Khisanth.2948 Posted December 25, 2018 Share Posted December 25, 2018 > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > Yes, let's complain about group content when literally 95% of the game is casual and solo friendly. > > As to why team content gets rewarded better? Easy, if rewards were higher in solo content, the market would be flooded with stuff and the economy would go haywire. You might believe you are the be-all end-all of players but I guarantee you, there is many players who will be even better. > Often times when I see someone bragging or complaining about their team from someone on the opposing team it is often not the best player on that team. Pretty rare to see that from the actual person that was carrying their team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted December 25, 2018 Author Share Posted December 25, 2018 > @"Khisanth.2948" said: > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > Yes, let's complain about group content when literally 95% of the game is casual and solo friendly. > > > > As to why team content gets rewarded better? Easy, if rewards were higher in solo content, the market would be flooded with stuff and the economy would go haywire. You might believe you are the be-all end-all of players but I guarantee you, there is many players who will be even better. > > > > Often times when I see someone bragging or complaining about their team from someone on the opposing team it is often not the best player on that team. > > Pretty rare to see that from the actual person that was carrying their team. > > I've had this happen too, where I call out players for being bad and they respond with, yah you probably suck ect ect. Then I proceed to carry the team and then everyone shuts up and I think its funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashen.2907 Posted December 25, 2018 Share Posted December 25, 2018 > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > Yes, let's complain about group content when literally 95% of the game is casual and solo friendly. > > > > > > > > As to why team content gets rewarded better? Easy, if rewards were higher in solo content, the market would be flooded with stuff and the economy would go haywire. You might believe you are the be-all end-all of players but I guarantee you, there is many players who will be even better. > > > > > > > > That and the fact that any time actually slightly challenging solo content gets added the forums light up like a Christmas tree during holiday season (there, even gave you a holiday reference). > > > > > > They need to add in permanent content that is extremely difficult and rewarding and does not require the help of others. Also others cannot help. Gw2 has catered to every crowd except this one. > > > > I find soloing fractals to be very challenging. > > Yah but very unrewarding. I have mixed feelings on this. Sure it puts less gold in my wallet than other content for the time invested, but the feeling of accomplishment at the end is pretty rewarding to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyanchiv.2583 Posted December 25, 2018 Share Posted December 25, 2018 > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > Yes, let's complain about group content when literally 95% of the game is casual and solo friendly. > > > > > > > > > > As to why team content gets rewarded better? Easy, if rewards were higher in solo content, the market would be flooded with stuff and the economy would go haywire. You might believe you are the be-all end-all of players but I guarantee you, there is many players who will be even better. > > > > > > > > > > That and the fact that any time actually slightly challenging solo content gets added the forums light up like a Christmas tree during holiday season (there, even gave you a holiday reference). > > > > > > > > They need to add in permanent content that is extremely difficult and rewarding and does not require the help of others. Also others cannot help. Gw2 has catered to every crowd except this one. > > > > > > I find soloing fractals to be very challenging. > > > > Yah but very unrewarding. > > I have mixed feelings on this. Sure it puts less gold in my wallet than other content for the time invested, but the feeling of accomplishment at the end is pretty rewarding to me. That's one of the more positive messages I've seen. We play games to have fun. For some people that means not getting as much gold, but it doesn't mean the experience was less rewarding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DragonSlayer.1087 Posted December 25, 2018 Share Posted December 25, 2018 > @"borgs.6103" said: > Because it's an MMORPG. dead.... XD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted December 25, 2018 Author Share Posted December 25, 2018 > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > Yes, let's complain about group content when literally 95% of the game is casual and solo friendly. > > > > > > > > > > As to why team content gets rewarded better? Easy, if rewards were higher in solo content, the market would be flooded with stuff and the economy would go haywire. You might believe you are the be-all end-all of players but I guarantee you, there is many players who will be even better. > > > > > > > > > > That and the fact that any time actually slightly challenging solo content gets added the forums light up like a Christmas tree during holiday season (there, even gave you a holiday