now go do some work. We're busy playing games here!

[AliamRationem.5172]

> @"Menadena.7482" said:

> > @"pepebart.5187" said:

> > I met someone in a fractal party that was going near toxic on me because he was monitoring my dps it wasn’t enough at his taste. This is the first time I see this since I’m returning back to the game after 2 - 3 years of stop (I’m a veteran player)

> >

> > What can I do against that?

> >

> > It remind me the early meta people of cof p1 full zerk under 1 min epidemic

> >

>

> You can monitor your own dps, usually by using arcdps. Monitoring other people is a potential grey area (ie, they can consent). Monitoring people who did not consent is a quick route to getting your kitten reported.

 

False. If you are in a group with a player using arcdps, it will report your combat data. And as arcdps has been green-lighted by ANet staff, there is nothing to report. Toxic behavior is another matter.

[Samnang.1879]

> @"dolcolax.1268" said:

> > @"Samnang.1879" said:

> > improve your dps. why r some ppl content with being mediocre?

> > it's not toxic, for me, i always aim to improve myself and learn all the classes... why can't others do the same.

>

> the people youre calling mediocre might actually be successful irl. i mean its a game not an achievement ladder. its not like you can put in a resume:

>

> *top dps raid/fractals

> *can play all classes

> *1 million AP

> *unlocked all skins

 

Nobody expects you to be top dps or have 35k AP... those are going into no-lifer's territory. But ppl expect dps classes to do ... dps. There are several times when I fractal and a supposed "dps" has the dps of a healing druid... now I never kick those ppl cuz i know my guild mates and I can carry 1 or 2 ppl through fractals. But in other groups, they might feel this is unsatisfactory because they want to spend 30 mins on a frac not 1 hour... which is completely reasonable and rational... there's nothing toxic about that.

 

The OP never mention what his dps was so it's impossible to say if the group that was "toxic" to him was reasonable or not. But people rarely kick/insult others if they don't have extremely low dps (aka a healing druid's dps)...

 

also on a side note, successful people wouldn't be playing this game in the first place... just ask Mike O'Brien, does he even play GW2 in his spare time? LOLOL.

[Ardenwolfe.8590]

Sadly, you encountered an elitist. It sometimes happens when you raid or play certain game content. Best advice I can give you is not to play with that person again, forget about him, and move on.

 

Sorry you encountered this kind of person though. It's actually not typical with this community. At least . . . not from my experience.

[Ze Dos Cavalos.6132]

> @"dolcolax.1268" said:

> > @"Samnang.1879" said:

> > improve your dps. why r some ppl content with being mediocre?

> > it's not toxic, for me, i always aim to improve myself and learn all the classes... why can't others do the same.

>

> the people youre calling mediocre might actually be successful irl. i mean its a game not an achievement ladder. its not like you can put in a resume:

>

> *top dps raid/fractals

> *can play all classes

> *1 million AP

> *unlocked all skins

 

So if a player is a famous doctor or some genius scientist he will have the right to be carried by other players in this game?

Will be like: Hey I made a big scientific discovery in real life so now carry my 2k dps weaver in fractals and raids.

 

What has real life to do with anything in the game? You can be the most accomplished person in the world, if you join a high end content party/squad and don't do your part you will get kicked or insulted.