Balsa.3951 Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 > @"gebrechen.5643" said: > > @"Balsa.3951" said: > > i play guard and stopped joining squads in wvw no need for that anyway to many wanna be commanders try to force ur build to what they "read" somewhere is right. > > > > than the WVWer wondering why nobody want join the wvw mode and with less ppl doin so anet has less motivation to improve wvw... > > > > win win i guess > > Wait, what I write now may break your heart, but.. that's how it works. Builds are optimized for group play. It's the same as in PvE raids. You try to maximize the support/damage/healing your class can bring. It's a numbers game and numbers the important factor here. > It's not something "someone writes somewhere" but a mathematical calculation. Your build may be fine, but it's not best at what will be expected from you. > > In the end the rule is very easy: Only the commander decides who joins his squad. If you have problem with this just make your own squad and do your stuff. bla bla we all know wvw is the bigger number win u can fantazise as much as u want how ur build carried the full zerg but in the end its 90% spam 1111111111 speedbuff we all know that ps thanks for ur advice shows u didnt even read what i wrote so GG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanAlcedo.3281 Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 > @"Balsa.3951" said: > > @"gebrechen.5643" said: > > > @"Balsa.3951" said: > > > i play guard and stopped joining squads in wvw no need for that anyway to many wanna be commanders try to force ur build to what they "read" somewhere is right. > > > > > > than the WVWer wondering why nobody want join the wvw mode and with less ppl doin so anet has less motivation to improve wvw... > > > > > > win win i guess > > > > Wait, what I write now may break your heart, but.. that's how it works. Builds are optimized for group play. It's the same as in PvE raids. You try to maximize the support/damage/healing your class can bring. It's a numbers game and numbers the important factor here. > > It's not something "someone writes somewhere" but a mathematical calculation. Your build may be fine, but it's not best at what will be expected from you. > > > > In the end the rule is very easy: Only the commander decides who joins his squad. If you have problem with this just make your own squad and do your stuff. > > bla bla we all know wvw is the bigger number win u can fantazise as much as u want how ur build carried the full zerg but in the end its 90% spam 1111111111 speedbuff > > we all know that > > ps thanks for ur advice shows u didnt even read what i wrote so GG You know how bad the auto attacks of the meta builds are? Weaver staff: Projectile = useless Rev Hammer: Projectile = useless Firebrand Staff: Joke dmg Scourge Staff: Super slow Projectile You literally do everything but 111. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MUDse.7623 Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 > @"DanAlcedo.3281" said: > You literally do everything but 111. ok, i will try that for a change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortcake.8659 Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 just play a scrapper with a medkit. You can still 11111111111111 all day, shooting chemicals into people's eyes. it's helping! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gebrechen.5643 Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 > You know how bad the auto attacks of the meta builds are? > > Weaver staff: Projectile = useless > Rev Hammer: Projectile = useless > Firebrand Staff: Joke dmg > Scourge Staff: Super slow Projectile > > You literally do everything but 111. > How could he. He refuses to play an optimized meta build, because he thinks his one is better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kash.9213 Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 > @"dynomite.5834" said: > As a ranger myself, I don't join squads and quite honestly don't miss it - why join? I listen in discord and keep up. Getting the boons/heals doesn't really apply because I'm not frontline pushing with the classes that can give boons or healing so it doesn't really add much. My feelings aren't hurt to not be in the squad (plus I can park and get a drink/food whenever I want) **and not get told "stay on tag!"** That's the main reason I don't join squad so I'm not a blue dot they'll yell at for squirreling. I can get in to revive sniped tags and put up Snipers Cover and open up some opportunities with pulls and interrupts that I'll hope will be capitalized on, which most teams on our server are pretty quick to jump on something if they see it going down. I can sync up pulling some agro at the right time to work with a squads drive or to dismantle part of the other squads drive, but I need to be free of the squads core. I pack my own quickness and rip my own boon stacks and all that for flak though and the floaters who are usually on around my log in time don't need a lot of chatter to get a quick pick up/dropout group going or to just set up a play real quick so I don't feel lacking in mitigation usually. There are best in slot classes or builds to keep squad compositions rolling, but they still need floaters off or around tag who can think quick on their own if the other servers aren't duds that week, if there's no one 'mopping' up downs and cutting people off from getting back to their buffs or playing interception for support and everything then the other two servers recovery will snowball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gebrechen.5643 Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 > @"Balsa.3951" said: > > > i play guard and stopped joining squads in wvw no need for that anyway to many wanna be commanders try to force ur build to what they "read" somewhere is right. > > > > > > than the WVWer wondering why nobody want join the wvw mode and with less ppl doin so anet has less motivation to improve wvw... > > > > > > win win i guess > > ps thanks for ur advice shows u didnt even read what i wrote so GG It's that what you wrote. No questions left. 1) If you are not in the squad, you are on #3 to receive and give boons from or to the squad even if you are running with the squad (https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Boon#Boon_distribution_priority) 2) the commander or lieutnant decides who is in squad and who isn't. Similar to "my house, my rules". 3) there is a pretty good meta with builds that work and it's mostly accepted by the majority of the community and the guilds (that includes people with thousands of hours in this game mode) that test this builds on a daily basis. 4) "when in Rome, do as the Roman's do." You can't join a raid and tell the raid leader he has to take you with him, even when your build is shit. You can't join a pvp team as 2nd thief, just because you think you should be. That's not an issue of the game mode, but an issue of your mindset. WvW established a certain kind of meta, there are things that work and things that don't. 5) the win is not having you in a squad as it seems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Straegen.2938 Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 Generally if it is a full squad (50 players), all mediums get kicked. Most squads will put mediums in their own group if they aren't full. Skill groups will typically run parties and tagless. They will often port if they pick up too many tag-alongs. The rally mechanic in WvW really makes for a hostile environment for non-group classes (aka mediums). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xZombieTaco.5809 Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 > @"Tinnel.4369" said: > > @"xZombieTaco.5809" said: > > > @"Tinnel.4369" said: > > > In the squad you can do your job of scouting, flanking, picking squishies, finishing downs, etc AND get participation. Many thieves don't know how to do this/many commanders don't know the value. > > > > Other classes do it better though in this current meta setting > > Like? Soulbeast can single target snipe significantly better than thieves currently, scout effectively, finish downs, etc. Engis can stomp better also, same with backline classes such as Hammer rev/Staff ele Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sleepwalker.1398 Posted February 13, 2019 Share Posted February 13, 2019 Meh who cares if you in squad or not as a thief. All you need is to be in comms to know whats going on, get behind enemy zerg and take out backline as DE. They are downed easily cos most are glass anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tinnel.4369 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 > @"xZombieTaco.5809" said: > > @"Tinnel.4369" said: > > > @"xZombieTaco.5809" said: > > > > @"Tinnel.4369" said: > > > > In the squad you can do your job of scouting, flanking, picking squishies, finishing downs, etc AND get participation. Many thieves don't know how to do this/many commanders don't know the value. > > > > > > Other classes do it better though in this current meta setting > > > > Like? > > Soulbeast can single target snipe significantly better than thieves currently, scout effectively, finish downs, etc. > Engis can stomp better also, > same with backline classes such as Hammer rev/Staff ele Don't buy it, but your mileage may differ I suppose. Soulbeast may rival it, but significantly better...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Israel.7056 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 OP, If you're deadset on playing deadeye you're going to have a tough time finding a squad that will let you in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Straegen.2938 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 > @"Tinnel.4369" said: > Don't buy it, but your mileage may differ I suppose. Soulbeast may rival it, but significantly better...... I am guessing this guy never rolled a Dead Eye using Trickery and CS with Basilisk. It is the single most effective one shot in the game since it strips protection, block, etc and is a literal one shot not a channeled skill. Dodge stealth also makes it beastmode for stomps. Soulbeast leaving the confines of the zerg is typically a meat-bag with only one invuln and limited stealth. That said, DeadEye is still not well suited to a zerg nor is any medium for that matter. A Mesmer can pin snipe better than any class IMO. Double Moa FTW! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RisenHowl.2419 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 > @"DanAlcedo.3281" said: > > @"Bloodstealer.5978" said: > > > @"Chorazin.4107" said: > > > Squad spots are reserved for the core zerg classes. You might get in on a DD vault thief, but mostly the squad is for the sustain/DPS ball. So FB's, Scourges, Heralds make up the core, an occasional SB, Scrapper or Tempest. > > > > > > The DE whilst doing great single target damage doesnt do AoE, say you down someone at 1500 rng in the enemy zerg, ok great. Now hes down in the middle of their zerg and will get auto revived. It's why AoE dmg is king, you need to be able to drop targets and then drop mass AoE cleave on top of them. You might even snag an additional couple of rezzers. > > > > > > DE's, one shot SB's, etc etc usually all lurk around the main zerg just waiting for sniping opportunities. Or roam, these squad classes, Scourges, FB's, Hammer Heralds etc, they do not roam well. Well not like a condi Mirage or DE can. > > > > depends how your trying to play your opposite zerg.. most decent tags will want to splinter their oppositions zerg and pressure them to dump their support/utility skills.. once this is achieved then backline classes like thief will mop them up pretty fast. > > Like I've said it's about knowing how to play your class/build effectively in each situation. > > A zerg has both a frontline and a backline... whilst you may have preference on what you want, and that is any squad leaders prerogative it does not mean any specific class has no part to play or is of no use so must go roam. > > Wvw is already a struggle in terms of numbers and coverage, for many servers so for open tags to start discriminating against classes only serves to exacerbate the issue. Not everyone seeks to be a solo roamer, especially when there is already disparity in the matchup making roaming that much harder. With alliances incoming if that same discrimination is allowed to carry over it's likely only going to to hurt the mode more imo. > > Zergs having a frontline and backline isn’t true since god knows how long. > > If you are a skilled roamer, then you should know how wvw and Squad setup works. > > And no. Its extremely rare for a thief to „ mop them up“. > > Because two things need to be true: > A.) The thief must be REALLY good > B.) The enemy must be kitten brain dead. > > > Alliances wont discriminate people for their class choice but for skill and knowledge. > > If you are an amazing thief then surely Alliances will want you as roamer. > > But knowledge is to know that there are better choices for general zerging. > > > Thief/Rangers QQing all day about not getting in a squad usually lack both. I mean, that's after playing thief for a whopping 2 weeks. Isn't too hard to pick up and outputs as much as a weaver Edit: skip the downed part, recorded that for guides who asked to see the whole fight :< Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeyOrion.9506 Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 He must have tried hooking into a group lead by one of the old Jade Quarry commanders. It's not you, it's the commanders in question. I, and others, had to deal with commanders that had a very pissy attitude towards the Medium Classes. They didn't like Ranger, top of the list. They did not like Thieves, nearly at the top of the list.. They didn't like ENGINEERS, not even close to being top of the list. Literally our old commanders would kick rangers first, thieves second, and engineers third. All they wanted was ele healers, Guardian boons/burners, Warrior Domes. Anything that gave a boon or severe AOE they wanted. Rangers/Thieves/Engineers were relegated to roamers and even then we were treated like trash that shouldn't have been on the map at all. In one commanders own words, we were "Taking valuable space on the wvw map that could have been used with a BETTER profession for group combat." I didn't know who to be more pissed off at. Anet, or the damn commanders that we used to have that were a severe form of cancer in WvW. My advice, play your damn profession that you want, with the build you want, and tell your commanders to kiss your tail. =^o.o^= that's what kittah would say. All hail kittah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeyOrion.9506 Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 In essence, it's not you. It's the commanders in charge. And each commander has a PERSONAL PREFERANCE of what PROFESSIONS they want in their squad. Hell they have a preference of what they want on the map as a WHOLE. The commanders have generally never liked roamers, some never liked scouts, and some of them were more into "FIGHTING" than actual PPT or winning skirmish, or the weekly rounds. They've always moaned and complained about the medium classes, which forcefully relegates us as roamers or sitting in towers/garrisons/SMC as eyes. If your too bummed about not being accepted into the squad as thief, you can either perma roam till hell freezes over, or you can switch professions when you go into wvw. I wish I could be more ….glass 1/2 full kinda guy.....but i'm not anymore due to the Cancer Commanders I had to deal with for six fricken years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helicity.3416 Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 It's really simple, if you're not a core zerg class just _ask_ if there's a spot for you, and accept that you may need to leave squad to make place for others if it begins to fill up. While being in the squad can be _nice_ for you, you don't **need** it as a thief. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apharma.3741 Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 My server kicks people for dying in 1 push, not playing well as well as fore being on a class that's not very useful. Maybe it wasn't that you were a DE and that you're well known for being useless? I don't expect OP to reply, 4 days later and they haven't replied. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voltekka.2375 Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 > @"RisenHowl.2419" said: > > > If you want to play thief in a zerg thanks for this. Will try it out asap. Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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