reference). > > > > > > > > They need to add in permanent content that is extremely difficult and rewarding and does not require the help of others. Also others cannot help. Gw2 has catered to every crowd except this one. > > > > > > I find soloing fractals to be very challenging. > > > > Yah but very unrewarding. > > I have mixed feelings on this. Sure it puts less gold in my wallet than other content for the time invested, but the feeling of accomplishment at the end is pretty rewarding to me. Would be nice if skill was rewarded properly like it is in every other game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted December 25, 2018 Author Share Posted December 25, 2018 > @"DragonSlayer.1087" said: > > @"borgs.6103" said: > > Because it's an MMORPG. > > dead.... XD > Guess I should of known that mmos offer 0 single player content or challenges or rewards lol. They require almost no skill except for working well with others, wow amazing, I guess it really is press 1 to win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kal Spiro.9745 Posted December 25, 2018 Share Posted December 25, 2018 > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > Yes, let's complain about group content when literally 95% of the game is casual and solo friendly. > > > > As to why team content gets rewarded better? Easy, if rewards were higher in solo content, the market would be flooded with stuff and the economy would go haywire. You might believe you are the be-all end-all of players but I guarantee you, there is many players who will be even better. > > > > That and the fact that any time actually slightly challenging solo content gets added the forums light up like a Christmas tree during holiday season (there, even gave you a holiday reference). > > They need to add in permanent content that is extremely difficult and rewarding and does not require the help of others. Also others cannot help. Gw2 has catered to every crowd except this one. How would you gauge the skill level necessary? What is skill? Is it content requires a very specific build to play? That's not very inclusive. If you make it available to every class and build, suddenly certain classes and builds will have a much easier time of it and will say it doesn't take any skill. The only way to make high skill solo content is to remove the classes entirely. Thus we have jumping puzzles, adventures, and roller beetle racing. Things that require skill to get the most out of, but are designed for solo content. Unfortunately you're not going to get any legendaries out of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airdive.2613 Posted December 25, 2018 Share Posted December 25, 2018 > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > @"Ashen.2907" said: > > > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > Yes, let's complain about group content when literally 95% of the game is casual and solo friendly. > > > > > > > > > > > > As to why team content gets rewarded better? Easy, if rewards were higher in solo content, the market would be flooded with stuff and the economy would go haywire. You might believe you are the be-all end-all of players but I guarantee you, there is many players who will be even better. > > > > > > > > > > > > That and the fact that any time actually slightly challenging solo content gets added the forums light up like a Christmas tree during holiday season (there, even gave you a holiday reference). > > > > > > > > > > They need to add in permanent content that is extremely difficult and rewarding and does not require the help of others. Also others cannot help. Gw2 has catered to every crowd except this one. > > > > > > > > I find soloing fractals to be very challenging. > > > > > > Yah but very unrewarding. > > > > I have mixed feelings on this. Sure it puts less gold in my wallet than other content for the time invested, but the feeling of accomplishment at the end is pretty rewarding to me. > > Would be nice if skill was rewarded properly like it is in every other game. It is rewarded properly: you get exactly the same reward you would have got otherwise and you don't have to spend your energy on silly things like teamwork. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dante.1763 Posted December 25, 2018 Share Posted December 25, 2018 > @"Kal Spiro.9745" said: > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > Yes, let's complain about group content when literally 95% of the game is casual and solo friendly. > > > > > > As to why team content gets rewarded better? Easy, if rewards were higher in solo content, the market would be flooded with stuff and the economy would go haywire. You might believe you are the be-all end-all of players but I guarantee you, there is many players who will be even better. > > > > > > That and the fact that any time actually slightly challenging solo content gets added the forums light up like a Christmas tree during holiday season (there, even gave you a holiday reference). > > > > They need to add in permanent content that is extremely difficult and rewarding and does not require the help of others. Also others cannot help. Gw2 has catered to every crowd except this one. > > How would you gauge the skill level necessary? What is skill? Is it content requires a very specific build to play? That's not very inclusive. If you make it available to every class and build, suddenly certain classes and builds will have a much easier time of it and will say it doesn't take any skill. The only way to make high skill solo content is to remove the classes entirely. Thus we have jumping puzzles, adventures, and roller beetle racing. Things that require skill to get the most out of, but are designed for solo content. Unfortunately you're not going to get any legendaries out of it. To be honest the only thing theyve done thats been challenging solo content(outside of doing dungeons/fractals etc by oneself) is the Queens Pavilion(Arenas). Ive beaten all the bosses personally, but ive never been able to get my ele through them for instance. But i agree with you on the rest Kal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lothefallen.7081 Posted December 25, 2018 Share Posted December 25, 2018 > @"sorudo.9054" said: > dungeons = teamplay > raids = teamplay > WvW = teamplay > fractures = teamplay > PvP = teamplay > > where is this 99.9% solo play ppl talk about? Dungeons are defunct content as in they no longer develop the content. The only reason people go back to play them is to farm tokens, rares, and items to make gifts for legendary weapons. Raids are a proportionally small community when compared to the game at large. I'd wager to say that probably less than 10% of the entire game's population has been inside of a raid and more than likely less than half of that population clears raids weekly. WvW is more zerg-play than a honed team-play environment. And even with that said, many players choose to roam. In this context, WvW can be considered a flexible solo or team play environment. Fractals are solid group content. They challenge the player in terms of combat proficiency, puzzle solving, and cooperation. Overall, this design fits really well within GW2. And contrary to OP's opinion, I think there are plenty of opportunities for a player's individual skill to shine through in this content just the same as their ability to work as a team. GW2 fundamentally blurs the lines of individual and team cooperation by design. Again, I would wager to say that Fractals does not represent a majority of content designed in this game. The majority of content in this game is solo-oriented personal story, collections, achievements, map completion, leveling, dynamic events that can mostly be solo'd or don't require much coordination between peers (some do, but most dont.) PvP is also very reliant on cooperation, but also each person excelling at individual tasks at the same time . For example, if a player follows another player around aimlessly in PvP instead of responding acutely to the team's needs by performing individualized tasks, or if a thief doesn't work to decap points while the other team's thief does, that represents not only an individual failure, but a team failure as well. So, again, this content isn't exclusively team-oriented in design either. And with all that said, the PvP, raid, WvW, and dungeon player populations fluctuate heavily, but still, they're all infinitesimally smaller than the community of players that focus personal story, achievements, world bosses, new LS maps, and never step foot in any of the above content. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warlord.9082 Posted December 26, 2018 Share Posted December 26, 2018 Because skill is not relevant in GW2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted December 26, 2018 Author Share Posted December 26, 2018 > @"Kal Spiro.9745" said: > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > Yes, let's complain about group content when literally 95% of the game is casual and solo friendly. > > > > > > As to why team content gets rewarded better? Easy, if rewards were higher in solo content, the market would be flooded with stuff and the economy would go haywire. You might believe you are the be-all end-all of players but I guarantee you, there is many players who will be even better. > > > > > > That and the fact that any time actually slightly challenging solo content gets added the forums light up like a Christmas tree during holiday season (there, even gave you a holiday reference). > > > > They need to add in permanent content that is extremely difficult and rewarding and does not require the help of others. Also others cannot help. Gw2 has catered to every crowd except this one. > > How would you gauge the skill level necessary? What is skill? Is it content requires a very specific build to play? That's not very inclusive. If you make it available to every class and build, suddenly certain classes and builds will have a much easier time of it and will say it doesn't take any skill. The only way to make high skill solo content is to remove the classes entirely. Thus we have jumping puzzles, adventures, and roller beetle racing. Things that require skill to get the most out of, but are designed for solo content. Unfortunately you're not going to get any legendaries out of it. Jumping puzzles are an example of individual skill. Sadly there arent many of them, the rewards offered to them are non existant. Most can be completed with help from others, everyone complains they are too hard when they make more of them and there are no other alternatives to solo content in gw2 other then these. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted December 26, 2018 Author Share Posted December 26, 2018 > @"Fallesafe.5932" said: > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > Why is teamwork rewarded over personal skill in this game so much. Everything seems to revolve around teamwork, and its rewarded as such. > > For two reasons: > > 1) 99.999% of players are **not** that insanely skilled individual. They actually vaguely resent that individual... and would scream bloody murder if he was given access to any rewards they didn't also have super-easy access to. > > 2) Anet plays to (and markets to) these sentiments **heavily**... The resentful, zero-skill bozo finds a home in this MMO that he couldn't find in any other. Thats pretty sad and I agree with you, I gravitate towards games like bloodborne which I have plantinumed as well as hollow knight which I have just recently 100%. Its sad this game doesn't have solo content on par with the type of challenge and skill that is required to complete these types of games. If the player base doesn't improve and is challenged and properly rewarded, then where is the incentive to play, get better and improve oneself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VAHNeunzehnsechundsiebzig. Posted December 26, 2018 Share Posted December 26, 2018 you can solo in wvw a lot. Duels, roaming, camp flipping, tower flipping... can all be done solo. Story/LW solo. The only must do as group content is fractals and raids. And people really get their panties in a knot about that? Why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airdive.2613 Posted December 26, 2018 Share Posted December 26, 2018 > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > Jumping puzzles are an example of individual skill. Honestly, that's not skill, that's memorization. Do it once, and you can do it anytime. Adventures are a better measure of "skill". A bit more skill is involved in soloing champions/legendary bosses, but ultimately it's a matter of finding a build capable of sustaining indefinitely and enduring tens of minutes of perfect skill rotation, which again can be memorized. I think the definition of skill as the "high tolerance for memorizing game mechanics for the sake of it" is getting old by now. Humans are not machines, and video games are not work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maddoctor.2738 Posted December 26, 2018 Share Posted December 26, 2018 > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > Would be nice if individual player skill was measured, mattered and was rewarded accordingly, like teamwork is. How do you measure "skill"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumpin Lumpix.6108 Posted December 26, 2018 Author Share Posted December 26, 2018 > @"maddoctor.2738" said: > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > Would be nice if individual player skill was measured, mattered and was rewarded accordingly, like teamwork is. > > How do you measure "skill"? Throw random elements at players that require precise execution and timing and quick reaction time in succession. Make the sequence lengthy and then see who survives it or gets the furthest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rasimir.6239 Posted December 26, 2018 Share Posted December 26, 2018 > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > @"maddoctor.2738" said: > > > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > > > Would be nice if individual player skill was measured, mattered and was rewarded accordingly, like teamwork is. > > > > How do you measure "skill"? > > Throw random elements at players that require precise execution and timing and quick reaction time in succession. Make the sequence lengthy and then see who survives it or gets the furthest. That's not measuring skill, that's training players to focus entirely on the things that get them points, to the detriment of general cooperative gameplay. Personally I believe we have enough players already who only look at what gives them the greatest feeling of being "the best", which is usually to the detriment of those playing alongside them. The real "skill" relevant in a multiplayer game is that which brings the greatest profit to all players playing together, not just to an individual at the cost of everyone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sorudo.9054 Posted December 26, 2018 Share Posted December 26, 2018 > @"lothefallen.7081" said: > > @"sorudo.9054" said: > > dungeons = teamplay > > raids = teamplay > > WvW = teamplay > > fractures = teamplay > > PvP = teamplay > > > > where is this 99.9% solo play ppl talk about? > > Dungeons are defunct content as in they no longer develop the content. The only reason people go back to play them is to farm tokens, rares, and items to make gifts for legendary weapons. > > Raids are a proportionally small community when compared to the game at large. I'd wager to say that probably less than 10% of the entire game's population has been inside of a raid and more than likely less than half of that population clears raids weekly. > > WvW is more zerg-play than a honed team-play environment. And even with that said, many players choose to roam. In this context, WvW can be considered a flexible solo or team play environment. > > Fractals are solid group content. They challenge the player in terms of combat proficiency, puzzle solving, and cooperation. Overall, this design fits really well within GW2. And contrary to OP's opinion, I think there are plenty of opportunities for a player's individual skill to shine through in this content just the same as their ability to work as a team. GW2 fundamentally blurs the lines of individual and team cooperation by design. > > Again, I would wager to say that Fractals does not represent a majority of content designed in this game. The majority of content in this game is solo-oriented personal story, collections, achievements, map completion, leveling, dynamic events that can mostly be solo'd or don't require much coordination between peers (some do, but most dont.) > > PvP is also very reliant on cooperation, but also each person excelling at individual tasks at the same time . For example, if a player follows another player around aimlessly in PvP instead of responding acutely to the team's needs by performing individualized tasks, or if a thief doesn't work to decap points while the other team's thief does, that represents not only an individual failure, but a team failure as well. So, again, this content isn't exclusively team-oriented in design either. > > And with all that said, the PvP, raid, WvW, and dungeon player populations fluctuate heavily, but still, they're all infinitesimally smaller than the community of players that focus personal story, achievements, world bosses, new LS maps, and never step foot in any of the above content. the popularity is not the point here, it's where everything go's ever had anything legendary while playing solely open world, some nice new weapon skins, a chair for instance, got anything remotely like that from the open world? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rasimir.6239 Posted December 26, 2018 Share Posted December 26, 2018 > @"sorudo.9054" said: > ever had anything legendary while playing solely open world, some nice new weapon skins, a chair for instance, got anything remotely like that from the open world? You mean to tell me you got your legendary weapons without map completion? Or the chair from the original chair collection without visiting any of the cities and hunting for all the chairs? Or ambrite weapons without playing in Dry Top? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrustyBot.3564 Posted December 26, 2018 Share Posted December 26, 2018 > @"Rasimir.6239" said: > > @"sorudo.9054" said: > > ever had anything legendary while playing solely open world, some nice new weapon skins, a chair for instance, got anything remotely like that from the open world? > You mean to tell me you got your legendary weapons without map completion? Or the chair from the original chair collection without visiting any of the cities and hunting for all the chairs? Or ambrite weapons without playing in Dry Top? Aurora, Requiem, Wayfarer's Henge, list goes on and on. Not that I think there's any problem with Living/Open World Content getting most of the developer attention, just that it's really hard to argue that it _isn't_ getting most of the attention over stuff like raids/sPvP/WvW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sorudo.9054 Posted December 26, 2018 Share Posted December 26, 2018 > @"Rasimir.6239" said: > > @"sorudo.9054" said: > > ever had anything legendary while playing solely open world, some nice new weapon skins, a chair for instance, got anything remotely like that from the open world? > You mean to tell me you got your legendary weapons without map completion? Or the chair from the original chair collection without visiting any of the cities and hunting for all the chairs? Or ambrite weapons without playing in Dry Top? so you got the dhuum chair trough the open world? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyninja.2954 Posted December 26, 2018 Share Posted December 26, 2018 > @"sorudo.9054" said: > > @"Rasimir.6239" said: > > > @"sorudo.9054" said: > > > ever had anything legendary while playing solely open world, some nice new weapon skins, a chair for instance, got anything remotely like that from the open world? > > You mean to tell me you got your legendary weapons without map completion? Or the chair from the original chair collection without visiting any of the cities and hunting for all the chairs? Or ambrite weapons without playing in Dry Top? > > so you got the dhuum chair trough the open world? Is this about where the developer resources go to or about raid rewards being available to non raiders? Because those are 2 very different issues. Want me to start listing the things which require open world and living world completion or play and are not available via raids? Living World Season 3 and all the skins for backpacks alone as well as new armors with PoF would beat raid rewards by miles. That's not even getting into actual content to get played or the recent Living World episodes which introduced multiple new armor sets. Just stop. EDIT: and as far as Dhuums chair, goes for 400 gold on the TP. A bit of open world farm and you can get even that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Illconceived Was Na.9781 Posted December 26, 2018 Share Posted December 26, 2018 > @"Jumpin Lumpix.6108" said: > Throw random elements at players that require precise execution and timing and quick reaction time in succession. Make the sequence lengthy and then see who survives it or gets the furthest. That's just one kind of talent. And it's well rewarded in other sorts of games. Teamwork is another type of skill. "Make the sequence lengthy and see who survives" sounds like the dullest sort of platform gaming experience. If that's what I wanted, I'd, you know, play platform games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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